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BS: free WiFi - UK proposal cf NY?

Mr Red 01 Dec 19 - 05:25 AM
Mr Red 04 Dec 19 - 05:13 PM
Stanron 04 Dec 19 - 10:00 PM
Mr Red 05 Dec 19 - 03:33 PM
David Carter (UK) 05 Dec 19 - 04:11 PM
Mr Red 06 Dec 19 - 04:28 AM
David Carter (UK) 06 Dec 19 - 07:46 AM

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Subject: BS: free WiFi - UK proposal cf NY?
From: Mr Red
Date: 01 Dec 19 - 05:25 AM

I see that the NY City implementation is paid for by advertising (and data collection?), the UK proposal is more "free broadband", and an electioneering giveaway that I see as pie in the ether.

But has anyone suggested how to pay for free internet access?

certainly internet and web access is fast becoming essential for many things. Like any other utility (that are not free, BTW).

As a trivial example the UK has bus timetables on most bus stops, but IME they are unreliable because more than one group of competing people put them there and the rate which the routes/time change make updating lag or, frankly, lapse. As if older people are expected to own and use smart phones, and pay for tickets via them! Round here such "on-line" information is based on timetables not actual bus location (GPS).


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Subject: RE: BS: free WiFi - UK proposal cf NY?
From: Mr Red
Date: 04 Dec 19 - 05:13 PM

No ideas on financing it? Just as I feared.


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Subject: RE: BS: free WiFi - UK proposal cf NY?
From: Stanron
Date: 04 Dec 19 - 10:00 PM

I confess that I don't actually know how the internet works. There appears to be a network of computers that are interconnected. In order to get access to this interconnected network I have to go through an Internet Provider who charges me for access. Could it be possible to access the internet without going through Vodafone, EE, O2 or any of the others?

Tesla had a vision of free electrical power for everyone. Once his backers realised that he could deprive them of the income from charging for electric they pulled the plug(?). Has the same thing happened with the internet?


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Subject: RE: BS: free WiFi - UK proposal cf NY?
From: Mr Red
Date: 05 Dec 19 - 03:33 PM

not yet, but it is an election giveaway.

On the surface if you have a phone connection anything you add on top is bonus for the provider.
But the internet uses equipment that costs and needs personnel to administer and maintain that. The telephone network, per se, does not need it.

If it is given away, how do you finance this equipment/maintenance?

Having said that the UK is predominantly serviced through a company called "Open Reach" which is effectively a cash cow owned by BT. Basically if BT loose your custom as a phone net/provider "Open Reach" still get a slice of your contract. And it is an attractive target for other phone companies, and political parties!


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Subject: RE: BS: free WiFi - UK proposal cf NY?
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 05 Dec 19 - 04:11 PM

Radio is free and is paid out of general taxation. Personally I think TV should be free, and paid out of general taxation, or better still by taxing more heavily the commercial TV providers (this is also a cash cow). I think that the idea is that free internet would be paid for increased taxation on tech firms like facebook. I think this is a good idea, these firms are getting a free ride at present and offshoring their vast profits. Note that some towns and cities do provide free WIFI at present, funded from the business rate. It is seen as a way of attracting more custom to otherwise failing town centre businesses.

I don't think anybody is thinking of providing free WiFi in people's homes. You will still need your own router to connect to the cable infrastructure provided by the successor to Openreach.


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Subject: RE: BS: free WiFi - UK proposal cf NY?
From: Mr Red
Date: 06 Dec 19 - 04:28 AM

Radio is free and is paid out of general taxation

Not exactly true. In the UK it is either paid for by:
1) the "Radio Receiving Apparatus Licence" fee (aka TV licence). Radio used to qualify, and now exempted because of the difficulty of administering.
2) advertising
3) voluntary contributions and grants (community/hospital radio)
4) a mix of 1, 2 &/or 3 (even the BBC sell programs).

Drawing a parallel with the NHS. This is free (at the point of delivery - E&OE eg dentistry) but theoretically we pay for it via NI (National Insurance - a cluette there) contributions. Even the political hot potato, that is election giveaways, it is coming from NI, though which proportion visa vis dole & state pensions is a moot point.

Politicians like to tell us we are being given something when we have already paid for it. That is their conceit.

You will still need your own router to connect
That is the problem - crowded airspace. Solved poorly by carving up the allocated spectrum with channels and filling them with the packets. Eventually there is a traffic jam. Imagine - once everyone streams TV by default, multiple instances per household.

The thing is, once a resource like broadband is free, people use it without thinking of the profligacy and its repercussions. Like infrastructure (wot has to be financed - don't ya know?).


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Subject: RE: BS: free WiFi - UK proposal cf NY?
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 06 Dec 19 - 07:46 AM

You can't surely be advocating that everybody gets broadband over 4g? If you try that then you will very soon run into the problem you mention. The current solution of a cable into your home and then an IEEE 802.11something WLAN is surely more cost effective.


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