Types of folk music you like or dislike

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Jack Campin
Date: 25 Jan 20 - 06:11 AM

Eddi Reader: somebody who loves Scottish traditional songs so much she goes to the effort of singing them to country music despite having the disability of only being able to sing MOR pop covers.

Repulsive mediocrity.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,patriot
Date: 25 Jan 20 - 11:59 AM

and she's worshipped as the definitive performer of Burns' material- sounds like an engaging lass when interviewed, but good to know someone else thinks her singing is crap

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 25 Jan 20 - 12:34 PM

She seems like one of those very pushy types who get to the top at the expense of more quietly competent folks.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,Hochma Gandhi
Date: 25 Jan 20 - 01:29 PM

I just noticed that I never actually said whether hers was music I liked or disliked - there were 2 options in the thread heading and it is interesting that everyone has assumed "dislike", and not "like".
I will give her credit for 1 Burns song she has recorded which I did like - "Welcome, Willie Stewart", but the rest, no thanks - it was indeed "dislike".

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 05:37 AM

Her schmaltzy style of singing reminds me a bit of Karen Carpenter- she was worshipped too!

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 06:22 AM

I quite like Eddi Reader. Not sure if she is a folk artist or a pop artist singing some folk songs though.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Jack Campin
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 06:34 AM

Failed popster rebuilding a career out of folkies' lower expectations.

Siobhan Miller is the same generation and very much better.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,akenaton
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 06:59 AM

In defence of "Big Edna" she has a heart as big as the city and she sings as she feels, listening to her live performances is a trip back to what revival folk music felt like. It may not suit the mafia but no one can say that her interpretation is contrived......she is an exceptional performer who will be listened to and appreciated long after the "academic folkies" are consigned to the bin. She is also a funny and really friendly person.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,patriot
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 08:46 AM

That's all fine, akenton, am sure her concerts are fine & she sounds knowledgeable & engaging, with many other virtues. No-one's attacking her personally, and I'm sure her live performances echo on stage what she picked up in the folk clubs.
It's just that the media have decided she is the true voice of Burns, even though her style owes more to MOR & country- it just demonstrates the lack of knowledge of the media in the context of Burns' songs & music.
I have just heard a clip of her doing 'My love is like a red, red rose' and it was so syrupy I couldn't listen to it.
Do we want the world to think that her Scottish pedigree guarantees s that this is the authentic style of the great man?

There are so many fine singers in Scotland, whose style is much more in sympathy with the Scottish song tradition- you're right, Jack, Siobhan Miller is one and she's no 'academic folkie'- but there are many others who never get a look in!!

ps please count Siobhan as a 'like' !!

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Reinhard
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 09:50 AM

Siobhan Miller is the same generation

Eddi Reader is 60 years old. I would guess Siobhan is in her early 30s.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 10:50 AM

Do you like and listen to recordings of the source singers?

Yes

Do you prefer revival and present day singers?

No, with few exceptions

Do you like songs accompanied or unaccompanied?

I usually prefer unaccompanied. Accompanied is OK if done well, i.e. a) if it doesn't become more important than the singing and b) so long as it is not just guitar struffing.

Do you like traditional, contemporary or both?

Mainly traditional but there are a few good comtemporary songs.

What about electric folk?

Definitely, so long as it is well done.


Dance music, social or ritual?

Social dance music: Again, so long as it is well done, fine. I like Morris music but prefer it when it is not melodeon-heavy. Pipe and tabor is good.

Tradsinger

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,akenaton
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 12:22 PM

Bonzo has a point, and I don't know if any of the really know the authentic voice of Scotland. For example the finest singer of Scots song was the late Kenneth McKellar, vilified in folk circles as long as I can remember and the only real writer of scots song left is Davie Robertson who's writing stands comparison with Burns in modern terms. On the subject of Burns who's work I love, you would do well to study some of his misogyny and his profanity towards women before preaching your sermons to Bonzo…..seems to me that he knows more about the real warts and all Robert Burns than the PC members of this forum. Most of Burns great songs were produced for performance in a formal setting, what makes those who reside here entitled to promote the "proper" manner of performance?

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 12:27 PM

Without understanding any of the words, I enjoy listening to Scottish Gaelic singers and musicians, because the quality is always so good.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,akenaton
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 12:31 PM

On Scots female singers, I can only think of a handful and Mss Miller or Mss Polwart are not among them, the young "folk" crowd all sound identical......much as described by Bonzo. Marie Campbell and the dear late Gordeanna Mcculloch had the authentic sound.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,akenaton
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 12:35 PM

Walkabout....this area was partially Gaelic speaking when I was a boy, the music and song were terrific it sprang directly from the community.
Today Gaelic song is lifeless...there is no spirit in the young musicians......just another branch of the industry I'm afraid.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 12:42 PM

I wouldn't call Eddi a failed popster, Jack. She did rather well solo and with Fairground attraction and the Waterboys. She topped single and album charts and earned 3 Brit awards. She certainly earned enough to enable her to pursue her folk song hobby with no financial worries. If that is failing, I'd take it :-)

Ake. Is this the misogynistic Robert Burns you are talking about? I thought you would have known your own national poet better.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 12:42 PM

I'm going by BBC Alba and Radio Gael, Akenaton...and, at the start of her career, hearing Julie Fowlis at the Sage Gateshead.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,akenaton
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 01:04 PM

Yes Walkabout, Alba is forever promoting these you groups and singers, it is virtually impossible to tell one from the other and all sound stilted, they do not have the verve of the Irish. It was all so different in the Ceilidh Days.
Dave , don't even try to pass off an opinion piece in the PC Herald as fact.....You know as much about Burns as my arse does about snipe shooting. Burns was a complicated character who would never have supported the social mores of today, he loved humanity, but more he loved nature the sweetness and the cruelty, he also wrote for a living and often gave his patrons what they asked for......no modern "scruples" for Robbie.
Walkabout …..try a listen to Daori Farrell and Four Winds in a public setting. Daori is a fairly young performer who has the spirit in him.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,akenaton
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 01:11 PM

Four Winds

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 01:22 PM

Thanks, Akenaton, I agree that is good Irish music and certainly wouldn't mind being in a pub with a pint of Guinness and that mob playing...and, if there were no Irish dancers there, perhaps glancing up at a tv screen to catch some Gaelic football...

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 01:23 PM

Hmmmm. Who should we believe? Pauline Gray, a university researcher who specialises in Robert Burns and gives lectures on the subject, writing in a respected Scottish publicaton, or a self-proclaimed uneducated bigot writing in an obscure folk music forum? Tough one...

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,akenaton
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 01:29 PM

Definitely the "uneducated bigot", you may learn something to broaden your mind, but I wont hold my breath.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 01:34 PM

It wasn't me that proudly proclaimed a lack of education and tarred all university graduates as lacking sense, Ake.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 01:44 PM

I find you comments with regard to Ake, hateful and offensive Dave.
"uneducated bigot" ? What a nasty wee man you can be at times.
As for Burns, I have read a fair amount, I would not align him in any way with a "gender equality" movement..he was a man of his time, no more, no less.
One thing I do know is that some University "educated" researchers are driven more by ideology than by facts. I am not saying that this is the case here, however, one should be somewhast skeptical these days and not fall into the intellectual trap of believing that "academics" are infallible.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 02:12 PM

Hilo. Ake has very proudly proclaimed his lack of education many times on this very forum. That is the uneducated bit. He also classes people with a university education as lacking in common sense. That is stereotyping and is the primary trait of bigotry. You would do well to educate yourself with facts before spouting forth.

But this is all by the way. This thread is about different types of folk music. I will not let it become a platform for those who cannot or will not post below the line, where BS belongs. Continuing on this tack will result in thread closure so I will say no more on the subject. I suggest you and others stick to the topic.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 02:16 PM

No Dave, it is Not sterotyping, it is, in some cases, an accurate observation. Calling people uneducated bigots is not what I call sticking to the topic..perhaps you should reserve your bullying for below the line Dave.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,Big Al Whittle
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 02:36 PM

Its not actually compulsory for us to all have the same perspective on folk music.

I suppose resentment arises when we feel - a different view gets more of the limelight than our view.

I don't know what the answer is. Probably there isn't one.

I remember on Monkey World, the late Jim Cronin made this comment when a group of monkeys killed the old and past it leader of the troupe. 'There are no bad guys here - its just the way monkeys carry on.'

and folk music fans, maybe.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,akenaton
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 02:48 PM

:0) Ah, always the voice of reason Al. Thanks Hilo, appreciated.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 03:11 PM

Hopefully that is it but if those who cannot post below the line continue in this way on this thread could be closed. That would be a pity so please stop now.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,Hochma Gandhi
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 04:03 PM

"those who cannot post below the line.... " Meaning what ? What makes you so superior ?

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 05:10 PM

I can post below the line because I am signed in. If you are not a member you cannot sign in. Some people chose not to be members. Fine, but they cannot post below the line and accept that. Some people have had membership revoked so they try to bring BS up here. Nothing to do with superiority. Everything to do with keeping BS out of the music section. Anyone can become a member. Just see the FAQ thread. Seemples.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 05:11 PM

More poison contributed by unsigned-in people. I have tried really hard to persuade the mods that no-one should post to this forum unless they are signed in and can be identified by mods. The dirtiest word on this forum is "guest." Still, don't listen to me...

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 05:11 PM

Now, can we stop the BS or continue below the line?

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,akenaton
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 06:04 PM

Hmm It's debatable if Burns is folk at all. Most of the big songs were produced for aristocratic patrons, or aristocratic lovers. I think he would be delighted to have his songs covered by as many people as possible and in as many styles, so long as they were popular, especially if like today, they meant money in the writers pocket.
I enjoy the popularising of folk music as long as the performer has a genuine love of what they do, and can transmit enthusiasm for the product to their audience.....didanyone watch the faces of the crowd as Daoiri and Four Winds played.....magic.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,Hilo
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 07:04 PM

I have not had membership revoked, I choose not to go there because , Dave, people like you choose to bully those who disagree with you. I admit to not being an expert on Burns, but I am not prepared to accept a point of view based on no evidence just because an “academic” said said so. burns was a complicated and multi faceted man, his poetry reflected his time and place. twenty first values do not apply and it is intellectually lazy to. Suggest that they do. my guess is that you do not know much about Burns and have chosenTo belittle someone who may, perhaps know more than you do. above or below the line that is petty and wrong headed,

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 08:37 PM

You can be "bullied" just as much whether you're properly signed in or not, so, basically, don't be such an arse.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Stanron
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 08:44 PM

Spoken like a true bully.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 09:11 PM

Pattern emerging here, Stanron. You post gratuitous insults but only way after midnight. Now just put that corkscrew down and walk slowly away...


Then go to bed...

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Stanron
Date: 26 Jan 20 - 10:00 PM

There's a program on BBC Radio 3 at 2 pm on a Sunday called The Early Music Show. Today, or yesterday by now, it featured music by Corelli, Locatelli, Valentini and Pergolesi. I was in heaven. This is what I love to listen to.

I like playing traditional tunes. Particularly I like to play traditional tunes in company.

I can live without listening to other people sing, and experience has suggested that other people reciprocate, but have to admit I just don't get unaccompanied singing. I'm not a farmer, I hate muddy fields and never wanted to follow a plough. It's the music that gets me.

The words, not so much.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 27 Jan 20 - 02:58 AM

Sigh. I promised I would try to steer BS away from this thread but I am weak! New Culpa :-(

HiLo.

1. You will note I said some people chose not to be members. That includes you.
2. Disputing what people state as fact, things like Burns was a misogynist, no matter how robustly is not bullying. It is arguing.
3. I agree that we should not blindly accept the opinion of experts. Nor should we blindly accept the word of someone who is proud of their lack of education. My tendency is to put more credence towards someone who has done their homework.

Now, can we put this to bed? What are your preferences in folk music?

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 27 Jan 20 - 03:01 AM

I spotted that auto correct had changed culpa to cuppa but not the change from mea to new.

Mea culpa

I'll have a new cuppa :-)

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: gillymor
Date: 27 Jan 20 - 09:18 AM

I can't say that I like or dislike "types of folk music" but I do tend to sing a lot of songs from America, Canada, Ireland, England and Scotland and play a lot of tunes from those countries along with tunes from Brittany, Sweden, Norway, Brazil and the Caribbean and enjoy listening to music from all cultures especially North Africa, the Middle East, Nepal, Tibet, China and India. Spotify, with all it alleged deficiencies, has really opened up the world of music for me.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 27 Jan 20 - 09:40 AM

Yes, gillymor, I know what you mean about discovering a whole world of music via the internet, things we barely knew about a few short years ago are now available to us. I listen to a lot of music on you tube and have really been enjoying a lot of traditional Arabic music, Bulgarian Choirs, Eastern Orthodox Music, North American "roots" music. We are so lucky to have all of this available to us.
    Is there anything you could suggest to us, something that you especially enjoyed ?

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: gillymor
Date: 27 Jan 20 - 10:44 AM

Well HiLo, this flash mob video got me interested in playing Breton dance music- Zelda and Schottisse a Virmoux and I've since infected others.

Mountain Music Project, which can be found on Spotify, yielded Cluck Old Hen which I clawhammer along with. It was produced by a couple of American musicians who traveled around Nepal and recorded with some of the locals.

Then there is my current favorite fiddle tune, Hamnataing, which was composed by Shetland fiddler Chris Stout.
Hamnataing

This isn't even the tip of the tip of the iceberg.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Jan 20 - 12:06 PM

I am 76, so therefor well and truly come from the second revival. In those days, as now, folk covers a wide church. Now, I have to say that I had 4 years of very intensive involvement on the scene as an unaccompanied floor singer and then 'married out. Always kept in touch through Folk on Two and Folk on Friday. Now with the net, all regional stations....and Mike Harding.
Getting to the point, although I listen to these folk programmes, I don't really enjoy them. I think it's because it seems to be the sound of the groups that matters and not the song. Girl singers all seem to be influenced by Kate Rusby including The Unthanks who have totally changed their style. I think I'd better stop there because I can see me going on forever.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 27 Jan 20 - 12:11 PM

I,ve just listen to all three, enjoyed very much, especially the first one. Thanx so much.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 27 Jan 20 - 12:18 PM

Sorry about the above, my eyesight is very poor. I meant to mention The Laialy Arabic Music Ensemble. I would provide a link...if I knew how..bit of a Luddite.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 27 Jan 20 - 12:40 PM

I like being around a good session in a pub; watching the dancing, too, at a festival; hearing a good unaccompanied singer or someone double the melody, perhaps with a bit of ornamentation - from folks who are at least trying to be as loyal to their OWN tradition as possible.

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: gillymor
Date: 27 Jan 20 - 01:17 PM

Music good, chauvinism bad.

Is this who you're referring to, HiLo?-
Layaali Arabic Music Ensemble - Samai Nahawand Rawhi Khammash


Good stuff,I especially like the Oud.
One of my favorites-
Anouar Brahem "Astrakan café"

Subject: RE: Types of folk music you like or dislike
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 27 Jan 20 - 01:44 PM

Yes, Gillymor, that is who I meant. Thank you for the links, I will surely give them a listen.