BS: New news on the pandemic COVID-19

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Mr Red
Date: 13 Apr 20 - 02:17 AM

The cause is probably education and the nature of their employment.

It has been pointed-out that the lower paid/out of work are represented at a higher percentage in the African-American community, and there is a lifestyle dimension too.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Mr Red
Date: 13 Apr 20 - 06:09 AM

worrying opinions on the use of ventilators

Basically some respected medics in the US & Italy are saying that what they see is that COVD-19 causes a lack of oxygen, rather than pneumonia per se. And ventilating with positive pressure does cause lung damage and the sedation has side effects also. It is treatment, a patch, not a re-fit with new parts!
The bottom line is that COVID-19 is new and we are learning, and we do what has worked before. What is needed is not necessarily what was done before.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Apr 20 - 08:35 AM

Mr Red
Ventilators are one means to oxygenate blood and remove CO2. It is not the best but is more available and cheaper.
When ventillated;
TOU CAN NOT EAT
YOU CAN NOT TALK
THE CHEAPEST NOURISHMENT IS GLUCOSE DRIP :(not good for diabetics)
20%+ effective in saving life
Sedation or medical Coma is not required but is considered more comfortable.

You've seen the oxygen hoods used as an alternative or intermediary treatment.
Mucus/ (different kind of sputum) from Covis 19 is thicker but not like a fluid suffocating pnumonia.
The X ray of Covid damaged lungs looks more cotton like than dark fluid filled lungs with other pnumonias..
There are attempts to drain lungs.
There are a bevy of medications being tried.

Yes there is room for specific improvement to address damage and symptoms. Standards of care is being treated like a one size fits all.
This is a common problem in all areas of medicine. Perhaps a novel alternative will prove promising by a risk taking smart doctor.

Or you could ask the Stable genius and self proclaimed scientist Steve Shaw for assistance. He is the one who condemened my early pandemic warning in January and did nothing for 2 months.

The clues are there for all to see but the next effective treatments are immunity plasma and vaccines.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Apr 20 - 08:47 AM

If this was WW2 we are at the end of the beggining.
We have yet to discover 'radar' and 'enigma machine'.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Apr 20 - 07:30 AM

The US is #1
   Woo Hoo !
The UK is #2
in viral infections

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 14 Apr 20 - 07:36 AM

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Mrrzy
Date: 14 Apr 20 - 09:11 AM

Weirdly enough lying on your stomach improves your lung function and O2 saturation, if you're sick and having trouble with breathing.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Apr 20 - 11:41 AM

tru nuff

If you are far more comfortable resting on your left side, you may have a heart valve disorder. (or acid reflux or sore hip...)

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 14 Apr 20 - 12:05 PM

It would be nice if medical recommendations and diagnoses on this forum come exclusively from qualified medical professionals. Cheers.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Mrrzy
Date: 15 Apr 20 - 09:36 AM

Mine do. I just don't post the link. You can look it up yourself, keeps boredom away.

Our abysmal failure is now being blamed on WHO to the point of defunding. I am ashamed of my government, again.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 15 Apr 20 - 10:11 AM

Deflection of his own guilt by the Orange-Utan (sic) currently stinking-up 1600 Pennsylvania Ave., DC 20500.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Mrrzy
Date: 15 Apr 20 - 05:02 PM

Virginia has extended its closure of nonessential businesses orders for 2 more weeks. Does not alter the stay-at-home order.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Apr 20 - 08:44 AM

Now Covid virus has been found in nasal passages for up to 21 days after regaining health and getting positive antibody testing.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: gillymor
Date: 16 Apr 20 - 06:44 PM

"Sorry, Peons, Stay-at-Home Rules Don’t Apply to Ivanka Trump And Jared Kushner" -Vanity Fair

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Apr 20 - 09:58 PM

My source of inside information has dried up. This does not bode well.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Mrrzy
Date: 16 Apr 20 - 10:51 PM

Oh dear.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Donuel
Date: 17 Apr 20 - 06:57 PM

RESDEMIMIR WORKS (ebola drug)

Oxychloroquin causes more harm and is stopped by several nations.

China revises death toll by 50%

!0 times the number of citizens have Covid 19 antibodies than early tests revealed. Immunity even with antibodies is now in question.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Donuel
Date: 17 Apr 20 - 08:37 PM

Resdemivir cnn

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 18 Apr 20 - 01:01 PM

Latest from UK, on being questioned whether the government would lift the no recourse to public funds rules for illegal migrants so that those who are displaying symptoms feel safe to seek medical help if displaying symptoms rather than remain in the community the Communities Minister whose name is totally unmemorable stated that the government has no intention of doing so, and it would be down to individual local authorities to find the money for making provision if they so wish. We have a minister who is putting its hostile environment ideology before public health.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Mrrzy
Date: 18 Apr 20 - 07:51 PM

Ok this is from a fox affiliate, but they quote science: https://www.fox10phoenix.com/news/researchers-discover-new-coronavirus-symptoms-feet-lesions

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: keberoxu
Date: 19 Apr 20 - 01:54 PM

From the Washington Post:

Europe resistant to apps for tracking spread of coronavirus

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Mrrzy
Date: 19 Apr 20 - 02:18 PM

Nieman-Marcus goes bankrupt.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Mrrzy
Date: 19 Apr 20 - 02:23 PM

Also some post-pandemic advice:

https://www.cnet.com/how-to/5-things-not-to-do-when-coronavirus-quarantine-lockdown-end/#ftag=CAD-00-10aag7d

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Iains
Date: 20 Apr 20 - 07:22 AM

Have we all been had?

https://off-guardian.org/2020/04/17/8-more-experts-questioning-the-coronavirus-panic/

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Mrrzy
Date: 20 Apr 20 - 08:08 AM

Exercise is good:https://www.dailyprogress.com/news/uva/exercise-an-effective-weapon-against-pandemic-uva-study-finds/article_b4725588-29d8-5d83-a06b-bed9fad60778.html

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Donuel
Date: 20 Apr 20 - 08:19 AM

I'm gaining weight. I don't do superfluous excercise.   I don't even copy and paste if links are not a blue clicky.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: gillymor
Date: 20 Apr 20 - 08:41 AM

"Have we all been had?"

You have, guido jr., many times over.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: gillymor
Date: 20 Apr 20 - 08:44 AM

Squats a compound exercise you can do anywhere.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Iains
Date: 20 Apr 20 - 09:07 AM

Gillymoor I have every confidence in my opinions. I am disappointed you continue the poitless exercise of ad hominem attacks. Are you of the leftward persuasion also?
I wonder what the the collective name for a plurality of experts should be?
A contradiction of experts perhaps?

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: gillymor
Date: 20 Apr 20 - 09:09 AM

2i is dissapointed, boo-frickety-hoo.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Mr Red
Date: 20 Apr 20 - 01:10 PM

Gillymoor I have every confidence in my opinions.

That is what Mr Dunning & Mr Kruger found commonly.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 20 Apr 20 - 02:04 PM

Please people, stop posting misinformation. If you have information that a particular drug is effective, or ineffective, post a link to a publication in a peer reviewed journal and don't post at all. And Iains, the link in your post of 20 Apr 20 - 07:22 AM is complete crap from a bunch of tinfoil hat merchants. John Oxford used to have some credibility as a virologist, but in this case he should re-read what he wrote and reflect as to whether he was wise to say it.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Mrrzy
Date: 20 Apr 20 - 02:22 PM

What *is* the group name for experts? A panel?

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Mr Red
Date: 21 Apr 20 - 05:48 AM

A pressure of

As in has-been drips under........................

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Donuel
Date: 21 Apr 20 - 07:31 AM

Posting actual news about the pandemic is practically thread drift at this point but there is actual news as you are awash in all virus news shows 24/7. The word to the wise today is remdesivir

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 21 Apr 20 - 08:56 AM

The virus is basically the same the world-over.

In fact one of the positive things about it, in terms of working on a possible vaccine, is that it shows very few & minor mutations wherever it's been tested (unlike common 'flu strains). This is thought to be because of its virulence, if it wasn't more virulent then we would probably see more mutation.

The reason that some otherwise healthy people succumb to the virus, is due to viral load - nothing to do with Johnson not being present at COBRA meetings or what this government has or has not done. If you expose anyone to a high-enough level of viral organisms, or expose them frequently to these organisms, then the viral population in effect overwhelms the immune response. This is what we see in healthcare workers.

If you put someone in an environment where lots of people (or things) around them are infected, or they are coming into close contact with someone (or something) with the virus frequently, then their viral load increases - nothing to do with Johnson not being present at COBRA meetings or what this government has or has not done. That's why distancing & hygiene are so important.

Viral load is person-specific. It doesn't spread. Someone with a higher-viral load doesn't shed the virus at a greater rate again nothing to do with Johnson not being present at COBRA meetings or what this government has or has not done.

The reason why isolating yourself is important if you're infected, is as much to keep yourself safe, as to avoid passing it on to others.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 21 Apr 20 - 09:13 AM

You may well be right about viral load. But I don't know why you attached Boris's non-attendance at those meetings (confirmed by Gove) to it.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Mrrzy
Date: 21 Apr 20 - 09:14 AM

Um, of course higher viral load means more virus-shedding. One sneeze from a low-load has fewer viri than one sneeze from high-load.

Bavaria has canceled Oktoberfest.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 21 Apr 20 - 10:12 AM

Hmm. Once the virus has incubated and you've become symptomatic, or even before that point, the initial virus load would no longer be particularly relevant. And the plural of virus is viruses.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 21 Apr 20 - 11:14 AM

Donuel, that is a study without a control group, of 53 patients. The number at the end who died was consistent within statistical errors with the Chinese studies without the drug. The article mentions that someone else plans to carry out a controlled study of 600 patients. That might give useful information, but not yet.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 21 Apr 20 - 11:20 AM

Bonzo:

"The virus is basically the same the world-over."


Is that right? It may be, but I have seen no study of regional variation in the virus. The Wikipedia page on SARS-COV-2 talks about the difference between it and pangolin viruses, but nothing on regional variation or lack of.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 21 Apr 20 - 11:22 AM

Bonzo again:

"The reason that some otherwise healthy people succumb to the virus, is due to viral load - nothing to do with Johnson not being present at COBRA meetings or what this government has or has not done. If you expose anyone to a high-enough level of viral organisms, or expose them frequently to these organisms, then the viral population in effect overwhelms the immune response. This is what we see in healthcare workers."

Again, can you point to a study to support this? A paper in Lancet maybe?

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 21 Apr 20 - 12:50 PM

No, they are wise words from a medical consultant in the family, no more, no less. I don't do studies, I only wear a minimal size anorak !!!!!!!!!!!!

Subject: Flu ain't the pandemic
From: Donuel
Date: 21 Apr 20 - 02:31 PM

I wouldn't blame anyone for being impatient. Instant gratification is ingrained in our culture, machines and behavior.
Looking into an ebola drug is thinking outside the box.
Doing the double blind experiments takes a very long time followed by more time. What if there is a connection, what if there isn't?

The mysteries abound and confound.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Mr Red
Date: 21 Apr 20 - 03:05 PM

"The virus is basically the same the world-over."

Is that right? It may be, but I have seen no study of regional variation in the virus. The Wikipedia page on SARS-COV-2 talks about the difference between it and pangolin viruses, but nothing on regional variation or lack of.

There has been research into regional variations. They use techniques that were used to prove archeological migration patterns "out of Africa" and all that. The report I saw was in the Telegrope, and it showed a correlation for Europe & Australia. China was different enough to throw a spanner in the homespun theories of transmission routes. I can't see a Tory bias making that up! The Telegrope is not that subtle.

AND

Yer viral overload results in an over-active immune response where the knowledgeable (on more considered TV) use words like cytokine storm. However you look at it, the body itself attacks you. Hence the temperature.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Donuel
Date: 21 Apr 20 - 05:15 PM

At first there was a rumor about a couple variants of covid 19 then they said it appears fairly stable and not susceptable to quick mutation. I'm a spectator like everyone else.

The culture war right wingers are ignoring stay at home advisories.
Those politicians who can be bought to open venues like the Vegas Strip and new Shopping Malls are making money. The true red Trumpers are going full goose bonkers to expose themselves to the virus. I will be a spectator to thier mass die off 3 weeks after their grand opening.
The highest fatality rates, which are still only estimations, is about 2%.

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Donuel
Date: 21 Apr 20 - 07:17 PM

This just in on Onion news
More Republicans dieing of the pandemic than Democrats
is proof the virus has a bigotry against the right and is a never Trumper.

Militia General Ratner:
This liberal deep state bio warfare against the far right will not stand. "lock and load - or is it load and lock"

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 22 Apr 20 - 02:29 AM

My day off - hooraaaaaaaaaay!!!

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Mr Red
Date: 22 Apr 20 - 05:40 AM

Is that the day you go to work?




I'll get my face mask......................

Subject: RE: BS: New news on the pandemic
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 22 Apr 20 - 07:13 AM

No, I work Monday, Tuesday, Thursday & Friday - at home of course at the moment via Teamviewer to our office server. Not the most satisfactory way of working at the moment, because file transfer speeds have been slow this week.