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Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)

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NOT IN THE BOOK


Related threads:
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Joe Offer 14 May 20 - 12:09 AM
Joe Offer 14 May 20 - 12:20 AM
GUEST,Gerry 14 May 20 - 05:47 AM
cnd 14 May 20 - 01:36 PM
EBarnacle 14 May 20 - 02:39 PM
Joe Offer 14 May 20 - 04:54 PM
EBarnacle 15 May 20 - 02:27 PM
Joe Offer 15 May 20 - 03:44 PM
BrooklynJay 15 May 20 - 04:11 PM
Jack Campin 15 May 20 - 05:03 PM
Joe Offer 16 May 20 - 06:55 PM
Joe_F 17 May 20 - 05:58 PM
EBarnacle 17 May 20 - 06:08 PM
Joe Offer 17 May 20 - 06:56 PM
cnd 17 May 20 - 07:46 PM
EBarnacle 17 May 20 - 09:56 PM
Joe Offer 22 May 20 - 11:27 PM
GUEST,Gerry 23 May 20 - 03:23 AM
GUEST,Bo in OH 23 May 20 - 11:34 PM
Joe Offer 24 May 20 - 12:28 AM
Joe Offer 24 May 20 - 05:15 PM
Joe Offer 31 May 20 - 12:11 AM
EBarnacle 03 Jun 20 - 03:17 PM
Joe Offer 03 Jun 20 - 03:43 PM
Joe Offer 08 Jun 20 - 05:34 PM
Joe Offer 27 Jun 20 - 10:43 PM
Joe Offer 11 Jul 20 - 10:05 PM
JennieG 11 Jul 20 - 10:21 PM
Mysha 13 Jul 20 - 02:21 PM
Joe Offer 13 Jul 20 - 04:01 PM
Nigel Parsons 13 Jul 20 - 04:54 PM
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Subject: Rise Up Singing, Volume 3 (online)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 14 May 20 - 12:09 AM

OK, so I'll say more about this later, but one song that has to be in the third volume of Rise Up Singing, is "Log Driver's Waltz."


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Singing, Volume 3 (online)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 14 May 20 - 12:20 AM

I suggested that we should start working on a third volume of the Rise Up Singing Songbook, and Peter Blood and Annie Patterson said, "You do it, Joe!"

So, I think we should make an online songbook at Mudcat.

The first two books were Rise Up Singing and Rise Again. I love both books, and I worked very hard on the second one and continue working on a database to support the books with YouTube videos and background information. But I have to say I don't like many of the songs in these books.


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Singing, Volume 3 (online)
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 14 May 20 - 05:47 AM

I'd like to see more Australian songs in Volume 3. Poison Train, Wee Pot Stove, Do You Think That I Do Not Know, The Ballad of 1891, Weevils in the Flour, Song of the Sheetmetal Worker, Anderson's Coast, The Sandy Hollow Line, He Fades Away, Time is a Tempest, Bare-Legged Kate, Miner's Washing, The Man with the Pink Triangle, The Swaggies Have All Waltzed Matilda Away, The People Have Songs, Hey Rain, Sixteen Million People, Thirty-Ton Line, Past Carin', Of Trees and Humankind, The Outside Track, Year of the Drum, and I could go on....


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Singing, Volume 3 (online)
From: cnd
Date: 14 May 20 - 01:36 PM

It'd certainly be a neat way to make the book more accessible


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Singing, Volume 3 (online)
From: EBarnacle
Date: 14 May 20 - 02:39 PM

Will there be a paid subscription or will it be a labor of love, like the DT?


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Singing, Volume 3 (online)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 14 May 20 - 04:54 PM

No, what I'm thinking of, is having it right here at Mudcat, one thread per chapter, with this thread as the planning thread. I think we need songs that people are likely to actually likely to learn and sing, a treasure of the familiar (but not the trite). And I have a preference for songs people can sing together, at least on the chorus.
Name a chapter title, and give us some songs from that category that you think people would like to sing.
I'm open to suggestions for titles for this songbook. Right now, I think the working title should be Rise Up, Mudcat!

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Singing, Volume 3 (online)
From: EBarnacle
Date: 15 May 20 - 02:27 PM

I've been thinking about your note. I suggest you adopt a format that allows song posts only on the threads. These threads would be posted as links above the list of posters. Discussions could be accommodated by a new category, something like "about: XYZ." This would keep the main song threads from becoming cluttered with commentary and, at the same time, allow people to discuss entries.


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Singing, Volume 3 (online)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 15 May 20 - 03:44 PM

I'm thinking that the finalized chapters will be closed threads, with just the song lyrics - and a separate thread to discuss each chapter and submit links to lyrics (lyrics themselves should be posted in existing or new song threads, following our usual one song/one thread practice.

Any suggestions for chapter titles, so we can start some chapter threads?

I think maybe we shouldn't duplicate songs that are already in Rise Up Singing or Rise Again.

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Singing, Volume 3 (online)
From: BrooklynJay
Date: 15 May 20 - 04:11 PM

I don't have the first two volumes, so I don't know if this has already been used, but...

Murder Ballads

From the sublime to the ridiculous, think of the possibilities.


Jay


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Singing, Volume 3 (online)
From: Jack Campin
Date: 15 May 20 - 05:03 PM

A chapter of Jim Maclean songs.

Ditto for Anne Feeney and David Rovics.

Lockdown balcony songs around the world.


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 16 May 20 - 06:55 PM

A "Murder Ballads" chapter, Jay? Brilliant!

I love my Quaker supervisors from Rise Up Singing, but I don't think they could do a "Murder Ballads" chapter (but they did include "Banks of the Ohio"). Want to post a list of songs?


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: Joe_F
Date: 17 May 20 - 05:58 PM

Fall Down Singing


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: EBarnacle
Date: 17 May 20 - 06:08 PM

As we are talking of an online book, how will you add new offerings to closed threads? Unlike a paper book, there is no reason for a properly curated site to ever close out unless there will be a potential RUS, Volume 4, etc. As Tolkien put it, the road goes ever on.


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 17 May 20 - 06:56 PM

Well, I can add things to closed threads. I can also make them PermaThreads and assign an editor. That's why I think we need "feeder" threads for discussion and suggestions, and then we can add to the final chapter. Only problem is, it's difficult to reorder threads once things have been posted - so it would be hard to have added songs in alphabetical order.
-Joe-

Some subjects:
Murder
Environment
Activism
Justice
Ballads (we already have ballads in RUS and RA)
Sentimental Songs
Blues (We have a good blues chapter in RA)
Planes, Trains, and Automobiles
Ships


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: cnd
Date: 17 May 20 - 07:46 PM

I like the themes, Joe. I think a section on nature could be neat. Potentially related to "Environment," but more about the beauty of nature and appreciating it


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: EBarnacle
Date: 17 May 20 - 09:56 PM

Instead of forcing things into a specific order, perhaps they could simply be indexed and linked, as we now do so that someone looking for x could go down the list of a general subject, click on the title and arrive directly on x, as we already do with threads and songs that relate to subjects under discussion. That would also allow hyperlinking for relevance at the end of an entry, let us say, to a YouTube of the song.
This project seems perfect for overcoming the limitations of paper books. By creating the ability to add versions, you would be creating something closer in spirit to Child's approach to presenting songs than to having people say "This is THE official version of this song. It says so right here right here in the book." I believe we both agree that this is a major objection to people who treat RUS as the authority instead a starting point to making a song their own.


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 22 May 20 - 11:27 PM

"Moonshiner" - I'm a Rambler, I'm a Gambler

Going to the West

Tell Old Bill

Poor Lazarus

Lorena


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 23 May 20 - 03:23 AM

"Going to the West" is on Finest Kind, Lost in a Song. Liner notes say, "Ann [Downey] learned this beautiful, lonesome song of western migration from the singing of Kate Brislin and Jody Stecher. Its lineage before them can be traced through Ginny Hawker and Peggy Seeger to Byron Arnold's 'Folksongs of Alabama'."


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: GUEST,Bo in OH
Date: 23 May 20 - 11:34 PM

Loved both RUS and RA as a starting point for learning songs. After years of digging through "the blue book" I'm still finding new treasures at singarounds. Blessings to you for your work on RA ... a brilliant resource and fitting sequel. The third online is an inspired and intriguing idea. How about a "Great American Songbook" category? Some of these pop songs are getting close to 100 years old;I find it a fascinating trend that some of the seminal singer/songwriters from the 60s and 70s have been covering them, including Dylan and now James Taylor


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 24 May 20 - 12:28 AM

Great American Songbook? Oh, yeah!

First suggestion: Miss Otis Regrets (Cole Porter)


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 24 May 20 - 05:15 PM

The Good in Living

WHEN MCGUINESS GETS A JOB


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 31 May 20 - 12:11 AM

Row On

Innocent Hare (Copper Family)

Wedding Dress

The Last Trip Home (Davy Steele)

Dave Mallet's I Knew this Place and Summer of my Dreams.


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: EBarnacle
Date: 03 Jun 20 - 03:17 PM

Joe, please consider Ella's song. Here is a link to Sweet Honey in the rock's presentation. When I sing it, I change the opening to
"We who believe in freedom shall not rest;
We who believe in justice shall no rest until it comes."
I believe that the concepts of freedom and justice cannot be unlinked.


https://genius.com/Sweet-honey-in-the-rock-ellas-song-lyrics


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 03 Jun 20 - 03:43 PM

I love that song, too, EBarnacle....but we included it in the Rise Again Songbook.


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 05:34 PM

The Rosabella.


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 27 Jun 20 - 10:43 PM

How could we have missed Carrickfergus??

And Leadbelly's Gray Goose


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 11 Jul 20 - 10:05 PM

A classic song that works great for singarounds and pisses off the folk purists, is David Bowie's "Space Oddity."


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: JennieG
Date: 11 Jul 20 - 10:21 PM

Good timing, Joe......"Space Oddity" was released on July 11, 1969!


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: Mysha
Date: 13 Jul 20 - 02:21 PM

The Great American Song Book? Several of the suggestions seem rather Old-Worldly. Is there a specific American-plus origin in mind, or should it rather be kind of a Rise Up Unlimited?

Bye
Mysha


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: Joe Offer
Date: 13 Jul 20 - 04:01 PM

Rise Up Unlimited - songs that are good for singing, especially by groups. But the "Great American Songbook" songs of 1920-1950 are an interesting category that we covered quite well in the previous two books....


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Subject: RE: Rise Up Mudcat!, RUS Volume 3 (online)
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 13 Jul 20 - 04:54 PM

Joe,
Going back to 17/May:
Only problem is, it's difficult to reorder threads once things have been posted - so it would be hard to have added songs in alphabetical order.
I get away with it in the BBC song book threads by opening two tabs with Mudcat, and pasting from one to the other (usually between two 'edit' boxes to retain any format).
Admittedly this loses the name/date of the original post, and the originals don't appear on lists of posted comments. The original name/date could be retained by starting each post with a copy/paste "This post was originally made by Joe Bloggs on 32nd July 2020". Obviously it still won't appear in 'joe bloggs's' list of posts, but it is identifiable. (and not so much problem if posters know in advance, like the DTStudy threads, that the discussion is open to editing actions)

Also, if I know I'm going to be shifting a good number of entries I go through first creating a sufficient number of new posts "This post deliberately blank . . ." so no-one can post something in the middle of my transfer actions.

If it involves a large number of posts you may need one or more volunteers with edit buttons. (Oops, just used the 'v' word.)

Hope this helps. I haven't sent it as a PM as others may have better solutions.

Cheers


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