BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 05:19 PM

I know Bristol a little bit and I'm dead chuffed that Colston's statue was ripped down and dumped in the harbour, where his ships sailed from. I didn't even know that there was a statue of him in Bristol and I think that its presence was an abomination. Well done to the local police for taking a step back but yah boo to Priti Patel who could only spout the formulaic establishment line. Colston made his money via the slave trade and his philanthropy can't disguise that. I've been to the Colston Hall a few times and I'm over the moon that its name will soon be changed. There was a man who does not deserve any kind of glorification.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 05:25 PM

"Because a career criminal guilty in the past of many acts of violence which included the robbery at gunpoint of a heavily pregnant woman died at the hands of a police officer and large riots ensued...."

Blimey. If you believe in the rule of law that you really can't think this. No matter what he's alleged to have done in the past, he was entitled to the same due process as anyone else. I'll remind you that he was unarmed, that the policeman knelt on his neck for nine minutes and that, for most of that time at least, he was no threat to anybody. Think again.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Mossback
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 05:42 PM

Yo, Georgian:

EDUCATE YOURSELF

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Mossback
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 05:45 PM

Its the number of people who actually believe the garbage posted 07 Jun 20 - 05:10 PM that are the cause of the problem, and also the reason that Change Ain't Gonna Come.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Donuel
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 06:19 PM

Mossback, Forgive Georgian bozo walkaround, they know not what they do.
They are less evolved than Steve but education is a good 1st step.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 06:23 PM

I'm a Humanist, I also believe all lives matter...

including folks I don't particularly respect..

.. like for instance.. right wing christians...


btw.. big cheer for Bristol, the best place I ever lived..

For many obvious reasons, some now becoming apparent to the rest of the world...

Told you all before it's a radical progressive city..
.. well.. as much as it can be in tory owned great britain...

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Helen
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 06:31 PM

Georgiansilver, I think the key issue in Black Lives Matter is equality, justice and fairness for all.

If one ethnic or other identifiable group consistently outpaces another ethnic or other identifiable group in some key social measures over centuries not just years or decades, then there is a problem and that problem needs to be not only addressed ("we will commission a report and ignore the recommendations") but resolved satisfactorily for all people, not just for the benefit of one group.

The statistics tell the story. I posted some links to statistical pages on 06 Jun 20 - 08:12 PM.

You will notice from those statistical compilations that some of your statements are corroborated, however the statistics only form a basis for making decisions, formulating strategies and taking positive action. Different people interpret statistics and data differently, and it is important to view the research as objectively and fairly as possible, with minimal personal bias and aim for the best possible outcomes for all people, not just those with a privileged base or with their own agendas.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 06:50 PM

Should have typed mourners not goers, sorry - twitter character limitations and copy/pasting getting the better of me, I'm afraid; but, if you do a web-search, it seems Black Power rather than Black Lives Matter was chanted at the above-mentioned funeral.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 06:58 PM

No classifications of people deserve positive favoured privilege or negative discrimination,
more than any other..

Though, of course, we all have personal prejudices and bias
which tend to inline us to prefer some types over others..
We're only human, after all...

It's the powerful elites who sustain their entitled exceptionalism,
dominating the the rest of us,
by pitting us all against each other in constant pernicious fighting over entrenched differences...

Race is the most classic base nature conflict perpetuated by the rich and powerful'
as a vital tool of their divide and rule...

It was a pleasure to watch the symbolic theatricality of that despised statue being dumped in the river...

The reactionaries who despair at this 'vandalism' to a monument
they stubbornly rallied around,
should be glad the protesters are peacful,
and not coming next to drown them...

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Jeri
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 07:01 PM

I don't know what some of you are trying to say. Seriously, Bonzo's geezer thing makes absolutely no sense. And the stuff about chanting "black power" is just stupid. No evidence, just "I heard".
There are so many non-black people out there in the streets, that I can't see why there would be black racists there. What news source do you have that wants to be Fox? Go look at photos from the various US cities.

For the record, of course all lives matter, but that means black lives matter, and police should stop ending those of unarmed people.
Have there been many that aren't black?

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 07:02 PM

...a CEO in Japan earns about 10 times more than the lowest paid in a company; in Europe it is about 30 times more; and, in the USA, more than 300 times more. So why do so many around the world keep on Americanising? The American free-market way is NOT a good way for humanity.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Jeri
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 07:08 PM

Walkabout, prove it.
I think it's a lie, but proof should be easy to find.

There was no chanting "at the funeral". It was a FUNERAL, for pete's sake.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 07:20 PM

The problem with walky is, on rare occasions, he says something almost sensible enough
we can all agree with..

Then he throws away the goodwill, reverting to his usual highly dubious nonsense...

Same goes for bonz, who sometimes seems to be turning into a bit of a lefty pefty in his more mature years...

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 07:20 PM

"and police should stop ending those of unarmed people" (Jeri)...from the footage I have seen, the manner of the arrest of George Floyd was disgustingly wrong; but attacking property because it is "owned by whites" (without knowing what such "whites" believe in), and chanting Black Power is also wrong.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 07:26 PM

Before the private ceremony began Saturday afternoon, thousands of people from around the country had arrived by car, motorcycle or public transportation to attend a public viewing, NBC affiliate WRAL in Raleigh reported. As a hearse carrying Floyd’s coffin arrived, mourners chanted "black power" and "no justice, no peace" (NBC News)
.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 07:30 PM

walky - life's a bit unfair like that..

especially at times when peaceful society breaks down into angy mob disruption..

What if I wanted to seriously be a fanatical white supremacist thug,
but got my head kicked in on entering their club house
because they found out I was quarter jew...

life is so cruel...

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 07:34 PM

Walky - this latest obsession of yours about shouts of "black power" in earshot of news camera crews...

If it actually happened, anyone, and I mean anyone
could have shouted that..

Don't be so naive...

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 07:39 PM

Not sure which channel I was watching, PFR, but it was either our ITV or BBC news that reported the same.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Jeri
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 07:43 PM

No further replies to whackadoo posts.
PFR, there hasn't been any "angry mob disruption" since the first couple of nights, and from what I understand, that was most likely due to forces other than the Black Lives Matter protesters.

"Most of them appear to be white. They carry no signs and don't want to speak to reporters. Trailed by designated "medics" with red crosses taped to their clothes, these groups head straight for the front lines of the conflict"

From USA Today

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 08:00 PM

"PFR, there hasn't been any "angry mob disruption" since the first couple of nights, and from what I understand, that was most likely due to forces other than the Black Lives Matter protesters."


Jeri - Please understand some of us Brits
are as at least as sophisticated thinkers on these matters as you..

I AM cynical, verging on plausible conspiracy theorist, enough
to presume trumpist agent provocateurs at play in all mass gatherings..

When I'm being amicably sarcastic to reactionary numpties,
it's very likely I'll be talking in generalities to drive home points
they might understand...???...

It's even possible I may be referring to some things that are not even USAcentric...

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 08:08 PM

I'm pretty troubled by this counter-statement "ALL lives matter." I'm thinking that this is likely an extreme racist stance. Those of you who are embracing this need to carefully consider your position. You have thinking to do.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 08:12 PM

Yes and I know you typed those words, pfr, but your context was everything...

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Jeri
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 08:13 PM

PFR, I've never thought you were NOT a "sophisticated thinker". I respect you. When I said "whackadoo", I was referring to WAV, who doesn't seem to be posting about real things. He can't just make things up, and expect people to treat them as facts.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 08:19 PM

This post appeared not to take, so here 'tis again.

"I don't know what some of you are trying to say."

Well you could try just ditching your irrational anti-Brit stance and read the careful posts that folks like pfr and myself are sweating over and articulating as well as we can muster, unlike some of your own recent crudenesses. I note for example that you ditched your earlier FUCK/BOOM negativity (a facility denied to the rest of us, of course, which means that you think you can say what you like with impunity) and all the embarrassing (to you) responses you got to it. As ever, you will of course delete this and the associated crap, your routine modus operandi, because you can't bear to be embarrassingly called out, can you?

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 08:33 PM

Jeri - Yeah.. me and you..
Us Liberal to lefty folks on either side of the Atlantic must try to stick together,
despite all the misunderstandings and negative forces trying to divide us, and set us against each other...


.. and.. walky exists in his own dimension..

I've known folks like him in real life,
we get a lot of weird 'creative people' here in south west England.
It's the Arthurian mystic legends and mushrooms that attracts them here..

We've learnt to try to tolerate them in our social groups..
unless they go full on sword and sorcery warrior 'master-racey' on us..

Even then, we'll probably still continue being sort of friendly despite all that..

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 08:50 PM

A lot of 'em come to folk clubs too...

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Jeri
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 09:25 PM

I don't talk to my neighbors much. We're pretty spread out, and I normally don't want to bother them. The guy who mows my lawn, thought... I mistakenly got into a discussion about Covid-19, and he told me about how it was a virus that escaped from a lab in China, and everybody was overreacting, and the masks were silly, and I disagreed-but didn't feel like arguing. Then a neighbor came over to see if she could hire him, and more of the same paranoid shit. I realized I had some of those Fox viewers around here. I don't even want to hear about their opinions on Black Lives Matter. Nobody I know by choice feels like that.
But you can't change anyone else's opinion, and the only sanity-saving thing I can do is simply not engage.
And don't even get me started on the flat Earth guy I talked to at an art festival a few years ago. but he was actually nice.

But I really have been watching the news way too much.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 11:57 PM

I have to pace myself on the news. Rachel Maddow and usually one of the others, and when I can catch her, Christiane Amanpour (it plays at midnight here, so I've finally cranked up the PBS app that I've got with my regular PBS donation). More than that and I'm a little crazy by bedtime.

My children are bi-racial, and I've been careful not to press them one way or the other. My mother would have been a basket case and made me feel horrible if I'd done anything so dangerous as protesting back in the late 1960s, early 1970s. As it happened, proximity was more a factor than anything else (there wasn't much protesting going on in the places available to me). But in recent years I have marched. As it happens, we are all still so concerned about the COVID-19 that my and their protest activity is concentrated with donations to various causes.

Many of my elderly neighbors are GOP supporters (this is Texas, though urban areas are more liberal), but in the past when I've put up candidate signs in the yard people have stopped and quietly noted they also vote that way. During the last election there were Trump vandals attacking signs and houses if Clinton signs were put out. This time a Biden sign WILL go in the yard, and I'm at an intersection in the road so I can promote it in three different directions, not just to passers-by.

Politically I am aligned with the African American family across the street, and not with the Euramerican neighbors on either side of me, but we're civil, and simply put out yard signs and don't generally talk politics when we meet. We won't be changing each other's minds, but I do hope that they're extremely disappointed come November. I'm really tired of this Groundhog Day world we live in, and a cop in Minneapolis, showing off for his two trainees as he killed a black man, is the one who has finally pushed everyone too far. His misfortune that a 17-year-old girl stood her ground and got the entire thing on video, and that the world was in the COVID-19 suspended animation and had all of the time in the world to pay attention. Dismantle these petty armies of police in cities and train them to serve people, not antagonize them. It's going to be messy, but it needs to be done.

And we don't need any more saccharine poetry from WAV, but since it isn't kind to verbally duel with unarmed opponents, I just try to ignore his nonsense.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Helen
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 12:24 AM

Well said, SRS!

I keep thinking that things could not get much worse in the US and it (he) ramps up another notch.

According to the presenters on Planet America, even some of the Republicans currently in power are starting to back pedal on some of Trump's outrageous behaviour.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Neil D
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 02:29 AM

I'm actually surprised that WAV's posts are able to make it through the shimmering veil that separates us from whatever alternative universe he lives in.
Let's say your house catches on fire, but when the fire department comes out, they start at the other end of the street doing home inspections, because, after all, all houses matter.
Donuel, you said "Defunding should be a less funding with funding of education instead.imo". There are actually two schools of thought on defunding. The more extreme view is a total defunding of departments but more defunders are asking for exactly what you describe. The Minneapolis city council, however, has voted to eliminate their police department entirely. The question becomes: To be replaced by what? There are still going to be people who rob, rape, kill and get into barfights on Saturday night. Will we see a new industry of private police forces available for hire, a disconcerting thought. Just look at the abuses in the privately owned prison industry.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 02:43 AM

I'm proud of the way this has broadened and spread to cover other groups here - the demonstrations in London and elsewhere back home are heartening epecially when you the Government spokesmen (women) desperately using the pandemic to urge people to forget human rights "until all this is over - my arse!)
Australia has taken to the streets - for the Aboriginal People
I'm hoping someone will take up the cudgels here in Ireland for the Travellers, and for the shameful way some towns are treatin the refugees
The double-speak of avoiding demonstrations for safety's sake, while at the same time getting people back to work and children back to school against medical advice is sickening - I heard a new word yesterday; "It's about time we started ignoring the advice of the MEDICRATS - from a business spokesman
Let's hope they can't foll all of the people all of the time, this time !
Jim

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 05:15 AM

Apparently S Korean police shoot rioters with purple dye and spend the next week rounding them up and arresting them.
Sounds like a plan for those who do not protest within the law and within lockdown rules.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 06:19 AM

How were you when it came to Saddam's statue being illegally hauled down, Bonzo? Just wondering...

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Donuel
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 06:41 AM

The global reaction to George Floyds death was so unlikely, if there had even been sports, the slow motion murder would have faded into obscurity. To a degree sports is an opiate to the masses. Opiates have become the real opiates of society but my point is that by simple unlikely fate there were no distractions away from outrage and protest.
Sports was not the main factor of distraction. That would probably be the isolation and everyone being subject to the i phone video.

Dear Brits, over here the only type of people saying all lives matter are the most blatant racists. It a peculiarity I know but words and phrases differ.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 06:46 AM

Change on the way? Maybe some temporary change in the short term until the outrage dies down. But it would be a pretty safe bet that th elites will be doing everything to restore the status quo as soon as possible to appease their bigoted supporter base.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Donuel
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 06:50 AM

It has become indelible in a way that can not fade like the assasination of MLK or JFK

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 07:09 AM

How can there ever be change when the UK Home Secretary shows more outrage over the damage of a ****ing statue of a slave trader than the death of a black man at the hands of police? what's the point.... humanity is f****d.   Sorry for my profanity

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: gillymor
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 07:25 AM

Jim Carroll, here's a site that tracks polls in the U.S. and allows you to view trends.

project five thirty eight

I don't think it includes a CNN poll that came out this morning that has Biden up by 14 points nationally. His anti-constitutional publicity stunt in Lafayette Square last Monday seems to have done considerable damage in most quarters. It's mobilized a number of well-respected former and current military higher ups against him, Colin Powell called him a liar, hardly news, yesterday on national TV and expressed support for Biden.
It's almost 5 months until the election but it's a good bet he'll become more crazy and desperate in the interim.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Donuel
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 07:26 AM

We were only one timely basketball game and beer away from ignoring this entire issue.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: gillymor
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 07:37 AM

Yep, the constraints of social distancing have allowed casual trump supporters the time to assess his incompetency and derangement, qualities his die hard supporters probably find admirable.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: gillymor
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 07:50 AM

In responding to Jim's request I seem to have gotten off track. Carry on.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 08:13 AM

Thanks Gilly
I dread to think what card he'll play next but you can bet it will be aimed at redneck populism
Jim

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Donuel
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 08:29 AM

No doubt Jim some demonstrators have sacrificed their lives in the demonstrations during this pandemic. It is that important. I am in a land where a quarter of all the infections in the world festers.
The trends and outcome lag by about 4 weeks.
Lies and slogans can fool the people in the short run.
We are all living in the long run now.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 08:56 AM

Steve Shaw - The statue shouldn't have been taken down in the way it was but it should have been removed from our streets a long time ago.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 09:24 AM

You sound like Starmer, Bonzo. Personally, I can't blame people for taking things into their own hands. Had they not torn down that detestable statue it might have stood there for years, for decades or forever. They've been arguing for years in Bristol about rewording the inscription on the plinth and done nothing. There's still impasse over renaming the Colston Hall. There are deluded people arguing that we shouldn't change these things "because you can't erase history." Bunkum. You won't learn much about the history in question by going to a gig at the Colston or walking by that statue. There are people defending him saying what a great bloke he was for founding schools and almshouses. They're not telling you that it was slave money that paid for those things. His slaving company overcrowded their ships with captives who had been branded on the chest with his company's initials and thrown overboard when they died, twenty thousand of them. Huffing and puffing about justifiably angry people throwing his statue into the harbour doesn't sit very well with me. All power to them. Either we quietly drop the "illegal" bit, as the police sensibly appeared to do, or we make the law an ass.

"Dear Brits, over here the only type of people saying all lives matter are the most blatant racists."

Bravo, Donuel.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 10:12 AM

From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 05:19 PM

I know Bristol a little bit and I'm dead chuffed that Colston's statue was ripped down and dumped in the harbour, where his ships sailed from. I didn't even know that there was a statue of him in Bristol and I think that its presence was an abomination. Well done to the local police for taking a step back but yah boo to Priti Patel who could only spout the formulaic establishment line. Colston made his money via the slave trade and his philanthropy can't disguise that. I've been to the Colston Hall a few times and I'm over the moon that its name will soon be changed. There was a man who does not deserve any kind of glorification.



From: Steve Shaw - PM
Date: 07 Jun 20 - 05:25 PM

"Because a career criminal guilty in the past of many acts of violence which included the robbery at gunpoint of a heavily pregnant woman died at the hands of a police officer and large riots ensued...."

Blimey. If you believe in the rule of law that you really can't think this. No matter what he's alleged to have done in the past, he was entitled to the same due process as anyone else. I'll remind you that he was unarmed, that the policeman knelt on his neck for nine minutes and that, for most of that time at least, he was no threat to anybody. Think again.

And, if you believe in the rule of law you wouldn't condone the police stepping back.
The two are in no way equivalent, but belief in the rule of law applies to both. You can't choose to only support it when it matches your own beliefs, that way lies anarchy.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 10:56 AM

You appear to be equating the removal of a hated statue which celebrated a slave trader whose company killed 20000 black people with the brutal killing of an unarmed, untried man by a policeman who thereby denied him due process. So I'll ask you what I asked Bonzo: how did you feel about the illegal toppling of the statue of Saddam Hussain? I only ask because, as far as I recall, I didn't hear much huffing and puffing from the white establishment over that...

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: An Buachaill Caol Dubh
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 10:57 AM

There are many statues of people once admired but now, for one reason or another, despised or at least found "problematical". A statue of Churchill in London, it has been reported, now has some added information about his being a racist. Unlikely that it will be subject to more lasting alteration, of whatever kind. True, he might have commended an RAF officer called Harris for planning to "pacify" tribesmen in the Middle East by dropping poison gas from biplanes, and continued by opining that these methods might be employed against "the industrial cities of the North" [of Britain, that is], but he was an appropriately aggressive PM in wartime. That statue will slouch for a long time.

For a long time, in Scotland, people have raised concerns about a colossal statue of the Duke of Sutherland perched high on a massive pedestal set atop a hill above Dornoch and facing towards the sea; the traditional saying is, "he turned his back on the people". The Strathnavar Evictions provide one of the most notorious examples of the attitudes of the British ruling classes towards the Common People, an episode in a long process of dispossession commonly known as The Highland Clearances ( though not limited to the Highlands of Scotland). Some of my own ancestors were "cleared" in the name of Progress and the pursuit of wealth. It is incontestable that many died as a consequence of such actions. Down through the years there have been numerous attempts to remove this offensive landmark, this perpetual reminder that some are born to own the land, and some are born to work it for as long as they're permitted to by their "betters". So far, the legal route has met with the kind of attention to be expected; so far, the more direct methods have not, yet, succeeded. Perhaps now there will be widespread support for this laudable effort to remove a statue of someone who ought, now, to be regarded and identified specifically as one more powerful person from the Past whose actions caused immense human suffering and grief. Perhaps; but I ain't holding my breath.

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 10:57 AM

Peaceful" in relation to these BLM scumbags just took a nosedive. This was anarchy, disrespect and anti-British and should be punished and the book thrown at the little toe rag who tried to set fire to the cenotaph flag. We, the British people, are SICK and TIRED of this CRAP!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Black Lives Matter - change on the way?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 08 Jun 20 - 11:02 AM

Best if you just speak for yourself really. Most of the BLM demonstrators on British streets were, er....British....