BS: Trump Actions & Effects (NO new Trmp threads!)

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Nov 21 - 01:25 PM

That sounds like trouble in paradise for Don Jr.
"Kim who? ... Oh we dated a couple times but she's NOT family."

What next, Don Sr., hitting up Tiffany's Greek billionaire fiance' for a loan?

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 19 Nov 21 - 08:57 AM

Please Don't squeeze the Q anon charmin.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 19 Nov 21 - 09:26 AM

Ya know I would gladly vote for a healthy 80 year old John McCain at this point, if only to steer the Republican party back to sanity.
Even if Liz Cheney were his running mate.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 19 Nov 21 - 09:43 AM

McCarthy took to the floor last night and spoke for 8 hours during the period when there wasn't a limit on remarks. I suspect some of that jabber will be used against him later.

Today they'll vote on the bill they tried to vote on last night before they were so rudely interrupted.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 19 Nov 21 - 10:57 AM

Similar to the scene where Brian (Life of Brian) addressed a crowd, McCarthy asked "No one voted for Biden to be FDR" whereupon several Democrats exclaimed "i did".

Chronicling the events of the confederates and insurrectists are mainly Stilly River Sage (a clever double entendre) and Donuel. Stilly is the west coast Washingtonian while I am the east coast Washingtonian. She prefers straight reporting while I play the color man.

I have assumed a coming conflagration moving past the cold civil war tactics we now encounter. I also assume Stilly does not have such predilictions. However I am sure worry is another matter.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 19 Nov 21 - 12:58 PM

here is the missing -ion-

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: robomatic
Date: 19 Nov 21 - 03:10 PM

I think the Kyle Rittenhouse verdict will be interpreted as good news for the Trmpers.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 19 Nov 21 - 07:32 PM

Of course. In a land where we have never been able to pass an anti lynching law it is SOP to allow white vigilantes to shoot who they please at what was essentially a race riot.

As for kyle he was easily manipulated by white power thugs to flash WP hand signs while out on 'their' bail money.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 20 Nov 21 - 06:46 AM

One thing about cases such as this one is that we recipients of selective media information can never know all that is needed to know in order to properly judge the case. Ironically, there is more than a hint of lynch mentality in that last post. Accept the verdict of the jury and move on. The system might be flawed but it's the best we've got. Just shrug and get on with life. I'd much rather you made a bloody great big fuss about your stupid laws that allow all and sundry to tote guns around as if they're Billy The Kid.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 20 Nov 21 - 08:17 AM

The point that guns have evolved is a very important fact. We re still allowing guns to evolve. The ultimate evolution of the gun will be a gun that causes the victim to immediately see things from your point of view. Eventually the gun will be the ultimate peace keeper, meanwhile guns are still in a primtive dinosaur blood and gore phase.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 20 Nov 21 - 09:35 AM

The Rittenhouse verdict shows, to me, that the US, as a country, will take years or even decades to prove that it is worthy as calling itself part of civilised society.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 20 Nov 21 - 09:44 AM

Another white guy gets away with murder. He'll dine out on this the rest of his life—with the proviso that people who become famous this way don't, in my experience, lead long, productive lives.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 20 Nov 21 - 11:50 AM

Well the jury didn't agree with you. There's just the small chance that they knew a bit more detail and nuance than we did.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 20 Nov 21 - 12:41 PM

Stop right there. There was a bizarre judge in this case, who among other things, wouldn't let the prosecution refer to the men killed and injured as "victims." It was a really strange case, but a 17-year-old kid has been thoroughly vetted in the court of public opinion and found to have travelled across state lines gunning for a fight, he got it, and he should rot in jail. As the meme making the rounds today says:

"I jumped into the Polar Bear enclosure at the zoo, then had to kill all the polar bears in self-defense."

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 20 Nov 21 - 01:06 PM

There is also a good chance that the jury were not objective and were strongly influenced by the opinions and guidance of the judge, and the conduct of the trial. I am sure I read, somewhere, there was only one black jury member who was referred to in the trial as 'the black'.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 20 Nov 21 - 04:53 PM

"Stop right there."

Wow. Now I don't know exactly what was going through his mind. In this country, murder means that you killed someone with malicious intent. That he killed people is not in doubt. The malicious intent was challenged. The case was put and the jury failed to convict. So less of the "stop right there" if you don't mind. I'm expressing uncertainty, not saying he shouldn't have been convicted. You're expressing lynch-mob certainty ("rot in jail," etc.) in the face of a judge and jury who had far more evidence to hand then you have. You may be right. As with masks, I'm in awe of your certainty. As I age, I'm finding that I see things less and less in black and white. By the way, a wise prosecution service can see this kind of thing coming. There are various levels of manslaughter charges available, and it's possible to pass a guilty verdict but with the mitigation of diminished responsibility. An all-or-nothing murder charge levelled at a panicky teenager that could send him to his death is a downright risky strategy, and the risk on this occasion hasn't paid off. Blame your inept justice system.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 20 Nov 21 - 05:31 PM

I note that your president shares my view that we should accept the verdict of the jury. We can't pick and choose, can we? We can express disappointment loud and clear but undermining the justice system is not an option.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 20 Nov 21 - 06:28 PM

Tone deaf is tone deaf. I watched the entire televised trial on a channel without commercials. Even what one could see in 2 dimensions was shocking, like the judge brewing a cup of coffee and doodling on his lap top at the bench paying no attention to the prosecution's final argument which was the most brilliant of the trial. What is not said is still communcation. The judge was rapt when the defense delivered the final argument that had 4 exclamations of "Comon People" and " The state only has video out of focus hocus pocus ". (the HD version was witheld)
The prosecution chose its charges poorly to begin with.
I'm not surprised at the verdict, afterall even Zimmerman was cleared with a self defense plea.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 21 Nov 21 - 06:55 AM

Here in the Land of Oz we have people protesting vaccine mandates holding a sign saying " Jab mandate vaccinations without exemptions are a violation of our 14th constitution amendment!"

posted on this facebook page, Sunday 21st Nov Australian time with a comment -
These two people were protesting in Mt Gambier, South Australia this week.

The 14th amendment is part of the Constitution of United States of America, made in 1868 after the US Civil War to guarantee citizenship and equal civil and legal rights to African Americans and the formerly enslaved.

How deluded do you have to be to think the US Constitution applies here? ...

sandra
I'm not on facebook so can't link directly to the post

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 21 Nov 21 - 09:54 AM

The last few bickering posts have been removed - let's leave this to the discussion of Trump, please.

Fueled by Trump-inspired grievance, attempts to terrorize public officials escalate
Through public records requests, several previously unreported incidents came to light — while Capitol Police officials say the agency expects to log more than 9,000 threats this year.

When Rep. Joe Neguse delivered his closing remarks in February at the impeachment trial of former President Donald Trump, he expressed concern about the direction of a nation that weeks earlier witnessed a homegrown attack in its capital.

“I fear, like many of you do, that the violence we saw on that terrible day may be just the beginning,” said Neguse, D-Colo., who as an impeachment manager had a nationally televised role in prosecuting Trump on a charge that he incited the mob that stormed the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6.

Neguse ended optimistically, offering a favorite quote from Martin Luther King Jr.: “I’ve decided to stick with love. Hate is too great a burden to bear.”

The Senate acquitted Trump. A day later, Valentine’s Day, the propulsive threatening discourse that Neguse worried was taking root in American democracy landed on his doorstep.

A suspicious letter mailed to the congressman’s home was opened to reveal a picture of Neguse clipped from The New York Times. An unknown substance, suspected to be feces, marked an “X” over the photo, according to records kept by the police department in Lafayette, Colorado, and obtained by NBC News.

The disturbing incident, which has not been previously reported, was referred to the Capitol Police for investigation and is among the more than 9,000 threats the agency is expected to log this year. It’s also representative of the escalating security risks confronting public officials from the federal and state levels down to local school boards.

“I had one person call and say, ‘This is the gun I’m going to use. I’m going to put three bullets in the back of his head,’” Rep. Adam Schiff, D-Calif., said last month on MSNBC. “You find yourself feeling uncomfortable sitting next to an open window in your home. And that’s not something I ever thought I would have to think in this country.”

Quantifying exactly how dangerous things have become is a challenge, but even elections officials — a less prominent rung of public service that is nonetheless central to democracy — are reporting threats.

And officials with the Capitol Police, the agency responsible for protecting members of Congress, have said they expect the number of threats against members to surpass the 8,600 handled in 2020 and continue a significant surge during the Trump era. In 2017, the first year of Trump’s one term, only 3,900 threats were reported. (The department is not subject to the Freedom of Information Act, making specifics scarce.)

The rest of the article is at the link; on the bottom paywall click to read now without supporting the site.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 21 Nov 21 - 09:59 AM

Trump tells Navarro to 'protect executive privilege' in House COVID-19 probe

Former President Trump said Saturday in a statement that he is telling former aide Peter Navarro to “protect executive privilege” amid a House probe into the federal government’s response to the COVID-19 pandemic.

“The Communist Democrats are engaging in yet another Witch Hunt, this time going after my Administration’s unprecedented and incredible coronavirus response, despite the fact that, sadly, more Americans have died this year from COVID than in all of 2020,” Trump said in a statement shared through his spokesperson, Liz Harrington.

“I’m telling Peter Navarro to protect executive privilege and not let these unhinged Democrats discredit our great accomplishments,” Trump added.

If you happen to see any of the messaging coming out of Trump's Florida home he is still calling himself "President Donald Trump" and has as much pomp and letterhead as he thinks he can get away with to try to look like he still has some presidential powers.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 21 Nov 21 - 10:06 AM

And here is possibly the most bizarre recent development of all - the suggestion that if the House is majority GOP after 2022 that they should "install Donald Trump as the Speaker of the House." Bearing in mind that the head of the Senate or the House is the chief strategy person for their party and runs the whole institution in a supposedly honorable and responsible way (one could argue the Newt Gingrich was one of the first really corrupt officials to turn that on its head, and McConnell is still there with his lizard-brain trying to defeat Democracy.)

The 'Donald Trump for speaker' idea won't die

Earlier this week in an interview with onetime Trump White House political guru Steve Bannon, Mark Meadows said aloud what lots of Trump-y types have been thinking for a while.

Meadows, who served as Trump's White House chief of staff, said that if Republicans regain the House majority in 2022, they should install the former President as speaker in January 2023.

"I would love to see the gavel go from (House Speaker) Nancy Pelosi to Donald Trump," Meadows told Bannon. "You talk about melting down -- people would go crazy."

Meadows may be the most prominent Trump ally to float the idea, but he isn't the first.

In June, the former President had this exchange with conservative radio talk-show host Wayne Allyn Root:

ROOT: "Why not, instead of just waiting for 2024, and I'm hoping you run in 2024, but why not run in 2022 for the United States Congress, a House seat in Florida, win big, lead us to a dramatic landslide victory, taking the House by 50 seats, and then you become the speaker of the House?"

TRUMP: "You know, it's very interesting. That's so interesting. And people have said, run for the Senate, OK, run for the Senate, but you know what? Your idea might be better. It's very interesting."

In a subsequent interview with Fox News, House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy seemed to give the idea even more credence.

"You know, I have talked to President Trump many times," McCarthy told Fox's Brian Kilmeade. "He tells me he wants to be speaker, and I think he should be president."

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 21 Nov 21 - 01:49 PM

The audacity of Trump includes his recent attempt to send his 'diplomat' to a foreign country for policy talks.
The country declined.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 21 Nov 21 - 05:22 PM

Calling a stroke penalty on oneself is a honorable act in golf as well.
The Republican party’s vilification of members of Congress who have criticized Donald Trump or supported bipartisan legislation is “ruining America”, New Hampshire’s governor, Chris Sununu, said on Sunday, adding another tacit voice to the small but growing internal opposition to the former president.
The Republican party has ruled that Senator Cheney is not a Republicn anymore and may in fact not even be a white supremist.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 21 Nov 21 - 08:23 PM

This is not low-level pandering material.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 22 Nov 21 - 12:32 AM

following Donuel's post of 21 Nov 21 - 01:49 PM

Trump ‘Shadow Diplomacy’? Deploys ‘Ambassador’ To Address Serbia-Kosovo Tensions

The Biden White House mocked Trump’s claim to have an ‘envoy ambassador’ making foreign visits for him

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Nov 21 - 07:43 AM

The Trump Speaker idea is bizarre news to me. What State could he represent? Maybe being a Senator would be better. He could replace Manchin.
The world got used to 2 Popes so maybe 2 Presidents in the goverment only seems rational to some. What if Donald loses the Speaker choice?
I am more befuddled by these ideas than the convolutions of black holes.
Thus is the nature of history and rewriting history with misinformation and 'Patriot Purge' ideas that are clearly represented in the history of Rome. Holy Shit, I am becoming Senator Byrd!
Bottom line...The bizarre is as normal as quantum mechanics.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Nov 21 - 09:02 AM

The bizarre is normal like quantum mechanics.
The facts are then corn holed by wanton fanatics.
Philosophers try to order our mind
but stark raving nuts is all that they find.
So lets all hand over our rational thought
to AI computers and crack pot robots.

donuel

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Nov 21 - 11:46 AM

The new normal
like a guillotine
The new normal is growing so fast and furious I just can't keep up.
Like in WW II the new normal is created in courts and by bullets.
It ended in a new technological conflagration of incineration.
A pandemic has created new normals that I can't count.
63 dead per some mass shootings is beyond my scope.
Today we learned to never attend holiday parades.
A lame duck President inciting murder in DC.
Lies are faster than the speed of sound.
Keyboard Nazis defend a new liberty.
A freedom to never ever vaccinate.
They say Democrats eat babies.
Its not said, if or maybe.
Dehumanization is easy.
When facts are flimsy
and lies are louder
We're going down
faster each day
in such a way
you can't
believe
it.








pretty soon you will lose you head

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Nov 21 - 01:37 PM

Mister Trouble never hangs around
When he hears this Mighty sound.

"Here I come to save the day"

That means that Rittenhaus is on his way.
Yes sir, when there is a wrong to right
Rittenhaus will join the fight.
On the sea or on the land,
He gets the situation well in hand.

source: http://www.lyricsondemand.com/tvthemes/mightymouselyrics.html

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Nov 21 - 06:28 PM

Roger Stone and Alex Jones are now subpeoned by the 1-6 commitee.

If they also refuse to appear like Bannon, will they share a cell?

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 23 Nov 21 - 08:04 AM

3 Republican congressmen have offered Kyle Rittenhaus a staff position.
Best of all is Trump's endorsement for Kyle to be President of the NRA.
This has dissapointed the Proud Boys who hoped to appoint Kyle as their Grand Tyranysaurus in charge of BLM demonstration security. ":^/
A rash of Soutern lawfirms are now advertising "Get away with murder- ask us how". New standards for self defense are being developed as we speak.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 24 Nov 21 - 01:52 PM

Verdicts against the nazi demonstrators in Charlotsville that ended in murder include a 25 million dollar award to victims.

The Aubry murder resulted in all 3 white men guilty of felony murder.

Only 34 members of proud boy or oath keepers are under federal arrest for the 1-6 crimes.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 25 Nov 21 - 07:07 AM

There is no going into the past and killing Hitler. There is no warning from the past or present that would kill Trump revenge so I resign my watch hoping the actions of good people sway the future toward peace.
Suspect anyone who has motives to downplay the importance of Trump fascism. Condemn the actual Trump advocate. Silence or hiding only works for the few in a land of malious landmine ideas.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: robomatic
Date: 29 Nov 21 - 07:32 PM

The CIA has a cool website with much of interest both information and historically. In the latter category is some recent writing on what it was like to brief the former occupant
.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 01 Dec 21 - 09:58 AM

Vanity Fair has an ad that runs in my Instagram feed that suggests Ivanka Trump will be the next one to be charged in this whole Trump Crimes being prosecuted (in particular, she got in early in the 2017 inauguration committee, where millions of dollars were siphoned off to various individuals). That ad has been running for ages and still hasn't proven to be what is happening, so I guess I didn't miss anything by not subscribing to another online journal. And Rachel Maddow will talk about it if it happens.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: robomatic
Date: 09 Dec 21 - 06:38 PM

Fresh Air's Terry Gross is interviewing Barton Gellman today:

from The Atlantic: Trump's Next Coup has Already Begun

by Barton Gellman a Pultzer Prize winning journalist.

I guess the grimmest understanding of this article is that Trump will run in 2024 and Republicans are working legislative assemblies and State governents as well as officials who are in the ratification lineup of the next election. As well as electors.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 09 Dec 21 - 08:21 PM

For awhile I have reminded folks that the Putin path to success is to control those who count the votes and not the voters. Sledgehammers are being replaced by jack hammers that are cutting the base of pillars that hold up Democracy and the meaning of elections. Meanwhile the Democrats are studying marketing 101 while the Republicans are getting their PHD.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 11 Dec 21 - 03:44 PM

I pulled up Google News and see that Trump is clouding "Pence's effort to lay groundwork for 2024 presidential bid." That's fine - neither of them belongs in high office.

In another thread, Devin Nunes is not going to run again (Yes!) for Congress next year, instead choosing to run the new Trump media company (already under investigation because of huge donations from Saudi sources).

In many ways, Nunes is embracing the role his detractors have long accused him of playing, as Trump’s ultimate yes man. Early in the Trump presidency, leading Democrats fumed that he was walking away from his grave responsibilities as chair of the House intelligence committee to be Trump’s “stooge” and “fixer”. Now, though, he is walking away from Congress to serve Trump, without pretending that anything else is at stake.

Further down in the same article: "Some of that divisiveness, and the chaos that often erupts in its wake, is likely to greet him as he starts his new job. Two financial regulatory agencies are already investigating a $1.25bn business deal to take the Trump Media & Technology Group public."

The news that is most likely to sink Trump is that Capitol attack panel obtains PowerPoint that set out plan for Trump to stage coup
(Presentation turned over by Mark Meadows made several recommendations for Trump to pursue to retain presidency) This one is more than thinking out loud. This one, even though it's pixels, is in print.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Dec 21 - 06:58 AM

A giant screen powerpoint presentation is new criminal evidence!?

I remember the days of microfilm being used by enemies of the state.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 15 Dec 21 - 06:42 AM

Trump's chief of staff Mark Meadows is trying to shovel out his barn but he is no Hercules. His book 'Chief of the chief' went on sale to the consternation of Trump and has caused Mark to now call his own book to be fake news. Now it looks like he will go to jail for not showing up in contempt of Congress. Courts have ruled against his claims of executive priviledge. Is he the first rat to be trapped on the sinking ship of insurrection?

I am hopeful my side bet on a failure of democracy will be lost.
Too many failures of the coup and an honorable judiciary appear to be the saving grace.

Some say Mark Meadows is the John Dean of the former president. More bad news for Donald is that his tax returns can finally be scrutinized by the 1-6 commitee and his accountant is testifying against him.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: robomatic
Date: 15 Dec 21 - 01:53 PM

The 'saving grace' of many in the Trump regime was that their self-regard inserted large streaks of incompetence into their multi-level abuses of power.

Unfortunately this is simply schooling for the next time. This is not only a partisan observation. The ways of subversion know no ideology.

Over fifteen years ago I was conversing with a man in Walmart based only on our waiting in the same line and wearing tags that indicated we were working for the same company. I made some non-partisan light comment on national politics and he went off, not so much on me, but on the horrible horrible leftists endangering the country and how they needed to go against the wall. I came away a little bit shaken with the amount of emotion that erupted.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 15 Dec 21 - 05:00 PM

You'd do yourself a favor to listen to the thoughts of historian Heather Cox Richardson. I catch her every couple of weeks, and this particular one was shared today by a friend (it's a few days old) and I sat through the hour amazed at what she knows but also at how clearly she tells the story of history.

The large reason lots of the social programs of today are under fire is because of the rich slave owners in the first 150 years of the country, trying to either hold onto their slaves and prosperous system of government, or keep freed slaves and other poor people from voting in a way that would mean they get services and help from the government (that the rich southern landowners would be taxed for).

Trump is, in her telling, a symptom of the problem.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 15 Dec 21 - 07:32 PM

She reminded me that 90% of citizens have not taken poli sci 101 or know the true stench of States Rights. You did hear her take on the pendulum of politics? I erroneously take for granted that people know the American timeline and swinging ideology. My wife taught the history of American economics at Georgetown which makes for interesting conversation at home and dad was a Constitutional Law professor. What I consider dumbed down posts for social media maybe isn't if the audience has few fundamentals. or not.
Richardson is a good professor.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Dec 21 - 06:48 AM

Your saving grace post is true and also if the competant are discovered - they are fired or thrown under the bus.

What is the Trump 2024 dream team?
VP Mike Lindell
Senate leader Steve King
Speaker Jim Jordan (sorry Margie) he's a man.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Dec 21 - 08:34 AM

The subject of modern slavery probably can't be approached here. The third rail for the right is slavery while there is still a lust for slavery among the extremists. They want it but have to a go at it obliquely with nullification, institutionalized racism and private prison labor.
Slavery is still an existential global problem!
At any given time in 2016, an estimated 40.3 million people are in modern slavery, including 24.9 million in forced labour and 15.4 million in forced marriage.
It means there are 5.4 victims of modern slavery for every 1,000 people in the world.
1 in 4 victims of modern slavery are children.
Out of the 24.9 million people trapped in forced labour, 16 million people are exploited in the private sector such as domestic work, construction or agriculture; 4.8 million persons in forced sexual exploitation, and 4 million persons in forced labour imposed by state authorities.
Women and girls are disproportionately affected by forced labour, accounting for 99% of victims in the commercial sex industry, and 58% in other sectors.
Source: Global Estimates of Modern Slavery: Forced Labour and Forced Marriage , Geneva, September 2017.

With recent Supream Court decisions states rights could include a form of elective slavery just short of purchased ownership of people in states like Mississippi or Texas that could bypass the judiciary. This may not be as hypothetical as you think. Republican think tanks 'dare to dream'.
It does depend on how you define Democracy.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Dec 21 - 11:31 AM

Kanye is an ethinicutioner. (a traitor to his own people.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Dec 21 - 05:15 PM

Its odd how folks are awed with election fraud.
Secret squads casting broad flaws from abroad?
The rest applaud and nod to the Fox facade of
lies.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: robomatic
Date: 17 Dec 21 - 07:16 PM

Slightly off topic, but over the years working in the oil 'bidness' even in Alaska i've run into both Southerners and Texans (I think Texans are in a class by themselves). And have heard the argument, usually as an aside because it's not worth having and out-and-out about the (US) Civil War across regional lines. But two cute responses have come up.

The first is from my favorite engineer who grew up hardscrabble in Pennsylvania and does not suffer fools. When he heard folks try to call it "The War Between The States" his response was simply:

"Losers don't get to name the War!"

And for those who argue that the War was about States' Rights not Slavery, there is the original argument from President Abraham Lincoln, which I've read but don't remember word for word:

"You can't argue for a level of freedom for yourself when that is exactly what you are denying to a whole class of people under your power."

As usual, Lincoln understood it fully and expressed it best. If the United States is ever before a divine tribunal, it will be the words and actions of Lincoln that will represent the best in us.

Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 19 Dec 21 - 08:44 AM

Three US Generals warn of a 2024 insurrection and a break in the chain of command between the Army and National Guard.
They do not think the riots are as dead as Disko;

Everybody, storm the Congress, let's riot
Don't fight the feeling, get out and fight it
fake, fake, fake, fake fake fake
Fake election, fake election

Oh, fake fake fake, fake fake fake
Fake mailed ballots, fake mailed ballots
Oh, you can, you can do it very well
You're the best in the world, I can tell

Oh, fake fake fake, fake fake fake
Fake election, fake election
Oh, stop the steal, stop the steal
Fake Joe Biden, fake Joe Biden, get real

fake fake fake, fake fake fake
Oh, Fake election, fake election
Shake the cops, shake the cops
Oh, fake fake fake, fake fake fake

Shake your booty, shake your booty
You can do it, do it
Shake shake, shake shake
Shake policemen, shake policemen

Shake shake, shake shake
Laws are all fake
Right down there, sister
Shake shake, (c'mon) shake shake

Come on do your duty
Oh, do your duty