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BS: Trump Actions and Effects

gillymor 11 Jan 21 - 09:14 AM
HuwG 11 Jan 21 - 09:04 AM
gillymor 11 Jan 21 - 09:03 AM
Jack Campin 11 Jan 21 - 08:30 AM
gillymor 11 Jan 21 - 06:39 AM
Stilly River Sage 11 Jan 21 - 12:47 AM
robomatic 10 Jan 21 - 11:39 PM
Steve Shaw 10 Jan 21 - 09:16 PM
robomatic 10 Jan 21 - 09:07 PM
Steve Shaw 10 Jan 21 - 07:46 PM
Stilly River Sage 10 Jan 21 - 06:49 PM
Helen 10 Jan 21 - 06:20 PM
Steve Shaw 10 Jan 21 - 05:57 PM
Helen 10 Jan 21 - 05:19 PM
Donuel 10 Jan 21 - 05:02 PM
punkfolkrocker 10 Jan 21 - 02:43 PM
Donuel 10 Jan 21 - 01:42 PM
Donuel 10 Jan 21 - 12:08 PM
Jeri 10 Jan 21 - 12:05 PM
Donuel 10 Jan 21 - 11:53 AM
Stilly River Sage 10 Jan 21 - 10:47 AM
Jeri 10 Jan 21 - 10:37 AM
Donuel 10 Jan 21 - 09:54 AM
Donuel 10 Jan 21 - 09:49 AM
Donuel 10 Jan 21 - 09:40 AM
The Sandman 10 Jan 21 - 08:58 AM
Raggytash 10 Jan 21 - 08:47 AM
Donuel 10 Jan 21 - 08:04 AM
Donuel 10 Jan 21 - 07:52 AM
Steve Shaw 10 Jan 21 - 05:06 AM
Steve Shaw 10 Jan 21 - 04:34 AM
DMcG 10 Jan 21 - 03:47 AM
The Sandman 10 Jan 21 - 03:08 AM
leeneia 10 Jan 21 - 02:00 AM
robomatic 09 Jan 21 - 09:54 PM
Doug Chadwick 09 Jan 21 - 09:36 PM
punkfolkrocker 09 Jan 21 - 09:15 PM
Steve Shaw 09 Jan 21 - 09:07 PM
punkfolkrocker 09 Jan 21 - 08:56 PM
Steve Shaw 09 Jan 21 - 08:25 PM
punkfolkrocker 09 Jan 21 - 07:58 PM
Steve Shaw 09 Jan 21 - 07:38 PM
SPB-Cooperator 09 Jan 21 - 07:34 PM
Steve Shaw 09 Jan 21 - 07:17 PM
Donuel 09 Jan 21 - 05:42 PM
SPB-Cooperator 09 Jan 21 - 04:55 PM
Donuel 09 Jan 21 - 03:39 PM
Donuel 09 Jan 21 - 03:29 PM
robomatic 09 Jan 21 - 03:14 PM
punkfolkrocker 09 Jan 21 - 03:03 PM

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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: gillymor
Date: 11 Jan 21 - 09:14 AM

lol


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: HuwG
Date: 11 Jan 21 - 09:04 AM

As an aside, I read that the Capitol rioter seen walking off with the Speaker's lectern is to be tried in Florida.

I'd love to be the judge who asks "Will your client be taking the stand?"


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: gillymor
Date: 11 Jan 21 - 09:03 AM

I've seen video over and over again of a small force of Capitol Police trying to hold off the large mob in the Capitol bldg. and one of them was murdered in the endeavor so I can't get on board with a blanket condemnation of their performance. There were some bad actors among them and that is being investigated. The FBI warned the CP of the possibility of violence at the demonstration but did little to prevent it. It is their job, the FBI, to deal with threats of domestic terrorism and they came up woefully short in that department. There's plenty of blame to go around and no doubt some will find it's way to the White House for failing to act until things were too far along.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Jack Campin
Date: 11 Jan 21 - 08:30 AM

Video of entrance tunnel to the Capitol during the riot

That's the kind of newsgathering I can respect. The photographer worked his way through the crowd right up to the police line. Punctures a few myths:

- there was nothing very odd about the crowd. They weren't inbred freaks, they were normal-looking guys.

- they weren't acting particularly crazy. Very loud but NOWHERE NEAR what you'd see on an average Orange Walk in Glasgow. Nobody shouting violent threats or obscenities.

- with one exception: the group (acting as a coherent unit) who tried rhythmic pushing to use the people in front as a battering ram. They could have caused a Hillsborough-scale catastrophe. What did they think they were going to do, walk in over a carpet of their own side's bodies?

- almost everyone in the crowd must have owned a gun; nobody showed one. Dog in the night time stuff: they had this planned and universally agreed in advance.

One thing that video DOES confirm is how ineffectual the police were. Many different tactics could have stopped the rioters dead - a testudo of shields, tear gas, water cannon, stun grenades. Horatio on the bridge or the 300 Spartans could have done it. The fact that they didn't even try really stinks of collusion (and willingness to sacrifice the officers who got stationed in the front line: you see one of them suffering horribly).


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: gillymor
Date: 11 Jan 21 - 06:39 AM

Conservative Republican Sen. Ben Sasse on Trump's delight in the violence- Huffington Post


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 11 Jan 21 - 12:47 AM

This story of the January 6 seditious attack on the Capitol is still expanding. This new congress member was live-tweeting the location of Nancy Pelosi while the events were happening.

QAnon congresswoman faces calls for arrest after live-tweeting Nancy Pelosi's location to rioters

    Rep. Lauren Boebert (R-CO), a gun-toting supporter of the QAnon movement, is facing backlash after she was accused of live-tweeting House Speaker Nancy Pelosi's (D-CA) location during the attack on Capitol Hill last week.

    Boebert shared the tweet soon after President Donald Trump's supporters stormed the Capitol with deadly results.

    "The Speaker has been removed from the chambers," Boebert wrote.

    Twitter users responded by calling for the freshman representative to be jailed and removed from Congress.

    "@FBIWFO please arrest @laurenboabert for aiding and abetting those who were hunting down @SpeakerPelosi on Jan, 6th by tweeting the Speaker's whereabouts," one person responded. "She's 5ft tall, 100 pounds and carries a Glock (and won't stop telling everyone)."


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: robomatic
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 11:39 PM

Be nice, limeway, I almost lost my gummint this week!


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 09:16 PM

Yebbut it almost certainly wasn't THAT St John's wort. It's a big genus is Hypericum.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: robomatic
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 09:07 PM

Useless fact number seventy-twelve: When I was a student I hired out to be a gardener/ landscaper. One of my early jobs was to clear out a hill of oleander and plant it with hypericum. I did not know at the time that the one was poisonous and the other was St. John's Wort. Did get to see hummingbirds mating....I think.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 07:46 PM

I have two oleanders, both in big pots and both spending the winter in my greenhouse (they'd be killed by the cold otherwise). I can make them flower if I put them in my sunshiny porch in summer. I also have two lantana bushes, another plant that you see all over the Med. They are also poisonous in all their parts. They have to tough out the winter in a sheltered outdoor spot by my front door. I love the Mediterranean and I love to have plants that remind me of my sunny holidays in Spain, Italy and Greece. To date, I'm not aware that anyone has nibbled them or tried to distil out the toxins. Foxgloves grow wild in my garden. I probably cultivate enough digoxin to kill half of Bude, but the bees love the flowers so much that I don't think I'll bother.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 06:49 PM

Police Use of Clearview AI's Facial Recognition Tech Spiked After Capitol Raid

    First reported by the New York Times, Clearview AI CEO Hoan Ton-That confirmed to Gizmodo that the app saw a 26% jump in search volume on Jan. 7 compared to its usual weekday averages. Given the aforementioned treasure trove of potential evidence documenting the attack—from live cable news broadcasts to hundreds of images and videos—the Federal Bureau of Investigation and Washington, D.C. police have called for the public’s help in identifying participants. Roughly 2,400 polices agencies nationwide have contracts to use Clearview’s facial recognition software, according to the company, and several of them have reportedly been turning to it to assist federal investigators.

    Detectives at the Miami Police Department are using Clearview’s tech to identify rioters in images and videos of the attack and forwarding suspect leads to the FBI, per the Times. Earlier this week, the Wall Street Journal reported that an Alabama police department was also employing Clearview’s tech to ID faces in footage and sending potential matches along to federal investigators.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Helen
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 06:20 PM

A person selling oleandrin as a cure can only be a person who has no concern for the sanctity of human life. IMHO.

Oleandrin is a toxic cardiac glycoside found in the poisonous plant, oleander (Nerium oleander L.).[1] As a main phytochemical of oleander, oleandrin is associated with the toxicity of oleander sap, and has similar properties to digoxin.[1]

Oleander has been used in traditional medicine for its presumed therapeutic purposes, such as for treating cardiac insufficiency. There is no clinical evidence that oleander or its constituents, including oleandrin, are safe or effective. Oleandrin is not approved by regulatory agencies as a prescription drug or dietary supplement.[1]

.....

Toxicity

Oleandrin has been reported to be lethal.[1] In one fatality, the blood concentration of oleandrin and a related cardiac glycoside from the oleander plant was estimated at 20 ng/ml.[9] In practice, there have been adult cases wherein 14-20 oleander leaves (of unknown oleandrin concentration) proved not to be fatal, but also a lethal case of a child that consumed only one leaf.[10]


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 05:57 PM

Oleander is a beautiful shrub or small tree that, to me, is the signature plant of the Mediterranean. Like many plants it's poisonous in all its parts. Same can be said about foxgloves, yew, poinsettia, arum lilies, daffodil bulbs, thorn apples, Daphne mezereon, potato leaves and fruits and a host of others. The thing most of them have in common is that you're hardly tempted to eat them. Enjoy them and keep your kids away if it worries you.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Helen
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 05:19 PM

OMG, oleandrin??!! Everyone in Oz knows that the oleander tree is toxic. No right minded Australian would touch that with a ten foot pole.

I thought I had heard everything, but that really tops the lot.

Oleander, very pretty and the oleander flower is sweet, but the leaves (and all the rest) of the oleander are impossible to eat.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 05:02 PM

For years the radical right has said The Democrat's Hair is on Fire.
It looks like the D's are rather calm and contemplative and the right is litterally out of their #$!~%*NG minds.

pfr, Mike Lindell is a pillow salesman who with Trump's help tried to sell oleandrin, a toxic poison, as a cure for Covid 19.
To be fair oleandrin is safer than bleach.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 02:43 PM

What's all this last minute dangerous secret mission bollocks then...??????????

LINDELL: TRUMP will be PRESIDENT!


I haven't a clue who these trumpzis are, but wtf...!!!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 01:42 PM

Many republicans are not identifying as such is my conclusion


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 12:08 PM

13% of Republicans polled said Trump should be removed
94% Democrats said Trump should be removed


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Jeri
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 12:05 PM

Maggie, they may be forced to talk to each other and compromise. I'd rather they didn't have to, but I don't think it'll be a bad thing. As long as McConnell, and his "we're not going to do our jobs - or anything much at all" - crew are out of power.

I do remember when Democrats COULD have gotten things done, but were too busy fighting amongst themselves.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 11:53 AM

Trump is fortunate. He should count his blessings no matter how few there are. I know those pesky branchs of government like Congress and the Supream Court, Trump could do without, but if he indeed had the kind of government like his pal/lover in Russia and North Korea, he would have been dealt with far more harshly and secretly than back here in the ol US of A.

Let Trump be Trump
in the ash heap of history.
He is not worthy to be
king of the rats

The rat stampede wants safe passage. Individual rats claim "that was then this is now', I didn't know, He must have changed, I didn't see it coming but I wouldn't change a thing, Let my constituancy decide if I did right, I was just following orders-I mean protocol, I aws following FOX.
   
In law there is a measure of a man called the reasonable man. In short if an uneducated impoverished man does the same crime as a well privildged person, the harvard educated person is in a sense more guilty. The "reasonable man" has other meanings as well.


a correction: the other 25th 'like' ammendment for president removal is in the 14th ammendment.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 10:47 AM

I also decided to live dangerously and looked in on the Twitter feed of an acquaintance who (alas) was a Trump supporter (I haven't asked lately if he makes a distinction between the GOP and Trump's brand of the party). At any rate, one of his favorite commentators suggested that the horror of having the House, the Senate, and the White House all in Democratic hands for the next two years is unprecedented. Except it isn't. The last time it happened was the first two years of the Obama administration, at which time his work was slowed almost to a stop by the infamous "blue dog Democrats," those Democrats from traditionally GOP states who were so afraid of losing their jobs that they couldn't support the party. After two years the GOP won enough seats to take over leadership in the house and they did the dirty work of opposing the first African American president.

I think the Democrats are in less turmoil amongst themselves right now, but we shall see. They don't have much wiggle room for dissent.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Jeri
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 10:37 AM

I flipped on Fox for a couple minutes. Apparently, the media crack-down on Trump is because radical Democrat (which is all of them, if you listen) are trying to shut down free speech.

This is always what those people who want to incite violence say. "WAAAA - they won't let us tell people to kill those we don't agree with -WAAAAAH!" They were saying this sort of thing happens in "communist China".

Well, sort of. The leader of the country demands loyalists murder enemies of the state. THAT'S what usually happens.

Personally, I wouldn't mind the FBI checking out Fox, but that probably WOULD be a violation of free speech.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 09:54 AM

A terrible way of saying it would be "Psychology trumps philosophy"


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 09:49 AM

Perhaps it is easier for you or others to believe that citizens who feel like they have been cheated abd abused all their life by the powers that be, are most prone to be radicalized by propoganda. Its true but I say it goes deeper than that.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 09:40 AM

Sandman I empathize with your idea about certain types of education shapes minds to be too prone for propoganda. A credo to think for yourself would be worthwhile. At the same time we have to climb upon the shoulders of giants who have developed great truths in order to keep growing.

I have said before, it is more innate for the human mind to be hypnotised than we would expect. Education of an open minded kind will suit us better for this age than the 19th century education that had to support mercantilism. (endless desks of accountants rather than one computer).

^Reality formation is a very plastic and maluable thing. This quality of the mind may have an advantage to the species or not but it has persisted. Knowing this truth is an antibody to the mallevolent abuse of our susceptability.^

I don't know if you have a mind set that hypnosis is a stage or parlor trick or if you understand clinical hypnosis fully.
Sometimes you have to fight fire with fire if you know what I mean..
This has been my 20 year message and I'm sticking to it based on what I have seen in 20 years as a hypnotist.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: The Sandman
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 08:58 AM

I am not quoting anyone why should I be?


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Raggytash
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 08:47 AM

Dick, who are you quoting in your post of 03.08?


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 08:04 AM

Oh well you can't save te world quickly, it will long hard work like what Mandella did for South Africa. That is still a work in progress but it started with a TRUTH Commission just to air what was happening from all perspectives.
The American Taliban aka Nazis aka Trumpers need to be invited to the table to talk instead of bomb. Yes the sanity challenged need to have leaders at the meetings with Biden.

Its your choice for    CHAOS   OR   COMMUNITY


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 07:52 AM

A rose is a rose...
I abbreviate the diverse coalition of trumpers as Nazis.
There are of course KKK spin offs, bible code thumpers, gun nuts (walnut, hazel and pea), militia wannabes, teenagers for the wall, Qanon psychotics, AM radio ss shock jock fans for Rush Limbaugh and others that are in the mob.
It would be better if they were not unified under one Trump 'banner'... Speaking of 'Bannon' he has more than Trump to add to the current state of affairs. If Karl Rove was Bush's brain then Steve Bannon is Trump's brain.

leenia is so right about Pense and the ultimate betrayal he must feel.

I would say more but I have to go save the world... :^/


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 05:06 AM

Then there's the role of social media. There was a woman on Broadcasting House this morning who I think was saying that the two worlds of old, the social media world and the real world, have, worryingly, merged into one, and she was questioning the unfettered private-enterprise power of the massive social media companies. I didn't hear it properly as I was in the shower at the time, so I'll give it another listen later to make sure I didn't get what she saying arse about face... a bit like me in the shower did I hear you say...?


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 04:34 AM

It's gratifying to see a sensible and measured discussion emerging in this thread. I hope that we can keep it up.

To respond to DMcG, I agree with what you say when you compare the rise of the Nazis in the 30s with what went on last week (and its long build-up since 2016). But I do believe, despite the threat which I would not wish to understate, that there is still enough backbone in western democracies on both sides of the Atlantic to see off the kind of assault we saw last week. There was a severe fragility in German society at that time, in a country recently ravaged by a war that had decimated its young generation and left the country's economy and infrastructure in tatters, ripe conditions for a charismatic despot to hoodwink millions of people into believing in the false hope and nationalist exceptionalism he was peddling. We've seen echoes of some of that in Trump as he appealed to the "left behind" and in "make America great again." but the conditions in the country were nowhere near as conducive to his dream of takeover as they were for Hitler. I want to think that Trump's populist shenanigans will prove to be self-limiting and that there will be sufficient outrage and revulsion to prevent anyone like him from getting power again. That will take work in the form of serious public debate and self-examination - and education. I can't think of any American leader in my sentient lifetime that I've been even remotely a fan of, but we now need Joe to give us a few years of calm. And we need to think very carefully about the actions to be taken against Trump. We don't need a fallen hero, or a martyr, constantly stirring it in the background. I don't know what we can do about his dynasty, however. Americans do seem to love their dynasties...


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: DMcG
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 03:47 AM

[Being called N@zi] While they may well justifiably be applied to a few ringleaders, they may not justifiably be applied to millions of people who are simply misguided Trump supporters

The snag is, that was true in the 1930s as well. I have recently read "They Thought They Were Free: The Germans, 1933–45' which is largely based on interviews with 'ordinary' Germans, not military officers. Many could also be classed as 'simply misguided.'

However, I don't it too helpful to dwell on analogies from the past here: there are similarities and differences.

On the impeachment question: I think it important to consider the 2022 Senate elections as well. There are 20 Republican senators up for re-election, as well as 14 Democrat. By framing the impeachment as about the protecting the Constitution or Trump, it goes a long way towards forcing those 20 to declare themselves for the Constitution or for Trump, and either risks splitting their support, so helps the Democrats. Of course, these are politicians so avoiding such traps is something they are all experienced in. Nevertheless, the trap awaits.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: The Sandman
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 03:08 AM

The education system suits the present establishment , they do not want people to question, challenge or solve problems, yet many of our advances were made by challenging the system , an example Galileo, who met with great opposition from the Roman Catholic church. if people are not educated to challenge or question ,how can they discern truth from propoganda. Let us take Trump, Trump like most politicians is a puppet but he is a naughty puppet and a cunning operator, he has manipulated his supporters [ some of whom were shot] by posing as anti establishment, but does he have an ulterior motive is he [by getting his supporters to storm the capitol] warning the american establishment that if he is impeachd, he will expose other american politicians corruption. If people are not educated to challenge question and solve problems how can they discern or learn how to recognise hate speech and misinformation, If people are educated only in the style of Gradgrind[ Dickens Hard Times] of only facts they are ideal recipients for propaganda posing as facts


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: leeneia
Date: 10 Jan 21 - 02:00 AM

I am not a Republican, but I'm human enough to want to know how Vice President Mike Pence is faring. Apparently he has gone into seclusion. In my opinion Pence has suffered something like being raped by a relative. Trump set a lawless mob upon him.

I've seen Trump's "incitement" speech and I've seen footage of the mob inside the Capitol. At first the people on the Capitol lawn seemed obnoxious but not dangerous. But the mob in the hallway where Ashli Babbitt was shot was vicious, lawless and looking for somebody to destroy. And the main person they were looking for was the person Trump pointed at - his Vice President, Mike Pence.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: robomatic
Date: 09 Jan 21 - 09:54 PM

I have been very reticent about using the 'other' N word. For one thing, I think there IS a distinction to be made between the @zis of the 30s and 40s and the 'wanna-bes' of today. The majority of them in the far-right websites in America have no real idea of what the real ones were like. Take a look at "Garden of Beasts" for a mild reminder. And use of the term in this thread is more likely to remind us of a bad Seinfeld episode than to make a valid point about Trmp supporters.

For another thing, this ain't over. There ARE folks in the wings who do strive to be like the original. I've schlepped through D. Duke's "My Awakening" and it appeared to me to be long, repetitive, (unconvincing), but a genuine attempt to parallel "Mein Kampf" in an American environment.

And these people are distinct from Trmp and his kind. Indeed, Trmp overcame a great gulf since he has supposed Jewish in-laws and grandchildren. I think what may very well happen is that in the fallout from his failures, he will simply be re-labeled as a Jew himself.

Trmp has severe personality flaws and is despicable besides. And his great 'contribution' by which I mean damage is that he has been a diverter from what is really worth concentrating on in our national life. I don't think that is planned, just among the results of the effects of TMI on the world due to the nature of the data spigot of the social network combined with cult of celebrity. A sad revelation but we are subject to influences we have not learned to control.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 09 Jan 21 - 09:36 PM

I keep reading, both here and elsewhere, that more than 70 million people voted for Trump. In fact, 70 million people voted against the Democratic party. Many of those would vote for a stick with rosette on it, so long as the the rosette was red and said Republican. As the sitting President, Trump got pretty much a free ride to the 2020 nomination. In 2016, it would appear that not everyone realised just how ridiculous he would turn out to be. If he tries again in 2024, Republican party members will know what to expect. Forewarned is forearmed. Trump is a spent force. I think we should be more worried about Donald Jr. or Ivanka stepping up to the plate, maybe not in 2024, but in years to come.

DC


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 Jan 21 - 09:15 PM

well.. I not an expert, but I'm hoping the @ throws off search engines...


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Jan 21 - 09:07 PM

I agree with that. The @ symbol is a wonderful way of not having to be literal in the lingo. And bugger me sideways with a bent banana if it isn't five past two and way past my bedtime...


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 Jan 21 - 08:56 PM

Steve - I do tend to agree with you, and usually refer to the shittest human beings
as neo n@zis, or fascistic..

Though, trumpzis, and nutzis, and any other "....zis" folks can make up to take the piss out of the c@nts, is fair game...

.. c@ntzis...


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Jan 21 - 08:25 PM

My view has always been that the term Nazi should be applied, more or less exclusively, to the contemporary active supporters of the Hitler regime. There are plenty of dictators who have acted just like Nazis, and there are hopefuls in most western countries who would like to act like Nazis. But to chuck the term around lazily is to severely devalue the historical horror of the true Nazis in the thirties and forties. Here's a case in point: I severely dislike and condemn the Israeli regime for the inhuman, often murderous, way they discriminate against non-Jews in the West Bank and Gaza. But many's the time on this and on several other forums that I've bitten back against anyone on my side of this argument who calls the Israelis Nazis. Quite simply, they are not, and the insult is intended to remind them, as hurtfully as possible, what real Nazis did to the Jews and to somehow equate the regimes behaviour with that. That's just wicked. The other thing is that we can find different words. We are not inarticulate. Even "neo-Nazi" does at least make some distinction. Far right, white supremacists, stuff like that. All fine. I want Nazi to mean someone of a Hitler-supporting mindset that affords no compunction to that person when it comes to blind discrimination and unfettered, state-supported evil-doing. Let's not misuse and devalue the term on this forum is what I'm saying. In m'humble.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 Jan 21 - 07:58 PM

If a certain type of person was called a n@zi 80 years ago,
and a very similar type of person could now be called a 'trumpzi'..

They are still the same kind of person...

They have existed under one name or another throughout the ages.....

Hopefully, for all our safety, a significant numbers of trump supporters are still salvageable...???


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Jan 21 - 07:38 PM

I'm not denying their existence and I'm not complacent. But I repeat: millions of people supported Trump, they are not by any means all Nazis (incidentally, please define...) and we need to win them back.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 09 Jan 21 - 07:34 PM

There are at least 17 known Neo-Nazi organisations that are extant in US. it is dangerous to deny their existence.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Jan 21 - 07:17 PM

I'll try again. There are half a dozen posts in this thread just today which are likening Americans to Hitler/Nazis. This is neither sensible nor constructive, nor does it exactly make this forum look great. I tried to say this in a very brief post, but the Nazi allusions are still there yet my cavil was deleted. These references are lazy and throwaway, and while they may well justifiably be applied to a few ringleaders, they may not justifiably be applied to millions of people who are simply misguided Trump supporters. They are people who need to be won back in droves. There are far better ways of doing that than by name-calling and branding.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 09 Jan 21 - 05:42 PM

It's time for trial by combat, Lets get ready to rumblllllllllllle. In this corner Ser Gregor Clegane at 385 lbs fighting in abesntia of Donald Trump and in this corner Joe Biden at 142 lbs. You can hear the wind of Ser Gregor's sword as it is swung in circles above his head.
Joe points a phaser at Gregor and vaporizes all but his sword saying "I believe in science". Cries of 'unfair' rigged and cheated can be heard.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 09 Jan 21 - 04:55 PM

Robo, I would wait until they are standing next to each other like in the Red Dwarf despair squid episode.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 09 Jan 21 - 03:39 PM

Well I liked it 4 years ago.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: Donuel
Date: 09 Jan 21 - 03:29 PM

HAHAHA And here comes Steve limping out onto the field in his too tight referee outfit and whistles my post dead and issues a red card for saying NAZI.

I'm watching video of your 'patriotic protestors' wearing Tee Shirts that say Camp Aushwitz work sets you free and grey shirts that say 6MENE. Translated it means Six Million Exterminated Not Enough.

I suppose Steve thinks a proper Nazi should have gone to finishing school with the Hitler Youth like the prior Pope.
I liked your joke.


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: robomatic
Date: 09 Jan 21 - 03:14 PM

Okay, dumb dumb joke time, and like Steve's, this is a reframed famous joke:

You are in a locked room with Josef Stalin, Adolf Hitler, and Donald Trmp. Fortune has allocated you with a Colt 45 loaded with two bullets.

What do you do?













Shoot Donald twice, to be sure.

It's a JOKE!


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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions and Effects
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 Jan 21 - 03:03 PM

Yes, it is unfair, trumpists are giving n@zis a bad name...


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