BS: Brexit & other UK political topics

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 06:24 PM

It was commemorating a benefactor of Bristol who provided funds for a theatre and schools.

There are a lot of those "benefactors" who are no longer tolerated, and it isn't acceptable that they parsed out their acts, good and bad. Rhodes (as in the scholarships) is another example of that. I suspect that program will be renamed one of these days.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 06:04 PM

"The statue of Colston was not "commemorating a slaver".
It was commemorating a benefactor of Bristol who provided funds for a theatre and schools."

Exactly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

These thugs committed a criminal offence and were allowed to get away with it.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 05:44 PM

Your prerogative Steve, exactly as it should be.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 05:08 PM

This is currently the only place I post under my real name, or any other name, apart from rather rare posts to the Session. Y'all know what I think about Facebook et al.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 04:59 PM

You’ve heard the old saying, “Once bitten, twice shy”, SRS?

And it’s still possible to be followed around from forum to forum, and around your Social Media accounts, by unscrupulous people if you post everywhere under your real name. Some may be prepared to risk that, I’m not one of those and I prefer general anonymity. It doesn’t make me a lesser person, it simply indicates that I prefer caution to reckless abandon. ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 04:16 PM

Much of the old Mudcat troll activity was put to rest here when Max figured out about all of his sleeper accounts (back when we could sign up on our own). He still comes back on occasion to post some foul remarks and move on; I suspect that after a lot of his Flickr accounts were shut down and My Opera and other sites closed, he ran out of predatory options and moved on to new victims.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 03:13 PM

Just to clarify (as it seems to have been overlooked)

The statue of Colston was not "commemorating a slaver".
It was commemorating a benefactor of Bristol who provided funds for a theatre and schools.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 12:11 PM

”There are very few people that even glance at the Mudcat”

It only takes one, Dave - ask any of the former Mudcatters whose IDs became known to The Troll, and whose accounts elsewhere were taken over/cloned and bombarded with Photoshopped photos and other material purporting to show them, for example, supporting the BNP, or speaking in support of the Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei, and/or other defamatory material.

”There is far more information that people could use against you elsewhere

Undoubtedly true, Dave. However, my purpose in preserving my anonymity here, and on other forums of which I’m a member using different pseudonyms, is to prevent, as far as possible, individuals following me around the Internet from forum to forum making mischief. I willingly accept that anything I post here may attract antipathy here, and I can live with that, but I’ll be damned if I’ll accept disputes on this forum being dragged over on to other forums.

As I’ve said on a number of occasions, I’m happy to divulge my identity privately to ‘Catters whom I respect and trust (even though they and I may not always agree and, in fact, may disagree very strongly from time to time) - there are a number who already know who I am in The Real World, including you and Steve of course, and I’m perfectly relaxed about that - but there are those in whom I have little or no trust and for whom I have zero respect, and those are the ones from whom I want to protect my identity.

I understand perfectly that others don’t share my view on this issue, and I respect the views (and, frankly, the courage) of people like Steve and Nigel, who choose to post under their real names. But the forum rules permit the use of pseudonyms, and I choose to go that route.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 11:18 AM

I also note that Niggly Farrago on Any Questions, completely full of shite as usual, thought that the Colston Four were four white men. :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 11:14 AM

"They had no right to try and change our history."

The statue is now in a museum, where it can be discussed within its correct historical context, unlike it could when it was on a plinth glorifying him.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 11:03 AM

A bit more education for Bonzo. Not that he will read it.

https://theconversation.com/we-attended-the-trial-of-the-colston-four-heres-why-their-acquittal-should-be-celebrated-174481?utm_

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 10:27 AM

There are very few people that even glance at the Mudcat, John. There is far more information that people could use against you elsewhere :-(

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 06:36 AM

Having lived through the ‘FAF’/BNP era on here (which I believe we’re not supposed to talk about), and having witnessed the havoc, damage and stress it caused to members I know personally in the real world (many, perhaps most, of whom no longer post), there’s no way in hell I’m revealing my identity publicly (although I have no problem with individuals I trust knowing it).

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 06:28 AM

My moniker was chosen by my mum and dad at or around birth. I'm always happy to use it, and, in spite of all the mires of online controversy I find myself in, it hasn't done me any harm.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 04:48 AM

I was one of the few that attended her funeral, John!

Funnily enough my moniker was chosen in a similar self deprecating style. That and the fact that I am tall, slim and handsome of course.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 04:33 AM

”like many of the reactionary Tory backwoodsmen - sorry, John

No apology necessary Steve! I only took up the pseudonym ‘Backwoodsman’ after a particularly obnoxious, know-it-all, female member, with a predilection for ‘The Archers’ BBC radio programme, referred to me as such when she got her frillies firmly wedged in a ‘folk-clubs’ thread. It seemed a subtle way of sticking two fingers up at her without resorting to her kind of behaviour myself.

As she left this mortal coil several years ago, I suppose I could change it, but I really don’t feel it necessary - I’ve grown comfortable with it, and it makes attempts to insult me easier for the less intelligent type of poster we get here.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Jan 22 - 04:23 AM

It is not difficult, Bonzo. History cannot be changed. It has happened and there is nothing anyone can do about it. What happend here is that History was made. It is the point at which people said "we will no longer venerate slave traders". In future History books there will be the story of how we, the people of today, started to understand that everyone, regardless of race, colour or creed, has the same human rights. The 'Colston 4' will be part of that story.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 07 Jan 22 - 05:59 PM

Well the jury thought otherwise, Bonzo. As the true Brit you are, I at least thought that you'd recognise that our jury system, flawed though we could claim it to be, is one of the jewels in the crown of our democracy, as it has been for many centuries. I'm amazed that you're not here having a go at Suella Braverman, who (like many of the reactionary Tory backwoodsmen - sorry, John) thinks that only her brand of justice is proper justice. With so many Tories, including Johnson and Priti Patel thinking along the same lines, we should be bloody worried, frankly. Even you.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 07 Jan 22 - 05:30 PM

For goodness’ sake, Bonzo, they didn’t ‘try and change our history’ - they tried to shed light on history that had been kept dark. If anyone ‘tried to change our history’, it was those in the past who decided to keep Colston’s part in the slave-trade, and his involvement in the rape and abuse of slaves, away from public gaze.

Give your big daft head a wobble.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 07 Jan 22 - 04:42 PM

They had no right to try and change our history. It is what it is.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Jan 22 - 06:53 PM

Give over. Magistrates can do bugger all these days. I see that the jury verdict has got a good few Tory MPs going apoplectic. Now that I love...

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 06 Jan 22 - 05:23 PM

A great pity they weren't tried by a magistrate, then they would have been put away!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Jan 22 - 04:50 PM

Nice one, Dave!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Jan 22 - 04:34 PM

I seem to recall Bonzo berating someone for calling Tories scum.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 06 Jan 22 - 04:24 PM

You’re entitled to your opinion, Bonz, no matter how wrong that opinion is.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 06 Jan 22 - 03:59 PM

They are scum.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 06 Jan 22 - 02:44 PM

Here you go, Bonzo, read this and improve your education.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Jan 22 - 02:39 PM

I offered to do a gig for free beer once. They said they had seen me drink and couldn't afford me!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Jan 22 - 12:56 PM

Irrelevant, Bonzo. We're all folkies here. Black economy wallahs. Banknotes in plain brown envelopes over the bar. No cheques, bank transfers, cards, etc., thanks. Free beer...

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 06 Jan 22 - 11:15 AM

HMRC has waived late filing and late payment penalties for self assessment taxpayers by one month, effectively delaying the tax return deadline to 28 February

The tax authority has announced that it will not give out financial penalties for late filing and late payments for self assessment tax returns which will give more time for taxpayers to complete and submit 2020-21 tax return online and pay any tax due.

The deadline to file and pay remains 31 January 2022 however the extension of the deadline means that anyone who cannot file their return by the end of January will not receive a late filing penalty if they file online by 28 February.

The waiver also means that anyone who cannot pay their self assessment tax by the January deadline will not receive a late payment penalty if they pay their tax in full, or set up a time to pay arrangement, by 1 April. HMRC states that interest will still be payable from 1 February as usual.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 06 Jan 22 - 09:51 AM

It’s ‘Adolf’, not Adolph, Dave! ;-)
But you’re absolutely right otherwise.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Jan 22 - 09:04 AM

Changing history and venerating slave owners who abused people is two different things, Bonzo. Todays history is telling us that when these statues were erected people believed that people such as Colson were heroes. Tomorrows history will tell us that we, the people of today, did not accept that they were heroes but villains instead.

How many statues of Adolph Hitler are still standing? None as far as I know. It doesn't alter the fact that he existed but no one celebrates that fact.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 06 Jan 22 - 08:44 AM

Nobody was ‘seeking retrospectively to change our history’, Bonz. Precisely the opposite, in fact - they were seeking to highlight a part of our history that hitherto had been down-played due to its distasteful nature. It was those who tried to draw attention away from Colston’s slave-trading/rape-centres/other nefarious activities who sought to ‘change our history’, don’cha fink?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 06 Jan 22 - 08:35 AM

In general it is wrong for people to go round seeking retrospectively to change our history. It is what it is.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Jan 22 - 06:03 PM

"The sniping between Steve and Dick is at a level that I'm hearing about it from others."

This completely misrepresents the relationship I've had with Dick over many years. Any recent distemper (which, of course, we can't see because of your delete finger, which makes your comment so easy to make) comes mostly from him. It will pass if you let it and I'm not bothered. And "from others," eh? Easy to say, innit! In the words of Butch and Sundance, who are these guys?? :-)

Anyway, back on topic, it pleased me greatly today to see "the Colston Four" (the boys and girl who toppled Colston's statue in Bristol and dumped it in the harbour) being acquitted. Colston was one of the biggest slave-traders and he oversaw a rape centre for the abuse of female captives. When the establishment won't move against injustice, I think it's fine to take non-violent direct action. Arguing about what's "legal" and what isn't can come later. The four have struck a mighty blow against institutional racism. Kudos.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Rain Dog
Date: 05 Jan 22 - 01:58 PM

Following on from my post on the Trump thread about The Media Show. It was mentioned on the show that Politics For All has been permanently banned from Twitter.

The Guardian

"Politics for All, founded by 19-year-old Nick Moar, grew rapidly over the last twelve months by aggressively aggregating news stories published and reported by mainstream outlets. Its understanding of what would go viral on Twitter attracted hundreds of thousands of followers, including MPs and government ministers."

And

"However, it is unclear how the aggregator could appeal against the permanent suspension, which is similar to the treatment handed out to former US President Donald Trump. Twitter has stated the suspension is final and its rules on platform manipulation apply to users who “artificially amplify or suppress information or engage in behaviour that manipulates or disrupts people’s experience”. The specific behaviour that led to Politics for All being banned remains unknown.

The deletion of a relatively popular news aggregation service by Twitter could attract political scrutiny. Social media platforms will soon be regulated by Ofcom under the forthcoming online harms legislation, with mainstream journalism outlets lobbying hard to ensure their access to audiences is protected."

Regulated by Ofcom? Well let's see how that turns out. Twitter will probably close Ofcom's twitter account

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 05 Jan 22 - 01:56 PM

Or, as Brian would have it, ‘USAanes eunt domus’. :-) ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 05 Jan 22 - 11:40 AM

USAiani ite domum !!!

---

You forget, perhaps, WHERE this site is hosted? ---mudelf

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 05 Jan 22 - 10:56 AM

The sniping between Steve and Dick is at a level that I'm hearing about it from others. The subject they're arguing about is COVID over here in the UK Political thread. Yes, you can strain the original meaning of the thread but please don't. Just go talk about COVID in the COVID thread and argue about Brexit and UK politics over here. The ad hominem stuff needs to stop. You, too, Bonzo.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 05 Jan 22 - 09:48 AM

It was only one of many, SPB! I didn't start the rest

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 05 Jan 22 - 08:31 AM

No in this instance we need to stick together!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Jan 22 - 05:37 AM

If YOU agree with me, I might have to change me mind... ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 05 Jan 22 - 04:30 AM

I agree 100%, of course it's a political subject!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Jan 22 - 04:16 AM

So if I want to criticise the government for failing to provide sufficient lateral flow tests, or for forcing children to wear masks in the classroom, or for stalling in the vaccination programme, I mustn't discuss it in the UK politics thread? Jesus wept...

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 05 Jan 22 - 03:19 AM

"Your call."

Not really, it is up to everyone who contributes to this thread to have an equal call, not just Steve. And if a single person can make that call, surely it has to be DtG who started the thread?

I for one am happy to keep Covid related discussion to the Covid thread as this is a worldwide issue.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 04 Jan 22 - 11:38 PM

A very unpleasant task when it becomes necessary.

The alternative is to close the thread.

Your call.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Jan 22 - 09:09 PM

The COVID-19 issue is politically topical in the UK. Your deletions are incredibly clumsy to say the least. For goodness sake, find something better to do.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 04 Jan 22 - 08:28 PM

Please keep the COVID discussion over on the COVID thread.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Jan 22 - 05:30 PM

Anyway, less of this light-hearted banter. We are in serious trouble here. We have a fat, scruffy buffoon of a prime minister who is not just on the ropes, he's wallowing on the urine-soaked deck of the ringside bogs. But our "leader" of the opposition stands on a platform today and, instead of going all open-season on Johnson, he prattles on about how he's "making a contract with the British people" and about how patriotic he is. I'm having trouble here unclenching my buttockry...

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Jan 22 - 01:19 PM

Stoners' thread - heheh!