BS: Brexit & other UK political topics

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 18 Oct 20 - 06:25 AM

politicians that is!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 18 Oct 20 - 06:29 AM

Politician - Sons of Cream!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Raggytash
Date: 18 Oct 20 - 06:39 AM

Can you not read Bonzo.

Dave the Gnome posted "Of course it does, Nigel. People expect their politicians to be open, ethical and honest"

DMcG posted "I am not sure we now or ever actually expected politicians to be open, ethical and honest, Dave."

No mention there of Liberal, Labour, DUP, Scottish Nationalist, Plaid Cymru, Greens or Conservative. **

However we do have a Conservative leader who seems to be a stranger to the truth.









Apologys to those political parties I may have missed.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Oct 20 - 11:32 AM

Whataboutism just doesn't wash, Bonzo. For the first time we have a prime minister who seems to see nothing wrong with lying, cheating and plain incompetence. What is more he seems to believe he can get away with it and will continue to do so as long as the very electorate that he is leading up the garden path continue to excuse him. I hope all the turkeys that voted for Christmas are happy with the result.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 18 Oct 20 - 12:16 PM

Tough.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 18 Oct 20 - 12:23 PM

Don’t. Feed. The. Troll.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 18 Oct 20 - 12:42 PM

Always the same when anyone questions the labour shambles, and it is a shambles. Even starmer has lost it now. One consolation perhaps is that abbott is out of the picture!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 18 Oct 20 - 01:42 PM

But how many Labour MPs are the current prime minister?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: The Sandman
Date: 18 Oct 20 - 02:03 PM

doggerel from the dogs bollocks

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Oct 20 - 04:30 PM

Bonzo. The Tories have an 80 seat majority. The lying blonde bufoon is prime minister. Labour are powerless to do anything but point out the idiocy. The mess we are in is no one's fault but the Conservative governments. Yet you, Boris, the Conservative party and the Tory apologists will take no responsibility for anything. Preferring instead to blame a Labour party who's hands are tied. I know you don't care but I take great pleasure in seeing you trying to lay the blame elsewhere while everyone else can see where it really lies. Keep it up :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: The Sandman
Date: 18 Oct 20 - 04:42 PM

Dave, he is dogmatic, his dogma is blame everything on the party in opposition

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Oct 20 - 04:50 PM

Bonzodogmatic? :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Raggytash
Date: 18 Oct 20 - 06:00 PM

Bonzodogdoodah band were far more amusing. **












My apology for the poetic licence with the name !!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: DMcG
Date: 19 Oct 20 - 03:52 AM

These comments by Lord Kerr, and the earlier ones by Lord Neuberger fit into this discussion quite well, as the address the relationship between the judiciary and Parliament.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 19 Oct 20 - 04:28 AM

Good articles, Mac. No matter which side of the political divide anyone is on, the absolute necessity for a judiciary, independent of the political parties, with the power to call politicians to account, must be perfectly obvious.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Oct 20 - 04:47 AM

As if by magic...

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/opinion/the-government-has-moved-to-shift-blame-to-businesses/19/10/

So businesses are to blame for the government's failure to fulfil its promises

We are to blame for their abysmal record with the virus

Labour antisemitism anyone?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 19 Oct 20 - 06:58 AM

Businesses should not be making any changes at all to the way they operate, and if anyone takes issue, then all they have to say is 'take it up with Johnson'.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Oct 20 - 07:24 AM

Stolen from a Facebook friend. Bit long but well worth it

Post this
You really couldn’t make it up! ( sorry, did I say that last time...)
The Week in Tory is back! Fasten your seatbelts...
1. Boris Johnson announced a new 3 Tier lockdown system, with the lowest Tier being
“medium”, like at McDonalds
2. As part of the announcement, the Chief Medical Officer reassuringly said the plan wouldn’t
work
3. The govt said “in all cases, we are following the science”
4. It was revealed the SAGE science committee told the govt to lockdown weeks ago, but that
bit of science wasn’t followed very far 5. SAGE went on to say the govt’s “world-beating” £12bn
Test and Trace system was having only “a marginal impact on transmission rates”
6. Dido Harding, head of Seemingly Everything, said Test and Trace would be “local by default”
and be “highly efficient”
7. She then handed £12bn to Serco, which is highly efficiently charging us £7360 per day for
consultants. To trace Covid infections. Which they aren’t doing
8. Serco’s CEO is the brother of an ex-Tory MP. His partner is a Tory donor. Serco’s ex-head of
PR is now a Tory Health Minister
9. If you feel all this is a bit corrupt, you can complain to the govt’s Anti-Corruption Champion,
John Penrose, who is married to Dido Harding
10. Meanwhile an investigation by the Good Law Project found PPE suppliers owned by Tory
donors or associates were paid 30% more per item than similar businesses globally. I'm talling
you: John Penrose. He’s your fella. He’ll get to the bottom of it, fo shizzle
11. And only 34 days since the announcement of Boris Johnson’s "brainchild", the £100bn
Operation Moonshot, it was quietly scrapped, along with (apparently) Boris Johnson’s brain and
around 28% of his children
12. A Tory MP said Boris Johnson’s “personal skillset this doesn't play to this. He's not a details,
manager type. He's a picture painter”. On the side of wine-boxes, mostly.
13. Another said “I think it's obvious this is a government happier picking fights than governing”
14. Another said Boris Johnson “prefers to get on with dog-walking” and “let’s Dominic do the
work”
15. Chastened by reports local authorities were given only 5 minutes notice of previous
lockdowns, this time the govt gave them ... 7 minutes notice of the meeting to discuss it
16. Except some MPs didn't even get that, and were only invited after the meeting had started
17. And the govt invited the MP for Sunderland, who had to inform them she was only of 3
Sunderland MPs. The govt was “surprised to be informed” of this
18. The dep Chief Medical Officer said the infection rate in the north “never dropped” meaning
the relaxation of lockdown was at the expense of lives oop north
19. Then the govt said they would “devolve more decision-making” and “give more financial aid
to local authorities”
20. But the aid is conditional on the "devolved" local authority doing what the govt wants, which
is quite a novel a definition of "devolved" 21. So, following criticism, the govt briefed the press
that it was going to consult more with regional govts
22. Literally 2 hours later, the govt briefed the press that Manchester was moving into Tier 3
restrictions. The Mayor of Manchester was not consulted (or even informed) about a decision he
must implement, and which affects the largest city-region outside London.
23. A Tory MP, anxious about the lockdown affecting businesses over the party season, asked
the PM “what can you tell us about Christmas”. Boris Johnson replied, “it’s a religious festival
that’s been celebrated 2020 years”, which I’m sure helps us all
24. Matt Hancock insisted we all follow the science and adhere to the 10pm pub curfew that
scientists say makes absolutely no improvement on infection rates
25. Then Matt Hancock broke that curfew, in a House of Commons bar
26. And then Matt Hancock said “The drinks are on me but Public Health England are in charge
of payment methodology so I will not be paying anything”
27. In August, Public Health England was scrapped by [checks notes ] Matt Hancock
28. But prior to that, Tories imposed budget cuts of 5% to 10% on Public Health England for
each of the previous 7 years
29. Unsurprisingly, it was reported that hospitals in the north of England would run out of beds
within 7 days
30. The govt said "Hospital Trusts should consider cancelling all non-urgent treatments"
31. The govt then refused to drop fines it imposes on Hospital Trusts which cancel non-urgent
treatments
32. So Matt Hancock announced the reopening of Nightingale Hospitals, which were closed last
time because nobody could send patients to them, due to them not being staffed
33. They still aren’t staffed: Matt Hancock's' "urgent boost to nursing training" doesn’t start until
2021
34. Fortunately, the govt began a campaign to get ballerinas to retrain, and then scrapped the
campaign 24 hours later
35. In June, Boris Johnson announced an "urgent" £1.57bn Arts Rescue Plan
36. A mere 127 days later, it "urgently" got around to paying out some of that money
37. Except by now the £1.57bn had become £257m, which is 16% of the plan they originally
announced
38. Meanwhile, in news that will surely leave you all stunned and astonished, a month after work
began on HS2 the budget for it has already risen a further £800m
39. Boris Johnson congratulated Marcus Rashford on the MBE he was awarded for his efforts to
overcome the cruel policies of Boris Johnson
40. The Law Society raised concerns about the “dangerous rhetoric” of Home Office Minister
and Mouth of Sauron, Priti Patel
41. The next day, a migration lawyer was victim of a knife attack, and senior lawyers said
“Responsibility and accountability for this attack lies squarely at the feet of Priti Patel”
42. The Home Office announced plans to catch migrants in a big net and OH MY GOD
43. And then Lord West reassuringly said, “we need to deal with migrants in a concentrated
place, a camp or whatever”. He didn’t mention whether Arbeit Macht Frei, but it’s still only
Thursday, and who can tell what the remainder of the week will bring? [Open 2nd bottle now ]
44. Speaking of dates: today is 15th Oct, the absolute, immoveable deadline for trade talks that
mighty, fearsome Boris Johnson laid down to the cowed and quivering EU
45. Talks continue tomorrow. Because obviously, duuur
46. This is the third absolute deadline imposed by the British that has been missed because the
British have temporarily inverted arse and elbow
47. This didn’t stop Cabinet Office minister Lord Agnew from berating haulage businesses for
not being ready for Brexit on 1 Jan
48. The Road Haulage Assoc pointed out we have only 1,668 of the 33,000 EU Haulage
Permits we need on 1 Jan
49. Software to control our borders won’t be ready until 4 months after 1 Jan

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Oct 20 - 07:25 AM

Conmtinued...

50. And the govt is “still in the planning stage” of the “Kent Passports” we need on 1 Jan
51. And construction of Kent's “world’s largest lorry park” is behind schedule, so probably not
ready on 1 Jan
52. Fortunately the govt is well-prepared, and plans to install 1000s of Portaloos in Kent, the
garden of England, to be used by lorry drivers trapped in 2-day queues
53. And our food standards will still be fine, as Tory MP Nadhim Zahawi tweeted “Our manifesto
was clear. We will not compromise our animal welfare and food standards”
54. He then voted to compromise our animal welfare and food standards, as did the rest of the
Tory Party
55. And then govt used an obscure rule to deny MPs a vote on whether to allow chlorinated
chicken
56. Meanwhile, 20 years after North Sea Cod became so overfished the WWF declared it
“economically extinct”, Tory MPs voted to reduce protections designed to let fish stocks recover
57. So, after Brexit, our current plan is to accept tariffs that will destroy our manufacturing
sector, and border delays that will destroy farming exports and imperil food supplies, and
destroy the farming sector ... all so we can go and catch a fish that doesn’t exist
58. But at least we’ve now "got back control", and therefore we can level up the playing field by
implementing the govt's landmark “digital tax” policy on giants such as Amazon
59. This week it was announced Amazon will be exempt from the digital tax
60. Speaking of tax exemptions, it was revealed Dominic Cummings has had a £30,000 council
tax bill “written off” because he built the house illegally, so it doesn’t count as a real house, or
summat. Sorry, my hurricane-force sarcasm briefly turned me more northern.
61. And on the subject of extreme dodgy dealing, let me direct your attention to Robert Jenrick,
who set up the £3.6bn “Towns Fund” for the 101 most deprived town, and then gave the
maximum grant of £25m to his own constituency, which is the 270th most deprived town
63. His explanation was that he, Jenrick, did not make the decision. It was made by a colleague,
Jake Berry.
64. Jake Berry also got money for his constituency. By a dazzling coincidence, that decision
was made by – you guessed it – Robert Jenrick
65. Finally: at a meeting led by Liam Fox, the TaxPayers Alliance (insanity-pushers to the Tory
Party) advocated cutting pensions immediately because half of old people “won't be around to
vote against you in the next election”, and the other half “will have forgotten by then”

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 19 Oct 20 - 10:32 AM

What a long list of stuff happening. How does it shake out for individual members? What are each of you seeing in your immediate world that is impacted by COVID-19-laced negotiations?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Oct 20 - 10:34 AM

Mrrzy just posted a Boxer parody about Trump and I think we can do better. I'll make a start

I am just a rich boy and and a smarmy Eton clown
I have squandered our economy
Lined my own mates pockets
And broke promises
I lie and jest
Still I do just what I have to do
And disregard the plebs
When they find out I have screwed them
I just lie
Lie lie lie
Lie lie lie lie lie lie lie
Lie lie lie...

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 19 Oct 20 - 11:00 AM

In answer to your question, Stilly, I am pretty lucky. Retired on a reasonable pension. No debts to speak of. No real wish for material wealth. Living in an area of low contagion. So not much effect on me as yet. However, as the economy is bound to plummet as a result of both the virus and Brexit the future is pretty bleak for many, including my family and younger friends.

The other thing is, whether it affects me or not, I do not appreciate being lied to by those who are supposed to be looking after us. I have always been cynical of politicians in any party. I think that anyone who seriously believes they can run people's lives should be debarred from public office on the grounds of megalomania. But the lot we currently have at the helm really do take the piss. I will point out their lies and broken pledges whenever I come across them.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: DMcG
Date: 19 Oct 20 - 11:20 AM

Like Dave, I am retired on a reasonable pension and not directly affected by much of this. But plenty around me are. I have a friend who owns a small haulage company and she is in near despair over the situation. Almost every question she has is still unanswered, and the licencing aspect alone has major impact. Eldest son works for an American legal firm in their London office and there is much uncertainty whether they will move everyone to their Brussels office, and if so, when. Second son works for an international fashion goods company (high end shoes, handbags etc) on the web sales side. So far they are in profit this year, having shut all the high street shops but the future is naturally uncertain. Since the growth area is online sales, though, he is probably ok.

Daughter works in recruitment, which is more affected by covid-19 than Brexit, as far as we can separate them.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: The Sandman
Date: 19 Oct 20 - 04:09 PM

I live on 485 euros a month, so if anyone wants to buy anything from my website , i will be pleased

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: The Sandman
Date: 22 Oct 20 - 09:43 AM

Europe has been good for ireland in a liberalising approach, it has taken a country highly influenced by reactionary religious elements and gradually turned it in to a much more liberal minded and forward looking country

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 22 Oct 20 - 11:15 AM

Ireland isn’t a part of the UK.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Raggytash
Date: 22 Oct 20 - 03:54 PM

:-)

;-)

:-))

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Oct 20 - 04:45 PM

Who's the guy with the double chin?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 Oct 20 - 02:50 AM

Is it a double chin or a slit throat? :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: The Sandman
Date: 23 Oct 20 - 03:53 AM

northern ireland is part of the uk , and because of brexit there is a big border problem looming, it is affected by brexit so my comment is relevant

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: The Sandman
Date: 23 Oct 20 - 04:06 AM

I have lived in ireland for 30 years so i am aware republic of ire is not part of uk. talk about teaching grand mother to suck eggs.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 Oct 20 - 04:49 AM

Disgusting. But, sadly, what we have come to expect

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/oct/21/government-covid-contracts-britain-nhs-corporate-executives-test-and-trace

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 23 Oct 20 - 09:14 AM

You didn’t mention Norther Ireland, Dick, you said ‘Ireland’, which is the universally understood term for the Republic of Ireland. The Republic is not part of the UK, neither is NI a part of the Republic.

The title of this thread is ‘Brexit & Other UK political topics. Please stick to the thread topic, and don’t give the mods another excuse to close our one and only UK politics thread.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 08:49 AM

The EHRC's key findings as reported in the Guardian

The Labour party could have tackled antisemitism more effectively “if the leadership had chosen to do so”, the Equality and Human Rights Commission (EHRC) concluded as part of its 130-page investigations

Not that antisemitism is rife in the party, just that they could have handled it better. I'll be honest and admit that I have not read the report and am not likely to do so as I am not one for politikspeak. Any of the better versed or equipped care to comment?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 09:37 AM

And Jeremy Corbyn denies some of the findings, and has had the whip suspended for doing so.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 09:52 AM

I saw he had been suspended but not for denying the findings. Do you have a source for that, Nigel?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 10:00 AM

Another convenient distraction from the truly important issues - the appallingly-incompetent handling of COVID-19 by the Tory government, the looming disaster of a Brexit crash-out with no trade-deal with the EU, the inclusion of the NHS in any trade-deal with the US, the reduction in our food standards that will also be a part of a UK-US trade-deal, the skimming of billions of our tax-pounds in government contracts with companies who have neither the competence nor the assets to carry them out successfully, and who have not been required to subject themselves to a tendering procedure, appointments to senior positions of individuals linked to members of the government, with no proper recruitment procedures followed...the list goes on and on, need I say more?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 10:00 AM

BBC news (Radio)

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 10:01 AM

...the list goes on and on, need I say more?
Hopefully not.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 10:14 AM

The truth must be very painful, Nigel. But your denial won’t make it go away.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 11:05 AM

I didn't deny it, however:
Another convenient distraction from the truly important issues - the appallingly-incompetent handling of COVID-19 by the Tory government, the looming disaster of a Brexit crash-out with no trade-deal with the EU, the inclusion of the NHS in any trade-deal with the US, the reduction in our food standards that will also be a part of a UK-US trade-deal, the skimming of billions of our tax-pounds in government contracts with companies who have neither the competence nor the assets to carry them out successfully, and who have not been required to subject themselves to a tendering procedure, appointments to senior positions of individuals linked to members of the government, with no proper recruitment procedures followed

"the appallingly-incompetent handling of COVID-19 by the Tory government": Up until the last week the Labour party supported all the actions, and didn't offer alternatives, so not just the "Tory government"
" the inclusion of the NHS in any trade-deal with the US, the reduction in our food standards that will also be a part of a UK-US trade-deal": As no UK/US trade deal has yet been agreed, this is mere supposition.
"the skimming of billions of our tax-pounds in government contracts with companies who have neither the competence nor the assets to carry them out successfully, and who have not been required to subject themselves to a tendering procedure, appointments to senior positions of individuals linked to members of the government, with no proper recruitment procedures followed": Specifics? or just random claims?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 11:25 AM

"the appallingly-incompetent handling of COVID-19 by the Tory government"

can you even begin to imagine the winkie wankie wokie abortion which a Corbyn (now sacked from the labour party) government would have been guilty of?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 11:56 AM

Bonzo, how many times must we tell you this. The current Tory government has an 80 seat majority. The cock ups they are guilty of are no one's fault but their own. What any other party of leader may or may not have done is completely irrelevant.

Nigel. Yes, I have seen and read the BBC news. I cannot find where it says Corbyn had been suspended for denying any findings.

Nothing I have get seen from reports of the EHRC findings seems to indicate the the Labour party has a worse antisemitism problem than anyone else. It does say that their reaction and procedures for handling antisemitism left a lot to be desired. Am I missing something?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:00 PM

Nigel again

Specifics? or just random claims?

I refer you to my list of 23 Oct 20 - 04:49 AM

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:01 PM

List=post

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:19 PM

The grip on Starmer's short 'n' curlies is so over tightened now,
clumps are being pulled out at the roots..

Might as well just relinquish leadership of the party to margaret hodge and be done with it...

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:20 PM

Nigel again
Specifics? or just random claims?
I refer you to my list of 23 Oct 20 - 04:49 AM

A link to a Guardian opinion piece?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:21 PM

Or did you mean the two post list taken from someone else's Facebook rant (a few days earlier)?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:36 PM

No, Nigel, I said my post of 23 Oct 20 - 04:49 AM so which do you think I was referring to? It is a link and there is some opinion in it but if you would care to dispute any of the facts quoted by the author to support his opinion, please feel free.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:37 PM

Oh, 200!