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BS: Brexit & other UK political topics

The Sandman 31 Oct 20 - 05:08 AM
Dave the Gnome 31 Oct 20 - 03:48 AM
DMcG 30 Oct 20 - 07:11 PM
Dave the Gnome 30 Oct 20 - 02:36 PM
DMcG 30 Oct 20 - 02:19 PM
Dave the Gnome 30 Oct 20 - 02:00 PM
DMcG 30 Oct 20 - 01:07 PM
Dave the Gnome 30 Oct 20 - 12:47 PM
DMcG 30 Oct 20 - 08:29 AM
Dave the Gnome 30 Oct 20 - 07:28 AM
Bonzo3legs 30 Oct 20 - 06:57 AM
Dave the Gnome 30 Oct 20 - 06:27 AM
Bonzo3legs 30 Oct 20 - 06:19 AM
Dave the Gnome 30 Oct 20 - 05:52 AM
DMcG 30 Oct 20 - 05:34 AM
Dave the Gnome 30 Oct 20 - 04:39 AM
DMcG 30 Oct 20 - 04:22 AM
Dave the Gnome 30 Oct 20 - 03:26 AM
Backwoodsman 29 Oct 20 - 04:34 PM
Dave the Gnome 29 Oct 20 - 04:09 PM
Bonzo3legs 29 Oct 20 - 03:08 PM
punkfolkrocker 29 Oct 20 - 01:06 PM
Dave the Gnome 29 Oct 20 - 12:58 PM
DMcG 29 Oct 20 - 12:46 PM
Dave the Gnome 29 Oct 20 - 12:37 PM
Dave the Gnome 29 Oct 20 - 12:36 PM
Nigel Parsons 29 Oct 20 - 12:21 PM
Nigel Parsons 29 Oct 20 - 12:20 PM
punkfolkrocker 29 Oct 20 - 12:19 PM
Dave the Gnome 29 Oct 20 - 12:01 PM
Dave the Gnome 29 Oct 20 - 12:00 PM
Dave the Gnome 29 Oct 20 - 11:56 AM
Bonzo3legs 29 Oct 20 - 11:25 AM
Nigel Parsons 29 Oct 20 - 11:05 AM
Backwoodsman 29 Oct 20 - 10:14 AM
Nigel Parsons 29 Oct 20 - 10:01 AM
Nigel Parsons 29 Oct 20 - 10:00 AM
Backwoodsman 29 Oct 20 - 10:00 AM
Dave the Gnome 29 Oct 20 - 09:52 AM
Nigel Parsons 29 Oct 20 - 09:37 AM
Dave the Gnome 29 Oct 20 - 08:49 AM
Backwoodsman 23 Oct 20 - 09:14 AM
Dave the Gnome 23 Oct 20 - 04:49 AM
The Sandman 23 Oct 20 - 04:06 AM
The Sandman 23 Oct 20 - 03:53 AM
Dave the Gnome 23 Oct 20 - 02:50 AM
Donuel 22 Oct 20 - 04:45 PM
Raggytash 22 Oct 20 - 03:54 PM
Backwoodsman 22 Oct 20 - 11:15 AM
The Sandman 22 Oct 20 - 09:43 AM

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Subject: BS: Corbyn suspension
From: The Sandman
Date: 31 Oct 20 - 05:08 AM

I have resigned membership from the labour party.
My Stepmother was jewish , her parents escaped from nazi germany in 1936. I concur With CORBYN about exagerration


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 31 Oct 20 - 03:48 AM

I think you are right DMcG. "Look! Labour antisemitism!" was already wearing thin as a distraction. By the side of Boris's mis-management of the virus it just sounds stupid. Of course some people will still be fooled . As witnessed here.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: DMcG
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 07:11 PM

Reports are coming in of a strict national lockdown to be announced on Monday, effective from Wednesday.

If so, I think Labour and the ECHR is going to disappear from the front pages even faster than I predicted, and Johnson would be well advised to leave it out of PMQs unless he really wants to look detached from people's concerns.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 02:36 PM

The problem is that they did concern themselves with the other cases as they went ahead and reported them. They are either significant, in which case they need to detail them, or they are not significant, in which case don't report them.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: DMcG
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 02:19 PM

The exact quote is here:
This is by no means the full extent of the issues we identified within the files in our sample; it represents the tip of the iceberg. We also saw:
• A further 18 ‘borderline’ cases. In these cases, there was not enough evidence to conclude that the Labour Party was legally responsible for the conduct of the individual. These were people such as local councillors, local election candidates and Constituency Labour Party office holders.
• In many more files, evidence of antisemitic conduct by an ‘ordinary’ member of the Labour Party. These members did not hold any office or role, therefore the Labour Party could not be held directly responsible for their conduct under the Equality Act 2010.

In light of our position as a regulator, we only made findings of unlawful conduct in cases that were sufficiently clear-cut, in Equality Act 2010 and Human Rights Act 1998 terms. We explain this in Chapter 3


So they saw cases, but restricted themselves to ones that were 'clear cut' and for which the party was legally responsible.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 02:00 PM

I find that an official body suggesting it is the tip of the iceberg without going into detail quite alarming. It sounds like a Daily Heil headline.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: DMcG
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 01:07 PM

I would not go quite that far, Dave. They did identify a few cases and said this was "the tip of the iceberg" - but most of the other 18(?) cases they looked at in detail were by people that the Labour Party did not have legal responsibility for, or it was unclear what capacity these people were speaking in. Having said that, they also stressed other parties had similar issues.

I put the question mark after the 18 because that figure was mentioned but there are other complaints and I would need to double check the status of these 18.

The cases that they referenced, though, were often to illustrate where the process had fallen short.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 12:47 PM

Thanks for a good synopsis DMcG. It does seem to confirm the conclusions I drew from the "front page". Labour did have problems with handling antisemitism complaints but as for antisemitism itself it seems that the commission have either not investigated that or not found anything to worry them.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: DMcG
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 08:29 AM

OK, I have eventually got round to finishing the document - it did have to fit in with other things I had to do, you know!

One of the things that I got out of it which doesn't seem to be coming across as much in the media it is rather less about what the level of anti-Semitism in the Labour party is, as the lack of a clear mechanism to decide and then deal with it. The media is very much about how much anti-Semitism there is or is not in the Labour party, the rows between Starmer and Corbyn, Hodge, Abbott and others. On my reading, that is not really what the report is about at all.   It is much more what are the procedures in place to identify anti-Semitism in the first place (including how clear is the definition, and why, for example, no definition is in the Labour Rule book so all members can know it.) Once a possible anti-Semitic case is identified, how well-defined is the process to handle it, and whether this process is truly independent, or is it subject to political interference.

So for example, they point out the training given to people to identify anti-Semitism is 'academic, not practical.' I presume that means there insufficient case studies where the real world complexities can be seen.   Another example that worries the authors are comments from the Leaders office whether they think an act serious enough to investigate which may override the formal process (and there are examples where it expressed a view both against and in favour of proceeding.) Other Leader's Office comments referred to the timing of the investigations.

In the political world, the temptation to interfere in that way will inevitably be huge. The report is quite clear it is always unacceptable - the procedures must be followed rigorously and independently. It is interesting to notice yesterday Starmer has clearly taken this on board. When the press pressured him to say Corbyn must be suspected, he followed the report to not express a view. Later, when Corbyn had been suspended he stressed that it was the formal processes that suspended Corbyn and he supported both their right to make the decision and the decision itself. Their remains some doubt about the exact rules under which Corbyn was suspended, but it is not Starmer's responsibility to say.
Yet another thing they were concerned about was the appointment of Thomas Gardiner from the Labour leader's office into the body responsible for initial investigations. The at the very least ran the risk of political interference and in their words "undermined confidence in the complaint handling process and, in particular, its independence."


In my opinion, it is a well written report and the recommendations it makes are both sensible and can be implemented in practice in a comparatively short time.   Labour has a legal responsibility to state its plans for addressing the points within a few weeks, and I have little doubt that it will confirm its intentions to fully adopt them.

I also have little doubt the Tories will keep poking at this particular hornets nest, as will some of Corbyn's backers.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 07:28 AM

When can we expect the results of the enquiry into this Unholy alliance?

I'll not hold my breath.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 06:57 AM

Very relevant - will hippy abbott be next!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 06:27 AM

And that is relevant to the discussion because..?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 06:19 AM

Who would you look to for legal advice?
1. A barrister who advanced far enough to become the Director of Public Prosecutions.
2. A bunch of disorganised hippies who couldn't win an election against a Sesame Street character who hid in a fridge.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 05:52 AM

Yes, I got that far DMcG. It is also interesting to note that the commission does not address any actual complaints of antisemitism or uphold them. I would have thought that was its job. I do understand that it also looks at procedures for dealing with equality issues and that the Labour party is guilty of not dealing with the complaints properly. It is interesting to note that hours after the report's publication the CAA have issued a 70-odd page list of complaints, dating back many years, against members of the Labour party. All, it seems, from the left wing. I shall not speculate as to the motives behind this or the timing of it but let people draw their own conclusions.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: DMcG
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 05:34 AM

I have made a start on the document, but highly recommend everyone interested to read the forward and the executive summary. It is very clearly written and in plain English, and will not take very long. A few highlights:

But, more than that, politicians on all sides have a responsibility to set standards for our public life and to lead the way in challenging racism in all its forms. What politicians say and do matters. Their words and actions send a message about what is acceptable and what is not.
In recent times, there have been examples of behaviour that falls well below the standards we would expect, from politicians of various parties. While freedom of expression is essential to proper political debate, politicians must recognise the power of their language to sow division. The recommendations in this report provide a foundation to assist all politicians and political leaders in adhering to equality law, while still protecting freedom of expression and engaging in the robust and wide-ranging debate that is a core part of living in a democratic society

.. so yes, this is focused on Labour, but no one should interpret the issue as just about Labour. All parties have, at times, fallen short.


The issue of antisemitism within the Labour Party has been the subject of much scrutiny, most formally with three investigations in 2016, conducted by Baroness Chakrabarti, Baroness Royall and the Home Affairs Select Committee (HASC). Since then, the Party has failed to implement the recommendations made in these reports fully, or to take effective measures to stop antisemitic conduct from taking place. It is regrettable that many of the concerns we raise here were first raised in these reports over four years ago

.. some in the past have regarded Baroness Chakrabarti's report as a whitewash. That is not the ECHR view. But they do say its recommendations have not been implemented adequately.

This is by no means the full extent of the issues we identified within the files in our sample; it represents the tip of the iceberg. We also saw: • A further 18 ‘borderline’ cases. In these cases, there was not enough evidence to conclude that the Labour Party was legally responsible for the conduct of the individual. These were people such as local councillors, local election candidates and Constituency Labour Party office holders. • In many more files, evidence of antisemitic conduct by an ‘ordinary’ member of the Labour Party. These members did not hold any office or role, therefore the Labour Party could not be held directly responsible for their conduct under the Equality Act 2010.

Although only a few cases are addressed in this report, there is much more. While some of these are definitely antisemtic, because the people concerned are not employed by Labour, Labour has no legal responsibility for them. That does not make the actions excusable: it is simply the Labour Party is not legally responsible.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 04:39 AM

Thanks, DMcG. I look forward to your analysis.

Interesting quote from Caroline Waters, Interim Chair of the Equality and Human Rights Commission

Politicians on all sides have a responsibility to set standards for our public life and to lead the way in challenging racism in all its forms. There have been recent examples of behaviour from politicians of various parties that fall well below the standards we would expect. While freedom of expression is essential to proper political debate, politicians must recognise the power of their language to sow division. Our recommendations provide a foundation for leaders to make sure that they adhere to equality law and demonstrate their commitment to diversity and inclusion through their words and actions

Can we look forward to an enquiry into the "behaviour from politicians of various parties"?

I doubt it somehow.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: DMcG
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 04:22 AM

Reading the report is on my to-do list for today, so I won't talk about it directly yet.

Politically, I am sure Boris Johnson and co are heaving a sigh of relief that Covid and Brexit have been driven out of the media. They will be aware how long the papers kept Labour and anti-Semitism in play last time and I am sure they hope they can do so again.

I don't think that will happen. For one thing, the US election will drive Labour off the media in a day or two at most. Then people care more about lockdowns and other things that affect them directly than Labour's troubles.   I am sure come the next PMQ or two Johnson will try to drag this into his answers at every opportunity, but I don't think it has the 'legs' it had before.   A huge lorry queue at Dover, if it happens, is simply more newsworthy.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 30 Oct 20 - 03:26 AM

I still haven't found where the BBC, or any other news agency, have reported that "Jeremy Corbyn denies some of the findings" but I did find the following while I was looking

It (the EHRC) found Labour responsible for three breaches of the Equality Act:

Political interference in anti-Semitism complaints

Failure to provide adequate training to those handling anti-Semitism complaints

Harassment, including the use of anti-Semitic tropes and suggesting that complaints of anti-Semitism were fake or smears


So, to me, that suggests that the "Day of Shame" refers to how complaints were handled and harassment of those complaining rather than any institutional racism. Once the report has been fully digested I would be interested to see if it suggests that antisemitism in the Labour party is worse than in any other large organisation.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 04:34 PM

” the appallingly-incompetent handling of COVID-19 by the Tory government": Up until the last week the Labour party supported all the actions, and didn't offer alternatives, so not just the "Tory government"

1) As has been pointed out elsewhere, the Tories have an 80-seat majority, so nothing Labour may have suggested has any relevance.

2) Neither you, nor I, have any information on the detail of discussions which took place between the Tory and Labour leadership regarding the handling of the COVID crisis, so your assertion that Labour offered no alternatives is mere supposition.

" the inclusion of the NHS in any trade-deal with the US, the reduction in our food standards that will also be a part of a UK-US trade-deal": As no UK/US trade deal has yet been agreed, this is mere supposition.”

There’s a great deal of evidence that these things are already, or are destined to be, part of the negotiations between the US and the UK. It’s been widely reported in the press and media, and commented on by members of the government. Easy to find unless, of course, one chooses to pretend it doesn’t exist.

"the skimming of billions of our tax-pounds in government contracts with companies who have neither the competence nor the assets to carry them out successfully, and who have not been required to subject themselves to a tendering procedure, appointments to senior positions of individuals linked to members of the government, with no proper recruitment procedures followed": Specifics? or just random claims?

Once again, numerous examples widely reported in the press and the media - easy to find unless, of course, one chooses not to see it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 04:09 PM

Nothing sensible to add Bonzo?

Maybe you're just trying to fill the void left by the previous trolls. Be careful though and remember what happened to them.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 03:08 PM

Sounds like Starmer is winding up the lefties - I laugh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 01:06 PM

So how long before starmer starts suspending Jewish labour members,
who disagree with his unreasonable authoritarian definitions
of 'unacceptable anti-semitic behaviour'...??????


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:58 PM

That is the way I have seen it too DMcG.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: DMcG
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:46 PM

The ECHR report into Labour

I have not read it yet, but will do as soon as possible.

As far as I am aware at the moment, Corbyn was not directly named in the report, but was suspended because in his remarks after the report was published he acknowledged anti-Semitism but said it was overstated. This fell foul of Starmer's remarks that those who “deny there is a problem are part of the problem … Those who pretend it is exaggerated or factional are part of the problem.”


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:37 PM

Oh, 200!


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:36 PM

No, Nigel, I said my post of 23 Oct 20 - 04:49 AM so which do you think I was referring to? It is a link and there is some opinion in it but if you would care to dispute any of the facts quoted by the author to support his opinion, please feel free.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:21 PM

Or did you mean the two post list taken from someone else's Facebook rant (a few days earlier)?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:20 PM

Nigel again
Specifics? or just random claims?
I refer you to my list of 23 Oct 20 - 04:49 AM


A link to a Guardian opinion piece?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:19 PM

The grip on Starmer's short 'n' curlies is so over tightened now,
clumps are being pulled out at the roots..

Might as well just relinquish leadership of the party to margaret hodge and be done with it...


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:01 PM

List=post


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 12:00 PM

Nigel again

Specifics? or just random claims?

I refer you to my list of 23 Oct 20 - 04:49 AM


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 11:56 AM

Bonzo, how many times must we tell you this. The current Tory government has an 80 seat majority. The cock ups they are guilty of are no one's fault but their own. What any other party of leader may or may not have done is completely irrelevant.

Nigel. Yes, I have seen and read the BBC news. I cannot find where it says Corbyn had been suspended for denying any findings.

Nothing I have get seen from reports of the EHRC findings seems to indicate the the Labour party has a worse antisemitism problem than anyone else. It does say that their reaction and procedures for handling antisemitism left a lot to be desired. Am I missing something?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 11:25 AM

"the appallingly-incompetent handling of COVID-19 by the Tory government"

can you even begin to imagine the winkie wankie wokie abortion which a Corbyn (now sacked from the labour party) government would have been guilty of?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 11:05 AM

I didn't deny it, however:
Another convenient distraction from the truly important issues - the appallingly-incompetent handling of COVID-19 by the Tory government, the looming disaster of a Brexit crash-out with no trade-deal with the EU, the inclusion of the NHS in any trade-deal with the US, the reduction in our food standards that will also be a part of a UK-US trade-deal, the skimming of billions of our tax-pounds in government contracts with companies who have neither the competence nor the assets to carry them out successfully, and who have not been required to subject themselves to a tendering procedure, appointments to senior positions of individuals linked to members of the government, with no proper recruitment procedures followed

"the appallingly-incompetent handling of COVID-19 by the Tory government": Up until the last week the Labour party supported all the actions, and didn't offer alternatives, so not just the "Tory government"
" the inclusion of the NHS in any trade-deal with the US, the reduction in our food standards that will also be a part of a UK-US trade-deal": As no UK/US trade deal has yet been agreed, this is mere supposition.
"the skimming of billions of our tax-pounds in government contracts with companies who have neither the competence nor the assets to carry them out successfully, and who have not been required to subject themselves to a tendering procedure, appointments to senior positions of individuals linked to members of the government, with no proper recruitment procedures followed": Specifics? or just random claims?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 10:14 AM

The truth must be very painful, Nigel. But your denial won’t make it go away.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 10:01 AM

...the list goes on and on, need I say more?
Hopefully not.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 10:00 AM

BBC news (Radio)


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 10:00 AM

Another convenient distraction from the truly important issues - the appallingly-incompetent handling of COVID-19 by the Tory government, the looming disaster of a Brexit crash-out with no trade-deal with the EU, the inclusion of the NHS in any trade-deal with the US, the reduction in our food standards that will also be a part of a UK-US trade-deal, the skimming of billions of our tax-pounds in government contracts with companies who have neither the competence nor the assets to carry them out successfully, and who have not been required to subject themselves to a tendering procedure, appointments to senior positions of individuals linked to members of the government, with no proper recruitment procedures followed...the list goes on and on, need I say more?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 09:52 AM

I saw he had been suspended but not for denying the findings. Do you have a source for that, Nigel?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 09:37 AM

And Jeremy Corbyn denies some of the findings, and has had the whip suspended for doing so.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Oct 20 - 08:49 AM

The EHRC's key findings as reported in the Guardian

The Labour party could have tackled antisemitism more effectively “if the leadership had chosen to do so”, the Equality and Human Rights Commission (EHRC) concluded as part of its 130-page investigations

Not that antisemitism is rife in the party, just that they could have handled it better. I'll be honest and admit that I have not read the report and am not likely to do so as I am not one for politikspeak. Any of the better versed or equipped care to comment?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 23 Oct 20 - 09:14 AM

You didn’t mention Norther Ireland, Dick, you said ‘Ireland’, which is the universally understood term for the Republic of Ireland. The Republic is not part of the UK, neither is NI a part of the Republic.

The title of this thread is ‘Brexit & Other UK political topics. Please stick to the thread topic, and don’t give the mods another excuse to close our one and only UK politics thread.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 Oct 20 - 04:49 AM

Disgusting. But, sadly, what we have come to expect

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/oct/21/government-covid-contracts-britain-nhs-corporate-executives-test-and-trace


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: The Sandman
Date: 23 Oct 20 - 04:06 AM

I have lived in ireland for 30 years so i am aware republic of ire is not part of uk. talk about teaching grand mother to suck eggs.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: The Sandman
Date: 23 Oct 20 - 03:53 AM

northern ireland is part of the uk , and because of brexit there is a big border problem looming, it is affected by brexit so my comment is relevant


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 Oct 20 - 02:50 AM

Is it a double chin or a slit throat? :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Oct 20 - 04:45 PM

Who's the guy with the double chin?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Raggytash
Date: 22 Oct 20 - 03:54 PM

:-)

;-)

:-))


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 22 Oct 20 - 11:15 AM

Ireland isn’t a part of the UK.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics
From: The Sandman
Date: 22 Oct 20 - 09:43 AM

Europe has been good for ireland in a liberalising approach, it has taken a country highly influenced by reactionary religious elements and gradually turned it in to a much more liberal minded and forward looking country


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Mudcat time: 9 May 7:04 PM EDT

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