Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)

Subject: Obit: Phil Spector 1939-2021
From: G-Force
Date: 18 Jan 21 - 05:52 AM

OK, he may have been a violent murdering mysogynist, but we can at least acknowledge his musical genius.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector 1939-2021
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 18 Jan 21 - 06:30 AM

No shit, mind Hitler was good to his mother so perhaps we should forgive him too.

Dave H

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector 1939-2021
From: fat B****rd
Date: 18 Jan 21 - 06:49 AM

I still like most of the 60s Spector hits but I'll keep them entirely separate from the man himself.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector 1939-2021
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Jan 21 - 07:02 AM

We all are appalled by what he did, and we must never forget the horrible aspects. Lana Clarkson, Ronnie Spector and others including his own children - but on a music site his musical legacy should remain. His songwriting and productions skills will be a part of culture long after the man is dust. Ironically, he lives on with songs of peace, like Imagine.. and other co-production contributions to My Sweet Lord.. Happy Christmas War is Over etc.   A brute of a man, addled by ego, power, drink, and drugs with a disturbed childhood background. Also a testimony to why American gun culture is nuts.   He died a medical wreck, at one stage unable to even speak, let alone sing.   His late 50's-70's music rises above the horror of his personality.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector 1939-2021
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 18 Jan 21 - 08:54 AM

As long as we can also debate rationally about Gary Glitter's greatest hits..

.. and any other classic records we enjoy, released by vile depraved human beings...

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector 1939-2021
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 18 Jan 21 - 09:16 AM

As the sermon on the mount says, 'Judge not, lest ye be judged'.

Its the toughest commandment.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector 1939-2021
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 18 Jan 21 - 10:24 AM

You can judge me anytime anywhere and I'll stand it.

Dave H

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector 1939-2021
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 18 Jan 21 - 10:52 AM

In the past, for research purposes, it has been attempted to keep the obit thread separate from the discussion of the crimes of an individual. Too many people keep pushing the crime discussion into the obit to make that very practical because they come back to complain when their inappropriate remarks are moved to the other thread. As long as there is no cooperation, you'll have to sort this out among yourselves. Someone can start a "Phil Spector, murderer" thread and see what happens.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 18 Jan 21 - 06:14 PM

He was nutty as a fruitcake and a murderer, all of the records he produced sounded essentially the same.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Jan 21 - 07:53 PM

Big Al does have a point, and it behoves us to look at our own imperfections, but it's also valid to have red lines when it comes to individuals who have achieved eminence in their field but who have also been guilty of despicable deeds. I doubt whether anyone round here would buy a box set of Jim'll Fix It (Jimmy Savile's very popular TV show - my kids loved it...). Richard Wagner was a rabid antisemite and I won't listen to his music. Herbert Von Karajan was an enthusiastic member of the Nazi Party during the war and was a big help to Hitler, so ditto. Many would, and do, argue that these guys' artistic lives should be seen as entirely separate from their private shenanigans. I'm not all that sure. It's partly principle with me, misguided you may say, but, more than that, I find it impossible to hold my nose. We have to make our own personal decisions about people who are very close to that line, and what's tolerable for you may be indigestible for me. So be it.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: GUEST,Lin
Date: 18 Jan 21 - 08:28 PM

He went to my high school, but 17 or 18 years before I was there.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: GUEST,Frank Hamilton
Date: 18 Jan 21 - 08:33 PM

I attended a seminar hosted by Spector. It was on recording production. I made the mistake
of asking him how he financed his sessions. Bad move. He said, "None of you business."
I said, "This is a seminar on how to help others in this field." We had words.

I remember him parking his Rolls Royce on the sidewalk in front of the Ash Grove on Melrose in L.A. and his following a woman into the ladies rest room.

He was a great producer with a tortured life.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: GUEST,The Sandman
Date: 19 Jan 21 - 03:35 AM

His Sound does not interest me.
The only artist he produced who is of any interest to me was Ravi Shankar, i have not heard this production so it would be unfair to comment.
He was a murderer and sounds a similiar character to Charles Manson, Spector was a self confessed control freak.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: GUEST,johnmc
Date: 19 Jan 21 - 04:38 AM

The word "genius" is, I think we can agree, applied rather too liberally these days.
To be fair, many of those so described might themselves dismiss the suggestion.
Even some child prodigies don't, in the end, justify the title.
On a less rarefied note, if the producer of "You've Lost that Loving Feeing" is a genius, what does that make its composers ?

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Jan 21 - 05:06 AM

if the producer of "You've Lost that Loving Feeing" is a genius, what does that make its composers ?

Errrm, Spector did (co) write it...

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Jan 21 - 05:13 AM

JOHNHMC - Spector was one of the writers on ..'loving feeling'. He contributed a part and shaped it into the song you know, as well as producing the 'wall of sound'. Spector wrote or contributed to classic songs which were the pop soundtrack of an era, and wasn't just a Svengali producer. He was a 'genius of pop music' and knew it, but the label corrupted and turned him, along with drink and drugs, into a tyrant. Apart from the obvious 50's and 60's sounds, he influenced the Beatles to such a point that he produced and co-produced John and George's early solo classics. His genius influence, bounced off onto other pop 'geniuses' in their writing of songs and productions.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Jan 21 - 07:26 AM

A genius of pop music, ha ha. tha tis an oxymoron
an evil manipulative control freak may he rot in hell

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: GUEST,johnmc
Date: 19 Jan 21 - 07:36 AM

I stand corrected: he seemed to insist on keeping the dummy lyric.
Don't deny he was musically talented - but a genius ?
The Wall of Sound seems to me to be a matter of individual taste.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 19 Jan 21 - 07:58 AM

As expected at mudcat..

.. the usual old misery acoustic folkie intolerance and ignorance of pop music..

Spector was a shit human being,
but his contribution to, and influence on, popular music was immense.

Few people in the real world care about pedantic griping about use of the word 'genius'..

A stock label mostly applied by lazy hack journalists meeting their deadlines...

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 19 Jan 21 - 08:32 AM

You say asshole, and I say arsehole...

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: voyager
Date: 19 Jan 21 - 09:20 AM

no sympathy for the devil here.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: Jeri
Date: 19 Jan 21 - 11:42 AM

PFR, yep.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: GUEST,johnmc
Date: 19 Jan 21 - 01:25 PM

I think my "griping' was based on the notion that the debate about his character v his talent
is only of interest if someone is rated as an artistic giant.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Jan 21 - 03:15 PM

Yep.. the problem with being called 'legendary', during his lifetime is that it gave Spector an ego as big as his fortress home. Ironically, having a 'sound', counted against him in the end, as it became dated for mainstream pop, and times moved on. Towards the end of Spector's career the hits dried, and artists sacked him due to his behaviour. What goes around comes around. When you have power and a sound that's in demand they beat upon your door, when times change you may be a legend - but a solitary one that nobody wants to work with. His fortress was a lonely one. Spector's legacy though will live on..and every year you'll still be hearing Christmas songs that were produced or influenced by him.. (Mariah's ubiquitous 'All I want for Christmas is You', is a direct Spector sound flog and she also covered some of his work) His pop sound was dated and fixed in period, but with Christmas it still perfectly fits the annual seasonal jingle bell fest.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: Mooh
Date: 20 Jan 21 - 10:51 AM

Sure, a great producer with some cool and timely ideas, but I wouldn't position him above a lot of other greats like George Martin or Jerry Wexler or Quincy Jones. I think Jimmy Page has more going on, and better ears, or least did. Peter Asher is another.

As for his sins, Spector was an utter asshole who, I suspect, never had to come to terms with his evil because he was alright with it.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: GUEST,.gargoyle
Date: 20 Jan 21 - 09:17 PM

A full year without a haircut.
Due to CV19 and lock downs.

Sincerely,
Gargoyle

Look out Phil ...we are about to do sartorical battle.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 21 Jan 21 - 01:02 AM

Brian Wilson and Roy Wood [arguably genuine 'geniuses'...?????]
copied the wall of sound...

Two of my all time favourites,
and their greatest records were inspired by one of the most despicable men in popular music..

Oh well.. funny old world, innit...

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: GUEST,Phil d'Conch
Date: 24 Jan 21 - 02:36 AM

I was going to wait until the anniversary of Huddie Ledbetter's birthday to send ol' Phil off... and then missed it by a day... ah well!

IMNSHO his work with the Beatles and the early John Lennon solo stuff is going to hang around for a while longer than some of the rest.

To know him was not to love him and he is beyond caring. That much is certain.

RIP Phil Spector.

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: The Sandman
Date: 24 Jan 21 - 04:04 AM

but his contribution to, and influence on, popular music was immense." quote quote
please explain did he write any lyrics, did he write imagine or give peace a chance?
he created a sound which later became dated,
how does that make his contribution to popular music immense
he was a record producer, but then so was George Martin, he was also inactive from 1981 to early 2000s, 20 years inactive
    Spector remained inactive throughout most of the 1980s, 1990s, and early 2000s. In early 1981, shortly after the death of John Lennon, he temporarily re-emerged to co-produce Yoko Ono's Season of Glass.[95] In 1989, Tina Turner inducted Spector into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame as a non-performer.[96] He was inducted into the Songwriter's Hall of Fame in 1997 and he received the Grammys Trustees Award in 2000.[97][14]

He attempted to work with Céline Dion on her album Falling into You but fell out with her production team.[98] His last released project was Silence Is Easy by Starsailor, in 2003. He was originally supposed to produce the entire album, but was fired owing to personal and creative differences. One of the two Spector-produced songs on the album, the title track, was a UK top 10 single (the other single being "White Dove").[99]

Subject: RE: Obit: Phil Spector (1939-2021)
From: keberoxu
Date: 25 Jan 21 - 07:14 PM

The Righteous Brothers alone
earned him his place,
call his place what you will.