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Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11

DaveRo 28 Jul 21 - 02:30 AM
Bonzo3legs 28 Jul 21 - 01:45 AM
Bonzo3legs 25 Jul 21 - 08:38 AM
Donuel 25 Jul 21 - 08:30 AM
Bonzo3legs 25 Jul 21 - 07:49 AM
Bonzo3legs 24 Jul 21 - 04:19 PM
Bonzo3legs 24 Jul 21 - 05:06 AM
Bonzo3legs 23 Jul 21 - 08:04 AM
Bonzo3legs 23 Jul 21 - 02:43 AM
Stilly River Sage 22 Jul 21 - 10:29 AM
Bonzo3legs 22 Jul 21 - 02:03 AM
Bonzo3legs 21 Jul 21 - 05:40 PM
Bonzo3legs 21 Jul 21 - 01:58 PM
Ed. 21 Jul 21 - 12:13 PM
DaveRo 20 Jul 21 - 02:29 AM
Bonzo3legs 14 Jul 21 - 07:57 AM
Bonzo3legs 11 Jul 21 - 08:47 AM
Stilly River Sage 08 Jul 21 - 11:30 PM
Stilly River Sage 30 Jun 21 - 03:11 PM
robomatic 30 Jun 21 - 02:15 PM
leeneia 30 Jun 21 - 12:45 PM
punkfolkrocker 30 Jun 21 - 01:02 AM
punkfolkrocker 26 Jun 21 - 02:41 PM
DaveRo 26 Jun 21 - 01:37 PM
Jon Freeman 26 Jun 21 - 12:55 PM
Bill D 26 Jun 21 - 12:51 PM
Stilly River Sage 26 Jun 21 - 11:57 AM
punkfolkrocker 26 Jun 21 - 11:33 AM
DaveRo 26 Jun 21 - 11:31 AM
Stilly River Sage 26 Jun 21 - 11:19 AM
Jon Freeman 26 Jun 21 - 11:04 AM
Jon Freeman 26 Jun 21 - 10:22 AM
DaveRo 26 Jun 21 - 09:56 AM
Jon Freeman 26 Jun 21 - 09:37 AM
Jon Freeman 26 Jun 21 - 08:49 AM
Bonzo3legs 26 Jun 21 - 08:33 AM
Jon Freeman 26 Jun 21 - 07:44 AM
WalkaboutsVerse 26 Jun 21 - 06:52 AM
Sandra in Sydney 26 Jun 21 - 06:06 AM
Richard Mellish 26 Jun 21 - 05:55 AM
Stilly River Sage 25 Jun 21 - 11:35 PM
gnu 25 Jun 21 - 10:43 PM
Stilly River Sage 25 Jun 21 - 09:37 PM
punkfolkrocker 25 Jun 21 - 07:40 PM
Bonzo3legs 25 Jun 21 - 04:11 PM
GUEST 25 Jun 21 - 04:04 PM
WalkaboutsVerse 25 Jun 21 - 03:52 PM
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Bill D 25 Jun 21 - 11:17 AM
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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: DaveRo
Date: 28 Jul 21 - 02:30 AM

Google says "Did you mean: tpm and secure boot?"

I wouldn't update an old machine to Win 11 if it lacked 'necessary' hardware features - except in play. MS could release an update which requires these features at any time. Requiring biometric authentication, perhaps. Maybe in 2025 when Win 10 stops being updated.

Kasperski was warning the other day of fake Win 11 updates. Presumably, unlike the eventual production updates, these are unsigned. MS might use features of TPM v2 to stop that once Win 11 is released.

I hope that manufacturers continue to sell machines on which you can turn secure boot off, or at least run a non-Microsoft OS. It's cheaper to buy a Lenovo PC with Windows installed and overwrite it with Linux than buying a PC with no OS.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 28 Jul 21 - 01:45 AM

Just messing around with hard discs - an Insider version of Windows 11 (with tmp and secure boot search removed) will install over Windows 7 provided that you do a clean install - so there's no going back of course!

Updates do not include tmp and secure boot search so far, but versions "amended" for older machines will slways be there!!!


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 25 Jul 21 - 08:38 AM

Good fun though!!


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Donuel
Date: 25 Jul 21 - 08:30 AM

New software is not a cure for the world wide hack.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 25 Jul 21 - 07:49 AM

It seems to be a bug in latest version. Oddly once the TPM and secure boot checks are jumped by a Windows 10 substitute appraiserres-dll file, no further checks are made from updates....................so far!!


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 24 Jul 21 - 04:19 PM

They certainly lied about Windows 11, I have no option to roll back to Windows 10!!


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 24 Jul 21 - 05:06 AM

I also installed the beta version on a 12 year old desktop, that is a beta version doesn't check for the TPM module and secure boot!


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 23 Jul 21 - 08:04 AM

I don't mean the Taskbar, I mean the Start Menu!! Unfortunately the video bit of the motherboard is on the blink as it turns very bright after a couple of hours.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 23 Jul 21 - 02:43 AM

Very annoying that Windows 11 does not allow installation of my TP-link 722N wifi adaptor, and that it will not allow you to see the characters when putting in the router password.

Taskbar is now aligned left and looks better.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 22 Jul 21 - 10:29 AM

I have Windows 7 backup set to run weekly on my Win10 machine. There really isn't another Windows option. Long gone are the days of Norton Ghost. . .


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 22 Jul 21 - 02:03 AM

I don't like the start menu in the middle of the screen - lunacy!!


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 21 Jul 21 - 05:40 PM

Installed Windows 11 on 8 year old PC - TPM bypassed!!!


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 21 Jul 21 - 01:58 PM

microsoft states a great deal of mumbo jumbo about requirements for upgrading to Windows 11. I shall wait for a preactivated version first!!!


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Ed.
Date: 21 Jul 21 - 12:13 PM

Anybody using 'Win 7 backup' to a local disk on Win 10?

Dave,

See my Windows Backup queries thread.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: DaveRo
Date: 20 Jul 21 - 02:29 AM

Windows 11: What we like and don't like about Microsoft's operating system so far

Upgrade from Windows 10 is free. Windows 10 will be supported until October 14, 2025.

"Even Windows backup is still there in Control Panel, under the mysterious label "Backup and Restore (Windows 7)." This is the same as on Windows 10, though worth mentioning here, since unlike the strongly promoted File History in the Settings applet, this old-style backup actually is a full backup of the system that can be saved to a drive and taken offline – just the thing in these days of ransomware."

I'm not sure this is correct. When my wife's machine was upgraded to Win 10 I continued to use 'Win 7 backup' (in addition to File History) to backup monthly to a local drive. But after a recent reinstall it said that it was only capable of restoring backups but not making new ones. Anybody using 'Win 7 backup' to a local disk on Win 10?


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 14 Jul 21 - 07:57 AM

An invitation to upgrade to Windows 11 appeared on my work PC today!!


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 11 Jul 21 - 08:47 AM

"Yes, Bonzo - but only 120 GB (they expect us to use cloud storage, I think) with only 16.5 GB left (I think we are supposed to leave about that much for updates, etc.). Thus, I added the above 60 GB card."

No way will I entrust my data to cloud storage. I have a 500gb ssd and 500HDD in my Lenovo Thinkcentre.

I can't remember if I put this elsewhere, but 2 weeks ago I ran the MS utility to see if my Thinkcentre can run Windows 11. It told me that "secure boot" was not enabled - easily remedied in bios..........but then on restart I got "Error 1962: No operating system found. Boot sequence will automatically repeat." So Lenovo owners beware!

After many frustrating hours of trying to solve the problem using various "fixes" I came accross a fix that worked. All that was necessary was a couple of tweaks to the start up bios - enable CSM, and in Boot Priority change Legacy First to UEFI First, whatever that does. Then on startup I got the endless circle followed by the magic words "Getting Devices Ready" - home and dry!!


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 08 Jul 21 - 11:30 PM

Windows 11 reminds the PC ecosystem of the value of major releases

After years of anonymous Windows tweaks, Microsoft's big reveal celebrates the PC at a time when new Mac features have become largely about tying it more tightly into the rest of Apple's products and services.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 30 Jun 21 - 03:11 PM

There is a transfer cable with software built into it (the big end is basically a drive with the installed software). I also have a non-Internet computer on the next desk in my office, and I run the transfer cable between the two. The fat end is on the Internet connected computer. Anyway, the software is installed on both (EasySuite) and you open it on both devices then get the local and remote screen on both. I drag stuff back and forth between the two regularly (the old computer has the newer computer software that I can't replace without subscribing for Adobe monthly service, so I do a lot of my photo and design work there, and drag the results into the newer computer.) Radio Shack makes a good one that I got on sale from them a couple of years ago. I see that Amazon sells Radio Shack's cable much cheaper.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: robomatic
Date: 30 Jun 21 - 02:15 PM

do you have malware protection on either of your computers?


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: leeneia
Date: 30 Jun 21 - 12:45 PM

I have a big desk with two computers. One is old and runs on Windows 7. It is not connected to the Internet but does a beautiful job with MIDI software and Noteworthy Composer. The other is on Windows 10 and handles all our online activities.

When I want to transfer data between computers, I use a thumbdrive.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 30 Jun 21 - 01:02 AM

Win 11 pisses off consumers


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 02:41 PM

We can only hope that Microsoft are remembering to provide a stable and reliable operating system for musicians and graphics artists.

It's only in the last year or so that major music software developers are forcing upgrades that are only supported on win 10...

That will be the win 10 that many musicians including myself have rejected as too unstable...


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: DaveRo
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 01:37 PM

SRS; Do the Yubico key and the tablet have NFC?

This Google Pixel C tablet doesn't, despite it being a top-end device in its day. Pixel phones generally do. Perhaps it's because the main use is probably e-payments and peope don't use tablets to pay for things.

This is all related to the requirement for TPM chips in Windows 11 - secure authentication of the user and holding 2FA keys.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 12:55 PM

Thanks Dave. That CPU spec would count everything here out. I'm pretty sure my laptop is an Intel (apparently 6th generation) Skylake, and the PCs are pre AMD socket 4 Ryzen.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bill D
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 12:51 PM

refresh... hoping Joe Offer saw my answer to his local search problem


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 11:57 AM

Two-factor authentication. Yubico. There is one on my keychain in my pocket. They're pretty durable. I used it on my computer at work and at home starting several years ago. Fast IDentity Online


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 11:33 AM

Registered Fido...???

What.. the world is getting weirder..

.. we need dog licences to run a computer now...!!!???


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: DaveRo
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 11:31 AM

Jon: I should have said Intel Generation 8. Windows 11 requires "8th Gen Intel Core or 2nd Gen AMD Ryzen".

It doesn't mention other processor manufacturers. IBM for example make their POWER9 cpu as used in the powerful, and expensive, Talos II.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 11:19 AM

Looks like it will soon be time for another crash course in computing.

As a related topic, I was setting up a new tablet last week and the Google/Android part asked for my registered FIDO (I use Yubico) that I've used with full-sized computers for several years now. The tablet had only the micro USB plug, so I used another authentication method and got a code from my phone Authenticator. I ended up shopping around and picking up a converter female USB down to the male micro USB and the class C for phones and tablets. This isn't the first small device to ask for this, and I've been meaning to find a converter.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 11:04 AM

At a quick attempt, CPU generation seems to me to be maker dependent. New AMD Ryzen processors appear to be at generation 4 but in Intel terms, generation 4 could take us back to 2013,

I think...


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 10:22 AM

LOL Dave. 2.1 was my misreading of your post which just gives version 2.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: DaveRo
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 09:56 AM

Jon Freeman wrote: Did you mean TPM 2.0 rather than 2.1 above, Dave.
That puzzled me! A sans font and proportional spacing probably contributed to your question ;)

I've looked into it further. It seems MS are saying you need an 8th Generation processor to run Windows 11. Who on earth knows what generation their processor is? Anyway after a lot googling I discovered that the Thinkpad is 3rd Generation and that 8th Generation CPUs were introduced in 2017; see here. As Richard said, that requirement might be relaxed (I think they might drop it to 7th gen, which was the first processor that only supports Win 10) but I don't see the requirement for TPM 2 changing.

I think this new version of Windows is mainly driven by Microsoft's strategy of converging traditional desktops/laptops and touch/mobile devices. Also, I suspect, to simplify the code by dropping stuff inherited from earlier versions - like 32-bit processors. (Though it'll still run 32-bit programs, so Simple Piano should still work :)


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 09:37 AM

Oh, and, it is mentioned in my link but balena Ethcher is a pretty good cross platform (Linux, Windows and Mac) tool for getting ISOs onto USB drives.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 08:49 AM

A dual layer DVD?

Perhaps when all else fails, there is always the good old dd found as std on most Linux systems but be warned it will just take what you tell it to do without warning.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 08:33 AM

The Windows 11 ISO is 4,760,306kb, so it won't burn to a DVD and it won't copy to a FAT32 formatted USB. So you either need ISO shrink software or format a USB drive to NTFS!!!


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 07:44 AM

Did you mean TPM 2.0 rather than 2.1 above, Dave.

I just had a look at what it would mean to me (not that I want Windows on our main PCs).

My (I guess about 5 or 6 year old) ASUS laptop has TPM 2.0.

I’ve only looked at my own PC (Gigabyte 970A-DS3P BIOS dated in 2015) but all 3 PCs in regular use here are of similar AMD970 chipset build and age. Mine doesn’t have TPM support but should have a socket on the motherboard to take a TPM module. Gigabyte offer a few modules for their motherboards but I don’t think I’d find a 2.0 one for mine.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 06:52 AM

Yes, Sandra - can't remember if it was early this year or late last, but recall the changes to Blogger required considerably different processes to edit, etc., which took me a while to fathom, frankly.

That said, I think it is a good choice for anyone who wishes for their own site on the web - free (unlike some hosts that are only free for a limited number of visits) and if, unlike me, you wish to go pro and add ads, it still seems easy to do.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 06:06 AM

well said, Richard - "if it ain't broke, mess about with it anyway, and if it confuses users that's their problem".

That also applies so Google's "upgrade" of Blogger to make it easier for folk who blog short, instant updates on their phones - look at my kid/dog/garden - hell for the rest of us who create larger articles with lots of text & pics.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Richard Mellish
Date: 26 Jun 21 - 05:55 AM

My computer guru advises "Basically the min spec for W11 is crazy over-the-top (I think there may be a climb-down from MS, but we'll see) as even high spec PCs don't qualify"
and
"as things stand, W11 is essentially a cash-grab for the PC industry (or so it seems to me) and a push by MS to require online accounts (a number of features are locked behind an arbitrary MS account requirement)."

Anyway Micro$oft say they're continuing support for Win 10 for a few years yet, so we can afford to wait and see what happens.

All the changes to the user interface seem another instance of Micro$oft's general policy of "if it ain't broke, mess about with it anyway, and if it confuses users that's their problem".


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 25 Jun 21 - 11:35 PM

Apple is for zealots. :)


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: gnu
Date: 25 Jun 21 - 10:43 PM

Well, they still aren't finished working out the bugs in WIN 10, SRS. Bothers me greatly, but I don't have the $$$ for an Apple, and I am not tech savvy enough for other OSs.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 25 Jun 21 - 09:37 PM

C|Net is where I get a lot of my tech news also, Joe. I'll have to look into this - the main thing I DON'T want is an automatic upgrade to the new system. I'd like them to work out a few of the bugs first.


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 25 Jun 21 - 07:40 PM

https://www.techradar.com/uk/news/windows-11-home-and-pro

TechRadar in-depth report on what to expect from win 11..

Looks like it won't be released officially until much later this year...


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 25 Jun 21 - 04:11 PM

I see what you mean!!!


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Jun 21 - 04:04 PM

Bonz - is that the first version proper release ISO, or still a beta ?


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 25 Jun 21 - 03:52 PM

...and, if that works, Bonzo may move on to the Tasmanian tiger, closely followed by the dodo...


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 25 Jun 21 - 03:21 PM

I 've downloaded the Win11 iso, and will try to do an upgrade from Win7 Enterprise on a 16 years old PC!!!


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 25 Jun 21 - 11:46 AM

I don't bother but, if someone tends to remember roughly when they created folders and they have a lot, names can be started with year, month then day - e.g., 2021.06.25


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Subject: RE: Tech: They lied, Here's Windows 11
From: Bill D
Date: 25 Jun 21 - 11:17 AM

Joe- ".. - how to find stuff on my computer"

The absolutely best way I've found is a little program called
http://indexyourfiles

It very quickly uses a basic internal database to..ummm..index the files.

All I have to do is tell it which drives (or external drives) to search and give it a key word or phrase. Results are almost instant.

It has saved me many, many times... especially song titles or lyrics.


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