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BS: Another shooting in US
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 01 Jun 22 - 07:17 PM HIGH FIVES ALL AROUND FOR THE NRA - Another shooting at a Hospital. You see AR sales skyrocket when mass shootings threaten the manufacture of AR military weapons, in the mind of buyers. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: keberoxu Date: 01 Jun 22 - 07:19 PM It's a disease, at this point. Treatable, perhaps, but ... curable?? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 01 Jun 22 - 07:39 PM I can see how there can be a cult of gun-owners who revere them, and see them as a central part of a national tradition. But I find it hard to understand how that could go astray Into defending the ability of people to defile that tradition by how they misuse guns. So I'd expect to see people who see guns that way to be actively demanding checks on how guns could get into the hands of people liable to misuse them, and on the types of guns they could have. Not just because that would go towards protecting the right to own guns from those who might wish to oppose that, but even more because the misuse of guns was a kind of blasphemy. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 01 Jun 22 - 07:39 PM **** dis ease. I think good health is just a constant state of healing whether we know it or not. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 01 Jun 22 - 07:57 PM I wonder how much straw it takes to break a Camel's back. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Bill D Date: 01 Jun 22 - 09:45 PM McGrath...It is just very hard to identify possible misusers if they have no history of threats or arrests. Yes...there needs to need new restrictions on ANYONE buying guns, as well as what kind they can buy. Maybe now we can get **some** progress. I DO see how, given our history, reverence for guns can morph into misuse. I referred to such things in my long post. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Dave the Gnome Date: 02 Jun 22 - 03:42 AM Bill, did you see my linked article on how the Swiss manage to do it? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Steve Shaw Date: 02 Jun 22 - 05:06 AM ...And another... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Backwoodsman Date: 02 Jun 22 - 05:57 AM Obviously it’s Open Season, Steve… :-( |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Mrrzy Date: 02 Jun 22 - 08:46 AM The idea that shooting people is a *reasonable* response to discomfort is very much the American mindset. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Backwoodsman Date: 02 Jun 22 - 08:56 AM And a good start to changing that mindset would be to replace the ‘right’ to own a gun with the principle that it’s a privilege. Strict registration and vetting of all gun-owners, and restrictions on what types of gun they are allowed to own. That’s how it’s done in the UK and Australia, and <100 shooting deaths a year proves it works. No civilian needs military-style assault weapons. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 02 Jun 22 - 09:11 AM As Bill said, restrictions on who can buy guns and what kind of guns are needed in any country. And of course it's hard to identify possible misusers - but the fact that something necessary is hard is never a good reason not to do it. What I find hard to understand how any sane gun enthusiasts would not agree to that. I can understand there are some who would see things like that as being a step towards a total ban, but not how they can be anything but a fringe minority among gun owners, to be ridiculed and disliked. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Bonzo3legs Date: 02 Jun 22 - 10:12 AM I gather that it's more important to have guns than abortion in some states!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: robomatic Date: 02 Jun 22 - 10:34 AM It is called 'DEEPITY '. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Bill D Date: 02 Jun 22 - 11:04 AM Dave TK Yes.. and the Swiss actions make perfect sense. Sane & reasonable. But here, the bureaucratic process to institute such changes has so many barriers that it is almost dead from the start. Today, there is an article..if you can access it.. about how the US House of Representatives has begun..Unfortunately it is pretty soft and weak... https://www.cbsnews.com/news/gun-control-legislation-protecting-our-kids-act-house-judiciary-committee/ "The House Judiciary Committee on Thursday will consider eight pieces of gun control legislation that will be packaged together as the "Protecting Our Kids Act" and will move to the House floor for a vote next week, according to a committee aide. That movement comes as President Biden told reporters Tuesday that he will meet with Congress on guns. The legislation under consideration by House Democrats would do the following Raise the age for purchasing a semiautomatic centerfire rifle from 18 to 21 years old Make it illegal to import, sell, manufacture, transfer or possess a large-capacity magazine, with some exceptions Establish requirements regulating the storage of firearms on residential facilities Build on the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms' regulatory ban on bump stocks, attachments to guns that make rapid-fire easier. Existing bump stocks would have to be registered, and sale and possession by civilians of bump stocks would be banned. Current federal firearms regulations would apply to so-called "ghost guns." It will 'probably' pass in the House...but the Senate is another matter. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Bill D Date: 02 Jun 22 - 11:15 AM McGrath... I'm sure, as you say, that 'sane' gun owners would agree... but in such cases, sane is itself ambiguous. On issues like guns, abortion, immigration, LGBTQ rights...etc.. sanity is problematic. I'd counter by asking why Britain and other countries can't stop football/soccer riots. Are those who crash gates and pick fights 'sane'? Humans are distinguished by their ability to rationalize and ignore laws on certain topics... sadly, fascination with guns is the albatross WE are burdened with. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Steve Shaw Date: 02 Jun 22 - 04:58 PM We have stopped football riots. The little scuffles we get today are as nothing compared to the hooliganism of the seventies and eighties. The word riot is not appropriate. The issue at the Champions League final in Paris was not the result of supporter misbehaviour. I suggest thst you choose your sources of news a little more carefully, Bill. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 02 Jun 22 - 06:12 PM Being fascinated with guns is almost as easy to understand as being fascinated by musical instruments. They can both be ingeniously designed and constructed and beautiful as objects. It's easy enough to see how there can be some people who would see efforts to regulate ownership as a threat. What I find hard is how such people could ever be more than a tiny fringe of disregarded weirdos. Even if they had money to burn, how could they have a stranglehold on a major political party. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Bill D Date: 02 Jun 22 - 06:58 PM The thing in France was a minor scuffle? I did include "other countries". I read several articles about it...including the fake ticket scandal. I know that slow and inadequate police presence contributed. *shrug*.. but just because no one got trampled or got onto the field, it still seemed like quite a mess. My point was that around the world, there are serious things done in anger. There was some player in (Columbia?) killed because of an 'own goal' a number of years ago. Well, I'm glad it's better about the riots...at least those are easier to deal with... but the gun issues here will likely persist for the foreseeable future. Simply too many guns and idiots out there. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Steve Shaw Date: 02 Jun 22 - 07:38 PM Sorry, Bill, but you got the "football riots" thing arse about face. The Liverpool fans in Paris were absolutely not to blame for the over-reaction of the French police. The fake ticket thing happens at every big sports event, nothing has been proven, and the accusation by the French that fake tickets were done "on an industrial scale" is just bullshit intended to divert attention away from the shortcomings of the EUFA organisation and the pathetic and heavy-handed response of the French police. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 02 Jun 22 - 07:41 PM A little girl watched the 19 slain children on TV and asked,"Mom, what picture will you use of me"? Mcgrath has a point there are few things that are so elegant, mysterious, precious and lovable that can reach out and touch someone as deeply as a gun. But that is only half of the fairey tale . Behold the bullet! The graceful taper leading to a point of excellence and infinity. -Swoon- Nothing is as fun and spontaneous as bullets in a hot frying pan. Nothing as perfect and precise as a well aimed bullet, pronounced bule'. A well dressed man may sport a Rolex but nothing gets attention like an AR draped accross his chest. Accessories are to die for. They even sell a small splash guard for close up work and round 100 bullet magazines that will make your barrel glow red by the time its empty 000h. I say let the big dog bark loud and forget those puny silencers. The freedom, the glory, the power and the smell of gunpowder in the morning is pure ectasy...err um... well I suppose guns could be cool. I have friends who are gun nuts, Hazel, Walt and Pete. There is nothing like gun nuts boastin when they open fire. Biden is now making his appeal on TV tonight... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 02 Jun 22 - 08:43 PM Seriously I know and Stephen Colbert knows of the actual love affair some people have with their guns. Greg Stube of Florida is in Congress. Here he is debating a gun bill today. https://twitter.com/i/status/1532399894773878784 |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Mrrzy Date: 02 Jun 22 - 10:55 PM Unfortunately, it is a right. I agree it oughta be a privilege. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Steve Shaw Date: 04 Jun 22 - 04:23 PM Why should it be a privilege? Why should it happen at all? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 04 Jun 22 - 05:54 PM I'd sooner live in a world without guns, or for that matter cars or many other things that are part of our civilisation. But magic thinking doesn't work. What we have to do is agree on ways of controlling these things, and eliminating or minimising the bad consequences. We are lucky in the UK to have a culture in which virtually eliminating gun worship has been possible. Many, in fact most other parts of the world haven't been so lucky. The USA isn't the only country where private gun ownership is a constitutional right, and it isn't the only country where gun ownership is quite common. But it is the only country where it is a national obsession, and where mass killings of this sort are are regular events, and other kinds of gun deaths are so commonplace. There is no contradiction between there being a right to have a gun and and for the exercise of that right being subject to stringent requirements. I don't like the word "privilege" being used in this context, any more than in many others where it is deployed too readily. …….. The sad thing is how the title of this thread is always freshly the case. I note today there's a story of a judge getting killed by a nut with a death list of a string of other public people. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 04 Jun 22 - 07:12 PM I was surprised that more kids were shot and killed than on duty policemen this year. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 05 Jun 22 - 08:46 AM Why? Republicans https://uproxx.com/viral/marjorie-taylor-greene-gun-giveaway-joe-biden-taliban/ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: SPB-Cooperator Date: 05 Jun 22 - 09:02 AM And another |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Stilly River Sage Date: 05 Jun 22 - 10:38 AM If the feds were smart they'd track the sales of body armor. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: MaJoC the Filk Date: 05 Jun 22 - 02:32 PM Not sure that'd work, SRS: in films, heroes are always lucky, and need neither body armour nor more than one shot. Behaving like a film hero in real life doesn't guarantee you'll be lucky --- far from it. The remainder of this train of thought has been delayed at Paddington, awaiting the unloading of a Very Important Bear's crate of marmalade sandwiches. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: robomatic Date: 05 Jun 22 - 02:43 PM The book by Chivers: "The Gun" is about the design, development, and massive manufacture of the AK-47 which was stockpiled in the millions and used by the USSR as an inducement to influence foreign policy. It was a tool in the deaths of over a million people since its creation. Apparently its namesake, Mikhail Kalashnikov, was quite proud of his design, but also aware of its consequences and not proud of that part. Which also reminded me of the Nicolas Cage movie of almost 20 years ago: "Lord of War" |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 05 Jun 22 - 06:30 PM Without realizing it I have been associating our various summer get aways with the mass shooting that was concurrent with the trips. Williamsburg: Colorado movie shooter Northwest coast trip: Uvelve Texas shooting etc. With 3 mass shootings a week there is no shortage. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 06 Jun 22 - 06:12 AM Progressive news channels report 13 mass shootings in these last 2 weeks Fox reports 2 240 mass shootings have occured this year. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: SPB-Cooperator Date: 06 Jun 22 - 03:26 PM On track for well over 500 this year then. A world beating 'achievement' that would surely make every gun nut proud to be American. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Mrrzy Date: 08 Jun 22 - 10:15 AM I just got to Philly. I feel safer that they just *had* a mass shooting. I remember in the 70s feeling safer flying if there had just been a hijacking or plane crash. Similar fallacy. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 09 Jun 22 - 07:16 AM Get to know what the other side of the gun debate is about. "We did not ban airplanes after 9-11." "We have to protect weapons over the lives illegaly taken." "We need better doors and mental health at schools" "After the school accident, Democrats shamfully politicized the deaths." Its all part of running out the clock. Have you ever heard of a mass shooter calling 911 to declare to police "I'm about to shoot Bret Cavanaugh, I am 2 blocks from his house..."?? No one was harmed or shot. The good guys came to the rescue of the Justice. It is a very curious story about a (mentally ill) young man from Californis that had a job to do. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 09 Jun 22 - 12:43 PM Gun owner rights are superior to the lives of American children who by the way die from bullets from guns as their leading cause of death. Before children are born their lives are invaluable and women's rights are negligible. After they are born, rights are reduced to that of women (on the conservative side of things) India still has sacred cows but we have sacred guns that trump people's lives in church, on the job, in school, on the road, at the movies, at military installations, concerts and kindergartens. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Stilly River Sage Date: 15 Jun 22 - 11:58 AM In contrast to the police delay to confront the Uvalde shooter, Duncanville police took out a shooter quickly. https://www.npr.org/2022/06/14/1104904845/police-dallas-area-kill-gunman-summer-camp-for-kids-duncanville-fieldhouse. A gunman opened fire inside a building where more than 250 kids and staff were starting a day of summer camp on Monday, setting off a panic that ended with a gunfight with police in Duncanville, Texas. Duncanville is SW of Dallas and east of Fort Worth. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: SPB-Cooperator Date: 25 Jul 22 - 05:23 AM Los Angeles: Two killed and five injured in shooting in San Pedro park Two people were killed and five others wounded in a shooting at a Los Angeles park on Sunday (24 July). Gunfire broke out at an informal car show in the community of San Pedro, according to the Los Angeles Fire Department. As part of Southern California car culture, owners of classic cars and low riders often gather in public places to show off their rides. The shooting victims, four men and three women, ranged in age from 23 to 54, but a spokesperson said he could offer no information about what caused the confrontation. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: leeneia Date: 30 Jul 22 - 02:17 PM Thanks for the link, Stilly. It gives one a lot to think about. I'm glad they didn't name the perp. I have read that one motive for these "school" shooters is fame. The less notoriety we grant them, the better off we will be. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 30 Jul 22 - 02:48 PM A very narrow vote in the House has won a rebanning of AR 15s. The Senate is another matter. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: leeneia Date: 04 Aug 22 - 04:39 PM Banning is good, but there are a lot of these guns out there already. However, we have had guns for years, but these mass shootings are new. When there is a big change in people's behavior, I look for big changes in people's lives. If you are a senior citizen, think back to when you were twelve, when you were 25, when you were 40. What has changed? These things come to my mind: So many younger people don't have fathers. What does it do to your pride when your own father doesn't even want to know if you are okay? Poverty is so much more desperate. People living under bridges and in dumpsters. Families without enough to eat. Mental health - less help all the time, it seems. Illegal drugs - cause hopelessness, cause rage Internet malice. "Be famous! Shoot somebody! Here's how." Alcohol use is way up since Covid. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 04 Aug 22 - 04:55 PM All good points leenia. I worry about these guns being used by extremeists who now feel they were too timid over the Kansas abortion votes. Polling places may be the target of any shooting to inspire fear and skew the extremist vote. Make people think twice about going to the polls that were shot up the night before and maybe the extremists win. Fear and intimidation is the Republican calling card. This has not happened yet thank goodness, except at school board meetings and against volunteers who count votes and attorney generals that certify elections. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Trump Actions/Effects (NO new Trmp threads) 2 From: Donuel Date: 14 Feb 23 - 09:23 AM In the home of the brave, this is the phone message that schools are required to send to students, be they grade schoolers or college students, when a mass shooting is reported. No one is worried about aliens but getting shot in a mass shooting now occurs every day - every day - every day. This is on top of shootings that kill less than 4 at a time. The education that kids are getting is far worse than DUCK AND COVER. REPUBLICANS ARE FAMOUS FOR MAKING SURE THIS WAR GROWS WORSE. This post seemed to be misplaced in the Trump thread - there was a shooting at Michigan State University on Feb. 13, 2023 that it may be in reference to. ---mudelf |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: SPB-Cooperator Date: 15 Feb 23 - 07:26 PM Things aint so bad - only 87 mass shootings in USA over 47 days so far this year. A mere 16-17 times the total number of mass shootings we have had in UK over the last 30 years. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 16 Feb 23 - 06:55 AM Not 87 but it is about 70. It depends on how you define "mass" Republicans boo the mention of reinstating the assault weapon ban.+ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: SPB-Cooperator Date: 16 Feb 23 - 07:45 AM I just googled Mass shooting in USA 2023 and counted the number of incidents on a page that came up. Didn't read into any details. I just wanted to confirm to myself that their has, on average, been more than one mass shooting per day. If the number is 70 rather than 87, it doesn't in anyway diminish the total disregard for human lives over Americans' view that they are entitled to have the means to take away human lives. I am just glad I did not have to grow up there in spite of now having many friends from the folk scene across the pond. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Bill D Date: 16 Feb 23 - 10:56 AM *sigh* posts about "one more" and a regular body count do little to advance the discussion. Remarks like "Americans' view that they are entitled to have the means to take away human lives." are not only non-productive, they are also misleading. SPB and some others seem to think that pointing and shaming will somehow change the dynamics that produce those statistics! If I sound like a broken record over the months... and years... trying to clarify the context as to causality and bureaucratic stumbling blocks involved, so do all you who merely point and complain!!! I repeat, MOST Americans do NOT 'want' guns and gun violence and loose laws, but those who persist in interpreting the 2nd Amendment in a foolish, outmoded way have political backing. I am fortunate to live in a state with enlightened senators and representatives, but it is easy for anyone to go to a different state and bring guns to a shopping mall near me! It borders on the impossible to pass laws that will break this log jam! Until a few more individual states climb out of the dark ages, these events will keep happening...and I suspect that disturbed individuals, (never a shortage!) will keep the statistics high. (Note how many of them shoot themselves after 'expressing their anger.") |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Backwoodsman Date: 16 Feb 23 - 11:31 AM But why are different states allowed to have different gun laws? Why doesn’t your government make one set of laws covering all aspects of gun-ownership, and apply then in every state? Here in the UK, have the equivalent of your states in the form of counties, and each county has jurisdiction over local laws, but our gun laws are made by Parliament, and apply to every citizen wherever in the U.K. they live. And the fact is that it works - check the stats. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Rain Dog Date: 16 Feb 23 - 11:42 AM It is the United States of America. It bears no relation to the UK at all. |