BS: Wordle

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Apr 22 - 05:49 PM

Five. By line 3 I had four greens, but then I had four possible fits for the remaining letter. Bad guessing could have had me failing. So for line 4 I made up a word containing three of the four possibles. I couldn't have used all four because no word in the world contained all of them. By doing this I was guaranteed to not fail and guaranteed to get the answer on line 5. Yeah?

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Raedwulf
Date: 15 Apr 22 - 02:23 PM

Words with three vowels are a good starting point...

Actually, I disagree with this. If you like this as an opening tactic, then start with either ARISE or RAISE. They're the 3 most common vowels; O is less so, U not even in the top 10 letters. But many 5 letter words contain no more than one vowel (BITCH/DITCH/WITCH); some none at all (SLYLY). A better starting strategy is 4 consonants. TREND is good, as is STERN.

On a dictionary sort, (depending on your dictionary; what follows was done on the 1995 Concise OED), the top 10 letters are E, S, I, A, R, N, M, T, O , D; the 10 most common initial letters are P, H, C, B, D, R, M, T, A, F. A textual sort is no good because it's biased by common words like THE, WHERE, etc. Frex, W is the 6th most common initial letter, but only the 22nd most common otherwise. Remember Kipling's "Six honest serving men"!

But also remember! Well, two things actually... First, those frequencies are based on full dictionaries, not dictionaries of 5 letter words. Prefixes & suffixes will affect the order. How many 5 letter words start pre- or anti-? ;-) It's not perfect, but the best guide you're likely to get. When it comes down to it, Wordle runs off a limited subset of 5 letter words; if memory serves its (fixed) list is some 2,500 out of some 13K in total.

Second, when it comes down to it, just like the lottery, any given letter (number) is just as likely to appear in any given random moment. What I mean is this: If the lottery has drawn the 1 ball 5 weeks in a row, it doesn't mean that it won't appear this week. It still has a 1 in 49 (or whatever the probability is) of appearing. If you get S***E on Wordle, SLOPE or SCORE aren't more likely to be the word of the day, but they're more likely to give you a clue than SMOKE if they're not. When you get to SHA*E... There's 7 possible words there. SHARE & SHADE are no more likely than SHAVE or SHAKE!

And also, apart from the US word list (which reduces the frequency of U even further, because ARMOR / FAVOR etc can appear...), I have never seen a plural. BONUS is valid, NOTED was my 1 on Dordle today, but whilst STONE will be in the Wordle list, I don't expect to ever see NOTES...

Hope this is of some help to you hopeless addicts. Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa! ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Raedwulf
Date: 15 Apr 22 - 01:04 PM

I resisted joining in initially, when invited to do so. Now... Wordle, Dordle, Quordle, Octordle (1, 2, 4, 8). Tried Sectordle a couple of times, but found it a waste of time. With 16 words, they more or less solve themselves once you get the first one, so it's just a question of how quickly you get your first word.

On Wordle, I'm up to 70 games now. I play hard mode (must use any known letters) and I don't cheat by recording words that have already been used, so I can't eliminate possible words. The median i.e. most common score seems to be 4 (from 2 attempts, 5, 23, 28, 13, 1 is my current record), my average currently a shade under 3.75. I haven't had a 1 yet, though I had one today on Dordle, having had one previously on Quordle.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Jeri
Date: 14 Apr 22 - 05:48 PM

Five today. Bah!

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 14 Apr 22 - 05:28 PM

Four.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: robomatic
Date: 14 Apr 22 - 05:06 PM

Archive version was shut down yesterday. According to the site creator, per the request of the New York Times.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 13 Apr 22 - 11:21 PM

Wordle 298 4/6

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Apr 22 - 10:26 AM

Five. A duff start and a silly guess.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Apr 22 - 09:25 AM

Three.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Jeri
Date: 11 Apr 22 - 06:25 PM

Three.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Apr 22 - 06:06 PM

Four. It took me a lot longer than usual to unfurrow my puzzled brow.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 11 Apr 22 - 05:15 PM

I was skunked again today. Too many choices in the one letter I had to swap out.

Wordle 296 X/6

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Apr 22 - 09:55 AM

I haven't missed a day since my first go on Feb 1. I have more fours than anything, though the threes are catching up. I have more threes than fives and more twos than sixes and I have yet to fail. That, along with our grandson who's here for the week and a clutch of superb Liverpool matches to watch, means that life is currently not bad at all...

I like to hear about general strategies for doing Wordle but I fiercely resist hints, tips, clues or collaboration of any sort during the daily game. I've been known to get cross...

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: robomatic
Date: 11 Apr 22 - 12:20 AM

Working my way thrrough the Archive. Got to Wordle #102. Many 5s and a few nailbiter 6s.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 17 Mar 22 - 02:14 PM

Five blanks is not great ....

Twice I have had a five blank first guess and finished in three - not by pure luck but because my second guess and the eliminated letters left the answer as the only possible solution.

DC

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 17 Mar 22 - 12:55 PM

Better than yesterday, which was zip in six.

Wordle 271 5/6

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 17 Mar 22 - 11:55 AM

Five blanks is not great, Doug. Four blanks plus an orange eliminates four letters but at least gives you a sort of straw to clutch at. If you're at line three and can't think of any word at all for line four that fits with your permitted letters, you're nearly there. If you can think of loads of words that might fit, you could well be stuffed.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 17 Mar 22 - 11:43 AM

I'm not sure that you can have a 'bad' start. Five blanks means five letters eliminated. If one of those is a 'u' then you have eliminated 'q' as well.

DC

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 17 Mar 22 - 07:28 AM

Four. Bad start but I'm thinking more cannily these days, mainly with the aim of eliminating...

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 17 Mar 22 - 06:36 AM

I have been using the hard setting for the last couple of weeks. Also, I use yesterday's solution as today's starting word to make it more random. It hasn't made a great deal of difference to the stats.

To my mind, the hard setting, which obliges you to use the revealed letters in subsequent guesses, reduces the skill and makes it more a game of chance. If the first guess gave one blank and four greens, such as

_ A T C H

then the possibilities are

B A T C H
C A T C H
H A T C H
L A T C H
M A T C H
P A T C H
W A T C H

It is just random chance at which point you arrive at the solution and it may be that you run out of goes before you get there. The skill comes from recognising this and choosing words which will eliminate as many of the possible letters in the shortest number of guesses, which can't be done on the hard setting.

DC

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: robomatic
Date: 16 Mar 22 - 06:25 PM

Is anyone using the 'hard' setting? I've read that it is supposed to speed up the process but I think it could lead to losing streaks because it would seem to slow down or limit the process of eliminating letters.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 16 Mar 22 - 04:49 PM

Instead, we can use the rest of the letters and go with "myths".

DC

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 16 Mar 22 - 04:45 PM

"thyme", of course, doesn't count because it has an 'e'.

DC

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Stanron
Date: 16 Mar 22 - 04:06 PM

"nymph
thyme
crypt
cysts
hymns
slyly
shyly
dryly
wryly


DC"

impressive DC, as is crwth.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 16 Mar 22 - 02:46 PM

I think stanron (and I) were just trying to keep things simple, ie. AEIOU rather than suggesting other letters may not be used as vowels.

I think my "crwth" is the only one entered here that doesn't use the "y" but even there, the Wiki article I linked to says:

Like several other English loanwords from Welsh, the name is one of the few words in the English language in which the letter W is used as a vowel.

cwm is the only other with the W I'm coming up with at the moment and that's 2 letters short...

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Jeri
Date: 16 Mar 22 - 02:21 PM

"Y" is a vowel over here, but Americans - go figure.
Vowels are "AEIOU, and sometimes Y"

And I probably could've done this in fewer than 5 if I'd stopped to think. "Yeah, that letter is first, and this other letter can't go second, fourth or fifth, so it HAS to go third, and this other letter can't be last or second, and..."
When I started this, I often screwed up because I entered something too quickly, without his critical thinking step.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 16 Mar 22 - 02:13 PM

Oops! Doubled up on "wryly".

DC

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 16 Mar 22 - 01:43 PM

I was trying to find five letter words which had no vowels. I couldn't think of any so I put 'words without vowels into the search engine. I got these;

glyph
gypsy
pygmy
syncs
sylph
tryst
wryly
wynns

Anyone got some others?

nymph
thyme
crypt
cysts
hymns
slyly
shyly
dryly
wryly


DC

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 16 Mar 22 - 12:58 PM

And Dwygyfylchi to you Steve ;-)

Got it in 4 today. I'd got 3 right and 1 wrong on try 1 so it was just guess the missing letter (or perhaps just play a word using a few possible letters) from there today.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Jeri
Date: 16 Mar 22 - 12:51 PM

Got today's in 5. It came down to having figured out where some letters weren't.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 16 Mar 22 - 12:25 PM

"I can't help there Steve. Dydw i ddim yn siarad Cymraeg."

As my mum would have said, Jon, don't be filthy! ;-)

Got it in three today. A couple of lucky greenies in the first word helps a lot.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 16 Mar 22 - 12:05 PM

My short streak has ended with today's word. When you have all of the letters but one, and they add up to a large set of words - oy.

Wordle 270 X/6

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 15 Mar 22 - 10:22 PM

I can't help there Steve. Dydw i ddim yn siarad Cymraeg.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Mar 22 - 09:34 PM

Definitely a vowel in "Stilly."

Dunno how it works in Welsh, Jon. The only Welsh word I know is "rarebit." :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 15 Mar 22 - 09:24 PM

I have always considered Y to be a vowel.

Wordle 269 4/6

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Mar 22 - 09:08 PM

It's incorrect to regard y as not a vowel. In most cases it acts precisely in the same way as a vowel, as it does in every word in Stanron's list (and in myrrh). In fact, it's more often than not a vowel, to all intents and purposes. I remember being told at school 60 years ago that y could be either a vowel or a consonant. For a far more scholarly explanation than mine, check out Merriam-Webster's article on it (I googled "Is y a vowel").

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 15 Mar 22 - 08:44 PM

Just thought of another: myrrh

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 15 Mar 22 - 08:12 PM

crwth

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Stanron
Date: 15 Mar 22 - 07:58 PM

I was trying to find five letter words which had no vowels. I couldn't think of any so I put 'words without vowels into the search engine. I got these;

glyph
gypsy
pygmy
syncs
sylph
tryst
wryly
wynns

Anyone got some others?

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Mar 22 - 06:19 PM

Humph...

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Mar 22 - 06:17 PM

Same here! I got the last 2 in 2 :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Mar 22 - 06:47 AM

I've got it in two twice in a row! There's a lot of luck involved in that first word. Today I got the last two letters in the right places, and the three disallowed ones left me with hardly any choices as to line 2. So I'll not crow!

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 04 Mar 22 - 09:44 PM

Same here. Too many words that use that combination of three middle letters. I don't drink coffee.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Jeri
Date: 04 Mar 22 - 09:15 PM

I'm guessing it wore off hours before I got home, and I should've had another.

BTW, it was four times in a row I got the same three correct letters. Four.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Mar 22 - 08:54 PM

Wrong brand of coffee, Jeri? :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Jeri
Date: 04 Mar 22 - 08:38 PM

I always have one cup of strong coffee. I came back from doing laundry and buying food, then carrying it al into the house, and it was late and my patience level was mostly nil. It got to the point where I tried three different words with the same three correct-and-in-the-right-place letters, and put in an obviously wrong word, because I just wanted to SEE THE DAMNED ANSWER! (ahem) I don't know if I would have figured it out, anyway.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Mar 22 - 06:55 PM

I have yet to fail. You two are not doing it right. If, by line three, things are going badly, tell everyone around you to piss off and leave you alone, have at least one very strong coffee if not two, get your head down and FOCUS! You can do it... You know you can...

You'll lose friends, but hey ho...

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 04 Mar 22 - 05:29 PM

I didn't get today's word either. I'm slapping my forehead that I didn't, but no luck.

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Jeri
Date: 04 Mar 22 - 04:44 PM

I did not find it today. :-(

Subject: RE: BS: Wordle
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Mar 22 - 12:32 PM

Did it in three today, despite the fact that I was simultaneously showing an old lady at our Memory Café how to do it. She was most impressed. It could have gone completely the other way!