BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 18 Jan 23 - 12:17 PM

"Yeah, seven-figure tax-dodging by all accounts."

It's not unreasonable to argue your case with HMRC, who are at best draconian, and do not always interpret tax legislation correctly. Good for him, he lost and has to pay, no big deal.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Jan 23 - 01:40 PM

He knew he owed tax and lots of it. He tried to get away with it. He's a cabinet minister. We should hold these people to the highest standards of honesty and integrity. He fails the test, clearly not in your eyes, but objectively....

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 18 Jan 23 - 02:03 PM

The tax legislation provides the right to appeal an assessment, up to the House Of Lords if necessary.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 18 Jan 23 - 02:23 PM

Your arse must be very sore indeed, Bonzo.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Jan 23 - 04:45 PM

He tried to cheat, Bonzo.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 18 Jan 23 - 04:58 PM

Prove it, show me a copy of his tax return. You know nothing until you have seen that, which you would not understand anyway.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Jan 23 - 05:03 PM

You are defending the indefensible. Just because he's a Tory boy. Where are your principles!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 18 Jan 23 - 05:54 PM

Principles are irrelevant, it's tax legislation and the right to appeal.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Jan 23 - 06:21 PM

He's a cheat, pal! It's all over the news!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 19 Jan 23 - 05:04 AM

Principle are totally relevant which is why tax law needs to be updated so that the needs of society are put before the greed of the wealthy. I would go further and give the institutes the duty and power to revoke the right to practice of accountants who are paid proactively identify loopholes and legal avoidance methods that fall outside the spirit of tax law on the basis of what an ordinary person would consider reasonable to apply. I would go further, and make accountants personally liable for the taxes they help their clients avoid which society as a whole would benefit from.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Rain Dog
Date: 20 Jan 23 - 01:26 PM

Interesting article by Dan Neidle about Nadhim Zahawi. Well worth a read.

It is from Neidle's website Tax Policy Associates.


Nadhim Zahawi – the whole story

Of course it should probably be titled 'the whole story so far'.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 20 Jan 23 - 01:27 PM

Capital gains are wiped out upon death since your estate will have to pay inheritance tax. So incurring CGT by selling assets later in life could effectively mean paying tax on the same asset twice - don't do it!!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 20 Jan 23 - 08:43 PM

So dishy fishy Sunak has been fined for the second time in a year for breaking the law.

"Lancashire constabulary said on Friday: 'You will be aware that a video has been circulating on social media showing an individual failing to wear a seatbelt while a passenger in a moving car in Lancashire.

'After looking into this matter, we have today issued a 42-year-old man from London with a conditional offer of fixed penalty.'"

I mean, he illegally unhitched his seatbelt in order to make a video of himself which was intended for Instagram. What sort of an idiot would do that! An idiot that's running the country...?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Senoufou
Date: 21 Jan 23 - 03:09 AM

The Tory politicians seem to have a sense of superiority and arrogance, which gives them the idea that they're 'above the Law', unlike us lower beings. I shan't vote for them again, honest!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 21 Jan 23 - 04:23 AM

Settlements with HMRC in cases of failed, but lawful, avoidance arrangements invariably include penalties & interest. If it was not "all above board" ( ie dishonest ) he would have been prosecuted.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 21 Jan 23 - 06:14 PM

You're valiant, Bonzo, I'll give you that.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 22 Jan 23 - 03:34 AM

Valiant? Nah, he just enjoys taking it up the arse from the multi-millionaire Posh-Boys.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 22 Jan 23 - 05:25 AM

Only arseholes believe what they read in the guardian rag.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: peteglasgow
Date: 22 Jan 23 - 12:25 PM

i know quite a few people who read the guardian - me included. what exactly is your complaint about us? are you just jealous because you can't understand the long paragraphs or is your problem more philosophical. i've been reading it for nearly 50 years and never read the articles about money/finances - i'm more concerned with broader stuff like politics, ideas, arts and football and so on.....so fundamentally different eh?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 22 Jan 23 - 12:46 PM

Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, it's inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 22 Jan 23 - 12:51 PM

In that case, the last thirteen years have proven that the Tories are rock-solid socialists. :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 22 Jan 23 - 01:05 PM

What bonzo fails to do, yet again, is credit the source of his quote. He cannot even think of original insults on his own but has to rely on the fatuous wit of Winston Churchill. It is probably the years of accounting that has dulled his brain. Glad I got out if it before it was too late!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 22 Jan 23 - 01:28 PM

Bonzo proving yet again that he is brainwashed by the propaganda of the Party of the Selfish and Greedy. And of the dishonest, judging by the recent examples of some of its leading members - Johnson, Zahawi, yadda yadda.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 22 Jan 23 - 01:28 PM

I told you before, I do not credit source, better things to do with my time.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 22 Jan 23 - 01:35 PM

Then don't be surprised if posts are deleted, Bonzo.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 22 Jan 23 - 01:44 PM

Nah, just leave them up for all to see what a dishonest person he is, Stilly. He is just mimicking the bunch of crooks, thieves and liars that he seems to idolise. What both he and his role models fail to realise is that most people can see through the deception and that their dishonesty will be there forever

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: peteglasgow
Date: 22 Jan 23 - 02:29 PM

you never get any idea of what bonzo feels or cares about (the greyhound maybe?) it's just insults, spam numbers and tory worship. now and again i sort of feel the need to enquire - maybe it's the tree hugging, lefty social worker in me - but, like a tiresome client, i don't really care - just wish he and his tory idols would just leave us alone.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Rain Dog
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 04:07 AM

"I told you before, I do not credit source, better things to do with my time."

Is that wbat you advise your clients to do Bonzo?

The vast majority of Bonzo's posts, especially on this thread, are sent in order to try and wind people up. It is surprising that, even after all this time, it seems to work.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 04:18 AM

Well the story in the guardian rag [sic] seems to be true. He did avoid tax and he did pay a substantial penalty, and we're talking about £5 million ballpark. I notice this morning that "penalty" is being used as a euphemism for "fine" (not read in the Guardian either!)

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Rain Dog
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 04:41 AM

More from Dan Neidle here.

What the Zahawi statement tells us, and what we still don’t know

I think Zahawi might be gone by Wednesday.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 06:11 AM

Either that or he will be prime minister. This lot seem to love cheats and liars.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 06:48 AM

The alleged 30% penalty is high and it suggests that he's been a very naughty boy indeed. I agree with Rain Dog. He'll be gone by Wednesday, as PMQ will be like shooting fish in a barrel otherwise.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: DMcG
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 07:03 AM

Now that Sunak has asked the ethics advisor to investigate, it is very hard to see how they could sell an 'all is fine, nothing to see' story. Yes, I know innocent until proven guilty, but that is law, not politics, and if Zahawi stays, Sunak will pick up lots of charges of "whitewashing" and cries of "Where's this 'integrity, then?'" and much more.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Rain Dog
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 08:32 AM

From the BBC

"A few additional comments from Downing Street now, as the prime minister's official spokesman has been taking questions from reporters.

"Additional facts" over the weekend have led to the ethics investigation into Nadhim Zahawi's tax affairs

Rishi Sunak is previously not understood to have known that Zahawi had paid a penalty to HMRC

The investigation will be completed "as quickly as possible"

Sir Laurie Magnus, who will lead the investigation, will focus on ministerial declarations and whether these breached the ministerial code

But, it could extend to whether Zahawi's tax arrangements were appropriate"

++

So it would seem that either Zahawi:

Did not not fully inform Sunak of all the facts

Or

Sunak is already trying to distance himself from this latest mess.

The Tories could do with a better PR department or just getting their members to be more honest with each other. It might be quite a while before we can expect all of them to be honest with the general public.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 08:33 AM

What I'm waiting for (or did I miss it?) is for Zahawi to receive the curse of "the full and complete support of the Prime Minister". That used to be Parliamentary code for "the pearl-handled revolver is on its way, so do the Right* Thing"; the offender would then resign within the week. So: who's got custody of the pearl-handled revolver?

* I would have said "Honourable", but with this shower? *akkh* *phht*.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 10:06 AM

Yeah, you've missed it! :-) So Fishi is pretending he didn't know about the penalty?   That's a laugh is that. He should step down due either to lying to us or for gross incompetence.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 11:05 AM

Now another story of Tory snouts deep in the trough - seemingly our then PM, Boris ‘Father I cannot tell the truth’ Johnson put Richard Sharp’s name forward to become head of the BBC after Sharp had helped set up an £800k personal loan for Johnson.

Greedy, selfish Tory pigs, snouts in the trough once again. And still, the brainwashed, hard-of-thinking fools try to justify supporting them.

https://www.indy100.com/politics/boris-johnson-bbc-chairman-loan

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 11:31 AM

While watching Beeb coverage of Urgent Questions in the House, re Zahawi's little embarrassment, de Pfeffel vs the head of the Beeb ect ect ect ....

Herself: I don't see why they're having Urgent Questions --- they're not answering them.

Me: It puts it on the record that they're not answering them.

.... taking five minutes to say nothing is a skill; this lot doing so under heavy fire is an artform that's so high that it puts a cesspit to shame.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 11:53 AM

And yet another, in todays Guardian:

Conservative health minister has big stake in Covid testing firm

Exclusive: Nick Markham, who co- founded Cignpost Investments during the pandemic, was given a peerage by Liz Truss

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 11:54 AM

Yes I know there was supposed to be an apostrophe...

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 04:11 PM

"The alleged 30% penalty is high"

No it's not. He was trying to use the tax laws in a particular way to "avoid" tax, which in itself is not illegal. HMRC did not agree with him, and he let their decision stand.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 05:11 PM

Between 0 and 30% is the penalty for lack of reasonable care so, yes 30% is high. It is the maximum.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 05:13 PM

Somebody who earns enough to be liable for £5 million in tax shouldn’t have any need to dodge paying that tax - they are already immensely wealthy, without dodging paying their taxes.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 05:15 PM

But hey, Tory pigs, snouts, troughs. And supported and enabled by fools who are, by comparison, as poor as church mice.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 05:19 PM

And wasn’t Zahawi the guy who claimed the cost of heating his horses’ stables on his Parliamentary expenses account?

Words like ‘greedy’, ‘grabbing’, and ‘fucker’ spring to mind.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 05:52 PM

So Fishi didn't know "until last weekend" that Zahawi had paid a massive penalty while he was Chancellor. That is simply bollix. Are they really trying to tell us that the Civil Service failed to vet the man who was taking on the highest financial office in the land? Unbelievable. No, worse than that, a downright lie. Of course he bloody knew. That would be like a primary school headteacher hiring Jimmy Savile then claiming that they "didn't know" about his depredations.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 06:24 PM

So speak lefty triddlebuts!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 23 Jan 23 - 08:10 PM

There's nowt leftie about wanting some straightforward behaviour from the people who are supposed to be running our country. Although a bit of graft and corruption here and there, a touch of the Old Pals Act and the notion that the law is for others do seem to be rather right-wing sentiments. Perhaps that's what you mean.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 24 Jan 23 - 01:30 AM

Well Steve, our brainwashed, Daily Mail-reader, Tory shill can say whatever he likes about the Lefties, but at least we have the comfort of knowing that, unlike him, we weren’t so gullible as to vote like turkeys for Christmas. He voted for a bunch of greedy, selfish robber-barons, and that’s exactly what he got.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit & other UK political topics - 2
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 24 Jan 23 - 02:08 AM

Excellent!!!