BS: KISS keep it simple

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 27 Feb 23 - 12:36 PM

Small bits makes for better digestion.

The evil of a Trump or Hitler is from envy and a wish to bring others down to their level.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 27 Feb 23 - 12:24 PM

Do you ever wonder why you can do 13 posts in a row with just one little interruption? I doubt whether you'd want to hear my theory...

Subject: RE: BS: Evil, keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 27 Feb 23 - 12:07 PM

Bill D often points out the evil people can do based upon specious logic.
Even Hitler or Putin have done evil based on what they saw as beneficial to their own constituents or themselves.
But there is the more common everyday evil by average people based upon ignorance. In this sense I suppose the concept of we are all sinners is true. Original sin however is nonsense.
I believe it is an unintentional evil when people actually do not know or know the wrong things. These people are capable of redemption.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 27 Feb 23 - 11:25 AM

Ergo I can not differentiate names on a site like this easily.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 27 Feb 23 - 11:01 AM

I have given myself permission to dream about a subject and have experienced that subject in my dreams. Emergent knowledge of the complex comes in many forms. Part of that process is realizing the many things we can not know. For people who can not think in mental imagery must rely on language alone which seems like more of an imitation of reality than the mental picture of the subject. Of course the language alone person would see this differently. I often can see a clear picture of a person's face long before I can recall the name of that person. This would not be the experience of the language only person.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 27 Feb 23 - 10:30 AM

Narcissism is not arrogance, it is the complete opposite of arrogance.
There is so much a feeling of incompetence and inadequacy in the self that the defensive structure around that becomes dominated by a rocket-fueled envy.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 26 Feb 23 - 10:50 AM

So you can choose what to dream about? Hmm...

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Feb 23 - 09:52 AM

advice- Don't be afraid of the space between your dreams and reality.
If you can dream it - there is a better chance it can be done.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 23 Feb 23 - 03:58 PM

Our models for the early universe are wrong according to JWT.
The Universe lit up much earlier than we thought.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Feb 23 - 09:10 AM

it seems others consider this postualtion

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Feb 23 - 09:01 AM

https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg12517084-200-the-power-of-negative-matter/

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Feb 23 - 08:56 AM

This morning while pondering dark energy accelerating the expansion of the universe I wondered if in the immense quantity of space, virtual particles that pop into existence could play a role if half of those particles are negative matter particles. Negative matter would repel matter.
Virtual particles are short-lived but at any given moment in the entire expansion of space, there would have to be an increasing amount that would exist.

All we have to do is detect negative matter virtual or otherwise :)

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 20 Feb 23 - 05:56 AM

https://www.livescience.com/jwst-early-universe-discoveries



The Webb telescope is looking at the early universe.
It looks similar to now except for green peas.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Feb 23 - 09:00 PM

Soggy Bottom Boys

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Feb 23 - 08:52 PM

We have many low lieing areas. In DC we have Foggy Bottom.
Not to be confused with Mississippi's Soggy Bottom Boys.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 16 Feb 23 - 01:28 PM

With apologies for crossing the threads ....

> I recommend chicken life vests and galoshes for lying areas.

Do you mean "low lying areas" or Mar-a-Lago :-) ?

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 16 Feb 23 - 08:26 AM

Our chickens LIVE IN THE HOME OF THE BRAVE and have survived mass incarceration, fentanyl, Covid, mass shootings, insurrection, white national racism, and TRUMPISM. They wouldn't be caught dead in the UK which is a very silly island. We even protect them from UFOs and shoot down any galactic immigrants that dare incursion into the land of the American chicken. OUR BRAVE CHICKENS RULE.

Our chickens are not even afraid of a ten-foot sea rise from a glacial ice shelf that is about to break off of Antarctica and melt.
I recommend chicken life vests and galoshes for lying areas.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Feb 23 - 01:39 PM

Clearly not breed injured animals. Just fix 'em!

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Feb 23 - 12:31 PM

I will never go to a zoo. I understand that we may need to breed captive animals that are threatened, injured or on the brink of extinction, but animals on display for entertainment, not for me, thanks. Even my cat is free-range.

Cage eggs are becoming a thing of the past on the whole, though a third of our eggs still come from hens in "enriched cages," which are bigger (but still awful) than the pre-2012 battery cages, now banned. Barn eggs are common still, and from what I've seen around here "free-range" is a concept that needs a serious rethink. I know one place that has huge barns with pop-holes and I never see the hens in their outside enclosure. Their eggs are still sold as free-range. In farming, the concept of "what the eye doesn't see" is heavily guarded.

Tell us about your US chickens. We don't want them here...

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Feb 23 - 11:58 AM

199 posts and I am still none the wiser. Someone else can have 200 :-)

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 15 Feb 23 - 09:45 AM

Simply animal rights law beyond anti-cruelty statutes.

I'm perfectly capable of discussing it myself. An intro;
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2022/06/happy-the-elephant-lessons-for-the-future-of-animal-rights-law.html



Cage free eggs and an end to veal cruelty is also catching on.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Feb 23 - 09:04 AM

Your repetitive mentions of animal rights lack focus. We have fairly strict laws in this country about who can or can't do what to wild animals. There are rules regarding animal welfare standards in agriculture which some of us would like to see tightened and which, as with humans, are often breached. But we can't discuss it unless we know what you're talking about, and you did raise it out of context and out of the blue. Instead of calling people clowns for not responding to your apparent sudden bee-in-bonnet, why not tell us what you're on about and give us something to chew over?

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 15 Feb 23 - 08:33 AM

The issue of animal rights remains, despite the class clown trolls.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 14 Feb 23 - 12:23 PM

"Run for office with a 'no-shit' campaign."

Hmm. Something you'd never manage...

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 14 Feb 23 - 12:04 PM

Well, as we keep saying, Steve. You have your Donuel and I have my Dick.

:D

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Feb 23 - 09:26 AM

Run for office with a 'no-shit' campaign.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 14 Feb 23 - 05:21 AM

Careful now, Dick! :-)

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: The Sandman
Date: 14 Feb 23 - 05:12 AM

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw - PM
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 08:44 PM

I support fairies in the bottom of the garden because they're prettier than goblins and leprechauns. quote S Shaw
I prefer Gnomes.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 14 Feb 23 - 04:47 AM

See varmints thread. I love dogs but I strongly dislike a lot of their owners, which, round here, is most of them. They let them bark, they let them shit all over our streets and they let them charge around out of control. Nowt wrong with the actual individual dog. You misrepresent yourself here all the the time but kindly refrain from misrepresenting me.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 09:24 PM

History supports the idea that some radical ideas become mainstream in 100 years. For example; should Women be allowed to vote?
Should animals be considered co-creators of life on Earth and have legal rights?
If corporations now have the legal rights of a person why not whales, dolphins, primates and others?
US laws ban cruelty but does not convey rights to animals. We know how Steve feels about dogs but we wouldn't want him involved in this question if we love dogs, or any conscious life for that matter.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 08:44 PM

I support fairies in the bottom of the garden because they're prettier than goblins and leprechauns.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 08:29 PM

Another reason that I support panpsychism is that it supports legal rights for intelligent animals.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 06:15 PM

By way of a small diversion: the Super Bowl comment had me wondering which sport it was. Is it, I mused, that glorified rounders-for-chaps, or perhaps that version of netball for seven-footers? Why no, it's American "football," a game in which padded men beat each other up at regular intervals after someone has thrown the ball along lines of them, with scantily-dressed young beauties leaping up and down on the touchline with bunches of tinsel in their hands. As a chap who has just revelled in Liverpool's convincing (and much-needed) victory over Everton in the Merseyside derby, why would I have concerned myself with your Super Bowl prediction!

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 03:56 PM

"I think Steve protests too much"

In light of your post, that strikes me as being not only ludicrously ironic but also highly amusing.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 12:44 PM

I concede that similar reports are very similar but do not explain the phenomenon. It is common for me to make predictions. I recently got my super bowl prediction wrong but I'm sure no one cares except Steve.
He thinks my predictions are prophesying and rails against them as vigorously as against a 19th-century medium contacting someone's dear deceased relative for money. No one cares about my posts, nor do people's reality revolve around my opinion.

I think Steve protests too much as if belief in any of my remarks is antithetical to scientific principles he guards like a self-appointed white knight. Nevermind the symptoms of the narcissist.

I believe the most favorite topic for him would be the "I believe in Steve" thread.

I also believe that his intention is degradation in my opinion.
Its a sadism thing.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 11:52 AM

Yes, I spotted that "know for sure" too. On such a basis is dodgy science often predicated...

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Rain Dog
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 10:47 AM

"I only know for sure that others have had similar experiences."

You only know for sure that others have reported to have had similar experiences. They might have been similar to yours but then again they might not.

Back when Chladni was gathering experiences, he did not live in an age when people were posting this, that and the other. The witness was less likely to be influenced by previous reports. If anyone sees anything unusual these days they might well search online for previous reports of something similar.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 10:43 AM

Rhetorical trick my fat bottom. It's just that you didn't get what I said!

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 10:41 AM

I have no intention of injuring anyone. What a daft thing to say.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 10:41 AM

Here is another rhetorical trick Steve does to me;
" For over 99% of human existence, the sun went round the earth and the earth was flat."
quote: From: Steve Shaw - PM
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 09:46 AM

It is not a misquote, it is merely taken out of context.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 10:25 AM

I still do not have an explanation for the nebulous balls of light that passed through brick walls and out the interior wall. I only know for sure that others have had similar experiences. When I touched it I would have expected a shock if it was ball lightning. In the spirit of objectivity, I had jumped on a sofa and was not grounded.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 09:50 AM

I do not use Steve's snarky rhetoric that is intended to injure people and possible POVs. Raindog presents alternatives and facts in a reasonable and respectful manner. That's what I have been talking about.

Like my friend Allen J Hynek, I began as a skeptic but as decades of indirect evidence mounted I changed my tune, My experience has led me to far different honest conclusions.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 09:46 AM

You failed to take into account my HONESTLY-corroborated caveat. Piltdown Man was dishonestly corroborated. Lourdes and Fatima were "corroborated" by witnesses loaded down by confirmation bias, peer pressure or whatever else made them useless witnesses. There are no golden eagles in Cornwall or anywhere near, but suppose I claim that a golden eagle came to my bird table. Like Donuel, I could shout abuse at anyone who ridiculed me. Or I could present the real evidence, which would mean HONEST corroboration. A couple of proven unphotoshopped pics. Co-witnesses from the highest echelons of the RSPB. Related sightings close by. Sure, science needs lateral thinking, thinking outside the box, flights of imagination. It all helps to move science forward. But only evidence can put it on the right path. For over 99% of human existence, the sun went round the earth and the earth was flat. Newton indulged in alchemy. I've posted here several times about my sighting of ball lightning in Essex in the early 80s. I know what I saw and I know it was what I said it was. I couldn't find a single other witness. I don't require anyone else to believe me and I say that every time. The fact that I do say that has meant that I've never been called a bad scientist, been laughed at or been ridiculed for saying it. I think there's a lesson there.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 09:17 AM

There are some knowns. One was cylindrical, one was octagonal and Canada has not disclosed the shape of one that was shot down over the Yukon. A fourth radar signature vanished from radar over Minnesota.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Rain Dog
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 09:14 AM

"Witness is never evidence unless it's honestly corroborated"

In the history of science witness tends to lead and science follows with a explanation (or not as the case might be).

Sometimes science can dismiss witness evidence as being nonsense. Just ask Ernst Chladni.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Rain Dog
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 08:45 AM

"This week it has been reported that three UNIDENTIFIED objects have been shot down."

At the moment they unidentified. They might well remain so as it will be hard to locate any remaining wreckage.

My money is on it being a Thunderbird.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 08:38 AM

There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know.

(Donuel Rumsfeld)

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 08:35 AM

That's got nothing to do with what we're talking about (why am I surprised...), and, what's more, the balloons have their own thread.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 08:19 AM

This week it has been reported that three UNIDENTIFIED objects have been shot down. That is the extent of it. This is a departure from the previous policy. With a lack of evidence. ignoring the known realities would be a foolish plan. The eyes-closed method, insistence on silence, or the shaming of witnesses is the absurd policy of the past.
Let's hope we/you learn to do better.

Subject: RE: BS: KISS keep it simple
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Feb 23 - 05:50 AM

"In the debunking community there is a tendency to stigmatize a subject of inquiry and the researchers and witnesses or even attempt to harm or destroy those individuals. For example despite hundreds of thousands of witnesses and indirect evidence, the people involved are singled out for derision."

Well apart from the unwarranted hyperbole there, it's ironic that you debunk the debunkers far more assertively than the debunkers debunk you and your ilk. Good science shrugs its shoulders when presented with flights of imagination that are promoted without a shred of evidence. There's generally no attempt to harm or destroy unless there's a whiff of conspiracy theory afoot, so it's improper to cast yourself as some kind of victim. If you have an outside-of-the-box notion, it's up to you to kindle interest via the very simple step of presenting evidence that IS evidence. Witness is never evidence unless it's honestly corroborated, and I have no idea what "indirect evidence" is supposed to mean. You forget that good science is science that can be well-communicated. I dare say there are some good scientists who live in their own bubble of obscurantism, and they need help to get their ideas out. But there are bad scientists who like to wrap their shaky ideas up in deliberate and dodgy over-complexity and mysticism. If the cap fits, old chap...