DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 11 Dec 24 - 12:07 PM

You know what's funny - I saw that email and (without an intro from you) thought some eBay scammer was trying to pull a fast one on me! I put it together when I saw the Mudcat PM and opened the email again in my Thunderbird account and tracked it back on eBay. That is a scam. Act fast to get a refund from eBay, this is a dodgy new account from China. Don't ship it back, there is no point, unless eBay insists and they pay to refund that shipping.

There is a woman named Marsha Collier who got started in online sales on eBay and has written about it extensively. I learned a lot about selling and buying on eBay from her PBS lecture years ago, and since then have picked up a book or video for more.

On eBay you have to look at the seller for duration and history before buying anything. (Even with my puny sales, my feedback score is 100% with 437 sales over 19 years. The history and durability of an account speaks for itself.)

I've been researching the shrubs offered from the woman I met a few weeks ago via Freecycle. Figuring out where I'd put them, and how big they might grow to. I'll call today and arrange to go get at least one or two, and plan a return trip soon if those transplants work out.

Still working on reseasoning that pan. I could kick myself for letting it get damaged that way.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: pattyClink
Date: 11 Dec 24 - 10:19 AM

I've got a problem with a slimy Ebay seller showing photos of one thing and sending me a different model. I'm going to PM you with the details and get your advice on whether to appeal to Ebay itself, if you don't mind.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Charmion's brother Andrew
Date: 11 Dec 24 - 09:18 AM

Stilly, it's only two weeks since the surgery, and the physio course began last Friday with a post-op assessment, but, yes, we understand that the patient will complete the majority of the physio outside the clinic.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Dorothy Parshall
Date: 10 Dec 24 - 09:13 PM

Dupont:

SRS: these are not "kids"; There is not a snowball's chance they will want to come back here after they are in the heart of Montreal being tourists! Just for a few hours visit?? It is really my frustration about what constitutes clean - to them - and how I can do it - with help. Honestly - five extra adults are a bit daunting. The most or best I can hope for is opportunities to learn about who they are when I have not seen them in so many years.

No matter how clean I think it is, it will never be clean enough. I will try to talk to Taun about it. He is an engineer; it is very hard to get communication that is clear to me. He did not even tell me when they are actually arriving until today - just "the week of the 15th" --but they will not be here until the 19th - the house might need vacuuming again by then! Not for us - it has not been done since he was here in ---the last time (a few weeks ago?) - but it doesn't bother me. ...............

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 10 Dec 24 - 07:06 PM

Dorothy, when they arrive have the house looking the best you can and invite them to move over to the house from the B&B if they wish. More days until the visit gives you more time to work on other parts of the house. With the help of Robin and Mylene - don't hurt yourself. Maybe the grandkids would want to stay with you and their parents go back and forth to the B&B. I know how you feel, it's like pulling teeth to get the kids here to visit. I'm going to have to get over my reluctance to fly (after COVID) and make a trip to the Pacific NW and see how it goes.

Getting ready to decorate. When looking in a built-in cabinet this evening to put away some things from the mantle I realized I have a lot of glass cake stands. Back in the late 1990s and early 2000s they were all the rage (Martha Stewart Living deployed them everywhere). Most are clear, one is a pretty green, one is silver plate. I also have two from my family (on three low legs, not on a center stand) that are what is popular now - Vaseline or uranium glass. Mine are that same pattern. I'll be checking with the kids to see if they want any before making a move to sell or even give these away. Or find ways to use them. I had one cake stand on the table for Thanksgiving to hold the basket of dinner rolls above the fray. If I use them then they can stay. Normally I'd list them on eBay, but my eBay listings have ground to a standstill. I'm going to have to research other items like mine and see how they're selling. This is unusual.

I weighed myself this morning - 150. My goal weight is in the 148-153 range, so I'm there. I think the low-carb eating is the reason, I haven't working on dieting. I'll have to figure out how to get enough calories via slow-carb foods to keep my weight here. As my friend in New York has reminded me, a NY socialite had a famous quote about losing weight when you're older - "which do you want to look good, your face or your ass?" Keep a few extra pounds on if you want a less-gaunt face. A friend of mine (seven years older) lost a lot of weight and the last time we visited her face was really gaunt. I think I prefer to keep a few pounds on. This morning when I put on a new-to-me pair of size 10 jeans I had to get out a belt for them. I'm there.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Dorothy Parshall
Date: 10 Dec 24 - 03:43 PM

Dupont:

Lower than a snake's belly. Apparently only a total reno will suit my family. They are staying at Bnbs and will visit me. I actually don't know what I can possibly do - short of reno and replacement of all the old, well-used, and useful, K stuff... I did not raise my sons to be like this - someone else did and they are well indoctrinated. I guess 30 years with a wife who was a total slob ... This is totally irrational. Taun is trying to be nice about it but I am angry, hurt, disgusted...

And they are not coming until next Thurs which means I shall have to ... I don't even know. A week and it will need cleaning again. OK: text Mylene to see if she can come next Tues. Maybe I'll crawl into a hole for a while first. Start a fire in the wood stove!

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 10 Dec 24 - 12:39 PM

Patty, I found an online paper written about geologic research in this region that describes the "Chicxulub impact spherule ejecta layer." It could be they landed, became part of the sandstone, then that sandstone was eroded by the river and these spherules ended up in mud. (The Paluxy runs into the Brazos. I think it's safe to assume that this stuff splashed down widely over the region.) Good luck with the bed assembly and I hope one of those mops work for you. If I can't have my favorite mop it's good if someone else can locate their favorite style.

Andrew, I hope it's the kind of knee surgery where the patient can do their own exercises at home if the weather is too bad. My first knee replacement surgery recovery was interrupted by the arrival of COVID and my PT visits cut short, so I exercised at home. I didn't, however, give myself painful massages around the affected area, something I didn't miss.

Mrrzy, good luck with the scramble! I just got a text from a friend saying she can stop by. My first thought "OMG the house is a mess!" But then I reflect: I take care of her cats when she's out of town and on some of those occasions her house has the same evidence of a million projects in boxes on the floor and laid out on all flat surfaces. I do have more dust and the dog hair is more abundant.

Some shopping completed. A few years ago I sent a gift to an old friend who regularly walks over to his neighborhood bar in New York City for a Scotch or two. I tried sending him a nice single malt, not too peaty or smoky, but still, a single malt. He said it was too intense and I think his cousin took it home on his next visit. So now I send a bottle of Famous Grouse and he loves it. That box must be put in the mail soon.

So much to do around here. Dust the mantle then put up the garlands and nutcrackers. Sweep. Put the heartworm medication on the dogs (I missed it last week, they get it once a month.) Meanwhile, this morning the house smells like bacon because I'm cooking a couple of slices at a time then carefully just rinsing the 8" cast iron skillet and cooking more later. I made the mistake of leaving it in the sink and it got soapy and wrecked some of the seasoned surface.

The lights in the yard look good, better than most years.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Dorothy Parshall
Date: 10 Dec 24 - 12:30 PM

Dupont:
fascinating assortment of mops. Mine is the white with green stripes - works a charm on wood floors -most of ours! I need Mylene for the vacuum cleaning which my shoulders and safety - on the carpeted stairs - are a concern. However, she did not get here at expected time and I was missing my "grief group" so I texted her and she will come tomorrow. Today I shall try to finish that window; even with the storm sash closed, the cold is amazing! I cannot budge the actual window so must get it as clean as possible before R comes home - so it can be closed regardless! He has been gone since Saturday morning. The bridge -ICE! Still no snow tires as of last eve. Still looking for them!

Yesterday was strange - I realized I was feeling sad at not getting to the group --- ME?? a group of women - a gaggle of geese! I got there for most of it. An epiphany of sorts!

Mylene is coming at 9 am Thurs!! I have made great inroads into clearing lots of stuff - ignoring repairs! And realize I can store stuff in the pottery room!!! A store room is a wonderful thing to have! OK, so I am a bit dense at times! I will ask her to make the house as clean as possible.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: pattyClink
Date: 10 Dec 24 - 10:43 AM

Good luck on the expedition today, Charmion and Andrew.

Mrrzy, I feel your pain, chaos everywhere here. But your room can be tamed, working in small steps or a couple big blitzes, whatever works for you.

SRS, I forgot we had a research librarian in our midst. Thank you for taking the time to find links on mops, big help!

I kept my nose to the saw yesterday and managed to get one of the three slat frames put together, despite one mishap and lots of mis-steps. Thanking myself for traveling with a handsaw and hacksaw, both were needed since the miter saw has its limits.

I must have missed any post you made about the meteorite bits, that's very cool. Had no idea you had chunks of the Chixulub meteor!   

I only have one tiny slice of a meteorite I got from an old Russian in Tucson. It has Widmanstätten patterns, but is one that is prone to rust, so I have to keep it oiled up. Which makes it darn hard to mount!

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Charmion's brother Andrew
Date: 10 Dec 24 - 09:50 AM

Meanwhile, in my corner of the forest, we have Eastern Ontario's dreaded freezing rain-drizzle-snow combination to deal with as we try and get the knee surgery patient to physiotherapy. We have a problem getting footwear on, but we have discovered that crampons can be put on Sketchers clogs. We'll run a field trial later this morning.

Watch this space. ;)

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Charmion
Date: 10 Dec 24 - 08:59 AM

Three file boxes full of Messiah scores are stacked beside the chair where I sit to put on my boots. Today’s fun challenge will be returning them to the choir library, which entails two flights of stairs and several locked doors.

A file box of “Messiah” scores is brutally heavy, so I drafted Brad the Bass to help. I’m learning.

We’re heading into our third day of thaw temperatures and occasional bouts of rain. By Thursday we’ll be at -10°C. Phooey.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Mrrzy
Date: 09 Dec 24 - 08:26 PM

Argh! Deadloine looming! Am hosting a solstice party so I better get that room cleaned out!

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 09 Dec 24 - 06:57 PM

Patty, I have a friend who buys micro sliced mounts of pieces of meteorites that originated in various parts of the solar system or galaxy. It doesn't take a lot of space but is quite fascinating to look at them through a magnifying glass. I have a wad of the pellets that landed in what is now the Paluxy River area and were held together by weak sandstone or mudstone (and all crumbled apart in the bag I keep them in); they are part of the KT boundary. I offered them but since they are the blowback from the big meteor they aren't the same as his collection and he wasn't interested. Now that I think about it, I may have asked this before and said something similar in a past year's thread.

Wrapping white lights around the pine trunk this afternoon; the strings in the tree already have polarized plugs but today's LED strings don't, so when I realized I couldn't plug the polarized into the LEDs I had to turn around the new strings so I could plug them into the C6 string. I also replaced the fuses in the C6 ones and they work again. Until the next rain? They should turn on soon (they're all plugged into a multi-timer adapter using the dusk-to-dawn setting.)

Errands run today, including buying a couple of gifts. This evening working on the holiday letter some more and decorating the mantle.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 09 Dec 24 - 12:57 PM

Patty - eBay to the rescue. This is the mop pad results I found, and there is another brand name also (Aquashine). To get the mop it looks like a separate search. I see O-Cedar at Home Depot. Amazon has one also. Here's the Google search on the mops themselves. They look very practical. My favorite mop had a heavy sponge head that would fold in half to wring it out but they finally stopped making the refills, any left in existence go for astronomical prices on eBay. Those were more for scrubbing than just a damp mop.

Today is bright and clear so I'll step out and see why one of those strings of lights stopped lighting. It's not something to do in the rain. I've figured another way to use a few more of the extra strings in there also - they've been around for a few years and not put to use. I don't remember what I might have had in mind.

Last night I stayed up finishing that puzzle and seem to have lost one piece in the long months it was out on the table. But it is over and back in the box. I always mark on the box and guide where the missing piece is, and it will go to the donation bin. The new puzzle is the antidote to the last one, called Readers Paradise (they don't include an apostrophe but I'll guess with the antique cash register it is a public place so it is readers' plural. :)

Errands to do today. Starting the week with the dishes washed, the laundry done, and the trash out at the curb. I have a couple of decisions to make regarding volunteer projects.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: pattyClink
Date: 09 Dec 24 - 11:05 AM

The regenerating cobwebs sound like quite a trial. I've got a few spiders sharing quarters with me. Wonder if they would be a good candidate for diatomaceous earth?   I really don't mind the Daddy Longlegs ones, but the small black ones are a bit unnerving. Not enough to spray poison, so far.

And dust is an ongoing enemy. I even found a thick layer of dust atop the dishwasher when it was pulled out from the wall Yikes, it gets in the strangest places. I used to have a great damp dustmop, it had a flat surface maybe the size of 8.5 x 11 paper, you would cover it with damp terrycloth with elastic binding, I think I had 3 of those, and could throw them in the washer.   It went away in the great garage sale of 2017.   

Seems like it would be great to have one here for floors, but I'll be darned if I can imagine what the keywords would be to find one online. I do have a rickety plastic swiffer-ish one I can secure damp microfiber cloths onto, but something sturdier is needed.

I'd rather be digging through flats of minerals, splitting the choice bits into small chunks and making micromounts or thumbnail mounts. Or playing music.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Dorothy Parshall
Date: 08 Dec 24 - 09:56 PM

Dupont:

Well, Metheny comes tomorrow to clean - so I will have a clean house but not as tidy as I would like. I may throw myself at her feet and beg HELP! Maybe throw all the odds and sods into boxes or plastic bags just to get clear. The little I did yesterday wore me out so little happened today. That Window does look better but not terrific... My shoulders quit.

R just phoned and I let go a bit of a rant at the stuff he has all over the house that belongs in the cellar - at best. Then he asks who all is coming... How many times...!!! And he is in the middle of buying windows for one of his derelict buildings! He neglected to tell me: "Found the snow tires and they are on!"

I keep wondering how my son could be so pernickety; we spent several summers in a tent on Clam Bay, fetching water from "Aunt Kitty's spring" up the road. Often cooking over a drift wood fire. That was my idea of paradise and at least one son (the other one?) said that was the best part of his childhood.

I am suffering from dust. Going to bed with hope R gets home and gets a bit cleared before Mylene comes. I used to laugh at the idea that women had to clean up before the cleaning lady came!!

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff
From: Charmion
Date: 08 Dec 24 - 06:37 PM

The 2024“Messiah” concert has gone down-range; what a relief. Attendance was way down, probably because of the weather — snow, snow, and more snow for a week — but also because of weak marketing and stiff competition for concert-goers’ time and attention. I’m sure all this will be chewed over ad nauseam at the next choir board meeting, and I refuse even to think about it until then.

Incidentally, the choir sang really well.

The snow-heavy weather system has blown itself out, only to be replaced by several days of rain. I predict a fair few damp basements in Stratford this Christmas. Please, God, not mine!

The house is tidy if not particularly clean — cat hair is everywhere — and I continue to identify items that I don’t use and should re-home. Nevertheless, I believe I have just about hit the end of this phase of decluttering, having achieved about the correct balance of space versus stuff in this house — except for the boxes of photographs in the study closet, and the stacks of music CDs that I don’t listen to.

Oh, yeah — that’s what I had planned to deal with this winter.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 08 Dec 24 - 11:37 AM

Thunderstorm this morning at 6:15 had Pepper pushing my bedroom door open and rushing in; I caught her before she reached the bed (with her wet feet) and closed the door behind her, saying "go sleep in the tub." And darned if she didn't. :) There's a small rug in the hall bathroom tub since I realized that's where she heads now in noisy weather.

On Sunday mornings the gardening radio show is on (the only time I ever play AM radio). I puttered in the kitchen pulling together ingredients for my granola as I listened. (The original recipe called for six cups of oatmeal, now I use two. I add ground flaxseed instead of the whole seeds to help the consistency when the oil and honey are added.) The next kitchen thing is to declutter some of the Thanksgiving stuff; I put both the gizzards and the bones from the last batch of broth into the freezer until trash goes to the curb tomorrow.

I made a half-size batch of bread pudding yesterday and have reduced a lot of the carb hit from it. It's a mix of gluten free bread broken into pieces, just two tablespoons of brown sugar for flavor and the rest of the sweetening is from monkfruit drops and a couple of cut up dates. It also has vanilla, butter, egg, and I use a combination of cream and whole milk because the keto approach is to have more fat and lower carbs. The original recipe was double this and served six, but when I make this I find that less is more and usually have four servings.

My daughter went to a festival this weekend, and I've seen photos of a rainy encampment posted on FB by her friends. This has me thinking she might not want to participate in another cool day next week when I go to a friend's house to dig up a few plants to bring here. There is a peach tree in the mix she might want to take to her place so she'd have at least one tree easier to harvest than the ones already on her property (those trees were planted along the rim of a stock pond so when fruit falls it all rolls away.)

One of the strings of lights in the yard didn't turn on last night - fuses? I'll get wet feet today checking that. I need to spend time finishing my holiday letter and get it in the mail tomorrow. Alternating cool work and warming up work.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Dorothy Parshall
Date: 07 Dec 24 - 10:47 PM

Dupont:

Must feel uncomfortable to have an almost break-in. I would certainly want a camera thing in place. I asked son about one when he was here; if I am in bed and someone comes to the door... I would like to be able to see who it is and talk to them. WE passed on it then but... I am not really concerned about anyone breaking in when I am here - car in driveway. We never lock the house - yet. This area is pretty decent. Not upscale enough to be tempting? Montreal would be different!   

looking through FB an hour ago, I saw there was a recent accident (within the hour) on the slippery bridge. Phoned R; he will stay in town. He still has no snow tires and is in jeopardy of a nasty ticket in addition to a nasty accident. Sigh! A lasagna from the bakery was just ready!

So, social event today - a church Christmas bazaar/lunch. I bought some nut-free brownies, exchanged a few words with unknown persons and went for groceries.

Spent some effort trying to clean that window - with some success; will go at it again tomorrow. It will be an improvement...! My shoulders are weak.

Dawned on me, I could move a lot of stuff from the hall closet into a bin and stash it somewhere, freeing space for extra food stuffs. Thinking of a future when this might be really helpful.

This cobweb business: They seem to appear overnight. I may never get rid of all of them at the same time! Well, Mylene will be here on Monday!

Had a FB experience earlier tonight: a quite reasonable message from a friend followed by an explanation of getting a sum of money from the govt... Checked - Ah there is no pic. So I sent Steve a brief message re being hacked and a copy of the one I rec'd. I know Steve in real life - he is as good as they come.

BED Time!

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 07 Dec 24 - 06:15 PM

That is an interesting mix of activities, Patty! What are your mineral-related goals? I also have to get cards out and finish a few projects.

I'm determined to finish the puzzle today so I can move onto a new one. I have the whitish ones arranged in rows by the numbers of knobs and am going by shape because there is so little in the printed surface to give me a clue.

Shopping this afternoon to load up on veggies for next week. Ex and I made our usual trip then came home and had tea and turkey soup. There may be one meal left out of the Thanksgiving leftovers. This is better than most years when I'm really tired of turkey and still lots left.

Today we've gotten a lovely gentle rain and a heavy overcast, something we've needed for a while. No freezes in the next 10 day forecast.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: pattyClink
Date: 07 Dec 24 - 01:15 PM

Thanks, there does seem to be a lot to learn about arid-land gardening. Got a couple of books from the library on it, may plant some tough chollas rather than leafy things.   But, there is a raggedy old tree in the back yard, obviously has a great root system and drought tolerant, which was cut down and has sort-of continued to grow from its stump, with lots of leaves and jillions of suckers. I just started the process of cleaning that up, and will hopefully save a few main branches and their shade. I'll have to count that as my tree-planting effort, saving it from the carpenter's strong urge to rip it out with an excavator.   Also doing something similar with the desert willow in the front.

I can't begin to consider Christmas decorating or planting things that need consistent watering. My goal now is to get cards in the mail, get the bed done so I can move two dressers out of the middle of the living room floor, maybe find time for 2 refinishing projects, and buy a vehicle before January travel. Stay afloat in Gaelic, and pursue some music and mineral related goals. Life's niceties will have to wait til next year.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 07 Dec 24 - 12:58 PM

I'm to the point of needing another blanket on the bed. It went from a sheet and thermal blanket to adding a wool blanket and quilt and now I'll add another wool blanket (I've had a lap quilt over the top for the last week, so that will be set aside). It may be a year for the down comforter but the problem in this climate is that if we have some warmer weather during the winter that comforter is too much. It's a lot of work to get out and put away again.

Patty, I thought about you and your property this morning. I've been sharing information on the social media account for the gardening site where I work - it's a good time to buy living xmas trees, and for this area the little Italian Stone Pines are well adapted. We always tell people to avoid the Eldarica or Afghan pine (Pinus brutia var eldarica) because they are true desert trees and while they grow fast they get too much moisture in this area and die young. So if you're thinking about a holiday tree or simply want to plant a tree somewhere on your property, a good way to get one inexpensively is to buy one now at a nursery or big box store (or get one on clearance in January). You'll still need to plant it properly, but that doesn't mean a deep hole, it means soaking the roots to untangle then planting in a shallow wide hole and keeping it so the flare at the base of the trunk is above the soil. That keeps them healthiest (when they're transferred from one pot to the next by the growers they usually end up piling dirt on top of the roots so you need to pull that off of the top until you reach the flare). It does need to be watered for the first year or two while getting established, and needs good drainage, but there's a proverb "Society grows great when old [wo]men plant trees whose shade they know they shall never sit in." We need to keep planting those trees. Don't put it too close to the house, they get quite large.

Sheriff's office is out today checking the site of the robbery across the street. The neighbor drove over to city hall to report it because there is usually a deputy at the office; I think the fact that the homeowners were in the house at the time ups the ante on this one, though in my experience they never find much or capture the people who did it. I've checked my locks on the gates - they're intact. Someone cutting a lock would make enough noise to alert the dogs. This all ignoring the fact that gates and locks are meant to keep honest people out - if someone really wants in, well, there's a reason my climbing ice ax is tucked under my bed. No guns here, but that device has been handy in the past for more than just stopping a slide down a glacier.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 07 Dec 24 - 12:15 AM

Patty, it's your house, if you want an extra table or two for other projects (or puzzles) that seems like an easy splurge. Or is there not room? The realty website photos of the staging (it's ages since I saw them) looked like you had some room to work with. My sympathy with the pump work. I've had a few projects over the years that if I'd known more I'd have researched them better or had bit the bullet and had someone else take care of them. But you often don't know until you try for yourself. I remember one plumbing project . . .

The neighbors across the street (the elderly couple) report that the lock on their side gate into the back yard was cut last night and someone also forced their way into their garage (from the side door in the back yard). They were at home and heard nothing. It is definitely time to get the electrician here to change out the transformer for my doorbell so I can install the Ring. That might well have caught the activity or them passing by, since my porch looks directly at their porch (it wouldn't have seen the side yard activity, but the only way to approach that area is from the street on the front of our houses). I didn't hear my dogs barking so whoever was over there was quiet. They usually bark at people in the street (everything that isn't a car passing by - though they make an exception for the mail carrier truck.)

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: pattyClink
Date: 06 Dec 24 - 10:20 PM

Okay, I'll say it, that puzzle is genuinely weird! Good luck with all the white zones!   I've learned my limits and only do puzzles that won't take more than 5 sessions to do, much more fun than the 'impossible' ones. Reminds me I need to order a roll-up puzzle mat since not much table space around here.

Keeping busy with new problems daily. I screwed up the well by not purging when my friend used some muscle to replace the filter, so air was trapped. When I started trying to learn about maintenance, starting with all the parts in the pumphouse, I opened the little metal door to the control box. Not realizing some insane person designed it, so that a bunch of wiring is attached to the door of the box, which come undone from 5 bladed connectors when you open it. And very difficult to reseat again, since you can't see what you're doing and it has to be forcibly pushed to go back inside its rim. Long story short, got neighbors involved, it's fixed, but humiliation level pretty high. One of the pitfalls of rural life is everyone is highly aware of every mistake you make, and how incompetent you are compared to them.   

The carpenter is starting to work on the new veranda roof, but it's going to be days of just tear-down first. I declined to pay for weeks of rental on a construction dumpster, I just don't have an endless stream of funds. So I'll help unload trailer trips at the dump. Starting to wish I had just laid a patch on the roof all by myself.

Meanwhile, the tires have been replaced, other must-dos done.   But I've developed an aversion to working on the bed project-- at first I just kept getting interrupted by other chores and crises. Then it went from being a challenge I eagerly wanted to do, to being something I dread turning to, because I know there will be 20 ways that the process will go wrong. Perhaps I must break it down into baby steps, just measure and mark the first few pieces.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 06 Dec 24 - 12:53 PM

There is a bugger of a jigsaw puzzle that has been on the sunroom table for far too long. I am to the point of filling in the whitish background, the last of all of the zones. This one. As I worked I was doing various characters or objects, but shifted to color zones starting with the green field and body of the large cat, when I've literally arranged pieces by the shape; one, two, three, or four of the knobs or tabs. Working by shape and finally able to catch some of the nuance of the slight color shifts is finally paying off. This one is right up there with the gourmet cheeses puzzle for difficulty.

Charmion I suppose when you shop this time of year you can use an insulated bag for the avocados so they don't get too cold in the car if you make many stops while you're out. Those bags are a feature of every car in Texas for shopping during the hot months to get frozen goods home more or less still frozen. Enjoy that rehearsal and performance. There must be a robust locker room for changing for the concert and stashing all of the cold weather gear you all wear to get there.

Patty, how is the construction work going? That lumber you had delivered is for an outside project?

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Charmion
Date: 06 Dec 24 - 08:35 AM

At least another day of snow in Perth County, possibly two.

Tonight is the dress rehearsal for this year’s performance of “Messiah”, and the show is tomorrow night. In this weather, getting a good audience will be a challenge.

As will getting around town. Like it or loathe it, the Y and the supermarket are on today’s itinerary if I have to get there on snowshoes.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 05 Dec 24 - 11:26 PM

Good job, Dorothy!

Yard work today involved putting out a few more lights in the front so the neighbors across the street have more to see if they look out front. That couple is about 90 and in failing health and haven't put up a tree themselves in a couple of years. One string I used to put on the front porch is now draped around the lowest branches of the pine in the front yard, and I wrapped the base of the redbud with white lights (I have another string or two to add to it tomorrow, working it around and up the multi-stem tree).

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Dorothy Parshall
Date: 05 Dec 24 - 03:55 PM

Dupont:

And 65 years ago I gave birth to a tiny 6 pound boy. His grandma told me later, she didn't think he would live. He was average weight by 6 months And, thanks to our "home grown" goat milk, he is now a tall, slim, healthy guitarist.

I phoned him after noon!

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Dorothy Parshall
Date: 05 Dec 24 - 03:46 PM

Dupont:

Never have taken statins; Health folks in Ottawa checked my list of supplements before giving me the Ibrance. They asked me not to take E and were not happy with the chlorpheniramine maleate "not more than 3"; I am still finding them helpful with the cough - but not more than 3!

A couple inches of snow and continuing- with temp at freezing point. Have chosen not to go anywhere. Too many bad drivers out there. Local FB page tells of LOTS of drivers being ticketed for lack of snow tires (1 Dec was deadline). There are checkpoints - like for drinking. Someone posted that they were almost rear-ended - excuse: "I'm from another country; I have no brush...!!" Those sort of twits convince me to stay home. And they are now all "from another country!" My lack of energy contributes - I do not have what it takes to deal with even a mini-crisis out there in the cold.

R came home exhausted from stress-filled day but perked up when I mentioned the window that might not open - ! He opened it and worked on cleaning between the window and storm - -- There must be a magic implement that will go up between... Then he fell asleep in his chair - to bed ho!

HAH! finally checked the Atmospheric pressure -LOW!!! I was wondering why I was in a zombie state. Some sweet usually helps so a sliver of apple pie with a bit of cheese on top, slightly warmed might help.

Still snowing, still at freezing point, going down this eve... And R crossing the bridge ... as it does so.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 05 Dec 24 - 02:52 PM

I dressed for work in the yard today but so far have only made it out to the bay laurel to pick a leaf to add to the turkey soup I made this morning. It's warmer now so when the soup is finished I need to go outside.

There is a batch of broth simmering (the neck, back, and a couple of other trimmed parts were browned and now in water for broth to freeze). The soup is made with broth from simmering the baked carcass. To keep it more keto-like I just used carrots, no potatoes or noodles. And I've added tofu for protein and to have more volume in the soup solids. (There is also onion, celery, and some herb along with the last of the turkey meat.)

This morning I called a woman I met a couple of weeks ago through the Freecycle group. She told me at the time that she has plants in her yard she wants to give away before they move and several of them are small shrubs I've wanted (but are difficult to find at local nurseries). I'll go over next week and dig a few to plant here. I'll do them bare root so I'm not lugging around big pots of soil.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Charmion
Date: 05 Dec 24 - 11:27 AM

Heavy snow across southwestern Ontario today, and Stratford is choked. I was halted at the mouth of my driveway this morning, ready to turn into the street, when a man on foot wallowed up to the car and banged on the bonnet. I opened the window (snow swirling in), and asked, "You wanted to speak to me?" He said, "The roads are terrible! For your own safety, stay home!"

Reader, I went to the Y anyway. Getting home was a cute trick, however, and the only way back into the garage was nose-first; if I had tried to back in, as I usually do, the car would have stuck fast in the icy windrow left by the passage of the road plow. (It's a VW Golf, so it's front-wheel drive.) A glance at the weather radar map tells me this situation will prevail for several hours yet.

I had intended to hit the supermarket. I'm out of avocados. (How's that for a 21st-century First World problem?)

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 04 Dec 24 - 11:15 PM

One of the reasons for taking CoQ10 is if you are taking statins, because there is something they deplete or effect. I wasn't taking it when I was on statins (it wouldn't have helped) - and now since I'm off of them I'm not worried about it.

Your variety of cheeses sounds nice, Dorothy!

Today was drizzly and cool, finally feeling seasonal.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Dorothy Parshall
Date: 04 Dec 24 - 09:36 PM

Dupont:

So many topics that are foreign to me, or interesting, or helpful!

Snow: about half an inch out there at the moment but more on the way through the night - my phone says! Brussel Sprouts - not cooked to death and usually in a large pot with other veggies; usually a week's worth. We eat when we are ready, usually at dif times. R often gets home between 8 and midnight - 10 is good, 8 better, or I go to bed and the food is in the frig - take what you feel like... Planned overs are in glass containers with plastic lids which stack nicely.

"Christmas" - a habit of sorts to me with no special meaning other than once in a great while there is family. Taun is planning a trip the week of 15th ("I tried for Christmas but that wouldn't work") Tentative, dependent on weather - driving up through the Adirondacks???!! This is a big effort - for me as I might not be here next year. So far it is he and one grandson - maybe two - and respective partners. I have not been informed if they are staying here or at BnB.

My job is trying to get the house to his level of clean! He says cobwebs and dust are the problem. I don't even notice the dust and the cobwebs are ongoing - there is a spider in the bathroom that seems to work through each night do I walk into a couple strands each morning. The young woman is coming on Monday and we will focus on dust! I am trying to get to places I can reach easily - the mantel with all its gew-gaws was done a few days ago; I will watch to see how long it takes to get noticeable again. Might have to do it again. The real cruncher is the large bathroom window which has cobwebs between inner window and storm window! I doubt we can open it but will put in a request when I see R!

Went to the cheese shop and the vitamin shop today. Overdid the cheese selections; it cheers me up to know there is a variety available! I tried two nice ones for lunch. I ran out of CoQ10- I forget why I take it; it's expensive. And Weleda massage oil- for my feet - makes them feel much happier! And the woman who works there is worth a visit - to be greeted with such cheer - as though she was just waiting for ME! I usually mail order all the supplements but not quick enough this time.

Texted wonderful neighbour at Beaver/Bancroft for help! With the cold weather and storms and hydro going off at times... Should the water be turned off?? Larry will take care of it! And Steve will keep the drive clear; it is best not to let it build up.

And our new way of dealing with the firewood is terrific. I walk past the BIG pile in the hall on way to Bathroom and return with a couple sticks for the pile in den. The wood needs more drying so I put a few pieces at time near the stove. It is wonderful to have it in the house - though not very pretty ---OR beautiful depending...!

And still sorting out the TV room and re-homing all the sheets I found in the linen closet! In plastic bags so they don't gather dust! HAH! I see a cobweb!

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 04 Dec 24 - 08:59 PM

This was on a browser screen out of sight since morning - and I've posted since then, so it is edited.

My favorite holiday is Thanksgiving and having the meal with friends and family. While that holiday is about the dinner, the most food activity people see from me on xmas is breakfast. Like Thanksgiving, it is another mobile holiday that lands when we can get the most of us together in one place. Certainly our most memorable xmas in recent years was during COVID, when we drove our cars to the parking lot outside the Panda Express at a location central to all of us. We each went into Panda, masked, and ordered our lunch then ate in our cars (it was cold and clear, no desire to set chairs in a circle). After the meal we took turns handing gifts through windows or unloading from hatchbacks and unwrapping in our cars.

Still thinking about more lights. The next block over has done a bang up job and it feels wonderful to drive past.

For social stuff this month I'm leading two tours at the art museum where I have volunteered for almost five years. There are always special exhibits and docents who jump on doing those (making it difficult to find a time to do any of those tours after doing all of the research); I've decided that I'm sticking with the B team and will continue to do the general collection tour (it changes enough on its own to keep me on my toes). I volunteer in the archives also and if I decide to develop my own specialty tour it won't depend on changing exhibits. These will be a party or two as well.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 04 Dec 24 - 07:24 PM

Weight shows in the face, certainly, but I hadn't thought about how a hat might fit overall. Interesting observation! Today at my annual well-woman check I was weighed while wearing my jeans and t-shirt and was 154. That's just fine; at home on my scale in the morning with no clothes it probably would have been about 150. I'm watching the food I eat mostly to keep the carbs low (under 60, or failing that, under 100) and the right amount of calcium but a side effect with a keto-like diet is that I've lost a little more weight (and hope to stay at about this level).

Good talk with my doctor today, confirmation of some things I've been thinking about (one of her practice partners has told her "your brain needs cholesterol!" - my takeaway from my reading) and a couple of things helpful to her. A doctor married to a vaccine skeptic has to be an interesting relationship. Her husband has some health issues and is also looking at food and when I told her about my statin discovery a light went off for her. I was also able to answer a couple questions about (for example) some of the sugar substitutes out there that he's thinking about for some of his cooking (they're not recommended - might as well eat sugar). But sweeteners like monkfruit others have told her about it and I pulled up my Amazon account to show her the brand I like.

The turkey bones simmered this afternoon so it's time to make some soup. Now to figure out a low-carb soup. I have some turkey meat and tofu to use, along with onion, carrot, and celery. Maybe a little bit of potato. I could add some rice noodles, avoiding wheat but the carbs go way up.

I had a message from a friend of a friend today via Facebook Messenger. She is worried about a mutual friend who is struggling because her husband has moved to a care facility (he has something that resembles dementia) and she hasn't put out any of the holiday ornaments that she adores and was going to skip it this year. But the friend who wrote and I both think that for her well-being friends need to step in to help, so I've suggested our university retiree group meet at her house next week and put up the ornaments. And have the friend who contacted me come over as a surprise guest. (That can blow up in your face, but I think this would be a great surprise.)

For me time, there is a jigsaw puzzle in the sunroom that was feeling like I'd never finish it but recently I've made progress. I'll take time this evening to tackle more of it. It's a great "palate cleanser" for my brain some days.

Time to feed the dogs and make my soup.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: keberoxu
Date: 04 Dec 24 - 06:05 PM

Cool, Charmion! You decluttered your head!

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Charmion
Date: 04 Dec 24 - 02:39 PM

This morning I took out a tweed hat Edmund gave me on our last Christmas together. It was a bit too tight, but I could not part with it. Good thing — it’s not tight any more, though it’s snug enough it won’t blow off even when the wind howls as it is doing today.

I had no idea that flab accumulates even on the head.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: pattyClink
Date: 03 Dec 24 - 07:43 PM

Feeling good today after time with friends, and time and music with friends earlier in the week. Today I had the gift of a slightly long ride with a truly musical fellow, and we mostly just played CDs and really listened to them. Most people start yapping halfway through the first song.

I'll be honest, the holidays have been annoying to me for quite a few years, since the wonderful big-family get-togethers of yesteryear have gone away. This year I don't expect much, but I will get some get- togethers with music and homemade singing, and I love that, so much better than some avalanche of presents and hurricane of baking and cooking. Let us be merry in whatever way we can.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Charmion
Date: 03 Dec 24 - 07:32 PM

Not snowed in yet, but not for lack of trying; there’s more than a foot of snow on the patio table and flurries in the forecast every day for the foreseeable future. I think the snow shovel is a bit big for young Logan, and my walk isn’t worth more than fifty cents. A guy with a self-propelled snowblower clears my driveway — best $700 (for the whole winter!) I spend in any year.

I’m not bothering with holiday decorations, with just myself and the cats to please, and I’ll be heading down the road to Windsor on Christmas Day anyway, weather permitting. I’m sure I’ll get my fill of baubles and tinsel at the in-laws’ place. If the weather doesn’t permit, I’ll open a bottle of decent wine and grill a steak. The cats enjoy hovering over my plate and pretending they like steak.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 03 Dec 24 - 03:29 PM

I was so ready to be finished with this cat gig, and her chart ends at lunch today. But I always ask just to be safe - "will you be home as you expected before their dinner time?" Nope. Got the schedule wrong again. Tomorrow. Good thing I left the yoga mat in the car, and at least I'm getting more regular workouts with my exercise subscription.

Looking through the closet where the holiday lights live I'm considering putting a few up in two front windows (in the past I've used suction cups with hoods on the glass - I don't know if I have those any more). There is a plug close enough to each window that I can put the lights on a timer. This feels like a year that needs more colorful lights to cheer myself and others.

How is everyone feeling? Is Charmion completely snowed in? Shoveling the walk might be a good job for the youth who lives nearby and wants to save up for I forget what he wanted. We haven't heard from Linn for a while but she usually has someone come plow her driveway. Our late friend gnu used to post photos of his New Brunswick yard and driveway with snow up past the garage roof. Do you have snow, Dorothy, and I hope you're staying in for the duration (or until roads are plowed and walks shoveled). Meanwhile, no snowing, just mowing here in Texas.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 03 Dec 24 - 11:41 AM

When I got the new AT&T fiber Internet they offered a thank-you of a gift card or cash card, whatever, but those things are notoriously difficult to use unless they're something like the Amazon card. Flash that barcode at Amazon and they credit your account in a hurry. So that $100 is here and in the account. Often times when people switch companies they have to pay a penalty so a few days later AT&T asked if I had to pay a penalty when I left. Well, not exactly, but they didn't prorate back the rest of the month, so they kinda did. Fine, AT&T says they're sending another card. Good time of year to bulk up the Amazon account.

The other online clearing out I'm doing this week is unsubscribing stuff that I never read or that got added alongside other stuff (one account I followed on Substack was set up so you ended up with four other related subscriptions at the same time. I got the one I wanted and now will unsubscribe the others.) The email is a jumble of after-the-fact fundraising, holiday fundraising, Giving Tuesday fundraising . . . ugg.

Oh, and 1000.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 03 Dec 24 - 11:23 AM

Each year I've pulled a few of the ornaments that the kids really liked and given (locally to the daughter with a tree this year) or sent them (tucked in with gifts to the kid in the Pac NW) - so trees and ornaments are certainly topical this time of year and in this thread. I pull out some of the crystal pitchers and large vases (so much of this stuff - all from my great aunt's house) and carefully fill them with the various colors of glass tree ball ornaments. There are three up-lights on the mantle where they are placed and along with a string of lights wound through some faux-fir garland it looks quite festive in that small area. I go with themes - some years there are a few Santas set in amongst the greenery, other times various animal shapes. Or the nutcrackers. I gave away a couple of the big nutcrackers grabbed on sale at the grocery store and kept the ones my sister brought back from what used to be East Germany and a few others family members collected.

This morning I brought home a couple of more packing boxes from the cat sitting house (she sets them aside for me - they have packing materials that are good for shipping the eBay glasses). Also a robust plastic storage bin drawer thing that I'm pretty sure my daughter can use (with her voluminous collection of costume parts and materials). The last run is hopefully this afternoon for their lunch. And then I'll make a stop at a friend's downtown apartment with some leftovers from our Sunday dinner. I haven't had time to do that till now.

It's a bright clear fall day today, and I took time this morning to sweep out the track of my sliding glass back door and WD-40 it into working smoothly. The yard could use some attention also—here we are into December and the Bermuda grass still isn't dormant.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 03 Dec 24 - 09:14 AM

Christmas tree in and decorated today, which included Herself first going through the ritual deep-clean of our front room (which the builders saw fit to put at the back of the house). A small tree this year, but still bought in case Dear Daughter brings the grandsprogs down as threatened for a session of guitar building.

.... Here endeth the topic drift.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 02 Dec 24 - 06:46 PM

At our Thanksgiving table it was the opinion of those who regularly eat Brussels sprouts that they used to be even more bitter than they are now, since a hybrid or some specific variety has been cultivated more widely. Difficult to imagine people eating them at all under those circumstances.

The table is compressed to the smaller size and turned to make room for the dog beds that were moved out of the way for our dinner. It's always a one-two punch cleaning and furniture-wise at the holidays. I need to get out some of the decor and clear the mantle because that tends to be what I decorate. (Last week I put strings of lights in the juniper and I got a new string of large LED bulbs that is now hung along the soffit trim of the front porch.) It's just me here, why make a huge fuss? But when family do eventually arrive for our xmas meal and gift giving, it's nice to look like I put in some effort, and if I have to put in the effort it might as well be up for a while. I haven't had a tree in ages (my daughter spoke of picking one up this weekend - maybe I can send her a lot of the ornaments I'm not using.)

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Charmion
Date: 02 Dec 24 - 05:48 PM

My Welsh husband never failed to mark Michaelmas (in late September) by remarking that it was time to put the sprouts on for Christmas.

It’s still snowing in southwestern Ontario, and the forecast indicates flurries all week. I’m finally wearing full winter kit, including boots, woollen socks, parka, hat, and serious mittens, an outfit that adds five minutes to my get out of the house routine.

My great-niece has had two expensive crises since September, running me lower in ready-use funds than I’ve been in years. Pension day rolls around at the end of every month, so all would have been well but for a fluke mistake at City Hall, where somebody pressed the Collect Property Tax button ten days early and suddenly my bank account was overdrawn. Colour me very, very pissed off, along with the rest of Stratford. I was shaken by the bolt of panic that hit me with the warning email; apparently more than 25 years of financial stability have not expunged the fears of my time as a freelancer.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 02 Dec 24 - 04:24 PM

sprouts at Christmas are not an Australian tradition so I'd never seen/heard your sprouts comment, MaJo - I love it!!

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 02 Dec 24 - 11:53 AM

The table looked good this morning with the lacey cloth on it, so I was thinking I might not have to wash it between uses. But when I picked it up a whole bunch of crumbs dropped through the holes and were pretty evenly scattered on the surface under it. It's an antique so I soak it and do that wash by hand then put it in a zipper laundry bag for the drier.

A brief search on baking soda and vegetables shows that there is some loss of nutrition. One article suggests visualizing putting salt in the water - how little can be added before it is too salty. Swap baking soda for the salt amount and you can see it requires very little.

Now to get the eBay stuff out from where it was stashed for the holiday and return to listing things.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 02 Dec 24 - 09:10 AM

Bicarb in the greens ..... My grandmother used to do that: I understand it helps preserve the green colour, while permitting the greens to be boiled to buggery peridition. Who was it said that if the sprouts aren't boiling by September, they won't be ready for Christmas Day?

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Charmion
Date: 02 Dec 24 - 07:27 AM

For the record, I love Brussels sprouts steamed, roasted, sautéed, or any which way but boiled to death. Canada, too, has a heritage of bad cookery featuring the humble sprout, so I have eaten my share of such pitiful offerings. It’s a point of pride with me that I haven’t wrecked a dish of sprouts since Pierre Trudeau was in office.

Subject: RE: DECLUTTER *hoards *bad habits *toxic stuff - 2024
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 01 Dec 24 - 11:03 PM

My mother's generation & their mothers back in the Mother Country (England) before them boiled brussels sprouts into oblivion which is why lots of folk can't stand them.

My sister remembers us putting overboiled veggies on the little shelf below the base of the dinner table, I think it just braced the legs.

In the 70s I had a lovely friend who was born in 1912 & I remember her poking at the fiercely boiling peas for a long time, & apologising they still weren't soft even tho she had added bicarb! I said it didn't matter...

I still eat brussels sprouts but I adore kalettes have you tried them? I have a friend who is a gourmet cook & I had to persuade him to try kalettes. He's older than me & learnt to cook when he went overseas in his 20s & makes the most wonderful food, but still remembers his mother's sprouts!

sandra