BS: American Presidential race 2024

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 27 Aug 24 - 09:27 PM

More commentary today about the threat of these rogue election officials - since the results they would be slowing would be local, chances are that other candidates on the ballot (down ballot from Trump or Harris) would sue if results were slowed. Local elections would put local candidates in office and if that is messed up, they're bound to sue.

Jack Smith has removed part of the case that the Supreme Court trashed and reissued the coup charges after running them past a new grand jury. The "superseding indictment" still packs a punch against Trump and his activities AS A CANDIDATE on January 6. He had no official duties, he was out there churning the crowd as part of his campaign. Trump charged in superseding indictment in election interference case following SCOTUS ruling
The new indictment adjusts the charges to the Supreme Court's immunity ruling.

"The superseding indictment, which was presented to a new grand jury that had not previously heard evidence in this case, reflects the Government's efforts to respect and implement the Supreme Court's holdings and remand instructions," a Justice Department spokesperson said Tuesday.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 27 Aug 24 - 11:17 AM

Thanks, Stilly.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 27 Aug 24 - 11:01 AM

It is my understanding that they may try to slow things but will be challenged by higher authorities. In Georgia where the election board (supposedly non-partisan, and appointed, not elected) is making waves but the governor and attorney general will probably be able to dismantle that broken cog in the electoral wheel.

Their jobs to canvass elections are spelled out, they don't have the ability to actually toss votes or cancel elections without challenge and if they're not doing their largely ceremonial jobs states will most likely force their hands or set them aside. (Canvassing means to "thoroughly examine" or "scrutinize.")

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 27 Aug 24 - 09:43 AM

I am reading more and more that Trump's mad outbursts are paving the way for a cry of foul play once he does lose the election (We hope!) The latest worrying piece of news is that there are 70+ election deniers in key positions in swing states.

Is this a realu worry and, if so, what is being done about ot?

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 26 Aug 24 - 01:35 PM

The presidential debate terms are under negotiation now. It seems that Team Trump wants the mics muted when it isn't their turn; Harris wants them on all of the time as they have traditionally been over the years.

Is this thing on? Harris and Trump battle over hot mics at debate.
Negotiations over the Sept. 10 spectacle have hit an impasse over whether to leave the microphones on.

In the June debate between Trump and Biden they were muted between turns to speak. There was also no audience. From Politico:

But Biden is no longer running for president. And Harris’ campaign wants the microphones to be hot at all times during the ABC debate — as has historically been the case at presidential debates.

“We have told ABC and other networks seeking to host a possible October debate that we believe both candidates’ mics should be live throughout the full broadcast,” Brian Fallon, the Harris campaign’s senior adviser for communications, tells POLITICO. “Our understanding is that Trump’s handlers prefer the muted microphone because they don’t think their candidate can act presidential for 90 minutes on his own. We suspect Trump’s team has not even told their boss about this dispute because it would be too embarrassing to admit they don’t think he can handle himself against Vice President Harris without the benefit of a mute button.”

Privately, the veep’s team believes that Harris can get Trump to lose his cool and say something impolitic on mic.

“She’s more than happy to have exchanges with him if he tries to interrupt her,” one person familiar with the negotiations tells Playbook. “And given how shook he seems by her, he’s very prone to having intemperate outbursts and … I think the campaign would want viewers to hear [that].”

The Trump team is continuing the insults and BS as they try to get their way.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: The Sandman
Date: 25 Aug 24 - 03:15 PM

Kennedy has endorsed Trump, so presumably he thinks that by leaving he is helping Trump, of course he may be wrong ,but at the moment the situation is unclear

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: gillymor
Date: 24 Aug 24 - 07:44 PM

This is so rich, seeing the tables turned on "old" Trump.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 24 Aug 24 - 03:29 PM

From Politico: Trump Is Now the ‘Old’ Candidate. It Might Matter.

It’s one of the most time-tested tools used on the campaign trail: the age diss. Yes, it’s mean-spirited, but over the decades, it’s proven to be an incredibly effective — and historically bipartisan — attack on a political opponent.

It’s a tactic used to render one’s competitor as hopelessly out of touch, unable to handle the mission at hand.

That’s a playbook former President Donald Trump leaned on heavily this campaign cycle, repeatedly dinging President Joe Biden for his advanced years and dubbing him “Sleepy Joe Biden.” In a viral leaked clip of Trump at Mar-A-Lago after the presidential debate in June, he took things further, calling Biden a “broken down pile of crap.”

Now, with Vice President Kamala Harris, 59, at the top of the Democratic ticket, the 78-year-old Trump has gone from being the attacker on age to the attackee. Should he win in November, he will be the oldest president to ever take office.

Suddenly, it is Trump’s age that’s the issue, not Biden’s.

At her rallies, Harris uses subtle age shade, telling crowds that Trump would “return America to a dark past” and called his comments on her race the “same old show.” Her running mate, Minnesota Gov. Tim Walz, 60, opts for a more direct diss. Trump, Walz says, is hopelessly “low energy,” “tired” and “needs to get a little rest on the weekends.”

As age politics become increasingly pertinent on the campaign trail, we’ve compiled the “greatest hits” in political memory of presidential matchups where candidates levied age-focused attacks.

Read more at the link.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 24 Aug 24 - 12:35 PM

Not a jot.

From The Atlantic (here):

But Donald Trump and Bobby Kennedy—as I’ve referred to Robert F. Kennedy Jr. since we met freshman year at Harvard—have always had many features in common as well. Both are entitled playboy sons of northeastern wealth; both (in Michelle Obama’s words) were “afforded the grace of failing forward” as misbehaving, underachieving adolescents admitted to Ivy League colleges thanks to “the affirmative action of generational wealth”; both were reckless lifelong adolescents, both attention-craving philanderers and liars, both jerks. And Kennedy’s hour-long speech today was nearly as meandering and filled with lies as any average hour of Trump.

From the Washington Post - RFK Jr., environmental warrior, backs the ‘drill, baby, drill’ ticket
As an activist and lawyer, Robert F. Kennedy Jr. spent decades battling for environmental protections that Trump has worked to undo.

Kennedy had promised to be “the best environmental president in American history.” For decades, as an attorney and celebrity activist, he urged more vigorous enforcement of federal regulations guaranteeing clean air and water.

Now he joins a campaign whose policies, according to critics, would scale back those regulations and weaken the agencies that uphold them.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: The Sandman
Date: 24 Aug 24 - 05:26 AM

How will Kennedys leaving the race affect voters?

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 23 Aug 24 - 08:18 PM

Doug, as an Aussie I can excuse myself from that question. LOL

If I lived in the US, I wouldn't support the Republicans in the form they are now in but I'd be more likely to lean towards the Democrats. However, the Trump circus has pushed everything into Whackadoodle Land so who knows what will happen after this year?

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 23 Aug 24 - 06:58 PM

Just as a matter of interest, are there any Mudcat members who admit to being Republican party supporters? (not necessarily Trump supporters). It doesn't seem so from all I have read here.

DC

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: gillymor
Date: 23 Aug 24 - 06:37 PM

Trump seems to be a magnet for whack-a-doodles.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 23 Aug 24 - 05:01 PM

Kennedy has suspended his campaign and is offering his endorsement to Trump. He frustrated environmentalists and embarrassed his family. This parting shot will hopefully be the end of it. CNN coverage.

And the Gizmodo take on it: With Trump Endorsement, RFK Jr. Is Officially a Loser and Completely Full of Sh*t
As RFK's tortured political campaign came to an appropriately lame conclusion, Kennedy revealed himself to be a total phony.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: gillymor
Date: 23 Aug 24 - 03:45 PM

Trump and other lowlife Republicans get schooled by VP Harris' charming grand nieces-
Comma la

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: gillymor
Date: 23 Aug 24 - 10:44 AM

A particularly poignant moment at the DNC last night was the appearance of the The Central Park Five.
This was one of the most heinous chapters of Trump's miserable existence. It was probably when I first took notice of this racist monster.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 23 Aug 24 - 10:29 AM

Bill D, possibly the topic of another thread - but there is quite a family power struggle going on now amongst the Murdoch clan and who should run that media empire.

When I open Instagram on my phone these days it is about 90% political ads. I joined it originally to share non-political photos of the yard, garden, dogs, interesting local topics. I'm guessing some of that is still buried in there but the algorithms are working against me now. Most of the texts that arrive via phone are either scammers wanting to buy my house or are political volunteers wanting my money or to join their particular branch of the cause. Since they are unsolicited, they are a sent "Stop" and blocked. I participated in a prank against Trump a few years ago (when a Tik Tok group booked all of the seats at a New England event so that when they actually got there the place would be empty.) That unfortunately put me on a few GOP call lists, but they've thinned out considerably.

Lots of stuff comes via email (I have a folder and have set rules for those so they all go to one place where I usually never look at them). Organizations send stuff via the postal mail, some of them quite interesting.

In the next 74 days I imagine we will face an avalanche of communications. The money we donate is part of why that is possible. It is time for the Citizens United horrible decision from the Supreme Court to be overturned (via good legislation), to have the new voting rights act passed, and get a lot of this money out of politics.

Pardon me, I need to go order my Harris/Walz yard sign and t-shirt.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Bill D
Date: 23 Aug 24 - 08:28 AM

Ever curious, I would briefly change the channel on my TV to the Fox News site to see what they were doing.
It is interesting that they felt compelled to carry most of the DNC prime time stuff.... except when the speaker was particularly critical of Republicans in general and The Donald in particular. Still, this is the most I have ever seen of FOX actually broadcasting Democratic speakers extolling the virtues of Harris and comparing her to the alternative!
   Then, at the very end, after the balloons fell, the had Trump himself on by phone, repeating his usual diatribes about crowd size and lies about what he claims Kamala will do. The Fox hosts were visibly uncomfortable with his stream of BS and finally had to cut away for a commercial.
   I doubt that die-hard Fox viewers have ever heard more reasons to reconsider their vote.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 23 Aug 24 - 05:54 AM

Aaah, nice! Real people who are real patriots, trying to do the best for their country.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Neil D
Date: 23 Aug 24 - 05:47 AM

Helen, I don't know about " deep down in the bowels of the true Republican party", but there certainly are Republicans who can't wait to see the arse end of the monstrosity that has polluted our political landscape far too long. The Lincoln Project, Kelly Conway's ex and Lt. Gov. Geoff Duncan who spoke at the Dem's convention, saying ""If Republicans are being intellectually honest with ourselves, our party is not civil or conservative. It's chaotic and crazy. And the only thing left to do is dump Trump," Duncan said. "These days, our party acts more like a cult, a cult worshiping a felonous thug."

He said he was supporting Harris and stared into the camera to speak to his "Republican friends at home watching."

"If you vote for Kamala Harris in 2024 you're not a Democrat, you're a patriot," said Duncan, prompting chants of "USA! USA.!"

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 23 Aug 24 - 04:19 AM

Neil D, you said "Why they continue to treat him like some kind of godking is baffling to me."

I wonder if deep down in the bowels of the true Republican party - not the "reality" TV star hype party - that they are hoping Trump will shoot himself in the foot and lose the election big-time. One of the analytical news shows I saw this week posed the possibility that an important chunk of the Republican party may be prepared to lose this election so that they can get rid of Trump once and for all.

Also you said, "Well none weirder that Elon who destroyed 500,000 trees to build a factory and named his baby 'X Æ A-Xii'.

"I'm not sure which is the greater sin."

Personally, I think that a person who exposes his baby to a lifetime of ridicule and bullying is not a real person at all. For me, that is the greater sin. I'm placing a bet that his son and any of his other children with oddball names might change their names when they come of age.

Elon Musk’s 12 children in chronological order

And if Trump can't see how bad his decision is to be endorsed by Musk, maybe his political brand is on a downward slide.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 Aug 24 - 04:01 AM

Just seeing snippets about the Trump crowd mocking Tim Walz's son but not seen anything concrete. If it is true they should be ashamed of themselves.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Neil D
Date: 23 Aug 24 - 03:50 AM

Helen, I've never understood why businesspersons with a product to sell, would make any kind of political statement. What kind of math is telling them that when they alienate one half of the political spectrum, they can sell twice as many units to the other half. That being said, it seems that hitching your wagon to Trump is especially treacherous. Look what has become of Rudy and the pillow guy and a number of lawyers and employees who've been crushed under the wheels of the Trump bus.
In the same way, look at the negative impact he's had on the Republican party. They have now lost three straight elections, two midterms and the presidency, while allowing Trump to move the party further and further away from the mainstream, making it more difficult to win elections. Why they continue to treat him like some kind of godking is baffling to me.
And in regards to Musk, he is having issues with advertisers as well as consumers, suing them for not advertising on Twitter:
In November 2023, about a year after Musk bought the company, a number of advertisers began fleeing X over concerns about their ads showing up next to pro-Nazi content and hate speech on the site in general, with Musk inflaming tensions with his own posts endorsing an antisemitic conspiracy theory.

Musk later said those fleeing advertisers were engaging in “blackmail” and, using a profanity, essentially told them to go away.

But after they did go away, he is now suing them for going away.
Democrats in this cycle have done a brilliant job of tagging Repubs with the adjective "weird". Well none weirder that Elon who destroyed 500,000 trees to build a factory and named his baby "“X Æ A-Xii”.
I'm not sure which is the greater sin.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 23 Aug 24 - 02:22 AM

Harris and Walz are impressive. Fingers crossed for them. But there are many voters who are not politically well-educated, who feel badly done-by, and who fall for the tRump man-baby bluster. Let’s hope they are significantly outnumbered by those who wish for a Presidential team who are intelligent, well-educated, mature adults with the best interests of the US as a whole taking precedence over their own personal interests.

I like Biden a lot, I like Harris/Walz even more. Once again, fingers crossed.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 22 Aug 24 - 11:55 PM

The Democratic National Convention for 2024 is done and dusted. That was a spectacular retrospective speech by Kamala, in which she drew the distinction between the Democratic party and the party of Trump while she introduced a lot of Americans to who she is. During the week they made the case for Harris/Walz so thoroughly and through so many diverse voices that Trump is a no-go for the US.

In so many words she made the case that she is already doing much of this work, what you see this evening is what a President Harris looks like.

We can all see that the only work Trump did or would do is on his own behalf. His campaign is deflating more every day.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 21 Aug 24 - 06:01 PM

The rest of the article mentions some other possible factors for the reduced number of Tesla EV cars being bought, including the fact that there are now more brands available than when the Tesla cars were originally introduced.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 21 Aug 24 - 05:06 PM

This is on-topic re Trump & Elon Musk:

Tesla's reputation in Australia is tanking, with sales down and some buyers turned off by Elon Musk

"In short: Data provided exclusively to the ABC shows Tesla's "brand health" in Australia has steadily worsened over the past two years and is now in negative territory.

"EV groups say Tesla CEO Elon Musk has alienated potential buyers with his inflammatory rhetoric and support for known climate denier Donald Trump.


"What's next? The EV-buying demographic is shifting from early adopters who are generally loyal to Tesla to a broader segment who can access a wider range of non-Tesla models.

"On the face of it, Charlie Bell seems like an ideal Tesla customer.

The retired forestry researcher on NSW's south coast is preparing to buy his first electric vehicle (EV), having already installed rooftop solar and a home battery.

"I've always been a bit of a greenie," he says.

"He likes Teslas, Australia's most popular EV brand, but he's adamant he'll never buy one.

"The reason is simple: Elon Musk.

"The very rich, extremely online CEO of Tesla has alienated Mr Bell with, among other things, his "inane" public comments and endorsement of Donald Trump's run for the US presidency.

"And, according to new data, many other Australians feel the same.

YouGov, a market research company, has observed a sharp fall in the public's assessment of the Tesla brand since Mr Musk bought Twitter (now X) in November 2022."

[There is a graph just below that paragraph which shows the marked fall in popularity of Tesla vehicle in relation to significant points in Musk's public life.]

.....

"It's been a steep fall from grace for Tesla. Just two years ago, it was one of the few suppliers of EVs to Australia and held up as a clean energy pioneer, a model for a greener, car-driving future.

"Mr Musk was its erratic mastermind, known for stunts like launching a Tesla Roadster into space in 2018, or wading into South Australia's energy debate with a Big Battery solution.

"A turning point came in late 2022 when the multi-billionaire bought X and overhauled its moderation policies, allowing climate misinformation, conspiracy theories and far-right hate speech to proliferate.

"Over time, he became increasingly outspoken about his right-wing political views.

"In recent months, the self-described "free speech absolutist" has been accused of using X as a megaphone to amplify anti-immigration sentiment, including fuelling unrest during the UK's recent riots.

"Last week he hosted Donald Trump on X in a much-hyped interview where both men said there was no urgent need to cut carbon emissions, and Mr Trump called for more fossil fuel production."

...

Another section of the article describes a similar downturn in the U.S.

"US Democrats turn away from Tesla as California sales plummet"

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 21 Aug 24 - 11:36 AM

The fact that two large sports arenas were packed to the rafters last night as the DNC met in Chicago still and Harris/Walz had an event in Wisconsin (at the place where the GOP convention was held last month). Last night Trump addressed a group at the Livingston County Sheriff's Office facility in Howell, Michigan.

Although access to the event venue — a warehouse-like facility operated by the sheriff’s office — was limited to a few dozen supporters, dozens more Trump followers made sure to show up in the surrounding neighborhood.

The difference in crowd size (that Barack Obama rightly gave a nod to as one of Trump's major interests) was significant.

Here is a bit of history from Heather Cox Richardson's "Letters From An American" newsletter today, giving context to what is going on in current US politics:

Obama emphasized Americans’ shared values and pushed back against “those who are preparing to divide us, the spin masters and negative ad peddlers who embrace the politics of anything goes.” He reached back into history to prove that “the bedrock of this nation” is “the belief that there are better days ahead.” He called that belief “[t]he audacity of hope.”

Almost exactly twenty years after his 2004 speech, the same man, now a former president who served for eight years, spoke at tonight’s Democratic National Convention. But the past two decades have challenged his vision.

When voters put Obama into the White House in 2008, Republicans set out to make sure they couldn’t govern. Mitch McConnell (R–KY) became Senate minority leader in 2007 and, using the filibuster, stopped most Democratic measures by requiring 60 votes to move anything to a vote.

In 2010 the Supreme Court handed down the Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission decision, declaring that corporations and other outside groups could spend as much money as they wanted on elections. Citizens United increased Republican seats in legislative bodies, and in the 2010 midterm elections, Republicans packed state legislatures with their own candidates in time to be in charge of redistricting their states after the 2010 census. Republicans controlled the key states of Florida, Wisconsin, North Carolina, Ohio, and Michigan, as well as other, smaller states, and after the election, they used precise computer models to win previously Democratic House seats.

In the 2012 election, Democrats won the White House decisively, the Senate easily, and a majority of 1.4 million votes for House candidates. Yet Republicans came away with a thirty-three-seat majority in the House of Representatives. And then, with the 2013 Shelby County v. Holder decision, the Supreme Court gutted the Voting Rights Act, making it harder to protect Democratic voters.

As the Republicans skewed the mechanics of government to favor themselves, their candidates no longer had to worry they would lose general elections but did have to worry about losing primaries to more extreme challengers. So they swung farther and farther to the right, demonizing the Democrats until finally those who remain Republicans have given up on democracy altogether.

Michelle Obama made it clear that we see what the GOP is trying to do and need to work to fix things.

And then Mrs. Obama took up the mantle of her mother, warning that demonizing others and taking away their rights, “only makes us small.” It “demeans and cheapens our politics. It only serves to further discourage good, big-hearted people from wanting to get involved at all. America, our parents taught us better than that.”

It is “up to us to be the solution that we seek.” she said. She urged people to “be the antidote to the darkness and division.” “[W]hether you’re Democrat, Republican, Independent, or none of the above,” she said, “this is our time to stand up for what we know. In our hearts is right. Not just for our basic freedoms, but for decency and humanity, for basic respect. Dignity and empathy. For the values at the very foundation of this democracy.”

“Don’t just sit around and complain. Do something.”

Between the two of them they washed the floor with Trump and his ilk. Getting a good turnout is essential to fixing some of this stuff because the GOP purging voter rolls, the gerrymandering, and the stuffing of courts is going to make it harder as time passes.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Neil D
Date: 21 Aug 24 - 09:46 AM

Sandman, for the record, I don't think he can take over the country and yes, he is deluded. He thinks he can get elected and then use artificial crises (I previously mentioned the Reichstag fire) to suspend future elections. Of course that could only work if he had the full support of the military and I doubt that will happen. But this al hinges on him getting elected so let's not let that happen.
Oh and Sandman, now that I've engaged with you I feel the need for a nap.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: gillymor
Date: 21 Aug 24 - 09:44 AM

Prez Obama is still the coolest guy in the room, with the possible exception of Michelle. They both gave dynamite speeches last night. The Second Gentleman, Doug Emhoff also came a across with a glowing, heartfelt tribute to his wife. What a contrast with Trump's situation.

Obama takes the measure of Trump

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: The Sandman
Date: 21 Aug 24 - 04:56 AM

I believe that Trump actually thinks he can take over the country as dictator." quote NEILD.
IF Trump thinks that he is Deluded.
I think Trump believes the Hitler quote" credibility does not matter, the victor will not be asked if he told the truth"

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 21 Aug 24 - 12:42 AM

The Obamas gave excellent speeches, and among the points were Michelle saying to use your common sense - if your candidate isn't exactly perfect but you understand how important this election is because of who else is running, grow a set of ovaries and vote for your candidate (my words, not hers - and really, who decided balls are tough? To paraphrase Sarah Silverman, they're incredibly fussy and delicate.)

Obama touched on Trump's constant complaints "ever since he rode that golden elevator" into the first campaign. To have thoughtful and lucid people on stage all week it puts Trump in a bad light. Someone asked in one of the MSNBC social media posts if his team "tranqed" Trump to keep him quiet today.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 20 Aug 24 - 07:14 PM

Stephanie Grisham, former Trump Press Secretary and the first of his folks to resign on Jan. 6, just spoke. "He mocked his supporters as basement dwellers" - or something along those lines.

I would love to hear Cassidy Hutchinson discuss his throwing plates at the wall followed by streaks of catsup being washed off by the White House staff, but that's probably more information than we need at the convention.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: gillymor
Date: 20 Aug 24 - 06:12 PM

Right, Bill, but I don't think we could risk another debate performance like the one that did him in. The stakes are too high. Us seniors have good days and bad days.
I didn't watch the doin's last night but I watched the highlights on Morning Joe and apparently President Biden gave a powerful and gracious speech and one line that stood out for me, among many, is “Now, the murder rate is falling faster than at any time in history. Violent crime has dropped to the lowest level of more than 50 years. And crime will keep coming down when we put a prosecutor in the Oval Office instead of a convicted felon.”

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 20 Aug 24 - 05:23 PM

Yes, watching Pres Biden's face in his speech, the animation and positivity, the lack of stress and fatigue, I think a weight has been lifted from his shoulders. I think he probably felt obliged to fight against the imminent threat of Trump but the thought of that battle was draining his energy. Now that the battle is in Kamala Harris's hands with Tim Walz at her side, I think Biden can throw his considerable support behind them with more strength and cautious optimism.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 20 Aug 24 - 04:49 PM

I had that same thought. I suspect with the current configuration the coattails will do more heavy lifting.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Bill D
Date: 20 Aug 24 - 02:21 PM

The speech made me wonder:
What if Biden had been in that good form for the debate?

He might still be the nominee. Whether that would have been better or worse is a matter of speculation. However, it worked out that the Democratic party has come together with enthusiasm like I've seldom seen, not even with Obama. Couple it with the Republicans in their strategy of 'blindfolded circular firing squad', and the outlooks promising. If the down-ballot races also get similar results, Kamala might be able to really roll!

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 20 Aug 24 - 12:08 PM

There are some recent political and social movements that contributed to the events of this week. The #MeToo movement spoke out loud and brought a lot of serial preditors down (it snagged a few Good ol' boys also, and most of them are still ok - there was some discernment that happened as that movement grew). The MeToo movement is what snagged Donald Trump (it generated a new law in NY State that allowed the decades old case by E. Jean Carroll to go forward.) George Floyd was murdered on video and his murderers were charged and convicted. That happened under Trump's watch and he wanted the National Guard to shoot protesters in the legs. And Roe V. Wade was overturned, thanks to Trump and McConnell. At this point in time you have angry women fully engaged and many men who are their allies, and the families and friends of dead Black men and women feeling some effect of a shift in the treatment of cops who kill (still way too often and with impunity). The goal is to get cops to stop killing unarmed civilians; if they keep it up, the goal is to imprison them for the crime they commit. The ultimate goal is to keep people out of prison in the first place and keep them from returning if imprisonment happens. Kamala was working on a plan like this as the Attorney General in California.

Last night was about the entire population; it wasn't another convention featuring White men's view of the political landscape as it has always gone before. Obama was an asterisk there, but still a man. Now, women are front and center, talking about women's issues as human issues (as Hillary said when she was first lady: "human rights are women's rights and women's rights are human rights") now on full display at the convention and have a strong voice.

It was a barn-burner of a speech by Biden; the fact that several people shed tears last night was a good thing. Crockett's story about Harris, who she had never met, taking a look at her and asking "what's wrong?" went a long way to show Harris' ability to build people up and send them forward stronger. There is nothing in the Trump DNA that could ever build up anyone except his children and his personal bank account. And even then, some of his children are more equal in his eyes than others.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 20 Aug 24 - 04:28 AM

Article in The Register:

OpenAI kills Iranian accounts using ChatGPT to write US election disinfo

[....] Despite being posted on several websites, however, the influence operation "does not appear to have achieved meaningful audience engagement," according to a Friday alert.

The first comment on the article suggests why:

The problem any AI is going to have spreading disinformation in the US election is that they will be competing with Musk and Trump

In fact it maybe an useful test of sentience when the LLM just returns "bugger this, you lot are just too crazy, I'm going back to creating 12 fingered porn pics"

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 20 Aug 24 - 02:32 AM

Cheers to that, Neil D!

I saw the last bit of his speech and I had tears and it's not even my country. His achievements should be celebrated.

I think there is definitely a glimmer of hope for the future now.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Neil D
Date: 20 Aug 24 - 02:13 AM

God how I love that man.
I just watched President Biden's speech at the Democratic convention and I'm still in tears, from watching the farewell of the greatest president in my lifetime. (I go back to JFK) Ignore the GOP propaganda. This country is SO much better off than the horror show of 4 years ago. From record high unemployment to record low unemployment. From a democratic republic on the verge of implosion to a more secure democracy. And after a really long tough battle against inflation, caused mostly by Trump's bungled COVID response, it has been flattened out and is beginning to roll back. Infrastructure is being repaired, maintained and built. On the world stage he has repaired the damage done to our relationship with our allies by Trump. He has bolstered NATO and seen it expand. His leadership is the main reason that an independent Ukraine still exists.
After four years of achievement this remarkable man, because of some perceived loss of cognitive ability (I would point out that he just spoke for over an hour without a teleprompter), stepped aside for the good of the country. I would rank this sacrifice with Washington refusing the crown and stepping down after two terms.
Joe Biden is the great statesman that Trump can never be;
The world leader that Trump can never be;
The empathetic communicator that Trump can never be;
The faithful husband (50 years with Jill) that Trump (3 wives and countless concubines) can never be:
The decent human that Trump can never be.
His like shall never pass our way again.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 20 Aug 24 - 02:05 AM

A crap-free Trump - now that is a worthy goal to aim for! :-D

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 20 Aug 24 - 01:30 AM

Good speeches tonight. Probably scared the crap out of Trump.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 19 Aug 24 - 08:27 PM

The store of intelligence in the Trump campaign and the GOP is bankrupt. Iraq trying to hack both campaigns is a puzzle, they're likely to get better treatment from the Democrats, to possibly try to restore the status as it was before Trump went into office.

The convention is firing up now, union speakers on stage and it'll lead up to people introducing Biden and in turn his speaking about a lot of things consequential to him as well as to supporting Harris. I expect this to be unlike any keynote speech than we've ever heard at one of these conventions. Twenty years ago it was young senator Barack Obama who gave the keynote speech at the 2004 convention in Boston, MA. That was the stepping off point for him; ears perked up and talk of a presidential run started at that moment. Tonight will offer the capstone of a 50-year career. An interesting contrast and quite the set of bookends for the Obama and Biden administrations.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 19 Aug 24 - 07:24 PM

US intelligence officials say Iran is to blame for hack of Donald Trump's presidential campaign

"The US intelligence community has said that Iran is to blame for the hack of Donald Trump's presidential campaign.

"The joint statement from the FBI and other federal agencies was the first formal attribution of the hack to a foreign entity, though the Trump campaign had previously said Iran was responsible.

"They said Iran perceived this year's presidential election to be particularly consequential and was determined through the hacking operation and other activities to interfere in American politics and 'to stoke discord and undermine confidence in our democratic institutions'."

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 19 Aug 24 - 12:22 PM

Choices, choices . . . where to share this. Here or in the Trump trials thread.

Prosecutors defer to judge on Trump sentencing delay in hush money case
Trump’s lawyers argue they won't have enough time to properly pursue an appeal before his sentencing if the judge rejects Trump’s motion to dismiss the verdict.

This is all about the election, but it is also all about his criminal case - he hopes if he wins he can defer anything Merchan might impose on him.

It seems all the more critical that Trump receive a sentence. In a simple sense of fair play - for example - if former stockbroker Martha Stewart (I say that to show the magazine magnate knew better) had to do real prison time for erasing an inappropriate stock move, Trump needs to do real time for his crap.

The DA will defer to the judge. Puts a lot more pressure on the judge, but I hope he's up to it.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Bill D
Date: 18 Aug 24 - 05:25 PM

Well, for amusement read this article about D.T's appearance in Bloom County... with cartoons.
Cat with Trump's brain

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 18 Aug 24 - 05:00 PM

Yes, I was fairly sure that there is a US show related to 60 Minutes. I watch it very rarely, unless I see that something interesting is coming up. It seems to be balanced reporting, I think.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 18 Aug 24 - 04:22 PM

We have a similar 60 Minutes that has been around for decades. And when Mary Trump wrote her first book about Donald she discussed the family history and what happened to her nephew, that the Donald and his sibs decided to stop paying the insurance for the family, for all of the worse reasons.

I mentioned before, there is typically a quiet period in the campaigning when each of the parties holds their convention. Something tells me that won't be the case this week, Trump hates for the attention to be turned away from him.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 18 Aug 24 - 03:51 PM

I watched an interview on an Oz TV show called 60 Minutes last night about this:

Donald Trump's Nephew Fred C. Trump III Set to Release Tell-All Memoir About Trump Family

Like his sister Mary, Fred Trump is now publicly speaking out about his uncle Donald Trump and also campaigning for disability rights because his son was born with epilepsy and has disabilities as a consequence.

Fred Trump said that Donald Trump told him to let his son die. If you thought you had heard the worst from Donald Trump before this, this one takes it to a new, even worse level.