BS: American Presidential race 2024

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 18 Aug 24 - 05:00 AM

one of the best sources of Trump cartoons is Gary Trudeau's Doonesbury - he has compiled 4 volumes of his cartoons, & a 5th is planned!

I first discovered his cartoons in the 80s when one of our papers ran them, & I've bought several of his books over the decades, including the first volume -

30 Years of Doonesbury on Trump, New York Times Bestseller
He tried to warn us. Ever since the release of the first Trump-for-President trial balloon in 1987, Doonesbury's Garry Trudeau has tirelessly tracked and highlighted the unsavory career of the most unqualified candidate to ever aspire to the White House. It's all there--the hilarious narcissism, the schoolyard bullying, the loathsome misogyny, the breathtaking ignorance; and a good portion of the Doonesbury cast has been tangled up in it. Join Duke, Honey, Earl, J.J., Mike, Mark, Roland, Boopsie, B.D., Sal, Alice, Elmont, Sid, Zonker, Sam, Bernie, Rev. Sloan, and even the Red Rascal as they cross storylines with the big, orange airhorn who's giving the GOP such fits.

Garry Trudeau is the "sleazeball" "third-rate talent" who draws the "overrated" comic strip Doonesbury, which "very few people read." He lives in New York City with his wife Jane Pauley, who "has far more talent than he has." (quotes from guess who!)

the strip - note only the Sunday strips are current, all other dates are archival

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: The Sandman
Date: 18 Aug 24 - 03:39 AM

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cgl2xjxlz3xo Source BBC

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 17 Aug 24 - 11:45 PM

My Hubby sent me this cartoon:

Trump is still obsessed with the size of his crowds | Sheneman

I went searching for it with no luck but he then sent me the link.

While searching I also found this one:

COVID crowds

Take us back four years and every second member of the crowd is a COVID virus.

There were a lot more Trump cartoons out there if you are looking for some light relief.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 17 Aug 24 - 09:56 PM

That Chester Arthur book is a another work of fiction - I've never heard of Wiegand, and the blurb sounds rather improbable. Sinclair Lewis was a really gifted writer and that makes a difference, he studied human nature. And I must agree with you, your descriptions do exhibit a jaundiced view of the party. Sorry about that.

We'll see if there are previews of the Democratic Convention week to come on Sunday.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: robomatic
Date: 17 Aug 24 - 07:50 PM

Aside from missing WWDTM today because we had a fantastic Summer day and I was pulling weeds (that are also trees) at a park across town, I have a more jaundiced view of the Dems. I'd heard the Hilary's husband story. But I also remember Bill's endorsement for her during the 2016 convention which I thought was so self serving it buried the lead. Other than a few of those kinds of stories I kind of like that folks like Harry Reid, Barney Frank, Maxine Waters, and others kind of outrage the opposition. Al Sharpton is a long time guttersnipe, but he is in the American guttersnipe tradition. You have to deal with 'em as you find 'em. And another interesting book that interprets some of these folks would be Tom Wolfe's very excellent and discomforting "Bonfire of the Vanities." He had an Al Sharpton character in there.
Anotther book that is even less relevant to our politics of the day but is sort of relevant to the politics it came from is "The Chester A. Arthur Conspiracy." The premise to that one is too wild to mention here, it is Americn political fiction but it does purport to bring to life some unsavory American politicians who really lived and breathed.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 17 Aug 24 - 06:56 PM

Robo, I'm aware of the works you mention, they touch on the megalomania of the personality in the GOP, but the Lewis novel is disturbing in how complex the dystopian world he created and how it evolves. Good thing there wasn't WiFi or smart phones back then or keeping under the radar would have been much more difficult.

I heard a lovely story this morning from Faith Salie on Wait Wait Don't Tell Me; her then nine-year-old daughter saw a photo that her grandmother had taken with Bill Clinton. When Faith told the daughter who was in the photo, she answered "you mean Hillary's husband?" Hillary was a guest on the radio show today, and Faith said she originally told that story to Bill when she met him recently, and he thought it was funny (hard on the ego, but we're talking about a nine-year-old, not born when he was pres.) Hillary thought it was great!

Meanwhile, here in the US we're looking ahead to next week's Democratic National Convention. From Politico: Behind the Scenes at the DNC: Controlled Chaos and ‘Death Stares’
We helped run the podium at past conventions. Here’s what the Harris-Walz team is facing. It ain’t always pretty.

Trump thinks Monday night's speech is a bad gig for Biden; Trump isn't the best judge of what is good for the Democratic party, so we'll just pass on his observations. He'll probably spew his vitriol from the cheap seats on Truth Social or X all week.

An interesting paragraph in that Politico story:

For all but a small handful of speakers, we treat this as the “wedding guest” rule; it ain’t about you. You have to say what the candidate wants. This is not an easy message to deliver to a senator or House member. We still have nightmares about Harry Reid’s death stares, Maxine Waters’ death threats and one governor who told us to “stop busting his balls.” We’ve had to have uncomfortable conversations, like when we had to tell former Rep. Barney Frank in 2012 that because of his pronunciation challenges, his speech comparing “Mitt Romney” to the “myth of Romney” all sounded like “Miff Romney.” Or when we told a twentysomething actress that, as adamant as she was, her friends from her struggling days surely didn’t depend on Medicare; she probably meant Medicaid.

Do people go rogue? They have. In 2004, Al Sharpton couldn’t have been more agreeable — submitted a draft, rehearsed it, and then got up on stage and pulled an entirely different speech out of his pocket.

It promises to be interesting. I won't watch much of it, except for some of the evening ("Prime Time") activities.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: robomatic
Date: 17 Aug 24 - 01:14 PM

Charmion: I want to thank you for your Canada info. I've driven across and through Canada and fallen in love with many parts of it and have a prejudice in favor of Canadians for more than one reason. I don't think it'll ever make me root for the Bluejays but stranger things have happened. I WILL sing OH CANADA will full throated ferver.
Backwoodsman: Methinks though dost protest too much. TRMP is a very bad sign of the times, but it isn't all him nor only him. He is a product of America, and thus ourselves. Not waxing poetic, here. One finger points, the rest point back.
SRS: Haven't read Sinclair Lewis, and while his effort was decidedly poetic and prophetic, there are many such signs: There's A Face in the Crowd There's the line in "I Claudius" the BBC production where a historian tells Macro that his dictatorship is a sign that man should never have lost his sense of smell, there's the somewhat prophetic movie: "The Manchurian Candidate" with actor James Gregory as a standin for Joe McCarthy pounding his ketchup bottle at home, and then announcing in the Senate that there are '57' Communist infiltrators in American government.

We carry our gravedigger's worms in ourselves. They are always there, ready to feast on a self destructive society and they furnish an argument for diversity, tolerance, and nonviolence.

Having said all the above, I personally have had a lower opinion of the Trumplicans than ever of any American party in my lifetime. I used to say simply that Republicans are evil and Democrats are cowards, and the American people will go for evil over cowardice in an election. I think the Reps cornered the market on both of those commodities, while the Democrats kind of lost themselves in terminal 'improvement' of the human condition which scared the rest of us, many into the Rep refuge.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Charmion's brother Andrew
Date: 17 Aug 24 - 11:50 AM

Stilly, to refine Charmion's point, in this 44th Parliament, the two more "progressive" parties have entered into a "supply and confidence agreement" to manage the risk that the government might fall at a less than propitious moment, i.e. one that neither party chose and that gives an advantage to the Conservative opposition. "Supply" refers to the government's taxing and spending plan and involves three votes understood to be confidence motion in each year in Parliament.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 16 Aug 24 - 06:49 PM

Robomatic, have you or anyone else here read Sinclair Lewis' It Can't Happen Here? It's prescient; Senator Berzelius "Buzz" Windrip is a populist running for president and is classic Trump in that he's a buffoon out there blowing his own horn but is actually a tool of the folks in the background (in Trump's case, the Heritage foundation, but in the past, McConnell who wanted to put all of his judges in place). We live in a dystopian time, and that novel from 1935 shows that Lewis was watching his current events (listen to some of Rachel Maddow's podcasts about politicians of that era) and coming up with a scenario that is darned close to happening.

Of course the Trump sycophants in the US House are trying to flex some muscle - I see today a story that the House Oversight Committee (in the GOP-led House) are opening an investigation into Walz. Never mind there is nothing to investigate. The example of bad governance demonstrated by the MAGA Republicans will be used in cautionary tales in the future. House Republicans target Tim Walz in new probe

The things they bring to light as they try to make him look bad only make him look better. I don't remember hearing that he spent a year teaching in China after graduating from college, but that gives him more on-the-ground foreign policy background, IMHO.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 16 Aug 24 - 03:12 PM

”Getting back to TRMP I feel there has been a lowering of the bar of quality for behaviour on all fronts. He has, IMHO, a marvelous ability to corrupt, and then justify corruption not only for himself but for others whether in support or opposition.”

I agree, but I don’t believe there is anything ‘marvellous’ about his ‘ability to corrupt, and then justify…etc’. In fact, it is appalling and revolting, like everything else about him. An appalling, revolting, pus-filled sore on the face of the US in particular, and the world in general.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: robomatic
Date: 16 Aug 24 - 02:24 PM

Well, there's the issue of TRMP as a symptom of flagging Democracy, democratic/republican values, and character issues in general.
There is an issue as large as any over the impact of the internet.
There are major consequences on actions of the LEFT as well as the RIGHT.

Getting back to TRMP I feel there has been a lowering of the bar of quality for behaviour on all fronts. He has, IMHO, a marvelous ability to corrupt, and then justify corruption not only for himself but for others whether in support or opposition.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 16 Aug 24 - 01:22 PM

I don't remember everything, but there were bacon and sausage and eggs and other things things that should be refrigerated. I picked up "wilting" from Alex Wagner who used it to sum up the spoiled-on-a-hot-day state of a fair amount of it.

AP has a story, click through the photos.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 16 Aug 24 - 12:43 PM

> a lot of groceries sat wilting on a table behind him

Did this include a lettuce :-) ?

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 16 Aug 24 - 12:26 PM

If you can get Instagram here is a several minutes (20?) of Heather Cox Richardson talking with Joanne Freeman, both historians, wondering if there has ever been a case in history of a more unhinged candidate than Trump? And bemoaning (correctly) that the modern media has normalized his behavior, they don't treat it independently as a crisis of its own. (Except Lawrence O'Donnell, who really ripped into all of the media outlets, including his own, for giving Trump "equal time" for a rambling "press conference"). And Trump's done more of them lately, like the other day when a lot of groceries sat wilting on a table behind him. Why? And I hope they throw out all of that meat and spoiled stuff.


https://www.instagram.com/reel/C-tX5Fvs4cR/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: gillymor
Date: 16 Aug 24 - 11:31 AM

"What did you think I was talking about? :-D"

I don't want to know, Dave. I'm of the "don't ask and don't tell" mindset. :)

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Charmion
Date: 16 Aug 24 - 10:56 AM

Yes, Stilly, Canada has been known to go in for coalition and "unity" governments in times of crisis -- both world wars -- and when the governing party is in the minority, as now. The Liberals are in formal cahoots with the New Democratic Party to overcome the minority position with which they emerged from the last federal election.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 15 Aug 24 - 05:05 PM

Most of my sources have a paywall, but CNN has the story also: RFK Jr. reached out to Harris campaign about administration role in exchange for endorsement

From the New York Times the subhead is "Robert F. Kennedy Jr. was unsuccessful with his request to discuss endorsing the Democratic nominee in exchange for a top administration job, according to two people briefed on the outreach."

The Washington Post article subhead reads "Harris has rebuffed the offer of an endorsement, while Kennedy also has had conversations with Republican nominee Donald Trump about a role in his administration."

CNN has this gem in its article:

Kennedy campaign spokesperson Stefanie Spear said in a statement to CNN that Kennedy “is willing to meet with leaders of both parties to discuss the possibility of a unity government.”

A unity government? Like the strange bedfellows that coalesce to hold power in places like Israel? Is that what the UK does? Canada?

“No one has any intention of negotiating with a MAGA-funded fringe candidate who has sought out a job with Donald Trump in exchange for an endorsement,” DNC spokesperson Matt Corridoni said Wednesday in a statement to CNN.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Aug 24 - 05:04 PM

gillymor - Trump obviously thinks that size IS important and is trying to make up for the lack of it on other quarters.

I am referring to his hands of course - What did you think I was talking about? :-D

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 15 Aug 24 - 04:18 PM

Today Biden and Harris made a victory lap visit in Prince George's County, Maryland, with the release of the news about those drug negotiations.

Biden, Harris greeted by chants of 'Thank you, Joe' at 1st joint event since he exited race

The 2022 Inflation Reduction Act allows the government to directly broker with drug manufacturers for the first time in the history of the Medicare program. In addition to the 10 drugs negotiated for 2026, the government can select 15 more drugs for negotiation in 2027 and another 15 drugs for 2028 and up to 20 more drugs each year after.

Biden remarked they were "just getting started" and that he and Harris "are going to keep standing up to Big Pharma."

We'll have to see if the discussion of the expenses of Big Pharma come up following this announcement (I had a PM suggesting how an accountant could make all of the advertising costs go away; I would argue that it is a simple matter of "dollars in, dollars out." It's probably mutable in the hands of accountants, but I'd still like to see the numbers.

Trump is trying to characterize the Harris campaign and prospective administration as catastrophic and has also been saying that Biden is angry with Harris, something that was disproved today.

The Republican party convention took care of business just before Biden stepped out of the race; they were unmolested by the Democrats. Let's see if Trump and company are equally courteous next week.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: gillymor
Date: 15 Aug 24 - 11:48 AM

And then we have her opponent who's main concern seems to be crowd size.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 15 Aug 24 - 11:43 AM

There is also news of a proposed ban from the Harris administration on "price gouging" in the food marketplace; people may have wondered if some price increases were legitimate as COVID ended, but the evidence is clear that costs haven't gone up for the corporations to the extent they are gouging consumers with both price increases and shrink-flation (making almost identical looking packaging but reducing the size and volume for the same or bit higher price.)

“There’s a big difference between fair pricing in competitive markets, and excessive prices unrelated to the costs of doing business,” the Harris campaign said in a statement. “Americans can see that difference in their grocery bills.”

The proposed ban is part of a broader economic policy platform that the Democratic presidential nominee plans to unveil Friday at a campaign rally in battleground North Carolina.

Harris will also pledge that if elected president, she will direct her administration to increase scrutiny of potential mergers between large supermarkets and food producers, “specifically for the risk that the proposed merger would raise grocery prices for consumers,” her campaign said.

This package of regulatory proposals is one of the Harris campaign’s earliest efforts to outline an economic platform that is independent of President Joe Biden’s agenda.

I have stated a number of times since all of the price raises and the CEO pay package increases following COVID that a windfall profit tax is again called for (that was used against the oil companies for gouging on gas prices in the 1970s). Do that concurrent with making them stop the price gouging. Trump gave the corporations and their CEOs carte blanche for their misbehavior after the big tax breaks he gave them. It's time to reel all of those rich folks back in: Harris to propose federal ban on ‘corporate price-gouging’ in food and groceries

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 15 Aug 24 - 11:28 AM

There is a fact sheet list released by the White House today that might be helpful to the Harris campaign - the first 10 negotiated prescription drug prices for Medicare recipients starting next year.

HHS has reached agreements with all participating manufacturers on new negotiated, lower drug prices for the first 10 drugs selected for the Medicare drug price negotiation program. After manufacturers have steadily increased the list prices of all 10 of these drugs since they went on the market, these new prices will cut the list price of these drugs between 38 and 79 percent.

The new prices will go into effect for people with Medicare Part D prescription drug coverage in 2026.

Follow the link to the list - they are very expensive. Years ago the US banned cigarette ads on the radio and TV but for some reason started allowing drug ads. Those advertising costs must be driving up the price of the medications, and it's one thing I'd like to see reformed in the next administration (and I reiterate, they have to let Elizabeth Warren implement some of the plans she has proposed for years.) The drugs on this list have names familiar to US residents who watch commercial TV (or streaming services that have now pushed ads into their programming).

Meanwhile, we're not here to discuss Dick's theories on irrelevant side topics. They will continue to be deleted because they are simply an attempt to broaden the political subject and hopefully start fights.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 15 Aug 24 - 10:12 AM

I did say "acceptable", Helen, not "universally accepted" :-) .

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 15 Aug 24 - 06:50 AM

But the scent of musk - you either love it or you hate it.

I developed the acronym COTUS, but I've been using the "centre of the universe" label for many years for a lot of people I have encountered IRL. In the context of the Presidential race, it is appropriate in a wicked way because of POTUS, SCOTUS, etc etc. :-D

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 15 Aug 24 - 06:16 AM

> COTUS

Nice one, Helen. Is that the new way to pronounce "trust fund child"?

.... I've just realised there's one critical difference between Trump and Musk: musk is an acceptable ingredient for scent.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 14 Aug 24 - 03:41 PM

That is good news! :-D

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 14 Aug 24 - 02:55 PM

Elon is from South Africa. Thank dawg no way as far as the presidency. That is the one office that to hold you must have been born as a US citizen. (Meaning, if your parents were American and you were born abroad, that's ok, but you can't be from someplace else and naturalized here, or else Arnold Schwarzenegger would have run.)

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 14 Aug 24 - 02:29 PM

My view on Elon Musk regarding Trump is that Elon aspires to everything Trump has "achieved" and it wouldn't surprise me if Elon took a tilt at the White House at some point in his life. He has all the same qualities as Trump: he's cringeworthy, he has COTUS (centre of the universe syndrome), he is creepy especially around women, he has fathered children with three women (so far), he is rich ... the list goes on and on.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Charmion
Date: 14 Aug 24 - 01:09 PM

Oh, Robomatic, among Canadian mayors Rob Ford was small time. Take a look at Camillien Houde, the Nazi-adjacent mayor of Montreal who spent the entire Second World War in prison for his fascist views. Then cast a glance at Maurice Duplessis, premier of Quebec who governed so harshly — and corruptly — that the Quiet Revolution was the obvious result.

But Trump could not get elected here. In Canadian federal politics, every single Member of Parliament, including Cabinet ministers and the Prime Minister, has to be selected by a riding association and win a constituency election. There’s no starting at the top. I don’t believe for a minute that Trump could pass the smell test administered by the local party faithful of a riding association. If a national party tried to parachute him into a riding, his record of bad-faith dealing in his various businesses would torpedo him. We’re petty like that.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 14 Aug 24 - 12:29 PM

The US elections are of great interest abroad, as demonstrated by Russian meddling in years past and reports of Iran trying it's hand at hacking this time around. Another dip into the Daily Beast reporting to learn that turnabout's fair play - apparently Roger Stone, a self-proclaimed master of dirty tricks on behalf of Trump was himself hacked.

The email account of longtime Donald Trump ally Roger Stone was breached as part of suspected hacking attempts from Iran targeting Trump’s campaign, according to reports.

The self-proclaimed GOP “agent provocateur”—whose dirty tricks can be traced back to the Nixon campaign—was duped by an espionage unit.

The hackers then used Stone’s account in an effort to get into another account belonging to a senior Trump campaign official, a source told CNN. That attempt was part of wider efforts to breach campaign networks which are now being investigated by the FBI.

The irony here is that

Stone was convicted of seven felony charges in November 2019, including for lying about his attempts to obtain information from WikiLeaks about Hillary Clinton’s emails stolen by Russian hackers and released on the eve of the 2016 election. Trump then pardoned Stone just before leaving the White House in 2020.

Read the rest at the link.

I'm more concerned about the Twitterverse than Iran at this point. Elon Musk is bonkers and the bots he allows on X are insidious. Another Trump event, this time an "interview" with Musk is setting up the site to explode with toxic Trump lies and overseas bots. And money for Trump.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: robomatic
Date: 14 Aug 24 - 11:58 AM

To the Tasty Canadians who think they could never be TRMPed:

Wasn't a Mayor of Toronto, Rob Ford, recorded in conversation while using Crack Cocaine? And didn't he continue in office after that tender moment?

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: gillymor
Date: 14 Aug 24 - 07:58 AM

While it's certainly a disgrace that a wealthy nation like the U.S. doesn't have National health care I will never speak ill of Obamacare. As Neil noted Prez Obama got what he could and fought hard to get it and I'm forever grateful. I had some serious health issues before I became eligible for Medicare and without the effective, affordable insurance I was able to get under the ACA I would have been up the creek.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 13 Aug 24 - 06:50 PM

Charmion, you might get some satisfaction from looking at Trump's face now because I think he looks worried. As the only reason I can see for him trying to be re-elected is to pardon himself from all convictions or re-work the Dept of Justice to his own ends, I think he has every reason to be fretting about the future.

He never smiled or laughed before but now he looks decidedly grim.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Charmion
Date: 13 Aug 24 - 04:45 PM

NeilD, I understand what you're telling me. That's a scenario that could literally never happen in the Canadian parliamentary system, where the Senate is primarily an advisory and review body. What the Commons wants badly enough the Commons gets, and the governing party (headed by the Prime Minister) drives the Commons.

Canada's public health system was carefully designed to cover hospital costs and physicians' services (the largest wallet-drainers in 1965, when the original legislation was enacted), leaving all other medical costs -- including stand-alone clinic services, home care, dentistry and drugs -- for the insurance industry to feast on. The doctors screamed bloody murder and even went out on strike (for a while), but the insurance industry smiled beatifically and accepted a deal that would benefit them as accepting "points" instead of a salary benefits the star of a hit movie.

As for Mr T, I'm well beyond saturation point. The very sound of his fatuous voice and the look of his smug face make me feel rather ill.

Mr Walz has the stage presence of a Broadway diva, and his track record in Minnesota looks impressive. Ms Harris's shoes make my feet hurt at long distance, but she knows how to work a crowd. And the pair of them are fun to watch -- a big advantage at this point.

I note that the Harris-Walz poll numbers have now surpassed those of The Other People by more than the margin of error.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 13 Aug 24 - 02:22 PM

That "news conference" was set up at his house in such a way that no one could hear the questions reporters asked so he said what he wanted and ignored the softball questions that were asked. It wasn't a real news conference.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 13 Aug 24 - 02:00 PM

> That trainwreck of the "news conference" by Trump
> didn't need to be dignified with full coverage.

*Disagree*. Had the channels edited it, either they would have made Tr*mp look good by straining out the blethers, or Tr*mp could have accused them of censorship. Quite likely both at once.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Neil D
Date: 13 Aug 24 - 01:23 PM

Charmion, you said " President Obama's obeisance to the insurance industry in the drafting of the Affordable Care Act amazed me then, and puzzles me to this day." Remember, presidents don't write bills, congress does. Presidents can state what they want and with a majority in both houses, which Democrats had at the time, he generally gets it. The problem was a handful of what was called Blue Dog Democrats. These were Democratic senators from red states (states that trend to vote Republican). The rationale is that if they seem to be too liberal it will be hard to get re-elected in those states. That was the excuse anyway but dig into it a bit and you will find that all of the so-called Blue Dogs had also taken at least a million dollars in contributions from insurance companies, large medical corporations and drug companies. It took nearly a year to hash out the Affordable Care Act and the infighting was between Democrats. The Repubs wanted no healthcare bill at all so they sat on the sidelines throwing brickbats. I remember a catch phrase from the moderates in the party that were becoming increasingly desperate to get a bill, any bill passed: Don't let the great get in the way of the good. We ended up with the mediocre.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 13 Aug 24 - 12:11 PM

The insurance industry was going to be cut out of the health care operation back when Hillary was the first lady with the assignment of working on a health plan during Bill's administration. The insurance companies jumped all over them, putting up horrible ads (and I think they started some of the "death panel" stuff around then.) They kept protesting that she wasn't elected co-president, or elected at all (as if cabinet members were elected?) Hillary had to back off, and I think the Obama folks took the message.

Until Citizens United is overturned and the huge dollars are removed from politics, we will be facing a glut of smear advertising from the industries whose oxen will be gored. Elizabeth Warren needs to make the case fast if there is a triple Democratic house, senate, and presidency. That and another of investment practices (stock buybacks) need to be illegal again so the big dollars don't go back so much to the CEOs and stockholders as huge dividends.

Dick has entered one of his manic phases where he is trying to destroy conversations and is starting nonsense threads all over. A toddler on a sugar high. It's this behavior that got him completely kicked out of Mudcat before and it can happen again. I refuse to read his PMs so this is the only place he's going to get that message. Stop the crap or you're completely out. Again. And maybe the person who let you back in last time will remember why we all thought you needed to go. Dick, your musical contributions aren't worth it when you make all of the trouble everywhere else.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Charmion
Date: 13 Aug 24 - 11:25 AM

Today, as usual, I feel like a chorister sitting through a sermon -- by which I mean that all the media sources I find most easily seem to echo my own knee-jerk opinions. There must be disinterested sources in English, but I have yet to find them, and the few "conservative" sources I know are offensive in so many ways that I don't want the various algorithms to associate them with me.

I have no vote, of course, being Canadian, but US politics affect us so profoundly that I can't look away without feeling foolish. Pierre Trudeau's metaphor of the mouse trying to sleep with the elephant was nothing but unvarnished truth, and our relationships are far more entangled now, more than 50 years on.

My natural inclination is to recoil from the current Republican program and candidates as I would from toxic sludge. But many centre-left US ideological shibboleths strike me as strange to ridiculous -- e.g., why the hell not socialized medicine? -- so the Democrats do things that I see as downright odd. Staying with health care, for example, President Obama's obeisance to the insurance industry in the drafting of the Affordable Care Act amazed me then, and puzzles me to this day.

I believe that Trump would be completely unelectable in Canada, but this country has repeatedly elected the likes of William "Bible Bill" Aberhardt and Maurice Duplessis, so I could be wrong. J.D. Vance has clear analogues on this side of the border, including Stephen Harper (no longer in politics, thank God) and going on with Pierre Poilievre, who gives me the creeps.

The constant crystal-gazing and sloganeering that passes for journalism these days just makes me tired.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 13 Aug 24 - 09:16 AM

I don’t believe SRS has ever claimed to be ‘impartial’. She’s not an idiot either.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: gillymor
Date: 13 Aug 24 - 07:15 AM

"______ you are not impartial, who wrote the biden harris record"

Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't you post both lists and didn't the person you accused of being partial post the remark "lists don't help."

Mind boggling.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: gillymor
Date: 12 Aug 24 - 11:51 AM

If Trump accomplished anything as president it is negated many times over by the many corrupt and criminal acts he perpetrated during his time in office and during his 2016 campaign. It's hard for me imagine that any rational and moral person would even consider voting for him.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 12 Aug 24 - 11:49 AM

Trump falsely claims Harris rally in Michigan had no crowd.

Trump is all about size - bigger, better, longer, taller, richer. And when it is not working in his favor, he lies about it.

‘Most progressive governor in the country’: Former governor on Walz - a former Minnesota governor (R) says Walz and Harris are most progressive folks out there, but as the interviewer points out, recent polls say otherwise. The whole goal is to define your own campaigns, not let the opposition define it for you.

Lists don't help.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: The Sandman
Date: 12 Aug 24 - 11:34 AM

https://www.whitehouse.gov/therecord/AND HERE IS THE BIDEN HARRIS RECORD

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 12 Aug 24 - 11:28 AM

Dick, that is an archival page WRITTEN BY TRUMP FOLKS, left behind and stored by archivists ONLY because it was a document written during the administration. It is less than meaningless. It's a list, and it's also inaccurate. Did you actually look at any of the things on it?

I thought not.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: The Sandman
Date: 12 Aug 24 - 10:53 AM

https://trumpwhitehouse.archives.gov/trump-administration-accomplishments/
I am not a trump or harris supporter, but these apprently were his achievements

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 12 Aug 24 - 05:05 AM

Perhaps (and this is just a wild guess on my part, and far from being an informed opinion) the 'reasonable and decent' arm of the GOP are coming to their senses and beginning to be ready to accept another term of Democrat Presidency in preference to the double-horror-story of Trump and Hillbilly Vance in the White House.

Maybe? Just maybe? Miracles have been known to happen...

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Helen
Date: 11 Aug 24 - 02:09 PM

The shoe is on the other foot, and I suspect there will be a lot more shoes, and he'll need a lot more feet before this is over. He is acting as the victim when he is targeted but he acts justified when he is the perpetrator.

JD Vance is not going to be happy either, having his dirty laundry aired in public. Also 270 pages of vulnerabilities identified, not by his opponents but by his own allies, that must be really galling.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 11 Aug 24 - 11:21 AM

Trump's campaign is complaining that they were hacked and are blaming the Iranians. Well, it wouldn't be Putin's Russia this time. Anyway, apparently stuff has been shared that the campaign was concealing. According to the Daily Beast it is Trump’s 270-Page Dossier of JD Vance’s ‘Vulnerabilities’ Hacked by Iran
The Trump campaign announced it had been hacked by “foreign sources” that leaked internal documents to news organizations. Iran is the prime suspect.

What you didn't hear this year was anyone in the Harris campaign challenging foreign actors to dig up stuff on the opposition. In 2016 Russia hacked the Clinton site right after Trump asked them to. The odd thing about the Trump claim appears in this tidbit:

The Trump campaign accused Iran of a hack-and-leak operation Saturday, after a 270-page dossier of JD Vance’s “vulnerabilities” was sent to at least two news organizations.

The internal campaign vetting report on Vance was sent to Politico and The Washington Post from an AOL.com email address, along with a document on Marco Rubio, the Florida senator who was not chosen as Donald Trump’s running mate.

Hours after Politico revealed it received the materials, the Trump campaign said it had been hacked, accusing Iran of the breach.

“The Iranians know that President Trump will stop their reign of terror just like he did in his first four years in the White House. Any media or news outlet reprinting documents or internal communications are doing the bidding of America’s enemies and doing exactly what they want,” Trump spokesman Steven Cheung told NBC News.

The irony is stunning, isn't it? Shoe is on the other foot now.

Trump stopped the nuclear treaty with Iran, something that John Kerry had worked long and hard to set up during the Obama administration. Trump set them up to expand their nuclear program now, resulting in sanctions against Iran in this administration for the behavior. Trump is not necessarily their friend, but I doubt he's going after them, either.

Regardless of that, it is out there after someone hacked it. A little more detail from the Daily Beast (not the best source, but not behind a paywall so most readers of this thread can go to the original link):

He went on: “On Friday, a new report from Microsoft found that Iranian hackers broke into the account of a ‘high ranking official’ on the U.S. presidential campaign in June 2024, which coincides with the close timing of President Trump’s selection of a vice presidential nominee.”

The Biden administration has not commented on the alleged hack.

Subject: RE: BS: American Presidential race 2024
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 10 Aug 24 - 06:33 AM

He made an offer which was accepted by Twitter, but he then tried to back out. Twitter's owners sued him and the court decided he had to go through with the deal.