Subject: Kosher Gelatin From: GUEST,Anon Date: 09 Feb 00 - 01:08 PM Does anyone here know anything about gelatin? What is the difference between Kosher gelatin and normal gelatin. In yogurt and other milk producs., would kosher gelatin be made from animals or plants. Thanks Anon |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: MMario Date: 09 Feb 00 - 01:42 PM Most "kosher gelatin" isn't vegetarian (it's either made from fish cartilage or supervised by a less strict rabbinic authority that permits regular gelatin (a recent issue of "Kashrus" has an article on kosher gelatin)), but Emes kosher gelatin is made from carrageenan (and you can often buy Emes "gelatin" separately). qoute from another forum, which was the first link listed when I searched on "losher gelatin" in my browser. Do you have a song about gelatin? |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: Liz the Squeak Date: 09 Feb 00 - 01:45 PM In UK there is a product called 'vege-gel' which is a kosher, vegetarian alternative for when cornflour won't do. LTS |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: Sorcha Date: 09 Feb 00 - 01:58 PM Kosher gelatin can also be made from beef as long as the beef is kosher. Depends on what you want to use if for whether you could use it in Dairy dishes, and of course, how Orthodox we are getting. |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: Charlie Baum Date: 09 Feb 00 - 02:04 PM The gelatin in milk products and yogurt isn't necessarily vegetarian--it may have origins in a kosher animal that is properly properly slaughtered. In the process of turning into gelatin, it becomes a "d'var hadash"-- literally, a "new thing"--something that a dog wouldn't recognize as food. Once it attains this category, the distinctions between meat and milk no longer apply. So the meat-derived gelatin that has gone through this process MAY be used in items which are milchig (milk). That's not to say that there aren't vegetarian-derived gelatins--just that the presence of gelatin in a rabinnically-approved kosher dairy item doesn't guarantee that the gelatin has vegetarian origins. --Charlie Baum, who keeps a kosher kitchen and worries about stuff like this |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: Charlie Baum Date: 09 Feb 00 - 02:09 PM Oops--two "properly"s above. Also, another brand of carageenan-derived gelatin available in kosher food stores in the U.S. (or supermarkets in Jewish neighborhoods) is Ko-Jel. --Charlie Baum |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: catspaw49 Date: 09 Feb 00 - 03:01 PM Wasn't he the wimpy brother of Kojack? Spaw |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: Gary T Date: 09 Feb 00 - 03:14 PM Charlie can probaly elaborate here, but to answer the specific question "What is the difference between Kosher gelatin and normal gelatin?", kosher gelatin has been made in accordance with the with the kosher food preparation rules AND is certified to be so. In this respect, "normal" gelatin means non-kosher gelatin. This may or may not coincide with other ways to classify the product (e.g., the source). |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: Charlie Baum Date: 09 Feb 00 - 05:28 PM Gary T.--We can distinguish between "heckshered" (i.e., certified to be kosher, with an appropriate marking on the package by a rabbinical certifying authority) and non-heckshered. Given that there are non-kosher versions of gelatin easily accessible, most of those who keep kosher will usually look for a hecksher (certifying mark) on gelatin products. Some conservative Jews and those on the liberal side of interpretation of Halachah--Jewish law--are "to the left of gelatin"--they don't worry about that product, under the theory that since it became "d'var hadash"--a non-food item, the regulations about its origin no longer apply. This view is only held by those on the left of Halachic interpretation, not by the mainstream. Gelatin products without a hecksher and with no further marking would be considered of suspect origin. But products derived from carageenan or other vegetarian origins and which are labelled as such, and marketed by a company deemed to be reliable (a natural-foods company with an interest in maintaining a reputation as a trustworthy source of vegetarian products, for example) might well be acceptable to some who keep kosher. Non-heckshered does not necessarily mean non-kosher; it just means that it is suspect, until proven otherwise. --Charlie Baum |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: Charlie Baum Date: 09 Feb 00 - 05:41 PM A link for those who would like to relate this thread to music. |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: catspaw49 Date: 09 Feb 00 - 06:31 PM I worked one summer before college for a Jewish catering service that specialized in banquet sized parties. It was educational to say the least. Spaw |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: GUEST Date: 09 Feb 00 - 06:52 PM was there a song in here somewhere??? |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: Bert Date: 09 Feb 00 - 08:47 PM I love this place. Everything I needed to know, I learned at Mudcat. |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: bbelle Date: 09 Feb 00 - 08:52 PM Good thread. I knew the correct answer, but could not have stated it nearly as well. Thanks, Charlie ... moonchild |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: GUEST,Rich(stupidbodhranplayer...) Date: 10 Feb 00 - 05:44 PM Gelatin is animal derived. ANy vegetarian or vegan alternative will likely say so on the label, as it is intended for a target group of consumers looking for said products. Kosher means it was produced under kosher dietary guidelines, including but not limited to, the animal being slaughtered with a single cut and bled. On the other hand, a kosher dairy vecsure shows that there is no meat or meat-by-products (such as rennet, an enzyme derived from calf stomach and used in making cheese) Rich |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: Jacob B Date: 10 Feb 00 - 06:12 PM I think rennet (from a kosher slaughtered animal) is also considered dvar hadash, and acceptable for making hard cheeses (soft cheeses such as cottage cheese don't require rennet.) |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: Mark Cohen Date: 11 Feb 00 - 12:55 AM A sheynem dank, Charlie! I never knew! I grew up nonkosher, but at college I ate in a kosher facility and learned quite a bit from my Orthodox friends. Here's another somewhat related song, to keep the thread marginally musical. I agree with Bert -- I love this place! Anon (who started this thread), I hope you're enjoying the discussion and will stay on. Aloha, Mark |
Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: GUEST,_gargole Date: 11 Feb 00 - 03:42 AM
Gelatin is made from collagen, an animal protein. Collagen is extracted from the skin/bones of cows or pigs. It's soaked and cooked, then filtered, refined and evaporated. The finished product is gelatin.
The Torah prohibits only the meat of unkosher animals, but not the bones, horns or hoofs.
The Sages, however, forbade any bones, horns or hoofs which contain moisture. According to this, food made from unkosher bones is forbidden, unless the bones were completely dry.
But during the manufacturing of gelatin, the animal extract becomes totally inedible, such that even a dog will no longer eat it. Now, food which even a dog won't eat loses its status as food. Halachically, it's no different than stones or dirt which are you allowed to eat!
Based on this, some authorities permit gelatin from unkosher animals, since during the process the animal extract becomes unfit for even a dog. Rabbi Moshe Feinstein, zatzal, rules otherwise. He writes that although the animal parts are inedible in the middle of the process, this inedible state is only temporary. Since at the end of the process the unkosher bones are 'resurrected' into an edible product, the original prohibition remains.
Sources: http://www.ohr.org.il/ask/
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Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: Jacob B Date: 11 Feb 00 - 09:48 AM From the same Ask The Rabbi site gargole refers to above: Bob wrote: Is gelatin from a kosher animal pareve? Dear Bob, During the process of making, the animal parts become inedible and lose their status as meat. Also, they lose any taste of meat. In theory, such gelatin would be pareve - meaning you can eat it with milk. In practice, kosher gelatin is usually made of agar-agar - a plant (seaweed) derivative. The page for the gelatin questions and answers is http://www.ohr.org.il/ask/ask127.htm#Q1
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Subject: RE: Help: Kosher Gelatin From: Jacob B Date: 11 Feb 00 - 11:43 AM Speaking of trying to find a musical connection to this thread: Years ago there was a gelatin company that distributed guitar songbooks in the hope that the aspiring guitar players would eat gelatin to make their nails stronger. Anybody remember what company this was? What songs did they put in the songbook? |
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