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Can You Translate This Irish Song?

p.j. 26 Feb 00 - 12:27 PM
GUEST,fergus russell 26 Feb 00 - 12:54 PM
Sorcha 26 Feb 00 - 01:12 PM
Áine 26 Feb 00 - 03:53 PM
p.j. 26 Feb 00 - 04:44 PM
Áine 26 Feb 00 - 05:34 PM
p.j. 27 Feb 00 - 12:06 PM
Áine 27 Feb 00 - 12:28 PM
GUEST,Ryan 17 Apr 08 - 11:09 PM
GUEST,sammy 15 May 08 - 06:50 PM
Suegorgeous 15 May 08 - 07:51 PM
GUEST,.gargoyle 15 May 08 - 07:56 PM
GUEST,.gargoyle 15 May 08 - 07:57 PM
MartinRyan 16 May 08 - 03:52 AM
GUEST,OLD TIMER 16 May 08 - 03:52 AM
MartinRyan 16 May 08 - 04:13 AM
GUEST,.gargoyle 16 May 08 - 08:23 AM
MartinRyan 16 May 08 - 08:26 AM
GUEST,Laura 29 Jul 08 - 11:49 PM
GUEST 22 Oct 08 - 01:59 PM
GUEST,Angie 12 Sep 11 - 02:44 AM
Liberty Boy 12 Sep 11 - 02:50 AM
MartinRyan 13 Sep 11 - 11:51 AM
MartinRyan 21 Sep 11 - 11:03 AM
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Subject: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: p.j.
Date: 26 Feb 00 - 12:27 PM

Last week at a Music Camp I learned a beautiful Irish Gaelic lullaaby that I'm very anxious to sing. Trouble is, the person who was teaching it doesn't speak Irish, she learned it phonetically.

I don't speak Irish either, but when I do a song or a chorus in another language I want to come as close as I can to doing it right. I'd feel pretty silly if someone who spoke Irish heard me singing gibberish!

I wrote down the words/sounds she said, and tried to use the little Irish I understand to spell them correctly. (Fwesh-ta for "infant" became paiste, for instance!) Then I went to my Irish dictionary and did my best to turn the whole mess into a translation. Clearly, though, what I really need is a native speaker to set it right for me.

I can't find a reference to it anywhere in DigTrad or other Celtic Links, so if anyone knows how I can find out more about the song itself or it's origin, please let me know.

Until then, here are the words, and I'd be grateful for help unravelling their meaning and correcting any errors you find.

Thanks

PJ

Oro, oro na, mo paiste mo chroi thu
Oro, oro na, mo paiste mo chroi thu

Coladh ma contrah, ma contrah seoithin
Mo chroi, mo paiste chroi, ma contrah seoithin

Glac samh, glac samh mo chroi, a paiste chroi mo gra
Glac samh, glac samh mo chroi, a paiste chroi mo gra

Tusa mo muhuirin, fan ag mo thaobh sa
Oro muhuirin, mo leanbh beag mo gra

Roisin, oro Roisin, na bron chas anois
Roisin, oro Roisin, na bron chas anois

Mo chroi, mo Roisin Dubh, a paidir ta do tsaol
Roisin, oro Roisin, go gach duine codladh samh


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: GUEST,fergus russell
Date: 26 Feb 00 - 12:54 PM

If you can give the name of the song I might be able to help Slán go foill, Is mise Fergus


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: Sorcha
Date: 26 Feb 00 - 01:12 PM

<Á>ine can, send her a personal message.


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: Áine
Date: 26 Feb 00 - 03:53 PM

Dear p.j.,

Here's my best guess at the song as you've given it to us. There was one word and one phrase that I'm not very sure about. If you could please give us a title, that would make it easier for us to help you. For what it's worth, here's what I've come up with. Maybe someone else can be of more assistance.

-- Áine

Oro, oro na, mo paiste mo chroi thu
Óró, óró mo pháiste mo chroí thú
Oro, oro na, mo paiste mo chroi thu
Óró, óró mo pháiste mo chroí thú

Coladh ma contrah, ma contrah seoithin
Coladh mo _______, mo _______ seoithín
Mo chroi, mo paiste chroi, ma contrah seoithin
Mo chroí, mo pháste chroí, mo ________ seoithín

Glac samh, glac samh mo chroi, a paiste chroi mo gra
Glac sámh, glac sámh mo chroí, a pháiste chroí mo ghrá
Glac samh, glac samh mo chroi, a paiste chroi mo gra
Glac sámh, glac sámh mo chroí, a pháiste chroí mo ghrá

Tusa mo muhuirin, fan ag mo thaobh sa
Tusa mo mhuirnín, fan ag mo thaobhsa
Oro muhuirin, mo leanbh beag mo gra
Óró mo mhuirnín, mo leanbh beag, mo ghrá

Roisin, oro Roisin, na bron chas anois
Roisín, óró Roisín, ná brón cásamh anois
Roisin, oro Roisin, na bron chas anois
Roisín, óró Roisín, ná brón cásamh anois

Mo chroi, mo Roisin Dubh, a paidir ta do tsaol
Mo chroí, mo Roisín Dubh, a' phaidir 'tá do shaol
Roisin, oro Roisin, go gach duine codladh samh
Roisín, óró Roisín, go gach duine codladh sámh

Oh my child, I love you,
Oh my child, I love you,

Sleep my _______, my _______ (of) evening
My dear, my dear child, my _______ (of) evening

Be at peace, be at peace my dear, dear beloved child
Be at peace, be at peace my dear, dear beloved child

You are my darling, stay beside me
Oh darling, my little baby my love

Roisín, oh Roisín, don't grieve or lament now
Roisín, oh Roisín, don't grieve or lament now

My dear, my dark-headed Roisín, your life is a prayer(?)
Roisín, oh Roisín, may all people sleep in peace.


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: p.j.
Date: 26 Feb 00 - 04:44 PM

Thank you so much, Aine! Your corrections are most helpful, and the translation makes sense. I'm really taken with this piece, and I appreciate all the help I can get with it.

The song didn't come with a title, which is part of the reason I've had so much trouble finding out more about it myself. I was told it was a "seoithin seo" which is supposed to mean "lullaby", but in my dictionary all I find for a meaning on those words is "whispering show". Can you make sense of that for me?

In the line that begins "Coladh..." I tried to piece the puzzle together this way: If "ma" means "if" (sorry, I don't know how to type the correct marks over the letters on my keyboard) and "contrah" is really "crontrath", then the line could read

Coladh ma crontrath, ma crontrath seoithin
Sleep if dusk, if dusk whispering

Sleep if dusk is whispering. Could that work?

I was also wondering about the reference to Roisin Dubh in the last verse. Isn't that sort of a veiled reference to Ireland, The Little Black Rose?

PJ


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: Áine
Date: 26 Feb 00 - 05:34 PM

Dear p.j.,

I was told it was a "seoithin seo" which is supposed to mean "lullaby", but in my dictionary all I find for a meaning on those words is "whispering show". Can you make sense of that for me?

seoithín; seoithín seó; and seoithín seothó are all terms for 'lullaby'. Another word is suantraí.

In the line that begins "Coladh..." I tried to piece the puzzle together this way: If "ma" means "if" (sorry, I don't know how to type the correct marks over the letters on my keyboard) and "contrah" is really "crontrath", then the line could read . . . Coladh ma crontrath, ma crontrath seoithin, Sleep if dusk, if dusk whispering

contráth and cróntráth are the same word, just different spellings. But, the word crónánaí means 'murmurer' or 'hummer' or 'crooner', is very close in pronounciation and I think that's the word we're looking for here. If we use crónánaí in those two lines, they read:

Codladh mo chrónánaí, mo chrónánaí seoithín
Mo chroí, mo pháiste chroí, mo chrónánaí seoithín

Sleep my crooner, my crooner (of) evening
My dear, my dear child, my crooner (of) evening

I was also wondering about the reference to Roisin Dubh in the last verse. Isn't that sort of a veiled reference to Ireland, The Little Black Rose?

Yes, 'Roisín Dubh' is used in some songs to symbolize Ireland; but, I think you'd be stretching things a bit to apply that connotation here. I think I'd just accept it as the name of the baby the lullaby is being sung to.

I noticed that I'd misspelled a couple of words in my first post, so I'm reposting the words again with my corrections. And if you want to type out lyrics in Irish again, if you can't make the 'fada' symbol over a character, just type a slash -- / -- after the letter you're wanting to put a fada over. Ex. á would equal a/, etc.

============================

Oro, oro na, mo paiste mo chroi thu
Óró, óró mo pháiste mo chroí thú
Oro, oro na, mo paiste mo chroi thu
Óró, óró mo pháiste mo chroí thú

Coladh ma contrah, ma contrah seoithin
Codladh mo chrónánaí, mo chrónánaí seoithín
Mo chroi, mo paiste chroi, ma contrah seoithin
Mo chroí, mo pháiste chroí, mo chrónánaí seoithín

Glac samh, glac samh mo chroi, a paiste chroi mo gra
Glac sámh, glac sámh mo chroí, a pháiste chroí mo ghrá
Glac samh, glac samh mo chroi, a paiste chroi mo gra
Glac sámh, glac sámh mo chroí, a pháiste chroí mo ghrá

Tusa mo muhuirin, fan ag mo thaobh sa
Tusa mo mhuirnín, fan ag mo thaobhsa
Oro muhuirin, mo leanbh beag mo gra
Óró mo mhuirnín, mo leanbh beag, mo ghrá

Roisin, oro Roisin, na bron chas anois
Roisín, óró Roisín, ná brón cásamh anois
Roisin, oro Roisin, na bron chas anois
Roisín, óró Roisín, ná brón cásamh anois

Mo chroi, mo Roisin Dubh, a paidir ta do tsaol
Mo chroí, mo Roisín Dubh, a' phaidir 'tá do shaol
Roisin, oro Roisin, go gach duine codladh samh
Roisín, óró Roisín, go gach duine codladh sámh

Oh my child, I love you,
Oh my child, I love you,

Sleep my crooner, my crooner (of) evening
My dear, my dear child, my crooner (of) evening

Be at peace, be at peace my dear, dear beloved child
Be at peace, be at peace my dear, dear beloved child

You are my darling, stay beside me
Oh darling, my little baby my love

Roisín, oh Roisín, don't grieve or lament now
Roisín, oh Roisín, don't grieve or lament now

My dear, my dark-headed Roisín, your life is a prayer(?)
Roisín, oh Roisín, may all people sleep in peace.


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: p.j.
Date: 27 Feb 00 - 12:06 PM

This is wonderful! I'm so happy to find someone who will patiently work this out with me. Many thanks, Aine.

If I can pester you with a last question or too, I think I'll be done...

1. Can you give me the phoenetic spelling to pronounce chro/na/nai/? (I'm guessing something like "hro-nan-eye") and contra/th ("cone-trow"?)

2. I've heard "tsaol" pronounced "heel", but if it is also spelled "shaol" how should it be pronounced?

3. Grammatically, are all of these combinations okay in a song?

Mo pha/iste
Mo pha/iste chroi
Mo chroi
Mo chroi thu
Mo thu
Mo gra

Once again, thank you for being such a great resource for these questions, I'll stop bothering you now!

Go raibh mi/le maith agat

pj


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: Áine
Date: 27 Feb 00 - 12:28 PM

Dear p.j.,

I sent you a personal message in re the above. Let me know if you don't receive it and I'll post the info here.

-- Áine


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: GUEST,Ryan
Date: 17 Apr 08 - 11:09 PM

I know it is called "Suantrai Seoithin Seo"(Lullaby) and it sound familiar but I can't find it so I thought I would just ask.
Ryan


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: GUEST,sammy
Date: 15 May 08 - 06:50 PM

I don't even know if this is Irish but if it is, can you translate this song?

Anol shalom
Anol sheh lay konnud de ne um {shaddai}
Flavum
Nom de leesh
Ham de nam um das
La um de
Flavne…

We de ze zu bu
We de sooo a ru
Un va-a pesh a lay
Un vi-I bee
Un da la pech ni sa
(Aaahh)
Un di-I lay na day
Un ma la pech a nay
Mee di nu ku

(Fast tempo, 4 times)
La la da pa da le na da na
Ve va da pa da le na la dumda

Anol shalom
Anol sheh ley kon-nud de ne um.
Flavum.
Flavum.
M-ai shondol-lee
Flavu… {Live on…}
Lof flesh lay
Nof ne
Nom de lis
Ham de num um dass
La um de
Flavne…
Flay
Shom de nomm
Ma-lun des
Dwondi.
Dwwoondi
Alas sharum du koos
Shaley koot-tum


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: Suegorgeous
Date: 15 May 08 - 07:51 PM

Looks yiddish to me!


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: GUEST,.gargoyle
Date: 15 May 08 - 07:56 PM

Those of you that read the Irish Times no doubt are familar with documentary maker Manchan Magan's chronicles. His attempt to speak only Irish as he traveled through the Emerald Isle is hilarious.

You challenged the students of an Irish University to differentiate between Irish and Kling-on (the alien language from Star Trek). Could they tell them apart?

You submitted the Gaeltacht people to a lie detector test to find out how they actually treated learners of Irish.

ENJOY:
http://www.manchan.com/pb/wp_f4b21f7c/wp_f4b21f7c.html?0.5009952361112574

Sincerely,
Gargoyle


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: GUEST,.gargoyle
Date: 15 May 08 - 07:57 PM

Gaelic? What gall

Using Gaelic to practice his gift of the gab certainly got his kinsmen's Irish up.
By Manchán Magan
March 17, 2008

EXCERTS

DUBLIN -- Gaelic -- or irish, as we call it here -- is the first official language of Ireland. (English is second.) And 41% of the population claim to speak it. But could that be true? To put it to the test, I set off across Ireland for three weeks in the summer of 2006 with one self-imposed handicap -- to never utter a word of English.

I chose Dublin as a starting point. The sales assistant in the first shop I went to said, "Would you speak English maybe?" I tried repeating my request using the simplest schoolroom Irish that he must have learned during the 10 years of compulsory Irish that every schoolchild undergoes. "Do you speak English?" he asked again in a cold, threatening tone. Sea (pronounced "sha"), I affirmed, and nodded meekly. "I'm not talking to you any more," he said, covering his ears. "Go away!"

I knew the journey was going to be difficult, just not this difficult. Language experts claim that the figure of fluent Irish speakers is closer to 3% than the aspirational 41% who tick the language box on the census....

In Galway, I went out busking on the streets, singing the filthiest, most debauched lyrics I could think of to see if anyone would understand. No one did. Old women smiled, tapping their feet merrily as I serenaded them with filth.

In Killarney, I stood outside a bank promising passers-by huge sums of money if they helped me rob it, but again no one understood.

In January 2007, Irish became an official working language of the European Union, taking its place alongside the 23 other official languages.

Sincerely,
Gargoyle

(Reminders of the Spanglish the Mexican not Hispanic, not Latino speak as "their native tongue.")


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: MartinRyan
Date: 16 May 08 - 03:52 AM

"Do you speak English?" he asked again in a cold, threatening tone. "Sea", I affirmed, and nodded meekly." .

That exchange says as much about Manchan's Irish as it does about that of the sales assistant.

Regards


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: GUEST,OLD TIMER
Date: 16 May 08 - 03:52 AM

Are you sure this hasnt been put through the mangledlyrics translator


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: MartinRyan
Date: 16 May 08 - 04:13 AM

A minor point: there is no word for "Yes" in Irish. Sea is a contracted form of the Irish for "It is." - which is not the answer required or intended!

Regards


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: GUEST,.gargoyle
Date: 16 May 08 - 08:23 AM

Thanks Martin

How hilarious! If you liked that one - read the others on the links.

Like saying "Wee" instead of "Oui" in French.

Sincerely,
Gargoyle

There is no word for "Yes" in Irish. No wonder the Brits have always perceived them as obstinate.


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: MartinRyan
Date: 16 May 08 - 08:26 AM

Gargoyle,

It never made us obstinate BUT - combined with the absence of perfect tenses and a scarcity of auxiliary verbs, it helped make our vernacular English rather circumspect!

Regards


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: GUEST,Laura
Date: 29 Jul 08 - 11:49 PM

Hey guys!
At my church, someone sang a beautiful gaelic song and I'm very curious to know what it means and to see the written words. It was also called Suantrai Seoithin Seo (Lullaby). But it is not the one spoken of above (though I love that one as well!)

All I have is a link to the song being performed. Would someone listen to it and give me a hand?

Much appreciated!

A teeny bit of navigation is required:
http://media.marshillchurch.org/ Then go to MUSIC then BANDS, then RED LETTER. On the second page of their recorded music is the song, just called Lullaby here. Thanks so much!

Laura


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 01:59 PM

This is absolutely not Irish. Its from Hans Zimmer's Now we are Free (Song from Gladiator movie with Russell Crow). People have thought its Enya's song but its not!
I was also looking for a translation for this song but I couldnt find it on the internet.Ive heard its a made-up language or Latin or Hebrew but apparently nobody knows.


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: GUEST,Angie
Date: 12 Sep 11 - 02:44 AM

Can anyone help me out with the full lyrics and English translation of this Irish song sung to Oscar Wilde by his father:

Athá mé in mu codladh, agus ná dúishe mé

I'd love to be able to hear it - any ideas?

Thanks,


Angie


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: Liberty Boy
Date: 12 Sep 11 - 02:50 AM

i suspect this is the song you may have in mind!

Táimse im Chodhladh
Trathnoinin deanach i gcein cois leasa dom
Taimse i m' chodhladh is na duistear me
Sea dhearcas lem' thaobh an speirbhean mhaisiuil
Taimse i m' chodhladh is na duistear me

Ba bhachallach pearlach dreimreach barrachas
A carnfholt craobhach ag titim lei ar bhaillechrith
'S i ag caitheamh na saighead trim thaobh do chealg me
Taimse i m' chodhladh is na duistear me

Is mo buachaillin og a thogadh go ceannasach
Taimse i m' chodhladh is na duistear me
Do cuireadh le foirmeart anonn thar farraige
Taimse i m' chodhladh is na duistear me

Go bheicfeadh an la a mbeidh ar ar Shasanaigh
Ughaim ar a ndroim is iad ag treabhadh is ag branar duinn
Gan mise a bheith ann mura dteannam an maide leo
Taimse i m' chodhladh is na duistear me


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: MartinRyan
Date: 13 Sep 11 - 11:51 AM

BTW GUESTAngie - where did you hear/read that story about Wilde?

Regards


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Subject: RE: Can You Translate This Irish Song?
From: MartinRyan
Date: 21 Sep 11 - 11:03 AM

refresh


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