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Lyr Req: Wolfhound / Beth Gelert...the Greyhound

In Mudcat MIDIs:
The Wolfhound [Alan Foster]


Alison 12 Jun 97 - 11:45 PM
Bo 13 Jun 97 - 10:50 PM
Alison 14 Jun 97 - 12:07 AM
Alan of Australia 19 Jun 97 - 07:41 PM
dick 19 Jun 97 - 07:47 PM
Alan 19 Jun 97 - 08:07 PM
Alison 19 Jun 97 - 08:41 PM
Bert Hansell 20 Jun 97 - 09:05 AM
Dave of Derby U.K. 20 Jun 97 - 09:41 AM
alison 21 Jun 97 - 01:17 AM
Alan of Oz 29 Jul 97 - 06:51 AM
Bill in Alabama 29 Jul 97 - 08:12 AM
Bill in Alabama 29 Jul 97 - 11:09 AM
Jon W. 29 Jul 97 - 11:40 AM
Susan of DT 29 Jul 97 - 06:25 PM
Kiwi 29 Jul 97 - 08:53 PM
Alan of Oz 30 Jul 97 - 04:48 AM
Kiwi 30 Jul 97 - 07:42 PM
Alan of Australia 14 Aug 97 - 07:58 PM
Joe Offer 14 Aug 97 - 08:28 PM
Alan of Oz 14 Aug 97 - 09:15 PM
Laoise, Belfast 15 Aug 97 - 05:21 AM
Joe Offer 23 Jan 98 - 02:13 AM
Jim T. 23 Jan 98 - 04:06 PM
Alan of Australia 23 Jan 98 - 07:16 PM
Alan of Australia 23 Jan 98 - 07:17 PM
rhiannon, wales 27 Jan 99 - 04:17 PM
Baz 27 Jan 99 - 05:25 PM
alison 27 Jan 99 - 09:12 PM
Alan of Australia 28 Jan 99 - 05:38 AM
MMario 23 Mar 99 - 11:36 AM
MMario 30 Sep 02 - 04:08 PM
wysiwyg 30 Sep 02 - 04:16 PM
Big Tim 01 Oct 02 - 03:43 AM
GUEST,palmer 07 Mar 05 - 01:49 PM
GUEST 19 Mar 09 - 03:05 PM
Jim Dixon 22 Mar 09 - 02:48 PM
Joe Offer 29 May 17 - 12:02 AM
Jim Dixon 29 Jun 17 - 11:30 PM
Georgiansilver 30 Jun 17 - 05:47 AM
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Subject: Wolfhound
From: Alison
Date: 12 Jun 97 - 11:45 PM

Hi I'm not sure if this has actually been turned into a song, but I think I did hear one years ago.

The story goes.......

There was a lord who had a son, and a wolfhound. Anyway the lord went out (doing whatever lords do,) and left the wolfhound to look after the son. (Social workers would have a field day...) When he got back the child was on the bed covered in blood and the wolfhound had blood around his mouth. So the lord killed the wolfhound. Later on closer inspection the lord found a wild animal (can't remember what), lying behind the bed where the wolfhound had killed it, and the blood on the boy, (who was only sleeping), was that of the faithful wolfhound. 1...2...3............Aaaaaahhh!!!!

Is there a song?

Slainte

Alison


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Bo
Date: 13 Jun 97 - 10:50 PM

Sounds like a great basis for a song if there isnt one already. Are there any more 'true' details you have? ie Lord's Name, location, etc.....


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Alison
Date: 14 Jun 97 - 12:07 AM

Hi

Sorry, I have no further details. It's probably an old Irish story.

alison


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Subject: Lyr Add: THE WOLFHOUND (Alan Foster)
From: Alan of Australia
Date: 19 Jun 97 - 07:41 PM

Alison,

Maybe if we can't find one we can write one.

THE WOLFHOUND

by Alan Foster

Lord Redmond's to the hunting gone
He's ta'en his hawk and his hounds
And his finest wolfhound he's left at home
To guard his house and his lands.

And he has hunted many an hour
He's hunted the whole day long
With his wolfhound at home beside the door
Guarding his infant son.

And when the lord's returned home
To his son's room he strode
Found hound and baby lying there
Both covered o'er with blood.

Oh bloody hound, oh bloody hound
You have my young son slain
And he has drawn his long broadsword
And his wolfhound's life he's ta'en.

As he has shed a bitter tear
He heard the baby wail
He's lifted up his bonny wee son
And found him live and hail.

How came the blood upon your clothes
And the blood upon your sheet
And then he spied a wolf's body
Lying dead at his feet.

Oh faithful hound, oh trusty hound
I've done to you great wrong
For you have slain that cruel wolf
That would have slain my son.

Oh rue the day, oh rue the day
That e'er I did such wrong
For I have slain the best wolfhound
That e'er did guard my son.

Here is the tune in Sol-fa. It's one of the tunes used these days for Willy of Winsbury (Child #100). Taking it to be in the natural minor the base octave is l-t-d-r-m-f-s, (refer to the thread on Sol-fa notation).

:m<|l:-:l.t|d:-:d.r|m:-:m|r:-
:d.t|l:-:m|r:-.d:t|l:-:-|-:-
:s<|d:-:d.t|l:-:s<|m<:s<:- |m<:-:-|-:-
:f<.m<|r<:-.d<:r<|m<:-:s<|l:-:-|-:-:||

Chords for E minor, if they look a little strange it's because I have partially arranged it for the dorian mode.

|Em:-:-|-:-:-|G:-:-|A:-:-|
|Em:-:-|A:-:-|Em:-:-|-:-:|
|G:-:-|Em:-:-|G:-:-|Bm:-:-|
|Am:-:-|G:-:-|Em:-:-|-:-:-|

Cheers,
Alan


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: dick
Date: 19 Jun 97 - 07:47 PM

I like both your song and your style. Keep that tradition alive! (and I wonder how the words and music will change after a few people sing it.)


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Alan
Date: 19 Jun 97 - 08:07 PM

Thanks Dick.

They'll probably change for the better. I'd be delighted if people did sing it.

Cheers,
Alan


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Alison
Date: 19 Jun 97 - 08:41 PM

Hi

Thanks Alan.

I love the song.

slainte

alison


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Bert Hansell
Date: 20 Jun 97 - 09:05 AM

Alan, that's a Great song, I'l try singing it when I get home tonight.

Bert


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Dave of Derby U.K.
Date: 20 Jun 97 - 09:41 AM

Nice one Alan. I will certainly use your words with appropriate acreditation to you. Many Thanks ... Dave


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: alison
Date: 21 Jun 97 - 01:17 AM

Hi

After having sung this last night at a Sydney folk club, (well Alan sang and I accompanied him on flute.....) we now have some more info. It actually started out as a Welsh folk tale, which was then adapted into other cultures and varied accordingly.

Apparently Thomas Moore set it to music. If anyone has any more details please let me know.

slainte

Alison


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Alan of Oz
Date: 29 Jul 97 - 06:51 AM

G'day,
We were at a poetry night last week and sang the above song. Afterwards one of the poets said he thought Tennyson had written a poem telling this story, and that the hound's name was Gelert. A search of the net failed to find a relevant Tennyson poem, but a search for gelert found these.
http://www.nwi.co.uk/beddgelert/legend/
http://www.g-net.demon.co.uk/gelert.htm

Cheers,
Alan


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Bill in Alabama
Date: 29 Jul 97 - 08:12 AM

It is a poem by Tennyson. I'll get it down here as soon as I get back from my class this morning.


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Bill in Alabama
Date: 29 Jul 97 - 11:09 AM

It's NOT a poem by Tennyson (I reckon I'm skundered). It is a poem William Robert Spencer, entitled "Beth-Gelert, or, The Grave of the Greyhound". I found it in a book entitled The Best Loved Poems of the American People. It's a twenty-four stanza poem set in the standard ballad stanza and metre(4A 3B 4A 3B). I don't mind typing the text here, but I'm not sure that I can get it to come out in the correct stanzaic form. Any suggestions?


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Jon W.
Date: 29 Jul 97 - 11:40 AM

Bill - see the HTML-related threads in this forum for formatting suggestions. Basically, to get a real carriage return you have to insert <BR> in your text where you want the line to end.
Also use your Document Source selection under your View menu in your browser.


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Susan of DT
Date: 29 Jul 97 - 06:25 PM

A related Welsh legend. According to the Mabinogion, Rhiannon (immortal) wife of King Pwyll (mortal) had a child. When the child died its first night, the nurses had Rhiannon blamed by smearing the child's blood on Rhiannon's face and hands.


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Kiwi
Date: 29 Jul 97 - 08:53 PM

Hey Alan, I like the song! If only I could come up with the tunes like that... I've had an idea simmering in the back of my head for the past _two months_ and it still hasn't borne any fruit.


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Alan of Oz
Date: 30 Jul 97 - 04:48 AM

Kiwi,
Thanks, but I didn't write the tune. I was trying to fit a Child ballad tune to the words and this is the one I settled on.

I don't know the full story to this tune being attached to Willy O' Winsbury but I do know it happened as the result of a mistake. Somebody looked up the wrong tune, then found it worked. I think it works with The Wolfhound too.

Cheers,
Alan


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Kiwi
Date: 30 Jul 97 - 07:42 PM

Alan, I misspoke myself. I meant the lyrics, not the actual tune itself. :)


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Subject: Lyr Add: BETH GELERT (William Robert Spencer)
From: Alan of Australia
Date: 14 Aug 97 - 07:58 PM

We've sung the song at a number of venues now and each time someone adds a bit to our knowledge of the story. The latest is from a bloke from Birmingham England who is familiar with the village of Beddgelert. His father used to tell the tale and he (the son) knew it was true. Then he heard the same story from Russia and again from India. An ancient urban myth.

After singing the song at a poet's night one of the poets mailed a photocopy of this which I scanned:-

WILLIAM ROBERT SPENCER 1769-1834

Beth Gelert; or, The Grave of the Greyhound

The spearmen heard the bugle sound,
And cheerly smiled the morn;
And many a brach, and many a hound,
Obeyed Llewelyn's horn.

And still he blew a louder blast,
And gave a lustier cheer:
'Come, Gelert come, wer't never last
Llewelyn's horn to hear.

'Oh where does faithful Gelert roam,
The flower of all his race;
So true, so brave, a lamb at home,
A lion in the chase?'

'Twas only at Llewelyn's board
The faithful Gelert fed;
He watched, he served, he cheered his lord,
And sentinelled his bed.

In sooth he was a peerless hound,
The gift of royal John;
But now no Gelert could be found,
And all the chase rode on.

And now, as o'er the rocks and dells
The gallant chidings rise,
All Snowdon's craggy chaos yells
The many-mingled cries.

That day Llewelyn little loved
The chase of hart and hare;
And scant and small the booty proved,
For Gelert was not there.

Unpleased Llewelyn homeward hied,
When near the portal seat
His truant Gelert he espied,
Bounding his lord to greet.

But when he gained his castle door
Aghast the chieftain stood;
The hound all o'er was smeared with gore,
His lips, his fangs, ran blood.

Llewelyn gazed with fierce surprise;
Unused such looks to meet,
His favourite checked his joyful guise,
And crouched, and licked his feet.

Onward in haste Llewelyn passed,
And on went Gelert too;
And still, where'er his eyes he cast,
Fresh blood-gouts shocked his view.

O'erturned his infants bed he found,
With blood-stained covert rent;
And all around the walls and ground
With recent blood besprent.

He called his child--no voice replied--
He searched with terror wild;
Blood, blood he found on every side,
But nowhere found his child.

'Hell hound! my child's by thee devoured,'
The frantic father cried;
And to the hilt his vengeful sword
He plunged in Gelert's side.

His suppliant looks, as prone he fell,
No pity could impart;
But still his Gelert's dying yell
Passed heavy o'er his heart.

Aroused by Gelert's dying yell,
Some slumberer wakened nigh:
What words the parent's joy could tell
To hear his infant's cry!

Concealed beneath a tumbled heap
His hurried search had missed,
All glowing from his rosy sleep,
The cherub boy he kissed.

Nor scathe had he, nor harm, nor dread,
But, the same couch beneath,
Lay a gaunt wolf, all torn and dead,
Tremendous still in death.

Ah, what was then Llewelyn's pain!
For now the truth was clear;
His gallant hound the wolf had slain,
To save Llewelyn's heir.

Vain, vain was all Llewelyn's woe:
'Best of thy kind, adieu!
The frantic blow, which laid thee low,
This heart shall ever rue.'

And now a gallant tomb they raise,
With costly sculpture decked;
And marbles storied with his praise
Poor Gelert's bones protect.

There never could the spearman pass,
Or forester, unmoved;
There, oft the tear-besprinkled grass
Llewelyn's sorrow proved.

And there he hung his horn and spear,
And there, as evening fell,
In fancy's ear he oft would hear
Poor Gelert's dying yell.

And till great Snowdon's rocks grow old,
And cease the storm to brave,
The consecrated spot shall hold
The name of 'Gelert's grave'.

Note that the accent is on the first syllable of Gelert and Beddgelert is pronounced Beth Gelert as in the title of Spencer's poem.

So, Alison, you were right and here is the original poem. It's a bit long to sing to the average audience though.

Cheers,
Alan


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Joe Offer
Date: 14 Aug 97 - 08:28 PM

I'm glad you were able to scan it, Alan. I've been feeling guilty because I have the Spencer text and have been too lazy to type it.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Alan of Oz
Date: 14 Aug 97 - 09:15 PM

Joe,
No worries! I wouldn't have wanted to type it either!

Cheers,
Alan


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Laoise, Belfast
Date: 15 Aug 97 - 05:21 AM

That is one of the saddest poems I've ever read. Pass the Kleanex...

Laoise.


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Joe Offer
Date: 23 Jan 98 - 02:13 AM

Say, Alan, now that we have ABC and MIDI posting capabilities, I thought I'd revive this thread and ask if you could post the tune to your Wolfhound song. I've wanted to hear the tune for a long time, but I couldn't figure out your sol-fa notation. Thanks.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Jim T.
Date: 23 Jan 98 - 04:06 PM

This may not be terrible relevant, but the TV show on Discovery ch. with Tim Grundy & his cameraman covered this legend. At the end, Tim turns to the cameraman who is supposedly moved by the story, and says "Look give over, it probably died in its basket of old age"


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Subject: Tune Add: THE WOLFHOUND and GILL MORICE
From: Alan of Australia
Date: 23 Jan 98 - 07:16 PM

G'day,
Here 'tis as currently played:-

MIDI file: WOLFHND.MID

Timebase: 480

Name: The Wolfhound
TimeSig: 3/4 24 8
Key: G
Tempo: 100 (600000 microsec/crotchet)
Start
0960 1 59 075 0478 0 59 075 0002 1 64 091 0958 0 64 091 0002 1 64 069 0238 0 64 069 0002 1 66 054 0238 0 66 054 0002 1 67 099 0958 0 67 099 0002 1 67 069 0238 0 67 069 0002 1 69 091 0238 0 69 091 0002 1 71 118 0958 0 71 118 0002 1 71 113 0478 0 71 113 0002 1 69 127 0958 0 69 127 0002 1 67 093 0238 0 67 093 0002 1 66 073 0238 0 66 073 0002 1 64 095 0958 0 64 095 0002 1 64 082 0238 0 64 082 0002 1 71 080 0238 0 71 080 0002 1 69 111 0718 0 69 111 0002 1 67 084 0238 0 67 084 0002 1 66 073 0478 0 66 073 0002 1 64 108 2398 0 64 108 0002 1 62 084 0238 0 62 084 0002 1 62 093 0238 0 62 093 0002 1 67 101 0958 0 67 101 0002 1 67 093 0238 0 67 093 0002 1 66 070 0238 0 66 070 0002 1 64 108 0478 0 64 108 0002 1 64 083 0478 0 64 083 0002 1 62 067 0478 0 62 067 0002 1 59 095 0478 0 59 095 0002 1 62 098 0958 0 62 098 0002 1 59 091 1438 0 59 091 0002 1 57 093 0478 0 57 093 0002 1 55 088 0478 0 55 088 0002 1 55 085 0478 0 55 085 0002 1 59 075 0958 0 59 075 0002 1 62 094 0238 0 62 094 0002 1 64 094 0238 0 64 094 0002 1 64 113 2398 0 64 113
End

This program is worth the effort of learning it.

To download the January 15 MIDItext 98 software and get instructions on how to use it click here

ABC format:

X:1
T:The Wolfhound
M:3/4
Q:1/4=100
K:G
B,2|E4EF|G4GA|B4B2|A4GF|E4EB|A3GF2|E6|-E4DD|
G4GF|E2E2D2|B,2D4|B,6|A,2G,2G,2|B,4DE|E6|
-E4||

This is the tune used by Pentangle and others for Willy O' Winsbury (Child #100). The story of this tune being attached to W O' W may almost be urban myth but apparently someone looked up the tune and mistakenly got the tune to another Child ballad. I don't know which one but here is Bronson's tune No. 7 for Gill Morice (Child Maurice) Child #83. If you change the time signature and swing it a bit you'll probably hear the similarity.

MIDI file: GILLMORI.MID

Timebase: 480

Name: Gill Morice (Child #83)
TimeSig: 4/4 24 8
Key: G
Tempo: 100 (600000 microsec/crotchet)
Start
1440 1 59 093 0478 0 59 093 0002 1 64 115 0478 0 64 115 0002 1 64 115 0478 0 64 115 0002 1 67 105 0478 0 67 105 0002 1 69 105 0478 0 69 105 0002 1 71 107 0478 0 71 107 0002 1 71 122 0478 0 71 122 0002 1 69 111 0478 0 69 111 0002 1 67 115 0478 0 67 115 0002 1 64 108 0478 0 64 108 0002 1 67 118 0478 0 67 118 0002 1 69 102 0478 0 69 102 0002 1 71 108 0478 0 71 108 0002 1 64 118 1438 0 64 118 0002 1 67 091 0238 0 67 091 0002 1 69 089 0238 0 69 089 0002 1 71 127 0478 0 71 127 0002 1 69 118 0478 0 69 118 0002 1 69 111 0478 0 69 111 0002 1 67 097 0478 0 67 097 0002 1 64 102 0478 0 64 102 0002 1 62 095 0238 0 62 095 0002 1 64 093 0238 0 64 093 0002 1 67 105 0478 0 67 105 0002 1 67 108 0238 0 67 108 0002 1 69 097 0238 0 69 097 0002 1 71 111 0478 0 71 111 0002 1 69 068 0238 0 69 068 0002 1 67 110 0238 0 67 110 0002 1 69 118 0478 0 69 118 0002 1 71 127 0478 0 71 127 0002 1 64 127 1438 0 64 127
End

This program is worth the effort of learning it.

To download the January 15 MIDItext 98 software and get instructions on how to use it click here

ABC format:

X:1
T:Gill Morice (Child #83)
M:4/4
Q:1/4=100
K:G
B,2|E2E2G2A2|B2B2A2G2|E2G2A2B2|E6GA|B2A2A2G2|
E2DEG2GA|B2AGA2B2|E6||

Cheers,
Alan


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Subject: Chords Add: THE WOLFHOUND (Alan Foster)
From: Alan of Australia
Date: 23 Jan 98 - 07:17 PM

And the chords fit thusly:-

THE WOLFHOUND

by Alan Foster

------Em---------------G-------A
Lord Redmond's to the hunting gone
------Em--------A------------Em
He's ta'en his hawk and his hounds
---------G------Em-------------G-------Bm
And his finest wolfhound he's left at home
----Am--------G-------------Em
To guard his house and his lands.

by Alan Foster

Cheers,
Alan


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: rhiannon, wales
Date: 27 Jan 99 - 04:17 PM

Hi, surfed in to your site "by accident". You all sound like nice guys and ladies but - wahhh! some of your stuff got me really cross!

Yes, the legend of the hound/prince/baby is directly connected to Beddgelert in Wales. I really wish people would check things out before writing songs about them, and especially performing them : this is how legends get lost, by being wrongly interpreted. And yes I know about the "developing tradition" argument - developing is one thing, changing is another!!!

For instance, thanks to Stevie Nicks/Fleetwood Mac's song "Rhiannon", I'm sick of telling old Mac freaks that Rhiannon was NOT a witch, but a Queen. Sure, it's a great song, BUT !

re. Susan of DT's reference to the child of Rhiannon and Pwyll, Prince of Dyfed : the child did not "die its first night" as stated here - a great claw came through the window of the chamber and took it away. The ladies of the chamber did indeed blame Rhiannon for its loss by claiming she had killed it; but the child was LOST not dead. As he later re-appears, and the whole of the rest of the Mabinogi is all about his life, (underneath all the side-tracking) this is a pretty relevant factor!

Check out the Four Branches of the Mabinogi for the correct legend please! Next thing we know, somebody'll be writing songs about Rhiannon The Child Murderer!!!!!

I guess you now think I'm a really bad tempered piece - but this is my country and my culture under discussion and I care about it not being messed about. Thank you.


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Baz
Date: 27 Jan 99 - 05:25 PM

rhiannon, wales

Perhaps the Welsh are partly to blame in this respect. On a recent visit to Bed Gelert (please forgive the spelling)I picked up a postcard, printed in Wales, and it told the story much the same as Alan's song does.
Regards Baz


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: alison
Date: 27 Jan 99 - 09:12 PM

Hi Rhiannon,

Are you saying that the wolfhound story is wrong or just the Rhiannon one?

I know Alan researched it at the time, and his version is pretty much the information he got from the information available about Beddgelert, and an old poem.

At the time we didn't have Spencer's poem written above, so yes the "lord" ended up with the wrong name. Maybe next time he'll sing it as Llewelyn. (Bear in mind it was written by an Aussie, from a vague recollection of a story by an Irish girl...... I think he did a good job.)

There are a lot of people visit this site.... from all over the world, so we don't get everything accurate about other people's countries and, traditions and heritage.... that's what makes this site interesting...... we're here to learn about each other too...... as well as the music.

So please feel free to correct us.... and give us more info on Wales.

Slainte

alison


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Alan of Australia
Date: 28 Jan 99 - 05:38 AM

G'day,
It's interesting now to see how this thread developed. If I'd had all the "facts" and a copy of Spencer's poem to start with I'd never have written a song at all.

I suppose legends can be lost when someone rewrites them (although I don't expect "The Wolfhound" to supplant the Gelert legend) it's happened several times with this legend since it first appeared at least by about 540 AD in India.

Several months ago I acquired a copy of "Myths Of The Middle Ages" by Sabine Baring-Gould, edited by John Matthews. In this book B-G traces the Gelert legend to the 14th century 'Gesta Romanorum', which resulted in the tale being widely known throughout Europe (A Medi‘val urban myth?). In this version there is a knight named Folliculus, a greyhound and a serpent with the addition of a falcon which woke the greyhound when the serpent appeared. This in turn can be traced by a series of steps to the Indian tale mentioned above where the animals are an ichneumon and a black snake. This is recorded in the Sanskrit Pantschatantra. Further versions appear in Mongolia, China, Persia etc. etc. where the faithful animal varies amongst ichneumon, otter, weasel, cat or dog.

In fact it appears that the Gelert version was constructed by a man called David Pritchard who moved to Beddgelert in 1793 & adapted the tale to this new setting. With the help of parish clerk he erected the "grave" himself. He derived the name Gelert from the name of the village which in reality takes its name from the grave of an early Celtic warrior named Celert. It also seems that Pritchard told his version of the tale to Spencer who made the story more popular with his ballad version.

So, Rhiannon, if you are cross about the twisted story of your namesake please forgive me for "The Wolfhound". I don't think I've done much different from many other people over the centuries who have taken an incompletely remembered story and fleshed it out in their own way. I now have more knowledge of the background to the story but still would not see a need to change my version.

Cheers,
Alan


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: MMario
Date: 23 Mar 99 - 11:36 AM

I sang The WolfHound this weekend - and it was very well recieved.... Thanks to The Mudcat and Alan for the song!

MMario


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Subject: St. Guinefort
From: MMario
Date: 30 Sep 02 - 04:08 PM

reading a novel the other day and one of the charactors patron saint was St. Guinefort - who was a dog. curiosity aroused - I checked on the web and found this:

" ...St. Guinefort. I thought he was some saint. I made inquiries and at last heard that he was a certain greyhound killed in the following way. In the diocese of Lyons, close to the vill of the nuns called Villeneuve, on the land belonging to the lord of Villars-en-Dombe, there was a certain castle whose lord had a baby son from his wife. But when the lord and lady and the nurse too had left the house, leaving the child alone in his cradle, a very large snake entered the house and made for the child's cradle. The greyhound, who had remained there, saw this, dashed swiftly under the cradle in pursuit, knocking it over, and attacked the snake with its fangs and answering bite with bite. In the end the dog killed it and threw it far away from the child's cradle which he left all bloodied as was his mouth and head, with the snake's blood, and stood there by the cradle all beaten about by the snake. When the nurse came back and saw this, she thought the child had been killed and eaten by the dog and so gave
out an almighty scream. The child's mother heard this, rushed in, saw and thought the same and she too screamed. Then the knight similarly once he got there believed the same, and drawing his sword killed the dog. Only then did they approach the child and find him unharmed, sleeping sweetly in fact. On further investigation, they discovered the snake torn up by the dog's bites and dead. Now that they had learned the truth of the matter, they were embarrassed (dolentes)that they had so unjustly killed a dog so useful to them and threw his body into a well in front of the castle gate, and placing over it a very large heap of stones they planted trees nearby as a memorial of the deed.

But the castle was in due course destroyed by divine will, and the land reduced to a desert abandoned by its inhabitants. The local peasants hearing of the dog's noble deed and innocent death, began to visit the place and honor the dog as a martyr in quest of help for their sicknesses and other needs.
"

Stephen of Bourbon's exemplum On the worship of the dog Guinefort

elsewhere I found: "Despite the best efforts of the Inquisition to eradicate the cult of Saint Guinefort, people continued to visit the grove up to 1940, praying for the protection of their children. In 1987,.a movie was even made about the dog and his cult."


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Sep 02 - 04:16 PM

Yeah, I heard that Guinevere was a real dog.

~S~


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: Big Tim
Date: 01 Oct 02 - 03:43 AM

There's an Irish music group called Wolfhound, from Belfast I think, who seem to specialise in recording Irish rebel songs. There's also a major publisher in Dublin called Wolfhound.


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Subject: RE: Wolfhound
From: GUEST,palmer
Date: 07 Mar 05 - 01:49 PM

ite u write pretty good <>..........................lol joke not
love s u


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wolfhound / Beth Gelert...the Greyhound
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Mar 09 - 03:05 PM

Llewellyn (the lord)


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wolfhound / Beth Gelert...the Greyhound
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 22 Mar 09 - 02:48 PM

Versions of this story are still being told as current news. See Snopes. It says the oldest known version of the story comes from India, in the Panchatantra, and concerns a mongoose and a snake!


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wolfhound / Beth Gelert...the Greyhound
From: Joe Offer
Date: 29 May 17 - 12:02 AM

Do you think there's a connection between Brahmin and the Mongoose and Kipling's Rikki-Tikki-Tavi? Seems to me the earlier story must have inspired Kipling.
-Joe-


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Subject: Lyr Add: ECHO MOUNTAIN (James King)
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 29 Jun 17 - 11:30 PM

Here's a bluegrass-style retelling of the same story.

ECHO MOUNTAIN
As recorded by James King on "The Bluegrass Storyteller" (2005)

Now up on Echo Mountain in the spring of thirty-two
Jim and Becky Johnson, with a Bible and a mule,
Set out to raise a fam'ly, but the babies didn't come,
So when they found that old stray hound, they loved him like a son.

But soon their prayers were answered; the baby had his mama's eyes.
How that old dog loved him! He would never leave his side.
They could always trust that faithful hound with the baby they all loved,
Till the day the child was missin' and the dog was drenched in blood.

Now the cries on Echo Mountain are a painful thing to hear.
All the neighbors know the reason for the Johnsons' bitter tears.
When a man don't use good judgment, it's the innocent who pay.
Now the cries on Echo Mountain will haunt me to this day.

Jim picked up his rifle; he shot and killed the hound.
Oh, but there inside the cabin was the baby safe and sound.
When they found the back door open and two wolves lyin' still,
They knew they'd made a grave mistake with the righteous blood they spilled.

Now up on Echo Mountain you'll find a lonesome grave
Marked with a handmade marble stone that reads: "God bless the brave."
When daddy tells the story of the dog that saved my life,
He always asks forgiveness and the tears still fill his eyes.

Now the cries on Echo Mountain are a painful thing to hear.
All the neighbors know the reason for the Johnsons' bitter tears.
When a man don't use good judgment, it's the innocent who pay.
Now the cries on Echo Mountain will haunt me to this day.

When a man don't use good judgment, it's the innocent who pay.
Now the cries on Echo Mountain will haunt me to this day.

[Also recorded by Cedar Hill on "Stories" (2004) and by Dry Branch Fire Squad on "Echoes of the Mountain" (2009).

[There are other songs with the same title.]


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wolfhound / Beth Gelert...the Greyhound
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 30 Jun 17 - 05:47 AM

The legend of Beddgelert


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