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Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide
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Subject: Mudcat FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) From: Joe Offer Date: 17 Mar 00 - 05:06 PM Hello, everyone, and welcome to the Mudcat Cafe!Table of Contents (click here)This is a PermaThread™ for use as a guide for visitors and anybody else who might need help here. While most Mudcat threads are not censored or edited, I will monitor this one and maintain and edit it to serve as a guide to the Mudcat Cafe. Feel free to post questions and answers, but be aware that I'm going to edit this thread heavily. If you find messages at other parts of the forum that you think should be included here, please let me know about them. I would like to thank all the people who contributed material for this FAQ, with special thanks to Jon Freeman and Pene Azul and Jeri for all their technical help. If you're looking for a song, you'll often find it right here in the Digital Tradition Folk Song Database. Feel free to post a request, but we ask you to use the search box in the upper-left corner of this page (and most other Mudcat pages) to search the database and forum for your lyrics before you post a request for them. We have some 9,000 folk songs in the database, so it's one of the best places to look. Even if your song isn't in the database, our search engine will also search the forum for songs that may not yet have been included in the database. If you're looking for a folk song that isn't in the database or forum, start a new thread [click here to create a thread (topic)], and make sure the title or a phrase from the song you want is in the thread title. Generic titles like "desperately seeking lyrics" may end up being used for many different songs, and that gets very confusing. Please try to tell us whatever you know about the song - phrases you recall, where you heard it, and so on. Often, songs have various titles that can cause confusion, and a phrase may be a better way to locate a song. We specialize in folk music and blues. If the music you seek is of another genre, you may wish to try
The Mudcat FAQ (frequently asked questions)
Making Mudcat Accessible (click) Explore Our MenusBe sure to explore the links at the top of most Mudcat pages. Here they are again:
Quick Links Be sure to explore the Quick Links dropdown menu you'll find below, and on most Mudcat pages. Just click on the down arrow, and the menu will appear. On that menu, you'll find a link that will allow you to Search the Forum (or you can click here). Just select that link and hit the "go" button, and follow the search instructions. Dale Rose and others posted "thread of the day" messages and other things that have been deleted from this thread because they are not permanent in nature. Some of these messages have very valuable information, and you will find that those messages have been moved here (click). Searching Mudcat for Information |
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revised by Joe Offer, December 2023.
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Subject: Site Map and PermaThread Index From: Joe Offer Date: 17 Mar 00 - 05:27 PM This is a PermaThread™, intended to serve as an index to Mudcat and a permanent index for our PermaThreads™ and other memorable and notable threads. Feel free to post messages in this thread, but note that I reserve the right to edit or delete all messages here, so that this thread will serve as a permament reference.
PermaThreads™(threads maintained by various Mudcatters for use as permanent references)
Revised 11 Nov 2011 Handy Mudcat LinksUpdated 24 March 2020 |
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Subject: Basic Mudcat HTML From: Joe Offer Date: 17 Mar 00 - 06:28 PM You do not need to know any HTML to post messages at the Mudcat Cafe - but it's nice to know a little bit. I suppose the most basic HTML tag is the <br> line break. Mudcat automatically puts one at the end of every line you post, unless you have automatic line breaks turned off in the bottom of the message reply box. If you are copy-pasting text that already has line breaks visible, be sure to turn off the automatic line breaks. Once again, line breaks look like this: <br>If you see <br> in the text you're copying, be sure to turn Automatic Linebreaks OFF when you paste it into a Mudcat message.If you want to direct somebody to an interesting site on the Web (or to information that's at another location at the Mudcat Cafe), the best way to do it is by posting a clickable link. We have a Make a link ("blue clicky") tool at the bottom of message boxes that will make links for you. Click here to try it. You have to highlight and copy the text that results, and paste it into the proper place in your message. If you're posting links at Mudcat, the quotation marks are optional. I prefer not to use them, because they complicate the task of making links. Simple is better, I think. Fewer misteaks. I find it's best to open a new browser window [CTRL-N] and navigate your way to the site you want to link to. Highlight and copy [CTRL-C] the URL (address) of the site, and then go back to your Mudcat message and paste [CTRL-V] the URL into your link. Be sure to include the http:// in that URL. The quotation marks are standard procedure, but most links and HTML tags work just fine without quotation marks. I'd like ask our "regulars" to take the time to learn how to do within-Mudcat clickable links (internal links). When you make a link, leave out the http://XXX.mudcat.org (XXX being the name of the server). That way, the link keeps the reader in the server he/she was using. Our regulars post a lot of internal links, and I've had to spend a lot of time changing them. If you linked to ragtime or dharma or shorty or loki (all now dead), or even www - there are times that those servers aren't working, and your link then leads people to a dead end. The link maker tool handles this correctly - but it doesn't hurt to know how to do it yourself. The above tells you how to make clickable links. I'd also like to encourage you to explore all the links you'll find at Mudcat. For Mudcat Members, one very important link is the little grey box that sometimes appears and says You have XX Messages. The words in that box are a clickable link - clicking on the words will take you to your personal messages on your own personal page. Please take full advantage of personal messages for sending personal chit-chat and phone numbers and other personal stuff that doesn't belong in a public forum. Personal messages are one of the nicest advantages of Mudcat Membership. -Joe Offer- Here are some other HTML tags to try:
testing <i>testing (italics)</i> <b>testing (bold)</b> <font color=orange size=+2>testing (font colors)</font> <h3>testing (headline - please, no 2's or 1's)</h3>Clickable Links("blue clickies")for a thread: <a href=/thread.cfm?ThreadID=39542>(click here)</a>for a song (link preferably taken from SuperSearch/ Digitrad & Forum Search): <a href=/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=409>(click here)</a>Note how cleverly I have also deleted extraneous stuff from the end of the URL of both the thread and the song. All you need is; Now, to display angle brackets is in the Advanced Course.... Click here for more HTML stuffUpdated November 2003 |
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Subject: Submitting Links From: Joe Offer Date: 17 Mar 00 - 07:47 PM How to submit a link to Mudcat's Links PageOur links database and our membership database got bloated with duplicates, spam, and crass commercialism - so Mudcat owner Max Spiegel appointed me Gatekeeper.In general, you have to be a registered member - and then you can go to our Links Page and submit links. Then I review the links, and add them to our links database if they're appropriate. I occasionally get softhearted and add a link without requiring membership, if the link is of special interest to folk musicians. We were getting a lot of links submitted four or five times so they'd be in four or five categories; and we also got a lot of very wordy, self-aggrandizing link blurbs from budding singer-songwriters. We allow only one posting of a link, so choose your category carefully. Oh, and if you've given us a link to Page 1 of your Website, we don't allow a link to Page 2. If you're a performer, give us a link to one Website that tells your story; not to your Web page, your Facebook page, your Myspace page, and the fansite maintained by your mother-in-law. The one site you give us a link to, should give links to all those other places. I also control the membership database, another reason to be nice to me [I'm pretty easy - I just don't allow duplicate memberships, duplicate links, or links that aren't related to folk or blues]. If you'd like to join Mudcat or if you'd like to try to persuade me to post a link without requiring you to join, contact me by e-mail. Oh - and we don't do "links exchanges." Anyone is welcome to post a link to Mudcat on their Website - no need to ask permission. If you'd like to post a link of folk music interest on the Mudcat Links Page, become a member and submit the link yourself, so the wording and format are the way you want them. -Joe Offer, Mudcat Archivist, 5 August 2012- joe@mudcat.org |
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Subject: Mudcat Membership Benefits & Problems From: Joe Offer Date: 17 Mar 00 - 08:00 PM The Benefits of Mudcat MembershipSo, now maybe it's time to put up a consolidated message explaining the benefits of Mudcat membership. Here are the ones I can think of. Let me know the ones I missed.
-Joe Offer- How to JoinIf you've never registered with Mudcat before and you'd like to take advantage of our free, honest, no-strings attached Mudcat Membership, click on any Membership (click) link you see and submit the requested information. Mudcat will deposit a cookie in your computer so you'll be recognized, and then you can take advantage of our personal messaging and other special member features.
Solving Registration ProblemsIf you have been registered at any time in the past, please don't submit a new membership. If you can't figure out how to reset your cookie, go to the Help Forum (click) and ask for help. It's quite possible to fix things on your own. Here's the process that seems to work best:
If you've forgotten your password, don't worry. Go to Login (click) and fill in the information you know. One of two login pages will show up. One gives you a box that lets you select to have your password e-mailed to you. The other doesn't have that selection, but if you enter your user name and just leave the password box blank, you'll get another page that will ask if you want your password mailed. You'll get your password within seconds - Max's elves work very quickly. There are a couple of problems people have had. One is if they have their browser set so it won't accept cookies - just go to the "options" menu of your browser, and set it to accept cookies. The other is if you bookmark a Mudcat page other than the main page, www.mudcat.org - start at the main page when you begin a Mudcat session, and that should take care of it. Be sure to delete bookmarks to any other Mudcat pages. Also, some (but not all) of the information on your Mudcat registration is case sensitive. That means that if you are registered as "Joe Offer," you may not be able to log on as "joe offer" or "JOE OFFER." Be careful with capitalization. If that doesn't work, please click on my name below and e-mail me back with your real name and your Mudcat Name (the nickname you registered with), and your e-mail address. If you may have used another e-mail address when you registered, give me that, too. If you can do that, I'll try to talk you through fixing your registration cookie. It's usually pretty easy to do, but you have to log in with exactly the same Mudcat Name and e-mail address that's on your registration (and capitalization must be exactly the same). -Joe Offer (click to e-mail)- Duplicate Memberships |
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Subject: What's NOT Allowed From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 17 Mar 00 - 10:12 PM See the Posting Policy thread for recent developments.And there might be a request to people not to do undesirable things - that way when they start doing them it would be possible to refer back to this, which would make it less of a personal dispute.I refer most questions of etiquette to a truly wise person, Miss Manners, whose basic premise is the Golden Rule, that we should do unto others as we would have them do unto us, etc., etc. I fully agree with Miss Manners on this. The Washington Post's website also contains an archive of Miss Manners' columns.We believe that Mudcatters are blessed with common sense and admirable judgment, and should have little need of rules. The Powers That Be at Mudcat are tolerant of just about everything but intolerance. As for technical things, Mudcatters should refrain from posting embedded pictures and sounds from other sites because this slows down the loading of threads (use clickable links instead). Also, we usually try to discourage the posting of messages that are posted elsewhere and lyrics that are already in the database (clickable links or searching directions are usually better, with some common-sense exceptions). It's also usually better to avoid starting multiple threads on the same subject, as this tends to divide and confuse and duplicate discussions. It's usually better to resurrect and add to an old thread on a song, rather than starting a new one. There's no need for separate threads to request, post lyrics, post tune, and add comments on a song - all of these fit together quite nicely and make for a better discussion. We also do not permit the posting of lengthy non-music articles from other sources. If they fill more than a screen's worth of space, post a summary of the article in your own words, and provide a link to where the information can be found. Although Mudcat is a music forum, we welcome discussions of politics and other subjects, as long as discussion participants use their own words and ideas. -Joe Offer- MudcatiquetteJoe: I think there should be a paragraph or two on "Mudcat-equet". Alison made the first step with her request that requests for lyrics be more informative. One of my pet peeves is a title like "Please Help Me" with no reference to the problem. It would be nice to think of rules of behaviour that will avoid flame wars; but I don't have any concrete suggestions.Murray, your point is well taken, but I'm staying away from giving guidelines on etiquette. I figure that whatever I say, the nice people will be nice and the nasty ones will be nasty. I've given some guidelines above about selecting appropriate thread titles, but we will always have some dumb people who will start dumb threads with dumb titles. Ya gotta love 'em. I'll leave matters of etiquette to one of the true idols and inspirations of my life, Miss Manners (click).
Some people have suggested that there should be more rules around here, so that people know how to behave properly; and that this or that should be better-organized or have instructions that are clearer. Mudcat is governed by a principle of civil anarchy, and that principle gives Mudcat much of its spontaneity, intelligence, and friendly spirit. We don't want to see anything here that's too organized or too slick. It's OK for people to have to use their heads and explore a bit. There's a well-known Mudcatter who occasionally sends me a personal message to remind me how much this place resembles Golding's Lord of the Flies. There are times when I agree with him, but I generally find our anarchy and lack of organization to be quite wonderful.
Some people claim that the troll (sense 1) is properly a narrower category than flame bait, that a troll is categorized by containing some assertion that is wrong but not overtly controversial. See also Troll-O-Meter. Who's In Charge Here?Mrrzy asks: Hi, nother question that might be frequent - who does what here? I mean, there are occasional references from people who post frequently, who all seem to know that X will fix this or they hope Y will get rid of the duplicate posting or... it would be nice to have a Contacts list, like ask Joe for tech help but ask Max for whatever he seems to be helping about.Also, I seem to have read in this thread that the Help option for posting is for technical help; I've been using it whenever asking for input on anything that isn't specifically lyrics, so I didn't think the Lyrics Requested was the right topic. For instance, that lost book, or the jargon terms for folk singing. Should those have been BS? I would now say the latter Yes, but the former No; how about another category like Favors? Information Requested? Offline Help? Or something... Thanks, as always, -Mrr Hi, Mrrzy -
Updated July 2015
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Subject: Mudcat is about the Blues (and Folk) From: GUEST,Neil Lowe Date: 17 Mar 00 - 11:01 PM No reference to da blues in the introduction? I know folk is the overwhelming focus, but the heading at the top of the page does say: "A magazine dedicated to blues and folk music." Granted, the few of us that are still around might not be around much longer, what with: Whiskey, wimmin, Fast cars and hard livin' Chain-smokin' Camels Ramblin' around, Lookin' for my baby On every street corner downtown. Oh Lordy, I've paid my dues, Enough to buy Hades, And drown it in blues. I think even the founder of this Forum has been know to pay homage to the blues on occasion. Ooops! Glad you caught it before Max did. Mistake repaired. -Joe- |
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Subject: Posting Lyrics - how to do it From: Joe Offer Date: 19 Mar 00 - 09:24 PM Also, threads get llllllllllloooooooooonnnnnnnnngggggggggg sometimes. I had posted to the World Where Are You one, and later saw that someone had split off a smaller subthread for better loading, but the smaller one doesn't have my comment on it so I am not even sure how it got split up... And I'm a linguist too (in case you hadn't figured that out by my thread on jargon in folksongs)! So this was very interesting! (Not that I've noticed lots of errors, just curious. I was surprised not to see Ed credited with having recorded I've got..., but then again there are probably bunches of folks who also sang it who aren't there... I would suggest that if you feel McCurdy's version is sufficiently different to deserve addition to the database, then post the lyrics to a new thread and see what happens next. In any event, you are sure to elicit a new round of discussion, and someone is bound to profit from your work. Even if it is never added to the database, it will still be there in the threads for all to find by way of Max's super search. Somebody asked for a description of what Susan and I do to harvest songs for the database. Here's the process:
All this takes a lot of work, but thre are fringe benefits. I always have new material for my Wednesday night song circle. And you wouldn't believe the number of songs that Dick has in his head, and Susan has a serious passion for long ballads. NOW do you understand why it takes so long? I actually think it wouldn't help to have more people do the harvesting, because even my added presence can tend to confuse things and Susan and I are still learning how to avoid duplicating each other's work - but it sure helps when people post songs that are already formatted and annotated. -Joe Offer- Some of you may have noted that I marked Kendall's lyrics for "East Virginia" with a three-winged harvesting birdie ^^^ - the third wing means the song is redundant because it's already in the database. But it really isn't redundant. I don't think it's different enough to include in the database, but it's certainly of great value to have all the different variations posted in the forum. Thanks, Kendall. -Joe Offer- Partial Update July, 2008 |
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Subject: Join in on line with other Mudcatters From: Jon Freeman Date: 21 Mar 00 - 08:14 PM Some Mudcatters get together for on line chats and sing arounds and even concerts. Here are a few ideas:
Alas, most of these online gatherings are no longer. We used to have wonderful, worldwide song circles on PalTalk, but we haven't found a good replacement for PalTalk. -Joe- (29 Aug 2009) But COVID-19 hit us in 2020, and Mudcat responded in June 2020 with the Mudcat Worldwide Singaround, which meets on Zoom at 8 PM London time every Monday (noon in Los Angeles). Email Joe Offer joe@mudcat.org to get on the email list for notifications and the Zoom link, which is updated weekly. (Joe Offer, April 2022) Jon Hints, and Links and pointers to helpful threads (links submitted by various Mudcatters)
Lonesome EJ has volunteered to maintain the list below: Mudcat Classic ThreadsThe following links will take you to prime examples of the musical knowledge, humor, and thoughtfulness to be found in the Forum of the Mudcat Cafe.I had originally asked Rick for suggestions for a Classic Thread under the topic Technique and Instrument Discussions, which was why he started the Pickers Tips Thread. I had also planned a Traditional Music Discussions topic, but a lot of the ones I considered are already named in Alice's Memorable Threads. At any rate, I'll give you my picks at the risk of overlapping Rick and Alice. The individual threads may be changed from time to time, but the Topics should be ongoing.
-Lonesome EJ (updated 13 September 2000)-
Alice's Memorable Mudcat ThreadsThanks also to Alice Flynn. For quite some time, Alice has maintained links to memorable Mudcat threads on our Mudcat Links Page: |
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Subject: Why Didn't Anybody Answer Me? From: Joe Offer Date: 22 Mar 00 - 05:49 PM Transferred from another thread, and slightly edited. Thanks, Malcolm. -Joe Offer- Subject: RE: Whats the matter with you people???? From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 22-Mar-00 - 12:44 AM
Sometimes a question doesn't get answered, maybe because it's not expressed very clearly, or the thread-title is too general ("NEED HELP BADLY" turns up a good bit; lots of people don't bother looking at those) or because nobody knows the answer! |
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Subject: Thread Naming Conventions From: Elektra Date: 22 Mar 00 - 10:55 PM A quick list of thread naming conventions would be helpful, though I'm sure I'll leave a few out. Purpose ______________________________Format
*elektra*
P.S. All yours, Joe!from Gaz: BS: So that's what it stands for. From the nature of the 'contributions' I assumed it stood for Bullshit. That's right, Gaz. At Mudcat, "BS" stands for "breeze-shooting." "Breeze-shooting," of course, is a euphemism for "bullshit."I've had to change a lot of thread names in the last few days, and I can't quite figure out why there's a rash of naming music threads with the BS: designation. Please do not use the "BS:" designation when starting threads that discuss music.Thread #24630 Message #283140 Posted By: Gary T 23-Aug-00 - 08:05 AM Thread Name: What does 'BS:' stand for? Subject: RE: What does 'BS:' stand for?
Actually, what Joe mentioned--breeze shooting--is probably the most accurate way to look at it. Of course we all know that "bullshit" is the original word that BS indicates, but it has different shades of meaning. MichaelA's second post listed some of them. Here it essentially refers to something that's not the stated business at hand (folk and blues music), similar to having a "bull session" at college (instead of discussing studies) or "shooting the breeze" around the office water cooler (instead of talking about work). So I would say it means bullshit in the sense of breeze shooting. |
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Subject: Support the Mudcat-money matters From: GUEST,Mrrzy-at-work Date: 12 Apr 00 - 01:44 PM About those contributions and things, can you explain something someone mentioned in some thread at some point (wish we could do body searches!) about Amazon.com, and how if you are going to order from them if you do it through Mudcat then Mudcat gets a slice? And are there any other cooperative affiliations of this type? Mrzzy,if you click on the banner with the Mudcat Logo that says Help Support the Mudcat at the top of this page, you will get the answers to your first question. -Jon Freeman-Mrr says: Another question: What does the little SHOP line mean that sometimes, and sometimes not, appears below the date of the posting? Thanks, -Mrr Click on one, and see, Mrr. It leads you to recordings of songs mentioned in the message, and you can buy the recording and generate a small amount of income to help support Mudcat.Ok, I see what it DOES, but why or how does it get there? I have seen something under my name sometimes that didn't seem to relate to anything... I will try to find an example. Thanks again. I'd like to benefit Mudcat - pity I buy so little music! It gets there by Max's Magic, Mrr. Max is the whiz who keeps this place running. Trouble with Thread Titles and Starting ThreadsMrrzzy: Another question: sometimes when creating a new thread, I change my mind about what the title should be halfway through. Then when I post, what I see posted is always what I first typed, not what I had (by the end of my typing) decided to title the thread. Does it save the thread title as soon as you tab into the body, and if so, how can you change your thread title from your first stab? Should I wait to title till I'm completely done thinking? The title for the thread appears to be set when you first go to create it. When you enter and submit the post, you have the option to change the subject field but not the actual thread title. If you change your mind halfway through creating a new thread, I would suggest that you copy the text that you have already typed, abandon that attempt (you can do that by using your back button but make sure you don't hit the Submit button before doing this) and starting again with the correct title. You can then copy what you have already typed back into the form. -Jon Freeman- |
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Subject: Definitions and Terminology From: Night Owl Date: 18 Apr 00 - 01:40 PM What's a THREAD, anyhow? "Thread" is a term that has been around the Internet for a long time, probably from the ancient time when there were Newsgroups but no World Wide Web (WWW). A "threaded" discussion is one that has a number of separate messages that discuss a single topic. If you're a Mudcat Member, you can trace threads that are interesting to you, and check to see if messages have been posted to them recently. Otherwise, threads stay listed on our forum menu for 24 hours after the most recent message was posted. You can bring a thread back onto the menu for another 24 hours as often as you like - find it with the "search" engine or filter, and post a new message to the thread. The message can contain just the word "refresh," if you like. We delete duplicate, blank, and excess "refresh" messages when we find them, so don't worry about your "refresh" message cluttering anything. We cannot delete excess or duplicate threads, so try not to create a second thread on a subject when there has already been one - better to refresh the old thread and continue the discussion there. I don't know about how many threads and personal messages you can keep on your personal page, but I don't think I'd worry about it unless your personal page starts loading very slowly. I keep about 40 traces threads and 40 personal messages on my personal page, which is probably too many because the page is slow to load - but I'm not ready to delete them yet. Do as I say, not as I do... -Joe Offer- What's "Refresh" Mean? Somebody asked why a Mudcatter posted a message with just the word "refresh" in it. The Mudcatter didn't have anything to add, but he refreshed the thread and brought it to the top of the Forum Menu by posting a new message to it. That made me notice it. I checked the one songbook I thought might have the requested song, but had no luck. Maybe somebody else will know it. If there's no answer to a thread in a day or two, find the thread using our "filter" and post a new message to refresh it. Messages disappear from the menu if nobody posts a new message in 24 hours, but you can always find it by putting a phrase from the thread title in the filter box and setting "age" to an appropriate time, like three years. If you don't remember the thread title, try putting a phrase from the thread in our "search" box. Define "mudcat" mud cat any of several catfishes capable of living in Muddy Waters.Catfish and Muddy Waters are inextricably connected to the Blues. Max started the place as a blues site, but generously invited us folkies to join him. Sometimes, he's still not too sure of us. Ask him what he thinks of Gordon Bok. What's a cookie? A cookie is a small file a Website deposits in your computer. The cookie identifies you the next time you visit the site. Your Mudcat cookie gives you access to various features, particularly the ability to send personal messages and to post in the forum and be identified as a member with a known personality. When you log out of Mudcat, the cookie is deleted from your computer. When you log in, it's put back on. And an explanation of GUEST. Another advantage of Mudcat Membership is that the messages you post are identified as coming from you. If you are not registered or if you post messages from a computer that does not have your Mudcat cookie, you will have to fill your own name in on the the messages you post, and you will be identified as Guest, So-and-So. Guests are welcome to post messages at the Mudcat, to don't be taken aback by the fact that you're identified as a guest. If you're a member and the messages you post identify you as a guest, then it's time to Reset your cookie (click) |
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Subject: Mudcat T-Shirts From: Mrrzy Date: 10 May 00 - 02:20 PM Hey, how long does it take for a Mudcat t-shirt to arrive? It hasn't been that long, I'm just wondering. I think about 6 to 8 weeks, Mrrzy. It's all done by volunteer people who have too much to do and too little time, so it takes a while. Service is slow, but very reliable, friendly, and conscientious. -Joe Offer- Pass Mrzzy but for UK people like myself, Bill Sables helps out and is likely to supply quicker than Mudcat themselves can and cut some postage costs out but with the profit still going to the MC Jon Freeman |
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Subject: Submitting Tunes From: IvanB Date: 27 May 00 - 08:57 PM Joe, one newcomer question which I'd like answered: I posted a lyric request last week, which another MC'er fulfilled within a day. Since I have the tune for the requested lyrics, when would it be appropriate to submit it? Hi, Ivan - If we don't already have the tune in the database, send a MIDI or ABC file off to MMario or to Joe Offer (joe@mudcat.org). Be sure to tell us where the lyrics of the song were posted, so he can link to the tune. If you have the tune in other formats, you'll find a Digital Tradition e-mail address in the "Contact Us" page on Quick Links - or you can post a message in the thread and ask somebody to type up a MIDI from whatever resource you have. More Information on Posting Tunes Here (click) |
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Subject: Sending Personal Messages to Multiple Recipients From: Joe Offer Date: 17 Jul 00 - 07:44 PM Hi, Mrrzy - no, you can't send a personal message to more than one person at a time, but I still think it's better not to use the Forum for stuff that's not of general interest. What you can do is highlight the text of your message (use the "shift" and arrow keys on your keyboard - the highlighted text changes color). Then copy [CTRL-C] the text onto the clipboard of your computer. Then start a new personal message to the second person on your list and paste [CTRL-V] the text into the second message. Copy-Paste is a technique that works both in Windows and (with just a few differences) Mac - and you can use it on the Internet and in all sorts of other applications to save you a lot of typing. If you want to send a second person a copy of a message you've already sent, you can click on View Your Sent Messages at the bottom of your personal messages list. Just highlight and copy the old message, and paste it wherever you like. Hope that helps. -Joe Offer- P.S. It's a nice idea to use personal messages to alert people to threads that might interest them. HTML works the same way in personal messages as it does in the Forum, so you can send links and use line breaks and fancy fonts and all that stuff. You can also copy-paste a forum message you're posting and send it as a personal message. I'm going to do that with this one, and send it to you as a personal message. |
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Subject: Revealing Personal Information - Privacy From: Joe Offer Date: 18 Jul 00 - 04:32 AM I don't worry about using my real name too much - and my name is a lot more unusual than most. I don't give my address on the Internet or in the phone book - I use a post office box. I do not give my full name, my date of birth, or my social security number unless the recipient of the information has a darn good reason to know. If I can't figure out why they would have a legitimate need for the information, I don't give the information. But I do like to be known by my real name, and it's nice when I meet Mudcatters in real life and they know immediately who I am. I find it's helpful to use my real name online. It hasn't caused me any problems, but I do use some precautions:
-Joe Offer- |
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Subject: Protect Your Privacy From: Big Mick Date: 18 Jul 00 - 09:31 AM Please pay very close attention to Joe's post. He knows this stuff very well. Before he retired, Joe was an investigator for the government. And, I wager, a very good one. All the best, Mick Q: I had to relocate because of a security reason. Could you clarify: if I register as a member, is my email address seen by anyone who comes here? (I don't want to be found via reverse-search.) Just because I'm paranoid... Hi - The staff and a few select volunteers have access to your registration information, but it is not posted anywhere public unless you ask to have your name posted publicly at Member Photos & Info. We try to be very careful with registration information, and we never use it for commercial purposes - we're here for fun, not money. I'm a retired federal investigator, and I think it's quite safe. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: Digital Tradition for Windows- Donkey Works From: John in Brisbane Date: 02 Aug 00 - 08:04 PM If you've downloaded the entire Digital Tradition Database, Donkey Works is an excellent FREE program for PC's with Win 95 or later. This is a great way to explore the treasures in the Digital Tradition offline. Apart form being free, the searches are more versatile than an on-line Internet search and don't consume air time or attract timed call charges.
And you can print direct from the program with your choice of font, or copy the text into your favourite word processor.
Regards, John
-Joe Offer, May, 2005- Sheet Music for Digital Tradition SongsI'm trying to figure out how to better get tunes. Searching lyrics is OK, but I'm having problem with tunes. I really want sheet music, so I downloaded ABC2win and found the 'post tunes here' Mudcat thread, but found only unindexed posts. Also, I haven't figured out how to convert the ABC notation to sheet music without having to cut and paste. Any advice?From the forum you will have to cut and paste in order to produce sheet music from the posted abc's OR the miditxt. If you have a program that will import midi's - then you can use the midi's in the database and/or on Alan of Oz's mudcat midi site. Check out NoteWorthy Composer. There is a site called Yet Another Digital Tradition (click) listed on our "links" page. It has the ability to convert the tunes from our database into various formats, including sheet music. For converting tunes not yet in our database, you may want to look at the Mudcat ABC Tune Guide and the Mudcat MIDI Guide. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: rabbitrunning Date: 30 Aug 00 - 01:00 AM Hey ho, I'm unclear about the harvesting process. Are the "harvesters" humans or a computer program? And why are some songs not harvested? How can we tell that they've even been noted by a harvester if we've seen them in a thread? If I see a song in a thread that I didn't find in the database (and would love to see there) but it isn't in the right format, should I repost it correctly so it gets noticed? What about variants? How much of a difference should there be to make a song worth "harvesting?" Does a tune make a song more likely to be harvested? I'm looking up a lot of girl scout songs, and I'm sort of frustrated by how many of them I find in threads, but not in the DT. I did see one commment that rounds, in particular, weren't going to be picked up without tunes, but I'm not sure why some of the others aren't being included. |
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Subject: Harvesting Lyrics From: Joe Offer Date: 30 Aug 00 - 02:48 AM Well, the "harvesters" are Susan of DT and Joe Offer and Jim Dixon. Dick Greenhaus does some, but he does mostly the tunes and the technical stuff. I have met Susan of DT and found her to be quite human, and a very nice and interesting person. Several people have posted documented evidence in the forum that has almost convinced me that Joe Offer is a computer program created by Max, but my mother insists it isn't true. Mom thinks Joe Offer is human. My ex-wife thinks so, too. And being quite human, we occasionally miss songs that have been posted. If you post a song and don't see a ^^harvesting birdie at the end of the lyrics by the end of a week, send Susan or me a personal message, and tell us where we can find it. If you're willing to give us a little more slack, post a link to your song in the Songs you've posted (click) thread, and we will harvest and mark it at our leisure. If you post songs, please post them in the Digital Tradition format, which is explained toward the top of this FAQ thread. We'd like to get tunes for all the songs in the database, and you'll find tune posting instructions in the FAQ and in the Please Post Tunes Here thread. Rounds don't do anybody much good without a tune, so Dick usually stays away from them. Dick and Susan have maintained the Digital Tradition since 1988. They make the decisions about what goes into the database, and what doesn't. I got recruited at the beginning of 2000. I just harvest, categorize, and format them, match them with the tune files, and send them as text files to Dick. Generally, alternate versions of a song are included in the database only if the lyrics are substantially different from what's here. If a song is the same except for a few verses, I's suggest that you post the entire song so we know where all the verses fit, but mark the alternate verses some way so we know what's different and what's not. There are some glaring mistakes in some songs in the database, and you're welcome to submit corrections (best to do it as a whole set of lyrics, with notes below to tell us what you think should be corrected). Remember, though, that we are dealing with folk songs, and we expect slight variations in lyrics and tunes and don't pay too much attention to that. If Ewan MacColl sang one word and A.L. Lloyd sang another, we probably won't care to make a change. -Joe Offer, human being- Somebody asked for a description of what Susan and I do to harvest songs for the database. Here's the process:
All this takes a lot of work, but thre are fringe benefits. I always have new material for my Wednesday night song circle. And you wouldn't believe the number of songs that Dick has in his head, and Susan has a serious passion for long ballads. NOW do you understand why it takes so long? I actually think it wouldn't help to have more people do the harvesting, because even my added presence can tend to confuse things and Susan and I are still learning how to avoid duplicating each other's work - but it sure helps when people post songs that are already formatted and annotated. Dick and Susan, is there any information you can add to my description of the process? -Joe Offer- Some of you may have noted that I marked Kendall's lyrics for "East Virginia" with a three-winged harvesting birdie ^^^ - the third wing means the song is redundant because it's already in the database. But it really isn't redundant. I don't think it's different enough to include in the database, but it's certainly of great value to have all the different variations posted in the forum. Thanks, Kendall. -Joe offer- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: GUEST,SharonA Date: 13 Jun 01 - 02:32 PM I'm a newcomer (newbie? or newkie?) and I just read your instructions about creating line breaks. I'm confused about the following text: "Most word processors will let you search for 'special characters' - search for a paragraph mark or carriage return, and "replace all" with both a paragraph mark and a <br> line break (if you remove all the paragraph marks and just replace them with line breaks, you get a jumble of words that's hard to work with)." Does this mean I need to type the 'less than - br - greater than' symbol ONLY, or the symbol AND a hard return? Or the hard return and THEN the symbol??? Thanks for your help. Hi, Sharon - you can replace those carriage returns with just a <br> line break and then paste the whole mess into Mudcat. I replace with both a carriage return and then a line break because the end product is easier for me to review - it comes out with a line break at the beginning of each line except the first, and that makes it easy for me to see it's OK. Welcome to Mudcat. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: Posting Songs for the Digital Tradition From: Joe Offer Date: 21 Jun 01 - 10:45 PM This came up in the Help Forum, and I thought I'd post a copy of my reply here. I don't worry too much about thread titles for searching purposes. The Filter is the only thing that searches thread titles, and it covers only three years. The SuperSearch (Digitrad and Forum Search) is based on an index that is rebuilt every few days, so recent messages aren't included in SuperSearch. I don't know if SuperSearch covers thread and message titles, or if it just searches the text of messages. When I search for songs to harvest, I use the old, reliable Forum Search that's available in QuickLinks. It searches by title and by user name, or both. If you'd like to help make it easy for Jim Dixon and me to find a song to harvest (if the song doesn't have ADD and the song title in the message title), just post a message below the song - title it ADD and the song's name, and put "see above" in the body of the message. If you've posted songs, it's a good idea to add a link to them in the Songs You've Posted thread. That makes it easy for Jim and me (and Susan, sometimes) to find the songs, and it makes a handy index. I know the thread is past the 100-message cutoff that we usually have, but most of the messages there are reasonably short and it doesn't seem to take that long to load the thread. I think there's a part 2 of the thread, if you're squeamish about adding to part 1. If a song has been posted for over a week and doesn't have harvesting marks, send a personal message to me or to Jim Dixon if you think it warrants harvesting. If you're making your own changes to songs or if you're adding verses, please take note that we're trying to have mostly the traditional versions of songs in the Digital Tradition. If you want to let people know about your version of a song, please make it clear in the message that the version is your own. If you post a song you've written yourself, please put your name (or Mudcat Nickname) as the songwriter in the usual Digital Tradition format
You're free to post whatever you like at Mudcat, although we ask that you don't copy-paste lyrics from the Digital Tradition or from other threads. If it's a song that's of no particular interest to folkies, it's preferable that you just post a link. If it's one that folkies might enjoy (and it isn't in the Digital Tradition or Forum, then please post the complete lyrics, plus give us a link to your source of information (or tell us where it came from, if not from the Web). Now, although you're free to post anything, that doesn't mean that we're required to harvest it. Dick says we'll accept anything for the Digital Tradition - but Dick doesn't do the harvesting. Susan of DT, Jim Dixon, and I do it, and I think we'll confess that we bypass some songs at times. However, remember that you have three chances - Susan of DT, Jim, and Joe. Your song may make Joe and Susan groan, but Jim's an old softie... No word yet on when the next edition of the Digital Tradition will come out. Dick had a crash on the computer he I think it's important that we take our time with the DT so that it is the best information we can gather. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: Why line breaks and blue clickys From: Joe Offer Date: 01 Jul 01 - 10:19 PM I got an e-mail from somebody who wondered why Mudcat doesn't make clickable links automatically when somebody posts an URL or an e-mail address. Here's my response. Let me know what you think. -Joe Offer- Mudcat works off a program called ColdFusion. Max Spiegel, our Webmaster, can set all sorts of options on ColdFusion. One would add line breaks automatically instead of forcing us to put <br> at the end of each line when we post lyrics. I believe there is another option that would automatically make clickable links out of World Wide Web URLs and e-mail addresses. The problem with both of these options is that once you choose them, the line breaks are added and the clickable links are created, whether you want them or not. Max chose to allow us to choose how our posts look. It means we have to learn to do some simple HTML, but that's kind of an interesting and worthwhile challenge. We have experimented with the options, but we felt too caged-in by the results. It's like riding a bike with training wheels after you've learned to ride without - you feel very restricted in what you can do. If you ever have any questions about how to do things, take a look at the FAQ (frequently asked questions), and follow the link to the Mudcat HTML Guide. If you have more questions, post them in the HTML Guide thread. |
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Subject: Digital Tradition Corrections From: Joe Offer Date: 17 Aug 01 - 07:33 PM If you have corrections to the Digital Tradition, post them. It's that simple. No magic formula. We'll send a correction file to Dick, and he'll look at what you say and decide whether it's worth adding to the database. Put the word ADD in the title of your message, and make clear in the text that you're submitting a correction. If there's an existing thread on the song, post your corrections there. If not, start a new thread. |
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Subject: HearMe and PalTalk From: Joe Offer Date: 16 Oct 01 - 11:45 PM Over the last few years, Mudcatters have used the HearMe and PalTalk services to gather for online concerts and song circles. Both these services are in a state of flux, so our procedures for singing sessions keep changing. Click here for a thread that should have the latest information on Mudcat online sings. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: Cookie Problems - probably on your computer From: Joe Offer Date: 30 Nov 01 - 11:49 AM Somebody asked me why he keeps having cookie problems. Here's my answer. Any other ideas? -Joe Offer-
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Subject: Internal Blue Clickys From: Joe Offer Date: 01 Dec 01 - 01:51 PM
for a thread: <a href=/thread.cfm?ThreadID=39542>(click here)</a>for a song (link preferably taken from SuperSearch/ Digitrad & Forum Search): <a href=/@displaysong.cfm?SongID=409>(click here)</a>Note how cleverly I have also deleted extraneous stuff from the end of the URL of both the thread and the song. All you need is;
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Subject: Searching for an individual's posts From: Joe Offer Date: 03 Feb 02 - 01:53 AM Somebody asked how to find all the messages a Mudcatter has posted. You can search under user name and/or message title in the Mudcat Forum Search, which is in the QuickLinks dropdown menu on most pages at Mudcat - explore all the QuickLinks, and you'll find lots of handy stuff. If you look at an individual message posted by so-and-so, you'll see that the sender's name is a clickable link - click on it, and you'll find that all of the sender's messages will appear. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: Personal Messages From: bfolkemer Date: 15 Mar 02 - 09:18 AM Hi! How do I send a personal message to a mudcatter? One of the members will send me a hard copy of some tunes if I send him my postal address. Thanks! Beth |
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Subject: Finding things at Mudcat From: Joe Offer Date: 07 May 02 - 12:42 AM Spaw posted this in another thread, and I thought it was worth copying over to the FAQ. -Joe Offer- Thread #47291 Message #704520 Posted By: catspaw49 04-May-02 - 10:17 PM Thread Name: HELP TO FIND OLD THREAD Subject: RE: HELP TO FIND OLD THREAD
Jeepster.......You can thank Jeff as you did for this one, but let me help you a bit for future reference. |
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Subject: Requests for editing messages From: Joe Offer Date: 13 May 02 - 12:57 PM In general, please don't ask us to edit messages or delete duplicate posts. We have a number of JoeClones who monitor the Forum, and they have been instructed to delete duplicate posts when they see them, leaving only the duplicate that was posted most recently. If you ask us to go to the Forum to make corrections of non-critical errors, we often go looking for a message that has already been deleted or repaired, and that's frustrating. If you make mistakes on a post and you want to correct them, just post a second message, with the errors corrected. The first post will most probably be deleted - and the world won't end if it doesn't get deleted. The main thing we need to know about in the Help Forum are critical problems, or requests for help resetting cookies - things like that. If there are seriously objectionable messages you think we should review, send a personal message to both Joe Offer and Pene Azul. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: Selling Items on Mudcat / auction From: Mr Happy Date: 11 Jun 02 - 12:17 PM i've some questions about buying & selling items on mc. 1. is it allowed? 2. is it allowed to post buy/sell/swop ads on the open forum or is there a special place for these? [if its allowed] the reason i'm asking is i've got an instrument i bought some time ago & although i persevered in trying to learn to play it i can't do it well enough for my own satisfaction. i'd be interested in exchanging it for another instrument. can you help? thanks mr h Hi, Mr. Happy. Yeah, you can do it in a regular thread in the Forum, or you can sell it through the Mudcat Auction and give Mudcat a percentage of the sale price. We don't want to turn Mudcat into a marketplace, but it's ok to do that sort of thing occasionally. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: Please Don't Copy-Paste Long Non-Music Articles From: Joe Offer Date: 27 Jun 02 - 01:05 PM Please remember that Mudcat is a Music Forum. We welcome discussion of all topics, but we give special emphasis to music. If you wish to discuss other topics, you are welcome to post your own opinions. Please do not copy-paste the entire texts of lengthy non-music articles that are available elsewhere on the Internet - just post a link and summarize the article in your own words. We don't routinely delete threads because they're political or controversial. We DO delete cut-and-paste non-music articles when we find them. We don't have room for people to debate simply by throwing newspaper articles at each other - but we DO allow political discussions if people express their own opinions. If you find music information or lyrics you wish to share, particularly if it is about folk music, please DO post the entire text, plus a link to where you found it. Thank you. -Joe Offer- Possible revision: Our copy-paste limits apply only to non-music items. If it's about music, please post the entire text, if at all possible. For non-music articles that you want to copy and post, our limit is one screen of text, which is a lot of information. If the article is longer, post excerpts or a summary in your own words, plus a link to the source of the text. Whenever you post information from other sources, please tell us where you got it from - this is especially important when you are posting lyrics, because it helps answer a lot of questions. Generally, we ask people NOT to post lyrics that are copied directly from the Digital Tradition (or Yet Another Digital Tradition), or from messages already posted in the Forum - it confuses our song harvesters. Blues Fake Book |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Mr Happy Date: 19 Jul 02 - 05:27 AM i've recently been exploring some of the threads posted in the past, some going back several years. sometimes a topic in these old threads seems also relevant now, so i've refreshed it along with adding my comments. often these revived threads are then further added to by other respondents [often new mcs] some of these threads are now getting inconveniently long. i've looked through the various mc resources & faqs on the subject of making 'blue clickies' but these seem to refer to making links to other sites. i know i'm being very long winded here, so to avoid beating about the bush or procrastinating any further, [:)],i'll come to the point. can someone give info. on how to make 'blue clickies' as links for the purpose of making 'part 2,3, etc' threads for the overly long ones mentioned above? i'd also need to be able to make retrospective links back to the original thread[s]. i'm also a bit dim on being able to absorb technical stuff, so i'd appreciate it if the instructions for the procedure could be made as a simple step-by-step progression. like: 1. do something 2. do something else 3. do something more etc many thanks in advance, mr happy
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Nigel Parsons Date: 19 Jul 02 - 06:03 AM Mr Happy: There may be a standard method (but I think not). So, what I have done in the past, and which seems to work. Remembering that you can't do a clicky until you know the thread ID, you must post the new thread first. This often leads to last minute entries in the old thread, putting it ahead of the new thread in the list. So, 1,think of title for new thread 2,Check 'Thread ID of old thread' either write it down, or, if crafty, cut'n'paste from the current address (e.g. this one shows in current address as "http://www.mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=19340#750935". you need only cut'n'paste the bit between the "org/" and the "#". i.e "thread.cfm?threadid=19340") 3, compose the initial message for the new thread, referring back to the old with a clicky. E.g see [a href=thread.cfm?threadid=19340]Name of Old Thread[/a] (in practise, the square brackets "[" should be the 'less than & greater than'"<" brackets., and the bit after the "a href=" is the cut'n' paste you made. 4,Submit this as your new thread. 5,Note the address of this new thread (as in 2 above) 6,Post message at end of old thread with a "clicky" to the new thread. (In this final message I always try and leave several blank lines before a final comment [say 6 line breaks] to the effect "Please post all messages to the new thread") 7,Check the list of current threads to ensure that the new one is higher up the list, if not, refresh it. It is worth composing both messages in something like wordpro, on separate pages as 'old thread' & 'new thread', and minimising them on your tool bar. You can then post the 'new' message by starting a new thread, and pasting your message. Note the new thread ID, type it into your 'old thread' message, and cut'n'paste that. This reduces the time between posting the two messages, and avoids a rush job. Nigel |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Watson Date: 19 Jul 02 - 06:42 AM Mr Happy. Nigel got in before me, and my explanation is much the same, but you can cut and paste my example if it makes it any easier for you. Start your new thread Make a note of the threadid number Go back to the old thread Type in a line like: <a href="thread.cfm?threadid=xxxxx">Click here</a> ...but instead of the red xxxxx put in the number you have noted. Either use the Click here or substitute your own text. Put whatever explanation you feel is appropriate Submit Message and away you go. |
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Subject: Searching/Filter From: robinia Date: 05 Nov 02 - 12:38 AM How do you back check the forum for say a month or so? I know I'm SUPPOSED to be able to do this because there's a pull-down for varying time periods, but no matter what I "pull down" to, my screen maxes out at about four or five days. (Yes, I'm still trying to chase down the most recent thread on The Knight and Shepherd's Daughter). What am I not doing? Hi, Robinia - the best way to search by thread title is to use the filter. Put a pertinent word from the thread title in the filter box, and set the age back an appropriate length of time. The thread you started is here (click). The previous thread is here (click). Be sure to check the crosslinks at the top of the threads. -Joe Offer- | ||||
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Subject: Links From: GUEST,Q Date: 11 Nov 02 - 08:12 PM There used to be a Links list (very long) at top right. Part of it seems to be buried as links under Site map, "Links," but where is Max Hunter, Lomax Southern trip, etc. I was trying to see if the Wolf Collection had a link. No can find. Links (click) |
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Subject: preformat tags From: Joe Offer Date: 07 Dec 02 - 12:50 PM The <pre> tag is the best way to post chords, but it does not make line breaks. And if you don't have line breaks put in manually or automatically, you'll have an 'orrible mess. If your material already has line breaks in it, make sure the "automatic linebreaks" feature is turned OFF. Leave it ON is you're copy-pasting a straight text file, with no line breaks or HTML tags in it. Be sure to close the preformat tag with </pre> at the end of the section with the chords. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: Can Mudcat Cookies Carry a Virus? From: GUEST Date: 27 Dec 02 - 10:48 AM I'm thinking of becoming a member, and have checked a good deal of the FAQ, but have not found info on this: Will, or could the cookie leave by computer vulnerable to virus? This may seem a foolish question to some, but I'm new at this and I don't want to stuff things up. Hi - the answer to your question is an emphatic No! No need to worry about that. Mudcat cookies won't harm your computer. They are not fattening or hazardous in any way. |
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Subject: Thanks for recognizing my parents From: GUEST,DianElvin@bigpond.com Date: 17 Feb 03 - 08:19 PM I found my parents' work alive and kicking on your site. All I have to say is "thank you"! They would have been thrilled! Much better than being on a shelf in their out-of-print books. The words dance on your site. I put "Montgomerie" into your site and found 88 hits! Wonderful! Where are you? Good luck to you all. Dian Montgomerie Elvin Daughter of: William Montgomerie (1904 - 1994) and Norah (Shargool) Montgomerie (1909 - 1998) |
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Subject: BS and Music threads - mixed or separate? From: Joe Offer Date: 18 Apr 03 - 11:33 PM On March 3, 2003, we changed the Forum Menu so that all the music threads are at the top of the Forum Menu, and non-music "BS" threads are at the bottom. We did this to give our music threads better exposure. We realize that not everyone will like this change, so we worked out a solution: Registered Mudcatters who'd like to have the old "mixed" format on their Forum Menu should go to membership, check the appropriate box toward the bottom of the page, and click the "submit" button. Your cookie will be reset, showing that you have the mixed-format preference. Uh, well...it doesn't seem to work any more for me. Jeff says it should work for those who don't have a Mudcat cookie. If you're registered and logged in, your Mudcat cookie overrides it. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: How Many Characters in a Title? From: Allan C. Date: 09 May 04 - 03:38 PM I've searched the FAQ and cannot find anywhere that tells how many characters one can put in a thread title. Does the total number include the thread designation and punctuation, such as, BS: ?
-Joe- |
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Subject: RE: Don't post e-mail addresses From: Joe Offer Date: 21 Mar 05 - 11:47 AM I really shouldn't have to post a reminder about this, but I guess some people just don't catch on. On Saturday, somebody posted another Mudcatter's e-mail address in a political thread. It's true that the address had been posted elsewhere at Mudcat, but not in a controversial thread. I deleted the message as soon as I found it, but the damage had already been done. The Mudcatter's e-mail was swamped with e-mails that condemned her for her opinions - and the e-mails came from several addresses, none of which were registered as members at Mudcat. If you post your own e-mail address or personal information at Mudcat, please be mindful that you do so at your own risk. I post mine, but I have good reason to. But PLEASE don't post anybody else's e-mail or phone or personal information in a public message, unless it is an e-mail address or information that is openly published at other locations for business purposes. Thanks. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: Letters with diacritics From: wysiwyg Date: 04 Apr 05 - 09:30 AM Letters with diacritics I believe these can all be copy-pasted and turn out right: Extended ASCII: Æ Á Â À Å Ã Ä Ç É Ê È Ë Í Î Ì Ï Ñ Ó Ô Ò Ø Õ Ö Ú Û Ù Ü Ý á â æ à å ã ä ç é ê è ë í î ì ï ñ ó ô ò ø õ ö ß ú û ù ü ý ÿ Czech/Slovak characters: Č č Ě ě Ň ň Ř ř Š š Ů ů Ž ž Hungarian characters: ő Ő ű Ű Polish characters: Ą ą Ć ć Ę ę Ł ł Ń ń Ś ś Ź ź Ż ż Romanian characters: Ă ă Ș ș Ț ț Turkish characters: Ğ ğ İ ı Ş ş ~S~
-Joe Offer- |
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Subject: Happy! Happy? From: Joe Offer Date: 17 Apr 05 - 12:08 AM In the Help Forum (click), somebody noticed two threads they thought were duplicates. One was titled Happy? - April 16, and the other was Happy! - April 16. There was also one called Happy! Sam on March 31, 2003. There was another on August 31, 2001; and a few others I'll track down and add to this list. The "Happy!" and "Happy?" threads are a trademark of the infamous and inimitable Abby Sale, and I ask that we reserve that title format to Abby. I'm looking forward to what Abby comes up with in the future. -Joe Offer- You'll find historic "Happy!" posts at Dick Gaughan's Website. Note:The "Happy!/Happy?" format is reserved to Abby Sale. If anyone else starts a thread with that format, it will be renamed. |
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Subject: Tricks for viewing long threads From: Joe Offer Date: 10 Aug 05 - 01:31 PM In the column showing the number of messages logged for each thread, some of the larger number are shown in blue, underlined, suffixed with the letter 'd' and asterisked. What does all that mean? Have you tried this?
It's a little-known feature that Jeff designed, and some people have found it very useful. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: Using the filter From: autolycus Date: 25 Jan 06 - 07:26 PM Hi Joe, I'm following the instructions for recalling a thread that's dropped off the current list, ending with pressing the grey Refresh button, and nothing happens for me. Sorry if this has been dealt with somewhere (Haven't read thru all this thread);I don't know where. Auto.
-Joe- |
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Subject: Tech Tips PermaThread From: wysiwyg Date: 18 Feb 06 - 10:04 PM Remember the Mudcat permathread of Tech Tips??? ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: wysiwyg Date: 19 Mar 06 - 01:04 PM Joe, would you say something about old threads being closed now (for site tech reasons I guess) and that you can be PMed to ask that they be re-opened? ~Susan |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Brass Monkey Date: 19 Mar 06 - 02:52 PM How do you create a complete new subject for a thread? |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Changing Post Subject Lines From: wysiwyg Date: 19 Mar 06 - 02:59 PM You can change the subject line of your post, but not the thread title-- look in the text box at the top of the compose window, and at the subject line of my reply to you. The trick you learn after being here awhile is, when it is a good idea to start a new thread as an offshoot, and when not. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 19 Mar 06 - 08:41 PM If it's a completely new topic, use the create a new thread link on the Forum Menu - but use the Filter or search engine to check to see if your topic already has a thread you can resurrect. There are some old threads that were closed for housecleaning purposes, particularly old "BS" threads. They can be reopened as needed - just ask. In some closed threads, it's obvious that they were closed because of contentiousness or obnoxiousness or repetition - generally, we don't reopen those. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Mrs_Annie Date: 12 Jul 06 - 03:57 AM I followed the link to Members photos and info above, and was fascinated. I can't see how to get there from the home page, can you tell me? Also how can one put ones own information into these pages? thanks |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 12 Jul 06 - 01:21 PM Hi, Mrs. Annie - Our member photos and information are available only to registered Mudcatters - you can send photos and get added to the e-mail list by contacting our Tech Guru, Pene Azul, jeff@mudcat.org Jeff can also help you set up a profile. Member Photos & Info is a link on our QuickLinks dropdown menu, which you'll find on most Mudcat pages. -Joe Offer-
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Mo the caller Date: 24 Nov 06 - 08:39 AM I want to start a thread and am not sure how many characters I have for the title. The links advising on how to start a thread dont tell me. (must admit I've not gone all through this thread.) So I risk being unnecessarily terse, or having it chopped, and either way not making much sense. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Sorcha Date: 24 Nov 06 - 09:07 AM You can change it UNTIL you go to the actual text box. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: wysiwyg Date: 24 Nov 06 - 09:09 AM You will know when you start the thread, because only what will fit wiill show up on the screen that comes after "Create" and before "Post." You can estimate what will fit by setting the filter to 3 or 7 days' worth of threads, and look for the longest thread title showing. Try that number of characters for a start. ~Susan |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Mo the caller Date: 24 Nov 06 - 09:17 AM Yes, I did that Susan. I still think it would be helpful if the instructions on starting a thread told you though. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: catspaw49 Date: 24 Nov 06 - 10:06 AM Although it would be helpful I suppose, its not a big deal and there are several tricks you can use to get more in. For instance, eliminate spaces when possible by capitalizing.....like this: Suppose you want to start a thread with the title: Harry Legg craps real big in his pants You can save a lot and it will be very legible in the title page like this: HarryLeggCrapsRealBigInHisPants Eliminating "Real" would save even more of course. Spaw |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 24 Nov 06 - 08:26 PM It's kind of a trial-and-error thing, Mo, so I can't really post an explanation (or maybe it would be more honest to say that I don't really know the answer...) ALLCAPS titles take up more space, so fewer letters are allowed. If your title includes a preponderance of lowercase letter "i," you can fit in lots of letters. If it's mostly uppercase "M," you're not so lucky. If the title doesn't turn out the way you want it, contact me, or one of your friendly local JoeClones. Oh, and please note that we don't usually allow ALLCAPS in thread titles, although there may be exceptions at times. We also expect titles to be reasonably specific, and to reflect what's in the thread. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: Anonymous Posting From: Joe Offer Date: 09 Jan 07 - 03:36 PM From now on, anonymous posting will be watched and controlled. We've had far too many problems with anonymous posters. If you want to post, use a consistent name. We're not requiring registration, although we certainly prefer that. You may certainly use a pseudonym as a user name, but please use that same name every time you post. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: Objectionable Messages From: Joe Offer Date: 09 Jan 07 - 03:55 PM I see forum messages here and there, questioning why Mudcat "allowed" a certain message and deleted another. We don't "allow" any messages - we allow posting, and we don't do full review of all messages to determine if they are suitable or not. If we see messages or threads that are causing a problem, we deal with them. If I receive e-mails or personal messages complaining about a specific message, I review the message and make a determination - and I ordinarily respond directly to the person who made the complaint. I do not feel bound to respond to complaints (particularly anonymous complaints) that are posted in the Forum or the Help Forum. If you have a complaint, contact me directly by personal message or by e-mail. My e-mail address is joe@mudcat.org. You can also contact Jeff and Max on these matters, but I'm the one who's most readily available. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Azizi Date: 16 Jan 07 - 08:48 AM Joe, I have several questions to ask about posting lyrics to songs. 1. If the purpose of the post is to explore the meaning of the lyrics, or to explore the meanings of a particular line of a lyric-for instance "people keep comin but the train done gone-in the RE: Religious Train & Chariot Songs thread- a} is it appropriate to post the lyrics of that song even if it is already posted in another thread? b}And if so, since the purpose of the post is not to add lyrics, but to share theories about the meaning of those lyrics, should that specific post have the title "Lyr Add: [name of song]? 2.If the purpose is to compare and contrast versions of songs- a} is it appropriate to post the lyrics to more than one version in the same song in the same post? b} If so, should the Lyr: Add: title be used? Should there be a new title? {such as "Lyr: Compare: titles"} 3.{similar to #3}, if the purpose is to list or compare songs from different genres that may have the same or similar floating verses or lines, or which appear to share some other element{s} a} is it appropriate to start a new thread on that subject? b} is it appropriate to post all of the lyrics or portions of the lyrics to those songs even if those lyrics are are already posted in another Mudcat thread, or should there just be a hyperlink to the thread which contains those already posted lyrics, followed by new commentary? |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Azizi Date: 16 Jan 07 - 09:10 AM Also, I have some questions regarding posting hyperlinks to YouTube and/or other videos of songs: 1.Should there be a new title for this {such as "Video: Add: title" or "Vid: Add: title"? 2.Should each link to a video be posted separately, or can links to multiple videos of versions of the same song or similar songs be provided in the same post? 3. Should links to a video that is posted in one thread be reposted to Permathreads? For instance, I posted a link to the video "Mary Had A Baby" in the "African American Christmas Carol" thread. I believe that I also posted that same link on the "YouTube VideoPermathread". Should I have done so? And should I have also posted a link to that same video on the African American Spirituals Permathread? ** Also, here is a portion of my post in response to Susan's recent post about the African American Spirituals Permathread: I have not yet posted any video links to the African American Spirituals Permathread. However, if it is appropriate, I can post those links to videos I have included in other threads, if this would help. Also, if this will help, I will go back and correct the way I have titled individual posts that have lyrics to an African American spiritual and/or gospel song. Furthermore, I will post the thread number where those songs are found in the African American Spirituals Permathread and will henceforth to the best of my ability and understanding follow the Mudcat rules for titling posts. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: wysiwyg Date: 16 Jan 07 - 09:53 AM Azizi, I just want to address this: I posted a link to the video "Mary Had A Baby" in the "African American Christmas Carol" thread. I believe that I also posted that same link on the "YouTube VideoPermathread". Should I have done so? And should I have also posted a link to that same video on the African American Spirituals Permathread? Using this example, what would be really helpful to people would be to post the "Mary Had A Baby" video link on the existing "Mary Had A Baby" thread. In that case there would be no need to post about it in the Spirituals permathread itself. OR an alternative that would be acceptable would be to post the link, the song title, and the thread number where the song is discussed, in the Spirituals permathread. The goal is that people can easily find material related to the song, without assuming that the person will have known about your newer thread or that they will know, again using this example, that in December of 2006 there was a thread about "African American Christmas Carols" where they might find additional information or examples for that song. Also, if the "African American Christmas Carols" thread does include a number of spirituals, of course I want to include a link to it in the Spirituals index, so it would be really helpful for that thread title and thread number to be posted in the Spirituals permathread. I'd probebly put it HERE where there is a list of "KEY RESOURCES AT MUDCAT ABOUT SPIRITUALS." Looking forward to this, ~Susan |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Azizi Date: 16 Jan 07 - 10:44 AM Susan, I have begun to review my postings and put information on the African American Spirituals Permathread as I understood you to outline in your recent BS thread about that Permathread. As I was doing this, I noticed this question was posted from GUEST,Will Greene: "Would it not be simpler to compile a list of these threads and then PM them all to the Permathread co-ordinator instead of posting each one in the Music section?" -snip- If you prefer me to compile information from all of the threads that I have posted video links or lyrics of African American spirituals and gospels to since I joined Mudcat two years ago, I can do it that way. However, that will take time, and I can't say when I can get that to you. Please let me know way you prefer to get this information. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: wysiwyg Date: 16 Jan 07 - 12:02 PM I answered Will's question where he asked it. A simpler way to understand the goal of correct titling of subject lines is to look at this example: Q's Posts If you will just click to bring upo that page, you'll see it's quite easy to use that search feature to sort his new material from his replies to exisiting material, and to use Find in Page to quickly determine if he has posted a lyric one might be in need of finding. About 90% of what's now in the permathread index was found in old threads by doing that with the posting history of several aficionados of the genre, when we started that permathread. Volunteers each took on particular keywords and posting histories to compile the index. Therefore, if you adopt that convention, your posting history can be linked in the permathread as a quick way of mining your research for valuable gems. I know it's a lot of work-- I remember how long it took ME to do the searches I did as my part of compiling that index! Just let us know what you can do, and I will seek out volunteers to pick up the slack on the old posts, as long as the future posting will be done as we've discussed. Thanks! Going to be offline now for a bit-- ~Susan |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 16 Jan 07 - 07:41 PM Hmmm. So many questions, so little time. In general, I see no problem with re-posting lyrics for the sake of discussion, but it should be made clear that the lyrics came from the DT or from another thread. It's ALWAYS important to identify the source when posting lyrics. In general, the principle with MUSIC information from other sites is to copy-paste the entire text of whatever it is - within reason, of course. For non-music information, post a summary or excerpts, plus a link. For Youtube stuff or other online audio or video, I think it would be good to post a summary of the information shown in the link. That's probably true for ANY information you link to - summaries are good. That especially goes for YouTube, because some of us rural hicks don't have broadband and can't access YouTube. -Joe, Thank God I'm a Country Boy- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: wysiwyg Date: 16 Jan 07 - 08:04 PM Thanks, Joe, I think Azizi and I are off to a good start on how she can help ensure that her contributions are represented in the Spirituals Permathread, and why subject titling is important. We can work it out from there, I think. ~Susan |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Azizi Date: 16 Jan 07 - 08:37 PM Thanks for your response to my questions, Joe. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: katlaughing Date: 16 Jan 07 - 09:10 PM "Country Joe McOffer!" |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: wysiwyg Date: 07 Mar 07 - 05:43 PM Joe, I see you've made some changes in that privacy/security stuff since I last looked-- I like it. Some people are not aware that when a change is made within a permathread, the thread does not necessarily refresh back onto the daily threadlist. (I learned this in my own work on the Spirituals permathread.) This is because if a change is made in a post already occupying the thread, it doesn't constitute a "new" post and therefore doesn't bring the thread back up. I found that quite disconcerting at first with the Spirituals permathread, when I did a LOT of work to reorganize and update it and yet it remained off the day's threadlist as if I hadn't done a thing. But I got used to it quite soon. Now I like being able to work on that project without necessarily inviting all of Mudcat to insert jokes or other comments into the middle of what I may spend several days re-coding and re-writing before the whole is ready for public consumption. What it means, though, is that we can't take the permathreads for granted and assume that we necessarily know what-all is inside them-- we have to be grownups about it and actually look at them to see what's current. IMO that's a good thing. ~Susan Or when there's new stuff on a PermaThread, post a "refresh" message to move it to the Forum Menu, and delete it later when it's no longer needed. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: GUEST,Dave Date: 07 Mar 07 - 06:05 PM How can I update or submit a link for the links section (e.g. for 'composers') Also, How can I submit photo and profile info; thought I did this correctly (via email), but it's been about a month and I haven't seen any updates. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 07 Mar 07 - 06:33 PM Hi, Dave - you have to be a registered user and logged in to submit links (then go to "submit"), or to access Mudcat photos. If you're registered and want to have your photo, profile, or e-mail included in the Photo section, e-mail it to Pene Azul, jeff@mudcat.org. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: EuGene Date: 20 Jun 07 - 01:30 PM Golly, I am new here and read all of this FAQ thread . . . lotsa good info here, but unfortunately I am very computer illiterate so I will probably mess up a lot trying to learn what it all means and how to work the system. I googled onto this forum while searching for Folk and Blues music score & parts sets, either to order or to download and print out. I hit this forum twice when I googled "Golden Vanity" and then "Red River Valley", two of the songs our little community band would like to play. We are Ozark hillbillies, so I can identify with "Country Boy" Joe on that score. Does the DT have just the basic melody & chords for the tunes, or does it also sometimes also have stuff that a typical concert band (with the usual complement of woodwinds, brass, and percussion)can play? Eu |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Amos Date: 20 Jun 07 - 02:00 PM Typically the DIgital Tradition database contains lyrics and sometimes can provide a link to a MIDI file to demonstrate the tune. The Forum discussion threads, however, often have rich discussions which include chords, usually geared to the needs of an individual guitarist. I don't know of any concert arrangements! :D A |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: EuGene Date: 20 Jun 07 - 02:26 PM Thanx, Amos. I could see from the nice long thread about the origin of "Red River Valley" that there are a lot of folks coming to this site for the lyrics to songs and discussions about same. I wasn't sure, however, if the participants were folk singers, bluegrass group members, guitar pickers, or what, but there's room for all genres, even us old fogies in small community bands. "My Bunnie lice soda devotion, . . ." Eu |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: topical tom Date: 02 Nov 07 - 10:28 AM How can I create a "blue clicky" (or other colour) on Mudcat?
I find it's best to open a new browser window [CTRL-N] and navigate your way to the site you want to link to. Highlight and copy [CTRL-C] the URL (address) of the site, and then go back to your Mudcat message and paste [CTRL-V] the URL into your link. Be sure to include the http:// in that URL. The quotation marks are standard procedure, but most links work just fine without quotation marks. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 16 Nov 07 - 01:07 PM Mudcat Photos (click)(Temporary Location)send photos for posting to joe@mudcat.org |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: edarem Date: 29 Nov 07 - 11:26 PM Dave, you can hear "The Rich Maharajah of Magador" here: http://www.midomi.com/index.php?action=main.profile&recording_id=f9994504922ecf0245d06b108183af9c |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: topical tom Date: 14 Dec 07 - 11:53 AM Here I am pestering you again! I now can make a blue clicky but only by using the full url address. My question is how do you make a blue clicky saying only "click here" or "here"? sending the user to the desired site? |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Bill D Date: 14 Dec 07 - 12:05 PM You simply insert 'click here' in place of the URL that is BETWEEN the > <...it is as easy as NOT pasting the URL twice, or backspacing over the 2nd URL entry, and retyping 'click here'. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Bill D Date: 14 Dec 07 - 12:11 PM Tom...look closely at Joe's answer to your earlier post several above this...it has a perfect example of what a link should look like just before you post it. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: wysiwyg Date: 14 Dec 07 - 01:17 PM I think MOST people who ask questions here never realize their answer will have been inserted into their post, after the fact. I'm not saying that's a bad way of handling questions, but how can we help people know to look there? ~Susan
-Joe Offer- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Jeri Date: 14 Dec 07 - 10:07 PM Joe, regarding the photos, I assume you worked the whole thing out with Jeff and he approved the alternate site. (I know you wouldn't just do that without consulting with him.) Will he eventually pluck the photos off your site instead of having folks mail them to him? I got the impression that we were supposed to send photos to Jeff and he'd get to them. I think there might be a problem with profiles and member photos because there hasn't been much new posted there, but I'm sure some new stuff has been added in the 'Events' section. I think people just quit sending photos to Jeff. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: katlaughing Date: 14 Dec 07 - 10:51 PM Jeri, as I understand it, hatched out between BillD, Joe, and me, we aren't taking any photos from the Mudcat photo section, nor profiles to put up at the myopera site; only new ones since after the crash and no more were added here. I did add the ones of Big Mick when he visited here because he asked me to. I would do the same for anyone else who might ask. I think we plan on limiting it to 2-3 photos per person, at this point. I also hope we can eventually see the Mudcat ready to host more of them, here. In the meantime we thought myopera would be a good way for folks to send updates, new ones, etc. Hope that's clear as mud.:-) |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Jeri Date: 14 Dec 07 - 11:19 PM My question was, is Jeff going to get photos from your site? Or Have you taken it out of Jeff's hands without talking to him? What I also said was that some HAVE been added since the crash. The crash ended on 15 June 2005. Post #1501298 was on 15 June 2005. Post #1501288 is the first intact message prior to the crash and was posted on 6 June 2005. Poppagator's photos from before and after Katrina are there and a couple of events from 2006 are there, so there HAVE been photos posted since the crash. I suppose If Jeff cares, he can say something - as if... |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 15 Dec 07 - 03:27 AM We're just taking the photos temporarily, until Jeff has a chance to add them at Mudcat. Think of myopera as a temporary holding place. Eventually, when Jeff has the time, they'll be posted at Mudcat. -Joe- Mudcat Photos (click)(Temporary Location)send photos for posting to joe@mudcat.org |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Janie Date: 15 Dec 07 - 11:55 PM Has Jeff passed on to you the photos and profiles that have been sent to him over the last year or so that have never been put up on the member photos and profile sections? |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 16 Dec 07 - 12:36 AM No, Janie - If they haven't been posted, please send them to me for posting. -Joe- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: topical tom Date: 16 Dec 07 - 02:56 PM Thanks a lot, Bill D! Because of your message and Joe's previous post I can mow type "Click Here" and it actually works!Muchas Gracias! |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: semi-submersible Date: 05 Jul 08 - 06:32 AM I've been looking for protocols for format of the "composer" line when posting songs (in this case, a weboholic parent parody, on which I spent far too much time, which may ironically leave me a cranky and impatient parent tomorrow.) Would it be possible for the FAQ guidelines to include an example, such as a parody with appropriate mentions of original songsmith(s) and new song-mangler? Also, does it matter if the keywords in the subject line are capitalised or abbreviated? (E.g. LYRICS ADD: vs. Lyr Add:) |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 05 Jul 08 - 03:40 PM Hi, semi-submersible - Check the FAQ index way at the top of this thread, and follow the link to Posting Lyrics. This link will also do the trick. The operative word in the subject heading of a message is ADD and the song title (Lyr ADD if you have space). I won't give an example - because every song in the Digital Tradition serves as an example. I know you're looking specifically for example on how to post parodies - but I don't want to get THAT specific and legalistic in the FAQ. The people who harvest songs for the Digital Tradition and the Mudcat Songbook, will make corrections if they're needed. Correct information is more important than correct format. -Joe- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 31 Jul 09 - 08:11 PM Maybe this is a good time to remind people that when they post songs, it helps to post them in proper Digital Tradition format:
I go through songs and correct formatting and such, and then I regularize the formatting of the song title to <b><big>, to indicate it's ready for harvesting. I don't format the song title until the song is ready. T'anks. -Joe- |
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Subject: Starting New Threads From: Joe Offer Date: 28 Aug 09 - 04:56 PM I see an experienced Mudcatter started a thread today titled "Some John Hartford Wonderful." Yesterday, the same person started a thread titled "More Vintage Ron Bankley." In both cases, I think it would have been better if the information had been added to existing threads. We have over 123,000 threads on Mudcat, so in many cases I find it hard to see how starting a new thread on an established subject is a virtue (there are exceptions, when one wants to take a different tack in approaching an issue). With each addition of a thread, it gets harder and harder to find all the wonderful music information that has been posted. Please consider using the Filter to look for related threads that can be resurrected and added to, rather than starting new threads. At least, that's my opinion. -Joe- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: GUEST Date: 28 Feb 10 - 01:58 PM I have two albums which I made over the last ten years. I was told that you review albums. If this is true could you tell how and where to send them to. Thank you, Simon Davey
-Joe Offer, Forum Moderator- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: wysiwyg Date: 19 Mar 10 - 09:55 AM In THIS THREAD, there Is, IMNSHO, the clearest explanation (with an example right in it as well) of why and how certain threads get closed. A link to it in the FAQ, or quoting it wholesale, would do much to buttress policy. ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Rowan Date: 13 Apr 10 - 08:20 PM Greetings All, The first sentence of the first post in this thread (currently) reads "If you're looking for a song, you'll often find it right here in the Digital Tradition Folk Song Database. Feel free to post a request, but we ask you to use the search box in the upper-left corner of this page (and most other Mudcat pages) to search the database and forum for your lyrics you post a request for them." [I've removed the formatting.] It occurs to me that it might (better) read "If you're looking for a song, you'll often find it right here in the Digital Tradition Folk Song Database. Feel free to post a request, but we ask you to use the search box in the upper-left corner of this page (and most other Mudcat pages) to search the database and forum for your lyrics before you post a request for them." [I've italicised the suggested amendment.] But, it has lasted so long that, it occurs to me, it might be one of your clever tricks to get people to concentrate. As an aside, now that the Search engine is again running, I'll be able to find the original words to "I've been everywhere" (as sung by Lucky Starr, using Australian place names) so they can be added to the DT alongside (but 'preceding') Hank Snow's effort on Canadian place names. A long-ago Mudcat thread had a post with all the material required by the DT harvesters but I haven't been able to resuscitate it recently. If I find it before you do I'll do as recommended in the posts above. Many thanks for your efforts. Cheers, Rowan |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 14 Apr 10 - 12:17 AM Hi, Rowan - It's actually a good feeling to know that somebody reads what I wrote, closely enough to find my mistakes. There's information on posting in the Digital Tradition format here in the FAQ thread. -Joe- |
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Subject: Spam From: Joe Offer Date: 14 Oct 10 - 05:21 PM As I've said many times before, please don't bother to notify moderators about Spam unless it is more than 24 hours old. We regularly check Guest messages, and most Spam gets cleared in our regular checks. It's a horrible hassle to follow up on individual Spam messages, because we often get several dozen a day. Be patient, and it will be removed. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: Finding Lost Posts From: Joe Offer Date: 29 Oct 10 - 12:43 AM I try posting, but get back to the Forum Menu page, check the thread, and my message isn't there. BillD discovered the solution to this. What happens when your message doesn't post is that you were posting on a copy of the thread that was saved by your browser, not a fresh copy. To force your browser to download a fresh copy, click the "reload" button on your browser (usually a circular-arrow icon) - pushing F5 usually works, too. THEN you can post, and it almost always "takes." Getting your lost typing back is another matter. It will sometimes come back if you use your "backspace" key or the "back" button on your browser, but not always. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. When posting long messages, here's a good thing to do before hitting the "Submit" button: |
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Subject: Posting Songs From: Joe Offer Date: 28 May 11 - 05:57 PM For the sake of uniformity, and to make it easy for Digital Tradition harvesters, we ask that songs be posted in the Digital Tradition Format - title in ALLCAPS, then the songwriter name in parentheses, then skip a space, then the text of the song, and then source information and notes. The Message title should have ADD and the title of the song, in Title Case (not ALLCAPS). |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 11 Apr 12 - 03:14 PM Posting LyricsI've noticed lately that a lot of lyrics are being posted without a title, and without the name of the songwriter. Sometimes, the title and songwriter name can be determined by reading the thread, and sometimes not. This may seem redundant, but it's nice to know for certain what the song was called by the source it came from.When posting lyrics, please include the song title and songwriter name at the beginning of the lyrics, and source and background information at the end. At the very least, please tell us where you got the lyrics. Thanks. -Joe Offer, Mudcat Archivist- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 07 Sep 12 - 12:43 AM Mudcat Photos (click)(Temporary Location)Is now closed, and we haven't come up with a replacement. However, if there's something you'd really like people to see, especially if it's musical, Joe Offer is willing to post a limited number of photos on his own Website.Send photos for posting to joe@mudcat.org Updated 214 March 2014 |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: GUEST,Karl Dallas Date: 21 Sep 12 - 09:58 AM I have downloaded the database and I'm using it. But I have a technical problem perhaps someone can help me with. I've written some new words to Florence Reece's Which Side Are You On. What I want to do is to find the midi file and add my words below the music line. Well, here's my puzzle. If you access the list of songs, Which Side Are You On isn't listed. But if you do a search, there it is. In the /tunes folder, some of the midi files are listed (in the old 8.3 format) but there's nothing remotely like Which Side. So where does the playback of the song get its data? I'll post the lyrics to The Skiffler's Song, when I've sorted this out. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 21 Sep 12 - 10:36 PM Hi, Karl - Sorry I missed your message until now. The "easy way" isn't working just now, but there's a workaround. You can't extract MIDIs easily from the downloadable Digital Tradition, which has melodies in the Songwright format. So, the next step would be to go to the online Digital Tradition and download the MIDI, but our MIDIs aren't working right now. Luckily, there's a Digital Tradition mirror known as Yet Another Digital Tradition (click here), and it has a link to a MIDI (or click here). E-mail me if you have trouble. -Joe Offer, Mudcat Archivist- joe@mudcat.org |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 20 Jan 13 - 09:34 PM Hot Tip:Thread too big to load in your computer?In the "messages" column on the Forum Menu, there's a column of numbers that tells how many messages are in each thread. If the thread has more than 50 messages, that number is a clickable link that will display the thread in batches of 50 messages. Next to that number is a small "d" that is a link that will display the messages in reverse (descending) order. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 22 May 14 - 01:42 PM If a message doesn't "take," it's gone forever. Usually, what happens is that you've posted on a thread that was stored on your computer, not loaded fresh. As a precaution, it's best to highlight [CTRL-A] and copy [CTRL-C] all long messages before you post, and then check the thread to make sure it posted. If it didn't, refresh [F5] your thread to make sure it's a new load, and then paste [CTRL-V] your message text into a message box and "Submit." |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 21 Feb 15 - 10:29 PM Non-members: to contact members, e-mail joe@mudcat.orgIn general, I don't think it's a good idea for Mudcatters to post personal e-mail addresses (their own, of that of others) in the Forum. Occasionally, a non-member will want to make contact with a member, and Mudcatters will often instruct the Guest to join Mudcat so they can send a personal message. I have an easier solution - have them e-mail their message to Mudcat's Registrar, joe@mudcat.org, and he will be glad to forward the e-mail to the member. Don't bother trying to protect me by posting my email in any sort of code like "joe(at)mudcat(dot)org" - my e-mail is intended to be public, and I just put up with the Spam. Thank you for your concern, but it isn't necessary. Feel free to post joe@mudcat.org wherever you like. I have no way of contacting Guests unless they have furnished an email address to me or the Forum for some reason. And we never release member registration information to anyone. -Joe-
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Susan of DT Date: 10 Sep 16 - 07:48 AM There is some really ancient contact info for me and Dick Greenhaus in parts of this thread that were written a long time ago. current: dick@camscomusic.com 800 548-FOLK We are in Lansdale, PA (USA). PM if you need details I'd rather not post my email, so PM to contact me. Old addresses/emails/phones are listed under: Get you mudcat tee shirt (no longer available anyway) Who's in charge About the Digital Tradition (written in 1999) DT Official Rules Get your own copy-has not been available on floppies in many years Contact mudcat and digitrad Updating and correcting the Digital Tradition. Due to technical problems, it has not been possible to update/correct the DT for several years. Max is working on a solution. I have stopped monitoring the corrections thread, since I cannot do anything useful about it. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: maeve Date: 10 Sep 16 - 01:45 PM Thanks, Susan. Wishing you and Dick good health and much joy, Maeve |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: GUEST,.gargoyle Date: 12 Oct 16 - 06:46 PM Dear Mr. Pork, Post your question to a New Thread using Lyric Requested and the first line of the chorus. I bet you will receive an answer within 24 hours. 1. Look for the BOLD type face Create A New Thread Upper Left Side and click. 2. Select "Lyrics Requested" from the "pull-down menue" (first one) 3. Use your three word chorus for the title. 4. Post in the box below...exactly what you have requested in this thread. 5. Wait for the answers to roll in....And they will. Sincerely, Gargoyle --------------- Look for thread titled "Persevere, Persevere." -ed- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: FreddyHeadey Date: 04 Apr 17 - 08:02 AM thread.cfm?threadid=19340#213795 If a guest adds a nickname will all subsequent posts in that name be from the same person? e.g. http://mudcat.org/usersearch.cfm?who=GUEST%2CGuest |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Jeri Date: 04 Apr 17 - 09:56 AM FreddyHeadey, the short answer is "no". People can type whatever they want into the guest "From" block, and they have to type it (or not) for every post. We (Moderators/admin volunteers/people with magic buttons) try to watch for identity usurpers, but there's no guarantee we'll notice them. Membership's the only way to preserve and protect a unique name. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: FreddyHeadey Date: 04 Apr 17 - 10:38 AM Thanks. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: RunrigFan Date: 09 May 17 - 06:58 AM Hi can we change the timezone |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Jeri Date: 09 May 17 - 09:37 AM To what? Why? It's Eastern (Daylight) Time, and seems to currently be correct. Changing the time zone would be fairly complicated as Max would have to move everything, and I think he's happy where he is (aside from stormishness). Yeah, Joe, I know this is getting deleted. 😀 |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: RunrigFan Date: 09 May 17 - 09:39 AM I'm from the UK and keep forgetting it's DST time. Or allow member to change the timeone in their area. Not everyone on here is from USA. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Jeri Date: 09 May 17 - 09:58 AM The way Mudcat time-stamps and indexes messages, it can only deal with the one time zone. (Although it occasionally gets wibbly-wobbly) If you can figure out how to change Mudcat's time on individual computers, please share. There are probably a few people are confused by having to add 5 hours onto the time. (Or less, or more, or if you're west of Mudcat central, subtract time.) Think of it sort of MCT (Mudcat Central Time), like GMT. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: RunrigFan Date: 09 May 17 - 10:30 AM No you're not understanding. If you go to a forum, you can change date/time/timezone. Here it;s US format and since I'm from the UK, I forget mudcat uses DST. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: DaveRo Date: 09 May 17 - 10:31 AM I considered making my Mudcat Browser Tools addon change the displayed times to my local (UK) timezone. It would be quite easy to do. I didn't, mainly because it's not really a problem, but also because you sometimes have to quote the time of a post - they're not (visibly) numbered. Referring to FreddyHeady's question of 04 Apr 17 - 08:02 AM: the addon will automatically fill in the same guest username. But only on the same computer (and on supported browsers). |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Nigel Parsons Date: 09 May 17 - 11:20 AM At the very bottom of the list of threads there's a note of the current 'Mudcat Time', currently: Mudcat time: 9 May 2017 - 11:13 AM EDT This can be compared to the time on the most recent posting for how long since the last post, or compared to your local time to know what time difference to allow for. By the time I type all of this (on two fingers) it will probably be a few minutes out from the time stamp I quoted above! Cheers |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 09 May 17 - 02:07 PM Hi, Runrig- Mudcat runs on software from 1996, so we don't have all the bells and whistles of modern software. We also don't have some of the glitches of more modern software. Lately, we've had a problem with some of the clocks on some of our servers (we have many) being out of sync, and that is a real problem that Max is trying to resolve. The time stamps are an easy way to talk about a message. If I talk about your message posted 09 May 17 at 01:49PM, everybody can tell exactly what message I'm talking about. If we had different time stamps for everybody, that would do away with that functionality. -Joe- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: RunrigFan Date: 09 May 17 - 03:00 PM OK, it;s just hard to tell the time in US from UK as US has -5 or-8 timezones. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Bonnie Shaljean Date: 09 May 17 - 04:06 PM Hi Runrig - If you just add 5 hours to the Mudcat time, you should get the British time. It only gets dodgy for a few weeks each year when Daylight Savings kicks in or out, because that happens on different dates across the globe, and it goes out of whack for a little while. But for the majority of the time, that's a reliable guide. The Firefox browser has (or used to have) a nifty little free extension called Fox Clocks, which gives the times in all the various zones, and you can choose which areas you want it to display on its menu when you click. I don't know the latest state of play though, so that info could be out of date, |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: GUEST,Ann Boulden Date: 04 Aug 18 - 02:21 PM My father worked on the narrow gauge railroad in CO way back when. He used to sing 'Wreck of Old 99'. I can't remember all the words so would like to find them on here. Thanks.
I think you want Wreck of the Old 97 (click). If this isn't the one, please email me. -Joe Offer, Mudcat Music Editor, joe@mudcat.org - |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: GUEST Date: 28 Nov 18 - 05:31 PM Where's the spot for setting my thread view to mix music and BS? ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: wysiwyg Date: 28 Nov 18 - 05:36 PM Hm, my view reverted to the mixed view I'd chosen, when I logged back in, but during that process "click here to view or edit your personal...." and that's not where that link actually goes..... and I had not logged out to start with. ...
-Joe Offer- joe@mudcat.org |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 07 Dec 18 - 02:22 PM Search Problems?Remember that the main search engine depends on an index that has to be generated, so the recency of those searches depends on how recently Max updated the index.There are other search engines on the Old Advanced Forum Search on the quicklinks dropdown menu on most Mudcat pages. My favorite search engine is the Filter box at the top of the list of threads on the Forum Menu. It searches by thread name, and it's quick and accurate. Use one or two key words in the Filter, and then set the Age back. You can do a secondary search of the results with CTRL-F. Other search tips in the FAQ, above. And if you still can't find it, ask a moderator or start a thread and ask. -Joe- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Steve Shaw Date: 26 Nov 19 - 04:08 PM Ah yes. Anonymous unsigned guests. Stevie's 'obby 'oss. From the rules of the now sadly-defunct Gaughan forum: 2. No anonymous members. It is a requirement of forum membership that you let the other members know who you are. There is not a single good reason in a forum of this kind for anonymity. If you are normally known by a nickname, by all means use it here; my birth name was Richard but the only people who ever use that are my parents (both dead) and my two sisters and their children. The no-anonymity rule is not here to check people's birth certificates, it is simply so that we all know who we're talking to and the risk of anonymous trolling is reduced. As said, by all means use a nickname on posts but please put your real name in your member profile and you will be asked to give it when registering. So if you troll or otherwise post inappropriate stuff, as above, the mods know who you are and you're toast. Good, eh? As ever, only in m'humble, and this is never my gig. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 26 Nov 19 - 07:12 PM I agree about unnamed guests, Steve, but I lost that battle. -Joe- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Steve Shaw Date: 26 Nov 19 - 07:21 PM Then fight again, Joe. Remember Pseud... |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 26 Nov 19 - 07:50 PM Well, it's a mixed bag. We get some really priceless one-time posts from people who have valuable information on a particular subject - people like Si Kahn, who drops in now and then to comment on his songs. Other people come as guests and decide to stay. Many of these people wouldn't bother going through the hassle of registration just to give us one post. It's that music information that we're here for, not the thousand-message marathons that usually end up in squabbles. Maybe we should move the marathons into the BS section, where only members are allowed to post. -Joe- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Steve Shaw Date: 26 Nov 19 - 08:02 PM I do get that, actually. But if Si Khan was so exercised as to want to post here, surely a quick prior registration oughtn't to be beyond him...? |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 26 Nov 19 - 09:06 PM Well, no. When people see something here and want to answer, we get the best answers when we let people post without having to wait a day to register. Our "regulars" are very valuable to us, but we need the spontaneous input of outsiders to keep us fresh and prevent us from becoming ingrown (more ingrown than we are). -Joe- |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Jeri Date: 26 Nov 19 - 09:25 PM I thought it was ironic that Dick Gaughan once posted here and said he didn't want to join because he didn't want a cookie. Then, he created a forum where you HAD to be a member to post. I guess all it proves is that people acquire new info and change their minds sometimes. (And I miss his forum.) |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 27 Nov 19 - 12:01 AM I like the forums where guests can post immediately, but they have to wait for moderator approval for the post to appear. Our software doesn't accommodate that feature. We've looked into changing to more modern software, but the changeover doesn't allow us to import all the wonderful posts from the golden years of Mudcat, when people like Rick Fielding and Art Thieme and Sandy Paton and Jean Ritchie were posting. -Joe- |
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Subject: Moderation Change: 3 May 2020 From: Joe Offer Date: 08 Feb 20 - 04:02 AM Thread #167769 Message #4050150 Posted By: GUEST,Mods 03-May-20 - 01:44 PM Thread Name: Moderation Change Subject: Moderation Change
We, as moderators, are deleting battles between people. They seem to be mostly about who is involved, not the purported subject of the thread. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 16 Feb 21 - 07:45 PM I can't make sense out of much of Many Mudcat threads with the invasive ads. If you have the same problem, please remember that there is an ads-free version of every post and every thread in the "printer-friendly" option. Use [CTRL-F] and search for friendly |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: DaveRo Date: 21 Nov 21 - 02:41 AM Perhaps I could mention this here? Someone commented recently that the blicky-thing failed with long URLs, so I created a simple replacement: Simple linkifier You could bookmark it. |
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Subject: Clickable links From: FreddyHeadey Date: 23 Nov 21 - 03:02 PM ! DaveRo thanks ! It works for links to mudcat too. :) |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: GUEST,fricklefrackfreddy Date: 23 Aug 22 - 11:03 PM Newbie here. Any Pentangle songs demystified? Particularly songs from their 1991 Album 'Think of Tomorrow' like Meat on the Bone. Pentangle threads (click) |
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Subject: Message: I Delete Most of Your Threads From: Joe Offer Date: 03 Feb 23 - 03:59 PM I sent a personal message to a Mudcatter today and titled my message "I Delete Most of Your Threads." Here's the message, redacted: Hi, xxx - you seem to like to start threads at Mudcat. We already have over 172,000 threads at Mudcat, and we really don't need more. We try to encourage people to add to existing threads, and to start a new thread only when the subject hasn't been discussed before. Before starting a new thread, use the Filter at the top of the list of threads, and search for a thread on your subject. I moved your message to [another thread on the performer], and that revives that wonderful earlier discussion. I hope you understand. -Joe- P.S. If you post something that isn't offensive and you can't find it, it probably was moved and not deleted. You can find all your messages by clicking on your name in any message you've posted. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: Joe Offer Date: 07 Mar 23 - 10:43 PM I'd suggest that Mudcatters read my guide to searching. It's the first message in the FAQ thread. https://mudcat.org/detail_pf.cfm?messages__Message_ID=196922 People always go to the Mudcat search, but it has never been reliable - Max never got it past the experimental stage. Our older, more reliable search engines are the Filter (top of the Forum Menu) and the Old Advanced Forum Search (in QuickLinks) https://mudcat.org/forumsearch.cfm The Filter searches by thread name. Put one distinctive word (like international) in the Filter box and set the age back to "all," and refresh. Then do a secondary search of the results with CTRL-F, maybe looking for women (or whatever). You'll be amazed what you can do with CTRL-F on any Web page. A search and then a secondary search are very powerful. The "Old Advanced Forum Search" can search for MESSAGE title (subject), and I have been re-titling messages for 25 years to make this more useful. It can also be used by UserName, to find messages posted by whomever. If you're looking for your own messages, click on your name in any message you've posted, and you'll find your Mudcat Life History. Hope that helps. |
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Subject: RE: Mudcat FAQ - Newcomer's Guide From: GUEST,Ann Parsons Date: 28 Mar 24 - 10:42 AM I'm looking for contact details for Pete Scrowther Hi, Ann - please see this thread (click). Thanks. Joe Offer, Mudcat Music Editor |
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