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Lyr Req: I Had a Little Nut Tree

GUEST,Mrrzy-at-work 04 Apr 00 - 01:52 PM
Teasle 04 Apr 00 - 02:10 PM
Jon Freeman 04 Apr 00 - 02:27 PM
MMario 04 Apr 00 - 02:30 PM
Malcolm Douglas 04 Apr 00 - 02:40 PM
alison 05 Apr 00 - 03:06 AM
Steve Parkes 05 Apr 00 - 03:28 AM
MMario 05 Apr 00 - 09:59 AM
GUEST,Mrrzy-from-work 13 Apr 00 - 05:08 PM
Jon Freeman 13 Apr 00 - 05:31 PM
GUEST,Mrrzy-at-work 14 Apr 00 - 12:07 PM
Jon Freeman 14 Apr 00 - 12:30 PM
GUEST,barbreev@webtv.net 14 Apr 00 - 01:22 PM
MMario 14 Apr 00 - 01:33 PM
Malcolm Douglas 14 Apr 00 - 01:51 PM
MMario 20 Dec 01 - 10:53 AM
MMario 20 Dec 01 - 12:59 PM
MMario 20 Dec 01 - 04:32 PM
kytrad (Jean Ritchie) 20 Dec 01 - 06:39 PM
Mrrzy 29 Oct 04 - 11:53 AM
Q (Frank Staplin) 29 Oct 04 - 01:05 PM
MMario 29 Oct 04 - 01:19 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 29 Oct 04 - 01:31 PM
MMario 29 Oct 04 - 01:46 PM
Malcolm Douglas 29 Oct 04 - 08:17 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 29 Oct 04 - 08:41 PM
GUEST,Thnidu 14 Dec 16 - 01:33 PM
Mrrzy 14 Dec 16 - 06:53 PM
michaelr 15 Dec 16 - 02:29 AM
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Subject: I had a little nut tree
From: GUEST,Mrrzy-at-work
Date: 04 Apr 00 - 01:52 PM

I can't find this anywhere outside of my brain. I recall a children's song starting:

I had a little nut tree, nothing would it bear
But a silver nutmeg and a golden pear.
The Queen of Spain's daughter came to visit me
All for the sake of my little nut tree.

Also, as I learned this before learning to carry a tune, I'd like the music for it too, as I can't sing on key without a model and I'd like to sing this one again.

Thanks, all.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: Teasle
Date: 04 Apr 00 - 02:10 PM

I know the verse you already know ... I have also heard it sung as part of a Scottish song called

Coulter's Candy

Ally bally, ally bally bee,
Sittin' on yer mammy's knee
Greetin for another bawbee
To buy some Coulter's Candy.

I had a little nutmeg
etc

Here's auld Couter comin' round
Wi a basket on his crown
So here's a penny, now ye run down
And buy me some Coulter's candy.

Ally bally, ally ballybee
When you grow up ye'll gang tto sea
Makin pennies for your daddie and me
To buy some Coulter's candy

It's a sweet song - quite a simple tune but I don't know how to pass it on to you over the net. sorry - I'm sure someone else will help out.

Cheers,

Teasle


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 04 Apr 00 - 02:27 PM

It is years ago since I last heard this and only remember there being the one verse. I used to love it as a kid. From childhood memory, the tune used to go something like: this

Jon


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: MMario
Date: 04 Apr 00 - 02:30 PM

two songs in the DT listed as coulter's candy, but neither with these lyrics.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 04 Apr 00 - 02:40 PM

That's pretty much all there is of it, though I remember the third line as "The King of Spain's daughter".  Iona and Peter Opie, in The Oxford Book of Nursery Rhymes (1951), give a further couplet:

I skipped over water, I danced over sea
And all the birds in the air couldn't catch me.

I seem to remember that from "Listen With Mother" back in the '50s, and certainly still recall a tune; substantially the same as the one Jon gives.  The Opies comment:

"Edith Sitwell in Fanfare for Elizabeth (1946) pictures Lady Bryane, governess-in-ordinary to the young Princess Mary and then to Elizabeth, singing this song to her charges, and remembering a black and terrible shadow, the shadow of Juana of Castille the mad "King of Spain's Daughter", who visited the court of Henry VII in 1506.  This picture was probably inspired by James Orchard Halliwell's suggestion* that Juana of Castille is here celebrated.  Whether there are grounds for the theory is not clear.  The rhyme is said to be the favourite recitation of the Shakespearian actress Dame Sybil Thorndike"

*in The Nursery Rhymes of England, 1853.

Malcolm


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: alison
Date: 05 Apr 00 - 03:06 AM

If you change the tune from major to minor.. the first few lines are pretty close to Hatikvah, the national anthem of Israel.... just a bit of trivia

slainte

alison


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: Steve Parkes
Date: 05 Apr 00 - 03:28 AM

It may just be my dirty mind, but I've long suspected that "nut tree", "silver nutmeg" and "golden pear" of being euphemisms for ... well, you know ...

It also sounds like it should be historical, doesn't it? I daresay many of you know the story, accurate or otherwise, that "Mary, Mary quite contrary" is about Queen Mary Tudor and her drastic measures to re-establish the dominance of the Roman Catholic church in England?

Steve (at great risk of thread creep!)


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: MMario
Date: 05 Apr 00 - 09:59 AM

And there are others who say it was about Mary Stuart and her fickleness and lack of attention to her government, and preoccupation with men, baubles and gaity


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: GUEST,Mrrzy-from-work
Date: 13 Apr 00 - 05:08 PM

Well, if we're going to creep, how about The House That Jack Built? I've had an entire English history course through that one!

But meanwhile, Jon, I couldn't get your file to play, do I need something I don't have? It brought up the little box that claimed to be playing something, but nothing came out of my speakers...


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 13 Apr 00 - 05:31 PM

It is just a striaght MIDI file and needs nothing special to play it. Assuming you are running Windows, the most obvious suggestion is to check your playback settings in Volume Control. In particular, make sure that the MIDI is not muted or turned down low.

Jon


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: GUEST,Mrrzy-at-work
Date: 14 Apr 00 - 12:07 PM

Thanks, Jon. No idea why that didn't work - you might have to call me and sing!


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 14 Apr 00 - 12:30 PM

Mrrzy, thinking of singing, some of us do get together and have a song circle on Hearme that you might like to join in with sometime. They can happen anytime anybody feels like starting one up and are normally announced in a thread here but talking EST (or Mudcat Time), there is a pretty regular one that starts at about 7:30pm on a Sunday and goes on till whenever.

If you are interested, a search for Hearme in the forum will yeild more details. In brief though you need a PC (no Mac support yet) running IE4 or higher or the Netscape equivilants and preferably a microphone - some people just pop in and listen and join in the text chat.

Jon


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: GUEST,barbreev@webtv.net
Date: 14 Apr 00 - 01:22 PM

The second verse:

Her dress was all of crimson
Snow white was her hair
I asked her for her nut tree
And her golden pear.

I said so fair a princess
Never did I see
I'll give to you the fruit
Of my little nut tree.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: MMario
Date: 14 Apr 00 - 01:33 PM

y'know, I did a search the other day on this and came up zilch....today, over 30 references....

all pointed to this:

I had a little nut-tree, nothing would it bear
The king of Spain's daughter came to visit me,
And all because of my little nut-tree.
I skipped over water, I danced over sea.
And all the birds in the air couldn't catch me.

couldn't find any mention of the 2nd verse above...


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 14 Apr 00 - 01:51 PM

It has the look of a modern addition, but one never knows; where did you find it, barbreev?

Malcolm


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: MMario
Date: 20 Dec 01 - 10:53 AM

from kididdles:

I had a little nut tree,
Nothing would it bear
But a silver nutmeg,
And a golden pear;
The King of Spain's daughter
Came to visit me,
And all for the sake
Of my little nut tree.

Her dress was made of crimson,
Jet black was her hair,
She asked me for my nut tree
And my golden pear.
I said, "So fair a princess
Never did I see,
I'll give you all the fruit
From my little nut tree."

tune to come.


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Subject: Tune Add: I HAD A LITTLE NUT TREE
From: MMario
Date: 20 Dec 01 - 12:59 PM

MIDI file: nut_tree.mid

Timebase: 192

Name: I HAD A LITTLE NUT TREE
Text: Generated by NoteWorthy Composer
Key: E
TimeSig: 4/4 24 8
Start
0000 1 64 110 0094 0 64 000 0002 1 64 110 0094 0 64 000 0002 1 66 110 0094 0 66 000 0002 1 64 110 0094 0 64 000 0002 1 68 110 0094 0 68 000 0002 1 71 110 0190 0 71 000 0002 1 71 110 0190 0 71 000 0002 1 73 110 0094 0 73 000 0002 1 73 110 0094 0 73 000 0002 1 73 110 0094 0 73 000 0002 1 76 110 0094 0 76 000 0002 1 71 110 0382 0 71 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 68 110 0190 0 68 000 0002 1 68 110 0190 0 68 000 0002 1 66 110 0094 0 66 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 66 110 0094 0 66 000 0002 1 63 110 0094 0 63 000 0002 1 64 110 0256 0 64 000 0032 1 64 110 0094 0 64 000 0002 1 64 110 0094 0 64 000 0002 1 66 110 0094 0 66 000 0002 1 64 110 0096 0 64 000 0000 1 68 110 0094 0 68 000 0002 1 71 110 0190 0 71 000 0002 1 71 110 0190 0 71 000 0002 1 73 110 0094 0 73 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 73 110 0094 0 73 000 0002 1 76 110 0094 0 76 000 0002 1 71 110 0256 0 71 000 0032 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 73 110 0094 0 73 000 0002 1 76 110 0094 0 76 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 68 110 0096 0 68 000 0000 1 73 110 0190 0 73 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 68 110 0094 0 68 000 0002 1 68 110 0094 0 68 000 0002 1 66 110 0190 0 66 000 0002 1 64 110 0190 0 64 000 0098 1 64 110 0094 0 64 000 0002 1 64 110 0094 0 64 000 0002 1 66 110 0094 0 66 000 0002 1 64 110 0094 0 64 000 0002 1 68 110 0094 0 68 000 0002 1 71 110 0190 0 71 000 0002 1 71 110 0190 0 71 000 0002 1 73 110 0094 0 73 000 0002 1 73 110 0094 0 73 000 0002 1 73 110 0094 0 73 000 0002 1 76 110 0094 0 76 000 0002 1 71 110 0256 0 71 000 0032 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 68 110 0190 0 68 000 0002 1 68 110 0190 0 68 000 0002 1 66 110 0094 0 66 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 66 110 0094 0 66 000 0002 1 63 110 0094 0 63 000 0002 1 64 110 0256 0 64 000 0032 1 64 110 0094 0 64 000 0002 1 64 110 0094 0 64 000 0002 1 66 110 0094 0 66 000 0002 1 64 110 0094 0 64 000 0002 1 68 110 0094 0 68 000 0002 1 71 110 0190 0 71 000 0002 1 71 110 0190 0 71 000 0002 1 73 110 0094 0 73 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 73 110 0094 0 73 000 0002 1 76 110 0094 0 76 000 0002 1 71 110 0256 0 71 000 0032 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 73 110 0094 0 73 000 0002 1 76 110 0094 0 76 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 68 110 0094 0 68 000 0002 1 73 110 0190 0 73 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 68 110 0094 0 68 000 0002 1 68 110 0094 0 68 000 0002 1 66 110 0190 0 66 000 0002 1 64 110 0190 0 64 000
End

This program is worth the effort of learning it.

To download the latest version of MIDItext and get instructions on how to use it click here

ABC format:

X:1
T:I HAD A LITTLE NUT TREE
M:4/4
Q:1/4=120
K:E
EEFEGB2B|-BccceB3|-BAAABG2G|-GFAFDE3|EEFEGB2B|
-BcBceB3|BceBGc2A|AGGF2E3|EEFEGB2B|-BccceB3|
BAAABG2G|-GFAFDE3|EEFEGB2B|-BcBceB3|BceBGc2A|
AGGF2E2||


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: MMario
Date: 20 Dec 01 - 04:32 PM

NWC file sent to Joe.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: kytrad (Jean Ritchie)
Date: 20 Dec 01 - 06:39 PM

We sang this line as: The queen of Spain and daughter came to visit me....


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: Mrrzy
Date: 29 Oct 04 - 11:53 AM

Hmmm - why isn't this in the Trad yet? I did a search on silver nutmeg golden pear and it said nothing in either the forum or the database, I had to do some real digging to get to this.
Now that there is no more hearme, I will likely need some kind person to sing this to me... And did anyone ever come up with the history/folklore whatever about this one? It's been a couple of years, so I hope so...


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 29 Oct 04 - 01:05 PM

"Nursery Rhymes of England," 1846, James Halliwell, has this version (p. 4):

V.
I had a little nut tree, nothing would it bear
But a silver nutmeg and a golden pear;
The king of Spain's daughter came to visit me,
And all was because of my little nut tree.
I skipp'd over water, I danced over sea,
And all the birds in the air couldn't catch me.

Halliwell notes: "The following perhaps refers to Joanna of Bastile, who visited the court of Henry the Seventh." No support provided for this statement.

There are some rhymes about skipping over water; this one may be a compound.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: MMario
Date: 29 Oct 04 - 01:19 PM

well - I can't answer for Dick - but you do realize there has only been one posted release of the DT since the start of this thread?

a midi file of the tune can be found at Kiddiddles

if you had searched on *either* "silver nutmeg" or "golden pear" you would have found this thread - however - not the combination because that made the search look for a phrase that wasn't in the post until you recently put it in...

in google searching on silver nutmeg golden pear equals a search for silver + golden + nutmeg + pear but here it equals a search for the exact phrase "silver nutmeg golen pear"


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 29 Oct 04 - 01:31 PM

Anyone found where the second verse first appeared?


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: MMario
Date: 29 Oct 04 - 01:46 PM

I've sent a query to www.rhymes.org.uk who have the second verse posted as part of their "Lost lyrics to Nursery Rhyme" asking for their source.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 29 Oct 04 - 08:17 PM

I've just had a look at that site. So far as I can see, it is composed almost entirely of lies and misinformation. The ignorant crap those idiots are circulating will almost certainly ensure that we will have to waste our time for years to come, repairing the damage that they have done.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I had a little nut tree
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 29 Oct 04 - 08:41 PM

The Traditional Ballad Index has an entry. Roud #3749. "...first printing appears to have been in one of the Tom Thumb songbooks (n. d. but c. 1790)." Not able to verify this in the few references that I have.
There is no evidence of the rhyme before the 18th century; the appended stories about Juana and Henry VII on the one hand and Prince Philippe on the other may have been concocted in the late 19th to 20th c.

More than one tune available; no evidence of these before the 20th c. that I can find.
The Opie's in the preface to "The Singing Game" say that "Many of the tunes are recognizably part of the common stock; and echoes of old and well-known airs can be heard in them: ....'I Had a Little Nut Tree'....." Perhaps this is why the tune is so familiar; I have heard it or a slight variant with several simple songs.
The Traditional Ballad Index mentions a tune by Linscott; don't know if this is the one found on some of the children's rhymes sites.

Not in W. W. Newell, "Games and Songs of American Children," (first printings 1883 and 1903; Dover reprint); Linscott's report of 1939 seems to be the first record of it in America. I would guess that this might be an oversight.

There is a copy of sheet music, "I Had a Little Nut Tree," in the James Joyce Sheet Music Collection, Miami University, Otto G. Richter Library; date and composer not given in the listing.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Had a Little Nut Tree
From: GUEST,Thnidu
Date: 14 Dec 16 - 01:33 PM

Does anyone know about this song done as a round?


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Had a Little Nut Tree
From: Mrrzy
Date: 14 Dec 16 - 06:53 PM

Thread creep, does anybody know what happened to the Hearme thing that is now 404?


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: I Had a Little Nut Tree
From: michaelr
Date: 15 Dec 16 - 02:29 AM

Donovan's Coulter's Candy


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