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Help: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs

GaryD 19 Apr 00 - 08:56 PM
Kelida 19 Apr 00 - 09:02 PM
GaryD 19 Apr 00 - 09:08 PM
MMario 19 Apr 00 - 09:11 PM
Margo 19 Apr 00 - 10:54 PM
GUEST,dshalit 19 Apr 00 - 11:45 PM
Ship'scat 20 Apr 00 - 06:22 AM
Folkbloke 20 Apr 00 - 09:09 AM
Irish sergeant 20 Apr 00 - 08:32 PM
GaryD 21 Apr 00 - 11:53 AM
Amos 21 Apr 00 - 12:28 PM
GUEST,andrea 21 Apr 00 - 12:41 PM
SeanM 21 Apr 00 - 01:10 PM
Ship'scat 21 Apr 00 - 01:48 PM
SeanM 21 Apr 00 - 02:44 PM
Irish sergeant 21 Apr 00 - 06:14 PM
GUEST,Uncle Jaque 21 Apr 00 - 10:14 PM
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Subject: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: GaryD
Date: 19 Apr 00 - 08:56 PM

I just recently got some recordings from our friends at Folk Legacy of a group called "Boarding Party".. They are simply fantastic.. they sing Seafaring Songs & Shanteys.. I got to wondering about the history of such songs and musics.. thought it would be great to see how much information I can get regarding the origins, styles, purposes, and anectdotes of this great music form.. How about it...any Takers?... Gary

I'm also going to post a separate thread about the group I mentioned.. would like to know more about them..


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Subject: RE: Help: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: Kelida
Date: 19 Apr 00 - 09:02 PM

Try Contemplations From the Marianas Trench. They have a lot of songs with histories attached, seperated by song type.

Peace--Keli


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Subject: RE: Help: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: GaryD
Date: 19 Apr 00 - 09:08 PM

Thanks, I'll give it a shot.. dear God, I'll be glad to get my new IMAC so I can HEAR the great music up here, as well as see it.. Oh well, my dinosaur has given me good service so far...


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Subject: RE: Help: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: MMario
Date: 19 Apr 00 - 09:11 PM

sea chantey faq

url=http://pw1.netcom.com/~neilmber/shantyfaq/part1.html

another good site

url=http://members.xoom.com/Anitra/chanteys/


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Subject: RE: Help: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: Margo
Date: 19 Apr 00 - 10:54 PM

As for Books:

SHANTIES from the SEVEN SEAS by Stan Hugill
SONGS of the SAILOR and LUMBERMEN by William Main Doerflinger
Any by Joanna Colcord. I don't have her shantey book, but I do have a wonderful book called "Sea Language Comes Ashore", which talks about everyday expressions we use that came from aboard ship.
Margo


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Subject: RE: Help: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: GUEST,dshalit
Date: 19 Apr 00 - 11:45 PM

"Any by Joanna Colcord". Her book of sea chantys is called "Songs of American Sailormen." It's long out of print but a good library (e.g. a university) would have a copy. I'm still hunting to buy a used copy.

I'll have to check out the group you mentioned

Dan


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Subject: RE: Help: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: Ship'scat
Date: 20 Apr 00 - 06:22 AM

Its one thing to read about them and another to hear them but what you really want to do is experience them! The absolute best way is to fly, run, walk, hitch, row (I've actually arrived under sail) or whatever to the Mystic Sea Music Festival held in, of all places Mystic, CN at the Mystic Seaport.

Save making the acquaintance of your local Sail Training Association's odd brig or bark, there's nothing better than the program the Seaport puts on in terms of hands-on (for both performers and festival goers) mating of tasks and lines to the work songs that went with them. The festival is held on the second weekend in June 8-11.

See http://www.mysticseaport.org/public/visiting.msm/events/sea.music/festival.html

I've heard that in recent years they included more non-chanty dimensions. I can only hope that it isn't act the expense of the chantying roots.

If you can't make it to Mystic, there's always South Street Seaport in NY or sea music festivals throughout England, France, Holland and occaisonally, Poland but that's another story.

Regards, KC (Boarding Party)


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Subject: RE: Help: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: Folkbloke
Date: 20 Apr 00 - 09:09 AM

There is always the shantyman's Bible. The definitive study piece on the subject written bya man with a family history before the mast. Stan Hugill Shanties of the 7 Seas. Check any good bookshop, Library or Amazon on the Web. If no luck Try The English Folk dance and Song Society, Folk shop at Cecil Sharpe House, 2 Regents park Road, London, England. or any branch of Hobgoblin Music in the U.K. London. Crawley, Bristol or manchester. Best of Luck, and keep the Art alive. Adrian McEwan. (folkbloke)


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Subject: RE: Help: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: Irish sergeant
Date: 20 Apr 00 - 08:32 PM

All great references and I can dig arriving by sail even though all my blue water time was spent on a carrier. Shanties such as Haul Away Joe" were work songs meant to keep atempo while hosting (or lowering) sail. By the way I've always seen Shanties spelled Chanties" Good luck in your search and keep using the mudcat forum. I learn something every night on this sight. Neil


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Subject: RE: Help: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: GaryD
Date: 21 Apr 00 - 11:53 AM

I agree..I love this place..don't get up here nearly as much as I want.. Meanwhile, I'd kill (well, almost) to get to those folk festivals in New England..but stuck here in Central MN is a far cry from the coast...maybe I could write a Chantey on the mighty Carp or Sunfish..what do you think?...

There is something about the great harmony & stories, ballads, etc. that thrills me to my soul when I hear this kind of singing.. I swear I must have been a seafaring man in an earlier incarnation...

One question I'd like to know, is there any kind of this work song today? or has it become totally extinct..Any seafarers out there???...


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Subject: RE: Help: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: Amos
Date: 21 Apr 00 - 12:28 PM

There aren't many occasions in the merchant marine for chanties, because the men whose muscles were used in the work in the heyday of sail have been replaced by generators, donkey-engines, electric motors, and the like.

Regardless of that, though, there's a great wealth of chanty knowledge still out there, used on ships of all kinds by people who sing them out of love for them, not because they need them for the forebit gang.

I believe they still use them for weork on some of the Barefoot Adventure sailing ships, but that's just a rumort -- I know they turn out anyone who wants to help raise sail and sing "Amazing Grace" but I don't know the details of their drills.


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Subject: RE: Help: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: GUEST,andrea
Date: 21 Apr 00 - 12:41 PM

You might find something a bit nearer to home. There are several schooners that sail out of Traverse City, MI; go take a look at http://kermit.traverse.com/tallship/home.html and give them a call; find out if they have any working chanteymen on board, and then go take a sail! (As a matter of fact, under "News", you will find mention of a music cruise in June.)


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Subject: RE: Help: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: SeanM
Date: 21 Apr 00 - 01:10 PM

What Andrea says holds true for several ports. On the west coast, we've got 10-12 tall ships with home ports scattered along the coast. Most of them do history programs of some sort or another, and are usually either presenting shantymen or are looking to have some sing for 'em.

Just something for to keep track of.

M


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Subject: RE: Help: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: Ship'scat
Date: 21 Apr 00 - 01:48 PM

The other short answer for pure marine work is - probably not. The last that I know about was collected by Roger Abrahms in the Carribean in (I believe the mid-60s) with island natives using deep-water shantys to hunt black fish or move houses. Its available from CAMSCO http://www.camsco.com/ as Abrahams, Roger D. Deep The Water, Shallow The Shore- Published 1974, American Folklore Society. This book surveys the importance , historical and contemporary, of sea shanties in the British West Indies. Hardbound Book $45.00. The realy hard thing to find are the field tapes that supported the book. Absolutely magic!

Another loss is that I believe all of our direct connections with shantying under sail (Stan Hugill and Eric Illot among others I'm sure) have "swallowed the anchor.

I tried hard to find shantying in the Arabian (Persian) Gulf in the early 80's and the Gulf of Guinee in the late 60's with no luck.

Anybody know of more recent sources or finds?

Having said that Sail Training Association http://tallships.sailtraining.org/ affiliates, where ever are your best bet to recreate the experience.

Regards, KC


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Subject: RE: Help: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: SeanM
Date: 21 Apr 00 - 02:44 PM

I've heard (and heard of) shanteys being sung for work in several locations, but it seems as if it's always being done for the purpose of the shantey, not for the work. While the artform itself may live on, it seems that the original use for it is dead.

M


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Subject: RE: Help: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: Irish sergeant
Date: 21 Apr 00 - 06:14 PM

Gary: There are some tall ships that sail out of New England. But I do fear that as a working art form meaning serving their original purpose has become a thing of the past. The last tall ship I was on was the Natalie Todd out of Bar Harbor Maine and I know they didn't sing them. I helped them hoist sail on that occassion and I would remember. (It was my honeymoon, 1993) The exception might be the USS Constitution out of Boston. And yes, I am talking about Old Ironsides. She is still seaworthy and under naval commision. Neil


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Subject: RE: History: Sea Shanteys, Sea Songs
From: GUEST,Uncle Jaque
Date: 21 Apr 00 - 10:14 PM

Up here in coastal Maine where the chantey was once oft heard on the waterfront or from the occasional retired Sailor hauling in the laundry from the clothesline out of force of habit, it is seldom encountered today.

Son of ME Gordon BOK is a reknown interpreter of Sea Songs, including Chanties, and an excellant group to hear is the "Ancient Mariners" Fife & Drum Corps and their vocal group the "Chanteymen" - they have a couple of CDs out, and they really rollic!

http://www.gordonbok.com/

http://www.tiac.net/users/smitchel/mariners/index.html

I work at a little lantern shop in Yarmouth, ME http://www.heritagelanterns.com/

and frequently sing chanties while operating some of the old hand-cranked machinery we use there to make reproduction 18th & 19th Century lights. I think it helps!


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