Influence of Literature in music

Subject: Influence of Literature in music
From: Kelida
Date: 04 May 00 - 03:18 PM

I've noticed a lot of more modern songs (though not really folk, per se) that allude to literary characters, themes, ideas, settings, etc. In addition to folk, I listen to (shamefully) a lot of heavy metal and glam. The books I've noticed being used in those genres are the Cthulhu Mythos books by H.P. Lovecraft (who is one of my favorite authors).

I was wondering, does this idea of using literature as a basis for songs exist in folk music? If so, then to what extent?

I imagine not in traditional folk music--which is what I am most familiar with--but what about modern folk and classic rock? What other genres of music does this exist in?

Peace--Keli

Subject: RE: Influence of Literature in music
From: Wavestar
Date: 04 May 00 - 04:59 PM

Keli-

Why on earth not in traditional folk music? All those ballads, stories of love denied, heroes gone to sea, and the Childe Rowland and other ballads... all those were stories! That's literature... What may have started as a bed time story or legend was put into song to be remembered and enjoyed. Stories and songs have always intermingled... I think that's literature in it's most basic form.

My brain is blanking on examples, but I think you'll find lots of references to legendary figures in the early ballads, and also now.

I also know that many contemporary songwriters use literary references in their songs... Dar Williams certainly does, people are constantly setting pieces of poetry (literature!) to music. Witness Loreena McKennit.

It may be easier to see in popular music, in some cases. Tori Amos does it CONSTANTLY, I have this nagging certainty that Leonard Cohen (is he folk? or pop from the 60's through today?) did it as well...

Please forgive my vagueness, I'm in brain fade due to essays, the end of the year, and conversations with ex boyfriends. But I'm sure there are so many allusions, if you know where and how to look....

-J

Subject: RE: Influence of Literature in music
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 May 00 - 05:16 PM

Anne Lister for one, especially on classical Greek myths.

Then there's Woody Guthrie's retelling of the film version of The Grapes of Wrath, Tom Joad.

And of course there are lots of cases of verses by literary coves being turned into songs by folkies - Kipling's Barrack Room Ballads, Patrick Kavanagh's Raglan Road...

Subject: RE: Influence of Literature in music
From: Callie
Date: 04 May 00 - 07:15 PM

And of course Leonard Cohen was a poet before he turned to songwriting.

Numerous poems by WB Yeats have been set to music. Eg: "I went down to the hazel wood because a fire was in my heart" and "Before the World Was Made".

The works of TS Eliot have been turned into Andrew Lloyd Webber's "Cats" (which does not appeal to me at all - but it's an example)

The Cure sang about "Killing an Arab" which is the Albert Camus book "The Outsider".

Paul Kelly sings "So Much Water So Close To Home" after a Raymond Carver story.

Van Morrison's "Alan Watts Blues" is based on the works of guess who.

There are just a few random examples. I'm sure there are thousands.

Subject: RE: Influence of Literature in music
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 04 May 00 - 07:40 PM

Not exactly folk, but Tom Wait's songs have lots of literary, historical, and pop-cultural allusions. Here's a web site devoted to them.

Subject: RE: Influence of Literature in music
From: Mbo
Date: 04 May 00 - 07:48 PM

Oh BOY!!!
Electric Light Orchestra's "Poor Boy (The Greenwood)" is about Robin Hood.
The Kinks's "Dedicated Follower of Fashion" is based on "Private Lives" by Noel Coward
There are many Led Zeppelin songs based on themes from J.R.R. Tolkien, including "The Battle of Evermore," and "Ramble On".
Loggins & Messina's "The House at Pooh Corner" from A.A. Milne's book.

--Mbo

Subject: RE: Influence of Literature in music
From: Midchuck
Date: 04 May 00 - 07:54 PM

I sang "Say Goodbye to Montana" on Hearme a few nights ago. It doesn't say so, but was obviously written directly after reading, or viewing, Lonesome Dove.

Peter.

Subject: RE: Influence of Literature in music
From: Mbo
Date: 04 May 00 - 08:00 PM

As was the Garth Brooks song "Lonesome Dove."

--Mbo

Subject: RE: Influence of Literature in music
From: Frank McGrath
Date: 04 May 00 - 08:34 PM

In Irish folk music there has been a crossover influence where folk music has influenced literature and literature has in turn has added to the folk tradition.

Very obvious examples that spring to mind immediately are Brendan Behan's literary works airing songs such as "The Old Triangle"; James Joyce and "Humpty Dumpty"; Partick Kavanagh and "Raglan Road", to mention but a few.

But these writers were very much influenced by the tradition and while they gave us songs and reintroduced us to old songs their work featured this folk tradition because it was such a part of the times and lives they wrote about.

This process I'm sure happens outside of Ireland but I cannot think of any examples right now. I'm also sure that contemporary writers are similarly influenced.

A very talented local (Nenagh, Co. Tipp., Ireland) playwrite recetly won a host of drama awards for a play which featured many traditional Irish folk songs as well as his own compositions in the Irish folk idiom.

Thank God the process continues.

FMcG

Subject: RE: Influence of Literature in music
From: sophocleese
Date: 04 May 00 - 08:49 PM

Then there is John Gay's "Beggar's Opera" which used folk tunes. Walter Scott and Robbie Burns collected folk ballads and rewrote a few and composed a few of their own. Their styles became popular and likely influenced the styles of some other now anonymous composers. Once it is possible to write down the words to a ballad or song and have a fair number of people read it then the style can change. There is less need for repetition in passing it on. Now that songwriters want their songs to be requested on the radio there is again a drive towards using a catchy phrase, or hook, over and over again.

Subject: RE: Influence of Literature in music
From: Susan A-R
Date: 04 May 00 - 10:07 PM

There is another thread about this sort of thing, about poetry set to music, which talks about Burns poems, Byron poems, Kipling poems, Brecht poems, etc. etc. Vance Gilbert also does an Icharus song. Happens a lot, I'd guess.

Subject: RE: Influence of Literature in music
From:
Date: 05 May 00 - 08:44 PM

Hey, everybody, a recently retired English teacher is now speaking atcha. Nice discussion, guys. 6 years ago or thereabouts a lesbian group, Disappear Fear, cranked out a six minute blockbuster song: "Who's so Scared" based on a (not really a classic) poem by Harlem Renaissance poet, Countee Cullen, "Incident in Baltimore." This Disappear Fear song is one of the strongest pop statements I know of for gender tolerance (or is it tolerence?), Song is on Disappear Fear's eponymously titled CD.

Subject: RE: Influence of Literature in music
From: Caitrin
Date: 06 May 00 - 04:47 PM

I love Loreena McKennitt's arrangements of Tennyson poems. Robert Burns is, of course, musical literature. I've also heard Yeats' "Down by the Salley Gardens" sung.
The Camus book that "Killing an Arab" is based on is "The Stranger," not "The Outsider."

Subject: RE: Influence of Literature in music
From: Amergin
Date: 06 May 00 - 04:56 PM

Subject: RE: Influence of Literature in music
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 06 May 00 - 05:27 PM

And there's Shakespeare of course. Full of songs. And the players in Midsummer Night's Dream - typical bunch of mummers doing a slightly different kind of play (self-parody of Romeo and Juliet) out of mumming season.

Subject: RE: Influence of Literature in music
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 06 May 00 - 07:53 PM

With reference to Camus' L'Étranger, "The Outsider" is a better translation of the title than is "The Stranger".  The Irish "hedge-schools" produced a lot of songs with very conscious Classical allusions; there are quite a few examples on the DT.

Malcolm