Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Mark Clark
Date: 23 Oct 02 - 04:54 PM

I suggest it's a fine time to learn to play slide blues. If you can check out records (what are those?) and CDs at your public library, go down and find all the slide blues players you can and listen and mess around until you figure out what tuning they're using and start working. Slide blues is a very useful skill because you can play solo on an acoustic guitar or electrify and play with a band.

If you're into bluegrass and country, trade something for a resophonic guitar (Dobro) and work on that.

My own RA is controled now with meds but the day will come when my hands won't be up to the task. When that happens, I'll go to slide blues and bluegrass Dobro.

Keep on pickin', Bob.

      - Mark

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: 53
Date: 23 Oct 02 - 11:12 AM

How do you play with your left hand messed up?

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Marion
Date: 23 Apr 01 - 12:38 AM

Here, God willing, is Part 3

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Justa Picker
Date: 25 Mar 01 - 06:50 PM

McCartney's "Blackbird" played in its mother key of G, is an excellent song to use for checking the intonation of a guitar or a guitar one is thinking of purchasing. I use it as one of my "litmus" tests.

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Mark Clark
Date: 23 Mar 01 - 11:40 PM

Marion, I hope that works for you. An old friend of mine learned to play (self taught) in his mid teens and was almost instantly brilliant. He was naturally obsessive about it and dropped everything else to play guitar, even school. He couldn't help it. He could have been a great player but he was so painfully shy he often wouldn't even play for friends, let alone in front of strangers. Guitars can get in your blood and lead you astray as easily as they can reward you.

Fiddles are an interesting tuning problem because you can't tune them just by plucking the strings. The arc of vibration of a bowed string is greater than that of the same string when plucked so the bowed note may not be precisely the same as the plucked note. I tune the A string to an A440 tuning fork. I strike the fork and place the but end between my teeth taking care not to touch it with my lips. This causes the A note to vibrate cleanly through my head while I am tuning the bowed A string. I then tune the other strings relative to the A string by bowing them together while turning either the friction peg or the fine tuner. Your ear will tell you when the two "drop" into tune together. Of course the G string is tuned off the D string in the same fashion. I don't have perfect pitch and probably can't sing an accurate interval without having a chord to listen to, I've just learned what the adjacent strings sound like together when they're in tune.

      - Mark

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 23 Mar 01 - 09:30 PM

Hey Marion, another "obsessive personality" jumps in! Ha ha!

Justa, I've been hearing about how bridge pins can seriously alter the sound of your guitar for years. Folks use Brass, Bone, ivory, rosewood, tusq etc. and truthfully I don't know how much difference it makes. I DO know that it's the "touch" of the player that make all the difference in how guitars sound. Say for example that someone uses brass bridge pins in order to get more sustain....but they don't finger their chords cleanly? No sustain.

Now here's an experiment. You're obviously a guitar "nurd". Why not try three or four different sets of bridge pins and report back. I don't know how many here will care, but there'll be a few.

Shaving bridges? Easy. Ninety nine out of a hundred players (pro and am. alike) never even THINK about bridge replacement (or neck resets, or neck shaving, for that matter) they simply accept their axe for what it is. Plus, those are damned expensive procedures. Heck, shaving the bridge or the saddle is easy......think I'll just grab my old penknife and shave down this nice old Martin....maybe BOTH of them!

Cheers

Guitar nurd boy

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Justa Picker
Date: 23 Mar 01 - 07:38 PM

While we're at it, and I can't see any evidence of this having been discussed before, let's talk about bridge pins - myths, misconceptions and expectations.

In the grand scheme of things, how MUCH of a real SIGNIFICANT difference does it make to YOUR ears, whether the pins are made of plastic, wood (i.e. ebony) or bone, in terms of the overall sound of your guitar?

I think if a guitar is setup properly and perhaps has a bone nut and bone saddle, as far as the type of material the bridge pins are made out of, the sound differences are negligable.

What do you guys/gals think?


AND WHY DO PEOPLE SHAVE BRIDGES????? (It just becomes one more thing to ultimately have to pay for to replace when you do finally get around to springing for the impending neck reset?)

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Marion
Date: 23 Mar 01 - 06:52 PM

Just above I mentioned the "Twinkle Twinkle" method of checking a fiddle's tuning. My most recent discovery is the "Amazing Grace" method for checking a guitar's tuning.

There is a fourth between "A" and "maz", and a third between "maz" and "ing".

Therefore, you should be able to sing "A-maz..." on each pair of adjacent strings except G and B.

You should be able to sing "A--maz-ing" playing D-G-B open strings.

PS to Mark Clark: I've got your statement in the first thread that "you need an obsessive personality..." up on my wall.

Marion

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Marion
Date: 07 Feb 01 - 10:16 PM

Thanks Mark. I did see the diagrams in your original post, but didn't know how to link to it.

Marion

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: mkebenn
Date: 06 Feb 01 - 10:02 PM

Thanks, guys an' gals, I read both these threads, then over to the Doc Watson side spur, put down my flat pick and tried a little thumb and index work {about three hours on and off thru the day, an' now I can hardly type. However, I made the first really New sounds in a decade, so relly, thanks. Mike

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Mark Clark
Date: 06 Feb 01 - 01:16 AM

Marion,

All the muting is done with the noting hand. In my original post the chord names are active links (blue clickies) that generate the chord diagrams and fingering. In the G6 chord, the A string is muted by the second finger and the E string is muted by the third. As you guessed, make the chord so these fingers don't come straight down but angle over slightly and deaden the adjacent string. For the G7, the damping is done with the first and third fingers, in the Gmaj7 it's the first and second.

By the way, the thumb, for these chords, is bent backwards at the first knuckle and placed squarely in the middle of the back of the neck.

When moving from the G6 to the G7, you can't slide your index finger up to the third fret so you move your second finger over to cover the F. Your index finger then moves to cover G on the E string replacing the now absent index finger. Of course in practice the two fingers are raised and repositioned at exactly the same time.

The same approach is used when moving from G7 to Gmaj7 except it's the second and third fingers that are repositioned while the first and third ramain at their stations.

The interesting thing with this is that, after you get it down and can do it easily, there is only one note moving between these positions: E, F and F# on the D string. With these chords, and a half dozen more in the same vein, you have most of what you need to play jazz rhythm in any key you want. Of course a big helping of theory goes a long way too.

Good luck,

      - Mark

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Marion
Date: 06 Feb 01 - 12:18 AM

Mark Clark:

"Inexperienced but obsessive" is just how I like to think of myself, so I want to try this exercise you gave in the middle of Thread 1.

"Here is a gratuitous chord exercise for the ambitious beginner. (If I haven't blown the HTML) It moves up and down from G6 to G7 to Gmaj7 and back down again. The trick is this: only two fingers may be lifted from the fingerboard for any single change! Under no circumstances may you reposition your hand. I'm assuming you are using a flatpick and all strokes are down, 4/4 time, two beats per chord. They are four-string chords so the unplayed strings must be muted. Keep this pattern moving until it's smooth."

My question is how to mute the high E and A strings. I haven't done muting before but I'm guessing that you bend the fingers fretting the B and low E back so that they're touching the strings you want muted? Right? Or is it something you're supposed to do with your right hand?

Thanks, Marion

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: GUEST,folkcensor
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 05:48 PM

Mooh, you don't fool nobody, poor man my ass. You likely hired someone to do it for you.

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Mooh
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 12:25 PM

Wanna really drive 'em nuts at a session? Strum your guitar with a shaker egg in your pick hand, the effect is really nice when used in moderation. The problem is that most such shakers are a little large to hold at the same time as manipulating a pick. I looked around for a while and found those little plastic capsules which hold little prizes in gum machines (or "Kindereggs") to be about the right size. Instead of using popcorn or splitshot inside the egg, I used the ball ends from worn out guitar strings. About 30 will shake around nicely for an acceptable shaker sound.

I like these poor man solutions. Mooh.

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Marion
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 10:10 PM

Something that might be helpful for tuning to intervals:

Find an example of the interval you need in a song that you know well.

The first time I tried tuning a fiddle string by listening to its interval above another string, I ended up tuning it an octave above instead of a fifth above. I just wasn't in touch with how "abstract" intervals sounded. Then I discovered that there's a perfect fifth in the beginning of "Twinkle Twinkle Little Star."

So now when I'm testing the tuning of adjacent strings I'm singing "twinkle, TWINKLE" to see if the gap seems right.

Marion

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: MK
Date: 14 Nov 00 - 09:56 AM

I find in the winter and when relative humidity levels are below 40% (a hygrometer in the room where your guitars are stored so that you get a daily reading) that refilling the "Dampit" (or your guitar humidifier of choice) 2 - 3 times a week gets the job done nicely. You want to hold the guitar sideways and site it looking across the top. If the area immediately below the bridge is lower than the area immediately above the bridge start humidifying immediately. To know if your guitar is in decent shape during the winter (and dry months) the area immediately below the bridge should be slightly higher. If it is significantly higher, than don't humidify till it drops down. (Tops expand and contract all the time. It's normal.) I agree with Mooh, and always make sure you ring out the sponge so that it is moist without dripping, and the external cover is dry. Takes on average about 8 hours to completely evaporate and dry out.

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Mooh
Date: 14 Nov 00 - 09:40 AM

I hope I'm not repeating myself here, but it's not a bad time of year for attention to guitar humidifiers.

Though I use several Kyser brand soundhole humidifiers, and I like them, there's a cheaper way. An old plastic 35mm film canister with several small holes drilled in it, and a damp sponge inserted in it, works well as a humidifier. This can be placed in the case, or suspended inside the guitar by cord or velcro (love that stuff) if like me you keep your guitars hung up. So long as it doesn't drip it will work as well as any store-bought solution.

Check it every day or two, depending on the weather, and refill as required.

Mooh.

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Mooh
Date: 12 Nov 00 - 01:27 PM

I recently purchased a Yamaha classical guitar, new, solid top, just a workin' man's ax. I often need such an animal for gigs and lessons and recording, and I get nervous borrowing one from a good and reliable friend, feeling it's not fair to put his guitar at risk. I haven't actually owned my own in years. Not wanting to waste any life the factory strings had, I left them on until they pissed me off for the last time. I prefer hard tension nylon strings because they don't slip and slide around so much under my fingers, but the guitar was shipped with what felt like rubber bands.

While I was at this little chore of changing strings, I did a general set-up job. Though the guitar sounded acceptable when I bought it, I knew there could be some improvement. While I had the strings off, I touched up a couple of fret ends and dropped the action a hair. The saddle was very uneven on its bottom and I suspect it made poor contact with the bridge. The bottom of the saddle slot was flat enough, though someday I may remove the finish from it as it impedes the transmission of vibration to the top. The saddle itself I sanded flat on a thick slab of Corian with medium to fine sandpapers. When I returned the saddle to its home I discovered that the slot itself was too wide. My option here was to make a new saddle, but instead I returned the original, shimming it (with an appropriate grade of paper) between the soundhole side of the slot and the saddle (NOT under the saddle). I chose that side of the saddle because I had noticed that the intonation erred that way with the factory strings, and suspected it would with the new ones.

It's a good thing classical strings last a long time for me because it takes an annoying day or so to get the stretch out of them. Once I had the strings broken in I did some measuring. The action was much better, and the intonation was dead on. Sustain improved too, as did the individual note clarity and tone. Next time I change strings I'll make a new saddle that fits the slot snuggly without a shim, but save the old one in case of an emergency. My actual time investment was less than an hour and I've got a much better guitar than the one I bought.

I am one of those non-traditionalists who likes strap buttons on my classical guitar. Heel and tail, as on most steel strings these days, was all I wanted. I love locking strap buttons, but on acoustic instruments which may be recorded or played seated with the strap on loosely, I avoid the locks if they are the variety which rattle.

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Clifton53
Date: 29 Oct 00 - 11:26 PM

Indeed, the capo lowers the action a bit I think. Another thing about capo use which I think changes things is the stretch is not as great with your fretting hand, so if you get too use to playing a tough piece with the capo on, especially if you have it up pretty high, going back to playing it straight is a real wake up call for your fingers.

Clifton53

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: MK
Date: 29 Oct 00 - 11:18 PM

Something I discovered and thought it might be worth passing on. If you want to preserve your well developed callouses, DON'T get into a habbit over a protracted period of time playing your guitar capo-d up two or three frets. I'd been doing this the past several weeks as I was working out different flat and fingerpicking runs.

In preparation for a get together today with a friend and to do some pickin', several days ago I took the capo off of the instrument and started playing things in the first three opened positions, and for the life of me couldn't figure out why the ends of my fingers (fretting hand) ached. I'm feeling the ends of my fingertips thinking where the f--k are my callouses? Apparently playing in a capo-d position on a regular basis destroys them, and because the action is so low, you can get by with a feather light touch and your fingertips don't get the regular workout they need to maintain the callouses.

So take that capo off and play in regular positions frequently. Your callouses will thank you, and you won't have to go through the process of rebuilding them.

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: MK
Date: 13 Oct 00 - 12:34 AM

I was just doing a bit of practising and working up a little arrangement of "Mr. Bojangles" and I stumbled across something interesting in the process. (Maybe to more advanced players than myself it's old hat, but I thought it was a cool technique and something worth pursuing and knowing how to do, so I thought I'd share it as it works really nicely in improvising of 'Jangles chord changes.

It's always been stressed to me that in order to develop the ability to improvise in fingerpicking, it is necessary to be able to play as much of a scale in a given key as you can mangage --while keeping the alternating bass going.

The approach I had been taking was to pick each note indivdually with either the index or middle fingers, but by sheer fluke, I discovered you can avoid picking each note individually by exercising a series of pull-offs and hammer-ons, achieve the same sonic ideas, but with a different, more flowing texture to the sound. So now, in addition to being able to pick all the notes in a given scale, I'm going to start learning how to do it using pulloffs and hammer-ons in all the regular keys I play in. It's a little tough on the left hand and you need well developed callouses to get a good attack, but a technique well worth learning to add to the old "tools arsenal." Like I said, not rocket science or anything, but a little breakthrough for me. (You need those every once in a while when you've think you're coasting on a plateau.)

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: John Hardly
Date: 10 Oct 00 - 12:43 AM

You are right--I made it too confusing. I should have either used the 1 again or, to reflect the intention of doing two octaves, just continue 9, 10, 11,etc.

Yes, I meant go down the scale as reverse. The point of learning to reverse anywhere is the way it approximates the way notes of a scale often fall in a tune--f'rinstance Molly Bloom starts very much the same as this exercise.

It's also TONS easier if you take the short time it takes to tab it out instead of "hunt-n-pick" John

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Marion
Date: 10 Oct 00 - 12:01 AM

I think I understand what you mean.

You basically play the scale going up but echoing each note with the third above it before going on to the next note of the scale, right?

By "reversing the order", do you mean going down the scale? Or going up but playing the third-aboves before the scale notes? Or using the third-belows as the echoes?

I just wanted to remind you that in the scale 1 equals 8, so the third above 7 would be 2, not 1 as you have it here: "1,3,2,4,3,5,4,6,5,7,6,8,7,1,8,2,1,3,2,4,3,5,4,6,5,7,6,8,7,1"

And the third above 8 would be 3. I don't mean to nitpick, I understand what you meant, but I worried this might confuse someone else using this tip.

Thanks and I'll try it out tomorrow,

Marion

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: John Hardly
Date: 04 Oct 00 - 11:01 PM

Marion,

Since I have no way of tabbing this out to make it easier I'll try to make sense by saying-- Take the scale (G major for example) as you are used to playing it. Now, instead of that 1,2,3,4 order do it 1,3,2,4,3,5,4,6,5,7,6,8,7,1,8,2,1,3,2,4,3,5,4,6,5,7,6,8,7,1 then reverse the order. the G scale works well because 2 octaves in first position make it easy to gain speed and accuracy, as well as get used to the way it sounds. Learn to reverse the order at will, anywhere along the scale. It will set you up well as a primer to cross picking, especially when you start practicing the 5ths----1,5,2,6,3,7,4,8,5,1,6,...Clear as mud?

If this doesn't make sense PLEASE let me know and I will figure out a better way.

John millring Hardly

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Marion
Date: 04 Oct 00 - 03:16 PM

John, I don't understand what you mean by playing a scale in ascending and descending thirds. Can you explain this, please?

Thanks, Marion

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Oct 00 - 08:06 AM

Neat idea John Hardly. Thanks for the suggestions.

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: John Hardly
Date: 04 Oct 00 - 12:59 AM

If you've got one of those small bodied guitars that Rick refers to at the beginning of this thread, you might find the imbalance of those heavy enclosed tuners pulling the neck down (see thread on gravity). Call Elderly and order ebony tuning keys. It cuts the weight by 72 grams and really helps balance the guitar. (Looks better too)

Learn the scales in ascending and descending thirds. It will spare you the boredom of do re mi, train your fingers to play progressions as they appear in lots of tunes, and show you how chords appear in keys. When you've mastered thirds move on to fifths--sounds kinda modal.

just some things that have helped me.

John

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Marion
Date: 03 Oct 00 - 10:16 PM

Thanks Michael, mousethief, and moonjen. I'm not that upset by fret noise - it's only one small thing among Things That Are Wrong With My Guitar Playing (the list is long but distinguished) - but I had been wondering about it.

Fiddle tip:

Recently on the fiddle-l list there has been discussion about how to train your bowing wrist to move freely. These things have been suggested, and I hope to try them soon:

- immobilizing most of your arm by standing too close to a wall, or in a doorframe, or with your arm resting on the top of your chair, or even by having another person grip your forearm.

- opening a paperback novel in the middle and propping it up on your arm, then trying to play without letting the book fall.

The idea is that these exercises will force you to play from the wrist. Although you may really want to play with both wrist action and arm action, the exercises will have made your wrist fluid so you won't end up playing with just your arm.

Marion

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: bbelle
Date: 26 Sep 00 - 01:38 PM

I prefer other strings to Elixirs, but if fret noise is your problem, they're probably the best. The only time I've had a problem with fret noise was from Martin Silk & Steel for folk guitar. Pure drech.

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: mousethief
Date: 26 Sep 00 - 01:31 PM

Marion,

That's called "fret noise" (don't ask me why since it's not caused by frets but rather by the texture of the strings) and there is little you can do about it. If it REALLY upsets you you can get flat-wound strings (most electric strings are of this sort), which decreases but doesn't totally eliminate the noise.

Otherwise just consider it part of the joys of playing the guitar.

Playing the guitar has been one of the greatest joys of my life, and I'm thankful to whatever angel or demon incited me to buy that guitar when I was 16 and my parents were out of town, even though my grandmother (who was "sitting") nearly wrang my neck.

Alex
O..O
=o=

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: MK
Date: 26 Sep 00 - 01:24 PM

Talcum powder on the fingertips, or Elixer strings, Marion.

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Marion
Date: 26 Sep 00 - 01:11 PM

What about that cute little squeaking noise I get from the left end of the guitar when I change chords?

Should I consider it a problem? Is there anything that can be done about it?

Marion

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Mark Clark
Date: 18 Sep 00 - 10:57 AM

Here's a link to Rick Fielding's tips on Playing Like Doc Watson. Some of the best advice I've seen in print.

Another tip would be to move to Toronto (great city, you'll love it) and become a student of Rick's, seriously.

      - Mark

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Dee45
Date: 02 Sep 00 - 02:10 PM

The process involved in Making a New Saddle.

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Mooh
Date: 15 Aug 00 - 08:53 AM

I may have mentioned this already. Please forgive the repetition if I have.

Most thumb picks come from the factory with much too much length for most people. Common every-day nail clippers will trim and shape a thumb pick well. A little filing and fine sanding will round the edges. The best and most commonly available abrasive for an absolutely smooth picking surface is likely toothpaste, but I don't personally find it necessary.

Peace, Mooh.

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Pene Azul
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 04:04 PM

Dear Dr. Folkenmusik

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Mooh
Date: 01 Aug 00 - 06:05 PM

Check out the "Capo. Cheat or Godsend." thread for my description of my "capo-nut" and other capo tricks. Mooh.

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Pene Azul
Date: 31 Jul 00 - 01:01 PM

Capo. Cheat or godsend?

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Terry Allan Hall
Date: 29 Jul 00 - 10:39 AM

Here's a tip I didn't see listed...if you're having trouble hanging on to your flatpick, take out your Swiss Army knife (you haven't got a Swiss Army knife? Well, get one ASAP!) and carve little "cross-hatches" on both sides.

Works like a charm...then there's "Gorilla Snot"...

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Pene Azul
Date: 28 Jul 00 - 03:40 PM

Mark and Rawhide, thanks for all the links. Those will be very useful when I index this stuff. I think we'll have a fine resource here.

Thanks to all of you for the great contributions. Keep 'em coming!

PA

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Dee45
Date: 28 Jul 00 - 02:00 PM

Bit of a crosspost here, as I submitted the following to another thread, but it occurred to me, this would also be an appropriate place to add these links.

Here are 3 good places on the Web to purchase strings. I've dealt with all of them at one time or another and they are all reputable and straight up.

Just Strings

Big City Strings

WebStrings

Subject: More Tip Links
From: Mark Clark
Date: 28 Jul 00 - 11:44 AM

I guess once I get started on this, it's hard to stop.

Mystery of Django's Chords. oooooh!
TWELVE-STRING GUITARS
Harmonica Players Unite!
Help: Banjo Player Questions
Attn: Jews Harp Players

      - Mark

Subject: Links to Other "Tip" Threads
From: Mark Clark
Date: 28 Jul 00 - 10:53 AM

Paul's comment got me searching to see what other threads might already have discussed recommended players. In the process I realized how many different threads there are that provide important tips of all types. I don't pretend to have found them all but here are a few for cross reference purposes.

Figuring out alternate tunings
For Guitarists
Guitar Picks - What's your favourite?
Ragtime Guitar
Bluegrass G run
improvising folk, blues, jazz etc.
Musicians Little Secrets

I'm sure there are many more. Perhaps others will provide more links as they are rediscovered.

      - Mark

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Pene Azul
Date: 28 Jul 00 - 03:00 AM

While I'm at it: Robert Fripp, Jeff Beck, Allan Holdsworth, Taj Mahal, Andres Segovia,...

Maybe we need categories here (?)

PA

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Pene Azul
Date: 28 Jul 00 - 02:54 AM

Let's not forget Frank Zappa.

PA

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Mark Clark
Date: 27 Jul 00 - 09:23 PM

There you go. We'll turn it into a long list yet.

      - Mark

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Peter T.
Date: 27 Jul 00 - 04:27 PM

Of course you are right. Might one add Dave van Ronk, Elmore James, Lonnie Johnson, Joseph Spence; Paul McCartney and Jaco Pastorius (bassists)? yours, Peter T.

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Mark Clark
Date: 27 Jul 00 - 03:52 PM

Peter, I'm sure you're right. I would never do that to an individual student, I'd suggest specific players according to the student's abilities, taste and goals. Still, I wouldn't think the student was serious unless he or she was willing to listen to all the players on my short list. In fact, I'd expect a serious student to discover some of them on his or her own and tell me about them first.

I keep being troubled by the fact that my list is too short and was done too quickly. Now I'd like to go back and add Kenny Baker as well. If you haven't listened to the guitar work he did with Josh Graves on the Puritan label you're in for a real treat.

      - Mark

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Peter T.
Date: 26 Jul 00 - 11:18 AM

Dear Mark, with respect, I think that is a mistake. You are wasting your vast source of knowledge and capacities as a teacher by just dumping a list like that. It is like me saying to my environmental students -- go out into a swamp and see what happens. That is great, no problem with it -- but a map and a guidebook can be a great help to see what is there. This is maybe good advice (though I doubt it) if you are 19. The rest of us are older and are not stifled by getting some guidance about what is useful -- we can discard it at will. We are wandering around enough as it is. You mention a motivated beginner. A motivated adult beginner (me!) wants to know what to go and listen to for specific things. He doesn't want a list of the great guitarists of the last 50 years. He is already motivated: he has already heard Jimi Hendrix and Joe Pass. He wants to know how to do things. Actually I think this is true of 19 year olds as well -- though broadening their listening is great. Information and guidance are not going to stifle an interest in roaming around and listening to all kinds of music.

yours, Peter T.

Subject: RE: Help for Pickers - Give us a tip II
From: Mark Clark
Date: 26 Jul 00 - 10:43 AM

Thanks, Moonchild. As I re-read the list, I start to think of all the great guitar players who should be mentioned. As I said, it's a short list, very spur-of-the-moment. Those are simply some of the guitarists I could think of right then.

Peter, It was my intent to omit references to style or genre. I sort of feel that a motivated beginner will seek out the music of those players and discover for himself where each fits with respect to his own goals. In the process, the student may broaden his view of music and the guitar. Like Douglas Adams' fictional computer, Deep Thought, I think it's often more useful to provide a better question rather than an ultimate answer.

      - Mark