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BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: kendall Date: 02 Aug 00 - 09:05 AM I still think those responses belong in the garbage threads. That way, they are all in one pile. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: The Shambles Date: 02 Aug 00 - 03:56 PM No responses = no garbage. No piles. How are they, by the way? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: wysiwyg Date: 02 Aug 00 - 05:41 PM RANT ON. Why the hell not. Yes, Praise gets mad. And I am taking the gloves off. And I will probably be sorry, but this has been eating me for more than a day and dammit, I am here too!!!!! I am supposed to be too Christian to get mad or hurt, but I'm not perfect, and you know what really hurts here at the Mudacat is when a friend or (someone who has at least been a civil acquaintance) starts up with mocking Christianity. Why? It certainly is not usually directed in those cases at me personally, but it hurts more than any of the flames that were directed at me personally. It's because when you do that, you act like you forget I am even here, and all the others who find that humor really offensive and are thus reinfdorced in never talking about their own spirits. Do you know what it is like to keep the most imprtant thing about yourslf separate just because someone who decides to go into idiot mode will get their panties in a wad for a few freaking minutes????? It's likie always trying to be a good nigger, a silent Jew, a submissive woman, so as not to get noticed and targeted for all the insanity and violence our society offers its minorities. IT'S LIKE SITTING AT YOUR DINNER TABLE AS A BLACK PERSON AND BEING EXPECTED TO IGNORE OR EVEN LAUGH ALONG WITH JOKES ABOUT LYNCHING. There is a lot of crap that is put out in the world as "Christianity." NO SHIT!!! Duh!!! But look. If it needs mocking, trust me, we Christians are all too good at doing it for ourselves, with each other, and to each other. Come to church and watch us cut each other and the people in other churches to ribbons over coffee, ha ha ha. I get a lot of PMs from Christians here who tell me, in effect, it just isn't safe to identify themselves here. I think they are wrong, I think that is just not so, and I try to act like it, but that's the feeling. So they are here, and they "pass" just like a light skinned African American might pass. Heads down in the trench. Is that how you want your fellow Mudcatters to feel??? Hello! Would you like it if I came in and posted stuff mocking your faiths or belief systems? I may talk about mine, but I don't do it by accusing any other belief system of the stuff mine is accused of, and I don't appreciate it when others do. And mine is supposed to be the intolerant one, remember? I am tired of bursting into tears when someone I thought "got it" goes off in a direction that makes me feel like crap before I can even get a grip on my head and calm myself down. And I am really tired, much more tired, of knowing that what hurts me is hurting a lot of people I am coming to know as dear friends. And I don't want to see any PMs apologizing either, or cheering me on, or reassuring me that no one is hurt by that kind of thing. Just knock it the hell off and think before you post. RANT OFF. ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: Catrin Date: 02 Aug 00 - 07:33 PM Two points I want to make. The first is, Praise, I for one completely respect your beliefs even though they might not be my own - I would like to think that others would do the same for me. There are many many many more supportive mudcatters than otherwise. Nuff said, I know you asked for "And I don't want to see any PMs apologizing either, or cheering me on, or reassuring me that no one is hurt by that kind of thing." But this is a 'garbage dump' after all. And I needed to say it. The second point is that Sinsull - I so agree with you. I have seen the trolls and the flamers and avoid completely. Why do people feed their egos by responding? If a thread is started by someone who is obviously trying to wind people up - IGNORE IT. In case its too subtle for us newbies then put your request in about asking others not to respond. If its a stupid comment in what is otherwise an interesting discussion, then act like it hasn't happened, carry on the conversation - they'll soon get bored. Saying that, I do understand the need for a thread like this one - Its the only way I, for one, felt that I could say what I felt about the whole 'flaming' issue. Thanks for listening, Catrin |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: SINSULL Date: 02 Aug 00 - 08:13 PM Praise, I'm glad you got that off your chest. No PMs allowed so for what it's worth - I respect your beliefs and your right to believe. I am an atheist. I refuse to join the American Atheists because I disagree with some of their beliefs. This thread (and Kendall's)was started so that people who for whatever reason could not NOT respond to a flamer could vent here thus allowing the offending thread to drop off the page. It has also called attention to the need to ignore flamers and so not encourage them with attention. I agree with Wolfgang. This is not appropriate and should not be necessary in a music forum. I wonder what Max thinks...he spends his time and money and talent to produce a dream and somebody stumbles in and shits on it. Sad. Then again 99% of what goes on in here is positive if not productive so he has a lot to be proud of. Mary, dangling her prepositions again. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: bbelle Date: 02 Aug 00 - 08:23 PM Mary ... watch out for the "dangling" ... we'll be having to send you a codpiece ... jen |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: SINSULL Date: 02 Aug 00 - 08:32 PM Only if it has something in it. I have enough useless crap around my house. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: GUEST,Newbie and Lost Date: 02 Aug 00 - 09:35 PM I was wondering where the "chat" area was. Good. I don't know anything about music either, so I just thought I'd hang out with y'all in here. Is that OK? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: katlaughing Date: 02 Aug 00 - 11:49 PM Sinsull, see the Did You Know thread for more on those dangly bits.... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: Hardiman the Fiddler Date: 02 Aug 00 - 11:53 PM Welcome, Newbie and Lost, come on in, the ranting is fine, and if any of it makes sense to you, good on ya! aND IF IT DOESN'T, (damn Capslock!), join up so you get a personal page with personal message capability ("PM's") and send anyone here who you like a message. Ask anything, and say whatever you like-- in this thread or anywhere. You'll fit right in. Welcome the next Newbie, too, when you spot one. As for Catrin and Sinsull. Crap. You have completely ruined my perfectly good bad mood! I'll get you for it. You'll see. When you least expect it I will repay you, bigtime. **GGGG** ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: wysiwyg Date: 02 Aug 00 - 11:56 PM Duh on me. I forgot to reset the cookie after I wrestled Hardi for the laptop. That last was me. ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: Bill D Date: 03 Aug 00 - 12:58 AM well, I suppose I should have read in this thread before I posted in another one, but I had been avoiding this one, trying to stay OUT of serious controversy...but... ...."Would you like it if I came in and posted stuff mocking your faiths or belief systems? "..... happens to me all the time. Or rather, they mock my lack of a rigid belief system..(in several areas..not just religion). I get caught in situations where I want to avoid mentioning that I do not attend a regular church, but I get asked directly... (Can you imagine what it is like to run for public office and have to FIND a church to have any hope of being elected?) I get two different denominational groups knocking at my DOOR and telling me that I am going to hell, and that I M*U*S*T adopt creed 'X' if I want to have a happy afterlife. (and by the way, they are OFFENDED if you mistake them for each other!...as I found out the hard way)... if I was at a party, or festival, and some conversation came round to these subjects, it would be MUCH easier to analyze the situation and decide to wait to make a joke or remark until I knew there was no one to take it badly. In here, it is different...it is much like being a writer, or journalist...your words are out there, and you can't easily explain the 'tone' of your remarks. And, in 'real life', you do not expect to be 'friends' with everyone you meet...some you just try to be polite to and avoid certain subjects. One of MY pet peeves is shallow and gratuitous use of 'explicit' language in jokes, remarks, etc...(I ain't no prude..just a gourmet)...but what good would it do to say so? I simply shrug when MY sense of humor is offended by lousy, crude jokes..(and no doubt there are those who think MINE are out of bounds) One of my favorite forms of reading is the Murphy's Law type of book...and one of my VERY favorite laws is this:
"You Have Taken Yourself Too Seriously
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: Sorcha Date: 03 Aug 00 - 01:31 AM Bill D,I am right with you there on all points, and Praise, I cleared entries on a post that was so identical to yours that I had to look again.......... Sorcha |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: kendall Date: 03 Aug 00 - 08:14 AM I failed in my run for the dtate legislature not because I'm a Christian, but because I'm a Democrat! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: SINSULL Date: 03 Aug 00 - 09:23 AM Kendall, Next time run for the state legislature. You'll have a better chance. And by the way, go dump in your own garbage thread. Tee Hee. Mary |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: kendall Date: 03 Aug 00 - 09:53 AM Jeez..run off again!! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: Naemanson Date: 03 Aug 00 - 10:37 AM BillD, I agree with you and your read on those situations. With those who shamelessly proselytize their belief systems and who I don't know and respect I can be more direct and give them the brush off. With those I know and respect I need to explain that my beliefs are too personal and held too closely to share with anyone who doesn't also share my life. On the use of gratuitous foul language, I find it is better if its use is limited. That way when you do find a situation that calls for that language it has a better chance of fulfilling its purpose. Remember that overuse knocks the shine off of anything. If you commonly use those words they will not shock anyone. If you are known as someone who does not normally swear then the vehemence of your anger will shine when you resort to the language of anger. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: Little Hawk Date: 03 Aug 00 - 10:55 AM Hmmm....well, I finally took a look at this thread...it's different. I'm not sure if it's beneficial or not. After all, there are a lot of interesting things one could talk about besides this stuff. On the other hand, it's helping me get to know some of you. Praise - your comments interest me. This thing of being "Christian" or not being "Christian" is a pretty subjective business. There are some people who would definitely say I am Christian and there are some who would definitely say I am not. Ironical, isn't it? This has to do more with their chosen belief structures than mine, in all probability, as theirs are usually a whole lot more exclusive. As far as I'm concerned, I am Christian, Muslim, Buddhist, Taoist, a follower of the North American Indian Medicine Way, a mystic, a Pagan, a Bahai, a Hindu, a Jane, you name it. All of those and more. Most importantly, I am human, that's the crux of them matter. I grew up in a totally atheistic and rational family, with a strong sense of morality and social order. My parents believed in the rule of law, normal morality, science, logic, and MATERIAL GOODS!!!! Oh, and MONEY, of course. I followed along on this basically atheistic path until I was about 21. I had noticed that the people I admired the most (Dylan, Joan Baez, Buffy Sainte-Marie, Jesus Christ, Buddha, Lao Tsu, Mahatma Gandhi, Martin Luther King, Crazy Horse...and so on) were all people who clearly had VERY strong spiritual beliefs. This was obvious. And I began to wonder if maybe they were onto something. Accordingly, I investigated every religious and mystical notion out there in my early 20's. I now cannot look at any situation in life without seeing it in spiritual terms. I cannot look at any religion without seeing at its core the same essential truths, although the cultural details and the "do's and don'ts" will differ from one to another. So...although I may sometimes look askance at specific churches for their closed-mindedness and their abuses against humanity...I will never look askance at honest faith in God (or whatever you choose to call your concept of Divinity). If I should happen to criticize the church, I will not be criticizing your faith. As one believer to another...Hi there. Peace be with you. Regards, George Coventry |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: SINSULL Date: 03 Aug 00 - 11:06 AM George, Very nicely put. Thank you. Praise, I didn't know that Christians were not supposed to lose their tempers. Didn't Jesus lose it in the temple and physically eject the money changers? I bet he used a few choice words too. Sometimes, enough is enough. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: kendall Date: 03 Aug 00 - 11:53 AM and, I'll bet that Oy vey was not two of them! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: SINSULL Date: 03 Aug 00 - 12:14 PM Kendall, Apologies in advance for the "Bran" crack. Mary |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: kendall Date: 03 Aug 00 - 12:59 PM what "bran" crack? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: Jim the Bart Date: 03 Aug 00 - 01:09 PM There's a scene in the matrix where the Keanu Reeves character finally GETS IT (whatever "it" is, it's been a while since I saw the movie and I'm old and I forget things). Anyway, the image that I remember is some guy shooting at him and he doesn't even have to duck, because ythe bullets have no power in relation to him. He doesn't even have to duck or anything. The bullets just kind of hang there. It's a cool effect and a cooler metaphor. Let the flamers go. They can't hurt you unless you let' em. That being said, it's a pretty cool human trait to care enough about something or someone - even yourself - to care about a comment or a slight. It's a difficult world to stay vulnerable in (Am I dangling? Eek!). Sometime it is a lot easier to not care. In "Been Down So Long It Looks Like Up To Me", Richard Farina talked about it in subatomic terms - having no valence, no attraction or repulsion. A free range particle. But his character, "Gnossos", doesn't come alive until he gives up the neutral atate, let's his shields down and becomes involved. He gets completely screwed over, of course. . . Kat, Praise, moonchild, shambles anybody else who has at one time or another been targetted by some knucklehead - remember that someone may just see something in you that they wish was theirs. Maybe it's the fact that you're visible and they're not. That's a chance you take when you stand up. Personally, I always admire "stand up guys" (of all genders. Hope you all have a wonderful day. Bart - signing off from amongst the garbage and the flowers |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: bbelle Date: 03 Aug 00 - 01:38 PM Bart, et.al. ... thank you for the kind words. Everytime (and I do mean everytime) I post, I wait for "the other shoe to drop." It doesn't appear to matter what I post ... just, that I do post. The attacks have become very personal and straight for the jugular. I responded to three of the most recent, even though I'm admonished to "ignore." But I was able to do it calmly. If I think I'm going to lose control, I will not respond. It's a double-edged sword or damned if I do and damned if I don't. If I do respond, I take the chance of being taken to task by those who say "ignore." If I don't respond, he has succeeded in silencing me. I appreciate the fact that no one is adding to the fire when I am flamed and respond, because that only serves to turn the thread into a eddy of negativity. I also appreciate that I can click on this thread and see that others do care about me. Even though I appear calm in my responses, when I read a "flame," it becomes difficult to breathe and I feel like I've been slapped across the face. It's important, for me, to know the support is "there." jenny |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: wysiwyg Date: 03 Aug 00 - 02:40 PM I think that having an opportunity and place to rant loses some of its effectiveness when everyone begins to comment on the rant. It wasn't my intention to start a discussion. I was just having a turn in a thread I thought was meant for that. I think next time I'll just head for the nearest hill and scream for awhile. I'll read everyone's comments above but I am not going to comment on them here. ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: SINSULL Date: 03 Aug 00 - 02:48 PM Damn! I just got dumped on in my own "garbage thread" and for being nice not for flaming. And by the nicest person in Mudcat. This has to be a first! For the record, this is funny. Mary |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: wysiwyg Date: 03 Aug 00 - 02:59 PM Waiddaminnit, I hope you didn't mean me, SS, I wasn't dumping on you!!! WHY does everything have to get SO screwed up?????? (Focking earth people!) *G* ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: Jim the Bart Date: 03 Aug 00 - 05:09 PM Some people vent by screaming. I tend to vent by waxing philosophical toward the object of my discontent. It's kinda like planting a seed and churning the manure until some flowers grow. My kids absolutely hate it. They'd rather have me yell at them than philosophize at them any day. And they think I don't realize that. . . Just an thought, but what would be more frustrating for someone who is trying to provoke anger than to be greeted with sympathy? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: SINSULL Date: 03 Aug 00 - 05:18 PM Bart, I once tried that theory out on my son who was prone to tantrums. With great difficulty, I QUIETLY explained my position and ignored his mouth. Finally, in total frustration at not getting a rise out of me, he angrily shouted "You're not getting angry just to get me angry." I think the answer was yes. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: Peter T. Date: 03 Aug 00 - 05:35 PM The only comment in all the above that puzzles me is Praise's remark that she is getting personal messages from people saying they are afraid to say they are Christians here. Why? Lots of people have made no secret of their beliefs here, and as long as no one goes into active prosyletizing, and is prepared to put up with the usual graffiti discussed above, what is the problem? You have to be a little robust, but I would have thought Christians were pretty used to that by now. I am a Buddhist, which means that we eat stray foreigners and hover a few inches off the ground. Apart from that, our main aim in life is to make Richard Gere king of the world, since he can't act. Harmless, really. Here I stand, as Lord Buddha once remarked, I can do no other. yours, Peter T. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: kendall Date: 03 Aug 00 - 05:40 PM I like the way you think Peter |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: katlaughing Date: 03 Aug 00 - 08:04 PM Peter! Does the HHDalai Lama know you want Gere to be King of the World!? I would have put my vote in for HHDL, before Gere!**BG** Namasté |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: wysiwyg Date: 04 Aug 00 - 12:23 PM RE: Peter's comment, "I would have thought Christians were pretty used to that by now..."
This is a general reply, not meant to be directed at Peter, who just raised the question. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: wysiwyg Date: 04 Aug 00 - 12:43 PM Sinsull, I'm sorry. Your really wonderful idea has been hijacked into a discussion thread. Can you or kendall start another dump and lay out guidelines that MIGHT prevent that from happening again? I would really have liked to be able to just dump like everyone else. And I would hope to be able to do it again. ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: Ringer Date: 04 Aug 00 - 12:47 PM Returning to the title-subject of this thread, this is addressed to Brendy: I refer to your posting of 02-Aug-00 - 02:24 PM in the thread BS: Grit your teeth, the PIRA boys are out about which I am amused rather than cross, because it shows the world just what an offensive prick you can be. My earlier post in that thread suggested (quite politely, I thought) that use of familiar names rather than sign-on names could be construed as adding to Mudcat's cliquishness, as well as sometimes being mystifying for the reader. I only referred to you as I introduced the subject, because your posts still earlier had temporarily mystified me; you are certainly not the only offender (though I suspect "offender" may be too strong a word for a very slight "offence"). And then you imply that my comments are on the same level as a little boy pulling the wings of (sic) flies. You really can't take criticism, can you (I've noticed that before), even though the criticism was mild and not really aimed at you specifically. Do grow up a bit - this is a forum for mature adults, not moody children. Additionally, I also indicated that I would not like to be referred to as Timothy, and what happens? In your following post you call me Tim! That, I suggest, is more akin to pulling the wings off flies, showing deliberate offensiveness. But it made me ROTFLMAO, because, you see, my name is not Timothy. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: kendall Date: 04 Aug 00 - 01:11 PM Go Sinsull...they like you better than me anyway LOL |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: Peter T. Date: 04 Aug 00 - 04:09 PM With great respect, Praise, A-H are not remotely a response. G is about the closest. E can be easily reversed: virtually all the Buddhists I know were brought up as Christians and Jews, so they ought to have some knowledge of Christianity, and do. So what? It makes some of them tolerant, some intolerant. So with Christians and other religions they may have come from (I avoid the topic of missionary work). Why someone would be afraid to post here because of F makes little sense: almost nobody anywhere knows anything about Christianity any more, and very few people have any insight into anything. You seem to be suggesting that the only people Christians can talk to are other Christians or deeply sympathetic outsiders. This is hardly a robust Christianity. That leaves us with G which says that there are more mocking Christian threads here than others. I don't remember many mocking religious threads at all (except the various digs at the Prayer Circle, which seemed to be about as non-sectarian as these things get), but suppose you are right. So? Apart from the fact that there are more Christians here statisically anyway given that we live in the remnants of a Christian society, we are all mocked: God is not mocked. We have had at least one thread recently where people talked quite interestingly about religion, with only minor bruises. It seems like no big deal. A full scale attack on any identifiable religion seems to bring out the "let a thousand pathways bloom" strain around here in response. The question still stands: Why are these mysterious people afraid of identifying themselves as Christians here? yours, Peter T. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: wysiwyg Date: 04 Aug 00 - 05:48 PM Peter, I leave the computer now for vacation. I will write when I land at a computer again, middle of next week. ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: catspaw49 Date: 04 Aug 00 - 05:50 PM The interesting exchange between Praise and Peter is best summed up by that old Irish wish: Go li maorlathai mithrocaireach do chuid fo-eadaigh. Its amazing to me that there is always an Irish wish/expression for everything! Spaw |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: SINSULL Date: 04 Aug 00 - 06:22 PM Praise, Enjoy your vacation. Garbage can include discussion too. And this appears to have gotten right back on track. I wish someone with magic fingers would do a blue clicky to a new thread. This is ready for archiving. Yeah, Kendall, they like me but they respect you. Mary who is also not Timothy. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: katlaughing Date: 04 Aug 00 - 06:40 PM Here ya go, Mary: new garbage bin thread Please post to the new one phoaks. Thanks, kat |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: Peter K (Fionn) Date: 04 Aug 00 - 08:43 PM What is ROTFLMAO? I can't even work out LMAO, for God's sake. I'd start a thread, but I think this is probably a non-music question. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Garbage dump for responding to idiots From: kendall Date: 04 Aug 00 - 09:00 PM Rolling on the floor laughing my ass off |