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BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll

Lonesome EJ 09 Aug 00 - 02:16 AM
Melani 09 Aug 00 - 02:21 AM
rangeroger 09 Aug 00 - 02:29 AM
Lox 09 Aug 00 - 02:33 AM
Joe Offer 09 Aug 00 - 02:39 AM
Sandy Paton 09 Aug 00 - 02:40 AM
Lepus Rex 09 Aug 00 - 03:16 AM
Thomas the Rhymer 09 Aug 00 - 03:18 AM
GUEST 09 Aug 00 - 04:07 AM
Ella who is Sooze 09 Aug 00 - 04:29 AM
kendall 09 Aug 00 - 05:21 AM
kendall 09 Aug 00 - 05:21 AM
Big Mick 09 Aug 00 - 06:19 AM
Morticia 09 Aug 00 - 06:44 AM
Amergin 09 Aug 00 - 06:47 AM
Midchuck 09 Aug 00 - 07:04 AM
keltcgrasshoppper 09 Aug 00 - 07:04 AM
Skipjack K8 09 Aug 00 - 07:05 AM
Bud Savoie 09 Aug 00 - 07:17 AM
ol'troll 09 Aug 00 - 07:23 AM
Dharmabum 09 Aug 00 - 08:28 AM
JedMarum 09 Aug 00 - 08:47 AM
Giac 09 Aug 00 - 09:06 AM
Alice 09 Aug 00 - 10:23 AM
catspaw49 09 Aug 00 - 10:25 AM
Ebbie 09 Aug 00 - 11:00 AM
Downeast Bob 09 Aug 00 - 11:28 AM
jeffp 09 Aug 00 - 11:35 AM
Mrrzy 09 Aug 00 - 11:38 AM
GUEST,Jeff Emmett 09 Aug 00 - 11:54 AM
Jed at Work 09 Aug 00 - 12:00 PM
IvanB 09 Aug 00 - 12:05 PM
Kim C 09 Aug 00 - 12:32 PM
katlaughing 09 Aug 00 - 12:41 PM
Naemanson 09 Aug 00 - 12:48 PM
DougR 09 Aug 00 - 01:18 PM
canoer 09 Aug 00 - 01:29 PM
Mbo 09 Aug 00 - 01:47 PM
Sean Belt 09 Aug 00 - 01:51 PM
Bill D 09 Aug 00 - 02:04 PM
JR 09 Aug 00 - 02:17 PM
catspaw49 09 Aug 00 - 02:24 PM
GUEST,Luther 09 Aug 00 - 02:59 PM
thosp 09 Aug 00 - 03:28 PM
Peter T. 09 Aug 00 - 04:11 PM
AllisonA(Animaterra) 09 Aug 00 - 04:16 PM
gillymor 09 Aug 00 - 05:01 PM
Bill D 09 Aug 00 - 05:15 PM
GUEST,Mimsey 09 Aug 00 - 06:56 PM
Burke 09 Aug 00 - 07:23 PM
CarolC 09 Aug 00 - 07:38 PM
GUEST, Banjo Johnny 09 Aug 00 - 07:44 PM
GUEST,Luther 09 Aug 00 - 08:02 PM
northfolk/al cholger 09 Aug 00 - 08:22 PM
CarolC 09 Aug 00 - 08:40 PM
Lox 09 Aug 00 - 08:40 PM
Little Hawk 09 Aug 00 - 11:42 PM
DougR 09 Aug 00 - 11:51 PM
JamesJim 10 Aug 00 - 12:13 AM
GUEST,Mickey191 10 Aug 00 - 12:22 AM
DougR 10 Aug 00 - 12:26 AM
Little Hawk 10 Aug 00 - 12:43 AM
Rosebrook 10 Aug 00 - 01:08 AM
Thomas the Rhymer 10 Aug 00 - 02:58 AM
Lox 10 Aug 00 - 07:58 AM
Midchuck 10 Aug 00 - 08:44 AM
Little Hawk 10 Aug 00 - 09:28 AM
Kim C 10 Aug 00 - 09:47 AM
JedMarum 10 Aug 00 - 09:51 AM
Rosebrook 10 Aug 00 - 10:36 AM
Kim C 10 Aug 00 - 12:39 PM
death by whisky 10 Aug 00 - 12:53 PM
JedMarum 10 Aug 00 - 12:59 PM
GUEST 10 Aug 00 - 01:16 PM
GUEST,Luther 10 Aug 00 - 01:27 PM
DougR 10 Aug 00 - 03:23 PM
Lonesome EJ 10 Aug 00 - 03:41 PM
thosp 10 Aug 00 - 07:17 PM
Tone d' F 10 Aug 00 - 07:29 PM
DougR 10 Aug 00 - 09:52 PM
CarolC 10 Aug 00 - 09:55 PM
bbc 10 Aug 00 - 10:05 PM
Tone d' F 10 Aug 00 - 10:14 PM
Bill D 10 Aug 00 - 10:27 PM
mg 10 Aug 00 - 11:21 PM
Little Hawk 10 Aug 00 - 11:22 PM
DougR 10 Aug 00 - 11:42 PM
Lepus Rex 10 Aug 00 - 11:47 PM
DougR 10 Aug 00 - 11:49 PM
ol'troll 11 Aug 00 - 12:01 AM
Lepus Rex 11 Aug 00 - 12:08 AM
Thomas the Rhymer 11 Aug 00 - 02:48 AM
mactheturk 11 Aug 00 - 07:51 AM
BigDaddy 11 Aug 00 - 12:43 PM
Kim C 11 Aug 00 - 02:02 PM
Lonesome EJ 11 Aug 00 - 02:57 PM
JR 11 Aug 00 - 04:20 PM
DougR 11 Aug 00 - 05:34 PM
BigDaddy 11 Aug 00 - 07:03 PM
Little Hawk 11 Aug 00 - 07:05 PM
ceitagh 11 Aug 00 - 07:37 PM
Susan from California 11 Aug 00 - 08:18 PM
DougR 11 Aug 00 - 09:06 PM
RWilhelm 11 Aug 00 - 09:25 PM
Little Hawk 11 Aug 00 - 10:53 PM
tar_heel 11 Aug 00 - 10:57 PM
tar_heel 11 Aug 00 - 10:58 PM
JedMarum 11 Aug 00 - 11:14 PM
WyoWoman 12 Aug 00 - 01:38 AM
Peter K (Fionn) 12 Aug 00 - 06:49 PM
McGrath of Harlow 12 Aug 00 - 07:22 PM
DougR 12 Aug 00 - 07:32 PM
celticblues5 12 Aug 00 - 07:40 PM
CarolC 12 Aug 00 - 08:33 PM
Lepus Rex 12 Aug 00 - 08:49 PM
Lonesome EJ 12 Aug 00 - 09:03 PM
death by whisky 12 Aug 00 - 10:53 PM
Little Hawk 12 Aug 00 - 10:59 PM
DonMeixner 13 Aug 00 - 02:10 AM
Peter Kasin 13 Aug 00 - 02:52 AM
ceitagh 13 Aug 00 - 11:19 AM
GUEST,bob s. 13 Aug 00 - 03:01 PM
Uncle Jaque 13 Aug 00 - 05:25 PM
Little Hawk 13 Aug 00 - 07:20 PM
DougR 13 Aug 00 - 08:02 PM
Rick Fielding 13 Aug 00 - 08:14 PM
McGrath of Harlow 13 Aug 00 - 08:19 PM
Little Hawk 14 Aug 00 - 12:17 AM
Lonesome EJ 14 Aug 00 - 12:18 AM
DougR 14 Aug 00 - 01:04 AM
CarolC 14 Aug 00 - 01:21 AM
GUEST,JB 14 Aug 00 - 02:33 AM
Little Hawk 14 Aug 00 - 11:39 AM
Lonesome EJ 14 Aug 00 - 12:25 PM
DougR 14 Aug 00 - 01:49 PM
Little Hawk 14 Aug 00 - 04:18 PM
McGrath of Harlow 14 Aug 00 - 07:35 PM
DougR 14 Aug 00 - 07:44 PM
McGrath of Harlow 14 Aug 00 - 07:53 PM
GUEST,Matewan 14 Aug 00 - 08:24 PM
Biskit 14 Aug 00 - 08:38 PM
DougR 15 Aug 00 - 12:41 AM
Lepus Rex 15 Aug 00 - 01:17 AM
Big Mick 15 Aug 00 - 03:00 AM
GUEST,JB 15 Aug 00 - 04:20 AM
Little Hawk 15 Aug 00 - 07:21 AM
McGrath of Harlow 15 Aug 00 - 02:14 PM
Lepus Rex 15 Aug 00 - 02:49 PM
DougR 15 Aug 00 - 04:00 PM
Don Firth 15 Aug 00 - 07:02 PM
Little Hawk 15 Aug 00 - 07:11 PM

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Subject: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 02:16 AM

OK, shoot me, but I'm doing this anyway.

I'm wondering, at this stage of the game, which Presidential Candidate Mudcatters are suppoting. My guess is that the Dems and Liberals outnumber Republicans and Conservatives,but we'll see. Maybe we can poll now, and then close to the election to see if anyone changes horses,and why. So....

All Mudcatters,yanks or not,invited. Please post ONLY 1)who you support and 2)and how strong your support is(S=strong W=weak). Dumb,non-music related bullshit? Sure it is! I'll start..

Gore w


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Melani
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 02:21 AM

Gore-S


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: rangeroger
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 02:29 AM

Gore w, Lieberman S


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Lox
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 02:33 AM

Jello Biafra (Greens) and his running mate Mumia Abu Jamal.

(see www.alternativetentacles.com - and read the "jello goes green" section)


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Joe Offer
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 02:39 AM

Gore - M (moderate)
Lieberman - M/S

I was leaning toward Nader, but Big Mick convinced me.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 02:40 AM

Gore/Lieberman - S


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 03:16 AM

Ralph Nader. Lox, Jello Biafra's supporting Nader now; Ralph got the nomination.

---Lepus Rex


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Thomas the Rhymer
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 03:18 AM

Nader -- S


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 04:07 AM

Gore/Lieberman - w/S


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Ella who is Sooze
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 04:29 AM

Fred Flintstone

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: kendall
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 05:21 AM

Lieberman/Gore s


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: kendall
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 05:21 AM

Never change horses in the middle of a job well done


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Big Mick
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 06:19 AM

Gore/Lieberman S

Big surprise there, eh Sandy?....LOL

Mick


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Morticia
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 06:44 AM

I thought you were interested in who should be voted President of the Mudcat....I vote for Catspaw.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Amergin
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 06:47 AM

Nader-S


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Midchuck
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 07:04 AM

Bush - PFW

"He will do less, therefore he will do less harm."

(I do think that if this choice is the best the two-party system in the US can offer us, it is time the two-party system was eliminated.)

Peter.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: keltcgrasshoppper
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 07:04 AM

Gore/Lieberman


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Skipjack K8
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 07:05 AM

Naaah, Morty, it has to be Cletus.

Let's face it, a Mudcat Presidential race is much more interesting than the dullard-fest going at the moment. Even our Septic mates have gotta agree with that!

Weren't it Hazlitt who scribed that political parties are like rival stagecoaches, on the same road, going to the same destination, splashing mud on each other?

Skipjack


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Bud Savoie
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 07:17 AM

Bush--W

Having been in the folksong world since prior to the 60s, I am aware that I am that rara avis, a Republican conservative folkie. Gets lonely here at the top.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: ol'troll
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 07:23 AM

A pox-to quote Mercutio-on both your houses. It's a choice between Tweedle Dum and Tweedle Dumber.Lets hear it for ANARCHY! I don't like any of them. They'er all a bad joke.

troll


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Dharmabum
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 08:28 AM

Don't know if I agree with this {time will tell}but I heard someone refer to this campain as a , Battle of wits between two unarmed oponents.

Nader {for now}


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: JedMarum
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 08:47 AM

Bush - S


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Giac
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 09:06 AM

Democrat.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Alice
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 10:23 AM

Snoopy... just kidding. There was no one I could support in the race until Lieberman was chosen. Now if I could only vote for Lieberman without Gore....


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: catspaw49
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 10:25 AM

G/L...S. Just can't see that Ralph has a snowball's chance in hell.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Ebbie
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 11:00 AM

Gore/Lieberman S


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Downeast Bob
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 11:28 AM

Undecided or "in the switches" as Nelson Algren so aptly put it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: jeffp
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 11:35 AM

Gore/Lieberman S


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Mrrzy
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 11:38 AM

Gore - S; Lieberman - W to Moderate. Glad we got someone in a real bid who isn't both male and Protestant, but I have to admit that I'd be happier if it were the gender barrier that had been bent (it ain't broke yet!) rather than the religious one. AND I hope that going outside the box isn't what torpedoes the Democrats.

-Mrr, who had harbored the secret hope that BOTH sides would pick a woman and thus remove that issue from the debate completely... all the rednecks would vote for Nader! What a riot!


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: GUEST,Jeff Emmett
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 11:54 AM

Bush


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Jed at Work
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 12:00 PM

I too was disappointed that neither side broke the gender barrier, especially since we have some great possibilities out there at this time. But I suspect that's just a matter of time before we have a woman leading candidate - Hillary is certainly a possibility next time around (though not on my list).


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: IvanB
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 12:05 PM

Gore/Lieberman - W


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Kim C
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 12:32 PM

I'm a troublemaker. I vote Libertarian whenever I can. :)


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: katlaughing
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 12:41 PM

If we had a primary - Nader

Otherwise: G/L - S


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Naemanson
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 12:48 PM

I guess I'm in favor of keeping the crooks that are in office rather than supplanting them with a new set of crooks. Better the ones you know...

Gore/Lieberman - VW (Very Weak)


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DougR
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 01:18 PM

Bush S. (Surprise!)


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: canoer
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 01:29 PM

Tweedle Dum.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Mbo
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 01:47 PM

Father Tom Bonacci, C.P.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Sean Belt
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 01:51 PM

G/L...S

But only because they won't let Bradley play.
- Sean


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Bill D
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 02:04 PM

Abraham Ribicoff ....ummm.... Ed Muskie ....ooops...Eugene McCarthy nuts!...(I also chose Betamax VCR, SyQuest storage drive and a bank that has been sold three times!)

oh, well...Gore/Leiberman


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: JR
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 02:17 PM

Joining the groundswell Bush S


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: catspaw49
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 02:24 PM

At the moment, it looks to be about 4 to 1 here for the G/L ticket. I'm waiting to see if the Fred Flintstone groundswell can match B/C. Flintstone? BC? They do have something in common.....

Spaw


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: GUEST,Luther
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 02:59 PM

Nader - S

haven't felt this good about a candidate since George Tirebiter...


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: thosp
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 03:28 PM

Nader-S

peace (Y) thosp


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Peter T.
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 04:11 PM

Are you Americans still having that damn election? I thought you had it last year, or was it the year before that? You sure do go on.
yours, Peter T.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: AllisonA(Animaterra)
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 04:16 PM

Nader- for now. Call me a dreamer...


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: gillymor
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 05:01 PM

G/L -S the difference between them and B/C is not enormous, in my mind, but it is critical.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Bill D
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 05:15 PM

Peter...many of us down here would give undying thanks if this stupid 2year+ electoral process could be shortened! Maybe we should just poll the pollsters 2 or 3 times and DECLARE a winner....'twould save a lot of $$$$$$,,,but the poor cartoonists would need new material...


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: GUEST,Mimsey
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 06:56 PM

Nader--S

Yeah, yeah, I've heard the argument about weakening the lesser evil of the other two strong parties, but I say, if we don't start voting for the best choice now, then WHEN??? Come on and follow me, and we'll wow 'em into thinking twice, and giving it a real chance!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Burke
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 07:23 PM

Gore - S

I wish he'd take a public speaking course.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: CarolC
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 07:38 PM

If I could, I'd vote for Porgy Tirebiter in a heartbeat. However-

Gore/Leiberman S (But I really wanted McCain).


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: GUEST, Banjo Johnny
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 07:44 PM

Can GUESTS vote?

Gore - S Lieberman - S


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: GUEST,Luther
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 08:02 PM

no way -- Porgie was utterly discredited by the fiasco at Communist Martyrs High. His political career is finito.

George, however, had the best campaign slogan ever.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: northfolk/al cholger
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 08:22 PM

First time I've known my comrade Mick to be wrong... Gore and Nader are similar on many issues...the difference, Ralph isn't lying. Health Care reform, Campaign finance reform, Labor law reform, and a litany of other issues that affect us every day are only going to be fixed when the American people demand that they be fixed... I'm certainly not portraying that electing Nader will get automatically get those things done...it won't.

But Naders is the only candidacy that a populist movement can be built around, to accomplish those goals...

I say if nothing else, we should be demanding to get Nader into the debates, because he will force the others to be more substantive...


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: CarolC
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 08:40 PM

But, Guest Luther, Porgy was a spy and an girl delighter. I rest my case.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Lox
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 08:40 PM

Whatever you do, VOTE!

You don't have any other political say. It makes no sense to have opinions if all you intend to do is parade them around in pubs and on websites.

I'll bet that most of you have a lot to say and get pretty passionate about it too.

Nows your chance to keep the biggest idiot out at the very least.

If you don't, he'll be able to do all those things that you disagree with and he'll be able to say "Well, you chose me".

And remember, it's not a horse race, you don't win a prize if you're right, you get a politician!!!

Choose wisely. This isn't a time for bullshit TV personalities, soundbites and gut reactions. It's a time for you to say what you think by choosing the guy that best represents your viewpoint.

It's not a case of agreeing with the best actor, it's a question of deciding whats most important to you, and then asking who's going to deliver. Fuck the TV, do a bit of simple research and ask "what? When? and Why?" then say "Who?".

It is your life whether you choose to believe it or not.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Little Hawk
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 11:42 PM

Yeah. Tweedledum and tweedledummer. Exactly. If I was an American I suspect I would prefer Nader, on the whole. If it came down to Bush vs Gore (which it no doubt will...groan!) I would have to go for Gore, not cos I'm too impressed, but at least he isn't Republican...not that I think Republicans are bad people...I just think they have a wrongful idea of how to improve society, that's all.

The 2 party system is a farce. So is Canada's 5 party system. I would be in favour of permanently abolishing all political parties forever, and electing one of say four individual candidates (nominated by popular ballot) in every riding...strictly on the basis of their character and what they have to say. Then all those individuals elected would form a national assembly and run the government by committee, each assembly member being responsible directly to the constituency that elected him, NOT to any party machine.

This would eliminate many forms of corruption and divisiveness that presently plague our political system.

Further to that, I would legislate that the election campaign be short...45 days only...and that EQUAL funding be provided for each candidate, out of a tax pool, that funding being of a moderate nature, sufficient to get their message out. That would eliminate the influence peddling that allows huge financial players to control every political party (except little guys like the Greens).

To hell with political parties. They have perverted and destroyed our democratic system, and made our elections a running joke.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DougR
Date: 09 Aug 00 - 11:51 PM

Little Hawk: do you REALLY think that would stop corruption and divisivness in government? You, my friend, are describing "Shang Ri-La," and I don't believe that can ever exist, regardless of the form of government. DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: JamesJim
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 12:13 AM

BC.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: GUEST,Mickey191
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 12:22 AM

Gore & Lieberman- S. I really wanted McCain.For many reasons I feel the same antipathy for Bush that I felt for tricky Dick.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DougR
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 12:26 AM

I voted for McCain in the Arizona primary. I think he would have been a good President, Guest 191. DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Little Hawk
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 12:43 AM

Doug R - Yes, I have a lot of faith. I believe that anything that can be imagined can made to exist, if people have enough courage and will to make it exist. Do I think this is going to happen soon? No. The political parties control the present system, and they absolutely will not let it happen, not until they have been so discredited that no one believes in them anymore. I have already reached that stage. I don't believe in them.

It could be accomplished at any time, but almost certainly won't be. What I am describing is really quite similar to the kind of democracy that existed in many simple tribal peoples for thousands of years. Decisions were arrived at by cooperative consensus, rather than by dividing up into competitive groups and then enforcing the will of a temporary majority upon various minorities. That is not what I call democracy. I call it a semi-democratic form of dictatorship, with limited tenure.

I'm a creative artist, not a politician. It is my job to imagine the finest thing I can and then express it as best I can.

I realize it may seem unrealistic. The most idealistic things always seem unrealistic. Consider the things Jesus taught. Unrealistic, right? But if people had the courage to follow those teachings in every way we could transform the world.

Yes, I believe in Shangri-La.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Rosebrook
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 01:08 AM

Gore - S

And in Oregon No on 9, AGAIN! (wishing I had kept my buttons from the first homophobic go round ballot measure #9 in '92)

Rose


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Thomas the Rhymer
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 02:58 AM

I just got an e-mail from Michael Moore. He is endorsing Nader. He is encouraging all supporters of Gore not to change their mind. He says Nader won't need their votes. Moore is taking the glamour of not voting, and he's encouraging the 100 million plus non voting segment of our population to vote Nader instead of not voting at all. It is well written, well researched, and quite enjoyable to read.

If half of the disgruntled non voting public votes for Nader, It would be a landslide victory. It only took 40 million votes to win the last election! Consider the realities, vote this time,... Nader wins!


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Lox
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 07:58 AM

Imagine if you had a alternative on your voting slip.

Imagine if the rule was that, if won more than 50% of the vote, then a new list of candidates would have to be drawn up.

Choice would be widened considerably, and the republicans and democrats would no longer have the control that they have now over who gets to be your president. They wouldn't dare spend so much money on campaigns, having instead to convince you that the were the right man/woman for the job by saying something with a little meaning for a change.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Midchuck
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 08:44 AM

Lox is right, IMO.

There should be a "None of the Above Is Acceptable" line on every ballot.

The trouble is, that line would have won every U. S. presidential election since 1960 or thereabouts.

Peter.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Little Hawk
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 09:28 AM

Yup, "None of the Above" would win, that's for sure. The public in North America would probably be better off choosing leaders from the ordinary public by chance lottery (given certain basic minimum qualifications) than they are with the present cynical system.

I like that joke about the "battle of wits between 2 unarmed opponents". Ha Ha Ha


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Kim C
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 09:47 AM

Jeez, am I the only Libertarian? :)


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: JedMarum
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 09:51 AM

don't most Libertarians vote Republican?


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Rosebrook
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 10:36 AM

Martin Sheen

;)


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Kim C
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 12:39 PM

Jed, I don't really know... why vote Republican if your party has a candidate? I know, I know, "no third-party candidate has a snowball's chance of winning." Well, yeah, especially if people don't vote for them......

I guess the Libertarian idea of taking personal responsibility for your own freedom is just a little too hard for a lot of folks to handle. :)But the fact is, freedom and responsibility go hand in hand, something our litigious society seems to have overlooked these last few years.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: death by whisky
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 12:53 PM

Will they come to Ballybunion for a round? Eh! We'll get the road resurfaced again.HA!


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: JedMarum
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 12:59 PM

sorry Kim, sounds like the reason I vote republican.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 01:16 PM

have voted Libertarian in the past...will probably vote for the candidate least likely to succeed this time around - just as a form of protest against the two most popular choices. I'd like to see just how "secret" the secret ballot really is...maybe I'll vote Worker's World Party and see if anyone (when Bush gets elected) comes knocking at my door.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: GUEST,Luther
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 01:27 PM

feh! Porgy is up to his neck in big oil. "Groat cakes!!! Heavy on the 30-weight, Ma!" Ring a bell? CarolC, if you want to turn this country into a commie cesspool of groat cakes and government inflicted simulation, fine!! Just don't forget to inflate your shoes.

I hope that doesn't sound too harsh, but it needed to be said. End of rant.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DougR
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 03:23 PM

Guest: He couldn't. Now way to find you. You haven't a name!

Kim: I think the Libertarians make some excellent points myself. Not in agreement with all of them though.

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 03:41 PM

Sorry, I don't see Nader as the kind of charismatic individual that would be needed to give a third-party the chance to win. Just as a vote for Perot has been a vote for Clinton, a vote for Nader will be a vote for Bush. I'd like to see him debate, but I expect Bush will demand it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: thosp
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 07:17 PM

Little Hawk ! again you surprise me ----- of course ALL our politicians have the basic minimum requirements -- i defy you to find one with more than the basic minimum requirements ---- actually i think it's required to have minimum requirements --although i think in many cases its been waived ----

peace (Y) thosp


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Tone d' F
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 07:29 PM

As you colonials don't have a choice of the like of the Monster Raving Looney Party (Screeming Lord Such Deceased) it looks like you're going to be stuck with G / L

Our Vote would be for Homer Simpson and his running mate Barney

Brewsters Millions said it all

Dont Vote for Them .... It only encourages them


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DougR
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 09:52 PM

Well, Tone d'F, don't write off Bush yet. I don't include the VP candidate in my message, because we will be electing a President, not a Vice President. The VP will obviously be elected along with the president.

You may have noted in the past day or two the American press has centered most of their attention on the potential Vice President, not the potential President. The reason: the potential Vice President is the best hope the Democrats have. DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: CarolC
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 09:55 PM

Guest Luther, you win. I think I'll go climb a tree, take off my shoes, and learn to play the flute.

Carol


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: bbc
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 10:05 PM

Bush--S (actually, *any* Republican)

bbc

P.S.--Hi, Doug!


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Tone d' F
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 10:14 PM

Doug

Chill out, get a Terry Pratchet Book read it and put the world to right

It will put things in perspective

The people who dont want to run are the people for the job

Where is the logic on spending X million $ to get a job that pays thousands

Giv you one up on the brits at least one of youre presidents was a peanut farmer and able to pay the civil servants


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Bill D
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 10:27 PM

Libertarians have VERY little how things would actually work if they DID win...and Nader has NO idea how to negotiate with China...*sigh*......


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: mg
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 11:21 PM

I think if Gore wins we'll have the best first lady in history...and probably not a bad second lady either although I know nothing about her...imagine having a choice of honest decent women as first ladies..which I hasten to add in my lifetime we have almost always had....mg


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Little Hawk
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 11:22 PM

thosp, you are one funny character. Ha Ha. The only reason I stuck in that "minimum requirements" proviso was to prevent people from attacking my public office election chance lottery idea by saying things like..."Oh, sure, Little Hawk, and we get a 7 year old kid for president!"

The weird thing is, I think you're right...they have been picking people with the "minimum" requirements! How ironical.

Remember Bill and Opus's campaign slogan: THIS TIME WHY NOT THE WORST?

I thought that was great. This time why not Hollywood Hulk Hogan? He's getting a little old for the wrestling game anyway.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DougR
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 11:42 PM

Tone d'F: The Terry Pratchet book is on the top of my shopping list, though I have to confess that I have no earthly idea who Terry Pratchart is, and why I should be looking to him for leadership! The fact that you recommend him is reason enough for me to look into it.

Ok, Bill D, how DOES one negotaite with China? I'm sure everybody would like to know that!

Oh, and Tone d'F, wanna applaud the double digit (I mean real double digit inflation during the Carter administration?) I doubt it.

And Mary Garvey, have you know idea what you are saying when you say with Tipper Gore, we will have the best first lady in hitory? Do you not know what will befall you for thinking such blasphemous thoughts when we have such stellar ladies as Hillery Clinton as our first lady? And what about Eleanor Roosevelt? You gonna just sweep her into the trashbin of history? Shame on you! (Said with a very stiff tongue in the cheek) DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 11:47 PM

Tipper Gore is an evil fascist cow. I wouldn't vote for anyone who would stay married to the former leader of the dreaded PMRC. :)

---Lepus Rex


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DougR
Date: 10 Aug 00 - 11:49 PM

Scuse, Lepus Rex, what is PMRC? DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: ol'troll
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 12:01 AM

VOTE CTHULU! Why settle for the lesser of two evils.

troll


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 12:08 AM

Oops, Doug, that info might help, eh? Parent's Music Resource Center. It was (is?) the group who brought about the "warning labels" on recordings with "harmful" content, wanted to keep albums with "lewd" cover artwork under the counter like porn, etc. She's tried to distance herself from her eeeevil past since then, though. But she's the ANTICHRIST! ;)

Cthulhu, eh? Mayyybeee... At least he isn't married to the ANTICHRIST.

---Lepus Rex


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Thomas the Rhymer
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 02:48 AM

A vote for Nader would be a vote for Nader. Nader would be a great president. Why is this so hard to understand?

Meanwhile, "Don't eat with your hands,... use your entrenching tool!"

"Oh blinding light, Oh light that blinds, I cannot see, watch out for me!"


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: mactheturk
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 07:51 AM

John Prine/Ani DiFranco....all the way in 2000!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: BigDaddy
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 12:43 PM

Gotta go with Gore/Lieberman. It seems every time we elect a Republican, we find an excuse to make war on civilians in "third world" countries (e.g. Nicaragua, El Salvador) or befriend dictators like the Shah of Iran, Marcos in the Phillipines, etc. It seems the Democrats do less harm environmentally as well (Remember the James Watt years?). I'd vote for Nader if I didn't fear it would contribute to a Bush victory.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Kim C
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 02:02 PM

Why can't we get somebody like Bartlet on "West Wing"? Or dig up Teddy Roosevelt?

Actually, I think Ted Nugent would make a pretty cool President..... :)


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 02:57 PM

Thomas and Carol.... "I guess the old saying is true: just dig a hole that's big enough, and everyone will want to jump into it." Reebus Kaneebis

or

"oh,that son of mine!"
"He's not your son, George."
"Stop torturing me Ethel."


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: JR
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 04:20 PM

You guys are just for Gore cuz he gave you the internet & thus, The Mudcat.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DougR
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 05:34 PM

BigDaddy: I'm sure you recall who the last president was that ordered missles in to destroy a pharmaceutical plant in a far of land, don't you? 'Twas not a Republican president. Shades of "Wag the Dog."

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: BigDaddy
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 07:03 PM

DougR, No argument on that one. I'm not enthused about any of our choices. And speaking of "Wag the Dog," I'm from Michigan where we had our own version of "Old Shoe" complete with parades and accompanying media idiocy. This poor joker was in the wrong place at the wrong time, was captured and somehow this made him a "hero." Anyway, I'm glad we can at least vote for our choices even though I feel the choices are poor ones. For a nation that gave birth to the likes of Lincoln and a number of others who had at least moments of greatness, I just wish we could do better. Cheers!


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Little Hawk
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 07:05 PM

Ted Nugent? Ha! Ha! ROTFL! What a great idea! The Nuge for president, and Ozzie for Secretary of State. That'd scare the shit out of those Islamic fundamentalists and commie pinkos (the latter an endangered species, alas!).


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: ceitagh
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 07:37 PM

Doug,

yes, do pick up a Terry Pratchett novel, I highly recommend it. Great reading, absolutely hilarious. I don't expect it to change your political views tho, it hasn't mine (B/C, if i were american, which i'm not, ;-))


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Susan from California
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 08:18 PM

Gore & Lieberman--M But I'm a yellow dog Democrat :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DougR
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 09:06 PM

Ceitagh: I'll do that. Can you recommend any particular one (novel)?

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: RWilhelm
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 09:25 PM

I was going to say none-of-the-above but I agree with Lepus Rex. Tipper and all her sorority sisters must be stopped.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Little Hawk
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 10:53 PM

Tipper Gore is a name that gives me the shivers. Not that I'm referring to the lady herself (don't know much about her), just the name...


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: tar_heel
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 10:57 PM

god,what a bunch of liberals in here!!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: tar_heel
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 10:58 PM

bush!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: JedMarum
Date: 11 Aug 00 - 11:14 PM

Chuck - when you go to a steak house, ya probably don't want to order the salmon. ;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: WyoWoman
Date: 12 Aug 00 - 01:38 AM

Gore/Lieberman, S

(Carol, Luther and LEJ, stop eating with your fingers. Use your entrenching tool...)

ww


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 12 Aug 00 - 06:49 PM

Those of you moaning about a two-year campaign should remember tht Tony Blair made re-election his top priority from day 1 of a five-year stint.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 12 Aug 00 - 07:22 PM

"It seems every time we elect a Republican, we find an excuse to make war on civilians in "third world" countries (e.g. Nicaragua, El Salvador) or befriend dictators like the Shah of Iran, Marcos in the Phillipines, etc" -

Well, don't go forgetting that little business in Vietnam. A Democrat affair as I recall, till Nixon took over and extended it until it ran out of steam.

How come with 200 million or whatever it is people to choose from it ends up with a run-off between Bush and Gore? And only a tiny fraction of Americans will vote for either of them. And one of them will end up effectively being President of the planet, and we all have to put up with the result.

Why can't you have a straight fight between Hunter Thompson and Michael Moore?


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DougR
Date: 12 Aug 00 - 07:32 PM

We are greatly outnumbered, Chuck, no doubt about that. So that makes us a minority, right? All good folks though, just the same.

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: celticblues5
Date: 12 Aug 00 - 07:40 PM

Much as I dislike the idea of little Susie Creamcheese Tipper being first lady, I'll go with G/L. The Republicans only have one issue I agree with (which, you'll be thankful, I'm NOT going to mention, not wanting to open a huge and very unmusical can o'worms). Every election it seems like one has to choose the lesser of the two evils, as they say.
Saw Hadassah L being interviewed the other day, and she was at once poised and warm, seemed very sincere & open. Bradley & Lieberman would have made an interesting ticket!


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: CarolC
Date: 12 Aug 00 - 08:33 PM

When Bill Clinton was elected, I thought, "we're back from the shadows again". When I listen to Al Gore, I think, this is a man who understands about vegetables being green and about peeing in streams (and that's important), and I think, I want this man for president.

Respectfully,

Carol


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 12 Aug 00 - 08:49 PM

Peeing in streams? He sounds like a slob... Get him housebroken, and I might consider it. (Yeah, right!) :)

---Lepus Rex


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 12 Aug 00 - 09:03 PM

Now there's a ticket,CarolC! Arty Choke and the Whisperin' Stranger!


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: death by whisky
Date: 12 Aug 00 - 10:53 PM

I can't ignore Clintons part in N.I's peace process. Plus,he gave us pothole free roads from Listowel to Ballybunion.....!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Little Hawk
Date: 12 Aug 00 - 10:59 PM

You're right, Doug R, all good folks. Thanks for being positive about the avalanche of liberals here(of which I might be considered one...although I'm a bit more radical than most "liberals", seeing I don't even believe in political parties of any stripe whatsoever).

I generally like the Democrats a little better than the Republicans, but wouldn't vote for either one of them.

Curiously enough, the Democrats seem to get involved in just as many foreign wars and interventions as the Republicans, contrary to what someone said earlier. Bush attacked Iraq (After assuring them through the American ambassador in Baghdad that the USA had no concerns about a forthcoming Iraqui attack on Kuwait!!! Saddam believed him...what a sucker!). Then there was the totally phony propaganda story about Iraqui soldiers turning off babies' incubators in the Kuwaiti hospital...even Amnesty International was fooled by that one...what a public relations coup! What a crock.

Then Clinton bombed the aforementioned pharmaceutical factory in Africa, some other small places in Asia, and finally launched the Kosovo intervention. I'm not going to argue the pros and cons of Kosovo here (God help us!), but it looks to me like there's precious little difference in warmaking tendencies between the Republicans and Democrats. The Democrats TALK more peaceably, but in practice they are virtually indistinguishable from the GOP. No surprise to me. It's someone else you don't hear about (and don't get to vote for) who calls the shots on all of these decisions.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DonMeixner
Date: 13 Aug 00 - 02:10 AM

Mallard Filmore, he'll do well in DC. He understands the importance of getting a bill passed. He is a graduate of Drake university.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Peter Kasin
Date: 13 Aug 00 - 02:52 AM

If Mallard Filmore of Drake wins...duck!


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: ceitagh
Date: 13 Aug 00 - 11:19 AM

Doug- try Guards Guards. I think you'd like Captain Vimes. I *know* you'd like the Patrician. :-D

Oh, just a thot I'd like to throw out there....anyone know where one can find a party for socially conservative socialists? I did a quiz once that showed I'd be really left wing if i weren't so determined about personal responsibilities and the sacredness of life. I guess I even out to moderate something, but i'm not sure what.

Ceit


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: GUEST,bob s.
Date: 13 Aug 00 - 03:01 PM

Did you know that Bill Clinton is considering changing the Democratic seal from a donkey to a condom, because it represents inflation, halts production, and gives you a false sense of security while you are being screwed.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Uncle Jaque
Date: 13 Aug 00 - 05:25 PM

Well, although a distinct minority, I'm glad to see that I'm not the only member of the vast right-wing consiracy out here in folkietune town! As paridoxical as it must seem, I love the traditional old tunes commonly associated with "folk" - although the "protest songs" of the '60s never did much for me - and listen to "Rush" too! Speaking of the "protest" movement, I think that my teenage enfatuation with Joan Baez was eventually broken when all she would open her mouth for (at least what got recorded and I heard) was to wail, whine, and b!+$# about how awful things were. Now granted, things were a little seamy back then, but Mommas still loved babies, some good dogs were to be found, God was still in Heaven, and as I recall there remained in a few sheltered corners some things worthy of celebration... despite the bum politicians (both R and D). Most Folkies seem to have pretty much gotten over it in the past 30 or 40 years, but some, alas, just can't seem to let it go. Personally, I resonate with the healthy dose of skepticizim I sense here, although It's a challange not to let it get me down. Having surveyed the aforementioned Libertarian Party, I find about 85% of their principals essentially harmonic, 10% not all votes in yet (or, as my Quaker Freinds might say, "Awaiting furthur Light") and the remaining 5% (including the dreaded "choice" issue) engendering some discomfort. I think if they ever come up with a viable Candidate, I would have to seriously consider getting behind them. I understand that they are starting to make some inroads in local and State offices, so stay tuned. I don't think that a party more dedicated to restoring a Constitutional Democracy can be had at any price.. although it's going to be a hard sell to folks accustomed to rolling on the dole or being "taken care of" by Great White Father in Washington. As to the choices at hand: I was for Allan KEYES, despite his sadly thin political resume. Since his political demise (I'm hoping that there might be a Cabinet position for him) I'm rooting for the "W". The spectre of 4 more years of the Clinton Machine (which, dear hearts, is what we may expect from an "ALGORE" Administration despite some theatrical "distancing" of late) frankly chills me to the bone. After the complete gutting of any moral authority America might have had left abroad, our national defense has been squandered, abused, and sold (primarily to the Communist Chinese Government, who brought us the Tienimen Square Massacre). Any political credibility we might have had has gone down the flush; our enemies have been capitulated to and our allies have been routinely betrayed. It seems that people of the global community have little but contempt for us, and frankly, I can't blame them. Our lofty status the (or even "a") "Superpower" is deteriorating rapidly as our "leaders" seem hell-bent on reducing America to 3rd-world squalor. "W" may not be perfect, but I do beleive that he has at least a modicum of integrity. And that, as I have learned from years of working with the "Mentally Retarded", can make up for a heck of a lot of cunning and charisma! I'm thinking of a Political "rallying" song for "W', much like "Lincloln and Liberty" was in 1860. You're gonna love it... or then again, maybe ye wont, eh? But regardless, I think that "Mudcatters" are a crowd with sufficient class to enjoy one another's company and music.. learning from and growing by one another - while setting some of our other diverse passions aside for a season. Now THAT, I submit to you, is something to celebrate!


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Little Hawk
Date: 13 Aug 00 - 07:20 PM

Hmmmm....okay, Uncle Jaque...interesting comments. Next time, though, break it up into a number of paragraphs (hit "enter" twice between each)...it makes it easier to read. Somebody told me about that a while back, and they were right.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DougR
Date: 13 Aug 00 - 08:02 PM

Uncle Jaque, interesting points. I, too, think the Libertarians make a pretty good case but they have a long way to go. There is a much sharper difference between the Libertarians and the Democrats than there is between Republicans and Democrats, I think.

I love folk music too, but the protest songs didn't do much for me either. Perhaps because I was older than the kids marching in the streets singing protest songs.

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 13 Aug 00 - 08:14 PM

MY God! Not one Mudcatter for Pat Buchannan! Or that other looney from the Natural Law Party (the folks who brought you Yogic Bouncing.

Hey, this a consensus we can build on!

'Course since I'm Canadian, I'm not going to mess up the accuracy of this poll with a vote that just won't count.

Rick


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 13 Aug 00 - 08:19 PM

Best suggestion I saw was Lox's that you could only get elected if you got more than 50% of the vote. Though I'd advise that you made it at least 50% of the people entitled to vote. Some countries have that kind of rule.

Maybe as a compromise they could make it that the fella elected has his or her salary and pension tied to the proportion of the total electorate that votes for her or him. Except that I suppose the salary and pension aren't a very important part of the financial rewards of the job. Who was the last President (etc etc) who left office poorer than when they came in?


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 Aug 00 - 12:17 AM

Hey, don't be so quick to judge the Natural Law Party. They are seemingly quite unusual...until you actually meet some of them, and discuss a few things in depth. I have met them, and they are people of WAY above average intelligence and perception, with extraordinarily high ideals. There are some absolutely brilliant people in the Natural Law Party.

I voted for them in the last 2 elections, on the basis of my direct acquaintance with their local candidate here, and a number of their other members.

I can't say enough good about them. The "yogic flying" thing is real, but they should not have publicized it, because it's simply too offbeat and it makes people think they are weird. As you indicated, it's a sort of bouncing, actually, that occurs in deep meditation, while sitting in the lotus position. You have to go quite deep before it happens, but it is real. It has to do with altering the base frequency of your whole body system, which is vibratory...as is everything else in this reality.

More extraordinary things than that can be done, and have been. Like firewalking, for instance.

Needless to say, I knew they didn't have a dog's chance in Hades of being elected, but I respected them, so I voted for them. I vote by my conscience.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 14 Aug 00 - 12:18 AM

So far,based on the results of this scientific poll of primarily middle-aged,sandal-clad ex-members of the SDS with a strong tendency to sit around strumming their twelve strings rather than holding down a steady job,who also prefer spending on-line time at the Mudcat Cafe rather than making $8 stock trades at priceline.com, we can confidently declare Gore/Liebermann the clear leaders!

Notice:poll carries an error margin of +/- 99%


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DougR
Date: 14 Aug 00 - 01:04 AM

I think that's a safe assumption, Lonesome EJ. DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Aug 00 - 01:21 AM

Lonesome EJ, who gave you my dossier?

Carol


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: GUEST,JB
Date: 14 Aug 00 - 02:33 AM

I'm from Texas and I say: Dubya = no way!

Sure, Nader would be good, but don't you fear a Republican being elected president, more? The Supreme Court is awfully old. Please vote your conscience, but please vote!


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 Aug 00 - 11:39 AM

Lonesome, how did you know I was wearing sandals, you old scoundrel?!!! Ha Ha!

I hold down a steady job. I own a small export company that manufactures steering wheels and sells them mostly to the USA and Australia. Thank God for that...I do not relish the thought of having to make my whole living from playing music. As it is now, I just play enough of it to thoroughly enjoy myself, and when I get paid it's like a Christmas bonus.

Yes, I would rather be chatting on Mudcat, or strumming my 6 string...and I do.

SDS ain't quite radical enough for me, Lonesome. I consider both the right and the left to have some good ideas, and yet to be seriously out of touch in that they waste their energy fighting each other, instead of combining their good ideas. After all, they both sincerely want a better world. It isn't a question of right or left any longer.

It's as pointless as having a war between the sexes.

I declare peace.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 14 Aug 00 - 12:25 PM

Right,Hawk.Now if we can just get a Presidential ticket that features The Two Jesses....Jackson and Helms.

LEJ:>}


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DougR
Date: 14 Aug 00 - 01:49 PM

Guest J.B., what's you're being from Texas got to do with it? You mean if you were from Oklahoma you'd be for Bush? Or maybe you're implying that you are the only Texian that won't vote for Bush?

I'm FROM Texas, and I'm going to vote for Bush, so we will just cancel each other's vote out, I guess.

:>) DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 Aug 00 - 04:18 PM

Ummm...I don't know much about Jesse Helms...can someone enlighten me on that?


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 14 Aug 00 - 07:35 PM

Is it a bird?..is it a plane?..no it's SuperGore.

I've found it surprising that noone seems to have commented on the fact that the Gore looks not at all unlike Superman, as incarnated by Christopher Reeve.

That's not intended to have any political significance, but then this sounds like an election that seem to be primarily about politics.

However that seems to be the shape of elections these days in a lot of countries. Both sides seem to have pretty well the same politics, and the argument is about which is more to be trusted, and which gives you the worse nightmares. (And I think it's safe that for most people in Europe anyway, Bush getting elected is a pretty scary nightmare. But I suppose that for the people who'll vote for him, that's just another good reason to vote for him.)


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DougR
Date: 14 Aug 00 - 07:44 PM

Little Hawk: a little leg-pulling there, I suspect. Jesse Helms is a very conservative republican senator in the U. S. Senate, and a thorn in the foot of liberals.

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 14 Aug 00 - 07:53 PM

I left a "doesn't" out of the second paragraph - should read "That's not intended to have any political significance, but then this sounds like an election that doesn't seem to be primarily about politics." Makes a bit more sense now.

I kind of thought Jesse Helms was that nutty wrestler that got elected up in Minnesota to embarrass Garrison Keiller.

But isn't being called Jesse a disadvantage to a candidate in America? Or is it like "A Boy Named Sue", and it just serves to toughen them up?


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: GUEST,Matewan
Date: 14 Aug 00 - 08:24 PM

Jessee Helms? You mean Senator Pigshit? The Turd that Walks like a Man? No, he's not a "very conservative senator"; he's a slimy, racist sonofabitch owned lock, stock and barrel by the tobacco companies and the factory hog-farming corporations, and an embarrassment to the human race. I'm suprised the Church of the Creator hasn't endorsed him- or maybe it has.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Biskit
Date: 14 Aug 00 - 08:38 PM

I really liked McCain, I believe he would've been a good leader.With the choices that remain,.....it's really a toss up between Fred Flintstone Or Snoopy,Does anybody know if Pat Paulson is running this year??? Peace -Biskit-


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DougR
Date: 15 Aug 00 - 12:41 AM

Guest, Matewan: Other than that, do you have any strong feelings about Jesse Helms?

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 15 Aug 00 - 01:17 AM

McGrath, that's Jesse Ventura we elected, heh. Much more entertaining than the guys he ran against. Well, Fancy Ray McCloney's pretty entertaining, in a way, but he came in last...

---Lepus Rex


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Big Mick
Date: 15 Aug 00 - 03:00 AM

Well, I was trying not to weigh in on this due to my connection to the campaign of Al Gore. But I must respond to my dear friend, Northfolk/Al Cholger.

Al, you know that my sympathies lie on the far left end of the spectrum. But after some 31 years of fighting in wars, being in strikes, working with young men and women involved in gangs, community activism, union organizing and political activism, I have become very sensitive to the cost of my actions. It is like, when you know a strike is inevitable and you sit in your chair and worry for the casualties you know will come. After all these years I have come to the conclusion that the best change comes from within. Don't get me wrong, I am as radically oriented as I ever was. But my days of jousting with windmills and damn the cost, are over. Too many casualties. I have figured out by watching termites that I can achieve the goal, without the risk to those I represent, by eating at them from the inside. I recognize that we still need radical activism of the type that I practiced when I was much younger. It draws attention to the problems. But as for me, I work from within. This is the same reason that I haven't supported The Labor Party here in the states. I salute those, like yourself, who devote yourself to this way. But my time is best suited working from within. I will meet you in Promontory (oblique reference to the meeting of the transcontinental railways here in the US, for my friends from other places). So to bring this back to the topic at hand, I am supporting and working actively in the Gore/Lieberman campaign. I feel that to support any of the so called third party efforts will lead to a Bush Presidency. And the effect of that on our environment, labor laws, the fiscal health of our country, Social Security, and on and on is too horrible to contribute to.

All the best,

Mick


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: GUEST,JB
Date: 15 Aug 00 - 04:20 AM

Doug R., I meant that just because he's from Texas doesn't mean all Texans will vote for him, we know him too well. "All hat and no cattle" is one saying that comes to mind, which is how Doonsbury portrays him.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Little Hawk
Date: 15 Aug 00 - 07:21 AM

Okay, I now know who Jesse Helms is...oooo...scary, scary. How about a triple ticket of Jesse Jackson, Jesse Helms, and Jesse "the BODY" Ventura? They could run the country like Julius Caesar, Crassus, and Pompey in ancient Rome...by decree. That would be a lively scene. Of course, that coalition fell apart after a while and degenerated into a war, but it would be fun while it lasted, eh?


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 15 Aug 00 - 02:14 PM

But Jessie Matthews looked a lot better and could sing and dance. That's a proper Jessie.


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 15 Aug 00 - 02:49 PM

Sayyyyy, McGrath... She IS better than Ventura. I'd vote for her!

---Lepus Rex


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: DougR
Date: 15 Aug 00 - 04:00 PM

Guest J.B., I knew what you meant I was just giving you a friendly jab. :>)

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Don Firth
Date: 15 Aug 00 - 07:02 PM

An old friend once said that he favored hereditary monarchy over democracy. He explained: "The hereditary monarch is trained for the job from birth, and within recent generations at least, he or she usually doesn't even want it. Generally these days, kings and queens do at least a halfway decent job, or at least try to avoid looking like a complete jackass. In a democracy, leadership goes to people who want it. That makes me immediately suspicious. If somebody wants the job, they're probably the last person on earth who should have it!"

But since we have the system we have, I'm afraid I have to go with Gore/Lieberman. One advantage of Gore getting in there is the book he wrote eight or nine years ago, "Earth in the Balance: Ecology and the Human Spirit." He says some pretty heavy-duty stuff in that, and if he doesn't get on the stick about environmental issues, that book is sure as hell going to come back to haunt him. All in all, I think he's generally okay. I really favor Nader, but he's an idealist and I'm afraid that if he actually got elected, the "Powers That Be" would eat him alive, if not assassinate him. I'm afraid, sadly but realistically, it takes more of a Machiavellian to be effective in that job. Sigh. . . .

In response to Lonesome EJ: Although fairly close, I don't quite fit the demographics as outlined. I'm at least middle-aged and on the brink of geezerhood. I have never owned a pair of sandals in my life. Granted, I would much rather sit around strumming my six string (classic) rather than hold down a steady job, but since I'm retired from the dreaded nine-to-five, I can and do. My main job right now -- self imposed -- is writing a retrospective on the folk music scene in Seattle during the Fifties and Sixties. And I seem to be spending more time milling around the Mudcat these days. I have no knowledge of stock trading (and my Social Security check doesn't supply my with enough funds to fiddle with even if I did). Also, I was never a member of the SDS. In fact, during the Sixties I was an Ayn Rand fanatic!

I'm a lot mellower now. . . .

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Presidential Poll
From: Little Hawk
Date: 15 Aug 00 - 07:11 PM

Ayn Rand...the perfect mate for Jesse Helms. Sort of like Conrad Black and Barbara Amiel (they're Canadian)...he's filthy rich and she's a very smart and very good looking right winger with a penchant for journalism and expensive jewelry. Conrad Black owns most of the printed media in Canada. Think of him as our version of Darth Vader.

Conrad actually lives in England now, and probably has secret ambitions to be King one day...for that matter, Barbara would make an unforgettable queen as well.

Some Canadiana for you to chew over.


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This Thread Is Closed.


Mudcat time: 23 September 2:05 PM EDT

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