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Thank God for Joan Baez!

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balladeer 07 Sep 00 - 09:13 AM
Catrin 07 Sep 00 - 09:31 AM
Steve Latimer 07 Sep 00 - 09:42 AM
Catrin 07 Sep 00 - 09:45 AM
Vixen 07 Sep 00 - 09:47 AM
GUEST,Russ 07 Sep 00 - 10:11 AM
Mbo 07 Sep 00 - 10:13 AM
LR Mole 07 Sep 00 - 12:44 PM
Little Hawk 07 Sep 00 - 12:54 PM
catspaw49 07 Sep 00 - 01:27 PM
Cobble 07 Sep 00 - 01:31 PM
Mbo 07 Sep 00 - 01:38 PM
catspaw49 07 Sep 00 - 01:40 PM
SINSULL 07 Sep 00 - 01:54 PM
GUEST,Mbo_at_ECU 07 Sep 00 - 01:59 PM
catspaw49 07 Sep 00 - 02:02 PM
GUEST,JTT 07 Sep 00 - 02:09 PM
SINSULL 07 Sep 00 - 03:26 PM
Mbo 07 Sep 00 - 03:45 PM
catspaw49 07 Sep 00 - 04:31 PM
SINSULL 07 Sep 00 - 04:40 PM
Thomas the Rhymer 07 Sep 00 - 05:06 PM
Mbo 07 Sep 00 - 05:59 PM
Mbo 07 Sep 00 - 06:05 PM
SINSULL 07 Sep 00 - 06:46 PM
Mbo 07 Sep 00 - 06:49 PM
Little Hawk 07 Sep 00 - 11:19 PM
Uncle Jaque 07 Sep 00 - 11:42 PM
thosp 07 Sep 00 - 11:54 PM
Little Hawk 08 Sep 00 - 02:10 PM
catspaw49 08 Sep 00 - 02:13 PM
SINSULL 08 Sep 00 - 02:19 PM
Catrin 08 Sep 00 - 03:43 PM
MAG (inactive) 08 Sep 00 - 03:53 PM
GUEST 08 Sep 00 - 04:39 PM
hesperis 08 Sep 00 - 04:55 PM
catspaw49 08 Sep 00 - 05:01 PM
Mbo 08 Sep 00 - 07:11 PM
hesperis 08 Sep 00 - 08:17 PM
Little Hawk 08 Sep 00 - 08:35 PM
WyoWoman 08 Sep 00 - 09:18 PM
gillymor 09 Sep 00 - 06:52 AM
RoseRed295 09 Sep 00 - 08:49 AM
balladeer 09 Sep 00 - 09:20 AM
Midchuck 09 Sep 00 - 09:43 AM
catspaw49 09 Sep 00 - 10:23 AM
Mrrzy 09 Sep 00 - 10:25 AM
balladeer 09 Sep 00 - 10:44 AM
gillymor 09 Sep 00 - 10:53 AM
GUEST 09 Sep 00 - 12:24 PM
rock chick 03 Jun 01 - 10:36 AM
Tiger 03 Jun 01 - 10:57 AM
GUEST,guinnesschik 03 Jun 01 - 12:55 PM
WyoWoman 03 Jun 01 - 01:03 PM
Little Hawk 03 Jun 01 - 01:47 PM
kendall 03 Jun 01 - 02:36 PM
Little Hawk 03 Jun 01 - 02:38 PM
Mark Clark 03 Jun 01 - 03:27 PM
Big Tim 03 Jun 01 - 04:41 PM
Little Hawk 03 Jun 01 - 05:03 PM
BobP 04 Jun 01 - 02:18 PM
Little Hawk 04 Jun 01 - 02:25 PM
BobP 04 Jun 01 - 02:57 PM
chip a 04 Jun 01 - 04:12 PM
GUEST,jaze 04 Jun 01 - 06:07 PM
Big Tim 05 Jun 01 - 05:01 AM
kendall 05 Jun 01 - 06:01 AM
GUEST 05 Jun 01 - 08:02 AM
Maryrrf 05 Jun 01 - 09:12 AM
Peter T. 05 Jun 01 - 09:52 AM
Big Tim 05 Jun 01 - 09:56 AM
Little Hawk 05 Jun 01 - 11:17 AM
GUEST 05 Jun 01 - 12:00 PM
GUEST,Celine 06 Jun 01 - 12:14 AM
Gary T 06 Jun 01 - 08:52 AM
Little Hawk 06 Jun 01 - 10:11 AM
GUEST,JEFF 07 Jun 01 - 07:38 AM
balladeer 07 Jun 01 - 08:12 AM
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Subject: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: balladeer
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 09:13 AM

As a city kid growing up in Toronto in the fifties, I knew nothing of folk music. My life's ambition was to be a "torch singer" (although my guidance councillor said there was no torch singer in her book of occupations for young ladies. She felt I should choose one of nurse, secretary, housewife.) My eyes were partly opened when I came across Sir Patrick Spens and Thomas the Rhymer in Grade Nine Poetry; my ears perked up when I heard Tom Dooley ON THE HIT PARADE! What a breakthrough that was. But Joan was the ultimate inspiration -- a genuine female role model -- a girl with guitar. She is the reason I got hired to sing in various corners of Canada. "What's this? A girl with guitar? How novel," they would cry, and hire me on the spot. So thanks, Joan, for opening the door for me to earn my way to Europe and around Britain in my youth. (Later, of course, I discovered Pete Seeger and the Weavers and realized Tom Dooley was not the first folk song ever to be played on the radio, But even if I had known of Ronnie Gilbert when I was 16, I doubt she would have had as much power in my psyche as that beautiful young woman in her angelic white dress, commanding the stage at Newport with her soaring soprano and her lone guitar.)


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Catrin
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 09:31 AM

Aaaaaah! Joan Baez. What a beautiful singer - saw her recently in Manchester (UK) and was not dissapointed. She's still as beautiful as ever.

She was one of the reasons I love folk music as much as I do. I remember listening to the stories in her songs as a child and crying to Geordie, Lady Mary, Mary Hamilton (among others)......

'Last night there were four Marys
Tonight there'll be but three
There was Mary Beaton and Mary Seeton
And Mary Carmichael and me

or Geordie 'The judge looked over his left shoulder
He said 'fair maid I'm sorry'
He said 'fair maid, you must be gone
For I cannot pardon Geordie'

Sob sob, boo hoo


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 09:42 AM

So this may be blasphemy on Mudcat, but I could never stand her singing. That warbling falsetto that set the standard for so many female folksingers to come drives me crazy. I'm sorry, I can't listen to her, although I admire the fact that she paved the way for many female singers.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Catrin
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 09:45 AM

ooooh Steve how could you??? how could you???

Catrin (in amazed puzzlement)


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Vixen
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 09:47 AM

Yup--

Joan Baez and Mary Travers were my idols in the early 60s.

V


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST,Russ
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 10:11 AM

I bought Joan's albums faithfully. I wore them out playing them. I learned her versions of many songs. But I always liked Judy Collins' voice better.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Mbo
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 10:13 AM

So Steve I'm glad to see you just don't have it out for Billy Ray!

--Matt (who has even heard Joan Baez)


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: LR Mole
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 12:44 PM

Huzzah! Another heretic! If she swings that damn chariot low one more time...I've always fallen for altos,myself.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 12:54 PM

There have always been some people who don't like the way Joan sings. That's natural. It happens with all singers.

I love Joan. She was my original # 1 inspiration, and I lay around on the carpet mooning over the pictures of her on the album covers (specially that one where she's sitting on a country fence, with her bare feet dangling down, and smiling demurely, eyes downcast...

What an angelic figure indeed.

She also was of huge assistance to Bob Dylan, and indeed to everybody in the folk movement.

I wrote a song dedicated to Joan Baez, and the chorus says "And I thank the stars God gave her a voice to sing with".

Live forever, Joan! Viva Joan! Gracias, gracias, gracias!


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: catspaw49
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 01:27 PM

I can't understand why you like her Hawk because to my knowledge, she's never done a cover of "Major Tom" on any of her albums.

It would be hard for anyone not to have some feeling for her and the influence she's had. No matter what you think of her voice, playing, songs, or politics, the "package" was indelibly written in the history of the times. Tremendously influential.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Cobble
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 01:31 PM

Have admired Joan's singing since early sixties. Saw her in York, UK. last year. She is still the best. Mrs.Cobble


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Mbo
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 01:38 PM

No matter what you think of her voice, playing, songs, or politics, the "package" was indelibly written in the history of the times.

Why does this only apply to folk singers? How come when I try to apply it to performers of other genres, I catch hell? Damn folkies and their stupid double standards.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: catspaw49
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 01:40 PM

I dunno....because this is a folkie website?

What are you talking about Meebo?

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: SINSULL
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 01:54 PM

Mbo,
How about Paul Robeson, Oscar Wilde, Anita Bryant? How about Richard Nixon, JFK, Lincoln? How about Socrates, Aristophanes, Hitler? Or are you talking about the Yardbirds again?
I went to see Joan Baez in concert and was treated to an introduction to the then unknown Bob Dylan. For that I can forgive the vibratto.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST,Mbo_at_ECU
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 01:59 PM

Oh exCUSE me for using such confusing terminology! I should have said "performers of other MUSICAL genres". Not sure how Hitler or Socrates or Nixon got into this. Last I checked, they weren't "performers of other genres." You can bet that Spaw won't issue a similar statement about say...Ani DiFranco.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: catspaw49
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 02:02 PM

You need to get a grip. What are you rambling on about?

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST,JTT
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 02:09 PM

I see that the Mudcatters haven't caught up with the forgotten Adolf Hitler and his Bluegrass Ramblers.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: SINSULL
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 03:26 PM

Hey Spaw - are you talking to me or Mbo? I took genres to mean any field. And if Nixon, Hitler, and Socrates weren't performers (all of the Sara Bernhardt school of over-emoting, I will eat my autoharp). Sorry Mbo but Paul Robeson and Anity Bryant still fit.

OK I'll bite. When did you try to apply the statement to other performers and who were they? And what has this to do with Joan Baez? An opinion of whom you have not given. (trying to keep my language precise).
Love you,
Mary


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Mbo
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 03:45 PM

Just read the "Worst Pop Songs" threads. Or the one about Oasis, for that matter. You'll see.

--Matt (playing his new harmonica)


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: catspaw49
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 04:31 PM

No Sins....Meebo. I'm glad he has his new harmonica. He seems a bit overwrought and I failed to see what the reference to Baez was in regards to whatever it is he's talking about. And where does Ani DiFranco fit in? I guess I'm supposed to substitute Oasis for Joan in the statement I made or something.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: SINSULL
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 04:40 PM

Substituting Oasis for Joan sounds a little like substituting salt for sugar when baking a cake. You are not going to get the expected results. But some will like it.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Thomas the Rhymer
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 05:06 PM

Laugh and sing, and minnions shout
Of tactics, and plastics, fantastics to rout
Their holiness transcends your pout
There's more in life (than music) to doubt


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Mbo
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 05:59 PM

"On est laid a Nanterre, C'est la faute a Voltaire;

Et bete a Palaiseau,

C'est la faute a Rousseau."

"Men are ugly at Nanterre 'Tis the fault of Voltaire; And dull at Palaiseau, 'Tis the fault of Rousseau."

--Victor Hugo


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Mbo
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 06:05 PM

Damn. Wrong thread.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: SINSULL
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 06:46 PM

Deja Vous all over again! I took Spanish in high school - can you tell? I thought this looked familiar and made no sense!


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Mbo
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 06:49 PM

HA HA I'm listening to Oasis right now! I ain't good looking but I'm someone's child, and no one will give me the air that's mine to breath!


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 11:19 PM

Mbo - I like some of the Oasis stuff. As for others who indelibly wrote upon the history of their times...

Frank Sinatra (I can't stand him...but he did)

Elvis Presley

The Beatles

Metallica (I can just hear the shrieks of outrage)

David Bowie (yes, Spaw!)

Prince

Michael Jackson

Bruce Springsteen

Elton John

Beethoven

Brahms

Mozart

Bach

And so many more....and then there were the folksingers...whom we know and love, mostly.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Uncle Jaque
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 11:42 PM

Ahh, Joannie! I was so much in love with her as a teenager growing up in the Mt.s of NH in the early '60s, and also pretty much wore out a couple of her albums. The woman who became my Wife looked and sang a little like her when we met, and that may have contributed to our being together these past 28 years. I used to sing "Donna Donna" at the top of my lungs while going like hell on my motorcycle through the mountains... It was sad when she began to sing nothing but "protest" songs, and politics seemed to consume her. There were surely plenty of things worthy of protest back then, but so were there things worthy of celebration.. Joannie seemed to get so terribly myopic in a negative and bitter sort of way, it grieved me sore. I havn't heard her recently, but it seems that the last time i did she'd lost a lot of range, as we tend to do with age. I like to remember her the way she was prior to her "calling" to political activisim.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: thosp
Date: 07 Sep 00 - 11:54 PM

JAWS
STAR WARS
2001
THE 10 COMMANDMENTS

And so many more....and then there were the folksingers...whom we know and love,mostly : )

peace (Y) thosp


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 08 Sep 00 - 02:10 PM

Add to that:

BONNIE & CLYDE

PSYCHO

GONE WITH THE WIND

KING KONG

STAGECOACH


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: catspaw49
Date: 08 Sep 00 - 02:13 PM

Yeah Hawk, I can see that "Psycho" probably had a significant effect on your life.

So how is Mom anyway?

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: SINSULL
Date: 08 Sep 00 - 02:19 PM

CITIZEN KANE "Rosebud..."


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Catrin
Date: 08 Sep 00 - 03:43 PM

Good grief! Nobody's mentioned Bob Dylan!! I need therapy now, the world has become a very unstable place....


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: MAG (inactive)
Date: 08 Sep 00 - 03:53 PM

I tried to start a thread on the Baez and Carthy interview on world cafe, which nobody bit on. I was especially interested in Joan's comments on needing a voice coach as she got older -- realized she needed one, to save her voice, as well as deal with changes in her voice. it was a good interview.

I always liked Joan Baez, but the break in her young voice did give me pause, since as a singer, so much of my work involved the physical work to get in back of the break and connect it.

I do think Joan sings better now.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Sep 00 - 04:39 PM

Mag -- i would have loved to hear the interview --- i haven't heard her in years --- the last time i saw her was at the Beacon Theatre in New York --- she seemed tired and worn -- but i loved her anyway ------ actually i fell in love with her from the first moment i heard her voice ---- in the early 60's ---- ( Yes i remember where i was when i first heard her voice)--- before i even knew about her social stands -- which only endeared her to me more ---

peace (Y) thosp


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: hesperis
Date: 08 Sep 00 - 04:55 PM

I was just introduced to the music of Joan Baez last night. Lovely voice. More power to her!


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: catspaw49
Date: 08 Sep 00 - 05:01 PM

Really hesp? Tell me, what was it like living on another planet?

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Mbo
Date: 08 Sep 00 - 07:11 PM

Don't know Spaw, I'm still living there.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: hesperis
Date: 08 Sep 00 - 08:17 PM

It was pretty much the same living on that planet as on this one, but this planet has an added lustre to it.

Sort of like the planet I was living on before Mudcat. Except that that planet didn't have the yellow-greenish, polluted atmosphere from Spaw's farts...


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 08 Sep 00 - 08:35 PM

Yeah, that's why I don't smoke. It's downright dangerous lighting up anything when you're living on the same continent as Spaw! The possibility of perishing in a gigantic putrescent fireball has always given me pause...

Spaw - actually, Psycho has had no effect on my life, as far as I know, cos I've never seen it. I am aware that as a movie it was a sort of a watershed, so that's why I listed it. What does the reference about "Mom" mean? I don't get that.

Catrin - you are absolutely right. NO ONE, AND I MEAN NO ONE IN MUSIC HAS LEFT SO POWERFUL A MARK ON HIS TIMES AS BOB DYLAN...in both music and lyrics, and really every which way you can mention.

Bob is the One And Only.

I thought it was so darn obvious, that I just didn't bother to say it earlier.

Here's are some others who did by way of the movies: Charlie Chaplin, and in his own really weird way, Woody Allen...and Peter Sellers, for sure.

And then there's Enrico Caruso (lauded by Joan in her own song "Voices of Great Caruso").


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: WyoWoman
Date: 08 Sep 00 - 09:18 PM

Well, actually, I think Ani DiFranco's "To the Teeth" is one of the best protest songs of our time, and I am trying to learn it right now. Not real melodic, but definitely in line with Joan Baez' passion for using music to try and address social and political needs.

And, while I learned every single one of her songs at one time, and can still sing many of them, I always did wish she'd support her voice with a little more diaphragm so she brought a little more womanly oomph to the tunes. But then, when I sang them, I did. For what it was worth. The world does not no, nor will long remember WyoWoman, but that Joan, now she da' bomb ...

ww


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: gillymor
Date: 09 Sep 00 - 06:52 AM

Hearing Joan's (along with Fred Hellerman sometimes) playing on those early Vanguard recordings is what really caused me to fall in love with fingerstyle guitar. I like that early singing but it seems like in the more recent stuff I've heard by her she's dropped into a register that is much more comfortable for her voice and is sounding better than ever. I also greatly admire her for her commitment to people issues around the world.

Frankie


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: RoseRed295
Date: 09 Sep 00 - 08:49 AM

I'm a newcomer to this forum, but I have to agree with my fellow Canadian whose post is somewhere up at the top..Joan Baez was a major influence for me too..still remember seeing her perform during my first year of university. I loved her early stuff..but also loved the others such as the Prison Trilogy, which probably had a lot to do with my career choice..Love Song to a Stranger which had a lot to do with....oops..not going there!!But..does anyone remember her sister Mimi Farina? Does anyone have the words to Children of Darkness?


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: balladeer
Date: 09 Sep 00 - 09:20 AM

I DO remember Mimi -- and Dick as well.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Midchuck
Date: 09 Sep 00 - 09:43 AM

We had Boiled in Lead here in Rutland a couple years ago. I was talking to the guy in the group, who played, inter alia, plucked dulcimer, and told him that that was the first good rock-and-roll dulcimer playing I'd heard since Richard Farina died. He brightened right up - the guy was apparently one of his heroes, even though the Boiled in Lead guy must have been born well after Richard's death. He was very interested that I had actually heard Dick and Mimi live.

Peter.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: catspaw49
Date: 09 Sep 00 - 10:23 AM

Speaking of Mimi....Anybody got a health update on the cancer situation?

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Mrrzy
Date: 09 Sep 00 - 10:25 AM

OK, back to the original thread. Joan Baez, indirectly but nonetheless fairly, saved a great deal of my sanity and that of my youngest older sister. Sis was going through a really bad phase - heroin, meanness - in which, among other things, she was really quite cruel to me, the only person younger than she in the family. This was during a phase of extreme unhappiness in my life anyway. However, at right around 15 (I was about 11), Sis suddenly decided that she wanted to be Joan Baez. She got herself a guitar, taught herself to play (very, very well, I might add - serious fingerpicking going on), and would sing folk songs with me. That was probably the year or two that the two of us actually got along well, and it healed a lot of the mutual grief between us. To this day, the only songs I can sing harmony to, or sing melody while someone else is singing harmony, are those that Sis and I used to sing together. I loved Joan Baez before that (and her voice was a LOT less piercing before Cds!) but she has a special place for me, since I really think she saved my sister and my relationship with her, not to mention allowing for some small happinesses during those 2 years I was so intensely, intensely miserable. I bless Joan Baez.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: balladeer
Date: 09 Sep 00 - 10:44 AM

Mrrzy: I found your anecdote quite moving. I had a mean older brother who dismissed me all my life until I learned to play and sing. Then he respected and (dare I even think it?) admired me for a few years. That felt good while it lasted.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: gillymor
Date: 09 Sep 00 - 10:53 AM

Thanks for that rememberance, Mrzzy and by gosh, your right about the CDs. A few years ago I got a CD of her first album and compared to the vinyl she sounded downright shrill.

F


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Sep 00 - 12:24 PM

Interesting comment about cd's making Joanie's voice sound shrill. When I began re-establishing my collection of her recordings via tapes and cd's, I noticed the same thing, however, thought it was probably the difference in my age, now, and my age, then. Her voice, then, was youthful and pure and innocent, as was I. My ear, now, wants a mature, seasoned, less innocent voice, as am I. A prime example of her mature voice is on "Ring Them Bells." It is lower, with more depth, but on some songs, there appears to be a contrived lowering of her voice, as if, singing in her higher register would be more natural, but singing in a lower register is more vogue.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: rock chick
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 10:36 AM

I have been really influenced by Joan Baez, has anyone got the chords/lyrics to the following songs: Love song to a stranger and Prison Trilogy (Billy Rose) I have tried everywhere but without succes. I'll keep my fingers crossed!


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Tiger
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 10:57 AM

Lyrics (but not chords) can be found at:

    http://baez.woz.org/

These are only the one's that Joan has written, but you're in luck.

Hopefully, someone will add the chords.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST,guinnesschik
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 12:55 PM

I started listening to "folk" music when I was a teenager, long years after the original folk movement. Billy Bragg inspired me to look backward for material.

I loved almost everything I could find and consume with avid ears, but couldn't tolerate Joan's quavery, bloodless voice. Last week, I checked out a CD from the library to see if I had listened with immaturity, or if my dislike had a foundation. I couldn't get through the CD.

Ironically, I love the material. "Diamonds And Rust" is one of my all time favorite songs, as is "Jesse" and the "Prison Trilogy." I just can't get past her voice.

However, "Vive la Joan!" She paved the way.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: WyoWoman
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 01:03 PM

Well, ya know, we're sort of given a certain vocal mechanism with the rest of the package when we get dropped into this world. What we MAKE of it, now, that's something else. Lots of people have better natural voices -- and I personally prefer a voice with more timbre to it -- but what Joan Baez made with what she had (and still has) is pretty impressive.

ww


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 01:47 PM

You could say the same thing about Bob Dylan, ww, and a lot of people hate his voice too. He has, though, sung in several different voices at different times in his life, so he seems to be more versatile that way than most. I can understand exactly why some people don't like Joan's voice, but I like it fine...a matter of taste, that's all.

- LH


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: kendall
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 02:36 PM

I fell in love with Joan 40 years ago. Her voice can be a bit intense, but, well, when you love someone, you dont see all the warts. Never could stand Frank Sinatra, Bob Dylan sounds like he swallowed sandpaper. He has written some good stuff, although not all of it is original.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 02:38 PM

Well, at least he doesn't sound like Rod Stewart!

- LH


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Mark Clark
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 03:27 PM

Never heard Joan's voice panned before. I always loved it myself. I also loved Frank's and Tony's and Mel and Nat and Nina and Billie and Dinah and Ella and ... Also loved Bill's and Carter's and Mac's...

Quick, someone stop me!

      - Mark


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Big Tim
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 04:41 PM

The first 5 albums were good (though why did they change the cover for the 5th? - this from memory) after that it was mostly downhill.

Good singer, right time, bad songwriter.

Thank somebody for BD!


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 05:03 PM

Oh, we do, Tim, we do.

I think some of Joan's later songwriting is quite good. "Diamonds & Rust" is a great song, for example. "Gulf Winds" likewise. "Time Rag" is excellent. And so on...

- LH


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: BobP
Date: 04 Jun 01 - 02:18 PM

Few thoughts 'bout Joan & dylanstuff.

Very young, 'bout 15, hung out in a record shop after school, couldn't afford her album, but loved the one with The Moonshine Song (my granddaddy made whiskey).

In those days they'd let you take the lp into a listening room.

Had the album later, wore out the grooves.

I collect old vinyl, but haven't found a replacement yet.

Contrary to one comment I think she sang from had the broadest song bag of any folkie, ever. From Wildwood Flower to most of Ochs (only really good voice to cover him thorougly, although Kim and Reggie do pretty well now).

She has several voices, like Bob, and uses different levels of "shrill" but seems able to reach down and turn it off when she wants, not unlike Garfunkel.

Best song is "All In Green Went My Love Riding", but her version of "Love Is a Four Letter Word", would be the best, except the recording is over-produced, says me.

A while back I was talking with friends about
"DYLAN, THE MOVIE" and we were kicking around who should produce, who should play Bob, and the biggest discussion was about who would play Joan?

Would Love to get catters going on this (probably done in some thread I missed).

Now that the boy, is sixty, the notion of doing that, with his approval, would seem appropriate.

I mean, can you imagine Bob and Joan at, say 70, walking out of the premiere or at the oscar show?

I say it should be done while those two are young enough to get a kick out of it. Seriously, someone should contact Speilberg, or such, and let them know that this should be done and soon.

If done right, and told the story of Washington Park, thru the early 60s', just how big would a flicl would that be?

Year's #1 and well past Titanic, says me.

Maybe mudcat could get something for the suggestion!

Y'never know; sure beats a pledge drive.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 04 Jun 01 - 02:25 PM

It would be very, very difficult to do such a film and do justice to the subject matter. Maybe not impossible, though. I wonder....

- LH


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: BobP
Date: 04 Jun 01 - 02:57 PM

Incidentlaly,

My choice for Joan would be Suzy Roche(from the Roches) who had a small role, in "Crossing Delancey".

She has the stage, drama and voice training to do Joan's classical gone pop style without voiceover.

I a movie like this, the story and dialogue should carry the project beyond the need for mimicry.

Just a thought; before it gets "cast" in concrete.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: chip a
Date: 04 Jun 01 - 04:12 PM

I loved her 40 yrs ago and still do. Volume two is wonderful. I still have the scratched remainders of her records and still play them. Anyone else got "Folk Singers 'Round Harvard Square" with Joan, Bill Wood & others? I used to lay on the floor with a speaker at each ear and just float away on that voice! Went straight from Chuck Berry & Little Richard to folk 'cause of her. Thanks Joan.

Chip A.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST,jaze
Date: 04 Jun 01 - 06:07 PM

Speaking of Bob and Joan in the 60's, I just finished reading "Positively 4th Street" by David Hadju (just published). This tells the story of Bob and Joan and Richard and Mimi Farina during the early 60's Greenwich Village days. Very interesting reading and gives a little different perspective on them from what has been written before. A lot about Mimi, who seems to have sadly been born into Joan's shadow. I agree, their story would make a great movie and should be told. Like 'em or not, they both had a profound effect on American music.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Big Tim
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 05:01 AM

I got my first Baez album in '62 but only saw her live for the first time about 18 months ago here in Glasgow, Scotland. The voice has naturally deteriorated with time but she was still pretty good. A member of the audience requested the "Four Mary's" (because of the line "as I rode into Glasgow town") and although she hadn't planned to do it she sang that long, intricate ballad word perfect. I was impressed by that. He mother (whom I believe is originally from Edinburgh) was in the audience and must have been very proud of her "lassie". I have many happy memories of Joan's SINGING !


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: kendall
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 06:01 AM

I have one of her early albums, titled Joan Biaz. It has Silver Dagger, John Riley, Mary Hamilton etc. To get it, you would have to pry it from my cold dead fingers!


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 08:02 AM

Brad Pitt would be a good early Dylan, or perhaps Val Kilmer, as he's had experience already playing 60's icon Jim Morrison. Older Dylan: Dustin Hoffman.

As for Joan Baez...perhaps Courtney Love.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Maryrrf
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 09:12 AM

I had the album Kendall mentioned on cassette but it got ruined. No matter, I know most of the songs by heart anyway. That truly was a beautiful album and I think it was her best. Joan Baez also was the reason I became a "Folkie" - I think it was the first time I heard her rendition of "House Carpenter" that I became hooked. But not too long ago I had the same experience as a few other mudcatters had - I re-listened to some of those recordings and, although I enjoyed them, I did find her voice a little too high and shrill and without enough emotion. I still consider her to be one of the greatest and wish she'd stuck more to traditional folk rather than going the singer/songwriter appeal to the masses route (although I do like some of her songs). Still, I don't think she does much traditional folk anymore and more's the pity.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Peter T.
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 09:52 AM

Of all the songs she introduced me to, hers was the first version of "In The Pines" I ever heard, and I can still remember being seriously frightened by it. I can't recall if I have ever been frightened by any other song.

I completely agree about "Diamonds and Rust" -- what an amazing song, really a triumph by someone who is not much of a songwriter. She singlehandedly retilts the whole relationship through which she took a lot of grief (and was probably a pain herself too). It just pours out. A novel in four verses: her Tangled Up in Blue (er, Bob). I would give a lot to find out what Bob Dylan thinks of the song.

yours, Peter T.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Big Tim
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 09:56 AM

Probably not a lot. Bob himself now apparently regrets recording "Ballad in Plain D" - just too personal. Great art tho. Johnny Depp to play Bob, with a mask?


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 11:17 AM

I can't think of anyone who could play Bob. 'Cept maybe his son...

"Ballad in Plain D" was not only too personal, perhaps, but it was also horrendously unfair to Carla Rotolo (Suze's sister), and just a tad self-indulgent. On the other hand, it has that great last verse:

My friends from the city, they ask unto me
How good, how good does it feel to be free
And I answer them back most mysteriously
Are birds free from the chains of the skyway?

What a marvellous lyrical image to end a song with!

- LH


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 12:00 PM

Dylan used to ask Joan to perform Diamonds and Rust during the Rolling Thunder tour. Whether because he liked it or that it was big at the time is unclear. For all his twisted words, Dylan does seem to like the truth to be told(when someone else is telling it). Johnny Depp is a good pick to play Dylan. He excels at quirky characters. But who could play Joan? Too late now, but a young Emmylou?


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST,Celine
Date: 06 Jun 01 - 12:14 AM

Ah yes, I am a Joan Baez fan. My mother raised me on her and Buffy Saint Marie. Needless to say that I remember the sixties because I wasn't there... (have you heard that joke?) My mother was attracted because of the social activism these two women carried on through their music.

I can understand that some people would not like the wavering of her voice. It is excessive although I never tire of it. The first song I learned was "All In Green Went My Love Riding". Then "Fountain of Sorrow" which I find describes classically the fall-out of romantic obsession. That would be the pattern of her life romantically I would say after reading her auto-biography. I couldn't follow her path career wise. Someone had to tread that path. Thank God for her.

Perhaps her beauty lies in her mixed heritage - Mexican and was it Irish? A beautiful combination and from an intellectual family.

As for a movie, I'd love to audition although I'd not get the part. I don't have the looks nor the artistic profile.

Celine


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Gary T
Date: 06 Jun 01 - 08:52 AM

The mention above of Rod Stewart brings to mind his comment to the effect that he thought (correctly) that he didn't have much of a singing voice, but was inspired to go ahead and sing anyway by the fact that Dylan was able to get away with it.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 06 Jun 01 - 10:11 AM

Of course, Dylan had something to sing about. In somewhat recent years Rod's stable of songwriters churned out a blatantly transparent ripoff inspired by Dylan's "Forever Young" of 1974. They either thought no one would notice...or they just didn't care. Probably the latter.

The commercial music business actually really goes for people with "non-voices"...there have been a whole bunch of Rod Stewart clones of both sexes. Gravelly voice translates to romantic emotion in some people's minds.

- LH


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST,JEFF
Date: 07 Jun 01 - 07:38 AM

A friend's older brother bought Baez 1&2 when they were first released. I was pre teens and it was the first real music I had heard (apart from "The Laughing Policeman" and "Sparky's Magic Piano") and started a 40ish year love of folk music. Mary Hamilton and Geordie were beautiful but the best from the early years (ever?) was Birmingham Sunday. It had a great effect on me (a callow and probably objectionable teenager at the time) and showed me the power of a song. Later, of course, Diamonds and Rust. Why has nobody mentioned the great Dylan impression in Simple Twist of Fate on D and R. I can't believe I'm the only one who has spotted it.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: balladeer
Date: 07 Jun 01 - 08:12 AM

I love Rod Stewart. And Bob. And Joan. Still.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Stevangelist
Date: 07 Jun 01 - 10:58 AM

And just to make the point, there are very few women in music, IMHO, who have held up as well in the looks department as Joan. Always been very beautiful in my mind. BTW, Emmylou's nothing to scoff at, either.

May The Road Rise To Meet You,

Stevangelist


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 28 Jun 11 - 09:08 PM

Personally, I've been compared to Joan Baez in my singing a few times. I think she is a skillful singer with a very soulful voice, especially on spirituals.


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Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Joe_F
Date: 29 Jun 11 - 08:19 PM

People used to put her records on in the Student Center at Caltech while I was there in 1962. I did not know then, and do not care now, what she looked like or what her place in history was. I thought she sang like an angel, but I have thought that about a lot of people whose names I have forgotten & you have never heard.


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