Does the guitar make the difference?

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: GUEST,reggie miles
Date: 03 Dec 03 - 07:52 PM

Cluin, El Greko, if you only knew the whole story. It's not something I need to drag out further in this thread. I'm not fretting over the loss much these days. I've been having a great deal of fun creating my own guitars of late. Who knows, maybe one of my own will tickle me as much.

My point was to agree that, yes, I believe that there's a right tool for every job and it makes a noticeable difference. A better guitar can and indeed does enable even the average player to play with more definition. It can reproduce the same notes played on a cheaper, or lesser quality alternative with better results. I've played and owned plenty of guitars. This idea extends beyond just guitars and is true of many other tools, implements and instruments as well.

Susan, yes there are many good ones out there and many more average ones. There are also a number of funky guitars out there. Funky can be just what some players are looking for. It all depends upon your individual needs. No, guitars are not necessarily bad because they have a little known name or no name at all and some are even in demand by collectors of such. Knowledge about these more obscure guitars is limited because they initially were never produced in any great number. On occasion one can stumble upon guitars with no special name and find that it has all the quality of sound that any average player could wish for. Folks purchase guitars for a wide variety of reasons. Some feel confident with a major brand name. Others are just happy to have something that looks nice and plays okay. Many advanced players look for very specific designs and features to suit their particular fields of interest. There are guitars made to cover just about every need out there in the market place today and many are even very affordable. What a wonderful time we live in to be able to afford to purchase instruments of reasonable quality for such affordable prices. Some, who can't afford even the most reasonably priced guitars offered by sellers of such, are just as happy creating their own out of whatever they can find, even junk. They find great satisfaction in the creative process of taking something of little value, and using what skills they have, to turn it into something that they can use to further express themselves. Jugbands are a good example of this. Jugs and washtubs covered the bass lines while washboards and spoons clacked and scrubbed out the beat. One-string slide guitars were made by stretching a piece of bailing wire between a couple nails pounded into any front porch. Even the simplest of instruments, like the kazoo, could wail horn lines with all the fervor of the hottest jazz players when dedicated players applied their skill.

How can bailing wire compare to a top of the line guitar? Each can be used to advance one's self-expression and as such each has equal value. Good, better and best are all relative and ultimately subjective terms. I know a guy who can take an empty paper cup or a discarded newspaper and turn it into a resonator for this vocal thing he does. And man, can that cat blow! It's like a kazoo on steroids.

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: SueB
Date: 02 Dec 03 - 10:21 PM

Jumping back to the remarks about 3 chord players, someone recently told me that Woody Guthrie (or maybe it was Pete Seeger, I don't remember which she said it was) said something about more than three chords (the I, IV and V) being showing off. Is this true, can anyone confirm? Suzanne

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 02 Dec 03 - 06:37 PM

Reggie, you don't say why you "let it go", if you liked it so much right away. Was it overpriced perhaps? But in any case, you must have had your reasons. Surely, the tragedy is not so great that you will "regret it for the rest of your life"...Life is too precious to be marred by loss of such possessions (or opportunities to possess, which is the case here).
Losing a friend, a partner, a child - yes, those things are to be regretted. Losing the chance to buy a guitar, even a 000-28, hardly merits spoiling one's life forever.
Sorry to pick on your statement, Reggie, and please don't take it personally. But I confess that I am astounded at the adoration that "guitarophiles" lavish on their wooden idols. A bit like motor car fanatics that can enthuse for hours about a minute detail on a fender.
As folkies, we are all "anoraks" by definition almost. But I won't start a thread about the colour or fabric of mine. And I won't cry if it's torn and I have to buy a new one.
As I said, it's all tongue-in-cheek, no offence meant. Let's keep this thread going, it is a cause of much mirth for me.
Misguided though I may be.

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Cluin
Date: 02 Dec 03 - 06:10 PM

Don't worry, Reggie. The "one that got away" is always the best one.

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: GUEST,Susanl
Date: 02 Dec 03 - 06:08 PM

Most decently made guitars are good instruments. If they have pitch, any kind of tone and an action that won't get your fingers caught in the strings, they are playable and capable of making beautiful music. I understand the idea of a beautiful instrument. I've heard some that are pristine. However, I get SO sick of listening to people talking about guitars and gear and tone. There are excellent musicians who know exactly what they are talking about and listening for who do this but my experience is that most of the people who talk about brands and tone and gear aren't usually great players. (I don't mean you Rick. You ARE a great player and you love talking about guitars. I'm sure many of the people on this thread fall into the Rick category. I haven't heard you play.) It's just that I'm sick of showing up for gigs and some guy asking me what kind of guitar I play and then telling me what kind of guitar HE has and what kind of guitar he USED to own. Not in a sentimental way either. In a way that proclaims his expertise.
A couple of weeks ago, I was at an open mike and heard a guy play a Takamine. Later, he was standing talking to my friend and I said to him, "Nice playing". I only said this because he was looking right at me and I'd had a couple of beers and I felt like I should say something. He said, "Crappy guitar. I'm amazed I could play it at all. Give me a Norman with a blah, blah, blah, pickup and blah, blah sound hole and .." went on while my eyes glazed over. The truth is, he WASN'T a great player and he took himself very seriously. The guitar sounded very nice. It had pitch and a nice tone and sang for him. It was way better than he was. It made me angry. It was like a mediocre jockey criticizing a good but inexpensive horse.

OK, I said horse but I've always felt that guitars are a lot like dogs. They don't have to have papers to be excellent and most of them are better than their owners.

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: GUEST,reggie miles
Date: 01 Dec 03 - 10:28 PM

I had the chance to acquire an old Martin. It was a 1929 000-28 OM. The braces were scalloped unlike any other Martin or any other guitar I've seen since. When I played it the back of the guitar trembled. I could feel the vibration of the strings pulsing through the rosewood back. It seemed to make my meager ability sound better or maybe it simply made me aware of just how good I could sound on the right guitar. Was I getting more from this instrument than I got from my lesser, funkier, cheaper guitars? I think so. Perhaps it was because this much better guitar had more to give, better design, construction and better materials. The result being a better ability to produce and reflect the sounds created with it. Being able to hear and feel the sound and tone of the guitar made it easier for me to play and enjoy. Isn't that the purpose of better instruments, to increase our enjoyment of playing by providing a better quality of sound, and to amplify our ability to the greatest possible degree via the best possible materials, design and construction techniques?

I foolishly let go of that 000-28. That's something that I will probably regret for the rest of my life. It was a once in a lifetime find for me. To this day, I have yet to play it's equal. I have not found anything close among the new reproductions being offered by Martin or other makers nor have I found anything as responsive among the older Martins and other brands I have tried. I suspect this may have been my one true Excalibur and I allowed it to slip through my fingers to another. Drat and double drat!

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 01 Dec 03 - 08:26 PM

I have several piano accordions, bought secondhand purely for the reason that they have differnt sounds - thus suitable for different styles of music.

A straight tuned and a chorus tuned box sound so different, the chorus tuned box has a "big" sound: but there are some things for which the chorus tuned box sounds just wrong. the straight drier sound suits some styles and tunes better.

I also have several whistles, including Low Whistles, for the same reason.

Robin

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Cluin
Date: 01 Dec 03 - 08:02 PM

Whoops! Hit RETURN too soon...

The ones that bother me are the guys who buy those vintage instruments as an investment and never intend playing them. Guitars should be played, man. That's just mean.

That's all I gotta say.

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Cluin
Date: 01 Dec 03 - 07:59 PM

I've known lots of 3 chord guitar players with Gibsons and Martins. They were fun to jam with and got a lot of enjoyment out of their music; some where even professional and made money with it and other people enjoyed listening to them. Who says you have to know more than 3 chords to justify having a good quality instrument?

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 01 Dec 03 - 07:49 PM

For some people, owning a high quality instrument is throwing pearls before swine. They're never going to be serious enough about playing it to justify the purchase. For others, a quality instrument can provide the impetus to become a much better player. Unfortunately, the only way to find out which category one falls into is to take the plunge.

Now, if all the wieners that only know three chords but have a Martin or a Taylor in the closet would only take a beat up old Yamaha or Alvarez in trade and sell the good guitar to someone who knows what to do with it...

Bruce

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: GUEST,Frankham
Date: 01 Dec 03 - 06:18 PM

A good instrument makes a difference. It helps a student progress
faster and a good player sound better.

Some players sound better on electric or accoustic, finger-style or pickstyle. The style influences the choice of guitar and vice-versa.
Django Reinhardt's best work was on his choice, the Selmer accoustic Modele and when he played electric guitar, it didn't quite sound
like him.

I don't think that many classical guitarists would be able to sound
as good on an electric solid body.

Style is an indicator of how you will sound. In Chicago, I played Big Bill Broonzy's guitar and couldn't come close to making it
sound like it did when Bill played it. I heard him live many times, there. People have played my Martin 0021 and can't make it sound
like I do even though they were good players. I can't make my
style sound right on a dreadnaught or other types of Martins.
A lot is playing on what you are used to.

I think that accoustic-electric guitars that are run through a direct box sound synthetic and I think that it hurts good accoustic players to do that. They would be better off with a high quality condensor mic pointed directly at their instrument.

So....yes a better instrument affects that quality of your playing
and not everyone can equally sound good on every instrument.

Frank Hamilton

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 01 Dec 03 - 12:27 PM

Apologies to M.Ted - he's been reactivated, I missed that; welcome back to the active world!

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 01 Dec 03 - 12:20 PM

I totally support ClintonHammond's point about good tools (not) making a good workman.
And I do agree with M.Ted - now sadly defunct for some reason - that some of the talk involving strings of digits and letters, hyphens and hashes next to well-known guitar makers' brands makes little sense to me. Perhaps I am not academic enough about guitars, I just play the damn things as best I can, and try to improve a little every time.
But for me the telling point about how good a guitar is can only be one: Does it support the beer mug properly, when it's flat on the floor and you want to rest your beer on its face? So, Bowl-back Ovations are out, according to that; and cutaways too - you can miss and drop your mug.
OK, OK, I feel extra facetious today...

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: M.Ted
Date: 01 Dec 03 - 11:32 AM

Snagger, why did you revive a three year old thread with an inquiry about a Bacon and Day Senorita?

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 01 Dec 03 - 08:04 AM

Having played at many venues over many years the same annoying factor rears its ugly head time and time again. I don't mind low standards, I do mind people not tuning their instrument beforhand. The number of times I have heard an out of tune player does not bear thinking about. Having said that, there are many cheap guitars that are not tuneable

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 30 Nov 03 - 02:49 PM

A good guitar player can make a bad guitar sound better than it really is... just like a bad guitar player can make an otherwise good guitar sound like crud...

"anyone who disagrees with this theory, simply should forget about guitar playing!"

My oh my, isn't that nice and arrogant and dismissive...

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: GUEST,guitaristGreg
Date: 30 Nov 03 - 02:21 PM

Simple answer to your question. A good guitarist makes money from playing well, and can afford to buy a good guitar, a bad guitarist makes shite money and therfore don't waste it on something he has already. (Q)Definition of a good guitarist? (A)knowing why they put more than the first 3 frets on a guitar! But yes my friend you do have a point, i have a 1970's Martin D1. a beauty, nearly plays itself, anyone who disagrees with this theory, simply should forget about guitar playing!
Glad to be of help!

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 29 Nov 03 - 10:15 PM

Can a good hammer make one a better carpenter?

Can a good gun make someone a better cop?

Or it's like a chum of mine once said... We were sat, a bunch of us, around discussion different dart weights, different materials... different flight materials and textures and what worked better for some and not other...

"Bullsh!t!", my chum said... "You can either play darts or you can't."

And to make his point, he went off and grabbed a set of plastic darts (Like they give you to throw at the mid-way... all plastic except for the brass head and point on them) and proceded to beat all takers with them...

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Snagger
Date: 29 Nov 03 - 06:56 PM

Dear Thread,

   I`ve been looking for a Bacon and Day Senorita for years. Would you know where i could find one for purchase? It`s a Bill Broonsy thing.
Snagger

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Lonesome Gillette
Date: 25 Oct 00 - 08:16 PM

Hi WyoWoman, It was a neat one pickkup odd shaped little guitar. I've never seen another like it, but there must be loads of them out there. As a matter of fact, I just posted a message about how it got stolen . Thread's name is "Wierd Guitar History"

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: pict
Date: 25 Oct 00 - 08:00 PM

Thyme I don't really have a preference per se but I have liked some Lowdens and I like some Martins and old Gibsons.I really only listen for a pleasing tone and look for clean construction.

Whistlestop "But if the question is modified to ask "Does the guitar make A difference?", I feel that the answer is yes." I totally agree. Hesperis I'm not suggesting that the inherent limitations of an instrument with a railway sleeper for a neck and an orange box for a body can be overcome by ability what I am saying is that a well made inexpensive instrument will not hinder the production of good music but lack of ability will.As for whether or not an instrument will improve your playing I think a decent well made instrument that the player is intimate with will produce better results than an another decent etc.etc. instrument that he/she/it is not familiar with.

Many are chosen few are Pict

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: MK
Date: 25 Oct 00 - 06:40 PM

Scale length can make a big difference too.

I'm beginning to understand and appreciate why some people (Norman Blake comes readily to mind) like wider necked, 12 fret instruments when it comes to fingerpickin'.

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: M. Ted (inactive)
Date: 25 Oct 00 - 05:56 PM

Just a couple thoughts on the topic (ran out of smart remarks, I guess): Different types of guitars can produce drastically different types of sound--Taylor guitars seem to have a real special ring--reminiscent of the old Gibson J-200, but more affordable--The booming bass notes on those Martin Dreadnaughts has been mentioned before, and I will add that with a bit of palm-damping, you can do some mightly nice Chet/Merle fingerpicking on them, and, though not much regarded by the guitar collectors, the 70's models are great for playing rhythm for Jazz and such things--

Biggest problem that acoustic guitars seem to have is that, in closed positions, even very good ones don't produce the kind of clean, ringing chord sound that you can get with say a Les Paul or and of the arch top electrics, and forget about being able to do solid melody or solo work--

John Zeidler's guitars, particularly his archtops, are designed to do this, and they sound great, but they are a lot of work to play,, and ungodly expensive--

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Songster Bob
Date: 25 Oct 00 - 01:46 PM

One thing about this thread that hasn't been mentioned (that I noticed) is how one brand of guitar may have a characteristic sound and another a different sound. Necks were mentioned, and this is along the same lines. Some music sounds "better" (i.e., more natural to the style) on some makes of guitar. Gibsons, like the J-45 mentioned above, sound better for some blues styles, for instance, than a similar Martin would. Part of this is the wood of which the thing is made, and part of it is the bracing pattern, body size, scale length, etc.

So people gravitate to the makes and models that are customary for the music they're making. Bluegrassers like D-28s (even though a J-45 can boom out the bass pretty well), finger-pickers like Guilds, Martins, Taylors and Larivees (not to mention some of the more hand-made upper-end guitars around), but don't play Gibsons (despite that Rev. Gary Davis did) as often.

A good guitar makes you sound and play better. And specific "sounds" make you sound and play more like your idol, "X".

And your mileage may vary.

Bob Clayton

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: hesperis
Date: 25 Oct 00 - 01:29 PM

pict - "I'm a firm believer of ability making the musician rather than the instrument."

That's fine if you have the ability already, but for a beginner, a well-constructed guitar as opposed to a complete piece of crap, can only help to get you over the first hurdles. My mother's steel string is set up with horrible action. She never plays it. She lent it to me so that I could work out some chords to something I'd written. Do you think I ever play it? God, no!

The thing completely destroys my fingers in 43 seconds. Can I work anything out on it? No. Do I have the patience to play it for 43 seconds every day, and do I have the willpower to actually put it down after my fingers are dead? No.

Yeeeeooooooowwwwwwch!!!!!

I can't build callouses with that thing.

My mandolin is a beauty, especially since the action was fixed on it. My callouses are slowly building, and maybe three years from now, I will be able to play that guitar for more than a minute!!!

BTW, it's a Vanguard HGV-150. Whatever that means.

But I'm not actually a 'guitar player'.

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Whistle Stop
Date: 25 Oct 00 - 01:10 PM

The Rolling Thunder relief bus driver? I love that guy!!

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: M. Ted (inactive)
Date: 25 Oct 00 - 01:01 PM

WW/PRT--Thanks for asking! The Hoot Gibson model, or the "Hooter" as it is referred to by professional musicians everywhere, is available from your local, authorized dealer, attractively priced for less than you'd expect to pay!!

Check the upcoming "Pro Tips" workshop at selected dealers throughout the United States and Canada--it will feature Lester "Funkfingers" Bunkum, who is best known for his work as a relief bus driver on Bob Dylan's Legendary "Rolling Thunder" Tour--

And if you plug "The Hooter" on the Internet, you're eligible for a complimentary "Wanna see my Hooters?" 100% Cotton T-Shirt!!!

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 25 Oct 00 - 08:31 AM

Good definition Whistle. Well put.

Rick

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Whistle Stop
Date: 25 Oct 00 - 08:21 AM

It's not all one or all the other. A good player with a bad instrument can generally still do good stuff, but not AS good as he can do with an instrument that suits his style and has a pleasing sound. So if the question is "Does the guitar make THE difference?", I would say that the answer is no. But if the question is modified to ask "Does the guitar make A difference?", I feel that the answer is yes.

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: GUEST,Roger the skiffler
Date: 25 Oct 00 - 05:41 AM

Although I'm not a musician, just a listener, I find these discussions on rival makes of guitars, multiple guitar ownership etc. interesting.
Recently I've been discussing Bert Jansch with Rick. At one time in his career BJ didn't even own a guitar, he just used whichever was to hand from flatmates or people in the folk clubs he visited in Scotland. Still produced marvellous sounds.
I suspect the best players can make poor instruments sound good, average players can be helped by good equipment and people like me wouldn't be helped by a sterling silver kazoo! (But if you'd like to contribute...!)
RtS

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Thyme2dream
Date: 25 Oct 00 - 02:48 AM

Thanks Richard & Pict for your input in RE the Landola...I haven't seen them at all in the US, so if I really decide to get one, will have to wait til I'm over again in March.

Pict, maybe I missed it in your posts, what guitar make do you favor?? To me, the Landola not only felt just right when I was playing, but had a nice rich tone to it as well...but I'd be open to suggestions as to a guitar with a deeper sound.

Ian's Takemine/Jasmine always seemed to me to sound sort of "tinny", but the action is so nice it's a joy to play anyhow, just sort of snuggles right into my hands and does what ever I ask it too(Ian calls her his other darlin, and I guess I understand why!)

Get technical all you want fellas, I have to have a personal relationship with the guitars I'm playin'...

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: WyoWoman
Date: 24 Oct 00 - 08:41 PM

Hey, Lonesome Gillette -- what about that Fender Bronco? Why was it a goofy guitar?

And Ted, my clavinet is pert-near useless these days. Left it on the shelf too long, I spose. Any idea where I can find a new 'un?

ww/Pansy Rue Twidgett

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: kendall
Date: 24 Oct 00 - 07:57 PM

Hell, Rick, I still have the first capo I ever bought...a Hamilton. It now has a penny under the felt! The old spring aint what it used to be.

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Little Neophyte
Date: 24 Oct 00 - 07:56 PM

I know some might say that if I can do certain techniques on another banjo but not mine own then maybe my banjo only needs a new set-up. This could be true with other banjos but in this case I have taken my banjo in for a new set-up to fix the problem. There is only so much adjusting I can do with it because it does not have an adjustable truss-rod in the neck (bends the neck). So I can monkey around and adjust a few things but after that I'm stuck.

A banjo of better quality will have an adjustable truss-rod.
I would never give this banjo up, it is excellent for traveling, especially the back-country type places I tend to go.
But I still need a better banjo.

Bonnie

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: pict
Date: 24 Oct 00 - 07:41 PM

I personally don't like Landola guitars and I've tried a few.They don't really resonate and have,to my ears,an annoyingly tinny,trebley sound they are well constructed though but definitely not my glass of whisky.The question of guitar or player brings to mínd something I read about Charlie Parker playing many different brands of horns including a plastic alto for a while and still retaining the same tone regardless of horn used.He apparently viewed quality tone production as originating with the player rather than with the instrument.I think that generally speaking good players only sound good because of years of practice/constant playing rather than because they have a specific instrument that makes them sound good.I'm a firm believer of ability making the musician rather than the instrument.

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 24 Oct 00 - 06:18 PM

Just two things. TO answer an earlier question, Landola's are finnish, use birch, and are very good value partly hand built guitars at the proce of an average Yamaha, and good if they suit you, THey tend to be clear and bright, and the reinforced edge to the soundhole tends to exaggerate that. THey have a new process for drying the woowd now which sort of artificially ages it and these ones ('ve not seen one) are being well written up over here inthe UK. They are a slightly longer tha average scale, and so tend to be hard work, but the twelves really do ring out (and have a clever sort of upsode-down truss rod arrangement to stop the table bowing. Try other makes as well, but if you like it, buy it.

Second, My Mugen makes me sound a lot better than my Washburn D10 ever did - even though I am no better. THe chords just ring better and fuller.

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 24 Oct 00 - 06:17 PM

Just two things. TO answer an earlier question, Landola's are finnish, use birch, and are very good value partly hand built guitars at the proce of an average Yamaha, and good if they suit you, THey tend to be clear and bright, and the reinforced edge to the soundhole tends to exaggerate that. THey have a new process for drying the woowd now which sort of artificially ages it and these ones ('ve not seen one) are being well written up over here inthe UK. They are a slightly longer tha average scale, and so tend to be hard work, but the twelves really do ring out (and have a clever sort of upsode-down truss rod arrangement to stop the table bowing. Try other makes as well, but if you like it, buy it.

Second, My Mugen makes me sound a lot better than my Washburn D10 ever did - even though I am no better. THe chords just ring better and fuller.

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: John Hardly
Date: 24 Oct 00 - 03:13 PM

Jeez Rick,

I didn't even realize Russell played guitar. I assume he played Celtic?

John

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Whistle Stop
Date: 24 Oct 00 - 09:58 AM

Marion, I'm not sure what blues lick you're referring to. In general, though, blues guitarists have played on steel strings, and the techniques they have developed were worked out on steel strings. So what you say doesn't surprise me. If you're trying to bend strings, for instance (common in blues guitar, as I'm sure you know), you will find the result considerably less satisfying on nylon strings -- it can be done, and may even result in a pleasing effect, but it is a fundamentally different effect than you'll get from steel strings.

Again, it's a different instrument - so as long as you know that going in (it sounds like you do), you'll probably figure things out just fine. Have fun.

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: M. Ted (inactive)
Date: 24 Oct 00 - 09:24 AM

Well Murray, so you admit that you were simply plugging Tony McManus all along --and as a result, more people are listening--do you charge a fee for your Promotional and PR Service, or are you "Jes heppin' the boy out"?

Well, I give up--guys like you run the country--

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Marion
Date: 24 Oct 00 - 08:49 AM

Whistle Stop, I didn't mean to imply that all steel string guitars are the same! I mean that they all sound the same to me - it's my own inability to judge them properly that troubles me. I think what I'll do is just buy an inexpensive steel string with a "known" name, and bring a steel player shopping with me if I can.

Bonnie mentions being able to do some technique much better on someone else's banjo - I've had a similar experience. There's a very basic blues lick that I've been trying to get down on my classical - I've been practicing it daily for about six months but still only get it right about 1/4 of the time. Once I borrowed someone's Takamine for a few minutes, tried the blues lick, and did it perfectly the first try. And this was with a few people listening, in which situation I normally play worse than alone. Coincidence? Maybe.

And as Bernard said, a lousy instrument won't necessarily deter a beginner if they really really want to play. My first fiddle was a cheap Chinese thing, but I still practiced on it day and night and stuck with it (I now have a higher end student fiddle - thanks Mom!). I think if someone is getting an instrument "to see if they want to learn it" then a bad instrument might put them off, but if they know they want to do it but can only afford a bad instrument, they can still get by.

Although maybe if my bad fiddle had strings an inch off the fretboard like Little Hawk's guitar (did you mean that literally, LH?) it would be a different story.

Marion

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Thomas the Rhymer
Date: 24 Oct 00 - 03:07 AM

There are many reasons why people prefer
To play good guitars; so let us concur
Some like the status, some like the feel
Others like inlays, and engleman real

Action is everything to those who must play
And string size and tention both must have their sway
Some like their necks longer with cut-away shaping
While purist tradition needs no trendy escaping

But I want the sound to be full, warm and bright
And surely, to like it, will my playing requite
For the tone makes the tune, as the singer; the song
When I like what I hear, I know right from wrong

Technique is indifferent to the brand of the wood
For well set-up plywood lets our Jonnie be good
Yes, the richness of wood-tone amingling with steel
Brings enjoyment to players; a sensual meal. ttr

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Lonesome Gillette
Date: 24 Oct 00 - 01:13 AM

Didn't Hound dog Taylor play a real cheap import solid body electric. I don't know if he chose it of just didn't think about it that much, but he sure made it work. Different brands can make you play better, because different brands can make you play different. It's up to you to decide which ones are better. My favorite acoustic was a plain old Yamaha too, but it got stolen along with my old fender bronco, what a goofy guitar that was!

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Matt_R
Date: 23 Oct 00 - 11:04 PM

Well Murray, I'd heard Tony MacManus even before I came to Mudcat, on the Thistle & Shamrock. And I'd just yawn and hope for some more David Allison or Burach or something...

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 23 Oct 00 - 11:03 PM

Shubb forever....Down with the Kaiser!

Boy I feel old 'cause I remember the "Bill Russell" capo!

Ted, you'd have LOVED the old Gibson catalogues from the twenties (I've got reprints). They used hyperbole better than even Martin (who felt they were so much better than the other companies that their blurbs were relatively brief.

'Course Gibson's slogan was "only a Gibson is good enough" and don't forget the "THE GIBSON" logo on all their higher end instruments. They did bogus interviews with prominent players who'd claim: "I truly feel sorry for the musician who has to make do with other than a GIBSON"(!!)

Believe me they were both put to shame by the Dobson and Vega banjo companies who implied that before playing one of their instruments you should put on your tuxedo! (I'm not kidding) They had pictures of formally attired young men and ladies with Vega and Dobson banjos, next to farm hands and black(!!) labourers, who played inferior brands!

Rick

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: GUEST,Murray MacLeod (at the Advertising agency)
Date: 23 Oct 00 - 10:59 PM

M Ted, I sincerely regret it if you find my light hearted plugging of Tony McManus "obnoxious". Tedious perhaps, misplaced, aggravating, but "obnoxious" ? I can guarantee that more Mudcatters have heard his music now than before I brought his name up. I can also guarantee that Tony doesn't give a tinker's cuss whether I plug him or not.

However I just realised that I had forgotten to mention the maker of his guita. He is a Scottish luthier called Bill Kelday, whose wider fingerboards and shorter scale length enable the advanced player to attain heights which previously they could only dream about .............

Murray

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: Bernard
Date: 23 Oct 00 - 07:18 PM

Posting twice beats not at all any day...

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: John Hardly
Date: 23 Oct 00 - 05:39 PM

I am the sincere sort. Unfortunately, my sincerity is limited mostly to my ineptness. And yes, my clavinet is small but since I'm married I don't get to use it that much anyway. As for in delicates, my wife won't let me do that either.

John

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: hesperis
Date: 23 Oct 00 - 05:26 PM

Spaw - you accusing someone else of indelicacy?

You must be practising for your irony lessons again, eh?

Subject: RE: Does the guitar make the difference?
From: catspaw49
Date: 23 Oct 00 - 04:42 PM

Well John I must say that your posting twice is, shall we say, indelicate. Try to do better.

Spaw