Lyrics & Knowledge Personal Pages Record Shop Auction Links Radio & Media Kids Membership Help
The Mudcat Cafemuddy

Post to this Thread - Sort Descending - Printer Friendly - Home


Another Music Theory Question

Related threads:
Time Signatures: 2/4 or 4/4 time.... (60)
12 tone music explained -- 30 min vid. (1)
Question about musical notation (47)
Music Theory: Who is W.A. Mathieu? (6)
Why Only 7 letter names? (31)
Unequal temperament (46)
Helmholtz: Die Lehre von den Tonempfindungen... (7)
harmony vs. melody (51)
Online printable music paper source (55)
Basic Music Theory Question (62)
Time Signature help needed... (7)
tone vs pitch (36)
help with music theory (19)
Origins of music: new theory (18)
stupid notation question (11)
Music Question: Improvisors? (82)
Scared of Music theory? Faggggedaboudit! (120)
Music Theory:Number Notes Need? (30)
2 ideas for technique/theory study (3)
Tunes rule OK? Or chords? (34)
How to train one's ear? (8)
Music Theory/Arrangement Question? (38)
Theory questions that make me nuts-- (24)
US / UK differences - music theory (12)
Link for music theory and tunings (3)


Peter T. 22 Oct 00 - 01:00 PM
Bernard 22 Oct 00 - 02:31 PM
Anglo 22 Oct 00 - 02:47 PM
GUEST,Murray MacLeod (at the travel agent) 22 Oct 00 - 02:52 PM
Bernard 22 Oct 00 - 03:00 PM
Peter T. 22 Oct 00 - 03:39 PM
Share Thread
more
Lyrics & Knowledge Search [Advanced]
DT  Forum
Sort (Forum) by:relevance date
DT Lyrics:





Subject: Another Music Theory Question
From: Peter T.
Date: 22 Oct 00 - 01:00 PM

Enquiring minds want to know!

A famous Mexican song, La Llorona (sung by Joan Baez, Tish Hinojosa, and others) is -- at least in one guitar version -- in A minor. The chorus does something strange: can anyone explain why?

Verse in Am:
Salias del templo un dia, llorona,
cuando al pasar yo te vi;
(repeat)

Chorus:
Hermoso huipil llevabas, llorona,
que te virgen te crei.(repeat)

The song is in 6/8. Easy strum: thumb, strum, strum; thumb, strum, strum.
Chords are:
Verse: Am/Am/Dm/Dm//
Am/Am/E7/E7//
Am/Am/Dm/Dm//
Am/Am/E7/E7//

Straightforward: major substitution of the E for the V7

then Chorus: Am/Am/G/G/F/F/E/E//(repeat).
What kind of a progression is going on here? Some weird Mexican thing, or something normal. Sounds great, but what is officially happening?

yours, Peter T.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Another Music Theory Question
From: Bernard
Date: 22 Oct 00 - 02:31 PM

It's a fairly typical flamenco chord progression, also found in pop music - the Ventures 'Walk, Don't Run', and the ubiquitous 'Stairway to Heaven' after the guitar solo are but two examples.

Theory-wise it's down to the 'melodic minor scale', which is different 'ascending' and 'descending', unlike the 'harmonic minor' whigh remains the same.

'A melodic minor' runs as follows:
A B C D E F# G# A G F E D C B A

'A harmonic minor', however, is:
A B C D E F G# A G# F E D C B A

I'll stop there, in case we've reached 'information overload'!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Another Music Theory Question
From: Anglo
Date: 22 Oct 00 - 02:47 PM

Well, I'll have a stab at it....

There are various tried and true methods for going from A to B (well, A to A, or Am to Am). In a standard major chord tune, such progressions as 1 4 5 1 [let's think in the key of C for simplicity - C F G or G7 C]; 1 6 2 5 [C Am Dm G(7)] using minor chords - the doo-wop progression; 1 3 6 2 with major chords [C E A7 D7, then home with G7 C, think Freight Train, this jumps to E with the sharp 5th of the scale, then comes home via the circle of fifths].

The dominant chord, that's the main alternate chord you use, is a fifth above the tonic (the key chord). So for C major the dominant is G(7). Play a G chord, give it a little tension by adding the seventh, and it wants to come "home" to C.

To leave your initial C chord you might add a 7th to give you a little impetus to get somewhere else. A C7 would lead naturally to F. (C is the 5th or dominant of F).

A tune in A minor might have E major as a dominant, but a lot of minor tunes, especially folk tunes, don't have the sharpened leading tone, G# in A minor. The tune uses a G natural. (Think the first phrase of Greensleeves, "do me wrong," the "wrong" has a G nat. in A minor). Many 2-chord songs in Am would be most naturally harmonized with an Am chord and a G chord. The G becomes the "dominant" replacing the Em which is a weaker chord. But a tune like Greensleeves, for its final cadence, sharpens the G so the Ending harmonization is E (you can add the 7th if you want for more tension) to Am.

(Also remember that the 7th of an Am is a G nat.)

So what goes between the G and the E7 to get you from the Am start to the Am end. Another Am is certainly a possibility. Am G Am E7 Am. But let's consider F. It's a strong chord, it shares a lot of notes with Am, and if we substitute it in we have a direct descending bass line. Am G F E with the G# of the E chord giving us a little extra impetus back to the Am.

And there's your common Spanish progression. Everything from the Kingston Trio's "El Matador" to you-name-it .

Here endeth the first lesson. Maybe someone else can be clearer than I was - exposition is not my forte - nor is music theory!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Another Music Theory Question
From: GUEST,Murray MacLeod (at the travel agent)
Date: 22 Oct 00 - 02:52 PM

Davey Graaham's "Angie" is probably the most famous example of this progression.

Murray


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Another Music Theory Question
From: Bernard
Date: 22 Oct 00 - 03:00 PM

Erm, 'infamous'!!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Another Music Theory Question
From: Peter T.
Date: 22 Oct 00 - 03:39 PM

Gracias, gents. We progress. yours, Peter T.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate
  Share Thread:
More...

Reply to Thread
Subject:  Help
From:
Preview   Automatic Linebreaks   Make a link ("blue clicky")


Mudcat time: 12 December 7:38 AM EST

[ Home ]

All original material is copyright © 1998 by the Mudcat Café Music Foundation, Inc. All photos, music, images, etc. are copyright © by their rightful owners. Every effort is taken to attribute appropriate copyright to images, content, music, etc. We are not a copyright resource.