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Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?

GUEST,Murray MacLeod 28 Oct 00 - 08:06 AM
Rollo 28 Oct 00 - 05:03 PM
Bob Bolton 28 Oct 00 - 10:59 PM
GUEST,Rita Bentley 21 Oct 19 - 09:25 PM
leeneia 21 Oct 19 - 09:48 PM
michaelr 21 Oct 19 - 09:53 PM
leeneia 21 Oct 19 - 10:28 PM
Jack Campin 22 Oct 19 - 03:16 AM
Megan L 22 Oct 19 - 03:18 AM
Ebbie 22 Oct 19 - 03:42 AM
JHW 22 Oct 19 - 05:17 AM
GUEST 22 Oct 19 - 07:53 AM
leeneia 22 Oct 19 - 10:54 AM
Mick Pearce (MCP) 22 Oct 19 - 11:26 AM
GUEST,akenaton 22 Oct 19 - 12:04 PM
leeneia 24 Oct 19 - 12:32 PM
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Subject: RE: Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?
From: GUEST,Murray MacLeod
Date: 28 Oct 00 - 08:06 AM

Bob, I don't think anyone is insisting that anything is "right" or wrong they are just reporting how the word is pronounced in their neck of the woods. It is obvious however that "Skoteeshers" are very much in the minority, but then again, the Scots have always been used to being a minority.

Murray


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Subject: RE: Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?
From: Rollo
Date: 28 Oct 00 - 05:03 PM

HEY ISN'T IT FUNNY!

Everywhere else they call this dance "schottische"...

only here in northern germany we call it "Schotts"... (to be pronounced "Shots"

But who cares, as long you do it slow enough, so our stiff german folk dancers can follow the tune without dropping over her legs, hurhurhur...


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Subject: RE: Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 28 Oct 00 - 10:59 PM

G'day Murray,

I have no brief for any concept that there is a right pronuciation ... you can't be a native English speaker and justify that proposition. I was just pointing out to a small minority that claimed there was a single 'right' pronunciation of a German "ch" that they were overlooking the second occurrence in the same word.

If you want to take a strict approach to pronunciation within the dance and music world, you have to follow the French in dance names and the Italian in matters appertaining to music - the source of a local silliness that I alluded to in my first post in respect of "Varsovienna / Varsovienne / Varsoviana / Versuviana / ... / Vater Wiesskopf / ... / ? / ! " All valid pronunciations for the same dance ... somewhere in the Australian spectrum.

Regard(les)s,

Bob Bolton


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Subject: RE: Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?
From: GUEST,Rita Bentley
Date: 21 Oct 19 - 09:25 PM

`I grew up near Crater Lake, Oregon with Texas parents. A small little community had a community center and held dances once a month or so. This was in the 1940's We all danced the Schottish was how we said it. I was about 5-11 while dancing this dance. It was my favorite and so much fun. A local family played the music, Gibsons, had a sax, piano, guitar, bass, I believe. I loved watching the piano player.We left there and moved to Northern Calif. in 1951 and I never heard the Schottish again.


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Subject: RE: Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?
From: leeneia
Date: 21 Oct 19 - 09:48 PM

I studied German for four years in high school and got a minor in college.

Yet it just occurred to me that in German 'Schottische' would have 3 syllables, because the final e would be pronounced. If I said

Das ist eine schottische Tanz. (That is a Scottish dance.)

schottische would be pronounced SHOT ish eh, and the eh is a short e as in red. We English speakers have mislaid a syllable.


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Subject: RE: Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?
From: michaelr
Date: 21 Oct 19 - 09:53 PM

Leeneia, Tanz being a masculine noun, the correct phrase would be "Das ist ein schottischer Tanz." But you're right about the pronunciation.


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Subject: RE: Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?
From: leeneia
Date: 21 Oct 19 - 10:28 PM

Jawohl. I was just about to correct myself.


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Subject: RE: Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?
From: Jack Campin
Date: 22 Oct 19 - 03:16 AM

I have heard that the word is neither German nor related to Scotland - comes from an old Polish word meaning "jump".

"Skotshne" in Yiddish - klezmer preserved the original Polish sense, as a solo display dance, often with its own flashy tune.


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Subject: RE: Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?
From: Megan L
Date: 22 Oct 19 - 03:18 AM

In the part of Scotland I was born it was pronounced Scot eesh


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Subject: RE: Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?
From: Ebbie
Date: 22 Oct 19 - 03:42 AM

Serious segue, here:

Rita Bentley, I am from Oregon, from the 'wet' side. I have visited Crater Lake- and was mind-blown by it - but I didn't realize there was a community around there.


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Subject: RE: Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?
From: JHW
Date: 22 Oct 19 - 05:17 AM

One tends to stick with the pronunciation first heard, even after correction. I first heard this at St.Chartier, France called a shot-eesh, emphasis on last syllable. Similarly though I know what a sailboard is it sounds awkward, the first name that comes to mind is 'planche a voile' because that's what the first ones I saw were called. (At Sidiailles nr St.Chartier)


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Subject: RE: Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Oct 19 - 07:53 AM

I have only ever heard it called "shoteesh" in English. The emphasis varies, being from south east England I tend to put it on the first syllable.


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Subject: RE: Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?
From: leeneia
Date: 22 Oct 19 - 10:54 AM

When I googled the word schottische, many definitions came up claiming that the schottische is a kind of polka. I don't see that.

A scottische goes one two three hop, one two three hop, one hop, two hop, three hop, four hop. A polka is far simpler. So how do they figure?

Nobody mentions that while the feet do the above, the body is doing bigger motions - such as turning around, going in and out of the circle, dancing side by side with one's partner, changing partners, etc. There are many versions of these, and thus there are many schottisches.


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Subject: RE: Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?
From: Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 22 Oct 19 - 11:26 AM

OED gives shott'eesh or 'shottish (translating from IPA).

Mick


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Subject: RE: Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?
From: GUEST,akenaton
Date: 22 Oct 19 - 12:04 PM

West Argyll, always an area in which Country Dancing was very popular, we pronounced it "Highland Scoteesh" in agreement with Megan.


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Subject: RE: Pronunciation of 'Schottische'?
From: leeneia
Date: 24 Oct 19 - 12:32 PM

I think it was in Milwaukee that we had a symphony orchestra conductor named Schermerhorn. He pronounced it Skermerhorn. The rest of us rolled our eyes.


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