BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One

Subject: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: wysiwyg
Date: 31 Oct 00 - 05:02 PM

Burnout.

Mudcatters.

Talk to me.

Your posts can be long descriptions you weep your way through, hot tips from whatever you did to recover, questions... anything on topic, or creeping from it. Or just post wordlessly if this is a current struggle for you and you want it known but don't know what to say.

But we are having an awful lot of us talking about burnout. Let's make it easy to find what's being said about it by putting it here or adding clickies to good past threads on this.

My thoughts and prayers are with each and every one of you who have wrestled with this. I know who some of you are. Some of you are in the worst of it now.

I'll repost my adrenal recovery links here in a bit. Please post your links, too.

But I start with an invitation, inspired by Music Man in another thread today. Burned out? Need to get away? Need to rethink or replan some stuff? COME ON OVER. STAY A COUPLE OF WEEKS. BRING YOUR MUSIC STUFF. I'll add a clicky to describe that too.

Talk to me.

I'll post when I can-- new computer due in a day or two, a Mac, I may be scramyxed for a few days. And I'm burned out, so I may be sleeping or doing other basic system maintenance.

But talk to me.

Burnout. And Recovery Therefrom.

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: GUEST,John Leeder
Date: 31 Oct 00 - 05:14 PM

I've been so close to burnout many times, always managed to pull back from the edge, maybe because I have become familiar with the symptoms and can monitor myself. (Going through that right now, as a matter of fact.)

Burnout is nothing to accept criticism for; if you're burned out, it's because you've been doing things. People who've never burned out perhaps haven't accomplished much. It's a badge of honour, like a scar from a wound earned in a good cause.

Recovery? Cut back, take time to relax, reward yourself by doing things you enjoy. You've earned it. Down the road, start taking on manageable responsibilities again. But keep an eye on yourself.

Hope this helps. I'm heading out on a week's holidays (which will include meetings which I'm afraid will be stressful), so I won't get to see any responses for a while.

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: wysiwyg
Date: 31 Oct 00 - 05:21 PM

John L, it does. Whole new viewpoint. Thanks.

Don't forget to take those meetings as light as you can, now.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Llanfair
Date: 31 Oct 00 - 05:40 PM

Still recovering after a year of not being a wage slave.
Lessons learned:
1.Earning money is not the most important thing. It is surprising how little we actually need, particularly if we stop smoking.
2.Family and friends are important. To value them, you need to spend quality time with them, not squeeze them in between work commitments.
3. Stand, or sit, and stare a lot. You can watch the grass grow, the seasons change, the rain, or the pictures generated by the afternoon play on the radio. All these are a million times better that having to do stuff to make money.
4.Procrastinate. A baking session is much more fun if you should really be cleaning the bathroom, ironing, or filling in forms.
5. Very, very gently, start poking about in your head. Is that opinion yours, or one you learned as a child? Do you REALLY have to do that? What did that dream mean? was it anxiety, or putting your world to rights? Why did you react like that? What kind of person are you really?
That's just a start. I still have a rush of adrenalin sometimes when the phone rings, and worry about things that don't need worrying about, but I'm on the way.
Thanks for listening.
Cheers, Bron.

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Matt_R
Date: 31 Oct 00 - 05:43 PM

I'm better to burn out all at once than to slowly fade away...

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Bert
Date: 31 Oct 00 - 06:23 PM

The only remedy I know is 'change'. Once you've hit serious burnout it doesn't seem possible to continue even after a long break.

I was a draftsman for many years and was hit really bad with burnout. I changed jobs and everything was OK for a while. Then unfortunately I received an offer I couldn't refuse, 3 times my salary at the time, to go back on the drawing board. I stuck it for a year but it was a nightmare.

I made a vow to myself that in future I would only take a job that I enjoyed doing.

I can still draw but after a day or two the burnout comes back.

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: wysiwyg
Date: 31 Oct 00 - 06:49 PM

Aw Bert. I know. I tried to go back to several things. I'd even healed well and cried what I thought were enough tears-- I mean REALLY worked through it. But it was just like you said. I didn't know it wasn't just me, I thought I'd blown it with lousy, piss-poor recovery. Thank you so much.

Bron, that's a great list. Yes. Letting the true thoughts bubble up, as they come, yes. All the rest too.

One of those thoughts for me has stuck; it was a deep lesson to learn-- I will never again do uphill work. I'm too good to put into a thing that will chew me up. I'm a good chisel, see? I don't work at my best on concrete. I can make a MUCH bigger difference in the world NOT working in the setting that kills me. Doesn't mean I don't work out on the edge, take on challenges. You see me do that here. But no more Sisyphus, this girl. I'd rather roll down to it.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Thyme2dream
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 01:17 AM

Three rowdy & strongwilled (but greatly beloved) boys & a recently single mum living just on the edge of the poverty level; the awful reality of ENTROPY (broken car, clothes dryer, toilet and furnace all in one month!)50 hour work weeks at a job that pays the bills but stifles me creativly....hmmm, recipe for burnout? Yup! Something I can do to change my overall situation, or get rid of the source of my stresses? Not much just now...I have to keep on keepin on!

Remedies I use:

1)Cry--as often as you think you need to, and scream once in awhile too!...it's like a river washing out the stress, nice release. No point in acting like nothing's wrong, but be careful to view this as something you're walking through, not staying stuck in--avoid the 'victim'or 'martyr' mentality during crying jags!.

2)Joy breaks!--Joy is different than happiness...happiness is based on circumstances, joy is a fruit in our spirits that we can take a bit of whenever we need it. Take time to enJOY something simple in the middle of all the chaos.

3)Music(or something else you are passionate about): helpful with either step 1 or 2...I have crying, screaming, rejoicing, and calming music selections taped and handy for times alone in the car, or breaks at work...

4)Take care of your body--practical stuff...make sure you get the right amount of sleep (not too much OR to little) remember to eat-good food, not just junk. Exercise-somthing simple...don't make exercising so complicated that it turns into another stressor!! Just a nice 20 minute walk that gets your heart rate up a bit will give you a nice little endorphin lift!

5)Don't be afraid to ask for help, advice, hugs or fogiveness!

Hmmm, that's probably enough for now...but a start anyway, and some basic things that keep me going!! Smiles all...:-)

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: wysiwyg
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 07:34 AM

For more on empowered, non-victim crying and other delightful releases, see:

www.rc.org (No that is not rc as in roman catholic, I have another link for that!)

T2D-- Such wisdom. That being poor thing can be complicated. PM me anytime. Oh and I LOVE rants. Also have highly absorbent shoulders, and willing to exchange shoulder time.

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: L R Mole
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 10:14 AM

Well, as Tom Waits said (echoing R.M. Rilke), "If I exorcise my devils, my angels might leave too..." But sometimes it's just no fun at all, at all.

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: The Shambles
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 02:28 PM

Just last night, some concerned neighbour placed a copy of a planning application, issued that day, through our letterbox and I suspect the rest of the street.

It was for the hotel, just a few doors away, to have a change of use to a Re-Hab residential centre, presumably for those recovering from drug and alcohol related problems.

I am sure there will be a lot of opposition to this plan and that we will be expected to join in...

How would you feel?

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: wysiwyg
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 02:32 PM

I don't know enough about the precise situation you have at hand even to start an opinion, dear. How do you feel about it?

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Barbara
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 02:42 PM

Hey, Praise, doesn't your personal mail work? Where do you live? Your question about visiting and making music intrigued me, but I forget where you are. I seem to remember east coast somewhere?
Anyway I'm in Oregon, and finishing up a separation agreement with my husband of 20+ years and looking for somewhere new to live.
The woman who does Upledger Cranial Sacral on me, ran me through a "talking to different parts of my brain" last night, and part of it involved resetting the RAS, so that I my stress level wasn't so far up on alert all the time. I think we put some WD40 on it too, so it could get up faster if I needed it, and then we reset it at 25 on a dial of 0 - 100.
I'd have to ask her what RAS stands for, I forget. But music sure does it for me.
Blessings,
Barbara

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Kim C
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 03:33 PM

I started piano lessons as a wee lassie and kept it up all through high school and when it was time for college I majored in music because that was what everyone expected me to do. After two years I said ENOUGH! I was tired of playing the piano just so people who knew more than me could tell me how well (or not well) I was playing. So I changed my major, and it was a long time before I played the piano again.

It's easy to get burned out at a job. I just find new ones after about five years.

Sometimes I get burned out on just being around people. It's nothing personal, sometimes I just want to be alone and I want everyone to SHUT UP and GO AWAY. (I have felt this way a lot more in the two months since my father died.) This is a little trickier - I try to get out of the office and goof off at lunch hour, but that's not quite enough. I would really like to go away for a weekend by myself but I don't think Mister would go for it. So I have to grab my alone-time when I can.

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: The Shambles
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 04:03 PM

Not too sure how I feel. I know we will be pressured to object. personally I like to think that I am a fairly charitable bloke but when you do have a Re-Hab clinic proposed for next-door, you have to do some real hard thinking.

It is a residential street on a small island that already has two prisons and a borstal. There is the feeling that the island is a dumping ground for the larger towm across the water from us. It is a true test of one's liberal views. You may recognise the need for such places but would you want one next door?

How would you feel?

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: wysiwyg
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 04:23 PM

Barbara, my PM box sometimes acts quite odd. I have gone into my archive twice to find an unread, unarchived message sitting in there. Another time I sent one PM and the recipient received 31 copies of it! And there have been some I sent that never arrived, as well as some I was told were sent that I never got. So I like e-mail! Easier also to chain long discussions just like a thread, and then save them.

I'm in north central PA. You coming over? When?

Kim! Tell the mister it's an all-girl party! See if you can come too! We'll leave you alone!! Promise!!! You can have the back room!

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Matt_R
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 04:26 PM

Susan, can you arrange to have me kidnapped right in the middle of CA class, and take me up to your place? You know just like Philip Zimbardo did in the convict/warden psychology experiment? HA HA Carl would flip his lid!

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: wysiwyg
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 04:35 PM

Sure, Matt, here's how. Actually you'll kidnap yourself. Just blurt out BEAM ME UP SCOTTIE and then click:

VIRTUAL VISIT TO OUR PLACE

Y'all are welcome virtually any time, or for real by arrangement.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Wesley S
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 04:44 PM

Dang it - I'm too busy for burnout right now. I'm going to have to schedule it in for next week or maybe the week after that.

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: wysiwyg
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 05:28 PM

To see how your adrenals may be (or may be getting) exhausted, click

HERE and HERE

Those first two will help you understand this next batch HERE and HERE

Also check out: THIS and THIS

These links were working quite recently and should be current. I'll test them.

I'll also post the mix of vitamins that let me turn it around.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Ely
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 07:21 PM

Oh, Kim C, I can relate to that! I was a biology major for three years until I couldn't stand it any more--the reading, the hours in labs, the extra hours AFTER labs, inadequate research materials for the long lab reports we had to write, etc etc. In all fairness, I love biology still but it took me 3/4 of my college career to admit I didn't want to do it academically. I switched to history, which set me back a semester, but I've been so much happier and so much less stressed out that my only regret is that I didn't do it earlier.

My favorite burn-out case is music buddy Ian, who was a physicist until he couldn't take it any more. Now he builds super-detailed ship models and plays the guitar for a living.

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: CarolC
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 07:32 PM

L R Mole, do you check your personal messages? Are you ok?

Happy birthday.

Best wishes,

Carol

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Llanfair
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 07:52 PM

Shambles, there are always some objectors when groups of labelled people move into an existing community. I have been heavily involved in resettling people with learning disabilities from long-stay hospitals, and, until the mystery is taken away, there will always be fear of the unknown.
You said that they were probably recovering from drink or drug related problems, but they are people first, and some you will like, and some you won't, just like in the rest of the population.
Find out what's going on, and meet the people concerned before you form an opinion. I can guarantee that they are not all axe-murderers or child molesters.
Cheers, Bron.

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: The Shambles
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 08:13 PM

Fully aware of that, as part of the difficulty for both of us is that we work with people with such problems all day. So there is little mystery involved for us. Maybe we should try and take some of the mystery away for our neighbours?.... Maybe we should do nothing and see what happens?

I suppose the point I am labouring, is that knowing all this does not really make the prospect of such a place on one's doorstep any clearer. Maybe it should? For I can see both sides of the issue.

That is why I keep asking. How would you feel?

Bron, knowing the problems, how would you honestly feel if such a clinic was proposed next door to you?

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Llanfair
Date: 02 Nov 00 - 05:01 AM

Shambles, I have to say that I wouldn't have a problem with it, but then my circumstances are different to yours. I don't go to work now, and therefore would have the time to become involved and get to know people. I also don't have children at home who would need to know the pros and cons of befriending people who might not play by the same rules as they do.
This makes me sound like a wishy washy liberal, but, since "burning out" at work, I no longer suffer fools as gladly as I used to do, and am thus capable of telling people when their actions are not acceptable to me.
It is always interesting to know why the authorities have selected a particular place for resettlement. And if I were in your position, I would make a nuisance of myself till I found out.
These days, disadvantaged people have taken the place of black people as targets for the NIMBYS, haven't they?
Cheers, Bron.

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: The Shambles
Date: 02 Nov 00 - 11:14 AM

Yes sadly I agree with that but I think I will be a little less hard on the NIMBYs in future. We all may feel that settling such folk back in to the community is a good idea but in truth I suspect that when I asked 'how would you feel'?. The first, and probably automatic little thought is 'I'm glad it's not me and not here?

I can see in this case that the NIMBYS will come up with many good reasons why it should not be there, other than acually saying they do not want it their backyard. The problem for me is that many of those reasons are in fact quite good ones.

Many will not be.

It is very difficult to be objective. I feel one should try as the alternatives are no easier to live with, in the long term.

Thanks for your help.

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: SINSULL
Date: 02 Nov 00 - 03:34 PM

Shambles,
My son is in a drug rehab. Though I am glad it exists and know unfortunately that it has to, I would scream, yell, lie down in the street, do whatever I had to to keep it off my street.
The reason: All of the clients are there by court decree. And EVERY week, at least 3-4 are thrown out because they test positive for drugs - not pot but crack, cocaine, heroin, etc. the presence of this facility means that there are drug dealers on hand to fill the need and clients who are high and not rational.
If the facility houses voluntary clients, it may be different. All my liberal sensibilities say "give them a chance" but the side of me who wants the local children to be safe, who wants to sleep securely at night, who worries about property values says "No".
Mary, risking the wrath of the 'Cat

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Morticia
Date: 02 Nov 00 - 06:20 PM

I'm so burned out I don't even know how to find the words for it. I can't seem to stop crying and I wake up every morning thinking " Oh God, not again".Don't tell me I should stop, I know it......but I have a kid to get through university first.

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Llanfair
Date: 03 Nov 00 - 05:31 AM

Morty, does the kid know what she's putting you through? I bet that if she did, she would look for other ways to finance her education.
Looking at that sentence again, it looks really unkind, but it's not meant to be. Perhaps it's because I made the decision that my health and well being are more important than I thought they were, and I tend to go on about it!!!!
Last night my eldest son rang with a tale of woe about his car, and I wasn't able to help him out. He'll sort it out, and perhaps realise that he can't afford a state of the art car on his pay, specially now that he's got a baby. I do feel a little guilty, but only a little.
Cheers, Bron.

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Catrin
Date: 03 Nov 00 - 07:53 AM

Oh Morticia!

My heart goes out to you. I think I told you I used to work for Social Services, for the Learning Disability Service.

My employers kept putting more responsibility on me, trickle by trickle so that at each stage it felt impossible to say 'well I'm not doing 'this''. Then one day somebody died. A woman with a learning disability who was living in one of the houses I was managing. It was a result of a member of staff being in too much of a hurry to take proper care over what should have been a simple, straightforward morning routine. I never blamed the member of staff though. (and still don't) Who did I blame? Why, myself of course.

I went for counselling, I took emergency annual leave, I tried all sorts - to help me deal with it. Nothing worked. One day I just could not face going into work and I rang in sick. (and I mean COULD NOT face it.)

The next day I felt the same, and the next. I went to see my GP who is a wonderful man. He persuaded me to take as much time as I needed to get my head together. It took three and a half months before I was able to return to work - but in a different job. It was a job I hated and despised BUT I still knew it was better than what I had been doing before.

Now I have found a job I love....

I have a daughter at university too and I understand completely the need to have to be there financially. My daughter's grant chack was late - I HAD to bale her out or she would have had no money for food.

But saying that, there are other ways of earning money. It does not have to be doing a job that is killing you (and I don't use that word lightly). What good will you be to Fiona when you collapse from over-exhaustion? Also, I know you work for Social Services too and I know you are entitled to some time off on full pay.....

Please, please take care of yourself. You are precious.

Cheers,

Catrin

P.S. Perhaps you've done your bit - now it's someone elses turn.

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Morticia
Date: 03 Nov 00 - 03:58 PM

I'm sorry if I alarmed you, guys.It's pretty awful at the moment and I know your advice is good but I'm just not in a place where I can take it....Catrin, I already just had 4 months off through a fairly serious back injury and anymore would result in my services being dispensed with, I think.Truthfully, I'm not qualified to do anything else and although the money isn't great, I couldn't earn anything like it elsewhere.
Bron, I know what you're saying but I need, for myself perhaps more than her, to finish the job I started by getting Fiona through the next few years.Then I'm going to take that deep breath and start all over again in something else.Thanks for your concern but I'm a tough old b**tch and I'll get through it, specially with all the good friends I have here.Thank you.

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: SINSULL
Date: 03 Nov 00 - 04:58 PM

Morty,
We tough old bitches have to stick together. Tough it out. And keep in mind that no matter how tough it is, you have a right and a responsibilty to smile occasionally. If and when you are ready to make a job change, I promise you will discover unlimited qualifications. My experience - I landed a job in Networking without ANY training and without a PC of my own. Even I couldn't believe it when the job offer came through. I applied in the hopes of getting some guidance on how to get into the technology industry. 21 years of selling sugar and here I am. Attitude is everything.
Life goes in cycles. This is temporary. Honest.

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Helen
Date: 03 Nov 00 - 06:46 PM

Shambles,

There were moves to place a similar facility in our suburb, and a friend of a friend wanted to talk to me to get information to try to stop it. (I was working at the local council and had some dealings with the issue.) I went to his house expecting a huge NIMBY and got a whole new perspective. He works in this field so he knew the inside perspective on it, but he objected to the council and other authorities dumping the facility on our suburb which is among the most disadvantaged in our city.

He got on the committee to make suggestions on what should be done, and was very persuasive. The stance he took was that these facilities are never proposed to be placed in the suburbs of the rich and influential, but only in the lower income/disadvantaged suburbs, and then it is one more stress placed on the suburb and brings it down one more notch. Our suburb becomes the one which bears the social responsibility for the whole city - out of sight, out of mind.

He proposed a completely different form of care management for the people in the facility - I don't think he made a lot of progress in practical terms but I think he convinced many of the right people about the sense of what he was saying.

So, my suggestion is: don't put up with bearing the burden for the whole region - start demanding that the region distributes the burden more equitably.

(How are you, anyway? Haven't herd from you for yonks.)

Helen

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Hardiman the Fiddler
Date: 02 Jan 01 - 02:54 AM

refresh

~Susan via Hardi Cookie

hmmm.. new Mudname, Hardi's Cookie??

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: John P
Date: 02 Jan 01 - 05:59 AM

I find myself in the best, most meaningful job I've ever had, working for and with great people, being involved with music for a living. The problem is that I've been there for eleven years now and am usually bored, tired, irritated, and desperately wishing for something new. It is, in most ways, a great job and I know that if I switch I'll regret it within a year or so. I don't make a lot of money, but I make enough to live on (frugally) and put a bit aside. Taking time off without pay is not an option.

I find myself coming off a year with lots of gigs, where I played lots of good music for lots of great people -- but I am irritated when I look at the money that came in and realize that the only gigs that pay me close to what I am worth are corporate background music gigs or wedding background music gigs. I hate playing background music.

I know I need a break from both jobs, but I've already used up more than my allotted vacation time at work desperately trying to get away from it enough to keep me sane. And about four years ago I tried to quit playing music professionally so I could have a life, but found that life without performing was even worse. Sigh . . . .

John

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Bernard
Date: 02 Jan 01 - 04:25 PM

Mmmm...

I've had a bad year - only one gig (just not interested anymore) and hating my job, but stuck with it.

I'd like to think this year could be better, but from where I'm standing I just can't see it...

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: GUEST,Steve
Date: 02 Jan 01 - 05:26 PM

How could I help? Everyone needs someone! Why not here?

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: GUEST,Mrr
Date: 03 Jan 01 - 01:36 PM

GuestSteve, you were already helpful in MY depression thread. CarolC, thanks for the blicky, will have to try to follow some of these links - but am at a hotel charging dollars per minute so I'll have to check those later. I've had my dose of CheerMeUp for the morning... at least, the morning I'm going through, I realize I'm not on Mudcat time. Will check back later.

MORTICIA - you ok now?

Subject: RE: BS: Burnout and Recovery Therefrom, Part One
From: Morticia
Date: 03 Jan 01 - 02:08 PM

I'm lots better than I was, thanks for asking :)I couldn't not work for Social Services but I quit the particular jobs that were becoming so difficult and life is,if not perfect ( and who's is?) much more managable.Hope things are better for everyone else too and many thanks for the support I recieved both here and in PM's.