Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar (Robert Burns, Jim McLean)

Subject: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: GUEST,Hagard MacLowlife
Date: 11 Nov 00 - 02:18 AM

I have a version of this song by the Dubliners where they have added 2 verses I think. It goes like:

I offer you nothing of silver or land,
What man can determine the price of your hand
But gin ye can say we'd be richer by far
Oh walk by me side sweet Tibbie Dunbar

Oh wilt thou become a poor beggars lady
To sleep in the heather rolled up in my plaidie
The sky for a roof and your candle a star
Oh walk by me side sweet Tibbie Dunbar...

Anyones got the right lyrics for these verses.
I'm not quite sure about it?

Hagard.

Subject: Lyr Add: TIBBIE DUNBAR (Robert Burns, Jim McLean)
From: Calach
Date: 11 Nov 00 - 06:07 AM

Tibbie Dunbar
Robert Burns (last 2 verses by Jim McLean)

Chorus; O, wilt thou go wi' me, sweet Tibbie Dunbar
O, wilt thou go wi' me, sweet Tibbie Dunbar?
Wilt thou ride on a horse, or be drawn in a car,
Or walk by my side, sweet Tibbie Dunbar?

I care na thy daddie, his lands and his money;
I care na thy kin, sae high and sae lordly;
But say that thou'lt hae me for better or waur,
And come in thy coatie, sweet Tibbie Dunbar.

Chorus

I offer you nothing of silver or land,
What man can determine the price of your hand
But g'in your consent we'd be richer by far
Oh walk by me side sweet Tibbie Dunbar

Chorus

Oh wilt thou become a poor beggars lady
To sleep in the heather rolled up in my plaidie
The sky for a roof and your candle a star
And our love for your fire sweet Tibbie Dunbar..

Chorus.

This is the way I learnt it years ago, there's a fabulous two part harmony from the Corries Version that's worth checking out.
Hope this helps. Ian/Calach

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: MMario
Date: 11 Nov 00 - 07:43 AM

I haven't sung this in years, but wasn't there another verse about a garden?

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: Abby Sale
Date: 11 Nov 00 - 09:27 AM

Interesting --- this is already an evolved version. Burns only wrote the first verse & chorus exactly as given above.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: David Coffin
Date: 11 Nov 00 - 05:28 PM

I seem to remember a Clary Croft recording, and a nice one at that, with this song on it. It might have been from a Helen Creighton collection but I can't remember and I didn't get to keep that recording when I .... well, never mind all that. David

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: DonMeixner
Date: 11 Nov 00 - 07:20 PM

Check the Corries site for the words to their version.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: GUEST,Hagard the Swede
Date: 12 Nov 00 - 11:46 AM

Thanks for your help, I shall check the Corries version Hagard

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: Ferrara
Date: 12 Nov 00 - 12:12 PM

Don't know who wrote the tune of the Corries version. I learned it from a Burl Ives songbook, which said Burl wrote the tune he used. He did the first two verses, may have added verse 2 himself.

Unfortunately I have a bad habit (ask my husband!) of "borrowing" song books from the library and leaving them in random inaccessible spots about the house. So, can't check right now.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: GUEST,Liam's Brother
Date: 12 Nov 00 - 11:06 PM

As Abby stated above, Burns wrote only the first verse. I first heard the song about 26 or 27 years ago at a concert in Cambridge, MA presented by Peter Johnson. Declan Hunt was the singer. I believe this would have predated recordings by The Dubliners, for example. I put the song in my collection, A Bonnie Bunch of Roses, because its a great song but particularly because of the extra verse.

The air is "Johnnie McGill," said to be, as I recall, the composition of a fiddler by that name from Burns' native Ayrshire. I recorded the song in 1976 with a group named The Flying Cloud.

All the best, Dan Milner

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Nov 00 - 10:37 PM

Forget the Corries, the best version of Tibbie Dunbar was done on the Complete Songs of Robert Burns, by Ian F Benzie from Old Blind Dogs.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: GUEST,Bruce O.
Date: 13 Nov 00 - 11:01 PM

As Dan Milner notes above, the Scots claim "Johnny McGill" was composed by a Scots fiddler by that name, Town Piper of Girvan, however, under that title the tune is first found in 1778 in Scottish sources. The tune is in a London stage production of 1772 (The Irish Fair, and in later sources) as "Blarney Castle" and later found in Irish collections as "The Black Rogue/ Rogue Erra Duff". ABCs of all are in file T1.HTM on my website. (T020A-C) See The Irish tune title index on my website for other titles of the tune.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: GUEST,Jim McLean
Date: 26 Jul 02 - 01:45 PM

I have to confess that I wrote verses three and four. At the time I was road manager for the Dubliners and worked with Scott/Soloman as a writer cum dogs body (1966. Jim McLean

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: MMario
Date: 26 Jul 02 - 02:00 PM

Thanks for the information Jim!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: Genie
Date: 26 Jul 02 - 03:10 PM

There used to be a Portland, OR group called Howlin' Gael that had this song on their "Rant and Roar" album, as I recall. (The group changed composition over the years of their existence, but I believe the group on the album included Mary Benson--a fabulous singer--and the late Robert (Bob) Kotta.) I haven't heard other versions, so I've nothing to compare it to, but their version was great. I don't know how many verses they did, nor could I "name" the tune.

Genie

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: GUEST,Pat
Date: 26 Jul 02 - 07:36 PM

I agree with 'Guest' who said that Ian F. Benzie did the best version of "Tibbie Dunbar" on the Complete Songs of Robert Burns. Foot tapping stuff.

Subject: Lyr Add: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: Liam's Brother
Date: 26 Jul 02 - 11:32 PM

Well, Jim, I know this as a two verse song with no chorus and what's usually called a two-strain melody. Verse One was written by Burns:

O, wilt thou go wi' me, sweet Tibbie Dunbar
O, wilt thou go wi' me, sweet Tibbie Dunbar?
Wilt thou ride on a horse, or be drawn in a car,
Or walk by my side, sweet Tibbie Dunbar?
I care na thy daddie, his lands and his money;
I care na thy kin, sae high and sae lordly;
But say that thou'lt hae me for better or waur,
And come in thy coatie, sweet Tibbie Dunbar.

Did you write what I would call Verse Two?

I offer you nothing of silver or land,
What man can determine the price of your hand
But g'in your consent we'd be richer by far
Oh walk by me side sweet Tibbie Dunbar
Oh wilt thou become a poor beggar's lady
To sleep in the heather rolled up in my plaidie
The sky for a roof and your candle a star
And our love for your fire sweet Tibbie Dunbar.

If the answer is "yes" Jim, that's some great work.

All the best,
Dan Milner

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: GUEST,Jim McLean
Date: 27 Jul 02 - 04:32 AM

Yes Dan, I wrote it. I know what you mean about the number of verses. As you say it's really a two part single verse as there's no chorus. Thanks for your kind words. Burns said he made songs like a gunsmith puts a gun together, possibly from old parts, changing the barrel for instance. In the sixties I did just that and thre are lots of songs around I have 'adjusted', hopefully for the better. Cheers, Jim McLean

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: Liam's Brother
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 12:15 AM

Well, Jim, I'm going to dust off "your" song again. I can only tell you it was THE one that made the lasses weak at the knees 30 years ago.

Love to meet you sometime. Where do you live?

All the best,
Dan

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: GUEST,Jim McLean
Date: 28 Jul 02 - 04:43 AM

Hi Dan, Thank you for your kind words. I got married in 1966 so maybe you are right about the song's effect! I live in North London. Cheers, Jim McLean

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: ianfb
Date: 19 Sep 03 - 08:15 PM

I recorded Tibbie Dunbar under the watchful eye of Dr Fred Freeman
( producer of the Linn Records / Burns Collection ) and he only gave me eight lines as per the original but I do think that Jim McLean`s extra verse does add to the song.....nice one Jim.

Ian F Benzie

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: RiGGy
Date: 20 Sep 03 - 12:50 PM

Thanks heading your way, from me, too, Jim, for adding another marriage to the books. My wife fell for me at the Castle Folk Club [San Francisco] when I sang your verse, learned from Dan's recording. I never realized it started with Declan Hunt in Cambridge. I could've learned it sooner, had I been listening !
Riggy

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: GUEST,Ron Dunbar
Date: 31 Oct 03 - 10:41 AM

The only version i have heard is Dubliners. Never heard it until a couple months ago. I'm a young folk singer in NC and have just started playing it myself. My version sounds nothing like the dubliners so I'm very interested in hearing some of the other versions mentioned here. Great 1st verse. Wonderful addition with the second verse. Excellent tune. Brilliant song. I do imagine it was a huge hit with the ladies, as my wife loves it! Thanks for all the info here.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: Jim McLean
Date: 31 Oct 03 - 05:29 PM

I've just seen this thread again --- was it over a year ago?
The actual lyrics I wrote were :

'...but gin ye consent we'd be richer by far,
Oh will ye gang wi' me sweet Tibbie Dunbar?'

A small change to that printed above.
Jim McLean

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: Henrik W.
Date: 01 Nov 03 - 07:12 AM

Davy Steele recorded an excellent version of Tibby Dunbar on his "Chasing Shadows" album. Well worth buying.

Henrik

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Apr 04 - 06:03 PM

Absolutely!!
Hello to all...

Brian Brooks (ex-Flying Cloud etc....)

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Dec 04 - 02:13 PM

I know this is a very old thread. But I play folk on my guitar, and I have been trying very hard to find this some way of playing this song on guitar. I've only heard the Dubliners version, and it sounds very fiddle-oriented and not so much of a guitar sound to it. Difficult stuff to translate (to guitar), very difficult without any sheet music or tablatures to cheat off of as well. So if any of you could help me that would be great.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: Susanne (skw)
Date: 07 Dec 04 - 05:31 PM

Mudcat threads are never old - they mature.

Sorry I can't help you with the music, though. Someone else will before long!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: MMario
Date: 07 Dec 04 - 07:21 PM

Sheet music at numachi.com - Yet Another Digital Tradition.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: Ferrara
Date: 08 Dec 04 - 12:08 AM

Hmmm.... That isn't Burl Ives' tune, wonder if he made up a tune too?

And, he repeats the last two lines of each stanza, with different tune, as in " Wilt thou ride on a horse, or be drawn in a car,
Or walk by my side, sweet Tibbie Dunbar? " Guess his version is NOT what Burns had in mind, ... but I like it.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Dec 04 - 05:52 PM

ah much obliged. all of you. Thank you very much. This has always been one of my favorite love songs.

-P

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: GUEST,rdunbar
Date: 22 Jan 06 - 12:31 AM

I laugh. My surname is Dunbar, one of my dogs is Tibbie (the other is Ruggles)
Just getting out info for a Robbie Burns night, and came across the poem/song. Poor dog will be serenaded all evening; perhaps she will enjoy it!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: sciencegeek
Date: 09 Aug 06 - 02:11 PM

oh wow....

Dan as I've told you and Bonnie many a time.... I just love your singing of Tibbie Dunbar...

and I even named one of my Highland cows that I bred & raised, Tibbie Dunbar, in honor of the song.

So... is that Flying Cloud album a CD yet?????????

hint hint if it's not... do we need to start a petition???

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Sep 07 - 07:40 PM

I love the song. Thank you Jim. I will sing it to my love tomorrow.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: masato sakurai
Date: 05 Sep 07 - 11:30 PM

From Dick's The Songs of Robert Burns, p. 363:

No. 35. O, wilt thou go wi' me, sweet Tibbie Dunbar. Scots Musical Museum, 1790, No. 207, entitled 'Tibbie Dunbar. Tune, Johnny McGill.' The MS. is in the British Museum. In Law's Museum MS List, Burns has written 'Mr. Burns's old words.' Nothing is known of the subject of the verses, which were written to illustrate the melody. Riddell's Note (not Burns's) in the Interleaved Museum is 'This tune is said to be the composition of John McGill, fiddler, in Girvan.' An old song in the Merry Muses is marked for the tune, the first stanza of which is:--

'Duncan Macleerie and Janet his wife,
They gaed to Kilmarnock to buy a new knife;
But instead of a knife they coft but a bleerie:
"We're very weel sair'd," quo' Duncan Macleerie.'

The nationality of the tune is disputed; on some slender evidence it is claimed as Irish. In Scotland it is now best known with MacNeil's song, Come under my plaidie. The music is in Campbell's Reels, 1778, 31, and Aird's Airs, 1782, ii. No. 119.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: dilly daly of Adelaide
Date: 31 Aug 09 - 10:20 PM

MMmario has given us a link above at numachi.com for the tune to this great song.Any suggestions on what chords to use or how to go about selecting the chordfs that go with the tune,-fumbling in the dark-help please!Incidentaly it's great to find a website with so many knowledgable people.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: Jim McLean
Date: 01 Sep 09 - 10:47 AM

Here's a site with chords, hope it helps.
Tibbie chords

Subject: Lyr Add: SWEET TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 02 Sep 09 - 08:34 PM

From The Songs of Scotland, Ancient and Modern, Vol. 2, by Allan Cunningham (London: John Taylor, 1825), page 338:


SWEET TIBBIE DUNBAR.

O wilt thou come wi' me,
Sweet Tibbie Dunbar?
O wilt thou nae hae me,
Sweet Tibbie Dunbar?
Wilt thou ride on a horse,
Or be drawn in a car,
Or walk by thy lover,
Sweet Tibbie Dunbar?

I mind nae thy daddie,
Sae high and sae lordly—
I mind nae thy kindred,
Wha bear them sae proudly:
Say only thou'lt take me
For better for waur,
And come in thy coatie,
Sweet Tibbie Dunbar!

O see yon green mountain,
Beneath yon bright star?
O see yon moon shining,
On turret and scaur?
Oh haste thee, and mount thee,
For we maun fly far;—
It is time to be going,
Sweet Tibbie Dunbar.

O far have I ridden, love,
All for to see thee;
And much have I bidden, love,
All to be near thee;—
For he that loves truly
Maun dree and maun daur,
So come now or never,
Sweet Tibbie Dunbar!

Burns wrote the first verse of this pleasant little song to a pretty west-country air called "Johnie Macgill," and sent it to the Museum. I have not heard who the heroine was, nor has the song succeeded in becoming a favourite, yet there is much ease and some gaiety and nature about it. The person who composed the air was a Girvan fiddler; his name was Johnie Macgill, and he gave it his own name. The idea and some of the words of the song are old.

Subject: Lyr Add: TIBBIE DUNBAR
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 02 Sep 09 - 09:15 PM

This can be seen with its musical notation in The Scots Musical Museum, Vol. 2, by James Johnson, New Edition with added material by William Stenhouse (Edinburgh and London: William Blackwood and Sons, 1853), page 216:


TIBBIE DUNBAR.
Written for this Work by Robert Burns. Tune, Johnny McGill.

O wilt thou go wi' me, sweet Tibbie Dunbar?
O wilt thou go wi' me, sweet Tibbie Dunbar?
Wilt thou ride on a horse, or be drawn in a car,
Or walk by my side, O sweet Tibbie Dunbar?
I care na thy daddie, his lands and his money.
I care na thy kin, sae high and sae lordly:
But say thou wilt hae me for better for waur,
And come in thy coatie, sweet Tibbie Dunbar!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: Jim McLean
Date: 03 Sep 09 - 04:55 AM

Jim, I first saw Burns' words in Johnson's SMM way back in the 60s and that's when I added my verse, the whole song was then recorded by Luke Kelly of the Dubliners. I didn't know Allan Cunningham had also added to Burns' original.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: Mr Happy
Date: 03 Sep 09 - 08:46 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CSYLB1Tk4Y

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: dilly daly of Adelaide
Date: 03 Sep 09 - 11:38 PM

Thanks Jim, now i can have a go at this great song.That's a great link.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: Jim McLean
Date: 04 Sep 09 - 05:17 AM

I don't know what happened to my link, posted above. When I tried it today I got a different page. I'll try it again but if it doesn't work then the tune to look for is the first version of Sweet Tibbie Dunbar on that site.
Sweet Tibbie chords

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: GUEST,Lucia Garner
Date: 07 Nov 09 - 09:25 AM

Here are the words of "Sweet Tibby Dunbar"" from the album "Second Wind" sung by Howling Gael .

O Wilt thou go we' me sweet Tibby Dunbar
O wilt thou go we' me sweet Tibby Dunbar?
We'll ride on a horse or be drawn in a car,
Or walk by my side sweet Tibby Dunbar.
I care nae your daddy his land or his money.
I care nae your kin sae high and sae lordly.
But say you'll be wi' me for better or waur
And come in your coatie sweet Tibby Dunbar.

I've naething to offer in siller or land.
What man can determine the price of your hand?
But gie me consent, we'll be richer by far.
O wilt thou go wi' me sweet Tibby Dunbar?
O wilt thou be known as a poor beggar's lady,
And sleep in the heather rolled up in my plaidie?
The sky for a roof and your candle a star.
My love for a fire, sweet Tibby Dunbar.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: Jim McLean
Date: 07 Nov 09 - 11:28 AM

Did Howling Gael credit me with writing the second Half?

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: meself
Date: 07 Nov 09 - 01:33 PM

Wonderfully poetic lines, Jim. Of course, she'd be crazy to go with him under those conditions, but - maybe she is crazy ... !

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: Jim McLean
Date: 07 Nov 09 - 06:11 PM

I saw the LP for sale on Ebay and asked the seller what the credits were. The song was down to Burns completely so there goes another few pennies in roylaties (and recognition).

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Tibbie Dunbar
From: buddhuu
Date: 10 Nov 10 - 04:18 AM

Sorry to drag up an old one, but I just found this thread while searching for the second verse lyrics to Tibby Dunbar.

A friend posted a Confucius quote on his Facebook status:
‎"With coarse rice to eat, with water to drink, and my crooked arm for a pillow—is not joy to be found therein? Riches and honors acquired through unrighteousness are to me as the floating clouds."

and I wanted to respond with the related sentiments in verse 2 of Tibby, so I checked the lyrics for accuracy compared to my memory.

Anyway, the point of the rambling post is to pay respects to Jim for writing the addition to Burns's song. IMHO, Jim, you eclipsed the man himself with those last two lines.

Glorious stuff.

I confess that, before reading this thread, I had believed that the whole thing was written by the great Mr B.

I live and learn.