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I hate drums

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GUEST,Bob 06 Dec 00 - 08:09 PM
GUEST,Gene Krupa 06 Dec 00 - 08:13 PM
GUEST,Buddy Rich 06 Dec 00 - 08:27 PM
GUEST,recycled 06 Dec 00 - 09:04 PM
Sorcha 06 Dec 00 - 09:08 PM
GUEST,Marcus Campbus Bellorum 06 Dec 00 - 09:15 PM
ddw 06 Dec 00 - 11:39 PM
paddymac 06 Dec 00 - 11:50 PM
Clinton Hammond2 06 Dec 00 - 11:52 PM
Troll 07 Dec 00 - 12:12 AM
Sorcha 07 Dec 00 - 01:43 AM
GUEST,Dita 07 Dec 00 - 03:27 AM
John P 07 Dec 00 - 07:10 AM
Tig 07 Dec 00 - 05:34 PM
McGrath of Harlow 07 Dec 00 - 07:16 PM
WyoWoman 07 Dec 00 - 07:28 PM
Little Neophyte 07 Dec 00 - 07:40 PM
McGrath of Harlow 07 Dec 00 - 07:47 PM
sophocleese 07 Dec 00 - 08:17 PM
WyoWoman 07 Dec 00 - 08:58 PM
Little Neophyte 07 Dec 00 - 09:19 PM
Midchuck 07 Dec 00 - 09:44 PM
blt 07 Dec 00 - 11:53 PM
GUEST 21 Jul 11 - 08:54 AM
Soldier boy 21 Jul 11 - 11:29 AM
GUEST,Suibhne Astray 21 Jul 11 - 11:43 AM
Spleen Cringe 21 Jul 11 - 12:03 PM
Big Mick 21 Jul 11 - 12:22 PM
Bobert 21 Jul 11 - 01:21 PM
Mavis Enderby 21 Jul 11 - 03:40 PM
Banjiman 21 Jul 11 - 04:14 PM
gnu 21 Jul 11 - 04:30 PM
kendall 22 Jul 11 - 07:36 AM
banjoman 22 Jul 11 - 09:26 AM
GUEST,punkfolkrocker 22 Jul 11 - 10:36 AM
kendall 22 Jul 11 - 11:14 AM
Bobert 22 Jul 11 - 10:17 PM
GUEST,punkfolkrocker 22 Jul 11 - 10:50 PM
Janie 22 Jul 11 - 11:44 PM
gnu 23 Jul 11 - 01:08 PM
GUEST,josepp 23 Jul 11 - 01:54 PM
Big Ballad Singer 23 Jul 11 - 06:24 PM
gnu 23 Jul 11 - 07:32 PM
Roger the Skiffler 24 Jul 11 - 01:04 PM
GUEST,ollaimh 24 Jul 11 - 01:27 PM
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Subject: I hate drums
From: GUEST,Bob
Date: 06 Dec 00 - 08:09 PM

It is a relief to go to festival and not hear drums beating away aimlessly in the background, behind every tent, on stage and in the carpark.

I reckon it sounds like a team of carpenters building a new house.

Man I hate drums.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: GUEST,Gene Krupa
Date: 06 Dec 00 - 08:13 PM

Excuse me,Bob,while I use your head for a snare


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: GUEST,Buddy Rich
Date: 06 Dec 00 - 08:27 PM

Drummers' ethos is as bad as the sounds they make.

Hey, folk music is anti-intellectual enough without bringing drummers onto the scene.

Give em a hammer and send em to the that building site.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: GUEST,recycled
Date: 06 Dec 00 - 09:04 PM

I say, give 'em their own festivals about 10 miles away from everythinge. One or two small hand drums or bodhrans in a song circle are one thing. 10 groups of 20 drunken fools banging on loud instruments are worse than a nuisance. They are close to justifying homicide.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Sorcha
Date: 06 Dec 00 - 09:08 PM

Well, Drunken Drummers, that is a different beast altogether. I think I could sympathize, especially after midnight..........


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: GUEST,Marcus Campbus Bellorum
Date: 06 Dec 00 - 09:15 PM

Drums dont kill music and festivals people do.

Take the word drums out of what has been said above and insert the word negros.

See what I mean.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: ddw
Date: 06 Dec 00 - 11:39 PM

A group of cultural anthropologists were making their way up the Amazon in search of a tribe to study. In the distance they heard drums.

"What do the drums mean?" one of them asked their native guide.

"Don't worry," the guide replied. "As long as you hear the drums, everything will be OK."

The drums kept up most of the day. Then, just as the boat was about to enter a long tunnel of foliage growing over the water, all the drums stopped.

Alarmed, one of the anthropologists turned to the guide, who was looking quite terrified.

"What happens now?" the anthropologist asked.

"Now," the guide said, "comes the bass solo."

cheers,

david


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: paddymac
Date: 06 Dec 00 - 11:50 PM

Marcus - I think you are way wide of the mark. Drumming, after all, is a thing people do volitionaly (maybe even maliciously), while membership in some racial category is non-volitional. The former you choose, the later you're born into.


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Subject: I and drums
From: Clinton Hammond2
Date: 06 Dec 00 - 11:52 PM

Drumming... the hearbeat of the human race...


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Troll
Date: 07 Dec 00 - 12:12 AM

Drums,like anything else, can be overdone. Unlike most acoustic instruments, a group of drums tends to carry a long distance. Those people who want to have a drumcircle should be aware of this and plan accordingly.
As our society becomes more crowded we must all respect the rights of others. Drummers are being put in the same category as the guy with the boom-box car or the ultra-loud engine with straight pipes.
They must realize that their music, in the midle of a campground, means that on one else can enjoy THEIR music. Take it somewhere else and bang away.
After all, a drummer IS a musicians best friend.

troll


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Sorcha
Date: 07 Dec 00 - 01:43 AM

Thank you Troll. Drums in the darkness......ooowwee, what a turn on......the BEAT coming out of NoWhere.........


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: GUEST,Dita
Date: 07 Dec 00 - 03:27 AM

I've heard a good session ruined by a couple of non-sympathetic drummers

I've heard a wonderful singing session drowned into non-existance by a bunch of highland pipers starting up next to it, mid-song.

I've heard a singer drowned out by someone starting up their own song at the next table.

I've been singing an unacompanied ballad, with my guitar on my knee, when someone across the room decides I need a strict 4/4 guitar backing (accent on the on beat).

Like Marcus, I don't hate drums, pipers, singers or guitarists, I hate insensitive people behaving insensitively.

love and sensitivity, john.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: John P
Date: 07 Dec 00 - 07:10 AM

Guest Bob,
It sounds like what you don't like is drum circles, not drums themselves. I get heartily sick of drum circles as well, and I am a percussionist. That said, I have been involved in some great drum jams with other drummers that involved playing quietly and listening to each other. Neither activity is usually present in drum circles.

On the other hand, being part of a drum circle seems to provide some important spiritual/primal experience for the people involved, even though it looks to me like they are all indiscriminately playing as loudly as they can in an effort to be heard above the the thunder. I think maybe it allows the non-musician to connect to the part of themselves that the rest of us access by playing music.

John


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Tig
Date: 07 Dec 00 - 05:34 PM

As a dreaded bodhran player I was given some very sound advice when i started playing some 30 years ago. One drum in a session is great, two can work well, three think hard about it and four forget it. I only wish more people learned this rule because I've been to more times where the music has been spoilt by inconsideration than enough.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 07 Dec 00 - 07:16 PM

Tig's right, it's numbers that are the problem, with drums or any other instrument. More than two guitarists together and you're asking for trouble, same with mandolins, banjos...

Compounded by the problem especially with bodhrans, where, just because you've bought one from a music stall that afternoon, it doesn't mean you haven't a bit of learning to do before you're ready to drown out everyone else in a session in the evening, together with 14 other people who bought bodhrans as well.

The exception to that generalisation is/are the bongos. In my opinion two bongos are one too many - and of course, if you're playing one set of bongos, you're playing two bongos, since the drums come in pairs.

Yeah, and I know there are people who like to get tiogether in drumming circles and play lots of different drums together. They'd so better to set up a samba band, with lots of pretty costumes and that, to take the edge off the drumming, and provide enjoyment for other people.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: WyoWoman
Date: 07 Dec 00 - 07:28 PM

I would kill to be able to play steel drum ...

ww


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Little Neophyte
Date: 07 Dec 00 - 07:40 PM

How many banjos does it take before you got too many banjos?

Little Neo


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 07 Dec 00 - 07:47 PM

One is fine, and very welcome. Two if people really know how to listen to each other and play together. More than that and I'm off to the bar.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: sophocleese
Date: 07 Dec 00 - 08:17 PM

Yeah but McGrath you'd be there anyway whether it was one banjo or ten.

Its a tricky thing this sensitivity. When I first thought about trying to play the bodhran I read a book which so emphatically stressed the need to be sensitive and not obtrusive that I didn't play in front of others because I didn't want to give them a distaste for the instrument. I need to learn to be looser, make mistakes and experiment loudly in front of other people.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: WyoWoman
Date: 07 Dec 00 - 08:58 PM

Yeah, well, I also might commit minor carnage to be able to play the bodhran as well as, say, P.J. Swan. I think it adds a lot to many of the songs I like, but I have this wee problem of not being able to sing and play an instrument at the same time ...

And drumming circles can be lots of fun, even if they're loud and out of control -- I mean, isn't that at least part of the point? We sometimes need to get connected to a part of us that isn't very well-behaved. Of course, if you're in the neighborhood of folks who don't have that necessity and just wanted to get a good night's sleep, I believe that falls into the category of "rude."

ww


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Little Neophyte
Date: 07 Dec 00 - 09:19 PM

Wild.....I mean WyoWoman, how about you and I get primal!
We will beat on our bare chests as the drums align our beings into oneness.

Actually, I kind of like hanging around drum circles. If the beat starts to 'connect' it gives my core being a good wake up call.

Little Neo


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Midchuck
Date: 07 Dec 00 - 09:44 PM

As Stan Rogers so aptly put it, when he started to write the chorus for Barrett's Privateers....

Peter


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: blt
Date: 07 Dec 00 - 11:53 PM

When I've been at festivals where drum circles were intruding on the "free jam" area, I attempted to solve the problem by positioning myself at an appropriate distance so that I could improvise along with the drums. However, this has meant I've spent a lot of time in far parking lots...or in the bushes. Hard to do a lot of social jamming when located in the midst of blackberry briars.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Jul 11 - 08:54 AM

Drums are accessible & easy to play & therefore the most common & badly played. Also they are very limited musically: play a tune on drums - thump thump thump thump.. . Wow.

Even where drums potentially have a musical role it is the lack of skill & dynamic control that ruins music. Drums are loud & noisy by nature. With relatively little skill drums are suited to tribal, marching & heavily amplified stadium music. The exceptionally skilled are able to finesse & tame the dynamics to enhance music's pulse without assaulting every other instrument & ear: examples are common in latin, jazz orchestral but less so in other genres.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Soldier boy
Date: 21 Jul 11 - 11:29 AM

Drums as a musical instrument to create rhythm and beat came well before any other musical instrument on the planet and are therefore the founding fathers of all forms of music, song and dance.

Without such primal rhythms created from the dawn of mankind and infused into our consciousness none of what you like to hear, play or dance to would have evolved and exist now.

So stop beating up the drums me hearties and give them some well deserved respect.........



Mind you.... I do agree about too many very badly played and off beat Bodhrans in sessions!!! If you can't respect the drum and play it well you are probably best to not even try in public until you can.

Chris


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: GUEST,Suibhne Astray
Date: 21 Jul 11 - 11:43 AM

Couldn't the same be said of any instrument? Love music - love drums - love life.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sk3EexefGOs


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Spleen Cringe
Date: 21 Jul 11 - 12:03 PM

I hate drums?

In the words of the great Razzy, "I hate hate... but good lord above, don't you know I love love!"

RAZZY


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Big Mick
Date: 21 Jul 11 - 12:22 PM

With ya, Razzy. I dislike folks that are not listening, or who do not understand that it isn't about the drum, the guitar, the bouzouki. It is about the tune or song that is being done. Much depends on the circle or session you are in. My opinion is that when one sits in, they should always determine by asking or observation, what is acceptable. I have played the bodhran for years. It, like whistles, is easy to play, but difficult to play well. Knowing that this leads to a bad rep for this instrument, if I see several folks already in with the 'hran I just sit it out. And no matter what instrument I am picking up, I watch carefully the person leading/singing to make sure I am only enhancing what THEY are doing.

As to the title, I LOVE DRUMS!

All the best,

Mick


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Bobert
Date: 21 Jul 11 - 01:21 PM

I'm with Mick...

I an old 60's rockers who started out playing drums back in the 50s and I LOVE 'UM...

Now a days, I have them rigged up so I can play them exclusively with my feet to accompany the various stringed insturments I also play...

Drums rock!!!

B~


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Mavis Enderby
Date: 21 Jul 11 - 03:40 PM

Lack of skill & dynamic control?


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Banjiman
Date: 21 Jul 11 - 04:14 PM

Drums are fine, it's those pianos I hate. Even one is far too many!


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: gnu
Date: 21 Jul 11 - 04:30 PM

Great links... love THAT link Burton!

Hran on!


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: kendall
Date: 22 Jul 11 - 07:36 AM

What is a drummer? a guy who hangs out with musicians.

Almost every program on tv that deals with history now has that incessant pounding in the background.
Give me a person who plays an instrument well, has a song that says something and screw the drums. Rhythm and timing are part of being a good musician.
I know a guy who sings in 2/4 time and plays guitar in 3/4 time. Nerve jangling.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: banjoman
Date: 22 Jul 11 - 09:26 AM

I walked out of a NW team because they decided that any person not dancing in the current dance was a "Musician" and could play the bass drum. Drums are ok when played properly but most people fail to accept that drumming is just as much a musical skill as is needed for any instrument( and that includes the banjo)


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 22 Jul 11 - 10:36 AM

Bass drums, Snares, and even Hi-Hats in the right hands are reasonably ok...

But I hate Cymbals !!!!!!

and those prissy tinkly hanging rows of little chime bars
and other assorted irritating drum kit percussion accessories
that are supposed to denote mature sophisticated clever tasteful snobby show-off fusion music styles of drumming..

..sadly far too popular in contemporary folk rock bands...


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: kendall
Date: 22 Jul 11 - 11:14 AM

The only real difference between music and noise is organization. They are both sound vibrations.
Pluck a string that vibrates at 440 and it can be pleasant. Kick a garbage can and well, you get the point.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Bobert
Date: 22 Jul 11 - 10:17 PM

Man, GUEST punkfolkrocker... You got it all wrong... Anyone can learn with very little effort to beat on a drum... Mixing cymbals in separates the real drummers from the wantabees... And the high hat is the sharp end of the cymbal menu... Crash being the other...

B~


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 22 Jul 11 - 10:50 PM

Maybe I am bitter and twisted but I will always hate the shiny metal ear piercing deafening bastards !!!!

A therapist might trace it back to an unpleasant youthful experience
meted out by an abusive drummer...

..that wicked deviant.. he hit the cymbal so viciously hard
it went flying off it's stand
and as it hit the stage the sharp spinning edge sliced clean through my amp mains cable
plunging me into silence mid power chord...


truly happened when I was about 19..
and I think that was the time I got a nasty electric shock
trying to hastily & drunkenly repair the cable in the dark at the back of the stage..


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Janie
Date: 22 Jul 11 - 11:44 PM

I love drums.

I may sometimes hate some drum sessions - but I love drums.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: gnu
Date: 23 Jul 11 - 01:08 PM

"Anyone can learn with very little effort to beat on a drum"

Depends on the drum. I have had Bodhran students that I simply told, "Yer wastin yer time and money. No charge for today and no tomorrow. If DO you improve to the point that you feel you are ready to return, you probably don't need to come back." These were adults. Most of the students were young children and I always encouraged them to continue.

Anyway, I gave it up because the music school didn't like the fact that I felt students, again, usually young children, only needed a maximum of three classes to learn the basics. After that, it's all about natural talent and practice.

While the Bodhran is a simple instrument, playing one "pleasantly to the ear", solo or accompanying is far more difficult than many others. I can prove it... read this thread, or just it's title, and Bob's yer uncle.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: GUEST,josepp
Date: 23 Jul 11 - 01:54 PM

I've been a drummer most of my life but they can be a nuisance. We used to have these buskers around here that would gather on a corner and bang drums all damn day. If you're trying to play your guitar--forget it. You can't be heard above the din which is audible for several blocks. It sounds like one of those old half time marching bands except it goes on forever and ever.

Finally,this spring, the cops started breaking them up and they've thankfully disappeared. I think the business owners complained because it was so damned loud. If it was just a small acoustic act with guitar, fiddle, bass, harmonica and a small trap set, that wouldn't be a problem but it was 6 guys with big toms and snares playing the same rhythm over and over again for half an hour then breaking for 5 minutes and then going at it again for half an hour. And they always attracted the biggest crowd to add insult to injury.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Big Ballad Singer
Date: 23 Jul 11 - 06:24 PM

A drum, as in a bodhran, or even sets of drums like bongos or congas, can be ok, most of the time.

DRUMS, plural, however, in the "drum set" context, are almost always impossible to "jam" with, unless you and the drummer are into very similar kinds of music, or you're dealing with a highly sensitive, adaptable listener.

Otherwise, it just turns into one person playing guitar or what have you, and the drummer just trying out every rudimentary pattern he knows until something like a sympathetic rhythm emerges... maybe.

I've always said and will continue to insist that a song WITH drums that doesn't hold up when played WITHOUT drums is just not a good song; it's an exercise in rhythm with chordal or melodic instruments being subjected to the time signature and tempo.

Take, for instance, many of Metallica's songs. (I'm SERIOUS!) Many of them can be played solo on acoustic guitar with no loss of feeling or depth of meaning of the songs. That's mainly because James Hetfield (founder and principal writer) often writes on acoustic guitar.

Now, take much of what passes for "pop music" these days on US radio... if you took out the drum loops, etc, you'd have random splats of noise combined with someone attempting to "sing"... it would be cacophony, to say the least.

No, drums, as in individual ones, should be played with much practice and care. Drums as in sets are dangerous to all but those who have done the work to know how to make MUSIC with them, not just beats.


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: gnu
Date: 23 Jul 11 - 07:32 PM

It seems there is a general agreement that any instrument, including the human voice, played poorly, sucks big time. Not so much agreed to is the choice of instrument which the general populace doesn't like, even when played well. I would conclude that the beauty of the mucic is in the ear of the listener.

Your mileage may vary.

Hran on!

... or strum or blow or whistle or sing...


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: Roger the Skiffler
Date: 24 Jul 11 - 01:04 PM

Hate drums? Get a washboard player!

RtS


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Subject: RE: I hate drums
From: GUEST,ollaimh
Date: 24 Jul 11 - 01:27 PM

i hate em too. good bodhran palyers are as rare as hens teeth. most people get a bodhran and bang it straight four four to everything and wonder why you stopped playing.
i think drumming is mostly self treatment psychotherapy. i have nbeen to so many music events where there were several intrunment players jamming well then the drummers show up and get so loud they drive all the musicians away. and the audience, but they seem never to notice.

i loved a skilled bodhran player . they can really hold a set of jigs or reels together, especially with amateur players of varrying ability. unfortunately most drummers don't realized that you need to practice and learn the drums as much as any other instrument.

you know what the irish say
q"how do you play the bodhran"
a "with a razor blade"


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