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Tune Req: Kalenda Maia

GUEST,leeneia 13 Jan 01 - 10:58 PM
MMario 14 Jan 01 - 12:21 AM
MMario 14 Jan 01 - 12:24 AM
John P 14 Jan 01 - 09:11 AM
GUEST,leeneia 14 Jan 01 - 07:48 PM
Snuffy 14 Jan 01 - 08:05 PM
Malcolm Douglas 14 Jan 01 - 08:13 PM
GUEST,leeneia 16 Jan 01 - 07:50 PM
MMario 16 Jan 01 - 09:36 PM
GUEST,Guest BardJudith 12 Apr 01 - 10:26 AM
Q (Frank Staplin) 08 Jul 11 - 05:52 PM
GUEST,leeneia 08 Jul 11 - 05:59 PM
GUEST,leeneia 08 Jul 11 - 06:04 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 08 Jul 11 - 06:43 PM
Jack Campin 08 Jul 11 - 07:18 PM
GUEST,leeneia 09 Jul 11 - 08:34 AM
Q (Frank Staplin) 09 Jul 11 - 12:51 PM
MorwenEdhelwen1 09 Jul 11 - 06:41 PM
MorwenEdhelwen1 09 Jul 11 - 06:43 PM
keberoxu 27 Apr 18 - 03:45 PM
GUEST,Mick Pearce (MCP) 27 Apr 18 - 06:35 PM
GUEST,Phil d'Conch 27 Apr 18 - 09:16 PM
Helen 28 Apr 18 - 05:05 PM
Helen 28 Apr 18 - 08:59 PM
GUEST,keberoxu 29 Apr 18 - 05:56 PM
Jack Campin 29 Apr 18 - 06:55 PM
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Subject: Kalenda Maia, anyone?
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 13 Jan 01 - 10:58 PM

I chap I know wants me to play the medieval song "Kalenda Maia" with him on February 2. I have tried three search engines and the Digital Tradition, and cannot find a MIDI for the tune. (I don't need the words.) If anyone here could add the tune to the data base so I can see the notes, that would be great.

Google thought I could find it on eBay, but I don't think so.


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia, anyone?
From: MMario
Date: 14 Jan 01 - 12:21 AM

is this it?

click me

url=http://carme.krotal.org/catala/audicions/kalenda%20maia.htm


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia, anyone?
From: MMario
Date: 14 Jan 01 - 12:24 AM

if not there is a midi here I could convert if you can't.


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia, anyone?
From: John P
Date: 14 Jan 01 - 09:11 AM

I don't know about online sources or communicating via MIDI, but I could mail you the sheet music if you like. Email me your street address if you need me to do so.

An interesting thing about Kalenda Maya is that it works very well both in 3/4 time and in 2/4. We used to do it slow and dreamy in 3/4 and then jump into a quick and rhythmic 2/4.

John


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia, anyone?
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 14 Jan 01 - 07:48 PM

Thanks, John and MMario. This is the score so far -- I can print the music at the carme.krotal site that MMario provided, but the tune seems to be an unusual variant. It is quite different from what I have on tape and what I have heard on recordings and at recitals.

The second version mentioned, the one at www.cam.org (the page with the Tower of Babel on top) is just right. However, I can get it to play, but I can't seem to save it as a MIDI file. The drawing of a tape player doesn't have a file button of its own, so when I save, all my computer saves is the lyrics in a text file.

So if anybody knows how to convert that song into a MIDI file, please let me know.

PS I have the "convert MIDI to text" feature on my computer, but it doesn't work. I guess it converts MIDI to ABC only.


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia, anyone?
From: Snuffy
Date: 14 Jan 01 - 08:05 PM

It converts the binary data in a midi file to normal text numbers, for posting here, and the other half of the program allows the rest of us to re-constitute it as a midi.

Have you tried right clicking on the midi on the web-page and selecting (I think) Save Target As?

Wassail! V


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia, anyone?
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 14 Jan 01 - 08:13 PM

I had a look, and right-clicked on the midi-playing thing at the bottom of the page, which gave me an option to "save as"; which I did.  It worked.  That was using Netscape.

Malcolm


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia, anyone?
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 16 Jan 01 - 07:50 PM

Thanks for the tip on right-clicking. I tried it, and my computer agreed to Save It As... That's the good news.

The bad news is that the MIDI file it saved consists of 12 staffs of music, all of them with many strange rests scattered thoughtout, and none of them with the melody.

I give up!


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia, anyone?
From: MMario
Date: 16 Jan 01 - 09:36 PM

I think I have the melody line - if you have an e-mail address I can send it.


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia, anyone?
From: GUEST,Guest BardJudith
Date: 12 Apr 01 - 10:26 AM

If your local library or university has a half-decent CD collection, try THE DEVELOPMENT OF WESTERN MUSIC anthology, Volume I, Disc 2. The fourth song is 'Kalenda maya', vocal and instrumental. The accompanying spiral-bound book has the music and lyrics. Hope this helps!


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 08 Jul 11 - 05:52 PM

Mistaken start of an old thread?
Thanks, I quite enjoyed the different renditions on youtube that I would not have heard without this prompt.


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 08 Jul 11 - 05:59 PM

Glad to hear it, Q.

Here's a page with MIDI's and images of famous medieval pieces, including Kalenda Maia.

http://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/vladislav/filk/


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 08 Jul 11 - 06:04 PM

I'm wondering. Kalenda Maya (or Maia) means the calends of May, or the first day. The ides were the middle day.

Is there a word for the end of the month?

And are other people like me, in that the only use of 'ides' they ever heard is in Shakespeare's 'Julius Caesar' where a seer says to beware the ides of March?


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 08 Jul 11 - 06:43 PM

Having been fiddling around with Caribbean music recently, I know that Kalenda is a form of stick-fighting practiced in Haiti.

"Stick-fighting May," or Kalenda Maya in the native Creole, was a dangerous lady who flattened competitors who came near her lovers with her quarterstaff. She is imortalized in the dance of the same name.
(Don't believe my story?)


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia
From: Jack Campin
Date: 08 Jul 11 - 07:18 PM

The end of the month would be Pridie Kalendas, I guess.

http://ancienthistory.about.com/cs/calendars/a/romcalterm.htm


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 09 Jul 11 - 08:34 AM

Thanks for the link, Jack. That's interesting. It brings to mind a society where people didn't have paper around, couldn't read, but could look at the moon and tell the 'date.'

I'm reminded of something I learned in a class on European history. When the Romans realized their calendar had become seriously maladjusted over time, they started over, beginning with a one-time, extra-long month. Landowners wanted to pay farm laborers the usual monthly wage, (because it was just one month) but they wanted extra rent money from them for the same period of time (because it was more than 31 days long.) There were riots.

It seems to me that the Romans did a lot to destroy their own empire.
=============

No, Q, I don't believe you about the dangerous Caribbean lady. Nice try, though.


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 09 Jul 11 - 12:51 PM

A very good summary of the Roman calendar and its changes is given in Wikipedia (surprise). Very interesting.

Roman calendar

The African word kalenda in Haitian Creole (and similar spellings on other islands) has the same spelling as the word in Kalenda maia, but there is no relationship.


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 09 Jul 11 - 06:41 PM

Q, I was thinking the same thing :). When I saw this thread, I thought, "Kalenda? As in stick-fighting? Oh..." .


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 09 Jul 11 - 06:43 PM

But it still is an interesting discussion. I never knew that medieval songs like this existed.


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia
From: keberoxu
Date: 27 Apr 18 - 03:45 PM

Here's a YouTube link to Musica Reservata performing Kalenda Maya.

Medieval music is outside my area of expertise.
I have read elsewhere that this song/dance dates to the 12th century
and that the lyrics are sung in "Occitan" or "Provencal."


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia
From: GUEST,Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 27 Apr 18 - 06:35 PM

By Raimbaut de Vaqueiras. The razo (a prose introduction that was often attached at the start of troubadour songs, often giving biographical details - real or fictional) give the story of the origin.

"You have certainly heard who Raimbaut was and where he came from and how he was knighted by the Marquis of Montferrat and how he paid court to Lady Beatrice and on account of his love lived joyously.
And hear how he experienced during a short time great sadness. This was caused by the false jealous ones who found love and courting displeasing. They spoke to Lady Beatrice in the presence of the other ladies saying: "Who is this Raimbaut de Vaqueiras even though the Marquis made him a knight? And how dare he court so high born a lady as you are? Be it known that it is not an honor either for you or for the Marquis." They said so many evil things (as bad people do) that Lady Beatrice became angry at Raimbaut de Vaqueiras. So when Raimbaut tried to woo her and ask her pity, she did not listen to his prayers, but to the contrary told him that he should woo another lady who would be more appropriate for him and that she would no longer listen to him. And that is the sadness Raimbaut had during a short time just as I told you at the beginning of this razo.
So he stopped singing and laughing and withdrew from all activities that might please him. That was too bad. All this was caused by the tongues of gossips, just as he tells it in one stanza of the estampie you will hear.
At that time two jongleurs came from France to the court of the marquis who were skilled at playing the vielle. And one day they played an estampie that much pleased the marquis, the knights and the ladies. But Raimbaut did not enjoy it. The marquis noticed this and said to him: "Sir Raimbaut, why do you not sing and rejoice since you are listening to a fine sound of the vielle, you see here so beautiful a lady as my sister who has retained you as her servant, and she is the noblest lady in the world?" And Raimbaut replied that he would do nothing. Now the marquis knew why, and he said to his sister: "Lady Beatrice, for the love of me and of all these people, I want you to agree to beg Raimbaut, in the name of your love and your grace, that he be happy, that he sing, and that he enjoy himself, like he
used to." And Lady Beatrice was so courtly and of such good grace that she begged Raimbaut, encouraging him, for her sake, to be happy again and to again make a song.
So Raimbaut, for the reason you've just heard, made the estampida that runs like this:


(from Rosenberg, Switten, leVot: Songs of the Troubadours and Trouveres.)

They say that despite the razo calling it an estampida (estampie) it is not in that form, possibly explained by the tune coming from the heard instrumental of the razo.Also, it could be argued that the tune for Kalenda Maia might be the only surviving pre-13th century piece of instrumental music.

The text appears in several manuscripts, the tune in only one. You can see the melody in the Troubadour melodies database: Kalenda Maia. (Some info on the encoding there can be found here:
Encoding Song in the Troubadour Melodies Database


There is some freedom in the interpretation of the tunes (only some 260 or so have known melodies) are most have only a simple melody recorded and the rhythm is open to interpretation. (There was some rhythm but either performers knew what it was (conventionally) or the scribes were unable to note it down).


Mick


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia
From: GUEST,Phil d'Conch
Date: 27 Apr 18 - 09:16 PM

Q: “I know that Kalenda is a form of stick-fighting practiced in Haiti….

The African word kalenda in Haitian Creole (and similar spellings on other islands) has the same spelling as the word in Kalenda maia, but there is no relationship.


afaik kalenda (calinda) is not an African nor particularly Creole word. Loosely speaking it's the Roman Catholic (Latin) tradition of holy days (holidays.)

eg: The formal, ritualized Caribbean stick fighting competitions are (mostly) held during the French Roman Catholic canboulay (cannes brulées) carnival season.

The Western traditions, Saturnalia & prize fighting inclusive, go back much further than the Latin titles. They were Greek, Jewish, Egyptian &c before that.

Same word, same meaning, same tradition.


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia
From: Helen
Date: 28 Apr 18 - 05:05 PM

If you like this sort of music, I can recommend the beautiful music played by
Hesperion XXi & Jodi Savall

I also have this music in one of my harp sheet music books, which is probably by Deborah Friou but I'd have to go through my books to check which one.

If I have a midi that I want to work with, e.g. isolate the melody line from the accompaniment lines, I use music notation software like Noteworthy Composer, which is very useful and clever despite its cheap price.

Helen


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia
From: Helen
Date: 28 Apr 18 - 08:59 PM

Wrong again!! Ooops!!

Kalenda Maya is on the Water Spirit CD by Kim Robertson and also in her sheet music book.


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia
From: GUEST,keberoxu
Date: 29 Apr 18 - 05:56 PM

Helen -- nice to know I'm not the only Mudcatter who messes up. LOL


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Kalenda Maia
From: Jack Campin
Date: 29 Apr 18 - 06:55 PM

Staff notation in this collection:

http://www.gaita.co.uk/tunebook.pdf
I meet with the editor of that every week if you have any questions.   It would only take a few minutes to put that into ABC.

Critical examination of what we can actually be certain about with this song (from an active Mudcatter):

https://earlymusicmuse.com/kalendamaya/

You can guarantee that any version offered only as MIDI will be trash.


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