Knocky Door Ginger

Subject: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Bun
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 11:27 AM

As a child, this was a game I enjoyed, much to the annoyance of my neighbors (knock on a door and run away). In a way I am doing the same as I have a half day and have to leave now. But I wondered what games you used to play before things like TV etc took over
Bun

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: catspaw49
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 11:39 AM

Lots of board games, lots of card games. Outside games of Tag and Hide and Seek. Just thinking on this one a moment brings back stunning flashbacks of being 8 years old in a small midwestern townat dusk. Summertime smells and huge old trees, a group of kids playing hid and seek.........I remember games covering a block, You knew to stay out of some yards, but most people didn't care. Old Man Rectanus and his wife hiding me on their porch and not telling on me.......Man its like yesterday. I don't know if it ever got better than that.......................

Spaw

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: mousethief
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 11:46 AM

Knocking on the door and running away we referred to as "Ding Dong Ditchit."

In my neighborhood we played a LOT of board games, usually in Mikey Sipila's carport (or inside if his mom was home), or my garage. Our faves included Monopoly (of course!) and Life and Mille Bornes.

This was on rainy days (and we're talking Seattle here).

Other days we rode bikes a lot, played in the woods (I lived in a "lollipop" neighborhood that was surrounded on all 4 sides by woods, at least at first), played tag football or baseball or basketball in the street, and such.

Ah. Sweet childhood memories.

I envy children that carefree existence. Like Matt_R, for instance.

Alex

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Bun
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 11:48 AM

Really got to go, but what you said....its like another world being a kid and totally involved in your game - nothing comes close. I too remember summers that lasted too long, with all the smells, ice cream, dust, lonf, long days - and parents had no worries about where you were and who you were with it so much more relaxed.
Sod it I really have to go - check this thread out in aboout 8 hours time.
Bun

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: MMario
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 11:55 AM

Kick the Can; Sardines; How deep is the mudhole?; Dare the Turtle; Shark!!!; Monopoly; MEGA-Monopoly (one board, cards from 4 sets);

we also spent a lot of time wandering around the salt marsh and the swamp next door. also playing tag in the ruins of the grist mill.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Troll
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 12:01 PM

Kick the Can. All the cousins from 5 to 17, outside my grandfathers house in the dark. The yard was about two acres in size with lots of trees and bushes to hide behind "Bogging" in the marsh or exploring tidewater creeks in our row-boats.
Wish I could go back there but it's gone now.

troll

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: mousethief
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 12:15 PM

Oh. Hide and Go Seek. Hours and hours of it.

Alex

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Les from Hull
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 12:31 PM

In Hull we called it 'knocking off Ginger'. Hide and seek was (and probably still is) called 'block'. Our fave kids' game would be eggety budge, which I think was short for 'bad egg if you budge', a game which combined throwing a tennis ball at your friends and spitting. We've always been just that bit different.

Les

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Bardford
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 12:50 PM

Knockadoor Ginger = Nicky Nocky Ninedoors or nocky nocky ninedoors where we played in a small town in the mountains of B.C. I seem to remember it as a late summer/early autumn pasttime. I can almost, but sadly, not quite, smell the leaves of the hedges and the grass next to the rock wall in Terry's yard we used for cover. Daytime we'd go 'bush-honking' on our bikes through a forested area which was destined to progress into a subdivision. They paved paradise...
What about "anti-anti-I-over", wherin a ball was thrown over the roof to palers onm the other side. Do I remember this, or have I made it up?
Thanks for the memories,
Bardford

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: bill\sables
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 01:38 PM

Koncking at the door and running away in my area of Co. Durham England was called knockey nine door. We used to play it in a slightly different way. As most of the houses were occupied by coalminers who used to come home and take off their boots at the door and walk around in their stockings, we used to collect a quantity of dog shit which we would wrap in newspaper and place on the doorstep. We would set the paper on fire and then knock and run to somewhere where we could watch the fun. The miner would find, on opening the door, this burning newspaper and would then proceed to stamp it out with his stockened feet. They were usually furious when they found they had stamped in a load of dog shit.
Bill

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 01:43 PM

Fivestones, otherwise known as Gobs. (Similar to Jacks, but with small clay cubes rather than metal thingies.) There was thread about them recently.

But mostly trunning around and chasing each other, sometimes formalised into various games like He or British Bulldog. (The Indians have a great variation of this called Kabadi which is played as an adult sport and on the telly and all.)

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Mrs.Duck
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 03:41 PM

We called it knock down ginger but were never as wicked as you bill!!!!!I remember fivestones. I was quite good at it! And what about chasing games? We used to play 'it' or'he' which round here is called'tig' ( I lived in Essex as a child and am now in Yorkshire) and if you wanted a rest you could cross your fingers and shout 'veinies' and then you couldn't be 'had'. And then there was two balls. I was good at that as well. Throwing two balls against a wall and singing such rhymes as 'Over the garden wall' and'Archibald king of the jews' and the batteries never ran out!!!!!

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Les from Hull
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 04:22 PM

Mrs Duck - you shout owt like that up 'ere and you'll be shouting to yersen!

Acutally the Opies (Peter and Iona) did a map of Great Britain by children's truce terms. Fainites and the like is very southern. We had 'Kings'. You'll find that 'catters up and down the land had different ones. Weird that.

Les

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Mrs.Duck
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 04:27 PM

We're a weird lot Les

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 04:51 PM

Good map.And there's some parts where it's "Barley" (cf parley as in Parliament. In public (ie private) schools it's "pax", which I suppose is what little Romans would say. (And the Romans played fivestones too. Knucklestones is the other name for the game.)

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Gervase
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 05:27 PM

Bill, love it! Used to do exactly the same thing as a kid (No wonder I was the sort of kid my mother told me never to play with!)
We called the knocked game "Knock Down Ginger" and wold sometimes finesse it with a piece of fishing line tied across the road with another piece of line joined to the middle which we'd hold, sitting behind a wall or a hedge. One tug, and two puzzled, pissed off householders (there seemed to be far fewer cars then - you'd never be able to do that today, I'm sure). For much of that, you have to see the Opie's wonderufl book, the Lore and Language of Schoolchildren - it's a nostalgic's dream and a wonderful source of material, some of which must go back hundreds of years.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Gervase
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 05:28 PM

Bill, love it! Used to do exactly the same thing as a kid (No wonder I was the sort of kid my mother told me never to play with!)
We called the knocker game "Knock Down Ginger" and wold sometimes finesse it with a piece of fishing line tied across the road with another piece of line joined to the middle which we'd hold, sitting behind a wall or a hedge. One tug, and two puzzled, pissed off householders (there seemed to be far fewer cars then - you'd never be able to do that today, I'm sure). For much of that, you have to see the Opie's wonderufl book, the Lore and Language of Schoolchildren - it's a nostalgic's dream and a wonderful source of material, some of which must go back hundreds of years.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Gervase
Date: 17 Jan 01 - 05:57 PM

Oops, double post. Must've been that piece of fishing line.
Now just let me get this little flaming parcel off my mouse-mat......

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Fibula Mattock
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 04:54 AM

We called the knocking and running away game "Thunder and Lightning" (knock like thunder, run like lightning).
Then there was kerbsie (throwing a ball at the opposite kerb and trying to get it to bounce back to you - elaborate scoring system involved).
"Sevens" (throwing a small ball against a wall in a variety of different ways, first seven times, then six etc., then repeating all the ways with one hand only).
Queenie-O, Queenie-O, who's got the ball-ee-O? (or "Ali Bali, who's got the ball?).
Hopscotch.
A variety of obstacle courses usually involving a very high wall and a stream.
Skipping to various chants. (Tying one end of the rope to something if there was only me and my sister.)
Playing "Robin Hood" and making bows and arrows (none of us ever wanted to be Maid Marian - we all wanted to be Robin).
Clapping games.

Er, this was only 15 - 20 years ago...

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 05:29 AM

Pretty boring name round near us (Salford, Lancs)- knock-a-door-run - although I have heard the thunder and lightening term before.

Simillar to Bills dogsh.. on a paper, a drawing pin (thumb tack) fastened to the thumb latch with dogsh was a favourite. Disgruntled occupier goes back indoors using thumb latch - drawing pin pierces thumb - sucks thumb... yuc!

Better, and more devious, was divil up'th'drainpipe. Wad of newspaper inserted into cast iron downspout and ignited - imagine the roar caused by the updraught!

Best prank as young teens though was refilling a hole in the road dug by council workmen - 3 nights running!

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Roger the skiffler
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 05:32 AM

My mother-in-law's cousin, known to all as Uncle Frank, emigrated to US, having met and married a Wellesley girl in the 20s, and worked a as a science teacher in New Jersey . He used to tell the tale of a bright electronics class he had who made a zapper that would work everone's automatic garage doors and they used to cruise down the streets sending everyone's doors up and down- a sort of modern-day version of the game.
RtS

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 05:56 AM

BTW, Bun, (see BS: What do you call your bread? ) are you realy a bun or a balm-cake, bread-cake or tea-cake???

Dave the Gnome (Of whom some say, fruit cake...)

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: KingBrilliant
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 06:03 AM

I think we just called it playing Knock. Usually my big brother would initiate it & us sisters would get caught. We didn't do anything with dogshit though - how I wish we'd thought of that!!!
However there is a game of getting dogshit on a stick & flicking it at eachother which has similarly regionalised names. In Reading Berks UK it is called 'Shit-Wanging' whereas in Liverpool I'm told it was 'Shitty Stick'. I remember playing cowboys & indians, & zulus & natives. All probably very politically incorrect. Also a chase-game called Stinky-Pooh, where I always seemed to be the designated poo.
My sister once convinced me we were playing 'Aliens from the planet Moronia' and had me walking around stiffly and mono-toning 'I am a moron' for days..... I'll never forgive her for that!
Childhood is a wonderful thing, full of humiliations and dogshit.....

Kris (oh yeah, and granny played a mean game of pontoon. And my brother had psychic control of the dice in Monopoly).

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Trevor
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 06:23 AM

It was 'Knock-Down Ginger' in the black country where I grew up. My favourite variation was to tie pieces of string to two adjacent doors, line all the milk bottles up just in front of the doors and then bang the knockers simultaneously. Brilliant chaos with neighbours coming out together, bottles rolling down the street and so on.

It was 'ollies' with us when you couldn't be had, and we also used to play 'Hot Rice', which was like Tig with a ball. Whoever was 'on' (decide by everybody standing in a huddle, the ball being dropped in the middle and whoever's foot the ball rolled on to - us wily ones always made sure we were on the uphill side of the playground) threw the ball at people who, when they were hit joined the 'on' team. The ball, usually a tennis ball which had lost all its fur, didn't half hurt when it hit between the knee and bottom of short trousers on a chilly day. Kids of today - don't know they're born!

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Bun
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 07:11 AM

I tried that trick with the dogshite last night............the neighbors are not too happy about it.
Did you ever play with loads of elastic bands tied together?

DTG - I am definitely a french stick!

Bun whi is called bun because he is as cute a bunny wabbit(bollox)

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: JulieF
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 07:37 AM

Lots of elastic bands tied together - Chinese Skipping !!!. I haven't thought about that for years. The elastic bands were tied to make a large loop. Three or four girls ( and it almost always girls ) stood with the loop round the back of their legs ( usually at ankle level or if you moved it up you leg it got harder). This made a sort of square or triange with the girls at the corner. The rest of the girls made their way round by jumping on the band. Very big when I was about 11 or twelve. I don't remember being any good at it al all.

Julie

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Grab
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 07:56 AM

Ball-tig, sure. And it was always "barley" where I grew up.

Our playground was laid out with football/netball courts, which gave rise to a game called "line tig", where you were only allowed to run along the lines. Standard lines were too restrictive though, so someone acquired some chalk and drew in some more lines which made it more difficult for the catcher.

Our school had a big craze for marbles for a few months, and we got quite a complicated "value" system for the various types of marbles. If someone got a particularly exotic marble then there was always some haggling to work out its value. Eventually they were banned after someone chucked a "dobber" (a big marble - don't know where the name came from) through a window.

Football (soccer) stickers were another one - I suppose this makes it obvious that I was a child of the 80s! :-) Complicated values systems for the stickers there too - a standard player was worth 1, team pictures were 2 (I think) and team badges (which were metal-foil) were 3. But then there were Scottish players where you got 2 small pictures on a sticker, which were worth 1 1/2, and Liverpool stickers were always worth more. And every year had some "special" stickers - somehow we all knew what they were worth without really talking about it.

It's odd how kids will avoid learning rules-based stuff like maths like the plague, but given half a chance they'll invent game rules more complex than anything an adult could come up with!

Grab.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Michael in Swansea
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 07:59 AM

It was 'Bobby Knockers' in Swansea, it still is. Other games Hide and Seek, Devil up the Drainpipe, Dandies (what we called fivestones),lots of others.
Anyone else make throwing arrows? A length of bamboo about 15 ins long with a headless nail stuck down one end cardboard flights at the other and launched using a knotted piece of string, dangerous!
Built a wall across a building site once, not very high only about 4 bricks but across the width of the access road. That was fun.

Mike

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Giac
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 08:19 AM

Interesting about the expression and crossing one's fingers for a rest or a time out. When I was a child in western Arkansas, we would cross our fingers and shout, "King's X." Everyone accepted it, never thinking, or caring, that the gesture was that old or had traveled across an ocean. Thanks, Mrs. Duck and others, for background on one of life's mysteries.

Such a rest was necessary when playing Kick The Can, Red Rover Cross Over, Dare Base, Hopscotch or Skip Rope.

Another summertime 'game' was to see who could sail a dried frog the greatest distance. The frog husks were obtained from the highway after an appropriate mummification period. After a frog had been run over for days, with air temperatures around 90-100 F for several days, it would be lifted (or scraped with a shovel) from the pavement. Then individuals, or 'sides' would take turns sailing the frog. We tried it with cats, but usually they were too icky, what with flying hair and all, but they were good for swinging on a rope (I think Mark Twain mentioned that pastime in Tom Sawyer).

Of course, we also sailed cow chips, and bombarded each other with horse droppings. Dang! I miss all that.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 08:27 AM

I had forgotten all about throwing arrows but I now remember them - exactly as M in S describes. Pretty damned long ranging and accurate they were too. We also made 'gat guns' (gat, for some reason being our term for catapult) out of scrap wood and innertube elastic. Bit difficult to describe but I will send plans to anyone needing a serious assault weapon...

It was 'Barleys' in Swinton btw. We also used to cry 'Two-Ten' if we were touched by anyone with mange - go figure as they say in the US.....

DtG

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 09:10 AM

Elastic bands and rulers - and inky paper-missiles made by folding paper and dunking it in the ink well. Poor little sods don't have ink wells these days. Or desk tops youi can surreptitiously bang, or hide behind.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Snuffy
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 09:18 AM

It was always Barley and cross your fingers when I was a kid - Stockport/Macclesfield area. We played ordinary tick, ball tick, ticky-off-ground (where you were automatically barley if you were off the ground), and another one where everyone who'd been ticked joined on in a big long line. And Kick-Can-1-2-3.

Wassail! V

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Ella who is Sooze
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 11:56 AM

We used to call it Postmans knock. And I remember playing it in a block of flats. Great... we'd start at the top floor... do the one nearest the stairs... run down one flight and hide in the corner under the stairs... then do the next floor and so on.

If it wasn't that, then we would be in the Rhododendron forest running around being wild... climbing the pine trees... and chasing some wild ponies...

If it wasn't that... then we'd get in the big round metal bins about 6ft tall, that had wheels on them and free wheel down the hill.

Also, british bull dogs - I broke my ankle playing this game...

Tag, Stuck in the mud, some daft game with a name similar to galloping gut rot... Lazzies - lots of elastic bands tied together to skip in and out of...

Oh... the THE BEST GAME.... Star Wars... I always got to be princess Layah (or however you spell her name)

Also, in another forest, we were explorers of the amazon, and spent hours disturbing big red ants nests... teasing other wildlife, and finding puff balls to stamp on.

Hide and seek, cricket, rounders, footie, riding on our bikes in a big gang... and knocking a load of plastic soldiers over with a football to score points.

Running away from my friends deerhound/irish wolf hound thing that used to floor me everytime it came near me.

And Kerbie... hitting the kerb with a football from the other side of the street.

oh, and running round a ruined old mansion pretending we owned it.

Wow them were the days... thanks for making me remember

And yes I was a bit of a tomboy, when I was younger.. Had to be really, there were not many girls around where I lived...

Oh... one more....

Run across the field before the bull gets you...

oh... dreamy dreamy days

Ella

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Bert
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 12:22 PM

OK, Mrs Duck, What are the RULES for Gobs. Seems like everyone can remember the rules to Knock Down Ginger.

Grab, that's 'cos most math teachers aren't really smart enough themselves to realise that math is all a game. So they get kids trying to believe that it's real, no wonder kids don't like math.

Hey anyone remember 'milk tops' or 'fag cards'. And anyone old enough to remember playing on 'the debris'.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: LR Mole
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 12:42 PM

When they were putting the interstate through, the chunks of dried mud could be thrown at other buddies. They were termed "dirt bombs" and would disintegrate in a Hollywood- war puff of dust. Sub-inquiry: how did YOU make gun noises? My own fave was sort of a preparing-to-spit KKKKKKKkkkh. There was some scorn for those who could only sort of go "dfvv". Worse for those unfortunates who said, "dah!"How long did you have to count before you weren't dead any more?

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Bert
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 12:47 PM

Keeeoooww, or tseeooow. And it was 'lie down dead and count to twenty'

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Les from Hull
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 01:05 PM

Dave the Gnome - yes we had throwing arrows and gat guns as well. And homemade bows and arrows. We also had 'banger guns' which were actually smoothbore muskets (made by stopping up one end of a bit of gas piping, drilling a touch hole and fastening it to a wooden stock) fired with slowmatch. The black powder came from Guy Fawkes bangers.

It's just occurred to me that we were a pretty vicious lot!

Les

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 01:56 PM

Postman's Knock? That was a Kiss Chase game. Girls chasing boys generally.

Gobs/fivestones/knucklestones - started off with onesies, twosies etc, picking up and then the same putting down, (and if you were good enough at catching hem all you could sometimes skip those) but after that I can't remember whether there was an official sequel for the other tricks. I think there was, with the idea being they'd get harder, but it varied. I think every playground and street had a different unchallengably right version.

I can remember some - Nelson's Column, putting it up and taking it down. The Square, making it and then unmaking it. Under the bridge (made with the finger and thumb). Duckpond. I'm sure there were lots more.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: John Routledge
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 02:26 PM

SPLIT THE KIPPER Two boys would stand facing each other 10ft apart each with a throwing knife.Alternately they threw to the side of the others legs and if knife stuck (in ground!) the opponent moved his leg to the position of the knife.

Slowly each players legs became further and further apart. However if you threw the knife exactly between your opponents legs you would get relief by being allowed to put your legs back together again.The name of the game indicates how the game ended.

Little did we realise the danger! Happy Playing GBroon

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Morticia
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 03:19 PM

we called it knock out ginger...it was feinties and crossed fingers....I remember lethal games of conkers ( on a really cold day the skin would split if you caught your opponents fingers) and we had all sorts of recipes for making conkers harder. I remember the elastic game too but we used real elastic rather than rubber bands, and that throwing of two balls against the wall, never could get the hang of that one.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Guest Hull
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 03:42 PM

Knock down ginger,marbles - "forced to follow straight on, no bangs 'ard"- never did know what that meant! Hopscotch,Hopping Johnny, statues

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Guest,Hull
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 03:57 PM

Knock down ginger, sevens, hopscotch,eggif you budge, marbles - "forced to follow straight on, no bangs hard"-I never understood that!, sevens, stilt walking, skates, scooters: it's magic seeing the kids today on their'new' scooters.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 04:20 PM

And it was yo-yo's last year. Next year hoops?

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Mrs.Duck
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 05:16 PM

Can you still get hold of Fivestones? It would be a good one to introduce at a gathering. Perhaps we could make our own out of fimo ! And I am definitely issuing a two ball challenge to all comers at the Yorkshire gathering!!!

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: mousethief
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 05:30 PM

Last time I took part in a two-ball challenge I regretted for weeks.

Wait, that's not what you're talking about, is it?

Alex

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 18 Jan 01 - 09:18 PM

I'ver got as set in my drawer, but I haven't seen them for sale ever. They'd be easy enough to make - any old clay would do.

Actually what with yo-yos and scooters, maybe it'll be fivestones soem time. But I can'tr see how you could get a high tech one which cost lots of money. I suppose they could stick little chips inside so that they lit up and squawked, and give them bounce-on parts in Pokemon, and they'd be all the rage.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Wotcha
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 02:15 AM

Conkers were popular in my patch of London ... don't know if kids still challenge each other with horse chestnuts but it was quite fun: see who had a "Twenty-Twoer" for 22 victories -- probably soaked in vinegar and baked to harden for battle. When I lived in Germany, the Germans thought I was mad picking up horse chestnuts ...
In the late 60s, Airfix kits of airplanes/aeroplanes were popular and we'd have mass formations of kids holding either RAF or Luftwaffe fighters (it seemed the tougher kids had the German planes and would reinforce them with iron filings and thumb tacks) and literally engage in combat ... plastic strewn everywhere afterwards...
Apart from Monopoly, the game "Formula One" caught kids' imagainations hoping to become young Brabhams or Hills.
Since I went to a prep school, the game of "Hic, Haec, Hoc" was very popular -- the American version is "Scissors, Rock, Stone etc." You'd end up with a Chinese burn or slapped wrist for losing the round -- quite a silly game.
Filling out a "Compactum" recording cricket scores must rate with one of the most boring activities for kids ... but budding bankers were clearly earmarked early in life.
Dayboys smuggling candy to boarders probably rated as one of the more interesting activities of 1960s Britain ... many a latter day Spiv found a calling ...

Cheers,
Brian

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Michael in Swansea
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 04:23 AM

Just remembered another one, "Best Faller". One guy at bottom of hill "shoots" the others as they run down the hill. So there we were running down hill, stopped in our tracks crying "AAARRRRGGGGGHHHHH" clutch chest, three steps back,triple somersault and slide down hill on nose. Minor fractures were quite common.

Mike

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: sian, west wales
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 04:48 AM

Would "fivestones" be Jacks? Sounds like the same game.

And in my bit of S. Ontario, Knocky Door Ginger was, I think, Knock Knock Thief.

We used to play variations of tag - like freeze tag, What Time is it Mr. Wolf, Simple Simon Pieman, etc.

There was some other thing - Statues? - where one person would swing the others around by the hand and let go; they then had to freeze into a strange position and were judged as to which was funniest.

And I'm pretty sure our gun-shots were K-pow, K-pow. I'll bet that it depends on your age, and what kind of guns were shooting up the bad guys in your particular era. I'm a Lone Ranger generation, me.

sian

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Roger the skiffler
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 05:31 AM

All these posts bring back happy memories of the immediate post-war years.
I (though not a parent) can understand today's parents trying to minimise risk to their kids, but it seems to me most of these games would be outlawed today on health and safety grounds while an element of risk and experiencing consequences is good for personal development.
Building fires, climbing trees, making slides in the ice, using a pen-knife, playing biosterous games with no safety equipment...and all with no risk assessment, made me the person I am today (ah, perhaps, modern parents DO have a poiint!)
RtS ( I probably banged my head too many times as a child!)

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Bun
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 06:04 AM

I remember walking round the school yard, shouting "who want to play Romans and Barbarians" anyone who wanted to play linked arms and continued the shout. We used to play British bulldog until it was banned cos some softie broke their arm. We also used to swap things - scraps I think they were called
Bun

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 07:18 AM

Jacks is similar to fivestones, but instead of the clay cubes it used little metal pieces - there must be a name for the shape, a sort of cross, but in three do=imentions with a little ball at the end - and a small rubber ball. I never played it. I think playgrounds were either fivestones or jacks - a buit like Rugby Union and Rugby League. (And to complioxcate things, I think in someplaces fivestones was called jacks...)

There was a very successful adventure playground movement in the two or three decades after the war - junky places where kids could make constructions out of scrap wood, and build fires, and sensible stuff like that, with an adult or so around to keep an eye on things and be available to avoid disaster.

My impression is that councils have backed off from helping or even permitting that kind of thing, maybe because they are frighted of court cases. Though the risk of serious accidents was actually a lot less than in conventional playgrounds I believe.

Nowadays if people talk of "adventure playgrounds" it seems to be trendy play objects in shiny colours built for children to pllay on, instead of incredible junk constructions made and constantly remade by the kids themselves, like something out of Mad Max.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 07:19 AM

Jacks is similar to fivestones, but instead of the clay cubes it used little metal pieces - there must be a name for the shape, a sort of cross, but in three do=imentions with a little ball at the end - and a small rubber ball. I never played it. I think playgrounds were either fivestones or jacks - a buit like Rugby Union and Rugby League. (And to complioxcate things, I think in someplaces fivestones was called jacks...)

There was a very successful adventure playground movement in the two or three decades after the war - junky places where kids could make constructions out of scrap wood, and build fires, and sensible stuff like that, with an adult or so around to keep an eye on things and be available to avoid disaster.

My impression is that councils have backed off from helping or even permitting that kind of thing, maybe because they are frightened of court cases. Though the risk of serious accidents was actually a lot less than in conventional playgrounds I believe.

Nowadays, if people talk of "adventure playgrounds", it seems to be trendy play-objects in shiny colours built for children to play on, and rapidly get bored by, instead of incredible junk constructions made and constantly remade by the kids themselves, like something out of Mad Max.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Jock Morris
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 08:34 AM

Bun,

British bulldogs got banned at my school for the same reason. Weren't raised in Alloway were you?

Scott

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Fibula Mattock
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 08:46 AM

Our school banned it as well, except we called it "Bullrush" and the whole school (about 40 of us) lined up to play it until the injuries started.
I hated playing Kissy-Catch at school. Mainly because no one ever bothered to chase me, but also cos I wasn't in a million years going to chase them. Ahh, how times have changed...!

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: sian, west wales
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 09:08 AM

I wonder... was your Bulldog the N.Am. (Canadian?) Red Rover? We also played a lot of Dodge Ball,and Leap frog - although I wouldn't be surprised if those were banned, too!

I never did learn to skip - and definitely never double-dutch.

Oddly, one folk dance lived on in my primary school playground, sung, danced to and called, "The Grand Old Duke of York". Never even thought of it as a dance, and it was always instigated by the kids (girls) - no teacher ever showed it, so I guess it was Living Tradition rearing its lovely head.

sian

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: alison
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 09:34 AM

Fibula.. you and I must have been in the same neighbourhood... I played "Queenie-Oh" and "thunder and lightning"... did you swing round the lamp-post on a rope?....

the one with the elastic bands we called "german jumps", we also played in the street, (terraced houses)... skipping and ballgames.......

when I got a bit older (about 10)we used to play football on the golf course, and kick the can and sardines, in the garden... great fun

slainte

alison

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Fibula Mattock
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 09:54 AM

Alison, ahhhaa - we swung round trees on a rope! I grew up in a hole-in-the-hedge in the middle of nowhere (oh, alright, the bottom of the Ards peninsula - it's still the Sticks!), but my dad's from Belfast and I moved there when I was 18.
Did you do all the songs - "Fair Rosa was a lovely child" and "Green Gravel" and "In and out the dusty bluebells" and "Oranges and Lemons"? Oh, and the song that no one outside my town has ever heard: "The boat was leaving Belfast"
I'll bet if I'd been born ten years later I would've missed out on all these things. The children I take for Guides today haven't a clue about them. We taught them to skip and when we started singing "Jelly on a plate" they said "ohhh, our mum sings that". How did it all disappear?

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: alison
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 10:06 AM

hahaha....

I took brownies.. and taught them those.....

we did "in and out go the dusty bluebells" and "oranges and lemons"... we also did "the Bangor boat's away" ...

do they still skip to "Cinderella dressed in yella"????

slainte

alison

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Fibula Mattock
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 10:27 AM

No! They didn't know it! Or "Cinderella dressed in blue" ("Went upstairs to do a poo" - for some reason this amused us). They knew "Apple jelly, rhubarb tart..." but we had to teach them "On a hillside, stands a lady, who she is I do not know...". And "Had a little bubble car". Skipping is so much FUN. A couple of years ago in Belfast, at the time of the 12th, the streets were all deserted as usual. I was living round in the Holy Land (wee terraced houses between the university and the Lower Ormeau for those who don't know Belfast too well) at the time and the army were rolling up and down the street in huge trucks. It was a really hot day and since the traffic was limited my friends and I got some rope and went skipping in the street and did all the rhymes we could remember. It was EXHAUSTING though - it totally wrecks you!

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Bun
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 12:14 PM

We used to skip to England, Ireland , Scotland, Wales, Russia, Prussia, Germany. Whoever got Germany had to skip twice as fast.
We also used to do the big ship sails down the alley alley oh - and get into knots with our arms.
When playing with two balls we used to sing something about Archibald who bought hie wife a pair of shoes???
Bun

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Bert
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 12:55 PM

Nebuchadnezzar the king of the Jews
Bought his wife a pair of shoes
When the shoes began to wear
Nebuchadnezzar began to swear

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,JohnB
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 01:07 PM

Knock on the door and run away, was what we called it. Other games were British Bulldog, even played in Phys Ed (Gym)at school. Tiggy off the ground, Hide and Seek, The Alley Alley Oh, One about Farmer Farmer can we cross your Stream/Field or something. Alleys what we called Marbles. When I was about 5 years old, I got a sore ear once playing alleys with my mother on the Living room carpet. All I did was compliment her prowess at the game with the words "that was a fu*#ing good shot mum" CRACK! WHERE DID YOU LEARN THAT WORD? Balleys was the "time out" phrase, a coruption of Barleys, accompanied by the raising of both Thumbs. I wonder how much exitement the kids of today would get trying to put the batteries in the "Ludo" board, we also had a solitaire game which was played on a special board with marbles. The idea was to leave just one right in the middle. Is none else going to admit to Cowboys and Indians and last but by no means least Doctors and Nurses. JohnB.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: The Walrus at work
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 01:26 PM

This is bringing back memories. Knock down Ginger - we did have one variation. On the council estate on which I grew up, all the street doors opened inward, so we would tie the door knockers of two neighbouring houses together, knock on one, wait about a count of ten, then knock on the other and watch the reaction as one door opened, only to be shut by the other one opening and the "tug-of-war" which ensues as each householder tries to answer the knock. It worked best at the terrace ends.Trevor, I just WISH we'd thoufgt of the milk bottle trick

I remember "split the kipper" although we just called it "splits".

Does anyone remember "knuckles" or "slaps"? How about "crab football" (usually "officially" instituted, but still often enjoyed). Which versions of "British Bulldog" do you lot remember, I seem to recall at least three versions on "catching" a crosser, one just grabbing, one grabbing and lifting / throwing and one involving just hitting them with a thrown tennis ball.

Michael, I remember "Best Faller" ("Best Dead" to our lot), if you had those hills, did you ever try the tray slide? toboggoning down grassy hills either on metal trays or lengths of corrugated cardboard?

I'm getting quite nostalgic...

Good luck.

Walrus

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: The Walrus at work
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 01:52 PM

Bun,

I seem to remember:-

Archibald (bald bald) king of the Jews (jews, Jews) Bought his wife (wife, wife) a pair of shoes (shoes, shoes) When the shoes (shoes, shoes) began to wear (wear, wear) Archibald(bald bald) began to swear (swear swear) When the swear (swear swear) began to stop (stop stop) Archibald (bald bald), he bought a shop (shop shop), When the shop (shop shop)began to sell (sell sell), Archibald (bald bald), he bought a well (well well)

And that's all I can remember of it.

Good luck

Walrus

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: bill\sables
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 03:00 PM

Did any one ever roll car tyres? When I was a kid we used to collect a old tyre each and go off on jaunts down to the river swiming etc. We would roll the tyres before us and watch them smash through the woods. Somed of us could run along side the tyre and steer it with a stick and try to knock out other kids tyres. I remember one kid who was crying 'cos some big lads had pinched his tyre and he was very upset, I offered to give him my spare one when we got home but tears whelled up in his eyes as he said "How will I be able to get home without my tyre."
Did anyone have "Bogies?"
Bill

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Les from Hull
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 03:52 PM

Yes Bill - if you mean a vehicle made from pram wheels and a plank. If you're referring to those things that live up your nose, well I've still got them.

Cheers, Les

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: John Routledge
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 05:11 PM

BILL - Lovely to see you back in the real world of tyres and bogies.Reminds me of a song "Bogies Bonnie Belle". Presumably you need to be Scots to write about bogies.I was never very practical and my bogies never won anything.

Many a time we ran home frightened when a tractor tyre rolled down a steep grass hill went out of control - not dangerously so of course.

Hoping you are well recovered. John

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: bill\sables
Date: 19 Jan 01 - 06:10 PM

Les and Geordie, I do indeed mean little carts made from pram wheels and planks of wood. Mine has a car seat and a steering wheel from a Northern Bus. There was a stick stuck into the middle of the wheel with the other end pushed through a hole in the bottom plank and a bit of rope attached to the front axel and back to the stick.In theory when you turned the wheel the rope wound around the stick and turned the front axel. In practice the bugger didn't work and I crashed into the wall at the bottom of our street (Nothing much has changed in life has it)and bent the front wheels. These were the days before electric drills and tools in general and we built these carts with only a big hammer and a red hot poker straight from the fire to drill the holes.
Bill

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: alison
Date: 20 Jan 01 - 06:24 AM

we called them giders (pronounced guiders)... my dad made us one out of the wheels from my old pram......

the aussies make them too.. but they call them billy-carts...

slainte

alison

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Michael in Swansea
Date: 20 Jan 01 - 06:59 AM

Oh yes, tobogganing down the hill on cardboard, one of lifes simple pleasures. Thanks Walrus I'd forgotten about that.
Of course Cowboys and Indians and Doctors and Nurses in the bushes in the local park.
My three sisters,(one older, two younger), and myself used to do an occasional variety show for Mam and Dad and the neighbours. A couple of songs, a tapdance, a recitation and a play(?)
Fond memories.

Mike

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Penny S.
Date: 20 Jan 01 - 07:03 AM

The old school desks with a hole in the base for cleaning purposes, allowing a ruler to be inserted, resting on the knee, so the lid could be pushed up and down with apparently no human interference. Am I glad they've gone.

I was interested in the electronic knock-down-ginger version. There was a time I thought I might be a victim, and I'm still not sure.

I had a wireless door chime, an early version, which turned out to eat batteries at a rapid rate, a set every two days or so. Fortunately, it had a mains option, so I kept the receiver plugged in via a transformer. There was one other person in our road with the same model, several hundred yards away. (I know 'cos of collecting for charity - the owner was an elderly lady, not a fast mover.) After I had it a while, I had a single ring, and when I went downstairs, there was no-one there. I looked around, and there was no sign of anyone about. This began to happen again on occasion, but never with any trace of anyone in sight, and I did check the rough ground opposite, and the playground next door. The game doesn't work unless the result is observed, does it?

One evening, I had some visitors - an astrophysicist from NASA, and some others from Cambridge (England), and we began to get rings roughly every hour. No-one there. We tried with the mains disconnected. No ring in the predicted sequence. We thought it might be a regular blip in the mains current, perhaps due to a thermostat, with the trip temperature being sub-hourly, and I put up a notice requesting visitors to ring twice.

The phantom began to ring twice. The regular pattern stopped. Still no trace of visitors or observers. I changed the notice to ring three times.

And so it did, and then one evening successively increasing the numbers of rings to five. I approached a nearby AA repairman to ask if he had been working on the electrical system of the broken down car, thinking it could have been sparking and producing a signal. No good. I called the electricity suppliers to find if there had been any current changes which could account for the problem. No good.

I took the product back to the shop.

The problem remains unanswered. Except that I now have a wireless light switch system, and that is showing odd interference, too.

Penny

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Penny S. (testing a new connection)
Date: 21 Jan 01 - 12:04 PM

A friend has reminded me that the mad evening when the rings increased in number was one when we were discussing the problem in the room where it rang, and when we mentioned changing the sign to three rings, that was when it went up to three!

I also got caught yesterday at the shopping mall, I think. A bunch of lads were hanging out by the lifts (elevators), using mobile phones for something. I walked up the first level, as the only lift was filling with smokers, floolowed by one of these boys, then got in, pressed the button to go up further, only to arrive down on the ground floor again, to be met by the boy who had followed me up, grinning all over his face. It was the hilarity which made me suspect game playing. Was I mad!

Penny

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,JohnB
Date: 21 Jan 01 - 12:24 PM

One modern version happened at work a few years ago. Every time our Little boss, as opposed to the big boss who we could not have done this to went out of his cubicle. One of the guys would go in there and remove the microphone part of the telephone from the handset. He would come back, the phone would ring and he would answer, the person at the other end could hear nothing. This head would pop up and down from his cubicle shouting there's something wrong with this $#%#^* phone again. This went on many times during the course of a week or two we stopped when he called the phone repair people. To this day he is unaware of what was really going on. If you try this and get fired, don't blame me. JohnB. It is even easier these days with the plug in handsets and a piece of Scotch tape.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Penny S. (testing a new connection)
Date: 21 Jan 01 - 12:28 PM

My, aren't young males inventive?

Penny

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 21 Jan 01 - 02:28 PM

Anyone go in for "Grotters"? My wife tells me about that -she'd make a little arrangement with flowers and coloured things, and sit by the side of street - "Penny for the Grotter!", like for a Guy, but a different time of the year.

She says that it was only years later she realised that "grotter" was "grotto".

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Metchosin
Date: 21 Jan 01 - 02:55 PM

Bardsford, you are not making it up, only we called it Annie-Annie-I-Over and if the ball didn't make it over the top of the roof you yelled "Pigtails" and if you caught an incoming ball you ran around the building and tagged the person on the other side, but I can't remeber what happened next.

A variant was played in Junior High over the school roof (by someone whose name I won't mention) with a large rock. There was a loud crash of broken glass and it wasn't untill 30 years later, when talking to an old school mate, that he recounted the time he was sitting in the drafting room at lunch, working on a project, when a large rock came through the skylight and landed on the desk in front of the teacher. Seems it shook up Mr. Bagshaw quite profoundly.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: R!
Date: 21 Jan 01 - 04:05 PM

As a child I lived on a one-block street with over thirty other kids (it was a mostly Catholic street) and an empty lot at one end. There were endless games of hide and seek, kick-the-can, mother may I, red rover, tag, three feet over Germany, baby in the air, and wolfie wolf what time is it. Girls playing as a group played hop scotch, jacks, clapping games, jump rope, Chinese jump rope - with the rubber bands - and double Dutch jump rope.

My old china, who turned 72 on Friday, regales me with stories of his childhood games which included capture the flag and the aforementioned milk bottle and dog sh*t pranks. They also tied neighbors' front and back doors closed, using the neighbor's clothesline, of course. There were also a lot of high jinks involving dressing in black and darkening faces with burnt cork to evade capture by the bicycle-riding constable. His stories make growing up in the thirties sound so much more exciting than growing up in the fifties. Still, wouldn't it be fun to run around barefoot some summer evening, carefree and laughing, catching fireflies in a jar?

Thanks for the memories, Reen

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Lin in Kansas
Date: 21 Jan 01 - 06:40 PM

Growing up in Texas, Cowboys and Indians was a given--but two older brothers ensured that I was always the Indian--who always lost, of course. But then, that did let me do some memorable death scenes!

King of the Mountain, skip rope, jacks, Horse (with a basketball, shooting from the Free Throw line), Kick the Can (on the courthouse green). Whenever it snowed (which was every winter) one of the older kids would "borrow" his dad's pickup and an old barn door he kept just for the purpose, tie the barn door on behind the truck, and take everybody sleighriding at around 25 MPH. We always made it a point to turn loose and fall off at the corners of the town square, because the snowdrifts were deeper there.

Riding inner tubes down Wolf Creek--we didn't bother the cottonmouths if they didn't bother us. That was especially fun when Wolf Creek flooded--the currents under the bridge could be very interesting!

Stealing watermelons from the farmer who had his land posted "No Trespassing"--always an exciting adventure. Ray-Ray and I left rather large pieces of our bluejeans hanging on the barbed-wire fence one year when the farmer's shotgun went off...fortunately, he was aiming up. (He knew his thieves were kids, and we heard him laughing for a long ways as we ran away.)

Too much fun...I can't recall ever spending much time indoors if the weather was even half-way decent. We never seemed to have much to do (it was a VERY small town), but we were always busy, usually having fun.

Thanks, Bun! I needed that!

Lin

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Ebbie
Date: 21 Jan 01 - 09:19 PM

We were a farm family and since my dad was a horse trainer a lot of our games involved horses: stick horses, leg horses, wire horses, pony horses, army... Each version required a different 'story'.

We also had acorn fights, with acorn-filled coffee cans tied to our waists. Our shields were garbage can lids and boiler lids. Many a welt was raised on exposed skin.

We played the 'anti' or 'annie' over game too but I think we called it alley oxen free. Or maybe that is what we shouted when one made it successfully around the shed?

We played cowboys and indians a lot. A few years ago I was talking with a tall, handsome Sioux and told him that when we played it, the Indians were the favored side. He sighed and said, We just played Indians and Indians.

Indoors (this was in the 40s) two games that I remember were Rook and Flint. We weren't allowed 'playing cards'.

We also boxed (no hitting in the face) - as the only girl born in the middle of three boys, my oldest brother boxed me whilst on his knees.

We did the knock on the door and run thing too. One night I saw my youngest brother slip out the kitchen door. I went silently out the living room door and crouched behind the balustrade of the porch. Here comes my brother running on his tip toes, carrying a long pole and giggling breathlessly to himself. Just as he reaches the top of the steps, I leap up with a roar. Brother screams, pole goes flying and rattling over porch, I scream- we both nearly have a heart attack.

Ebbie

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Bun
Date: 22 Jan 01 - 03:54 AM

Bill, I used to have a bogie - nearly killed me and my sister on it - steering jammmed.....
Used to slide down hills on old bits of cardboard box.

One of my fondest memories is the den that me and my mates had. It was in the roots of an oak tree and some hawthorne hedges. You climbed the tree and acted as look out(for what - I'm not sure) But even in the rain you could stay relatively dry.(You know I would love to have a den now)

All your memories have brought back such great thoughts of a much younger bun! - thanks
Bun

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Fibula Mattock
Date: 22 Jan 01 - 08:22 AM

Walrus - was the end of the rhyme:
When the shop (shop shop)
began to sell (sell sell),
Archibald (bald bald),
he bought a bell (bell bell)
When the bell (bell bell)
began to ring (ring ring)
Archibald (bald bald)
Began to sing (sing sing):
"On the hillside, stands a lady,
Who she is I do not know
All she wants is gold and silver
All she wants is a nice young man
Lady, lady birl around
Lady, lady touch the ground
Lady, lady show your shoe
Lady, lady, pass on through"

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: bill\sables
Date: 22 Jan 01 - 09:50 AM

We had a cast iron range in our house, you know the sort with a big fire and a water boiler on one side and an oven on the other, there was a sheet of enameled metal on the floor in front and surrounded by a fender to stop coals falling on the mat. When everybody took out their ranges for "modernisation" and fitted a tiled fireplaces the metal sheets made a great sledges if the front end was curled upwards. Tho only problem was that they were too fast and there were quite a few accidents where kids had come off and cut themselves on the metal edges. One kid I knew sledged right down the track onto the main road and was killed by a lorry.
Bill

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Roger the skiffler
Date: 22 Jan 01 - 10:11 AM

I don't think anyone has mentioned "highest up the wall" contests. (The boys will know what I mean!).
A skill that declines with age and prostate!
RtS (of an age when "twice a night" means something different!)

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 22 Jan 01 - 01:27 PM

Hey anyone remember 'milk tops' or 'fag cards'. And anyone old enough to remember playing on 'the debris'.

Just noticved that bert. I can't remember any ganmes with the carbdoard milktops on bottles. I can remember that the milkman had a horse and cart - think that had been brought back for the duration. (Whichju wasa phrase in vry wide use - "Are you going to be there for the duration" to anyone who was taking too long in the bathroom, for example.

Fag cards - that ciggy cards for Americans - they'd stopped issuing them with cigarettes, but kids had collections, and the game involved flicking them so thye'd land in the right place. Do they ever do that with Pokemon cards?

Playing on debris of the bomb sites. That's where the Adventure Playgrounds I mentioned earlier really started, I believe. WE had a big undergrouind shelter in the communal garden at the back of our house, and I can remember when they demolished that, after the war - climbing through the tunnels and clambering up and down the heaps of rubble.

I was too young to get into collecting shrapnel, but I can remember admiring the collections amassed by bigger boys.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Bert
Date: 22 Jan 01 - 02:23 PM

Yes, Milk Tops was the same game as Fag Cards.
You stood about eight feet from a wall and flicked your fag card or milk top towards the wall. Everyone did this in turn. If your card landed on top of another card you got to keep both. Otherwise you left your card on the ground until either someone won it or you quit playing.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: MARINER
Date: 22 Jan 01 - 02:39 PM

In my part of Ireland, Wexford town, around Hallowe'en a tradition now died out was Cabbage Stump Night.You simply raided the local gardens( people grew their own veggies in those days)for the biggest Cabbage Stumps you could find and then ran from door to door bashing them as hard as possible.This always happened on Hallowe'en, why I don't know.Around the same time, we bobbed for apples, this was fairly widespread and was known as "dip night".Another favourite was tying two doors together and knocking both at the same time.Ah! those innocent days of youth.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Bert
Date: 22 Jan 01 - 02:50 PM

And how about those wicked tin can lids. We'd punch two holes in a can lid and thread it with string. And by pulling the string you could keep the lid spinning (after winding it up first). Of course the string would wear out, and the can lid would go flying. This was not the intent of the game but was highly dangerous, especially considering that most of our can lids had been cut from a can with a Bulldog can opener.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Metchosin
Date: 22 Jan 01 - 03:08 PM

Did any one else besides me decorate the spokes of their bicycle with the foil lids from milk bottles, gold for unhomogenized, silver for homogenized, green for skimmed (I think) or attach stiff cardboard to the spokes with clothes pegs so everyone could hear you coming?

My brother and I had the best coonskin hats in the neighbourhood because of the large stock of coonskins nailed for curing on the back of our garage. Seems to me we got a fair amount in booty for trading them to the rest, who wanted the real deal not just the measly strip of skin that you got in stores. How did I ever become an advocate of animal rights?....hmmmm.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: bill\sables
Date: 23 Jan 01 - 06:47 AM

Regarding Coon Skin Hats, When I was a young'n the film "Davey Crocket" with Fess Parker was released and all the kids wanted Davey Crocket hats. This created a market for fur in the area and I remember the Newcastle Evening Chronicle running an article about the strange dissapearance of pet cats from the area. I don't know if there was any connection but some of the kids were wearing tabby or ginger Crocket hats. Mine was made from fox.
Bill

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 Jan 01 - 07:05 AM

I could do with borrowing your headgear, Bill. When I tell people I am going to the Jug in Selby they all say "Wear the fox hat.......?"

(I've waited years to get that into a conversation!)

Cheers

Dave the Gnome

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Michael in Swansea
Date: 23 Jan 01 - 10:24 AM

Okay call me a big kid but I've still got my Davy Crockett hat that Mam and Dad bought for me when I was about 4, remember it well, didn't want it wrapped I wanted it on my head. Walking through town and the big people winking at me saying "Hiya Davy". I was so proud.
Where is it now? On my Teddy's head of course.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: bobby's girl
Date: 23 Jan 01 - 05:06 PM

I think I must have grown up in Hull about the same time as Les - I remember playing Block (hide & seek)-and I've only just realised that my kids growing up in the South of England don't call it that. We called the game with the elastic bands French skipping, and we alsomplayed British Bulldog, though it was frowned on at a Girl's Grammar School - Newland High if Les remembers it.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Les from Hull
Date: 24 Jan 01 - 04:04 PM

Bobby's Girl - yes I remember Newland High School. I was at Hymers College (scholarship kid, nowt posh about me).

Another thing I remember from junior school was lots of kids with their arms linked together marching across the school playground chanting "Anybody in the road gets a big KICK". And they did as well!

Les

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Trevor
Date: 29 Jan 01 - 06:25 AM

Did anybody ever make those kite-shaped, pre-frisby skimmers out of five woven together lolly sticks.

I also became hero of the third form for hollowing out a stick of chalk and filling it with match heads. When the physics teacher drew a long straight line on the blackboard the chalk caught fire. (I'm giggling now as I'm writing this!)

I remember death-defying races down the long hill over the road from where I lived, with a book (usually an annual) balanced on a roller skate. You sat on it and steered by shifting your weight. Much more dangerous than its successor, the skateboard, and therefore more fun, especially when there were about six of us in head-to-head races. I had a cart as well, made out of a plank and four wheels. I used to turn it upside down so that it wwas lower to the ground and looked more racy. I got my first ever scar when it was in upside down mode. I was holding on to the side of the plank as me and my mate went downhill at what seemed about mach 1, and a wheel fell off, scraping my fingers down the pavement. My mom wouldn't let me go to cubs that night for being stupid.

Anybody else got any 'first scar' stories?

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Ella who is Sooze
Date: 29 Jan 01 - 07:00 AM

Trevor that is sooo funny...

The only thing I did to a teacher was balance a box on the door - so when he walked into the room it fell onto his head...

I was usually caught before I had chance to get away with my plans -

Was once caught with my head, one arm and one leg sticking out of the small hall kitchen window... It was a small village school - with a village hall which was our assembly/dining room... The boys had locked me in the kitchen - by jamming a spoon in the door.... as I was halfway out I was caught..... and told off.

Then there was the paint fight with the sqeezy bottles of paint, in the room we had been put into for being naughty, next to the head masters office... And we went mad with the paint.

Then...the peas on the dining room ceiling -

The Biology skeleton and the lumps of lamb kidney -

letting the class locusts out

what a delightfull child I was!

Got a really long scar on me leg, from leap frogging a concrete bollard, that had a bit of steel wire sticking out from it, which went into my leg - that's about 5 inches long scar now

Have another one on another leg from the barbed wire, I was jumping over, running away from the bull...

Another one on my forehead, which is a bit of dent, from playing stick in the mud... I landed on my head...

Knees that look terrible, from all the scars...

always was accident prone - and still am

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Fibula Mattock
Date: 29 Jan 01 - 07:28 AM

accident prone? Ha! Clumsy should be my middle name. Perhaps it's something to do with being tall and gangly (when younger) and having bad eyesight.
The "falling into the fire" incident when 8 months old fortunately left no permanent scars except on my poor mother's memory.
Likewise, the "getting a tin whistle stuck down the throat" when a baby has had no lasting impact, and I actually own a couple of the harmful instruments.
Splitting my head open at the age of 3 I can remember, but have forgotten any pain involved, although I have a slight scar on my forehead.
I've still got a chip missing from my front tooth from running to the (outdoors) toilets at school, falling, and being run over by a stampede of nine year olds.
Various scars on my knees from various games and the old fall in swimming pools etc.
Managed to trip over a hose while VERY drunk (sangria - need I say more) while on holiday a couple of years ago. Woke up crying the next morning with a black and blue elbow and an arm twice its normal size, severely dehydrated and only aware that I had actually tripped over something and it wasn't just because I was drunk. When I saw what I had tripped over... and the fact that it was only a yard away from the unfenced, deep and dirty marina I went into a bit of shock. If I'd pitched to the right I would have been blind (literally) drunk in deep water. That episode has seriously changed my partying habits. I have sworn that I will never again drink to memory loss stage. Worst of all, it was only the second night of the holiday. Possibly one of the worst holiday's of my life, with apologies for discribing it as such to my holiday companion at the time who often reads these threads...

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Ella who is Sooze
Date: 29 Jan 01 - 08:35 AM

well, just recently obtained a nasty shoulder injury, whilst sledging in the snow, before New Years eve on a Fisons grow bag... Was going backwards, not a planned move - but fun anyways, tried to turn back around got foot stuck on tump - Flew in the air, hit my head, and shoulder.. landing in a frozen bog, and then, went back up for another go...

Not really realising, what I had done, and the extent of the damage to my shoulder - bruising, blood blister....

And I am 27... will I ever grow up?

I don't think so...

All this was sober...ok, as much as you can be during the weeks christmas festivities, where I don't drive anywhere as I am usually slightly inibriated from the many JUST THE ONE'S I have had from all the visiting done..

Ella

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Guest, pip
Date: 25 Feb 01 - 02:30 PM

I have been trying for MONTHS to find out what "tiggy" is. The British author Reginald Hill has twice used the phrase "play tiggy with hammers" to indicate a rough school or neighborhood. So how is it played?

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: bill\sables
Date: 25 Feb 01 - 04:51 PM

Tiggy in my school was a game with a group of kids and one of them was chosen to be "on". He would then have to catch up with the other kids and touch them or "tig them" and then they would be on his side to "Tig" the others. The last one "tigged" was "on" in the next game. To play tiggy with hammers I would presume was instead of touching the caught kid you would hit him with a hammer which would only happen in a rough area.
Bill

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Hawker
Date: 25 Feb 01 - 04:52 PM

Ooooh what delicious memories of childhood! For us it was: Queen Queen Queenie O British Bulldog (until it was banned) Big Ship Sails up the Alley Alley O Jacks Marbles Conkers Tick (also known this be called tiggy) Kiss Kat Line Tag (when tagged tuo join the line) Knock 'n' run Blocky off 123 Chinese skipping various rope skipping songs and various 2 ball songs and various hand clapping songs.... Now how did they all go...... There is a CD to bring back these memories called: Children's singing Games on Saydisc. with beauties like those dipping rhymes - one potato, 2 potato 3 potato and Ip dip dip etc, 2- ball songs olicha bollicha, Mrs Mop bought a shop etc. Saydisc can be contacted at Chipping Manor, The Chipping, Wotton-under Edge, Glos GL27 7AD England, Tel: [phone] or Fax: [phone] - Enjoy!

SUFFY, where are you from then? I was brought up in Macclesfield, I went to Christ Church Primary School, Great King Street, then Macc High. Both schools no longer exist! though Macc High is now part of Kings school I believe.

Lucy

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: SINSULL
Date: 25 Feb 01 - 07:42 PM

Chinese jump rope and Double Dutch. I had forgotten about them. And ball bouncing games: Oliver Twist, A My Name Is... Catholic School girls would never sink so low as to handle a bag of dog droppings. HOWEVER, some mornings on the A Train as it pulled into a very crowded station where people pushed to get on, we played a nasty gum trick. Four or five girls would chew wads of gum to just the right consistency. As the train pulled into the station, we would combine the wads and stick them on either side of the doors. As the doors opened, the gum stretched across and the first on were treated to a sticky mess. Most fun if it got into hair sprayed hair. To this day I look before I get on a train.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Snuffy
Date: 26 Feb 01 - 07:04 PM

Lucy,

Sorry for the delay in replying. I've been away for the weekend at the Middle Bar Singers reunion in Sidmouth - awesome. I did try to reply to you at work this lunchtime, but it blew our server!!

Anyway, I wasn't a real Maxonian - went to primary school in Hazel Grove and then joined the hillbillies in Wildboarclough when I was 9 and then went on to Kings.

My sister was at Fence Avenue, and she still gets the Old Boys/Girls association newsletter, which I see when I visit her. Don't know why I don't get it - they must have disowned me!

The schools have combined but I think they still operate from both sites. Happy daze. Were you there when the Head Woman was Miss Foot Man?

Wassail! Vaughan

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Hawker
Date: 26 Feb 01 - 07:18 PM

Snuffy, (You can tell I went to Macc High, I can't even speeel Sunfy! LOL!)

Yes, Miss Footman - The Lady with the wig!! I am 40 how old is your sister? I might know her......OOOh this could be worrying, now....what did I get up to back then..........LOL!

Lucy

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Snuffy
Date: 26 Feb 01 - 08:50 PM

I think she'd be a bit before your time - she did her A-levels in 67 or 68.

Wassail! V

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Hawker
Date: 27 Feb 01 - 03:57 PM

Snuffy, Yes, I started there in '72!

Incidentally, I was researching the workshop I was running after school today, this afternoon (OOPS! left that a bit late!) and I came across a piece in a book about Shrovetide customs.... In Cornwall the Monday night preceeding Shrove Tuesday is known as Nick-a-Nan night. This is an old custom now not so common - basically knock and run / knocky nine doors or whatever, also the kids apprently got up to all sorts of mischief, hiding behind hedges and hosing people down with water or firing soot at passers by! If the knocking was answered with the owner presenting them with a plate of pancakes, the knockers would leave them alone! (Sounds very much like trick or treat to me - and my husband is adamant that Nick-a-Nan night is either Halloween or 5th November)

Lucy

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Inukshuk
Date: 27 Feb 01 - 08:06 PM

God, what a thread. My eyes are damp from the joys of boyhood memory. I actually still have a good collection of fag cards. We played "Nick Knock" and left flaming bags of dog shit on the doorstep for the victim to stamp out. We also had a devise made from a notched thread spool that we could spin against a darkened window (or entangle in a girl's hair). We also had an incidious invention that would tap a button against a window from a safe distance.

If anyone is interested, I have the rules for "five stone" as we played it against the school wall in the late forties. Damn, I feel so sorry for today's children.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 27 Feb 01 - 08:26 PM

If anyone is interested, I have the rules for "five stone" as we played it against the school wall in the late forties.

I'm interested! (And I seem to remeber bert putting out a request for the same info some time back.) If we don't gather this stuff now it'll get lost.

But walking through the town centre and seeing all the kids from 5 to 16 with these doty little scooters that are fashionable now, I feel hopeful we'll be seeing gobs/fivestones back again - all it needs is to have Harry Potter start playing it, and a few teachers trying to ban it. (Well, actually there is a version of a game called Gobs in one of the Harry Potter books, but it's not the same game at all...) But we'll need to have the rules handy to pass on if they are wanted.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Inukshuk
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 08:09 PM

Official Five Stone Rules
(as played against the wall of Tweedsmuir School, Hamilton, Ontario during the late forties)

Equipment:
one ball (sponge, tennis etc.)
five small stones (pebbles preferred)
one wall with a few feet of pavement in front of it.

Set up:
Arrange the stones a foot or so away from the wall.
Place them in about a six inch square, with one stone in each corner and one in the centre

The play:
Thrown ball must hit the wall, the pavement (or the pavement and the wall)and be caught. It may hit each surface only once during each play.
Players continue to throw the ball until ball is dropped or makes more than the two designated bounces.
Play then proceeds to the next player.

The object:
The object is to score points by moving the stones.
Moving a corner stone is one point. The centre stone is five. Scores are cumulative until the school bell rings.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Inukshuk
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 08:11 PM

Official Five Stone Rules
(as played against the wall of Tweedsmuir School, Hamilton, Ontario during the late forties)

Equipment:
one ball (sponge, tennis etc.)
five small stones (pebbles preferred)
one wall with a few feet of pavement in front of it.

Set up:
Arrange the stones a foot or so away from the wall.
Place them in about a six inch square, with one stone in each corner and one in the centre

The play:
Thrown ball must hit the wall, the pavement (or the pavement and the wall)and be caught. It may hit each surface only once during each play.
Players continue to throw the ball until ball is dropped or makes more than the two designated bounces.
Play then proceeds to the next player.

The object:
The object is to score points by moving the stones.
Moving a corner stone is one point. The centre stone is five. Scores are cumulative until the school bell rings.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Bert
Date: 01 Mar 01 - 01:17 AM

Thanks for taking the time to post those rules Inukshuk. Unfortunately it is not the same game. We still needed you to post it though because as McGrath says, if we don't record these games they will get lost.

Now, thanks to you, there is another game that is preserved for posterity.

I'll try to do my bit and get them all collated for the "kids" page.

Thanks again.

Bert.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: tiggerdooley
Date: 01 Mar 01 - 01:50 PM

Who remembers 'What's the time Mr Wolf?'
Somebody would stand with their face to the wall, their back to the other kids. The kids would ask 'What's the time, Mr Wolf?' and the 'wolf' would give a time (eg five o' clock) and the kids would have to take that number of steps towards Mr Wolf (ie five steps). When they got really near, and when Mr Wolf felt like killing, he would suddenly answer the question 'What's the time, Mr Wolf?' with 'DINNERTIIIIIIME!!!!!' and everybody would run.
God, we were easily amused...

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST
Date: 01 Mar 01 - 04:48 PM

Yes, Tiggerdooley, I've spent many an hour playing that. Most of our games were out of doors and energetic; I feel sorry for today's youngsters, because it's not safe to let them roam the way we did.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: tiggerdooley
Date: 01 Mar 01 - 05:42 PM

That's so true, Guest.
I talk about some of the things we did, and how easily I went around to my friends houses without having to call them first so that they knew to panic if I didn't arrive(!), things I can't even do now. And I realise how young I was when I did these things, and looking at it through my tainted paranoid spectacles, I begin to think that my parents were barbarians, throwing me to the wolves. Then I remember that all of us kids could roam about, and it's only nowadays that you can't let them out of your sight. I would love my kids (when I get some!) to have the fun we did, and not have to be transported round in the safe cocoon of a family saloon...hey, I've just written a song!!!!
The solution is to remain like a child, and then you can teach your kid all those games and go exploring with them - but they WILL hate having you around!

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: Penny S.
Date: 01 Mar 01 - 06:01 PM

I spent ages wandering about Folkestone, going to ask if girls from school could play, which they never could. I had learned where they lived from going to parties, and worked out on the ground the best solution to a version of the commercial traveller's problem of the shortest route, factoring in the most favoured targets and the best places to spend time if, as turned out, playing outside was not an option for others. I just didn't know that nice girls didn't play out - my mother grew up in the country and did nothing else as a child. I grew up reading Arthur Ransome and Malcolm Saville. I thought that was what people did.

It was a good place to learn to wander a landscape, because of the line of hills behind the town, and the sea, which gave a framework to work on. I can read maps! I have recently wondered if the next generation, where the boys are far more constrained, as girls used to be, will need books called "Why people can't read maps".

When we played "What's the Time Mr Wolf?" a bunch of children trailed the wolf round the playground, and the wolf would answer with the times, leading up to breakfast time, lunchtime and dinnertime. There was no link with the times and the number of steps. I can't remember what happened to anyone caught - were they the next wolf?

Penny

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: tiggerdooley
Date: 01 Mar 01 - 06:04 PM

Yup, they were the next wolf. Being Wolf was never fun...

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,JohnB
Date: 02 Mar 01 - 12:46 PM

Further on the subject of Tiggy, we used to paly tiggy not just with hands. We would use available things and the name of the game would take on titles like Tiggy Ball, Tiggy Stone, Tiggy Dog Shit and such. Hence Tiggy Hammer in the rough areas. JohnB

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: GUEST,Same guest
Date: 02 Mar 01 - 02:48 PM

Tiggerdooley. Remain like a child; that's the answer to most problems of course - keeping a sense of wonder, looking forward, learning every day. My niece and I have great fun in our local parks/ play areas together(I don't see why adults shouldn't enjoy the swings; I'm smaller than many ten year-olds). Sadly, we see few other people there, even though the climbing frames and other playthings are often fantastic.

Subject: RE: Knocky Door Ginger
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Mar 01 - 08:05 PM

I feel sorry for today's youngsters, because it's not safe to let them roam the way we did.

I wonder whether that is really true, or just that there's more awareness of the fact that it can be a dangerous world.

The traffic is heavier, and there are more parked cars on the roads. But the most dangerous roads can be the ones that seem safe till some fool rushes around the corner in a car in a hurry. Busy roads carry their own warning. Fewer children get killed on the roads than a few years ago - though of course that could just mean that they aren't allowed to play out.

But the play out round where I live, and the play doesn't seem that different. Yesterday I was walking along and a biscuit suddenly appeared on the road in front of me, and it turned out there was a bunch of boys in an upstairs room throwing things at passers-by. They were still at it when I came back that way half an hour later, having a rare old time.

And there were kids on scooters (the fashionable non-motorised type of scooter, the modernised version of the classic ones dating back to Edwardian times or before); other on bicycles, or with a skateboard or roller skates. A bunch of girls doing a counting game on the pavement. Come the summer, they'll be playing tennis across the streets.

Things sometimes change a lot less than people assume.