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Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan

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Rick Fielding 09 Feb 01 - 01:20 AM
Amos 09 Feb 01 - 01:23 AM
Rick Fielding 09 Feb 01 - 01:36 AM
Peter T. 09 Feb 01 - 08:48 AM
GUEST 09 Feb 01 - 09:17 AM
GUEST 09 Feb 01 - 09:59 AM
Steve Latimer 09 Feb 01 - 10:17 AM
Rick Fielding 09 Feb 01 - 11:32 AM
Lonesome EJ 09 Feb 01 - 12:22 PM
Little Hawk 09 Feb 01 - 05:35 PM
Jeri 09 Feb 01 - 06:02 PM
GUEST,ojblues 09 Feb 01 - 06:36 PM
Little Hawk 09 Feb 01 - 08:05 PM
joshleik 10 Feb 01 - 12:52 AM
Rick Fielding 10 Feb 01 - 09:27 AM
catspaw49 10 Feb 01 - 10:01 AM
Peter T. 10 Feb 01 - 10:27 AM
Marion 10 Feb 01 - 11:56 AM
Amos 10 Feb 01 - 12:19 PM
GUEST,notdylanfan 10 Feb 01 - 01:21 PM
Peter T. 10 Feb 01 - 03:55 PM
catspaw49 10 Feb 01 - 04:36 PM
Peter T. 10 Feb 01 - 04:49 PM
Amos 10 Feb 01 - 05:23 PM
Steve Latimer 10 Feb 01 - 08:44 PM
Rick Fielding 10 Feb 01 - 10:28 PM
Little Hawk 11 Feb 01 - 07:49 PM
Rick Fielding 11 Feb 01 - 09:00 PM
Little Hawk 11 Feb 01 - 09:50 PM
GUEST,wanna warble 11 Feb 01 - 10:15 PM
Little Hawk 11 Feb 01 - 10:55 PM
Codfish 11 Feb 01 - 11:42 PM
Little Hawk 12 Feb 01 - 12:01 AM
Steve Latimer 12 Feb 01 - 07:49 AM
GUEST,Steve 12 Feb 01 - 11:14 AM
Rick Fielding 12 Feb 01 - 12:29 PM
Steve Latimer 12 Feb 01 - 12:52 PM
Rick Fielding 12 Feb 01 - 12:57 PM
catspaw49 12 Feb 01 - 01:03 PM
catspaw49 12 Feb 01 - 02:28 PM
Steve Latimer 12 Feb 01 - 02:41 PM
Peter T. 12 Feb 01 - 02:54 PM
Steve Latimer 12 Feb 01 - 02:57 PM
Steve Latimer 12 Feb 01 - 03:02 PM
catspaw49 12 Feb 01 - 03:08 PM
catspaw49 12 Feb 01 - 06:09 PM
katlaughing 12 Feb 01 - 06:55 PM
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katlaughing 12 Feb 01 - 07:17 PM
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Subject: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 09 Feb 01 - 01:20 AM

Yes it's true. The next two Mondays, my radio show "Acoustic Workshop" will feature esteemed Mudcatter Peter T. and I playing (on CD) the music of the esteemed Music Master from Minnesota, Bobbie Dylan. We both are big fans, although probably for some different reasons. With any luck we may even get into a couple of hair pulling bitch-slapping arguements over our choices for inclusion, and what we left off 'cause one of us thought it was crap. Heather will play the part of Wynton Marsalis (or Louis Armstrong)

The one thing Peter and I DO agree on is that no pop musician who first recorded in 1961 is still so widely and passionately discussed, so the little putz has sure done SOMETHING right.

It's at 7pm on CIUT (89.5 fm) and can be reached at www.ciut.com

I still think his first album was his best!

Rick

Here's a direct link for Real Player:
CIUT
- la joeclone -


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Amos
Date: 09 Feb 01 - 01:23 AM

Shucks -- I thought it was going to be a Roast or maybe an impersonation. I can just imagine Rick Fielding drawling out Civil War narratives and Peter T whining through a harmonica about the sad-eyed lady of the lo-o-o-o-ow lands....dang! I'm disappointed!

A


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 09 Feb 01 - 01:36 AM

Wait til ya hear the show for REAL disappointment!!

Actually, should be fun. Maybe I can get Peter to spit up his herbal tea.

R


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Peter T.
Date: 09 Feb 01 - 08:48 AM

Really useful, Rick!
Start again:
We are doing this show over the next two weeks. There has been a proliferation of Dylan threads recently (How many threads does it take till you know....) but we would like some specific input from Mudcatters, that we will feel free to read out on the air, use (or ignore!). CAN YOU HELP US?

1) Can you tell us about a Dylan song, either its music or its words, and why it works for you. We don't need a list of favourite Dylan songs, there is a thread for that. We want specifics.

2) How do you think Dylan has influenced you, or folk music in general for the better or worse? Specifics again, please, not "he wrecked folk music" or "he saved folk music".

3) Are there any little known songs or information that might shed some light on his work?

yours, Peter T.


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Feb 01 - 09:17 AM

It's a little known fact that Dylan's songs were ghost written by Sir Francis Bacon. Honest.

cheers, Fortunato


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Feb 01 - 09:59 AM

He gave a new generation a STARTING POINT to get involved with a genre that by the early 60s was already esoteric and inaccessible--and therefore very unwelcoming.

Here came a guy, prolific enough to fill anyone's repertoire, simple enough to imitate, intellectual enough to last, musical enough to be worth the effort.


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 09 Feb 01 - 10:17 AM

Well said guest.

Can't wait for the shows.


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 09 Feb 01 - 11:32 AM

If you take the period of say, 1960 to 1963 as the golden age of the singer-songwriter (or at least it's birth) Bobby was the ONLY one of the many who used traditional ballad form as the basis for his original songs. Whether he "borrowed" or stole the tunes and styles, hardly matters now. He obviously LISTENED to the traditional material, both American and "cross the pond", to the point where you can recognise it in virtually all his early material.

Always wondered if any (significant number of) listeners actually checked out "Lord Randal" after listening to "Hard Rain", the same way some got interested in Frank Proffitt after hearing The Kingston Trio's Tom Dooley.

Rick

Good second start Peter. It was late at night and I was reeling from glue fumes.


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 09 Feb 01 - 12:22 PM

I'll be listening to this one!


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Little Hawk
Date: 09 Feb 01 - 05:35 PM

Yeah, Bob absorbed traditional music like a sponge, along with the old acoustic blues, country, rock and roll, and god knows what else. You can hear all of that in his work, and that's what gives him such lasting legitimacy. He somehow carries the ghostly imprint of all that preceded him. He's like a walking musical history lesson.

It's good to hear that, when there is so much happening in the media that shows no respect or even awareness of the rich cultural past we all came from.

- LH


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Jeri
Date: 09 Feb 01 - 06:02 PM

One of the things I remember hearing and thinking about Dylan back in the 60's was that he was responsible for songs focusing on social commentary being heard by a large audience. Maybe he was the first, or maybe he just became/was better known than others. Pop music was mostly of the sappy love song variety until Dylan. At least it was in my memory, which is faulty because I was so much older then...


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: GUEST,ojblues
Date: 09 Feb 01 - 06:36 PM

dylan's biggest accomplishment was surviving the hearts and minds he broke. he did exactly what he wasn't supposed to (though i don't think he was guided solely by rebellion). yes, everyone knows he played rock at a folk festival and people were pissed, but the reason he played newport was because he played "his" folk music first. when dylan hit the village, people weren't writing folk songs, they were reciting them. when he wrote his own, people loved him. then he wrote songs with "no" structure. then he wrote songs with no chorus. etc. etc. and THEN he played rock. that he outlasted the alternate backlash and praise every time he broke the rules makes dylan the most powerful figure in american music. oh, and i agree, his first album is still his best.


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Little Hawk
Date: 09 Feb 01 - 08:05 PM

Yeah, he broke ALL the rules, and freed a lot of people in so doing. David Bowie saluted him for doing that in "Song For Bob Dylan".

- LH


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: joshleik
Date: 10 Feb 01 - 12:52 AM

Yes, I checked out Lord Randall.

I think the amount of music/styles he absorbed explains what happened from 62-66 and even beyond. You'd be hard pressed to find another person who soaked up that much. The impressive part being what he turned it into. In other words, he had listened to and learned so much, that the only thing he could do that was interesting to him was create what he created. That goes for blues to folk to rock and roll to country to rock and roll to gospel to rock and roll/country/gospel/blues/folkmusic(today). Who else has been so completely about music?


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 10 Feb 01 - 09:27 AM

As a kid I remember hearing "House of the Rising Sun" sung by Josh White. "What a song", I thought..and what a wonderful guitarist. Then I heard Ronnie Gilbert and Fred hellerman of the Weavers do it, and once again I was impressed with the song and the delivery (and Hellerman's jazzy chords).

I heard Dylan's version, and it drew me into the story instantly. It was like it was happening "at that moment". I know how much some folks absolutely HATED his treatment ("screaming, nasal wheezes...destroying the song", etc....) but it was that version (copied by the Animals) that went around the world....and nobody could honestly say he "commercialized" the song. He simply put the "anger" in it.

Rick


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: catspaw49
Date: 10 Feb 01 - 10:01 AM

There has always been a discussion as to how much of Bob is poet and how much is musician. He is certainly a wordsmith of great talent, and their is an obvious trad background. I think he absorbed traditional music and folk like a sponge and when many of the tunes came back reworked, it was a natural process as much as one of some sinister design. The breadth of his style(s) shows just how much he absorbs and then includes. On all fronts, wordsmith, musician, musicologist, one Dylan favorite of mine illustrates best what I mean. Interestingly, it was only recorded on Biograph although it was performed in concert.

"Lay Down Your Weary Tune" has the sound of a hymn, a particular style that Dylan never used on any other song. we've had discussions here at the 'Cat and done some searching to find what hymn he may have used and none really fit. The sound and style are extremely hymn-like and I wonder where this one came from, as it is a stand alone in that regard.

Dylan has always been very good with words evoking strong emotion and visual images and "LDYWT" has some of his absolute best. Somehow though they are different and the hymn style may have influenced that to some degree.

Struck by the sounds before the sun, I knew the night had gone. The morning breeze like a bugle blew Against the drums of dawn.

Geeziz, what a wonderful image! You can not only see it, but you hear it and feel it.

I gazed down in the river's mirror And watched its winding strum. The water smooth ran like a hymn And like a harp did hum.

Just fantastic..........somehow different than any other Dylan lyric or style, perhaps because I DO feel it and hear it as well as see it. Very real.

2 cents offered

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Peter T.
Date: 10 Feb 01 - 10:27 AM

Continuing thanks to all: keep them coming (Thanks particularly CP, for the detail).
yours , Peter T.


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Marion
Date: 10 Feb 01 - 11:56 AM

Some useful info: the musician under discussion is BOB Dylan. Bobby Dylan is the naked girl singing "Blowing in the Wind" in "Forrest Gump".

Marion


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Amos
Date: 10 Feb 01 - 12:19 PM

He wasn't a starting point for me. By the time I saw him stand up at the Newport gig in (I think) '62 I knew most of the older songs he was drawing on, and could stand in amazement at the deftness of his weaving of old Thiemes (I mean themes) into new fabric.

But I think what he did that really caught the wave was to voice the anger and protest of a very large generation of young people; he articulated the threads that were running through ou r minds as we tried to come to to some kind of terms with the world and discovered the endless layers of hypocrisy and fraud and stupidity and overwhelm and pain which made it up. "Masters of War", for example, is the "J'accuse" that every youth wants to hurl at the source of war machinery, in an impulse to make the world more safe. Dylan wrote what millions were thinking but could not say as well. For which he has been quite justly rewarded.

It's had to think of that sassy kid walking in the snow in Greewisch Village with a pretty young girl on his arm, probably not more than seventeen, as a rich man! How jealous can I get???

A


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: GUEST,notdylanfan
Date: 10 Feb 01 - 01:21 PM

I'm glad I looked into this. I really thought it was going to be a funny discussion about what was left out of Ken Burns' Jazz film, but it's been quite interesting. I've never liked Dylan's music all that much, but I have to admit I've never looked at it closely either.

I was unaware that he recorded House of the rising Sun and certainly didn't know about his adapting British Ballads and gospel songs. If he did, then he has a subtlety that I've missed.

I'll try and listen to the program and I hope that House of the Rising Sun is one of the songs used. If as Rick says, he's been going for 40 years (I first heard him about 15 yeras ago) then I guess he's reinvented himself quite a few times.


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Peter T.
Date: 10 Feb 01 - 03:55 PM

Interesting that Dylan's version of "House of the Rising Sun was Dave van Ronk's that he stole.
yours, Peter T.


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: catspaw49
Date: 10 Feb 01 - 04:36 PM

Somewhere, Peter, and I'm sure you or Rick have it, are some really wonderful and pointed comments of Van Ronk and some others in the Village scene then......The gist being that it was obvious from the gitgo that Bob wasn't just different, but was doing things to "achieve stardom." when I first read that, I thought it was just retrospective sour grapes, but I know now it isn't. He worked at being different and in the right place at the right time.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Peter T.
Date: 10 Feb 01 - 04:49 PM

Yeah, the ruthlessness of genius. You read about Joyce and Goethe and Dylan, and you really wonder was it all that great to have ever "rubbed shoulders with them".
yours, Peter T.


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Amos
Date: 10 Feb 01 - 05:23 PM

Geniuses are a lot easier to get along with once they've acheived acclaim; until they do, they can't get above having something to prove. Some of them, and it varies wildly, are huge of self but equally huge in benevolence. They'll talk to anyone. Others wear chips of competitive contest on their shoulders.

A


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 10 Feb 01 - 08:44 PM

'Spaw,

I loaned the booklet from Biograph to Rick. It has a lot of interesting information in it and I thought it would help with the shows. But I do rememeber Bob talking about Lay Down Your Weary Tune, said he heard a bagpipe tune and he was trying to recreate it. I think he named the tune, but I can't recall it.

Rick, perhaps you could find it.

I bought Biograph with apprehension, but there is a lot more wonderful material on it than I ever expected, the LDYWT being just one example.

Steve


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 10 Feb 01 - 10:28 PM

OK, Gonna be a bit contentious here. Bobby may have been born again so many times that he really DOES have five navels, but my outlook on the man's approach has changed several times as well.

To me, his talent was never in question, but after reading a biography every few years and talking occasionally to folks who knew him, I'd think "what a nasty, piece of work. Shame he couldn't have been more decent to those around him...or, was all that stealing (of books and records) and constant lying ('bout his past) neccessary"?

Over the last week I've been thinking more about that, and it strikes me that from day one very few folks ever "called him" on any of this. From early girlfriends (and there were quite a few) through his "Village" associates (well-known and unknown) and on down the line. The parallels with Woody are striking...and I never felt the same ambivalence about him. Guthrie was lionized and catered to, by many of the folks that I called heroes, while at the same time they knew h'ed left his first family to live in poverty. They thought it was cute the way he'd often bother women in public....the closest to a criticism came from Pete Seeger long after Woody's death, when he briefly mentioned his old friend's thoughtlessness and random cruelty, but seemed to dismiss these as trivial next to "the sheer number of songs he wrote".

In many ways both these men, through some accident, had HUGE charisma, as well as great talent. Rather than turn to the JD Salinger kind of reclusiveness, they both seemed to enjoy the company of other people...but...for every bright knowledgable irony-equipped fan or friend, both of them must have had to deal with at least fifty "partially-formed" others. Those decent but hoplessly lost folks, who ask naieve questions constantly, and feel they're making an important connection with their hero by stating "right on!" everytime he so much as coughs.

I used to watch this kind of fan/buddy behaviour back in the sixties when certain Toronto folkies would congregate around the rediscovered black Blues musicians, like Son House, Brownie McGhee, or Rev. Gary Davis. Hearing them use colloquial black slang in order to seem "hip" around these men almost made me puke. Needless to say the objects of their affectations, usually just smiled, because they neither had the money nor the "societal security" to tell the kids to "get some manners"(or at least a few social skills) I doubt if Dylan ever worried about things like where his next gig (or next ten bucks) was coming from, so I think he probably threw caution to the winds and said what he (and perhaps I, had I ever been in his position) thought. The beatles during press conferences appeared to do the same thing..but with more humour. Their disdain for people who wanted into their world (but without earning the credentials) was there in spades though...

....and yet, the victims kept coming back for more.

This week, as I think about Dylan, I feel less judgemental about how he dealt with other people.

Yup, Bobby's version of "House Of The Rising Sun" was gleaned from Van Ronk's. I'm a fan of his but Dylan made it electric...and they both knew it.

Oh, "NoDylanFan", We'll probably play "House..." (or at least part of it) I think it's important.

Rick


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Little Hawk
Date: 11 Feb 01 - 07:49 PM

Good anyalysis, Rick. Bob found himself very quickly in the spotlight of an outrageous amount of fame, and all the pressures that go with it, and he reacted defensively by being pretty sarcastic and downright nasty with a lot of people, and saying exactly what he thought, instead of trying to please them.

He probably felt that that was the only way he could maintain his own integrity.

He then proceeded to release certain material (such as Self-Portrait) which may have been a deliberate attempt to disillusion some of his more crazed fans and persuade them to stop "following" him, and get a life of their own.

I think everything he did was an instinctive attempt to preserve his own autonomy in the face of an incredible amount of attention and harassment...and a whole lot of jealousy and backbiting from some other folkies who couldn't get why he was a big star and they were not ("you've got a lotta nerve to say you are my friend").

It said in one book I read about Bob that there has simply been NO other person in the business whom people have such an all-consuming curiosity about, to the point of rummaging through his garbage even.

No wonder he became defensive and hostile. A lot of other people would have broken under the strain.

I've also heard that he can be extremely funny and easy-going around people whom he trusts...but there aren't many such people for Bob.

As for "stealing" Dave Ronk's version of HOTRS...well, he obviously liked that version and began to use it. Is that stealing? Just sounds like the ordinary folk process to me, but it's a matter of opinion, I suppose. I imagine all of them cribbed ideas from each other every which way, whenever they heard something they liked. Bob had more success marketing the stuff he cribbed, that's all.

- LH


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 11 Feb 01 - 09:00 PM

Little Hawk, you make a HUGE point.

"He just had more success with the stuff he cribbed"

Simple concept, but rarely have I seen it in print. Same thing (to a certain extent) with Paul Simon. Had Scarborough Fair NOT become a huge hit, people wouldn't have been asking Martin Carthy how he "felt about the theft" for almost forty years.

Lots of copying (not all of it intentional) goes on all the time. A student of mine recorded an "original" song that I remember making up and using as an excercise in helping them learn fingerpicking. I haven't a clue whether they remember "where it came from"......now if it sold a million....and THEY got the royalties.....well, it won't, so end of story.

Rick


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Little Hawk
Date: 11 Feb 01 - 09:50 PM

Yep. The Scarborough Fair example was on my mind too, but I didn't bother to mention it.

Rick, we are going to come and see you perform at Newmarket next Friday night, Feb 16th. By "we" I mean myself, Hesperis, CarolC....and probably flattop later in the evening...he's coming back from Montreal that same night, via Toronto.

I hope we get a chance to talk some before or after the gig. How early will you be there?

- LH


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: GUEST,wanna warble
Date: 11 Feb 01 - 10:15 PM

"The gist being that it was obvious from the gitgo that Bob wasn't just different, but was doing things to "achieve stardom." when I first read that, I thought it was just retrospective sour grapes, but I know now it isn't. He worked at being different and in the right place at the right time."--catspaw49

Is it too cynical to suggest a creative man who simply saw a MARKET ripe for the picking? The "folk" movement was monolithic in its politics and taste, regionally aggregated into very bite-size marketing morsels, and just organized enough to be tappable on a grand scale.

As to grand-scale listenership--he also arrived at the time of a grand-scale shift in the world view of mass media.

The suggestion doesn't really diminish the quality of his work--maybe just a gentle tweak to the "fans"


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Little Hawk
Date: 11 Feb 01 - 10:55 PM

I think Bob was genuinely excited about each stage of the music he went through...hell, you could hear the intensity in his voice...but he kept moving fast, and kept moving on to new things. His audience always had a very hard time keeping up with the changes, and they'd get mad about it. Not his fault. "But my feet are now fast, and point away from the past, so I'll just bid farewell, and be down the line."

And what a ride it has been.

- LH


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Codfish
Date: 11 Feb 01 - 11:42 PM

I play mostly bluegrass and a fair amount of blues. I heard Dylan recently playing along with bluegrass legend Ralph Stanley and they sounded terrific together. I am 60 and my musical roots were formed in the mid 1950's and into the early 60's by John Lee Hooker, Chuck Berry, Johnny Cash, Jimmy Reed, Ray Charles, Bill Monroe and possibly most of all, Bob Dylan. I loved the combination of guitar and harmonica and still do. We need to have a PBS special on Bob Dylan which would dig into his roots and early influences and progress through the war years and into his senior years.


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Little Hawk
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 12:01 AM

That would be great. It'd have to be about 8 hours long (in 4 parts) to really do justice to the subject, I'd say.

- LH


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 07:49 AM

So it's not an 8 Hour PBS Special, but here's a reminder that Rick and Peter T. are doing part one tonight at 7:00 P.M. www.ciut.fm


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: GUEST,Steve
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 11:14 AM

Great thread, for more see: "Baby, Let Me Follow You Down" by Eric Von Schmidt & Jim Rooney, an illustrated story of the Cambridge folk years.

I found it in my local library. Much info on most of the people involved ie. producers, club owners, friends etc.

Steve


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 12:29 PM

Were it a PBS special film of even eight hours or more, the "who's been left out" arguement would be paramount. They probably wouldn't have time for his important relationships with:

Mark Spoelstra

Paul Clayton

Gordon Lightfoot

The Gleasons

The Freisons,.....but......

Emmy Lou Harris would be there big time.

Rick (trying hard to make a playable copy of Dylan's "Talkin' Devil" for the program tonight)


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 12:52 PM

Allright Rick, Where is Talkin' Devil From?


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 12:57 PM

Broadside (forget which issue). It was on the Broadside (vol.1) record, along with "Only a Hobo" (another fine song)

My copy's pretty scratchy though.

Rick


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: catspaw49
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 01:03 PM

Well there is plenty of thoughts here and rather than argue the merits, I'd suggest one more.

With most songs, the matter of interpretation is always an interesting topic. Whether it be "making a song your own" or trying to say what the writer meant or whatever. Dylan is different in this respect than most others. What I mean is, that with most songs, the lyric is pretty straightforward and while there might be wiggle room here and there, its pretty much what it is, whatever that is.

I think Dylan has more songs open to huge amounts of interpretation than anyone I can think of. Many songs may have originally been done in one way, but others and often Dylan himself have done them in completely different ways to the point of actually changing the "meaning" or original intent of the song....using the same lyrics!

We have had discussions about several of them here, such as "Don't Think Twice." Depending on how YOU do it, its a piece of sarcasm, an angry song about being hurt, or a lament for love lost. Clapton did it as a blues and the effect was totally different again. "Blowin'" generally is a bit on the sappy side generally, sometimes a pleading bit of protest, but I was taken completely with one of Dylan's own renditions where it was an angry, almost mean, protest of hopelessness.

Perhaps this is because he is poet first, I don't know. It is equally true that few other artists re-iterpret their own material as much and as often as Dylan. It at least shows a continued growth of the man if nothing else.

Just another thought............Thought I'd throw it in....throw it out if you like.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: catspaw49
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 02:28 PM

BTW, here's the CIUT Web Page and in the upper right is a live broadcast thing you click on.....not working right now....maybe they are off the air????? Anyway, I'll be trying to listen tonight.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 02:41 PM

"Spaw, just went there, it's working fine for me. A bit of buffering at first, but it was okay after a few seconds.

Steve


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Peter T.
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 02:54 PM

We may be more George Burns than Ken Burns....yours, Peter T.


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 02:57 PM


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 03:02 PM

That's the first time in my life I've been left speechless.

If this show goes as well as I think it should perhaps you two could do one on another artist that I know is dear to your hearts, Willie. (I'll even loan you Night & Day)

Steve


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: catspaw49
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 03:08 PM

Geeziz Steve.....You're gonna' loan him your Willie? I didn't know you could take them off!!??!! Must be a Canadian thing.............

Once again, I ain't gettin' the CIUT thing......I keep getting my RP up and then it says UNABLE TO LOCATE SERVER. Jeri had a direct link somewhere....I'll go look for that.....Pain in the ass........much like PT.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: catspaw49
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 06:09 PM

Refresh hoping to catch a few 'Catters.

CIUT is working fine!!!! (at least at the moment....it seems to hate me.....must have a thing against me over the Neil Young Center for the Terminally Screwed)

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: katlaughing
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 06:55 PM

only a few more minutes to go!


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: catspaw49
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 07:00 PM

Its on....loud and clear.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: Jeri
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 07:07 PM

Bypass web page - clickie here for the RA broadcast


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Subject: RE: Peter T & Rick do Ken Burns and Dylan
From: katlaughing
Date: 12 Feb 01 - 07:17 PM

I can get my Real Player to play any other radio station, Hober Radio, Mudcat Radio archives, but when I try to listen to this I keep getting a message that my device may be in use elsewhere (which it isn't!) and so it cannot connect! I think I'll dump all of my RP and download the newest, again! Sorry I misse you, guys.


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