Origins: Whiskey In The Jar

Subject: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Paul
Date: 18 Oct 97 - 02:40 PM

I was searching the data base for this song (Whiskey In the Jar)after realizing I don't the words to it, to my surprise I couldn't find it. Does anyone know if it may be under a different name or not. Thanks

Paul

Subject: Lyr Add: WHISKEY IN THE JAR
From:
Date: 18 Oct 97 - 04:34 PM

An internet search came up with these lyrics, which are similar to the ones I've usually heard. The search also came up with many strange variations I had never heard.

There is usually also a verse after his capture, but before he mentions his brother, which documents his punching out the sentry and making his escape from jail in Sligo.

There is also a variation of this song called "Bold Lovell", aka "The Devil's In The Women". It is sung to a different tune and has a different (although more intelligible) chorus cursing the treachery of his bawd, although the storyline is much the same. (I've always thought that it would be a good exercise to write a version of Whiskey In The Jar from his girlfriend's perspective, explaining why she turned him in to the authorities.) In the Bold Lovell variation, he doesn't escape and he gets hanged.

I copied these from a site and take no responsibility for complete accuracy. Is there really a Kilmagenny mountain?


As I was going over the Kilmagenny mountain
I met with Captain Farrell and his money he was counting.
I first produced my pistol, and then produced my rapier.
Said stand and deliver, for I am a bold deceiver,

Chorus:
musha ring dumma do damma da
whack for the daddy 'ol
whack for the daddy 'ol
there's whiskey in the jar

I counted out his money, and it made a pretty penny.
I put it in my pocket and I brought it home to Jenny.
She said and she swore, that she never would deceive me,
but the devil take the women, for they never can be easy

Chorus

I went into my chamber, for to take a slumber,
I dreamt of gold and jewels and for sure it was no wonder.
But Jenny took my charges and she filled them up with water,
and sent for Captain Farrell to be ready for the slaughter.

Chorus

It was early in the morning, before I rose to travel,
the guards were all around me and likewise Captain Farrell.
I first produced my pistol, for she stole away my rapier,
but I couldn't shoot the water so a prisoner I was taken.

Chorus

If anyone can aid me, it's my brother in the army,
if I can find his station in Cork or in Killarney.
And if he'll come and save me, we'll go roving near Kilkenny,
and I swear he'll treat me better than me darling sporting Jenny

Chorus

Now some men take delight in the drinking and the roving,
but others take delight in the gambling and the smoking.
But I take delight in the juice of the barley,
and courting pretty Jenny in the morning bright and early

Chorus

(Note: Last verse is usually

Now some take delight in the carriages a-rolling
And others their delight in the hurley and the bowling
But me I take my pleasure in the juice of the barley
And courting pretty girls in the morning bright and early

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: rich r
Date: 18 Oct 97 - 08:54 PM

Search DT with "whiskey and jar" and you should get a couple versions of this song

rich r

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 21 Oct 97 - 01:41 PM

FWIW- If you search for whisky (Scots becerage) you won't find whiskey (everybody else's tipple. If you search for whixk* you'll get both (as well as whiskers and whisked). If you search for [in the jar] you'll find all the songs that use that phrase (the square brackets specify a phrase}

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Martin Ryan
Date: 21 Oct 97 - 03:40 PM

Tim

I think the usual location when sung in Ireland is "Cork and Kerry mountains" or "Kilgarry Mountain". Not sure if the latter exists. I'll check.

Regards

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: alison
Date: 21 Oct 97 - 06:22 PM

Hi,

the nearest I could find to it was a town called Kilmaganny, which is near the Booley Hills, (just North East of Carrick on Suir), but I don't think it's right because this is on the other side of the country from the Cork and Kerry Mountains, which always made more sense to me.

slainte

alison

Subject: Lyr Add: BOLD LOVELL (from Roy Harris)
From:
Date: 21 Oct 97 - 06:46 PM

Martin, I always thought it was Cork and Kerry mountains too.

The Bold Lovell version, the lyrics of which except for the chorus could be sung (perhaps with slight adjustments) to the tune of Whiskey in the Jar, says "across the the misty mountains".

I think its Irish and Bourbon "whiskey", and Scotch and Rye "whisky".

Here is Bold Lovell. I got it off of Roy Harris's "Champions of Folly", a long deleted Topic LP from the 1970's. I think that I have the chorus right in the last line, although with his accent and the slur it could as easily be "Ah the women cannot let a fellow be." I think it's "devil" though. (Curse all recordings without lyrics sheets) Maybe someone has it in a songbook. Sir Walter Scott apparently asked his son in Ireland to find him the lyrics.


BOLD LOVELL

As Lovell was out riding out across the misty mountains
Two merchants, two merchants, their money they was counting
He reached for his pistol, and he never gave them warning
He robbed them of their money and he bade them both good morning

Chorus
Oh, the devil's in the women so they say,
Ah the devil cannot let a fellow be

He went to a public house and counted out his money
He called on the landlady to bring forth pretty Polly
But while they was talking, and thinking of no matter
She stole away his pistol and she filled it up with water

Chorus

As Lovell and Polly were taking their sweet pleasure
In walked the troopers saying "Lovell, you must leave her
For a long time you've been on the road to the gallows
So some along with us young man and be a decent fellow

Chorus

He reached for his pistols but they wouldn't fire for water
They lathered him well and gave to him no quarter
Polly, she cried, "If I'd known that they was coming,
I'd have fought them like a tiger, love, even though I am a woman

Chorus

"I have two brothers and they're in the Marines
One of them's at Chatham and the other one's at sea
Bold, frisk and lively lads, and champions of folly
I'd rather they was here today than you deceitful Polly

Chorus

As Lovell was climbing up that old gallows ladder
He called out so gaily for his highway cap and feather
"Well, I've always been a lively lad, but never murdered any
I think it bloody hard to swing for liftin' a bit of money!

Chorus

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Nonie Rider
Date: 21 Oct 97 - 07:27 PM

Cool! I've never seen the Kilmagenny and Lovell versions, only Kilgary and Gilgarra.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From:
Date: 22 Oct 97 - 05:03 PM

Error about the pistol.

Should be, of course,

"She stole away his pistol and she filled it up with water".

Also in the next verse it should be singular for the pistol, as he only seems to have had one.

No matter how careful I try to be in typing things I manage to screw it up somehow.:(

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Nonie Rider
Date: 22 Oct 97 - 07:51 PM

Joe Haldeman used to sing this as he'd learned it:

"I drew forth me pistols and I brandished me sabre"
(spoken: "With my THIRD hand...")

--Nonie

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Ricky Rackin
Date: 22 Oct 97 - 11:23 PM

Anybody know the version :"Es tequilla in the Jar" whose chorus goes:

Muchos gringos trabajar We're from the Barrio [3x] Es tequilla in the Jar!

Obviously set to the standard tune.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Wolfgang Hell
Date: 23 Oct 97 - 03:19 AM

a long shot without corroboration: One name for the highest mountains in Ireland (Co. Kerry) is the "MacGillycuddy's reeks". Kilgarry, Kilmagenny could be a mishearing for the middle part of that place name.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Ted from Australia
Date: 23 Oct 97 - 09:32 AM

Also another verse:
They put me into prison without a Judge or writin'
for robbing Captain Farrell on Kilgarry mountain
But they did not take my fists so i knocked the gaoler (jailer,for you yanks)down
And I bid a fond farewll to that gaol in Salom (pronounced sal-m) town

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Ted from Australia
Date: 23 Oct 97 - 09:35 AM

Farewll pronounced@#*

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Nonie Rider
Date: 23 Oct 97 - 02:42 PM

No, I hadn't heard "Tequila in the Jar." Sounds wonderful! Source or lyrics please (please, please)?

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From:
Date: 24 Oct 97 - 03:58 PM

I've heard it as "I knocked the sentry down".

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Nonie Rider
Date: 24 Oct 97 - 04:53 PM

I'm also heard "And I bid a fond farewell to that judge in Sligo town."

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Lidi
Date: 25 Oct 97 - 05:54 AM

About the mountain.....I have heard; "...over the far-farmed Kerry mountains.."

Cheers

Lidi

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: BK
Date: 26 Oct 97 - 01:12 AM

Somewhere long ago I learned "Gilgarry Mountain." Probably no more likely to be accurate than anything else. It's the spirit that counts.

It is a "blackguarding" song, (automatically rowdy/amoral/offensive/anti-social/immature/irresponsible, etc..), but I've also wondered about the girlfriend's point of view; Maybe she doesn't want to be asociated with this damn fool bozo who blithely robs a prominant local citizen, (apparently assuming nothing effective will be done to him?) and thereby puts her, by association, into the role of accomplice, and in jepardy of a jail sentance, or transportation to one of the dreaded - probably for good reason - penal colonies, etc, etc... She probably was better off without this clod..

Cheers, BK

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: lesblank
Date: 26 Oct 97 - 06:26 PM

For my money, the definitive version of this oldie is done by the Limeliters on their 1962 or 63 album ,"Sing Out". It has some similarity to the lyrics on this thread but it is exactly like the old Burl Ives Columbia album of the early 60's. In any case, a great cause for swappin'.

Thanks !!

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From:
Date: 27 Oct 97 - 10:22 AM

Here is how we sing it in Poland:

As I was going over the far fam'd Kerry Mountains,

I met with Captain Farrel, and his money he was countin',

I first produced my pistol, and I than produced my rapier,

Sayin': "Stand and deliver for you are my bold deceiver".

Slainte

Szarak

Subject: Lyr Add: KILGARY MOUNTAIN (from Joe Haldeman)
From: Nonie Rider
Date: 27 Oct 97 - 01:24 PM

Well, if we're gonna swap versions, this is what I remember of how Joe Haldeman sings it. I don't know his source, but's pretty clearly a folked-over version, since it's got two names for the colonel and THREE for the woman, three hands worth of weapons, and a farewell to a judge he didn't have.

KILGARY MOUNTAIN

As I was a walkin' over Kilgary mountain,
I met with Colonel Pepper and his money he was countin'.
I drew forth me pistols and I brandished my sabre,
Saying "Stand and deliver, for I am a bold deceiver,"

(Cho)
Musha ringum durum da,
Wack fol the derry o,
Wack fol the derry o,
There's whiskey in the jar.

Them shiny golden coins sure did look bright and pretty,
I took the money home, and I gave it to my Kitty.
She swore and she promised that she never would deceive me,
But the Devil's in the women; they can always lie so easy.

Now when I awoke, 'twas around six or seven,
Guards were all around me in numbers odd and even
I drew forth me pistols, but alas I was mistaken,
For Molly'd poured the powder out, and a prisoner I was taken.

They put me into jail, without a judge or writin',
For robbing Colonel Pepper up on Kilgary Mountain;
But they didn't take me fists, so I knocked the sentry down,
And I bid a last farewell to that judge in Sligo town.

I'm going to join me brother, the one who's in the army,
And I don't care where he's stationed, in Killare or Killarney.
And with him I'll go roaming to the mountains and the city,
And I'm sure he'll treat me better than my darling sporting Jenny.

Now some takes delight in the fishing or the bowling;
Others takes delight in the carriages a-rolling;
But I takes delight in the fruit of the barley
And courting pretty women in the morning O so early.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Nonie Rider
Date: 27 Oct 97 - 01:29 PM

(Whoops--only one name for the Colonel above. I THINK his version has one Colonel Pepper and one Captain Farrell, but I don't remember where.)

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: LaMarca
Date: 27 Oct 97 - 04:52 PM

Then there's the version my husband sings:
As I was goin' over the (something somethin) mountain,
I met with Colonel Sanders as his chickens he was countin'...

Chorus:With a little hydrolyzed chicken distillate,
Monosodium glutamate,
Di-sodium guanylate,
That's how we make the sauce!

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Benjamin Hollister also from Australia
Date: 27 Oct 97 - 08:17 PM

I first heard this thru' the Seekers with the Col. Pepper and the verse about escaping from gaol, and going over the Kilgarry Mts. Then I heard the far famed Kerry mountains, so Sligo Town didn't fit too well anymore, so I substituted dTra/ Li/ (Tralee) Town.

Alos the verse when he wakes as:

Twas early in the morning before I rose to travel Up came a band of footmen and likewise Capt. Farrell I reached for me pistols for she'd stol'n away me rapier (sabre, whatever) But I couldn't shoot (fire) the water so a prisoner I was taken.

This has got to be one of the all time great almost impossible to sing along to songs as everyone knows different words. True folk!!!

The chorus even changes:

With a Whack fol the darry oh

or

With a muisheen a ring a down

Still great song

Sla/n a chairde

benjamin

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From:
Date: 27 Oct 97 - 08:52 PM

The Dubliners sing "the far-famed Kerry mountains", with other variations on the first version I posted.

What is the chorus supposed to be? Is it a corruption of some Irish words?

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Benjamin Bodhra/nai
Date: 29 Oct 97 - 06:35 PM

The nonsense in the chorus' of irish and Scottish songs seems to be just that - nonsense. You can see the same thing in Puirt a Beul - "i/ bhi/ a bhi/ u/ bhi/ a bhi/" (ee vi ar vi oo vi ar vi) though bhi/ is a word, or in Domhnaill Antaidh "hi/ ri/ iu/l eile".

Often they are just sounds that allow the rhythym to be kept and that large numbers of people can sing. That's my thought anyway. I actually tried to write the words for Whiskey's chorus in Irish and then translate and I never had much success.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Nigel Sellars
Date: 24 Nov 97 - 02:25 PM

Tim jaques sent me a copy of Roy Harris' version, which I first heard twenty years ago on a PBS special on the Philly Folk Fest where it was sung by Martin Carthy! (Who, alas, has never recorded it, though he's the guitarist on the Roy Harris version.) "Bold Lovell" is an English version, but I came across a Vermont version in the "Green Mountain Songster" with nearly identical words but it talks about "Plymouth Mountain"! (Should add Roy sings "pistols" not "pistol" and it's "Bold, _brisk_ , and lively lads and champions of folly," [my favorite phrase in the song]

Somewhere I once read that "Whiskey in the Jar" is actually a stage version of the song (it may have been on a Clancy Brothers' lp), though I can't say for certain that that is true. Does anyone know of earlier versions with different tunes? Whatever the case, this is the version that's supplanted all the others.

Nigel Sellars

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Barry
Date: 24 Nov 97 - 05:13 PM

Sandy & Caroline Patton also do an american version with the brother , whose in the army, is in jail somewhere in West Virginny, been so long ,thats the only bit of it I can recall. Barry

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From:
Date: 24 Nov 97 - 07:39 PM

Glad you got it, Nigel. Can you make out the Chorus? I am not convinced that I have it right but I can't make out the second line.

Thank you for the correction "brisk" for "frisk", which makes far more sense. I thought "frisk" might be the word from which we get "frisky" and it was the only thing that came to mind.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Nigel Sellars
Date: 25 Nov 97 - 09:30 AM

Tim Jaques asked about the chorus on "Bold Lovell," and I think the second line goes : "How the devil can a fellow let them be?"

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Nigel Sellars
Date: 26 Nov 97 - 02:33 PM

Just a thought, but I'm beginning to suspect the "Bold Lovell" version is closest to the original -- as are, it seems, the Vermont, Virginia, and at least one Irish version -- in that it fits into the traditional highwaymen's "good night" category with the fellow being hanged at the end (ala "Tyburne Tree", "Sam Hall", "Allan Tyne of Harrow," and "Newlyn (Newry) Town.") I'm wondering if some of the Irish versions were altered for political reasons, that is, to show contempt for English authority by having the hero (representing Irish indepence) smash the jail (gaol) doors, a symbol of English oppression. Any takers?

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Nonie Rider
Date: 01 Dec 97 - 12:52 PM

I dunno. "There's whiskey in the jar" is an unlikely chorus for a Goodnight. Tune also seems a little cheerful for the purpose.

The Irish aren't shy; if it was intended as an Irish vs. English rewrite, I'd expect that theme to be obvious rather than hidden. And since the singer is functionally blaming his woman more than his captors, that'd be an odd feature of a political ballad unless she was explicitly considered a traitor and punished for it.

But then, I'm not a scholar of the subject, just a fan.

--Nonie

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From:
Date: 01 Dec 97 - 08:30 PM

The notes on the back of the LP indicate that it was sung by A.L. Lloyd, who learned it from print (The New Green Mountain Songster, I think it was called) and changed it around a bit, and Harris learned his version. I will get the LP back out of storage and transcribe the sleeve note in full. Other versions are mentioned in the note.

Thank you Nigel. I think that is exactly what the second line of the chorus says. For all these years I've been trying to make it out, and now that you state it it seems so obvious. . .

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From:
Date: 15 Jan 98 - 04:57 PM

I said I would transcribe the sleeve note for Bold Lovell from Roy Harris's "Champions of Folly" LP, Topic 12TS256, recorded 1974 and released 1975, on which Harris is joined by Martin Carthy (guitar, dulcimer); Bobby Campbell (fiddle, mandola); and Vic Gammon (melodeon, concertina).
The sleeve notes are by the well-known folksinger, the late A. L. Lloyd.
I sent Dick G. a tape of this song, with the hope that he might add a midi of the tune to the database, since I do not yet have that capability. It is not the same tune as Whiskey In The Jar.


BOLD LOVELL

"The theme of this song reminds us of the capture of MacHeath in The Beggar's Opera. Was it suggested by it? Or is the ballad old enough to have put the idea into the head of John Gay who wrote the play in 1728? Sometimes the hero is named Peter or Patrick Fleming, not Lovell. Sir Walter Scott was interested in the song, but he only had a few scraps of it. In 1821 he wrote to his son Cornet Scott at Portobello Barracks, Dublin: 'I wish you would pick up for me the Irish lilt of a tune to Patrick Fleming.'From the bits that Sir Walter quotes, it's clear he had our song in mind. A close cousin is the celebrated Irish highwayman ballad 'Whiskey In The Jar'. Roy Harris learnt it some ten years ago from Mike Herring of Peterborough, who had it from A. L. Lloyd who got it from print ('The New Green Mountain Songster"), and adapted it a bit."

(Some of you may be more familiar with the twentieth century musical adaptation of The Beggar's Opera, "The Threepenny Opera" by Bertold Brecht, from which comes the song Mac The Knife.)

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Denis
Date: 15 Jan 98 - 07:08 PM

The two variations I have from my mother's singing are the Cork and Kerry mountains and I've also heard the far famed Kerry mountains.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Pejotka
Date: 15 Jan 98 - 07:25 PM

Here is another verse, that I like. I found it in „Folk ´round the world” edited by Herbert Haufrecht, London (ESSEX) (Gilgary Mountain, new words by Bob Gibson, Bob Camp and Frank Warner) 1 to 3 are similar to the other versions but :

4. Was early in the morning at the barracks of Kilarney, My brother took his leave but he didn´t ask the army; Our horses they were speedy ´twas all over but the shoutin` Now we wait for Farrell upon Gilgary Mountain.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Bruce O.
Date: 15 Jan 98 - 09:33 PM

A 'Patrick Fleming' version, with Colonel Pepper snd Ruberry mountain is reprinted from an early 19the century broadside in the Madden collection in Holloway and Black's 'Later English Broadside Ballads', I, # 90. Original edition was London, 1975, but I think Univ. of Nebraska Press has a reprint. (Cork, Kilkenny, Londonderry and London are all mentioned in this version.)

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 01 Jul 98 - 07:48 PM

G'day all,

I see that the 'Whisky in the Jar' seems to have come back to life. I guess that's a little like a good folk song - there's always life in it.

In Australia, this song got a folk processing during the time of one of our particularly notorious (or notable, depending on your viewpoint) bushrangers: Ben Hall. Ben Hall was considered by many to have been victimised by the authorities and to have only turned his hand to crime after being framed for actions of others.

The Police officer responsible was a Pommy remittance man who had enlisted in the colonial police force as an ordinary trooper. When overseas mail arrived addressed to him as SIR Frederick Pottinger (he was a minor baronet) it was decided he could hardly remain in the ranks and he was promoted to Captain. He did not do very well and died of an 'accidentental' shot from his own pistol on a coach bound for an departmental enquiry in Sydney.

Collectors have found a fragmentary local version of 'Whiskey in the Jar' which starts:

"As I was a'going over the Abercrombie mountains, I met with Captain Pottinger and his money he was counting ..."

This is obviously a direct parody (reworking, folk-processing, whatever) of the Irish model - but that is exactly what a folk song is ... a song that keeps working for its living, doing whatever job it turns its hand to, changing as needed to do the job.

Regards,

Bob Bolton

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Barry Finn
Date: 01 Jul 98 - 10:04 PM

Bob, Ben sounds like he could've been a fairly decent fellow if left to his own, kind a like our Pretty Boy Floyd. If folksongs were outlawed, only outlaws would sing about folks, wait, if only inlaws sang folksongs, only folks would sing about outlaws, wait, sorry, if only folksongs were about inlaws, outlaws would only be folks, or is it, if inlaws were outlaws, folks would then only sing out songs that were in .......forget it & slap me silly. Barry, who loves songs about outlaws.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 02 Jul 98 - 02:10 AM

G'day Barry,

I did not post any lyrics of the Australian variant because I was working off the top of what passes for my memory - and I seem to remember that it was a fairly brief fragment ... just enough to show that the song was known at the time (1860s) and someone had re-formed it to suit current events.

I will look up the texts and see if ther is enough to warrant posting the version. If see ... watch this space!

Regards,

Bob Bolton

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Barry Finn
Date: 07 Jul 98 - 07:38 PM

Bob, please do post, it would be quite nice to hea an Aussie version of this, I believe the true spirit of a nation can be judged by how high they hold up their outlaws (Ha, Ha). Barry

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Bert
Date: 08 Jul 98 - 12:16 PM

Hold up or Hang up???

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Bill D
Date: 08 Jul 98 - 08:18 PM

in response to Barry's earlier post...the TRUE moral is.."If inlaws were outlawed, more folk would have something to sing about!"....(as long as they don't RISE UP to sing..

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 12 Jul 98 - 07:14 PM

G'day Barry Finn,

I had a look at the "Abercrombie Mountains" - Ben Hall version of the song. It has 4 stanzas but only the first is really different. The rest has the usual tale 'darlin' Molly' who betrays the highwayman. I suspect that Irish workers here changed the 1st stanza but didn't bother to alter the song to cover the new story.

There are a number of very good original songs about Ben Hall. On the Digital Tradition I found 2 of them. The ballad just called Ben Hall is from Sally Sloane, a great source of Australian songs and music (died ~ 1984). I got to know Sally in the 1970s and she sang at a concert I organised in 1977 (at ~ 76 years of age). Sally was delivered by Ben Hall's Sister who still worked as midwife at the turn of the century. Great, great, great grandparents on my mother's side were married in the same church, in the same year as Ben Hall and Biddy McGuire.

The second song in DT is a rather corrupt transcription of "Streets of Forbes", a lament for Hall written by his brother in law, John McGuire, on seeing his bullet-riddled body led through town, tied over a police pack saddle. I will submit an accurate set of words to set the record straight (as soon as I get my typing fingers working and/or find a good OCR scanner). There are a few more good Hall ballads - Hall got traditional Irish ballads and laments. Twenty years later Ned Kelly songs tended to be in the fashionable music hall styles of the city and less interesting musically.

Regards,

Bob Bolton

Until I return, with lyrics

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: BK
Date: 12 Jul 98 - 11:50 PM

ok, Bill D; how did you get the funky little black square w/the yellow smiley face in this page abt one of my favorite bad boy songs? far out! if there were a lot of catchy little graphics, would they not take up a lot of text space?

cheers, BK

Subject: Lyr Add: THE STREETS OF FORBES
From: Alan of Australia
Date: 13 Jul 98 - 11:01 AM

G'day Bob,
Seeing I Have The words typed up already, I thought I'd save you the trouble:-

THE STREETS OF FORBES

Come all you Lachlan men, and a sorrowful tale I'll tell
Concerning of a hero bold who through misfortune fell
His name it was Ben Hall, a man of good renown
Who was hunted from his station, and like a dog shot down.

Three years he roamed the roads, and he showed the traps some fun
A thousand pounds was on his head, with Gilbert and John Dunn
Ben parted from his comrades, the outlaws did agree
To give away bushranging and to cross the briny sea.

Ben went to Goobang Creek, and that was his downfall
For riddled like a sieve was valiant Ben Hall
'Twas early in the morning upon the fifth of May
When seven police surrounded him as fast asleep he lay.

Bill Dargin he was chosen to shoot the outlaw dead
The troopers then fired madly, and filled him full of lead
They rolled him in a blanket and strapped him to his prad
And led him through the streets of Forbes to show the prize they had.

My Mother who grew up in Ben Hall country in the 1920s and 30s says that people in the area still talked about Hall in those days & it was generally accepted that a great injustice was done to him.

Cheers,
Alan

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Barry Finn
Date: 13 Jul 98 - 02:29 PM

Good job, nice song. Thanks, Barry

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From:
Date: 06 Dec 98 - 12:48 PM

Does anyone have the guitar tab for this tune? Anybody heard Metallica's version???

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Sandy
Date: 07 Dec 98 - 10:08 PM

Hello out there! My memory tells me that the hugely popular version of Whiskey in the Jar was derived from Lena Bourne Fish's version, collected by Frank Warner in New Hampshire. I was too much a purist at the time to be sure, but I thought it was The Highwaymen (aptly named) who recorded it. That it came from Frank Warner's collection would account for the Bob Gibson, Bob Camp, Frank Warner "arrangement" copyright. We've collected several versions of this song at Folk-Legacy: Max Hunter sings an Ozark version (learned from Allie Long Parker, whom we also recorded) with one verse stating "I have two brothers enlisted in the army, One of them's in jail and the other's in Caroliny" (a nice inversion of Kilarney, eh?); Sara Ogan Gunning sings a good version from Kentucky on her "Girl of Constant Sorrow" Folk-Legacy recording. We also will soon release a CD of traditional songs and ballads from our 40 years of collecting. On it, a splendid old logger from New Brunswick, Canada, sings the version referred to in one of the earlier posts about this song in which the hero says "Oh, it's false-hearted Molly, for you my heart is breakin', If it hadn't been for you, sure, I never would've been taken. And with the metal bar, I broke the Samson down (???), And straight-way made my escape to old 'Ginia town." The CD is ready for release, we're just waiting for the money to do it with. :-) Sandy

Subject: Lyr Add: GILGARRAH MOUNTAIN
From: Liam's Brother
Date: 08 Dec 98 - 12:57 AM

Right you are, Sandy. There on p. 147 of Traditional Folk Songs from the Anne & Frank Warner Collection is the copyright "Collected, Adapted and Arranged by Bob Gibson, Bob Camp and Frank Warner."

Here are the words as printed...

GILGARRAH MOUNTAIN

As I was goin' over Gilgarrah Mountain,
I met Colonel Pepper and his money he was counting.
I rattled my pistols and drew forth my saber,
"Stand and deliver, for I am a bold deceiver,"

CHO: Musha ringum durum da,
Wack fol the daddy o,
Wack fol the daddy o,
There's whiskey in the jar.

Them shiny golden coins sure did look bright and jolly,
I took the money home, and I gave it to my Molly.
She promised and vowed she never would deceive me,
But the Devil's in the women and they never can be easy.

I returned to my cave in Gilgarrah Mountain,
And left my sweetheart Molly the money a-counting.
As I was soundly sleeping, the divil sure may take her,
She fired off my pistols and she loaded them with pepper.

She told Colonel Pepper where I was a-hiding,
And led them to my cave right early in the morning.
O Molly, you've deceived me, although I loved you dearly,
But you never cared for me; I can see it bright and clearly.

Now I awakened between six and seven,
Guards were around me in numbers odd and even.
I flew to my pistols, but alas I was mistaken,
For I fired off my pistols and a prisoner I was taken.

They put me into jail, without a judge or writing,
For robbing Colonel Pepper up on Gilgarrah Mountain;
But they didn't take me fists, so I knocked the sentry down,
And I bid a long farewell to the jail in Sligo town.

Now some takes delight in the fishing and bowling;
Others takes delight in the carriages a-rolling;
But I takes delight in the fruit of the barley
Courting pretty girls in the morning so early.

Well, the Gilgarrah Mountain was not in Munster (Kerry, Tipperary, etc.), not if our highwayman was taken in his cave there and lodged in Sligo jail.

"There's Whiskey in the Jar" appears in Colm O Lochlainn's great book of (mostly) broadsides, Irish Street Ballads. For those who care, he has "Kerry mountain," "Captain Farrell" and "Jenny." He also includes the verse...

If any one can aid me 'tis me brother in the army
If I could learn his station, in Cork or in Killarney.
And if he'd come and join me we'd go roving in Killkenny
I'll engage he'd treat me fairer than my darling sporting Jenny.

I recall Liam saying words to this effect once while I was in the Air Force.

All the best,
Dan HTML line breaks added. --JoeClone, 11-Jul-02.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: AndreasW
Date: 08 Dec 98 - 07:16 AM

I heard
"As I was going over the mountains near Killarney"
by different singers in some pubs, one in Kilronan on Inishmore, one in Killarney and one in Dingle.
But don't ask me for the names of the pubs, those are stored somewhere in my memory, probably in some write-only memory...
Andreas

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Ritchie
Date: 08 Dec 98 - 07:56 AM

The late Phil Lynott of 'Thin Lizzy' used to look down from the stage to the assembled ladies in the audience before singing 'whisky in the jar' and say......

"Do you have any Irish in you....?"..pause for effect

"Well,would you like some....?"

(the little tinker..)

love and happiness

Ritchie.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Steve Parkes
Date: 08 Dec 98 - 10:33 AM

My two penn'orth:

I had it in the late 60's from Mike James of the Songsmiths as "They didn't take my fists, so I knocked down the sentry/And I bid a fond farewell to the judge and all his gentry" which rhymes, anyway.

Steve

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: DonMeixner
Date: 08 Dec 98 - 11:22 PM

My favorite varient is the Smother's Brothers version.

As I was goin' over the North Pole so merry I met a St. Bernhard who was short and squat and harry, I pull for a stick and I made for to heave her, Saying fetch and deliver for you are a bold retriever.

Mush a ringum...

Don Meixner

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Harry O
Date: 11 Dec 98 - 09:54 PM

The usual process. the song travels, placenames unfamiliar to the listeners are changed to suit the locality. The same applies to proper names. "Unusual" names are rationalised.There also exists the potential for mishearing the lyrics, or misremembering them in post-performance recollection.

We are all familiar with the "Chinese Whispers" phenomenon. Same principal applies.

Harry O

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: David Ball
Date: 13 Dec 98 - 09:38 PM

I used to study Greek and Latin and when I learned the rhetorical figures -- metaphor, simile, etc. -- I was struck by how they all could be found in even the most unpretentious songs. I particularly noticed that the last verse of "Whiskey in the Jar" is a priamel ("some like...some like...but I like..."), a form already well established when Sappho was writing (about 7th century BC). It's also a tricolon, a series of three, which is of course a favorite of everybody's.

Anyway, I've heard it as "...and bid farewell to this tight-fisted town," which I like, if only because it doesn't contain any names of places I've never visited.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From:
Date: 15 Dec 98 - 05:57 PM

I read on some newsgroup that there is now a shopping mall in Sligo. Sort of spoils the tune for me, although there is no reason why Sligo shouldn't have a mall like everyone else. "And I bid a fond adieu/To the mall in Sligo town" . . .

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Bert
Date: 16 Dec 98 - 11:59 AM

You've seen one you've seen a mall.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Chris Ubik
Date: 16 Dec 98 - 12:32 PM

As I believe was mentioned before, Metallica does a cover of it on their latest album, "Garage, Inc." Not the definitive recording, but surprisingly good.

Other gems on the album include Skynyrd's "Tuesday's Gone," Bob Seger's "Turn the Page" and Blue Oyster Cult's "Astronomy."

Ok, my inner headbanger is going back underground :-)

Chris

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Ian
Date: 26 Dec 98 - 09:00 AM

If anybody knows the whisky in the jar riffs/solo could they please submit it to OLGA as I'm tearing my hair out!

Ian Atkinson,Yorkshire, England

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Art Thieme
Date: 26 Dec 98 - 10:03 PM

Just E-mailed Roy Harris to check in here & look at the good discussion. He may have his .02 to add---we'll see! (Did that 'cause his version of this song was mentioned several times.)

Art

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: alison
Date: 26 Dec 98 - 10:11 PM

Hi Ian,

which riffs? the Thin Lizzy one is pretty easy to work out. I'l do it for you if it's that one you want.

slainte

alison

Subject: Lyr Add: WHISKEY IN THE JAR (from Metallica)
From: Kirk
Date: 31 Dec 98 - 03:56 AM

The Metallica version has different lyrics than have been posted. I have never heard the Thin Lizzy version, but I assume that the Metallica version has the same as the Thin Lizzy version.

Here is my interpretation of the Metallica version of "Whiskey in the Jar":

As I was going over the Cork and Kerry mountains,
I saw Captain Farrell and his money he was counting.
I first produced my pistol, and then produced my rapier.
I said stand and deliver, oh the devil, he may take ya,

(Yeah)

I took all of his money, and it was a pretty penny.
I took all of his money, yeah, and I brought it home to Molly.
She swore that she loved me, no never would she leave me,
But the devil take that women, yeah, but you know she tricked me easy

CHORUS: Musha ring dumma do damma da
Whack for my daddy 'ol
Whack for my daddy 'ol
There's whiskey in the jar-O

Being drunk and weary, I went to my last chamber,
Take the money with me, but I never knew the danger.
For about 6:00, maybe 7:00, (yeah) In walked Captain Ferrell,
I jumped up by my pistols, and I shot him with both barrels. (Yeah)

CHORUS: Musha ring dumma do damma da (yeah-yeah)
Whack for my daddy 'ol
Whack for my daddy 'ol
There's whiskey in the jar-O

{Lots of cool Thin Lizzy sounding riffs}

Now some men like the fishin', and some men like the fowlin',
Some men like to hear, to hear the cannonball a' roarin'.
Me, I like sleepin', 'specially in the morning's chamber,
But here I am in prison, here I am with the ball and chain. (Yeah)

CHORUS: Musha ring dumma do damma da (yeah, yeah)
Whack for my daddy 'ol
Whack for my daddy 'ol
There's whiskey in the jar-O (yeah)

ENDING: Whiskey in the jar-O
Musha ring dumma do damma da
Musha ring dumma do damma da
Musha ring dumma do damma da
Musha ring dumma do damma da

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From:
Date: 31 Dec 98 - 04:12 AM

RIP chain letter

THIS IS AN ABUSE OF MUDCAT

Subject: Abuse?
From: Kirk
Date: 31 Dec 98 - 06:04 PM

What is Abuse?

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: alison
Date: 31 Dec 98 - 06:14 PM

Don't worry Kirk, some nice kind person deleted a chain letter someone had slipped in here.

The Metallica version lyrics are pretty like the Thin Lizzy ones... I'll assume the guitar riffs are too.... will post them soon.

slainte

alison

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Kirk
Date: 31 Dec 98 - 09:15 PM

OK, I wondered what that was about.

Kirk

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: The Jinxminator
Date: 28 Jan 99 - 10:58 AM

Where the fuck can you find the bass and lead tab for Whiskey in the fucking jar? please?

Subject: Tune Add: WHISKEY IN THE JAR
From: alison
Date: 28 Jan 99 - 07:41 PM

Hi Ian and Kirk,

I had a go at working out the Thin Lizzy riffs so here you go. (Again.... not strictly accurate....... it's hard to be an electric guitar on a piano ....and where the lead went beserk I gave up ....you can try to figure that out yourselves....... alternatively just play very fast and stay inside the chord structures.)

This is the intro

Guitar chords are easy G D Em Em D G

MIDI file: WHISKINT.MID

Timebase: 480

Name: Whiskey in the jar (Intro)
TimeSig: 4/4 24 8
Key: G
Tempo: 100 (600000 microsec/crotchet)
Start
0000 1 72 054 1198 0 72 054 0002 1 72 044 0238 0 72 044 0002 1 72 029 0118 0 72 029 0002 1 71 030 0120 0 71 030 0019 1 69 042 0221 0 69 042 0000 1 71 038 1198 0 71 038 0002 1 71 025 0238 0 71 025 0002 1 71 049 0118 0 71 049 0002 1 69 046 0118 0 69 046 0002 1 67 030 0238 0 67 030 0002 1 69 029 1680 0 69 029 0019 1 67 024 0104 1 64 031 0049 0 67 024 0068 0 64 031 0037 1 62 026 0206 1 60 025 0032 0 62 026 0171 0 60 025 0036 1 57 036 0223 1 55 026 0032 0 57 036 0683 0 55 026 0035 1 55 026 1558 0 55 026 0107 1 59 030 0118 0 59 030 0002 1 62 048 0118 0 62 048 0002 1 64 031 0118 0 64 031 0002 1 67 045 0118 0 67 045 0002 1 64 022 0118 0 64 022 0002 1 62 027 0118 0 62 027 0002 1 64 029 1146 0 64 029 0019 1 62 022 0240 0 62 022 0035 1 59 023 0238 0 59 023 0002 1 57 023 0238 0 57 023 0002 1 55 022 0238 0 55 022 0002 1 52 015 0476 0 52 015 0290 1 50 013 0914 0 50 013 0960 1 67 068 0478 0 67 068 0002 1 66 047 0478 0 66 047 0002 1 64 061 1198 0 64 061 0002 1 62 034 0238 0 62 034 0002 1 62 050 0238 0 62 050 0002 1 64 034 0085 1 66 038 0035 0 64 034 0118 0 66 038 0002 1 67 045 0238 0 67 045 0002 1 64 029 0238 0 64 029 0002 1 66 036 0238 0 66 036 0002 1 62 034 0238 0 62 034 0002 1 64 029 0238 0 64 029 0002 1 67 037 0238 0 67 037 0002 1 67 044 1678 0 67 044 0002 1 62 034 0238 0 62 034 0002 1 62 043 0238 0 62 043 0002 1 64 034 0118 0 64 034 0017 1 66 038 0105 0 66 038 0032 1 67 046 0208 1 64 029 0015 0 67 046 0223 0 64 029 0002 1 66 030 0238 0 66 030 0002 1 62 029 0238 0 62 029 0002 1 64 029 0238 0 64 029 0002 1 67 032 0238 0 67 032 0002 1 67 038 1678 0 67 038 0002 1 62 050 0238 0 62 050 0002 1 62 038 0238 0 62 038 0002 1 64 033 0118 1 66 029 0002 0 64 033 0101 0 66 029 0019 1 67 030 0238 0 67 030 0002 1 64 035 0238 0 64 035 0002 1 66 025 0238 0 66 025 0002 1 62 028 0238 0 62 028 0002 1 64 024 0238 0 64 024 0002 1 67 031 0238 0 67 031 0002 1 67 053 1678 0 67 053 0002 1 55 031 0238 0 55 031 0002 1 55 027 0238 0 55 027 0002 1 57 030 0118 0 57 030 0002 1 59 028 0118 0 59 028 0002 1 62 030 0238 0 62 030 0002 1 55 027 0238 0 55 027 0002 1 57 038 0238 0 57 038 0002 1 55 020 0238 0 55 020 0002 1 59 036 0238 0 59 036 0002 1 55 032 0718 0 55 032
End

This program is worth the effort of learning it.

To download the March 10 MIDItext 98 software and get instructions on how to use it click here

ABC format:

X:1
T:Whiskey in the jar (Intro)
M:4/4
Q:1/4=100
K:G
c5cc/2B/2A|B5BB/2A/2G|A7G/2E/2|-E/4D3/4CA,G,3G,2|
-G,5B,/2D/2E/2G/2E/2D/2|E19/4D5/4B,A,|G,E,13/4D,15/4|
-D,4G2F2|E5DDE/4F3/4|GEFDEGG2|-G5DDE/2F/2|
-F/4G3/4EFDEGG2|-G5DDE/2F/2|GEFDEGG2|-G5G,G,A,/2B,/2|
DG,A,G,B,G,3||

and here's the lead break (well the first half of it anyway........ )

MIDI file: WHISKLEA.MID

Timebase: 480

Name: whiskey in the Jar (lead break)
TimeSig: 4/4 24 8
Key: G
Tempo: 100 (600000 microsec/crotchet)
Start
1440 1 71 061 0238 0 71 061 0002 1 72 031 0238 0 72 031 0002 1 74 053 0238 0 74 053 0002 1 72 042 0238 0 72 042 0002 1 71 031 0238 0 71 031 0002 1 69 044 0238 0 69 044 0002 1 71 048 0238 0 71 048 0002 1 69 053 0238 0 69 053 0002 1 67 033 0238 0 67 033 0002 1 66 042 0238 0 66 042 0002 1 67 040 0238 0 67 040 0002 1 69 035 0238 0 69 035 0002 1 71 043 0238 0 71 043 0002 1 72 041 0238 0 72 041 0002 1 74 045 0478 0 74 045 0002 1 71 048 0238 0 71 048 0002 1 74 045 0238 0 74 045 0002 1 76 040 0478 0 76 040 0002 1 76 053 0238 0 76 053 0002 1 74 036 0238 0 74 036 0002 1 76 042 0238 0 76 042 0002 1 79 048 0718 0 79 048 0002 1 76 042 0238 0 76 042 0002 1 74 046 0358 0 74 046 0002 1 76 042 0118 0 76 042 0002 1 74 037 0238 0 74 037 0002 1 76 042 0238 0 76 042 0002 1 71 040 0478 0 71 040 0002 1 74 033 0238 0 74 033 0002 1 72 038 0358 0 72 038 0002 1 71 037 0358 0 71 037 0002 1 69 022 0238 0 69 022 0002 1 67 040 0358 0 67 040 0002 1 66 038 0358 0 66 038 0002 1 64 029 0238 0 64 029 0002 1 72 034 0135 1 71 042 0017 0 72 034 0101 0 71 042 0087 1 69 034 0121 1 67 040 0016 0 69 034 0222 0 67 040 0002 1 66 029 0257 0 66 029 0002 1 64 036 0358 0 64 036 0002 1 62 041 0358 0 62 041 0002 1 60 026 0238 0 60 026 0002 1 59 029 0238 0 59 029 0002 1 60 015 0238 0 60 015 0002 1 59 018 0238 0 59 018 0002 1 60 021 0238 0 60 021 0002 1 59 016 0238 0 59 016 0002 1 60 024 0238 0 60 024 0002 1 59 016 0238 0 59 016 0002 1 60 015 0238 0 60 015 0002 1 59 012 0238 0 59 012 0002 1 60 009 0238 0 60 009 0002 1 59 014 0238 0 59 014 0002 1 60 022 0238 0 60 022 0002 1 59 030 0478 0 59 030 0002 1 71 050 0238 0 71 050 0002 1 72 049 0238 0 72 049 0002 1 74 031 0238 0 74 031 0002 1 72 046 0238 0 72 046 0002 1 71 049 0238 0 71 049 0002 1 69 049 0238 0 69 049 0002 1 71 042 0238 0 71 042 0002 1 69 042 0238 0 69 042 0002 1 67 038 0238 0 67 038 0002 1 66 039 0238 0 66 039 0002 1 67 043 0238 0 67 043 0002 1 69 036 0238 0 69 036 0002 1 71 042 0238 0 71 042 0002 1 72 042 0238 0 72 042 0002 1 74 049 0478 0 74 049 0002 1 71 053 0238 0 71 053 0002 1 74 050 0238 0 74 050 0002 1 76 049 0478 0 76 049 0002 1 76 061 0238 0 76 061 0002 1 74 049 0238 0 74 049 0002 1 76 049 0238 0 76 049 0002 1 79 048 0718 0 79 048 0002 1 76 043 0358 0 76 043 0002 1 74 046 0238 0 74 046 0002 1 76 052 0118 0 76 052 0002 1 74 037 0238 0 74 037 0002 1 76 044 0238 0 76 044 0052 1 71 048 0428 1 74 042 0015 0 71 048 0208 0 74 042 0019 1 72 040 0358 0 72 040 0002 1 71 032 0358 0 71 032 0002 1 69 036 0238 0 69 036 0002 1 67 035 0358 0 67 035 0002 1 66 035 0358 1 64 046 0032 0 66 035 0190 0 64 046 0020 1 72 032 0135 0 72 032 0036 1 71 041 0118 0 71 041 0069 1 69 042 0118 0 69 042 0053 1 67 052 0189 1 66 032 0049 0 67 052 0191 0 66 032 0002 1 64 032 0459 0 64 032 0053 1 64 042 0140 1 65 030 0015 0 64 042 0133 1 67 042 0022 0 65 030 0133 0 67 042 0022 1 64 032 0475 0 64 032 0019 1 72 026 0223 1 67 020 0015 0 72 026 0208 1 74 026 0015 0 67 020 0208 1 67 017 0015 0 74 026 0223 0 67 017 0053 1 76 017 0223 1 67 018 0015 0 76 017 0206 0 67 018 0005 1 62 028 0958 0 62 028 0257 1 62 022 0225 1 64 033 0048 0 62 022 0190 0 64 033 0002 1 67 041 0238 0 67 041 0002 1 71 048 0478 0 71 048 0002 1 71 038 0478 0 71 038 0002 1 69 033 0203 0 69 033 0018 1 67 033 0259 1 64 029 0031 0 67 033 0207 0 64 029 0002 1 62 031 0238 0 62 031 0002 1 62 026 0203 0 62 026 0002 1 64 033 0238 0 64 033 0018 1 67 020 0259 1 69 032 0031 0 67 020 0207 0 69 032 0002 1 67 023 0238 0 67 023 0002 1 64 031 0238 0 64 031 0002 1 62 026 0238 0 62 026 0002 1 64 016 0238 0 64 016 0002 1 60 020 0478 0 60 020
End

This program is worth the effort of learning it.

To download the March 10 MIDItext 98 software and get instructions on how to use it click here

ABC format:

X:1
T:whiskey in the Jar (lead break)
M:4/4
Q:1/4=100
K:G
B7c|dcBABAGF|GABcd2Bd|e2edeg3|ed3/2e/2deB2d|
c3/2B3/2AG3/2F3/2E|c/2BA/2GFE3/2D3/2C|B,CB,CB,CB,C|
B,CB,CB,2Bc|dcBABAGF|GABcd2Bd|e2edeg3|e3/2de/2de5/4B7/4d|
c3/2B3/2AG3/2F3/2E|c3/4B3/4A3/4G3/4FE9/4E/2=F/2G3/4|
E9/4c3/4GdG5/4e3/4G|D5DEG|B2B2AGED|D3/4E5/4GAGEDE|
C8||

Hope this helps, if printed music is easier e-mail me, (or use the personal messages.)

Jinxminator...... seeing as you asked SO nicely(!?!)..... try OLGA (on line guitar archives)it has most guitar riffs, (admittedly not this one), and please bear in mind that we have very young people visit this one.

Slainte

alison

Subject: Lyr Add: WHISKEY IN THE JAR
From:
Date: 29 Jan 99 - 05:11 PM

Hi,

Here is a version I play (with chords).

Slainte

Szarak

WHISKEY IN THE JAR

As I was going over the far fam'd Kerry Mountains, G e
I met with Captain Farrel, and his money he was countin', C G
I first produced my pistol, and I than produced my rapier, G e
Sayin': "Stand and deliver for you are my bold deceiver". C G

CHO: Musha ring dum a doo dum a da, D
Whack fol de daddy o, G
Whack fol de daddy o C
There's whiskey in the jar. GDG

I counted out his money and it made a pretty penny,
I put it in my pocket, and I took it home to Jenny,
She sighed, and she swore that she never would deceive me,
But the devil takes the women for they never can be easy.

I went into my chamber all for to take a slumber,
I dreamt of gold and jewels and for sure it was no wonder,
But Jenny drew my charges and she filled them out with water,
Then sent for Captain Farrel, to be ready for the slaughter.

'Twas early in the morning just before I rose to travel,
Up comes a band of footmen and likewise, Captain Farrel,
I first produced my pistol for she stole away my rapier,
But I couldn't shoot the water, so a prisoner I was taken.

If anyone can aid me 'tis my brother in the army,
If I can find his station, in Cork or in Killarney,
And if he'll go with me we'll go roving in Kilkenny,
And I'm sure he'll treat me better than my darling sporting Jenny.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Ben
Date: 03 Feb 99 - 12:24 PM

Holly #$%*. All I wanted was the lyrics to "Whiskey In The Jar". I had no idea of the history behind the song. I am a much wiser person now! Thanks to all!

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: The_one_and_only_Dai
Date: 04 Feb 99 - 07:42 AM

Here's a cat amongst the pigeons. This (popular) version has a counterpart on the other side of the Irish border.

I've heard a Loyalist version which is a bit more - er - direct than the (kind of) Republican one which everybody knows, I will try and persuade 'one who knows' to post it.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: alison
Date: 04 Mar 99 - 06:02 PM

Hi,

OK.. I now have a fancy gadget that will convert music into guitar tab... so if any of you are still looking drop me and e-mail (use the personal messages bit at the top of the page)with your e-mail address and I'll send you a GIF.

Slainte

alison

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From:
Date: 05 Mar 99 - 01:31 AM

eye god! I've found so many different versions of " whisky in the jar", that it's makin me noggin ache!

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Roy Harris
Date: 05 Mar 99 - 11:48 AM

I first heard 'my' version 'Bold Lovell' in the late 1960's sung by a fine singer, Mike Herring, of Peterborough,at the Nottingham Traditional Music Club when he did a guest spot there. I founded the club in 1967, it ran for 22 years. Mike told me he had the song from A.L. Lloyd. A.L.(Bert) supplied me with the words, I went on to sing it around the folk circuits, telling people that it was "An English version of Whiskey In the Jar". In my first ever concert in New York, held in Wayne Hollingsworth's loft circa '76,I sang it and announced it this way only to be approached by a gleeful Roberts & Barrand telling me it was in the 'Green Mountain Songster'. Bert Lloyd later confirmed this to me, adding that he had adapted his version from there! A further memory -I was once on the Gene Shay radio show in Philly, doing a mix of live and album tracks. Gene played Bold Lovell, a lady rang in to tell me "How marvellous that I could sing like that, and play guitar like that at the same time". I was very tempted to take credit, but had to admit to her that it was Martin Carthy on guitar. I always found it a pleasureable song to sing. The phrase "Both brisk and lively lads, and champions of folly" just rolls off the tongue. A great song. When I recorded it I called the album "Champions of Folly" I'm flattered to know that people in America have the album. Did it go any further? If you bought that record,far off from the UK, please let me know. Thanks. ROY.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: KillerBob66
Date: 06 Mar 99 - 01:24 AM

Kirk, I believe you made a little mistake in Metallica's lyrics for Whisky in the Jar "Me, I like sleepin', 'specially in MY MOLLY'S chamber"

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From:
Date: 06 Mar 99 - 06:42 PM

Roy, I am very pleased to see you posting here.

I bought that album in Montreal in the late 1970's or early 1980's, as well as another one called "By Sandbank Fields", I think -- I'm not by my LP's as I type this. You'd do us a great service if you could have these released on CD.

"Both" frisk and lively lads? So that's it! For nearly twenty years I thought it was "bold"!

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Persephone
Date: 12 Apr 99 - 09:32 PM

i heard this song on the radio a couple of days ago (metallica version) i thought it sounded like a folk song, but i wasnt sure. its such a wondeful song, and i find it refreshing that they chose to remake it. it made me think of how sick us muscisians are of covers, and that maybe in addition to the originals that i write, i should take a look at old folk songs and make them my own. songs survive so long for a reason;)

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: alison
Date: 12 Apr 99 - 11:26 PM

Yes, I heard it the other day too.. I think its in the charts over here....

The Metallica version sounded exactly like the Thin Lizzy one.

Slainte

alison

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 13 Apr 99 - 10:14 AM

Personally I can't stand the Metallica version, but as I've said on earlier threads, if popular bands covering standards will help people search out the originals, then it's a good thing.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From:
Date: 09 Sep 99 - 01:38 PM

Actually, that's EXACTLY what I'm trying to research...the history of the song. Most of these higwaymen songs have some kind of historical fact behind them. Anyone know about this one? I am involved in renaissance faires all over the U.S. and three different performs at one faire each have a different version. We ALL want to know if there is a REAL story behind the song. Please EMAIL me if you know.

Thanks.

Larry

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Art Thieme
Date: 10 Sep 99 - 09:13 PM

Roy,

Truly is good to hear your cybervoice here.

Jeff Davis, singing partner of Jeff Warner (Jeff & Jeff), says in his TRADITIONAL column in the current FOLK ALLIANCE NEWSLETTER that this song had NOT BEEN COLLECTED IN IRELAND. The first time it was collected was by Frank and Ann Warner--parents of Jeff & Garret--from (as Sandy said) Lena Bourne Fish. In the Warners' great book of songs they collected, _AMERICAN TRADITIONAL FOLKSONGS FROM THE ANNE AND FRANK WARNER COLLECTION_ -- (Syracuse Univ. Press--1984) it states that the "song was collected in Ireland" but as a "tune only".

Art

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: CarlZen
Date: 11 Sep 99 - 02:14 AM

Bezell-

The song appears in "The Folksongs of Noth America" by Allan Lomax. He credits Frank Warner, also. The introduction to the song has a lot of the type of history you may be looking for. The most interesting thing to me was his statement that "There is a close connection between this ballad and John Gay's 'Beggar's Opera' (1728). It's worth a trip to the local library. If you've enver seen the book, you may find it fascinating enough to purchase.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Sourdough
Date: 11 Sep 99 - 11:46 AM

In the Boston Atheneum is a one of a kind book by a highwayman sentenced to death in Colonial Massachusetts. Hemay have been a sailor at some time in his life because he had a lot of comlex tattoos.

While waiting for his execution, he didn't write a song but did write his memoirs and asked that they be bound in leather made from his decorative skin. This was done and the book is in the Atheneum.

I never had the nerve to ask the librarian whether there was a bookmark, too.

Sourdough

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar (Grateful Dead version)
From: Tom Henehan
Date: 24 Dec 99 - 03:24 PM

I just got the Grateful Dead box-set "So Many Roads," which includes a rehearsal tape of "Whiskey in the Jar," recorded shortly before Jerry Garcia's demise. (It's the second-to-last selection on the album, followd by the title tune, which was recorded at the Dead's final show in Chicago.)

Jerry had just recorded the song with David Grisman for their "Shady Grove" album (which I have NOT yet heard). To my ear, he's got the melody "wrong," or perhaps "different from the traditional": the verse should have an "ABAB" melodic structure, as I recall it, with a rising or starting line, floowed by a concluding line, then a repeart of the two lines before the refrain. Jerry sings it "ABBB," with the second or "finishing" melody line repeated almost-ad-infinitum, which sounds counterintuitive to me.

However:

All such quibbling aside, it's a nice rendition, with the band gradually joining in to accompany Jerry's John-Hurt-style fingerpicking. Since it's a rehearsal recording, you hear some verbal byplay commenting on the old song. Hearing this cut prompted me to look up the lyrics on Mudcat and to stumble across this discussion thread, and I'm glad that happened.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Liam's Brother
Date: 24 Dec 99 - 11:49 PM

I don't know where the song was first or last collected but there is a (circa 1850) London broadside of "Whiskey in the Jar" at the Bodlian Library. What we don't know is whether it was at that time a traditional song, a composition of a broadside scribe or a music hall song.

All the best,
Dan Milner

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,Bruce O.
Date: 03 May 01 - 10:38 PM

For evidence that the "Patrick Flemming" version, c 1800, in Holloway and Black's 'Later English Broadside Ballads', I, #90, is no later than c 1684 see ZN787 in the broadside ballad index on my website. www.erols.com/olsonw

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,Steve
Date: 07 Dec 01 - 03:11 PM

I remember that there's also a rather truncated version in Alfred Williams's Folk Songs of the Upper Thames. This shows it was in oral circulation in England about 1900-1920. But I've misplaced my copy of the book so I can't see what Williams says about it! Anyone?

Steve

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Percustard
Date: 25 Jun 02 - 02:59 AM

Just noting that the words to the song about Ben Hall's demise, The Streets of Forbes" (mentioned above) has an error.

Ben didnt go to Goobang Creek.

He went to Goobang Mick (who then betrayed him to the police).

Subject: Lyr Add: WHISKEY IN THE JAR
From:
Date: 18 Sep 03 - 03:35 PM

I've sort of become a local hero to the song... LOL

I did a paper in my freshman comp class about it, about the three versions I had (and preferred and the time) Metallica, Thin Lizzy, and the Dubliners.

The interesting thing, is that it never mentions him getting caught in either the Metallica, or the Thin Lizzy version, except at the end when Jame Hetfield sings "... Me I like sleepin', specially in my Molly's chamber, but here I am in prison, here I am with the ball and chain."

That's OK though, I found another version, on the "A Tear and a Smile from the Emerald Isle: The Gold Collection, Favorite Irish Songs" CD. Personally I hate that version, its way too damn poppy and happy... But here's the lyrics:

(Sounds like calliope music)

As I was going over Kilmagenny Mountain
I met with Capt. Farrel and his money he was counting
I first me pistol, and then I drew me saber,
Saying, "Stand and deliver for I am a bold deceiver."

With me ring dum a do dumma da
Whack for the daddy o
Whack for the daddy o
There's whiskey in the jar.

He counted out his money and it made a pretty penny.
I put it in my pocket and I gave it to my Jenny.
She sighed and she swore that she never would betray me,
But the devil take the women! They never can be easy.

With me ring dum a do dumma da
Whack for the daddy o
Whack for the daddy o
There's whiskey in the jar.

I went into me chamber, oh, for to take a slumber.
I dreamt of gold and jewels and for sure it is no wonder.
But Jenny drew my charges and filled them up with charges,
And she went for Capt. Farrel to be ready for the slaughter.

With me ring dum a do dumma da
Whack for the daddy o
Whack for the daddy o
There's whiskey in the jar.

'Twas early in the morning before I rose to travel.
Up comes a band of footmen and likewise Capt. Farrel.
I then produce my pistol for she stolen away me saber,
But I couldn't shoot the water so a prisoner I was taken.

With me ring dum a do dumma da
Whack for the daddy o
Whack for the daddy o
There's whiskey in the jar

If anyone can aid me it's me brother in army,
If I can learn his station in Cork or Killarny;
And if he'll come and join me, we'll go rolling in Killkenny,
And I'll gauge he'll treat me fairer than my darlin' sporting Jenny.

With me ring dum a do dumma da
Whack for the daddy o
Whack for the daddy o
There's whiskey in the jar.

With me ring dum a do dumma da
Whack for the daddy o
Whack for the daddy o
There's whiskey in the jar.
(End)

It isn't much different I suppose, but the song is way too happy sounding for me to like. LOL, I prefer the Dubliners version, my wife loves the Metallica version, and my mom likes both the thin Lizzy and Metallica versions better.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Sep 03 - 03:43 PM

sorry, left out some stuff, the line is of course "i first produce me pistol, and then i drew my saber"

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Charley Noble
Date: 18 Sep 03 - 08:34 PM

James-

You or someone else also messed up one line:

"but jenny drew my charges and filled them up with charges"

Which should run to rhyme with the next line as:


But Jenny drew my charges and filled them up with WATER...

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Sep 03 - 03:52 PM

hehe, yeh... little scatter brained with i typed it

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Charley Noble
Date: 19 Sep 03 - 09:03 PM

James-

Not to worry! Do feel free to come back with more goodies. We don't always savage "guests."

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,James Hood
Date: 21 Sep 03 - 11:16 PM

its cool, im still doing more work on seeing what i can dig up, heck i may even be able to find my english paper i did on these... heh

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Sep 03 - 08:23 AM

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,GUEST Patrick Sheehan
Date: 27 Oct 03 - 01:32 AM

Anybody know why the song is called "Whiskey in the Jar"? More specifically, why do they say, "There's whiskey in the jar" in the chorus when not one of the versions of the song has anything to do with Whiskey or Jars?
   The last stanza in a lot of the versions has the bit about "the juice of the barley" but all of the songs are about this outlaw guy getting betrayed by some girl, so why is the chorus a bunch of nonsense and a random bit about booze?


Some of my thoughts:
   I keep looking but everywhere I look tells me the same thing: the words in the chorus are just nonsense. But I find that hard to believe. It sounds very much like the little Irish I know:

"Musha ring um a do um a da" is very very similar sounding to these Irish words:
Musha => M'uishe (my whiskey)
ring um a => rinne me/ (rinne = past tense of "de/an" which is "do, make, perform, carry out, commit, turn out, reach, establish"; me/ = "I, me")
do => don (from "do" + "an" = "to the, for the")
um a da => amada/n (fool)

which translates to "I made my whiskey for the fool." Which, as a translation, has the nice qualities that it follows correct Irish grammar and also follows stress rules for both sentences and individual words. It also has to do with whiskey, which is nice.

my whiskey made a fool of me would translate to, I think:
Rinne se/ m'uishe me/ amada/n. Which doesn't work as a translation because the subject has to follow the verb.

"Whack for the daddy-o" is sometimes said to be a mistranscription of "work of the devil-o" which makes some sense as far as my first translation goes in an "alcohol is the devil's brew" sort of sense. It is also in keeping with the story line revolving around a highwayman.

A possible anternative Irish translation is as follows:
uacht failte ta/ diobh,
which sounds like "whack fol cha ta jiov" which is pretty close. Unfortunately, I don't think it makes any sense since it translates to "It is a testament of welcome for them".

My last thought is that maybe it has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with whiskey at all. Maybe the line "there's whiskey in the jar" is actually the mistranscribed line. Maybe the chorus never had anything to do with whiskey.

The Irish word for whiskey, "uisce" (pronounced "ish-keh"), is also the Irish word for water. And many of the versions of the song have his girl filling up his cartridges with water as a main plot point.

-----
Those are some ideas. Does anybody else have any helpful suggestions? (Aside from the suggestion that it is just nonsense...)
Does anyone know where this chorus originates? (There is a very similar sounding chorus in "Whiskey, you're the divil" which the Clancys cover, I think, and that song has a bit more to do with whiskey but still not much as it's mainly a war song.)
Any leads on what's goin' on here?

- Very confused,
   Patrick Sheehan

[e-mail]

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: John Robinson (aka Cittern)
Date: 27 Oct 03 - 04:42 AM

Slightly off topic, but after dismissing this song for many years after hearing way too many Irish Theme Bar versions, I was knocked off my seat by the version done by Last Night's Fun. So different that it had to be introduced since nobody would have recognised it as this song!

Best regards
John Robinson
http://www.JulieEllison.co.uk

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,knowitall
Date: 27 Oct 03 - 11:19 AM

Old bloke in the bar, tells tall tales of his adventurous past to tourists and passing trade, in return they usually buy him a drink. If the are not quick in providing the tipple, the storyteller leaves them with a cliffhanger and musharingdum... (blah blah) they have to be reminded "whack for me" (order me a drink) which means knock on the bar to catch the Innkeepers attention. When the whiskey is poured from the jar they get the next installment of the story. That's the tradition where all the different versions originate from.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,Den at work
Date: 27 Oct 03 - 04:04 PM

Metallica's version is the same as Thin Lizzy's with a bit more uumph!Metallica were big Lizzy fans and really covered (the Lizzy version) as a tribute.

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 27 Oct 03 - 07:55 PM

I have just come back tonight from a concert by Tomas Lynch in Glenfarg Folk Club, where he finished with an amazing version of this song, sung slowly with a hauntingly beautiful guitar accompaniment in DADGAD.

The whole audience was mesmerised ....

Murray

Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Charley Noble
Date: 27 Oct 03 - 08:37 PM

Patrick-

I think you're on to something with your translation of the "nonesense words" as having to do with whisky. Here's a mug to you!

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

Subject: Lyr Add: WHISKY IN THE JAR
From: Cluin
Date: 28 Oct 03 - 01:26 AM

I made some alterations years ago so this is the one I do, played really fast and loud.


Whisky in the Jar

As I was going over the Cork and Kerry Mountains
I met with Captain Farrell and his money, he was countin'
I first produced my pistol; then I rattled forth my saber
sayin', "Stand and deliver, for I am the Bold Deceiver!"

Musha rig rumma du rumma da
Whack fol the daddy-oh
Whack fol the daddy-oh
There's whisky in the jar

Well, he counted out his money and it made a pretty penny
I took the booty home with me and gave it to my Jenny
She kissed me and she swore that she never would deceive me
But, while I was a-sleepin', of my blade she did relieve me

Musha rig...

It was early in the morning I awoke to Jenny's favour
Them guards were standin' `round me, and me without my saber
Well, I flew to my pistol, but alas, I was mistaken
For Jenny'd wet the powder and it's a prisoner I am taken

   Musha rig...

Well, they hauled me off to gaol, without no judge or lawyer
And the arm of Captain Farrell around Jenny, my destroyer
But they didn't tie my fists, so I knocked the sentry down
And I bid a fond farewell unto the gaol in Slaigo Town

Musha rig...

Now, I think I'll find my brother: the one what's in the army
I don't know where he's station'd; Is it Cork or in Killarney?
Together we'll go rovin' through the mountains of Kilkenny
And I know he'll treat me fairer than my darlin' whorin' Jenny

   Musha rig...

Subject: Lyr Add: WHISKEY IN THE JAR (Glasgow broadside)
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 23 Dec 03 - 08:21 PM

The story remains pretty much the same, but I like this old version from Glasgow Broadside Ballads website, from about 1850.

Lyr. Add: WHISKY IN THE JAR
   Air- The Sporting hero.

I'm a bold Irish hero, who never yet was daunted,
In the courting of a pretty girl I very seldom wanted,
In the courting of a pretty girl I own it was my folly,
I would venture my life for you my pretty Molly.

Chorus
Mush a ring a do a da, fal lal da do da addy,
Mush a ring a do a da, there's whisky in the jar.

As I was walking over Wicklow mountain,
I met with Colonel Powers, and his money he was counting.
I pulled out my sword, and likewise my rapier,
Saying stand and deliver, for I'm a bold deceiver,

Cho.

It's when I got the money it was a pretty penny,
I put [it] in my pocket, and I took it home to Molly;
She said, my dearest Pat, I never will deceive you,
But the devil's in the women, they never can be easy,

Cho.

I went to Molly's chamber, you'll think it little wonder,
I laid my head upon her bed, for to get a slumber;
But as I lay sleeping, I knew not the matter,
She unloaded my two pistols, and filled them full of water.

Cho.

And as I lay sleeping, I dreamed of my pretty Nelly
I saw Colonel Powers, and four stout able fellows,
I flew to my pistols, but I found I was mistaken,
Out flashed the water, and a prisoner I was taken,

Cho.

O Molly, dearest Molly, now since you have deceived me
Over high hills and mountains, I'm forced to leave you,
I am to blame, but you are the faulter,
You have brought my poor head almost to a halter,

Cho.

It's I have two brothers in the army,
The one lies in Cork, and the other's in Killarney,
And if I had them here I would be blythe and jolly,
I would rather have them now, then you my pretty Molly

Cho.

Its when they led me through the hall,
I threw back the soldiers and loudly did call,
Many have I robbed, but never yet killed any;
And now I must die on the plains of Kilkenny.

Cho.

MS. # Mu23-yl:137, Glasgow Broadside Ballads, Murray Collection.

Quoted from the broadside:
"Fourth Edition since 18th October 1850.
- This song is a regular nightly favourite in the Glasgow Saloons and it meets with its regular nightly applause. It is in fact, within the last few months, become as proverbial in the mouths of the youth of Glasgow as "Jim Crow." As this is the fourth time it has beeb printed, all can possess it from the usual place, namely at the Poet's Box, 6 St. Andrews Lane, Glasgow, along with many other nic-nacks...." "January 13, 1855."

Is the air, "The Sporting Hero," the name of the one usually heard?
Whisky In The Jar

Another version, in the Bodleian Ballads Catalogue, was printed in London, H. Disley, 1860-1883, Firth b.25(168) (As I was going over Calvert mountain, I met with Captain Everett.... In this one, the "young fellow" knocks down the turnkey and makes his escape out of sweet Philip's town).

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 23 Dec 03 - 08:42 PM

The song also appeared on broadsides as The Sporting Hero and -perhaps a little later- as The Sporting Hero, or, Whiskey in the Bar; the tune title may be a circular reference. Examples at :

The sporting hero ("I am a sporting hero, that never yet was daunted ...") Performer: Longworth, J. Venue: Bermondsey Hotel. Printed by J. Bradley, Bradford, n.d.

Sporting hero, or, Whiskey in the bar ("I am a sporting hero, I never yet was daunted ...") Manchester & Leeds, 1850-55.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 23 Dec 03 - 09:37 PM

I see that Bruce had added a link from his site to the online Newgate Calendar, where details are given of the life and death of the highwayman Patrick Flemming:

PATRICK FLEMMING. An Irish Highwayman who held Sway near the Bog of Allen and, after numerous Murders, was executed On 24th of April, 1650

It appears that Whisky in the Jar, or whatever you prefer to call it, was a stage song based on the earlier broadside Patrick Flemming or Flemmen; the powder-dampening episode being retained while other details were changed. Although it's possible that the chorus may have some meaning on the lines of some the ingenious suggestions made earlier in this thread, it's probably just as likely that it's meaningless "cod Irish" of the music-hall variety.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 24 Dec 03 - 11:30 AM

I can't get the page I linked for the Glasgow Broadside Ballads version of "Whisky in the Jar" I posted, but it can be found via the index. Whisky in the Jar
Scroll down, near the bottom of the list. A link is provided to the one in the Bodleian, but given here from Ord's "Bothy Songs and Ballads ...." (1930).

Malcolm Douglas pretty well pins down this (at times) popular song. A title from the nonsense chorus title seems to have displaced "The Sporting Hero" as the title.
Was the chorus of this song just something to get the music hall audiences involved?

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,JTT
Date: 25 Dec 03 - 03:13 AM

1) He's a raparee, surely?

2) Chorus is port-a-bhéal - but if the first word, "musha" has any meaning, it'd be má 'sé "if so".

3) How's about that loyalist version, Dai? Did your friend release it?

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,skyesong
Date: 26 Dec 03 - 11:39 AM

In some Australian versions, the one by the Seekers for example, the second line of the chorus is "Whacko the derry-oh". This used to be a common phrase in Australian vernacular and I recall reading somewhere (probably in one of Bill Wannan's articles in the Australasian Post in the 1960s) that it was a corruption of an Irish phrase meaning to get drunk or go on the spree. There is a Scots Gaelic word "daorach" which means drunkenness. Assuming there is a similar word in Irish, it could well have been corrupted to "derry". I also once heard a version with Australian place-names:
'One day as I was walking across the Weddin Mountains' and
'I bade farewell to the jail in Parramatta town'.

Subject: Lyr Add: SPORTING HERO (from Bodleian)
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 04 Feb 04 - 02:34 PM

Lyr. Add: SPORTING HERO, or, Whiskey in the Jar

I am a sporting hero, I never yet was daunted,
In treating of pretty girls at places where I haunted.
In rum, gin & brandy, I would spend all my store,
And when that is done I would boldly rob for more.

Mush a ring a ding a da, ri too ral la,
Ri too ral laddy O, there's whiskey in the jar.

As I was crossing over Mulberry mountain,
I met with Col. Pepper whose money he was countin
It's first I draw my pistol, my broadsword and rapier
Saying stand and deliver, for I am your deceiver.

I picked up the money it was a pretty penny,
I took it home to Molly for she had not away,
I took it home to Molly, she swore she'd never deceive me,
But the devil's in the woman for the never can be easy.

I being wet and weary and for to take a slumber,
I laid myself down all in my Molly's chamber,
She unloaded my pistols & loaded them with water
I was taken like a lamb going to the slaughter.

Early in the morning between six and seven,
The strong guards surround me, likewise Capt. Nevin,
I flew to my pistols but I found I was mistaken,
When I fired off the water I was a prisoner taken.

I stood in the hall while the turnkeys were rolling,
I stood in the hall while the names they were callin
I drew up my metal bolts & knock'd the sentry down
And made good my way out of Melbrow town.

I have got two brothers and they are in the army,
The one is in Cork and the other in Kilkenny,
If I had them ere tonight I would be brisk & jolly
I would rather have em ere than you deceitful Molly

Some take great delight in their fishing and their fowling,
And others take delight in their carriage rolling,
But I take great delight in being brisk and jolly,
Filling up strong liquors for you deceitful Molly.

I have not corrected the printing errors. From Bodleian Collection, Ballads Catalogue, 2806 C16(329), J. Cadman, Manchester; Andrews, Leeds, between 1850-1855.
Also printed in Bradford, no date.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From:
Date: 03 Mar 04 - 07:40 PM

Thank you guys !!
I was searching to know if "musha ring durum da" was gaelic, and i've found much more. Now this song remains however a knaves song. Last time I heard it, it was sung in the street of the little village Tubbercurry, co.Sligo, by a group of drunken youngs, under the rain and long after pubs had closed, just before police arrived and sent us home. Nasty song, for nasty people.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Mar 04 - 05:42 PM

where can I find the origins of this song. circa? who wrote it? where?

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 23 Mar 04 - 06:24 PM

Presumably you've read the thread. We don't know who wrote it (though that information may perhaps turn up one day), but the middle of the 19th century seems likely; though, as stated, it was based on an earlier broadside song (which in turn was based on real events) of which forms have been found in oral currency in the USA and Canada.

Although the original events took place in Ireland, the music hall song would appear to be British, and the refrain meaningless and made just to sound "typically" Irish to non-Gaelic speakers; though of course we can't be certain of that. Look also at the late Bruce Olson's website (mentioned earlier) for more on the Patrick Flemming broadside: Patrick Flemming.

Subject: Lyr Add: WHISKEY IN THE JAR (from Grateful Dead)
From: GUEST,Lorraine
Date: 08 Apr 04 - 08:38 AM

Hey just to throw a spanner in the works,

I found all of the above and another one, by Jerry Garcia from the Grateful Dead(obviously not the original) but the lyrics are completely different to any of the other one, its a really great version him on guitar and David Grisman on Mandolin


right here we go

As I was a-goin' over Gilgarra mountains
I met Colonel Pepper and his money he was counting
I drew forth my pistol and I rattled my sabre
Saying "stand and deliver, for I am a bold deceiver"

Chorus
Musha ringum duram da
Whack fol de daddy-o
Whack fol de daddy-o
There's whiskey in the jar

The shining yellow coins did sure look bright and jolly
I took the money home and I gave it to my Molly
She promised and she vowed that she never would deceive me
But the devil's in the women for they never can be easy

[chorus]

When I awoke between the hours of six and seven
Guards were standing 'round me in numbers odd and even
I flew to my pistols, but alas I was mistaken
I fired off my pistols and a prisoner was taken

[chorus]

They put me in jail without a judge or jury
For robbing Colonel Pepper in the morning so early
They didn't take my fist so I knocked down the sentry
And I bid a long farewell to that cold penitentiary

[chorus]

Some take delight in fishing and bowling
Others take delight in carriage a-rollin'
I take delight in the juice of the barley
Courting pretty women in the morning so early

[chorus]


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The version on So Many Roads is essentially the same, with some minor differences as highlighted below. It fades in as Jerry is singing the chorus, followed by the last verse, (with the first two lines in the wrong order):
[chorus]

Some take delight in the carriage a-rollin'
Others take delight in fishing and bowling
I take delight in the fruit of the barley
Courting pretty women in the morning so early

[chorus]
Jerry then takes the band through the complete song:
As I was a-walkin' over Gilgarra mountains
I met Colonel Pepper and his money he was counting
I fired off my pistols and I rattled my sabre
Saying "stand and deliver, for I am a bold deceiver"

[chorus]

Them shiny golden coins did sure look bright and jolly
I took the money home and I gave it to my Molly
She promised and she vowed that she never would deceive me
But the devil's in the women and they never can be easy

[chorus]

As I was a-wakin' 'tween the hours of six and seven
Guards were standing 'round my bed in numbers odd and even
I didn't have my pistols so they ... to prison
Da da da da da, da da da da da da da da
[Jerry realises he's got the words wrong!]

[chorus]

They put me in jail without a judge or jury
For ... Colonel Pepper in the morning so early
They didn't take my fist so I knocked down a sentry
And I bid a long farewell to that cold penitentiary

[chorus]

Some take delight in fishing and bowling
Others take delight in the carriage a-rollin'
I take delight in the juice of the barley
Courting pretty women in the morning so early

[chorus]

As I was a-ridin' over Gilgarra mountains
I met Colonel Pepper and his money he was counting
I shot off my pistols and I rattled my sabre
Saying "stand and deliver, for I am a bold deceiver"

[chorus]

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,Mark S.
Date: 07 Jun 04 - 12:51 PM

Greetings to you from New Zealand.

My girlfriend and I were first exposed to this song by the Metallica cover and liked it from the start. I must say I'm amazed to find this thread that still seems to be alive after 7 years! It took quite some finding (Google: "history of" "whisky in the jar" +Gaelic), but what a great discovery.

I was inspired to look into the history of the song while hearing it at 2am on the radio while eating jelly beans in a car park lookout above our coastal town (it really goes to show this song has truly done the rounds and possibly what a strange fellow I am).

The song still receives regular air time on the radio here, mostly in its Thin Lizzy incarnation but I have heard a couple of other covers I cannot identify. One rendition apparently backed by a harpsichord, which struck me as extremely odd but makes sense when you consider the age of the song.

I suspect that it made its way here in the 1960's based on comments I have heard from my mother and grandmother. It does however seem to have lost its reputation as a "knaves" song, being sung and known by almost everyone here at some point.

I never knew that there were any different lyrics and reading these posts really fills in the gaps left by Metalica/Thin Lizzy. Thank you to everyone past and present who have left these tit-bits.

Now I find myself wishing I could hear it performed live as so many have described it on here.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: emjay
Date: 14 Jul 04 - 05:04 PM

refresh

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,jim
Date: 23 Sep 04 - 09:26 AM

Hello folks
have read this thread with interest as I too have been trying to decypher the almost code-like chorus. Just to throw confusion into the mix, it has been suggested to me that the 'whack fo' mi daddy-o' line could relate to the term 'whack' used by the british army in years gone by, meaning the last shot delivered by the commanding officer to those excuted by firing squad (later pinched for the term 'gettin whacked'). This suggestion would indeed fit into the framework if the lyrics were to be taken literally (in terms of highway man folklore / Patrick Fleming etc) as the first verse does sound like the proverbial 'stick-up... Capt Farrell... his money he was a countin'... stand and deliver etc... erm, now i'm talking jibberish... Your thoughts ladies & gentlemen....

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Lighter
Date: 23 Sep 04 - 10:10 AM

Jerry Garcia's version comes from Alan Lomax, Folksongs of North America (1960). The ultimate source was Lena Bourne Fish of New Hampshire, recorded by the Warners about 1940.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: PoppaGator
Date: 23 Sep 04 - 10:18 AM

This thread is so old, it contains a post I made under my "real-life" name way back on Christmas Eve 1999, before I became a member and assumed my current fake name. (I don't really understand how the prefix "GUEST" got omitted; I was *not* posting as a member...)

I'm glad to see it reappear. What a great old song! I'm sure we'll never unravel its mysteries (e.g., what in God's name does the chorus have to do with the story told in the verses?)

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 23 Sep 04 - 01:08 PM

Nothing in particular, as we've already mentioned a number of times. It's just there to add a little "local colour" for music hall audiences. Attempts like "Jim"'s to "explain" it are ingenious but lead nowhere; there is nothing to explain, no hidden code. That won't stop people continuing to invent imaginary meanings of their own, of course; but such explanations usually show little knowledge of the song's history.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Nerd
Date: 23 Sep 04 - 01:22 PM

Yeah, Poppagator, I too am in there under my real name. Funny, huh?

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Nerd
Date: 23 Sep 04 - 01:25 PM

"Whack fo the daddy oh, Whack fo the daddy oh, Whack fo the daddy oh, there's whisky in the jar..."

obviously means the guy is planning to slap his father three times for lying to him and saying there was no whisky left.

What is WRONG with you people who can't understand simple English :-)

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: PoppaGator
Date: 23 Sep 04 - 01:38 PM

Malcolm,

I understand, and largely agree with, your assertion that "there is nothing to explain, no hidden code."

However, I would assert that it can really help to enhance a singer's performance for him/her to have a "backstory" in which to believe. It can be completely spurious, and no one but the singer need ever know the details, but the intensity and affect of the performance can be strengthened by the singer's ability to project him/herself into some imagined scenario involving the song. And an elaborate explanation (whether false or true) of how and why the lyrics say what they say can provide this for a performer.

I am certainly in favor of making a clear distinction between hard facts and scholarship on the one hand and wild flights of fancy on the other, but I am glad to read about both.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 23 Sep 04 - 03:12 PM

That's perfectly true; but unfortunately they often can't resist sharing those flights of fancy with others, who then repeat fantasy as fact. Makes getting at the real truth far harder than it ought to be when you have to address all that stuff as well as the hard evidence!

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: PoppaGator
Date: 23 Sep 04 - 03:23 PM

You're right, Malcolm. If I were more serious about the scholarly side of this stuff, I'd get frustrated, too.

Nerd -- I gave a big fat hint about where to find my (not-so) secret identity; how 'bout you?

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 23 Sep 04 - 04:17 PM

In a list of "newest songs,' printed in Edinburgh in 1855- Whisky in the Jar. That version had the chorus Mush a ring a do a da, fal lal da do da addy, Mush a ring a do a da, there's whisky in the jar.

Musha ding a ring a ra etc. there's whiskey in the jar was printed in England at the same time.

Perhaps there should be a thread with nothing but 'whack' choruses and songs. A few:

Song- Whack! Row De Dow-
(No fool is Yankee Doodle Dandy)

Song- I never take more than my whack.

Song- Whack for the Emerald Isle

Song- The tale of Barney O'Whack, doorkeeper for the convent of St. Margaret's.

Song- Finigan's Wake- Whack, hurrah, dance to your partners; whack, hurroo boys...

Song- The Irishman's Shanty- Now boys, one for the Paddy,
Whack! Paddy's the boy!

Song- McGuffins Home Run- You hit it a whack, now...

Song- The Lanigan's Ball- Whack! Fal lal, fal la, tal ladeddy etc.

Song- Paddy Whack- Di du Mack Whack, I am just from the town of Bally hack, where seven praties weigh a ton.

Song- August the One- Whack fol de rol de ri do, etc.

Song- McClellan will be president- With a whack, row de dow ...

Song- The Eight-hour System- Whack row de dow...

Song- Paddy's Dream- Fal lal lue, ful lal lue, whack fad de riddle,
Sing ful lah lue, fal lah lue, whack ful de ray... etc.

.and so on ad nauseum.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Lighter
Date: 23 Sep 04 - 05:45 PM

Saw a paperback some years ago with the cover blurb: "A Story So True It Can Only Be Told As Fiction!"

Director John Huston is credited with the enigmatic line, "When the legend becomes fact, print the legend!"

So Nerd has my vote. I accept that ridiculous fiction as fact.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Nerd
Date: 24 Sep 04 - 12:21 AM

Well, I just gave my first name anyway...back in Dec 2001

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,Lighter at work
Date: 24 Sep 04 - 10:17 AM

I meant "John FORD."

Thank God nobody caught it before I did.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Pogo
Date: 24 Sep 04 - 01:21 PM

I've found this thread fascinating especially the ponderings on the nonsense words (this being a favorite song of mine)

Interestingly enough the version I heard went something like this (again I might be mishearing a few things...I disremember {O) )

As I was going o'er the far-fled (far-flung) Kerry Mountains
I met with Cap'n Farrell and his money he was countin'
I first produced me pistol and I then produced me rapier
Sayin' ' Stand and deliver for ye were a bold sea man'

This to me especially in the last line seems to justify the robbery a bit, it suggested to me that the robber and the captain served together as mates on a ship or something and somehow or another Captain Farrel owes him the money anyways since he cheated him, stole it, etc. But that might have been just imagination at work. Still it puts an interesting spin on the story eh?

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Lighter
Date: 24 Sep 04 - 03:17 PM

Pogo, it's "bold deceiver." But sing on!

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Pogo
Date: 25 Sep 04 - 12:28 AM

Yup picked that up from the rest of the thread...Still think ' sea man ' made for a nifty version...ah well

So I counted out his money an' it made a pretty penny
I put it in me pocket an' I took it home ta Jenny
She sighed and she swore that she never would decieve me
But the devil take th' women for they never can be aisy (easy)

mush-a-ring dom-a-doo dom-a-di
White fall the derry-o
White fall the derry-o
There's-a whisky in th' jar


I went unto my chambers all for t' take a slumber
I dreamt of gold an' jewels an' for sure i'twas no wonder
But Jenny drew me charges an' she filled 'em up with water
Then sent for Captain Farrell to be ready for th' slaughter

mush-a-ring dom-a-doo dom-a-di etc.

'Twas early in the mornin' just before I rose t'travel
Up comes a band o' footmen and likeways Captain Farrel
I first produced me pistol for she'd stolen away me rapier
But I couldna shoot the water so a prisoner I was taken

mush-a-ring dom-a-doo dom-a-di etc.

Now there's some takes delight in the carriages a'rollin'
And other take delight in th' hurley an' the bowlin'
But I take delight in the juice o' the barely
An' courtin' pretty fair maids o' a mornin' bright an' early

mush a ring dom a doo dom a di

If anyone can aid me 'tis me brother in the army
If I can find his station in Cork or in Killarny
And if he'll go with me, we'll go rollin' in Kilkenny
An' I'm sure he'll treat me better than me only sportin' Jenny

Mush a ring dom a doo dom a di


*sigh* I do love singin' me Irish music...I believe this is the Dubliners version

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Dec 04 - 12:00 AM

This thread is older than the net! lol. j/k. Wow, like the song, this thread lives on.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 18 Dec 04 - 01:06 AM

I'll drink to that!

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,Ur stalker!
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 09:55 AM

I think whiskey in the jar is the best song by metallica! i dont carea bout the dam origins i care about metallica and the blody raping

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,Barrie Roberts
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 10:37 AM

Somewhere back in the Dark Ages --- about 1957, when BBC Radio still had serious programmes about folkmusic --- I heard an American 'Whiskey in the Jar' with an odd last verse:

That night Sir Humphrey Gilbert was looking for a crew,
The Queen said, 'Here's two robbers. spared their lives to sail with you'.
Young Willie and the pedlar swore allegiance on her name
To be contented with their robbing from the Spaniard on the Main.

This verse appeared after the hero's arrest. the 'pedlar' had not previously appeared in the lyric.

Is this a chunk from a signficantly different narrative, or even a different song about two different people?

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 10:48 AM

Mettalica did this as a tribute to Phil. Their version is his. He intended it to be a novelty B-side to their 1972 single "Black Boys on the Corner", but the record company decided otherwise and made it the single. Phil was furious. It took him ages to shake the folk-rocker image. It was really radical and gave them their first taste of success. Apart from the original studio one, there are several bootlegs out there including Gary Moore and Midge Ure ones.
But find the original, it knocks Mettalica's out of the ring.

As to the meaning of the refrain, probably mostly just nonsense words to make it more singeable. The whiskey bit really oughtn't to surprise anyone. Being a blackguarding song refferences to alcohol, the most popular pursuit (after Jenny, Molly, Polly, etc,) are quite understandable.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,Barrie Roberts
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 01:47 PM

There's a vigorously Catlic Irish song also called 'Whiskey in the Jar'. It goes:

One Sunday morning, as I was going to Mass,
I met a bloody Orangeman and killed him for his past,
Killed him for his past and sent his soul to Hell,
And when he got there he'd a strange tale to tell.

Chorus: Falderaddle-rye, Falderaddle-rye,
         Falderaddle-rye-raddy,
         There's whiskey in the jar.

When an Orangeman dies and his toes turn cold,
The worms'll have his body and the Devil has his soul,
The Devil he's a-laughing, a-singing out for joy,
'I've a warm spot picked out for you, me bold Orange boy!'

If I had two yards of an Orangeman's skin,
I'd make it into drums for the bold Fenian Men,
The drums they would rattle, the fifes they would play,
And we'd all go to Mass on Saint Patrick's Day.

Personally I really love those old traditional expressions of religious warmth!

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,magnifico
Date: 30 Oct 07 - 01:51 PM

hi could neone submit the solo or tell me the link
thnx

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,TJ in San Diego
Date: 30 Oct 07 - 05:50 PM

Between about 1957 and 1963 or so (at least during the U.S. "Great Folk Scare"), it was probably easier to name the performers who had NOT done this, in some form. Gillgarry, Gilgarra, Kilgarra; different colonels, different cadences, etc., etc. It was always a dependable up-tempo "rouser" when things got too noisy in the joint.

The phrase "Whiskey (with or without the e)in the Jar" shows up in other songs as well. One example is in at least one verse of the Clancy's "Whiskey, You're the Divil."

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,Bardan
Date: 30 Oct 07 - 08:26 PM

The ideas on what the nonsense bits could have been originally is intersting. However, given the tradition of lilting and the countless nonsense syllables in Irish songs, I doubt they ever had a real meaning. I mean what does alilù puililù mean in Irish if you're going to analyse that sort of stuff? Incidentally the one decodable bit to me is the Musha. I'm sure I've heard it or something very similar used as a term of endearment.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,Nick
Date: 14 Nov 07 - 04:52 PM

Asked my grandmother and she remembered the "gibberish" part being about where he was running to after the robbery "Head for the dairy'o" Molly or Whichever name she goes be being a dairy maid.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,TJ in San Diego
Date: 14 Nov 07 - 05:49 PM

Obviously, there was the whisk(e)y before there was a song to celebrate it. Homemade whiskey (moonshine) was often put up in jars. I am loathe to suggest this, but the answer seems self-explanatory.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Amos
Date: 14 Nov 07 - 08:55 PM

There's a long tradition of "mouth music" specially in Irish songs, which are filled with sounds that have no special meaning for the beauty of their sounding.

This offends the rigorously Anglo, but it is true nonetheless, and enjoying the mouthmusic without trying to find morphemes in it is an exercise in Gaelic Zen.

A

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: michaelr
Date: 14 Nov 07 - 09:10 PM

Guest, Bardan -- alilu means Halleluja. See "The Seven Joys of Mary".

Cheers,
Michael

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: joseph
Date: 15 Nov 07 - 04:33 AM

originally recorded by irish legendary folk singer danny doyle now based in america

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,JazzCat
Date: 20 Jan 08 - 11:51 PM

I found this thread to be especially interesting. Read the entire thing and I seldom do that.
It came up in a conversation I was having with a friend about the origins of American Country Western music. I wont get into the details. Just wanted to say I found all the different lyrical versions and history info quite fascinating.
Jazz

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,xulih
Date: 09 May 08 - 06:01 PM

Just heard Metalica on Kerrange (the kids were watching) covering Phil Lynotts version.Brought back memories of the 70s for me.Jenny, Molly, ring or rain it still rocks, lol

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: meself
Date: 10 May 08 - 01:07 PM

Helen Creighton collected a version from Ben Henneberry around the 1920's; published without much info. in Songs & Ballads of Nova Scotia (1932). The story gets lost a little (but it's pretty clear what it's all about, anyway!), and the melody is different from the well-known one.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: katlaughing
Date: 28 Nov 08 - 08:58 PM

There is a snippet of Lena Bourne Fish singing this on the Warner recording which has been digitally remastered on THIS PAGE. I note it is spelled "Gilgarrah."

Subject: Lyr Add: WHISKEY IN THE JAR (from Bodleian)
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 20 Dec 09 - 01:33 PM

From the Bodleian ballad collection, Johnson Ballads 612A, "between 1846 and 1854."

[These versions are very similar: Harding B 11(4152), Harding B 15(372a), Johnson Ballads 612A, and 2806 b.10(109).]


WHISKEY IN THE JAR

I am a young fellow that never yet was daunted,
And oftentimes had money, but seldom it was wanted,
For robbing for gold, it was my own folly,
Paying for good liquor to treat deceitful Molly.
Musha ring a ding a ra.

As I was going over Calvert mountains,
I met with Captain Everet, his money he was counting,
First I drew my pistols, and then I drew my rapier,
Stand and deliver, for I am your bold deceiver.
Musha ring, &c.

Oh! when I got his money, it was a pretty penny,
I put it in my pocket and took it home to Molly,
When she swore by what was good, that she never would deceive me,
But the devil take the women, for they never can be easy.
Musha ring, &c.

Being both wet and weary, I went to Molly's chamber,
I went to Molly's chamber for to have a slumber,
When she flew unto my pistols and she loaded them with—water,
I was dragged out of my bed just as like a lamb to the slaughter.
Musha ring, &c.

It was early next morning, between six and seven,
Surrounded by policemen, and likewise Captain Everet,
I fired off my pistols and powder, but was mistaken,
I fired off the water and a prisoner I was taken.
Musha ring, &c.

There's some take delight in fishing and fowling,
Whilst others take delight in hearing cannons roaring,
But I take delight in being brisk and jolly,
And in paying for good liquor to treat deceitful Molly.
Musha ring, &c.

Oh! I have got two brothers, and they are in the army,
One is in Cork, and the other in Killarney,
If I had them here to-night, oh, wouldn't I make them jolly,
I would rather have them here than you deceitful Molly.
Musha ring, &c.

It was early next morning, between six and seven,
It was up against my cell door the turnkey he was bawling,
When I out with my shackles and knocked the turnkey down,
And I made my escape out of fair Philip's Town.
Musha ring, &c.

E. Hodges, from PITTS Wholesale Toy & Marble Warehouse, 31, Dudley Street, late Monmouth Street, 7 Dials, [London]

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,Tim Eriksen
Date: 17 Mar 10 - 09:13 AM

Just discovered this ancient discussion. My two cents worth is that I spent some time hanging out with (folklorist) Peter Kennedy in the late '80s, who claimed to be responsible for discovering the Dubliners and also for teaching them this song, which he learned from Frank Warner who got it from Grammy Fish.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 25 Apr 10 - 05:09 AM

What a nice informative thread.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,TJ in San Diego
Date: 15 Jun 10 - 05:01 PM

At one time or another, nearly every folk singer or group active during the "great folk scare" seems to have done a version of this. I stand guilty as well. It's a great up-tempo rouser and a good change of pace after doing something like "Johnny, I Hardly Knew Ye" or some similar dirge. I don't think many of us researched it well back then; we just glommed onto a version that sounded good to us and made it work. Looking at the origins and various permutations of it, in hindsight, is a great read. Thanks to all.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Mar 11 - 09:48 AM

a man caled james said thin lizzy were the best at singing this song but here is what i think of that recording. being a singer and accordian player i think the thin lizzy recording is rubbish. when i played in bravehart with martin i remember my mum saying because of the non sense chorus we were not allowed to perform this song at all. 1 thing i can say is the clancey brothers did not record this song because i have got 3 albums of them and there is not a sign of the song whisky in the jar and only pub singers would do this song. my own opinion on doing a version on this song is that the old folks at the day centers and homes would not understand what the chorus is. i think it is a nice tune but i have found no songs that have better words that have nothing to do with drinking.

Subject: Lyr Add: WHISKEY IN THE JAR (from The Dubliners)
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Mar 11 - 03:08 PM

The version I sing is from a recording by The Dubliners:

As I was going over the far famed Kerry mountains
I met with Captain Farrell and his money he was counting
I first produced me pistol and I then produced me rapier
Saying "Stand and deliver for you are a bold deceiver".

Chorus
Musha ring dumma do dumma da, whack fol the daddio
Whack fol the daddio, there's whiskey in the jar

I counted out his money and it made a pretty penny
I put it in me pocket and I took it home to Jenny
She sighed and she swore that she never would deceive me
But the devil take the women for they never can be easy

I went unto my chamber all for to take a slumber
I dreamt of gold and jewels and for sure it was no wonder
But Jenny drew me charges and she filled them up with water
And sent for Captain Farrell to be ready for the slaughter

'Twas early in the morning just before I rose to travel
Up comes a band of footmen and likewise Captain Farrell
I first produced me pistol for she'd stolen away me rapier
But I couldn't shoot the water so a prisoner I was taken

Now there's some take delight in the carriages a-rolling
And others take delight in the hurling and the bowling
But I take delight in the juice of the barley
And courting pretty fair maids in the morning bright and early

If anyone can aid me 'tis me brother in the army
If I can find his station in Cork or in Killarney
And if he'll go with me we'll go roaming in Kilkenny
And I'm sure he'll treat me better than me own me sporting Jenny

(bowling presumably referring to 'lane bowling')

Rog

PS I swap the last two verses.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST
Date: 02 May 11 - 04:23 PM

I'm a college student, writng a paper on "Whiskey in the Jar." Thanks guys, this thread has been an awesome resource.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,Alan Whittle
Date: 03 May 11 - 03:33 PM

I found this depressing. I bought the Champions of Folly album off Roy when it first came out, And I read here that it was deleted years ago, and then i saw that was back in '97.

You can't help wondering, how much longer til i get deleted?

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 30 Sep 11 - 11:37 PM

I listened to this song on a Dubliners "best of "album my dad has. Good song. Understatement probably, but it is great. BTW, "Mack The Knife" from The Threepenny Opera is one of my favourite songs, and I listened to WITJ because of the possible connection. I like that possible but unlikely connection between these two songs- that this was the inspiration for the betrayal scene in Beggar's Opera/Threepenny Opera).

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,JTT
Date: 01 Oct 11 - 08:29 AM

Perhaps the Captain Farrell referred to is this guy

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 14 Mar 13 - 11:45 PM

From a yahoo Q n' A board. I was looking down this lengthy thread hoping to find an elaboration on the following:

Whack for my daddy-o, there's Whiskey in the jar-o!

I love that song, but what does that mean?

It's a bastardisation of the phrase "whack fol di daddy oh",which is a form of 'mouth music' which is an Irish form of scat singing,which is using sounds rather than actual words.Scat is popular in jazz using sounds like 'do be ooten doo' etc.Irish Mouth Music uses sounds like 'Diddly aye an dooten' and 'skittly aye dum do'
I know,sounds like a wind up,but I can assure you it's completely gen.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,guest
Date: 14 Mar 13 - 11:55 PM

damn, I just realized how many similar threads on here were spooling into this garment! plenty of elaboration, eh? goodness.

Subject: Lyr Add: THERE'S WHISKEY IN THE JAR (from LOC)
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 08 Apr 13 - 10:59 AM

From a broadside printed in New York, held by the Library of Congress:

No. 122.
THERE'S WHISKEY IN THE JAR.

I am a sporting fellow, I never yet was daunted,
Money in my pocket whenever it was wanted.
Robbing for gold, 'twas my own folly,
Sure I'd risk my life for you, my sporting Molly.

Rack fal de ra,
Rack fal de raddy, O,
Rack fal de raddy, O,
There's whiskey in the jar.

As I was crossing the mulberry mountain,
I met with Captain Kelly, his money he was counting,
At first I drew my pistol, then I drew my rapier,
Stand and deliver for I am your money-taker.

Rack fal de ra, &c.

He handed me twenty pounds—'twas a pretty penny-o,
I took it home to Molly, she said she'd ne'er desaive me,
I took it home to Molly, she said she'd ne'er desaive me,
But the devil's 'mongst the women for they never can be aisy

Rack fal de ra, &c.

I went into Molly's chamber for to take a slumber,
I went into Molly's chamber, not knowing of no danger,
When I was sleeping, its well she knew the matter,
The unloaded the pistols, and filled them full of water.

Rack fal de ra, &c.

Early the next morning between six and seven,
She house was surrounded--likewise with Captain Kelly,
I sprang for my pistols, being very much mistaken,
I fired off the water, and a prisoner I was taken.

Rack fal de ra, &c.

I have to little brothers enlisted in the army,
One of them's in Cork, the other's in Killarney.
If they were here to-night, I would be free and jolly,
I'd rather have them here to-night than you deceitful Molly.

Rack fal de ra, &c.

J. WRIGLEY, Publisher. of Songs, Ballad's, and Toy Books, Conversation, Age, and Small Playing Cards, Alphabet Wood Blocks, Valentines, Motto Verses, and Cut Motto Paper, &c. No. 27 Chatham Street. (OPPOSITE CITY HALL PARK) NEW YORK.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,Morgan42
Date: 22 Apr 18 - 10:06 PM

When I stumbled upon this thread and saw how long it was I very nearly skipped reading it. But I'm so glad I read the whole thing! Thanks to everyone who contributed! <3

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Mrrzy
Date: 26 Jul 20 - 10:25 AM

A ferret sent me this today...

https://www.irishcentral.com/roots/history/origins-whiskey-jar

Thought y'all might enjoy.

Also I just tried to look up Tequila in the Jar but just got some crap, not the song to which I referred lo these many posts ago.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Lighter
Date: 05 Nov 21 - 06:29 PM

Daily Commercial Register (Sandusky, Ohio) (April 5, 1860), p. 3:

"'Rory O. Moore'...led a number of his countrymen to the 'Irishman's Shanty,' where he assured them 'There's Whisky in the Jug.'"

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Alvin-Songster
Date: 27 Mar 23 - 09:02 AM

I learned this song from the Peter, Paul & Mary album A Song Will Rise, and they called it "Gilgarra Mountain." It's a favorite of one of my cousins, so I still sing it.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Lighter
Date: 19 Nov 23 - 05:56 PM

T. S. Kenderdine, "California Revisited, 1858-1897" (Newton, Pa.: Doylestown Publishing Company, 1898):

“There were some good singers among our [ox-]drivers [crossing the plains in 1858]. While the songs were not refined they were not objectionable. One of these was...‘There’s Whiskey in the Jar;’ now no longer heard; unless in the homes of ‘Missouri Pikers.’ I can hear its chorus yet ringing out on the night air in senseless verbiage – with a buffalo or wolf accompani[m]ent on the distant plains:

             O! Ring a jing a jar
             Whack, thwack, my laddie oh!
             There’s whiskey in the jar.

But we had sentimental ditties too. ‘Dutch Joe’ would sing one beginning—

             My old mother and I did part,
             When I was very young,
             Her memory still clings round my heart—
             How close to me she clung!

That is all I can recollect, but I have seen rude men affected at the recital."

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Lighter
Date: 19 Nov 23 - 05:56 PM

T. S. Kenderdine, "California Revisited, 1858-1897" (Newton, Pa.: Doylestown Publishing Company, 1898):

“There were some good singers among our [ox-]drivers [crossing the plains in 1858]. While the songs were not refined they were not objectionable. One of these was...‘There’s Whiskey in the Jar;’ now no longer heard; unless in the homes of ‘Missouri Pikers.’ I can hear its chorus yet ringing out on the night air in senseless verbiage – with a buffalo or wolf accompani[m]ent on the distant plains:

             O! Ring a jing a jar
             Whack, thwack, my laddie oh!
             There’s whiskey in the jar.

But we had sentimental ditties too. ‘Dutch Joe’ would sing one beginning—

             My old mother and I did part,
             When I was very young,
             Her memory still clings round my heart—
             How close to me she clung!

That is all I can recollect, but I have seen rude men affected at the recital."

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: GUEST,Iains
Date: 21 Nov 23 - 01:55 PM

To me the cork and kerry mountains makes a lot of sense. The highest mountain in cork is very close to the Kerry border and the area is pretty much inaccessible, apart from foot and sure footed horse/pony. From Glengarrif to Kenmare over the Priests leap is fairly wild country and the alternative road to Kilgarven was built during the famine as a job creation scheme well after the song was created. Further east the countryside is equally rugged towards Gougane barra. The area provided thousands of acres to hide out. Even today sheep farming in the area provides a challenge accessing certain of the commonages.(I speak from personal experience.There are a lot of bogs and cliff faces and even a quad bike is of limited use)

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Thompson
Date: 22 Nov 23 - 05:54 PM

PW Joyce has a tune called Whiskey in the Jar (provenance "From a private in the 41st Regiment, Ballinamore, Co Leitrim") in his Old Irish Folk Music and Songs (Longman's, Green and Co, 39 Paternoster Row, London, New York, Bombay and Calcutta; Dublin, Hodges, Figgis & Co Ltd, 1909), but it's only music, no song, no mountains, no bold deceivers, no rapier and no money. It is, or was, on the Internet Archive.

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Lighter
Date: 22 Nov 23 - 06:35 PM

Joyce acknowledges that the tune was actually collected by James E. Pigot, most likely in the 1840s or early '50s.

It is recognizably related to the current tune. the second strain, however, is very much like Lloyd's "Derby Ram."

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Thompson
Date: 23 Nov 23 - 04:01 AM

There's an interesting Wikipedia piece about it, saying " A number of its lines and the general plot resemble those of a contemporary broadside ballad Patrick Fleming (also called "Patrick Flemmen he was a Valiant Soldier") about Irish highwayman Patrick Fleming, who was executed in 1650."

Subject: RE: Origins: Whiskey In The Jar
From: Lighter
Date: 23 Nov 23 - 01:14 PM

"Sporting Hero, or, Whiskey in the Bar [sic]" ca1852:

http://ballads.bodleian.ox.ac.uk/static/images/sheets/05000/01871.gif

"Patrick Flemming," from Holloway and Black. (The oldest available text, apparently from the 18th century):

   
Patrick Flemming was a Vallient Soldier,
He carried his Blunderbuss upon his shoulder
He cockt his Pistol and drew his Rapier,
Stand and deliver for I am the taker fal, lal,

If you're Patrick Flemming as I suppose you be,
We are three Pedlars a ganging so free sir,
We are three Pedlars a ganging to Dublin,
Nothing at all in our Pockets but our loading.

Says Patrick Flemming prithe don't trifle,
For I am resolved Your packs for to rifle,
Here is a bank on which they must rest on,
To search them all I have a Commission.

Loath they were to do as he commanded,
But knowing Patrick charg'd double-handed,
Searching their packs most carefully round,
There did he find four Hundred pound.

Oh! I have two brothers they're both in the army
The one is at Cork and the other at Kilkenny,
If they were here both blyth and bonny,
I'd rather see them than any one dear honey.

As I was going over Ruberry mountain,
Gold and silver there was counting
He thought it little I thought it better,
I took the Gold from Colonel Pepper.

My Whore she proved false and that is the reason
Or else Patrick Flemming had never been taken,
When I was asleep and knew nothing of the matter
Then she loaded my arms with Water:

Oh Patrick Flemming how often have I told you
With Swords with Pistols we would surround You,
For kissing of other mens wives brisk and merry,
as You was going to Londonderry.

Now my dear brothers i must leave You,
For of my Life they will bereave me
But when he set foot upon the Ladder
He briskly called for his hat and Feather.

Now You pretty Wives of fair London City
E'er it is long I sure shall be with Ye,
So bold and so Gallant i'lle gane to ye
That halters not made that [are] can undo me.      [e'er?

[All spellings as printed. The only "Rubery / Ruberry" I'm aware of is now a suburb of Birmingham.]