Subject: Whiskey In The Jar From: Paul Date: 18 Oct 97 - 02:40 PM I was searching the data base for this song (Whiskey In the Jar)after realizing I don't the words to it, to my surprise I couldn't find it. Does anyone know if it may be under a different name or not. Thanks Paul |
Subject: Lyr Add: WHISKEY IN THE JAR From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 18 Oct 97 - 04:34 PM An internet search came up with these lyrics, which are similar to the ones I've usually heard. The search also came up with many strange variations I had never heard. There is usually also a verse after his capture, but before he mentions his brother, which documents his punching out the sentry and making his escape from jail in Sligo.
There is also a variation of this song called "Bold Lovell", aka "The Devil's In The Women". It is sung to a different tune and has a different (although more intelligible) chorus cursing the treachery of his bawd, although the storyline is much the same. (I've always thought that it would be a good exercise to write a version of Whiskey In The Jar from his girlfriend's perspective, explaining why she turned him in to the authorities.) In the Bold Lovell variation, he doesn't escape and he gets hanged.
Now some take delight in the carriages a-rolling |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: rich r Date: 18 Oct 97 - 08:54 PM Search DT with "whiskey and jar" and you should get a couple versions of this song rich r |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: dick greenhaus Date: 21 Oct 97 - 01:41 PM FWIW- If you search for whisky (Scots becerage) you won't find whiskey (everybody else's tipple. If you search for whixk* you'll get both (as well as whiskers and whisked). If you search for [in the jar] you'll find all the songs that use that phrase (the square brackets specify a phrase} |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Martin Ryan Date: 21 Oct 97 - 03:40 PM Tim I think the usual location when sung in Ireland is "Cork and Kerry mountains" or "Kilgarry Mountain". Not sure if the latter exists. I'll check. Regards |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: alison Date: 21 Oct 97 - 06:22 PM Hi, the nearest I could find to it was a town called Kilmaganny, which is near the Booley Hills, (just North East of Carrick on Suir), but I don't think it's right because this is on the other side of the country from the Cork and Kerry Mountains, which always made more sense to me. slainte alison |
Subject: Lyr Add: BOLD LOVELL (from Roy Harris) From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 21 Oct 97 - 06:46 PM Martin, I always thought it was Cork and Kerry mountains too. The Bold Lovell version, the lyrics of which except for the chorus could be sung (perhaps with slight adjustments) to the tune of Whiskey in the Jar, says "across the the misty mountains". I think its Irish and Bourbon "whiskey", and Scotch and Rye "whisky".
Here is Bold Lovell. I got it off of Roy Harris's "Champions of Folly", a long deleted Topic LP from the 1970's. I think that I have the chorus right in the last line, although with his accent and the slur it could as easily be "Ah the women cannot let a fellow be." I think it's "devil" though. (Curse all recordings without lyrics sheets) Maybe someone has it in a songbook. Sir Walter Scott apparently asked his son in Ireland to find him the lyrics.
He went to a public house and counted out his money |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Nonie Rider Date: 21 Oct 97 - 07:27 PM Cool! I've never seen the Kilmagenny and Lovell versions, only Kilgary and Gilgarra. |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 22 Oct 97 - 05:03 PM Error about the pistol. Should be, of course, "She stole away his pistol and she filled it up with water". Also in the next verse it should be singular for the pistol, as he only seems to have had one. No matter how careful I try to be in typing things I manage to screw it up somehow.:( |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Nonie Rider Date: 22 Oct 97 - 07:51 PM Joe Haldeman used to sing this as he'd learned it:
"I drew forth me pistols and I brandished me sabre" --Nonie |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Ricky Rackin Date: 22 Oct 97 - 11:23 PM Anybody know the version :"Es tequilla in the Jar" whose chorus goes: Muchos gringos trabajar We're from the Barrio [3x] Es tequilla in the Jar! Obviously set to the standard tune. |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Wolfgang Hell Date: 23 Oct 97 - 03:19 AM a long shot without corroboration: One name for the highest mountains in Ireland (Co. Kerry) is the "MacGillycuddy's reeks". Kilgarry, Kilmagenny could be a mishearing for the middle part of that place name. Wolfgang |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Ted from Australia Date: 23 Oct 97 - 09:32 AM
Also another verse: |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Ted from Australia Date: 23 Oct 97 - 09:35 AM Farewll pronounced@#* |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Nonie Rider Date: 23 Oct 97 - 02:42 PM No, I hadn't heard "Tequila in the Jar." Sounds wonderful! Source or lyrics please (please, please)? |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 24 Oct 97 - 03:58 PM I've heard it as "I knocked the sentry down". |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Nonie Rider Date: 24 Oct 97 - 04:53 PM I'm also heard "And I bid a fond farewell to that judge in Sligo town." |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Lidi Date: 25 Oct 97 - 05:54 AM About the mountain.....I have heard; "...over the far-farmed Kerry mountains.." Cheers Lidi |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: BK Date: 26 Oct 97 - 01:12 AM Somewhere long ago I learned "Gilgarry Mountain." Probably no more likely to be accurate than anything else. It's the spirit that counts. It is a "blackguarding" song, (automatically rowdy/amoral/offensive/anti-social/immature/irresponsible, etc..), but I've also wondered about the girlfriend's point of view; Maybe she doesn't want to be asociated with this damn fool bozo who blithely robs a prominant local citizen, (apparently assuming nothing effective will be done to him?) and thereby puts her, by association, into the role of accomplice, and in jepardy of a jail sentance, or transportation to one of the dreaded - probably for good reason - penal colonies, etc, etc... She probably was better off without this clod.. Cheers, BK |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: lesblank Date: 26 Oct 97 - 06:26 PM For my money, the definitive version of this oldie is done by the Limeliters on their 1962 or 63 album ,"Sing Out". It has some similarity to the lyrics on this thread but it is exactly like the old Burl Ives Columbia album of the early 60's. In any case, a great cause for swappin'. Thanks !! |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: szarak@telesys.net.pl Date: 27 Oct 97 - 10:22 AM Here is how we sing it in Poland: As I was going over the far fam'd Kerry Mountains, I met with Captain Farrel, and his money he was countin', I first produced my pistol, and I than produced my rapier, Sayin': "Stand and deliver for you are my bold deceiver".
Slainte Szarak
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Subject: Lyr Add: KILGARY MOUNTAIN (from Joe Haldeman) From: Nonie Rider Date: 27 Oct 97 - 01:24 PM Well, if we're gonna swap versions, this is what I remember of how Joe Haldeman sings it. I don't know his source, but's pretty clearly a folked-over version, since it's got two names for the colonel and THREE for the woman, three hands worth of weapons, and a farewell to a judge he didn't have.
KILGARY MOUNTAIN
As I was a walkin' over Kilgary mountain,
(Cho)
Them shiny golden coins sure did look bright and pretty,
Now when I awoke, 'twas around six or seven,
They put me into jail, without a judge or writin',
I'm going to join me brother, the one who's in the army,
Now some takes delight in the fishing or the bowling; |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Nonie Rider Date: 27 Oct 97 - 01:29 PM (Whoops--only one name for the Colonel above. I THINK his version has one Colonel Pepper and one Captain Farrell, but I don't remember where.) |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: LaMarca Date: 27 Oct 97 - 04:52 PM Then there's the version my husband sings: As I was goin' over the (something somethin) mountain, I met with Colonel Sanders as his chickens he was countin'...
Chorus:With a little hydrolyzed chicken distillate, |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Benjamin Hollister also from Australia Date: 27 Oct 97 - 08:17 PM I first heard this thru' the Seekers with the Col. Pepper and the verse about escaping from gaol, and going over the Kilgarry Mts. Then I heard the far famed Kerry mountains, so Sligo Town didn't fit too well anymore, so I substituted dTra/ Li/ (Tralee) Town. Alos the verse when he wakes as: Twas early in the morning before I rose to travel Up came a band of footmen and likewise Capt. Farrell I reached for me pistols for she'd stol'n away me rapier (sabre, whatever) But I couldn't shoot (fire) the water so a prisoner I was taken. This has got to be one of the all time great almost impossible to sing along to songs as everyone knows different words. True folk!!! The chorus even changes: With a Whack fol the darry oh or With a muisheen a ring a down Still great song Sla/n a chairde benjamin |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 27 Oct 97 - 08:52 PM The Dubliners sing "the far-famed Kerry mountains", with other variations on the first version I posted. What is the chorus supposed to be? Is it a corruption of some Irish words? |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Benjamin Bodhra/nai Date: 29 Oct 97 - 06:35 PM The nonsense in the chorus' of irish and Scottish songs seems to be just that - nonsense. You can see the same thing in Puirt a Beul - "i/ bhi/ a bhi/ u/ bhi/ a bhi/" (ee vi ar vi oo vi ar vi) though bhi/ is a word, or in Domhnaill Antaidh "hi/ ri/ iu/l eile". Often they are just sounds that allow the rhythym to be kept and that large numbers of people can sing. That's my thought anyway. I actually tried to write the words for Whiskey's chorus in Irish and then translate and I never had much success.
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Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Nigel Sellars Date: 24 Nov 97 - 02:25 PM Tim jaques sent me a copy of Roy Harris' version, which I first heard twenty years ago on a PBS special on the Philly Folk Fest where it was sung by Martin Carthy! (Who, alas, has never recorded it, though he's the guitarist on the Roy Harris version.) "Bold Lovell" is an English version, but I came across a Vermont version in the "Green Mountain Songster" with nearly identical words but it talks about "Plymouth Mountain"! (Should add Roy sings "pistols" not "pistol" and it's "Bold, _brisk_ , and lively lads and champions of folly," [my favorite phrase in the song] Somewhere I once read that "Whiskey in the Jar" is actually a stage version of the song (it may have been on a Clancy Brothers' lp), though I can't say for certain that that is true. Does anyone know of earlier versions with different tunes? Whatever the case, this is the version that's supplanted all the others. Nigel Sellars |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Barry Date: 24 Nov 97 - 05:13 PM Sandy & Caroline Patton also do an american version with the brother , whose in the army, is in jail somewhere in West Virginny, been so long ,thats the only bit of it I can recall. Barry |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 24 Nov 97 - 07:39 PM Glad you got it, Nigel. Can you make out the Chorus? I am not convinced that I have it right but I can't make out the second line. Thank you for the correction "brisk" for "frisk", which makes far more sense. I thought "frisk" might be the word from which we get "frisky" and it was the only thing that came to mind. |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Nigel Sellars Date: 25 Nov 97 - 09:30 AM Tim Jaques asked about the chorus on "Bold Lovell," and I think the second line goes : "How the devil can a fellow let them be?" |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Nigel Sellars Date: 26 Nov 97 - 02:33 PM Just a thought, but I'm beginning to suspect the "Bold Lovell" version is closest to the original -- as are, it seems, the Vermont, Virginia, and at least one Irish version -- in that it fits into the traditional highwaymen's "good night" category with the fellow being hanged at the end (ala "Tyburne Tree", "Sam Hall", "Allan Tyne of Harrow," and "Newlyn (Newry) Town.") I'm wondering if some of the Irish versions were altered for political reasons, that is, to show contempt for English authority by having the hero (representing Irish indepence) smash the jail (gaol) doors, a symbol of English oppression. Any takers? |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Nonie Rider Date: 01 Dec 97 - 12:52 PM I dunno. "There's whiskey in the jar" is an unlikely chorus for a Goodnight. Tune also seems a little cheerful for the purpose. The Irish aren't shy; if it was intended as an Irish vs. English rewrite, I'd expect that theme to be obvious rather than hidden. And since the singer is functionally blaming his woman more than his captors, that'd be an odd feature of a political ballad unless she was explicitly considered a traitor and punished for it. But then, I'm not a scholar of the subject, just a fan. --Nonie |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 01 Dec 97 - 08:30 PM The notes on the back of the LP indicate that it was sung by A.L. Lloyd, who learned it from print (The New Green Mountain Songster, I think it was called) and changed it around a bit, and Harris learned his version. I will get the LP back out of storage and transcribe the sleeve note in full. Other versions are mentioned in the note. Thank you Nigel. I think that is exactly what the second line of the chorus says. For all these years I've been trying to make it out, and now that you state it it seems so obvious. . . |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Timothy Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 15 Jan 98 - 04:57 PM I said I would transcribe the sleeve note for Bold Lovell from Roy Harris's "Champions of Folly" LP, Topic 12TS256, recorded 1974 and released 1975, on which Harris is joined by Martin Carthy (guitar, dulcimer); Bobby Campbell (fiddle, mandola); and Vic Gammon (melodeon, concertina). The sleeve notes are by the well-known folksinger, the late A. L. Lloyd. I sent Dick G. a tape of this song, with the hope that he might add a midi of the tune to the database, since I do not yet have that capability. It is not the same tune as Whiskey In The Jar. BOLD LOVELL "The theme of this song reminds us of the capture of MacHeath in The Beggar's Opera. Was it suggested by it? Or is the ballad old enough to have put the idea into the head of John Gay who wrote the play in 1728? Sometimes the hero is named Peter or Patrick Fleming, not Lovell. Sir Walter Scott was interested in the song, but he only had a few scraps of it. In 1821 he wrote to his son Cornet Scott at Portobello Barracks, Dublin: 'I wish you would pick up for me the Irish lilt of a tune to Patrick Fleming.'From the bits that Sir Walter quotes, it's clear he had our song in mind. A close cousin is the celebrated Irish highwayman ballad 'Whiskey In The Jar'. Roy Harris learnt it some ten years ago from Mike Herring of Peterborough, who had it from A. L. Lloyd who got it from print ('The New Green Mountain Songster"), and adapted it a bit." (Some of you may be more familiar with the twentieth century musical adaptation of The Beggar's Opera, "The Threepenny Opera" by Bertold Brecht, from which comes the song Mac The Knife.)
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Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Denis Date: 15 Jan 98 - 07:08 PM The two variations I have from my mother's singing are the Cork and Kerry mountains and I've also heard the far famed Kerry mountains. |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Pejotka Date: 15 Jan 98 - 07:25 PM Here is another verse, that I like. I found it in „Folk ´round the world” edited by Herbert Haufrecht, London (ESSEX) (Gilgary Mountain, new words by Bob Gibson, Bob Camp and Frank Warner) 1 to 3 are similar to the other versions but : 4. Was early in the morning at the barracks of Kilarney, My brother took his leave but he didn´t ask the army; Our horses they were speedy ´twas all over but the shoutin` Now we wait for Farrell upon Gilgary Mountain. |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Bruce O. Date: 15 Jan 98 - 09:33 PM A 'Patrick Fleming' version, with Colonel Pepper snd Ruberry mountain is reprinted from an early 19the century broadside in the Madden collection in Holloway and Black's 'Later English Broadside Ballads', I, # 90. Original edition was London, 1975, but I think Univ. of Nebraska Press has a reprint. (Cork, Kilkenny, Londonderry and London are all mentioned in this version.) |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Bob Bolton Date: 01 Jul 98 - 07:48 PM G'day all, I see that the 'Whisky in the Jar' seems to have come back to life. I guess that's a little like a good folk song - there's always life in it. In Australia, this song got a folk processing during the time of one of our particularly notorious (or notable, depending on your viewpoint) bushrangers: Ben Hall. Ben Hall was considered by many to have been victimised by the authorities and to have only turned his hand to crime after being framed for actions of others. The Police officer responsible was a Pommy remittance man who had enlisted in the colonial police force as an ordinary trooper. When overseas mail arrived addressed to him as SIR Frederick Pottinger (he was a minor baronet) it was decided he could hardly remain in the ranks and he was promoted to Captain. He did not do very well and died of an 'accidentental' shot from his own pistol on a coach bound for an departmental enquiry in Sydney. Collectors have found a fragmentary local version of 'Whiskey in the Jar' which starts: "As I was a'going over the Abercrombie mountains, I met with Captain Pottinger and his money he was counting ..." This is obviously a direct parody (reworking, folk-processing, whatever) of the Irish model - but that is exactly what a folk song is ... a song that keeps working for its living, doing whatever job it turns its hand to, changing as needed to do the job. Regards, Bob Bolton |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Barry Finn Date: 01 Jul 98 - 10:04 PM Bob, Ben sounds like he could've been a fairly decent fellow if left to his own, kind a like our Pretty Boy Floyd. If folksongs were outlawed, only outlaws would sing about folks, wait, if only inlaws sang folksongs, only folks would sing about outlaws, wait, sorry, if only folksongs were about inlaws, outlaws would only be folks, or is it, if inlaws were outlaws, folks would then only sing out songs that were in .......forget it & slap me silly. Barry, who loves songs about outlaws. |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Bob Bolton Date: 02 Jul 98 - 02:10 AM G'day Barry, I did not post any lyrics of the Australian variant because I was working off the top of what passes for my memory - and I seem to remember that it was a fairly brief fragment ... just enough to show that the song was known at the time (1860s) and someone had re-formed it to suit current events. I will look up the texts and see if ther is enough to warrant posting the version. If see ... watch this space! Regards, Bob Bolton |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Barry Finn Date: 07 Jul 98 - 07:38 PM Bob, please do post, it would be quite nice to hea an Aussie version of this, I believe the true spirit of a nation can be judged by how high they hold up their outlaws (Ha, Ha). Barry |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Bert Date: 08 Jul 98 - 12:16 PM Hold up or Hang up??? |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Bill D Date: 08 Jul 98 - 08:18 PM in response to Barry's earlier post...the TRUE moral is.."If inlaws were outlawed, more folk would have something to sing about!"....(as long as they don't RISE UP to sing.. |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Bob Bolton Date: 12 Jul 98 - 07:14 PM G'day Barry Finn, I had a look at the "Abercrombie Mountains" - Ben Hall version of the song. It has 4 stanzas but only the first is really different. The rest has the usual tale 'darlin' Molly' who betrays the highwayman. I suspect that Irish workers here changed the 1st stanza but didn't bother to alter the song to cover the new story. There are a number of very good original songs about Ben Hall. On the Digital Tradition I found 2 of them. The ballad just called Ben Hall is from Sally Sloane, a great source of Australian songs and music (died ~ 1984). I got to know Sally in the 1970s and she sang at a concert I organised in 1977 (at ~ 76 years of age). Sally was delivered by Ben Hall's Sister who still worked as midwife at the turn of the century. Great, great, great grandparents on my mother's side were married in the same church, in the same year as Ben Hall and Biddy McGuire. The second song in DT is a rather corrupt transcription of "Streets of Forbes", a lament for Hall written by his brother in law, John McGuire, on seeing his bullet-riddled body led through town, tied over a police pack saddle. I will submit an accurate set of words to set the record straight (as soon as I get my typing fingers working and/or find a good OCR scanner). There are a few more good Hall ballads - Hall got traditional Irish ballads and laments. Twenty years later Ned Kelly songs tended to be in the fashionable music hall styles of the city and less interesting musically. Regards, Bob Bolton Until I return, with lyrics |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: BK Date: 12 Jul 98 - 11:50 PM ok, Bill D; how did you get the funky little black square w/the yellow smiley face in this page abt one of my favorite bad boy songs? far out! if there were a lot of catchy little graphics, would they not take up a lot of text space? cheers, BK |
Subject: Lyr Add: THE STREETS OF FORBES From: Alan of Australia Date: 13 Jul 98 - 11:01 AM G'day Bob, Seeing I Have The words typed up already, I thought I'd save you the trouble:- THE STREETS OF FORBES
Come all you Lachlan men, and a sorrowful tale I'll tell
Three years he roamed the roads, and he showed the traps some fun
Ben went to Goobang Creek, and that was his downfall
Bill Dargin he was chosen to shoot the outlaw dead My Mother who grew up in Ben Hall country in the 1920s and 30s says that people in the area still talked about Hall in those days & it was generally accepted that a great injustice was done to him. Cheers, |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Barry Finn Date: 13 Jul 98 - 02:29 PM Good job, nice song. Thanks, Barry |
Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Date: 06 Dec 98 - 12:48 PM Does anyone have the guitar tab for this tune? Anybody heard Metallica's version???
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Subject: RE: Whiskey In The Jar From: Sandy Date: 07 Dec 98 - 10:08 PM Hello out there! My memory tells me that the hugely popular version of Whiskey in the Jar was derived from Lena Bourne Fish's version, collected by Frank Warner in New Hampshire. I was too much a purist at the time to be sure, but I thought it was The Highwaymen (aptly named) who recorded it. That it came from Frank Warner's collection would account for the Bob Gibson, Bob Camp, Frank Warner "arrangement" copyright. We've collected several versions of this song at Folk-Legacy: Max Hunter sings an Ozark version (learned from Allie Long Parker, whom we also recorded) with one verse stating "I have two brothers enlisted in the army, One of them's in jail and the other's in Caroliny" (a nice inversion of Kilarney, eh?); Sara Ogan Gunning sings a good version from Kentucky on her "Girl of Constant Sorrow" Folk-Legacy recording. We also will soon release a CD of traditional songs and ballads from our 40 years of collecting. On it, a splendid old logger from New Brunswick, Canada, sings the version referred to in one of the earlier posts about this song in which the hero says "Oh, it's false-hearted Molly, for you my heart is breakin', If it hadn't been for you, sure, I never would've been taken. And with the metal bar, I broke the Samson down (???), And straight-way made my escape to old 'Ginia town." The CD is ready for release, we're just waiting for the money to do it with. :-) Sandy |
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