Innovative Griffiths guitars

Subject: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: little john cameron
Date: 27 Feb 01 - 12:44 PM

Chris Griffiths is ready to set the guitar world upside down with these guitars.Check out his write-up,

http://www.success.nfld.net/ambassador/newsletter/aug-sept-00/v8n5p3.html

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: catspaw49
Date: 27 Feb 01 - 01:14 PM

Interesting stuff LJ.....Anxious to see one in the flesh.....er,uh..polymer.

Clicky to ljc's Griffith article

Also check out the link to Garrison Guitars at the bottom of the news release.

Spaw

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: little john cameron
Date: 27 Feb 01 - 02:37 PM

Aye Pat,i've played one and they are sounding great.He also does great repair work.A marvellous job on my 1965 Gibson that was inadvertantly sat on. ljc

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: little john cameron
Date: 27 Feb 01 - 03:07 PM

I was just talking to them and got the prices.Wait till you hear this. These are US RETAIL prices.
G10---$339
G20---389
G30---409
G40---749
G40---
G50---989

The tuning system is deadly too.Check out what Leona Boyd has to say. ljc

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: catspaw49
Date: 27 Feb 01 - 03:18 PM

I saw that LJ. AND the prices are really down there aren't they? The jump in price between the 30 and 40 seems to be in the mahogany vs. birch. Having had pretty decent success with birch instruments myself, have you played/seen one of the 10,20,30's? Just curious.

Spaw

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: little john cameron
Date: 27 Feb 01 - 03:28 PM

Just the G30 Pat and it sounds great plugged in too. ljc

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: Fortunato
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 08:38 AM

Verrrrry interesting. The concept seems sound.(!)

When you guys say sounds great do you mean in comparison to a Takamine or what?

Anybody else compared these to 'topflight' guitars?

cheers, Fortunato

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: Grab
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 10:10 AM

While we're at it, anyone know how much difference the birch/cedar/spruce topsides make? And does mahogany vs. birch really make a difference for the back and sides?

Also on the subject, solid-wood instruments "mature" with age, don't they? Is there any "wearing-in" time associated with these? And would the plastic bracing affect that?

Lots of questions there! :-) Hope there's some luthier/experienced player who can supply a few answers, cos those look like some sweet guitars.

Grab.

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 11:42 AM

Thanks John. I hope the 12th fret gets one in. Would love to try it.

Rick

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: Gray Rooster
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 01:29 PM

Bob Taylor (at Garrison) says they are re-tooling for Dreadnught body styles now. They will cease production of the concert models. He also mentioned looking into more exotic woods later on.

I'm no expert, but I like spruce or cedar on top with a heavy turn towards spruce.

I like rosewood sides and backs for the most part. I do have several guitars with maple, walnut or koa sides and back. Different tones, naturally. I suggest listening to guitars you play and make a decision based on the sound quality alone. One man's trash ...

In a perfect world, the tone woods on all instruments would be "mature" at the time of construction. Aged woods are common ground for instruments and their makers. It is hard to "mature" a 50 year old piece of any tone wood any more than it is already IMHO. What I do think happens is the guitar settles to a players style(s) after it has been played consistently (as in hours per week, not once a year).

I'm sure there are different opinions out there in Mudcat land. I know some players who keep the tone they like with humidifiers and others who keep their guitar as dry as they can (dry will kill a guitar eventually but I played some incredible ones that "live" in the desert and have for over 20 years).

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: catspaw49
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 01:39 PM

I'm anxious to see one of these in the flesh. Sound is a matter of personal taste to some degree and let's not forget that some inexpensive guitars of ten win "blind" sound tests. Rick has a story about a Yamaha that won at Mandolin brothers and that happens a lot. Hard to pass on the name and beauty of some other biggies, but we tend to allow our eye to influence our ears.

Spaw

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: Gray Rooster
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 05:02 PM

Spaw, I'm with you.

I've played the G40 or 50 - I was in an airport situation and chanced upon a guy who had as many cases as I did. I asked him what he had in them and he asked me if I wanted to play a great $900.00 (US) guitar. I said OK and he pulls out this Garrison. I only had 10 minutes with it. During that time, I also looked inside (a horror to purists) and all over it, so my playing time was limited. It DID sparkle on the few pieces I attempted and this was at JFK with all the ambient noise an airport has.

Bob Taylor says the newer models coming out are much cleaner and lighter inside, so no more What The Hell Is THAT IN THERE kind of reaction is expected.

I might point out they are not trying to make cheap guitars there. They simply found a way to manufacture them for less and are passing the savings on to the consumer. Evidently, lots of stores lined up to carry them.

Bob did say they are looking at the quality of available student level guitars and are trying to raise the bar for them without breaking the students bank account.

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: Gray Rooster
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 05:03 PM

Spaw, I'm with you.

I've played the G40 or 50 - I was in an airport situation and chanced upon a guy who had as many cases as I did. I asked him what he had in them and he asked me if I wanted to play a great $900.00 (US) guitar. I said OK and he pulls out this Garrison. I only had 10 minutes with it. During that time, I also looked inside (a horror to purists) and all over it, so my playing time was limited. It DID sparkle on the few pieces I attempted and this was at JFK with all the ambient noise an airport has.

Bob Taylor says the newer models coming out are much cleaner and lighter inside, so no more What The Hell Is THAT IN THERE kind of reaction is expected.

I might point out they are not trying to make cheap guitars there. They simply found a way to manufacture them for less and are passing the savings on to the consumer. Evidently, lots of stores lined up to carry them.

Bob did say they are looking at the quality of available student level guitars and are trying to raise the bar for them without breaking the students bank account.

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: Gray Rooster
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 05:04 PM

Spaw, I'm with you.

I've played the G40 or 50 - I was in an airport situation and chanced upon a guy who had as many cases as I did. I asked him what he had in them and he asked me if I wanted to play a great $900.00 (US) guitar. I said OK and he pulls out this Garrison. I only had 10 minutes with it. During that time, I also looked inside (a horror to purists) and all over it, so my playing time was limited. It DID sparkle on the few pieces I attempted and this was at JFK with all the ambient noise an airport has.

Bob Taylor says the newer models coming out are much cleaner and lighter inside, so no more What The Hell Is THAT IN THERE kind of reaction is expected.

I might point out they are not trying to make cheap guitars there. They simply found a way to manufacture them for less and are passing the savings on to the consumer. Evidently, lots of stores lined up to carry them.

Bob did say they are looking at the quality of available student level guitars and are trying to raise the bar for them without breaking the students bank account.

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: Gray Rooster
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 05:13 PM

Spaw, I'm with you.

I've played the G40 or 50 - I was in an airport situation and chanced upon a guy who had as many cases as I did. I asked him what he had in them and he asked me if I wanted to play a great $900.00 (US) guitar. I said OK and he pulls out this Garrison. I only had 10 minutes with it. During that time, I also looked inside (a horror to purists) and all over it, so my playing time was limited. It DID sparkle on the few pieces I attempted and this was at JFK with all the ambient noise an airport has.

Bob Taylor says the newer models coming out are much cleaner and lighter inside, so no more What The Hell Is THAT IN THERE kind of reaction is expected.

I might point out they are not trying to make cheap guitars there. They simply found a way to manufacture them for less and are passing the savings on to the consumer. Evidently, lots of stores lined up to carry them.

Bob did say they are looking at the quality of available student level guitars and are trying to raise the bar for them without breaking the students bank account.

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: Gray Rooster
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 06:09 PM

Sorry - my first multiple post. The sever was not responding (so the message said) and I took the message at its word.

STUPID BOB, a.k.a. Gray Rooster

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Feb 01 - 09:27 PM

Gray Bob Rooster,

How would you compare the Griffiths to your other guitars?

chance/fortunato

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: Gray Rooster
Date: 01 Mar 01 - 02:00 AM

Hard to tell.

I've spoken to Bob about getting my hands on one for a true test. As soon as the retooling is finished and the new line is available, I'll have a few words to say.

Garrison's are not found down here in Texas. The only one I've seen/felt/played was for ten minutes - but it was enough for me to persue it.

It had a sparkle and flavor I liked (concert style) and I can only guess what the dreadnought will sound like. I expect a crisp, "pushy" sound, but I may be way off track.

I hope they'll be comparable to Martin's D28. If so, you'll hear about it. I've played Martin's for years and I'm looking for a guitar that costs MUCH less for my students yet stands up to the D28. I'm not fond of Martin's attempt to dumb down their line with inferior materials and craftsmanship (sorry). I'll get over it, but I think the Garrison will be more for the money.

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: GUEST,Chris Griffiths
Date: 08 Jun 01 - 07:39 AM

I'm a little late jumping in here! Thanx for the kind words and for taking the time to investigate. The results we are getting are quite astounding and I can't wait for you to spend LOT'S of time with our guitars. Email me directly if you like:

[e-mail]

Thanx.

Chris

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: UB Ed
Date: 08 Jun 01 - 09:23 AM

I second Rooster's resentment of Martin dumbing down their line. I suspect they have also lost a lot of quality in their 28 and 35 series as well.

Who are the dealers in the States carrying these babies?

Ed

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: GUEST,Tom
Date: 08 Jun 01 - 01:35 PM

I was just in e-mail contact today with a Mark Peddle from Garrison gtrs. I had inquired about dealers in the USA. He was open for suggestions of dealers to contact. You may want to e-mail him and give him the name of a dealer you like in your area. He was very appreciative of the information I gave him and had gotten in contact with the guy I told him about. I think they would appreciate any help one could offer.

[e-mail]

I'm not sure about the double "t" in guitar but that was how I saw it spelled. Cheers! Tom

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From:
Date: 15 Jul 01 - 01:23 PM

Hi guys, I was just reading through some postings. If you do have any favorite stores in your area, please e-mail me just as Tom stated. (no doublr "t" in guitars.

Thanks Mark

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: Fortunato
Date: 20 Sep 01 - 02:40 PM

Has anyone bought or played extensively of these guitars? Opinions?

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: Fortunato
Date: 21 Sep 01 - 08:42 AM

refreshing.

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: Steve in Idaho
Date: 05 Oct 01 - 01:02 PM

I haven't played one - or even seen one - but that buzz feiten tuning? Anyone had that done to an acoustic guitar?

Steve

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: little john cameron
Date: 16 Dec 01 - 11:09 PM

refreshing this.Go to Garrison Guitars for the latest update.
October 27th, 2001

2.30pm

.

May 10th, 2001

3.29pm,

Chris: Another happy customer! While shooting a movie here in Newfoundland, Keifer Sutherland caught wind of our guitars and manufacturing facility here in Newfoundland and was eager to try one out. Bob Taylor, our Artist Relations Manager, met up with Keifer in his trailer on location. All we had at the time was a G-40 prototype with the older, heavier bracing system (no longer in production). He was crazy about it and when he asked how much it costs, Bob turned the question back on Keifer and he replied "About $3000?". Wow! What does that tell you? This guitar retails in the US, with a hard-shell case, for $833.00!!! He wanted to buy it on the spot but when we refused (couldn't sell one of the prototypes), he wanted to borrow it for the rest of his stay here and made us promise to ship him one of the production models!

Nice to get that kind of end user feedback.

Subject: RE: Innovative Griffiths guitars
From: GUEST,cc
Date: 04 Nov 04 - 12:32 PM

I bought a G30 (spruce top, birch back & sides) a few weeks ago.

I'll say that these are NOT the guitar for everybody - aesthetics and tolerance of new technology will come into play here. I don't want to "defend" the purchase, and made an effort to include negative observations, but the positive aspects seemed to have won out for me. Most definately I am very happy with the sound at this point, though I had a few frightful moments caused by some UNUSUALLY twangy new strings. Following is a kind of rundown of my first week with it, posted on another forum.

First time I saw them a few years ago I was really put off by the android-like skeletal system. Now I like the idea of the stability it might provide, and thought maybe I could see past the black cage. It really sounded good, even with old strings.

I will add that the cedar topped G20's sound a little better out of the box, but I am counting on the aging properties of the spruce.

These are really loud guitars with outstanding projection - I played the cedar/birch(G20) and the engelman/sapele (G40) models also. It's still the spruce/birch that speaks to me - and still with the old strings on. The tone is very articulate and even, intonation is on. I would venture to say that the birch gives something like a maple sound, but with a mahogany-like signature.

When I picked it up, the dealer had put new Adamas light strings on it. Strummed in the store, it sounded right. The woods are finished well. The spruce seems very high quality, with tight grain. The birch is nothing to write home about, looks-wise, with a few interesting knots. Bookmatching is good, quarter-sawing not perfect (you get that two-tone appearance in certain lights.)

I got it home and tuned it up and got scared. It sounded like a dobro, especially the D and G strings. Different attacks, same sensation. Hard to describe, but you know that dobro twang, or twoing? My head was spinning. I kept thinking about how birch is used on a number of resonator guitars, and perhaps with good reason. I was really afraid I had made a foolish choice. I decided overall that there was just a whole lot of that "new string" kind of sound which is always a bit much for me. Decided to give it a little more time, and just played the heck out of it for the evening.

One thing for sure, after day one, this is a LOUD guitar. One of my main hopes for it was volume and projection, and it definately has a load of both. Probably one of the loudest guitars I've played.

Day 2, I tuned it up and it did sound mellower, still a little twangy. Wondering if that black frame is coloring the tone. Still got the new string sound (I don't think I'll ever buy Adamas strings again). Sounded more like a guitar and less like a dobro. Still amazed at the volume, and the sustain and balance between notes are outstanding. I think there is something to the Buzz Feiten tuning system. Very articulate. Played some hard and moderate strumming, and some fingerpicking. Biggest observation that day was the sense of hugeness in the vibration of this guitar. I believe their idea about transmission of vibration through the bracing, end and neck blocks, and through the necks is really working. This is a very strong guitar, and I feel very secure about the neck to body joint, which is an important point in my mind. Big sound.

Day 3, I put it through it's paces. Sounding like a very clear voiced guitar with some chimey overtones. It's a keeper, considering the volume capability and penetrating projection, but sounds less "twangy" today. I'm very enthused, I think as the strings mellow and the spruce opens up, this is going to be sweet. Kind of maple/mahogany in sound, if that makes any sense.

Well, 5 days into this and I think I'll be very happy with this. I'll also say that it's not the guitar for everybody, and that's a matter of personal preference, tolerance of technology (it's a little weird to look inside and see that black bracing), and of course, sound is very subjective.
At this point, the bass has seemed to really stand up. Must have been just too much of that new string zing for the first couple of days.

Somewhere I read that the Garrisons sound to some as if already EQ'd. I'd say that is a fair analogy. It's a very balanced sound. While the mids are warm and very present, they don't get in the way of the clear trebles or the authoritative bass.

Now that the strings have calmed down a bit, the guitar sounds woody. Also, something in that polywhatever bracing cage gives it a bit of sparkle and a real load of sustain. I'm hearing a solid wood quality sound.

And it IS loud. This is a clear sounding, articulate guitar. Really sounds great flatpicked, and strumming you can get a really nice "whomp" (think Niel Young). Very good response for fingerpicking also.

I haven't mentioned much about the playability. I like to stay away from comparisons to other brands, and this is as subjective as sound descriptions. I'll make an exception here. So far, the most easy to play guitars I've handled have been Taylors, and, believe it or not, a "Denny Zager" Washburn. This neck plays a lot like those. The action was perfect, (or my version of perfect) in the store, and the neck feels very straight and even up and down the fretboard. The radius may be more than some others. Comfortable feel and plays as fast as I care to. The little bit of extra nut width (1.7 as compared to the so-common 1 11/16 or 1.67) combined with the radius makes this a good fingerpicker. The "Buzz Feiten" tuning system seems to be doing what it is supposed to, I get great chord voicing up and down the neck, and the intonation is right on.

The woods are good. Though not perfectly quarter-sawn, evidenced by the "two tone" look in certain lights, they are book-matched perfectly. The spruce top is tight grained and full of "silking" or medial rays which may be a sign of a quality guitar top. The birch back and sides, though bland on this particular guitar, are finely grained and very well formed and finished.

It comes with a good Canadian hardshell case, though I opted to keep the case from the guitar I traded in.

Things to think about:

Definately a "Plain Jane" with those unstained (and sort of blandly grained) birch sides with the overall satin finish, yet there is an interesting sheen to it.

The binding being an integral part of the bracing system is a great idea, and makes for some great protection.

STRONG guitar. This is a natural road warrior.

Inside type bridge plate pickups might be a bad idea for this. They'd be sticking to that bracing material. Might be interesting to hear but my gut feeling is it wouldn't be very "acoustic" sounding. (I'll be going with an under-saddle piezo)

What happens if the wood shrinks or swells and the bracing doesn't? Let's keep it humidified.

Interesting observation: I've seen a lot of comments on the "Intelli-Touch" tuner, saying how people have trouble getting all the notes to register when they clamp it to the headstock, and have to move it for certain notes. I've experienced this on every instrument I've put the IntelliTouch to, except for this Garrison. Not an issue on this guitar, and I think it's because that bracing system, tied in so securely to the neck, is really doing what it's supposed to do. This thing THRUMS with vibration like it's alive.

Played it for a long-time guitar buddy (between he and I we must have more than a half century of playing time). He has played a lot of really nice guitars, but he was taken by the sound and playability of this G-30. No small achievement, because he always speaks his mind. He's now looking for a Garrison 12-string!

Though it's the middle of the night and I've got time to babble on and on, I'll sum it up. This is a go-to guitar. Great solid wood sound, huge volume, and strength to put aside a lot of the worries that go with acoustics. I don't think you'll see neck/body joint issues on these, though they do have the typical 14th fret slope. With the plain looks and the ease of playing, this is a guitar to be real comfortable with. I don't think this would be one people will be trading off. If I wanted a high end guitar, I wouldn't put this one up for sale, it's just too "useful". "Utilitarion"? I suppose, but I must stress that this is a MUSICAL guitar and a pleasure to play. I think even "elitist" high-end owners would like and appreciate the Garrison G-30, or even want one as a back-up or road guitar.

All that for just about $470 including a good hard shell case.