Help: Furrin Moosic for us Imperialists...

Subject: Furrin Moosic for us Imperialists...
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 02 Mar 01 - 08:01 AM

I was listening to Stings "Desert Rain" (or is it "After the rain has fallen"???) and thinking what a brilliant song when I got to thinking.

How come Sting (white, middle-class, thin bloke) can get away with singing 'world' music when me (white, middle-class, fat bloke) would sound and look a complete pratt if I tried to do something similar?

Does anyone have any suggestions of Eastern, Asian, African or any other 'world' music, which can be sung in English by British Imperialist Folkies like me without sounding like I am taking the p**s???

Cheers

Dave the eclectic gnome

Subject: RE: Help: Furrin Moosic for us Imperialists...
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 02 Mar 01 - 09:37 AM

The mantle of Imperialism has passed to other, bigger nations nowadays, of course, though as for cultural imperialism...  My own feeling is that people like Sting and Paul Simon are not engaging in "world music" as such, but are simply borrowing stylistic traits from other people's traditions in order to feed the hunger of the industrialised world for the exotic, while presenting it in an easily-digestible form.  "Fusion", "Crossover", or what you will.  Similarly, in an ever-contracting world, we have Japanese people playing Irish fiddle tunes, Irish and Scottish musicians trawling African traditions for interesting stuff to play around with... All well and good provided nobody gets too carried away and starts to believe that there's anything particularly authentic about it.  Basically, if you take a few years to learn how to do it properly, it'll sound alright (provided you never try to sing in a language you can't speak), but I'm not sure why you'd want to, unless there's a particular style or form that you have a real passion for.  Not much help, I'm afraid!

Malcolm

Subject: RE: Help: Furrin Moosic for us Imperialists...
From: GUEST,Matt_R
Date: 02 Mar 01 - 09:48 AM

I love singing in Japanese...

Subject: RE: Help: Furrin Moosic for us Imperialists...
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 02 Mar 01 - 09:55 AM

But do you understand it?

Subject: RE: Help: Furrin Moosic for us Imperialists...
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 02 Mar 01 - 10:03 AM

Good point, Malcolm! I hadn't thought about it that way - I think I might give the borrowing bits from other cultures and I might find something I am good at....;-)

I guess I could get my Anglo Concertina sounding like the Eastern (Indian?) harmonium type instrument, played properly. I will give it a whirl.

Mind you, people already reckon my concertina playing already sounds like something from another planet!

Matt R - that wasn't you who had to be carried off the stage part way through singing a 300-odd verse Japanese folk song at the 'worst singer' contest at Fylde some years ago was it???

DtG

Subject: RE: Help: Furrin Moosic for us Imperialists...
From: GUEST,Matt_R
Date: 02 Mar 01 - 10:09 AM

YES I understand it. And if I don't, I translate it. Singing in the Japanese language has a different quality than English. Unlike English, each syllable is pronounced. There are no "silent" letters in Japanese. So saying the words is an exercise in beauty. Singing them is an experience. Right now I'm learning a new one by Mr.Children called "Machine Gunwo Bupponase".

Subject: RE: Help: Furrin Moosic for us Imperialists...
From: mousethief
Date: 02 Mar 01 - 01:21 PM

What Simon did do, however, with Graceland, was open up the American market to all sorts of African pop and folk music. There was no such thing as "world music" in most people's minds before Graceland. Simon drove a wedge in a tiny crack and opened it up for the rest of us.

So says me.

Alex

Subject: RE: Help: Furrin Moosic for us Imperialists...
From: Les from Hull
Date: 02 Mar 01 - 02:32 PM

We have no problem nicking anybody's music. At the last count Maggie has songs in at least 4 languages (including Swahili!) and I'll play tunes from anywhere and in any style I can. As long as it doesn't sound like a parody I don't see why anyone would want to take offence.

Subject: RE: Help: Furrin Moosic for us Imperialists...
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 02 Mar 01 - 04:26 PM

I feel the right way to do it is to borrow things from other peoples traditions that you reckon you can use - so rather than trying to make the concertina sound Indian, you get one of those Indian Harmoniums and try to use it in a session or with a dance team.

The same goes with ways of playing the music, and styles of singing, and songs. And the best thing is getting to play with musicians from other traditions, and swap ideas.

"The Chieftains in China" - that's the kind of thing I mean.

I'm waiting for the first Bhangra Morris side to hit Sidmouth.

Subject: RE: Help: Furrin Moosic for us Imperialists...
From: Sarah2
Date: 02 Mar 01 - 10:20 PM

Okay, here I am in Amarillo, Texas, where you can always find a band doing the latest out of Nashville. If someone comes through doing ANYTHING else, I'll probably go listen, given half a chance. So when Red McWilliams, out of Fort Worth, organized a tour with a Welshman he'd met in Japan, I was all for it. I thought, knowing Red, it would mostly be Scottish stuff, but Tich Gwilym did an absolutely wonderful Blues set in the middle of the night, playing a strange instrument he'd found in South America -- looked like an eight-string ukelele, but it had a rich, full sound. And he ate that thing up! It was great.

Ain't a Welshman got a right to sing the Blues?

Sarah

Subject: RE: Help: Furrin Moosic for us Imperialists...
From: Rich(bodhránai gan ciall)
Date: 03 Mar 01 - 06:36 PM

Joe Craven (of the David Grisman Quintet) has a CD called "Camptown" which is a collection of Irish and Appalachian fiddle tunes set to world beat rhythms. It opens with a South African "Soldiers Joy/Leather Britches", has a Reggae "Wind that Shakes the Barley", a Brazilian "Camptown Races", a Gypsy Swing "Turkey in the Straw", and even a hip-hop "Kitchen Girl", amongst others. It is a disc that, as a traditionalist, I should hate with a passion, and yet it's one of my favorite CDs! It's on a small, California-based label called Acorn Records. Check it out!

Rich