|
Subject: English National Anthem From: Murray MacLeod Date: 08 Mar 01 - 08:18 AM Since the thread on alternative American anthems created such a response, let's see if we can do something similar for the British Isles. I have long been of the opinion that Andy M Stewart's "Rambling Rover" should be the National Anthem of Scotland, but in the (unlikely) event of total independence for the Celtic countries, England is going to need a new National Anthem as well. I propose Derek Brimstone's stirring song should be adopted
I'm a fine young Englishman,
Now the English are the best
These are Derek's omly two verses. Some years ago I took the liberty, with his permission, of composing a middle verse which goes like this:
You can see me on the street I feel this song encapsulates the spirit of the modern Englishman in a way which "God Save the Queen" somehow fails to do ................... Murray |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Snuffy Date: 08 Mar 01 - 09:35 AM Isn't that a bit sexist, Murray? You need something for the ladettes to sing too. How about Les Barker's "Tracy Likes Pina Colada" to the tune of the Dambusters March - everyone will know the tune at least. From memory the chorus goes something like:
Tracy likes pina colada Couldn't find it in the DT, but I've got it in one of Les' books at home if anyone wants the whole thing. Wassail! V |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: A Wandering Minstrel Date: 08 Mar 01 - 09:38 AM Billy Conollys proposition that we should exchange "The Archers" theme for the national anthem is still worth considering. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Peter Kasin Date: 09 Mar 01 - 01:11 AM Murray, would you go for "A Man's A Man For A' That" as a possible national anthem for Scotland? I heard when it was sung at the opening of the Scottish parliament, it had a powerful effect on everyone present. The MP's were crying there eyes out. A magnificent song, worthy of N. anthem status, from my viewpoint from across the pond. -chanteyranger |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Sorcha Date: 09 Mar 01 - 01:31 AM Current lyrics are sappy, and tune is schmaltzy, but it is easy to sing......"The Maple Leaf" was almost as bad as Star Spangled Banner.......but I don't have any better suggestions for the British.......uuhhhhh, UK, anthem. Not sure either the UK or the US could deal with changing Anthems now....... |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Peter Kasin Date: 09 Mar 01 - 01:51 AM Probably not, Sorcha. Pretty sacred cows, those anthems. It's nice to fantasize, though, eh? |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: English Jon Date: 09 Mar 01 - 03:19 AM Gilbert and Sullivan came up with the suitably silly "he is an Englishman": For he himself has said it And it's greatly to his credit That he is an Englishman, He is an Englishman. For he might have been a Russian, A French or Turk or Prussian, Or perhaps Italian, Or perhaps Italian... But in spite of all temptations To belong to other nations He remains an Englishman He remains an Englishman. Etc... Then there's "The English are Best" by Flanders and Swan... "The English, the English, The English are Best I wouldn't give tuppence for all of the rest." But then, I don't think anyone in England is bothered about wearing national dress? Anyone out there wear Morris kit to work? So why bother with a national song? ;) English Jon |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: alison Date: 09 Mar 01 - 03:25 AM I think someone should write words to the "Match of the Day" theme... it's catchy... everyone in the UK knows it..... slainte alison |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Steve Parkes Date: 09 Mar 01 - 03:43 AM English John we all wear the English National Costume: t-shirt, jeans & trainers! I'm a bit old-fashioned (well, I'm entitled at my age), and wear flannels instead of jeans. Steve |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: MikeofNorthumbria Date: 09 Mar 01 - 06:39 AM For several years, English rugby supporters have used 'Swing Low, Sweet Chariot' as their unofficial anthem. It's got a great chorus, but the verses are uninspiring, and anyhow, most people can't remember them. So how about borrowing a couple of verses from Mr W Blake, and inserting them between the choruses of 'Swing Low' , like this:
Swing low, sweet chariot: coming for to carry me home (2X)
Bring me my bow of burning gold; bring me my arrows of desire
Swing low, sweet chariot: coming for to carry me home (2X)
I shall not cease from mental fight, nor shall my sword sleep in my hand,
Swing low, sweet chariot: coming for to carry me home (2X) It might be worth a try ... Wassail |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Mr Red Date: 09 Mar 01 - 07:54 AM Sorcha An English Anthem would not relate the Celtic fringes, not even Cornwall I suspect. As a Staffordshire man I am proud to "English" until I hear "Match of the Day" and what the footie crowd may have got up to, in some far off foreign field! Alison "Match of the Day" should be struck! Football is not always Englands Glory. Game yes, once in 1966. Fans er.. not in my name. Having said that I have no obviuos suggestions for an English National Anthem. Whatever, it should be sung with a stiff upper lip and be ever so polite. Don't you know? |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Steve Parkes Date: 09 Mar 01 - 09:50 AM Mr Red, are you South Staffs (like me) or North? I think we should have separate national anthems! |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: GUEST,JohnB Date: 09 Mar 01 - 12:40 PM Flanders and Swan do one entitled "The English". I only remember the chorus, The English the English the English are best, I wouldn't give tuppence for all of the rest. JohnB |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Les from Hull Date: 09 Mar 01 - 12:48 PM Presumably we've already got an English (and Welsh) National Anthem. Certainly we shouldn't use God Save the Queen for a UK national anthem with the verse in it that's so beastly about the Scots. Perhaps somebody would post the words to show the rest of the world. Any road, there's only one anthem and that's t'Anthem. (Holmfirth Anthem for the geographically challenged - those of you who live outside Yorkshire). It's even got stuff about 'fighting French and Spaniards' in it! What else do we need? The best thing about Holmfirth Anthem is not the fairly meaningless words, but the singability. You've got to be in the right place at the right time to experience it. Les |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Mr Red Date: 09 Mar 01 - 01:34 PM Steve Parkes Akttewlly owr kid ar be Black country. Dead centre of civilisation - Wednesbury - the very dead centre. As Boswell said, black by day and red by night. Hence Black Country. So many foundaries - all gone. At least Stroud is clean. But it tay Wedgebury. Darlaston has a coughing shanty - I should know I wrote one. Wear am yo froom? |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: TamthebamfraeScotland Date: 09 Mar 01 - 01:44 PM I'm a member of the S.N.P. I think that the English national anthem should be 'here's to you sweet lovely England' by the spinners. I think that it just somes up the country of England. I hope that one day you will get your own national anthem. There are some people here in Scotland think that the English national anthem is 'God save the Queen' because most not all but most English people sing it whenever England is playing any type of Sport. Well as I say good luck and lang may yer lum reek.
|
|
Subject: Lyr Add: GOD SAVE THE QUEEN From: TamthebamfraeScotland Date: 09 Mar 01 - 01:55 PM For all of you, the real words to 'GOD SAVE THE QUEEN' are
1.
2.
3.
4. Then you wonder why some Scots don't like the song |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: TamthebamfraeScotland Date: 09 Mar 01 - 04:33 PM I just remembered, when are some English people going to stop talking about the world cup in 1966. Every year since then all we get is the world cup in 1966. We know that you won in 1966, so we don't to reminded again, mind you they never mention 1967 when SCOTLAND BECAME THE UNOFFICAL WORLD CHAMPIONS, beating England 3-2. at Wembley. And in 1978 we Scots were in the world cup representing Britain. I know we were rubbish but at least we were there. And we qualfied for the world cup more times than England. 5 times in a row, and we got a trophy to prove it. Tom |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Dave Wynn Date: 09 Mar 01 - 05:35 PM Really busbitter...I am surprised that you admit to being a member of the S.N.P.....I wouldn't dream of admitting I am a paid up member of the B.N.P.....;-) Spot. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: bill\sables Date: 09 Mar 01 - 06:38 PM As every one in Newcastle knows, when the Angles invaded England many years ago they sailed up the Tyne and disembarked at Newcastle. Now the acute Angles went North and settled in Scotland, the obtuse Angles went south and settled somewhere South of the Humber and became menbers of parlement, but the Right Angles stayed where they were on Tyneside and later invented the true National Anthem which is of course "The Blaydon Races" Bill |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Dave Wynn Date: 09 Mar 01 - 07:00 PM Or Cushie Butterfield Bill..... |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Lanfranc Date: 09 Mar 01 - 07:19 PM My vote goes to the Flanders and Swann song, but I suppose one would have to be more careful since a certain celebrated lady was condemned for taking the piss out of the Welsh on TV. Sod it, why should we, they don't scruple to denigrate the English! Racist, my arse! Better yet, let's do without a national anthem, or substitute John Lennon's "Imagine" or that earlier junkie, William Blake's stirring "Jerusalem". OK, it's the Parry tune that makes it, but standing in a tea chest to sing it need not be compulsory (pace Monty Python). "Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel." |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: TamthebamfraeScotland Date: 10 Mar 01 - 04:47 AM To spot, The B.N.P. are a Neo Nazi party were as the S.N.P. are a party for the freedom of Scotland and it's people no matter where they came from. Tom |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Hawker Date: 10 Mar 01 - 07:46 AM Mr. Red Hell NO! The Cornish already have their own National anthem (written by a Devon Man if you ever did!) TRELAWNEY Though those purists amongst you will protest that this is not true... he did admit in his scrawlings that he nicked the tune and chorus from an earlier popular folk song about Tinners As far as the UK National anthem goes ANYTHING (within reason) has GOT TO be better than the present one! Lucy |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: roopoo Date: 11 Mar 01 - 03:04 AM All other UK countries except England have their own anthems and use them except when a more general one is required. The English to my knowledge have never had one of their own, as is shown by any international sporting event. Not only that, the tune is also used across the pond ("My Country 'tis of Thee") so it is not just "ours". We should be ashamed that we've either been too arrogant or complacent to think of one! Now some might argue that the real English are the Welsh, but somehow I can't see "Land of My Fathers" being sung twice over at Twickenham! Other academics say that the nearest to Old English/Norse is spoken in Northumberland, which is about as unadulterated as you can get these days with the advent of "Estuary English". Unfortunately if you accept "Blaydon Races" it somehow wouldn't sound right in anything else except the original dialect. Personally I like the suggestion of "T'Anthem". It's not too long, and it's a damn good sing. It also "travels" into other regional accents reasonably well. Don't know how it'd sound played by the band of the Coldstream Guards though... Andrea
|
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Mr Red Date: 11 Mar 01 - 06:42 AM I think the tune for the Lichtenstein National Anthem would be a good one to use. I think it was composed by Dr Thomas Arne. **BG** **snigger** Hands up those who know it......... |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Eric the Viking Date: 11 Mar 01 - 08:43 AM 'ere- I should be careful wot yer say-ask Anne Robinson!!!! I think there should be an Anglo-Saxon/Viking anthem and bugger all the rest!! Don't want no bloody Normans singing any songs!! Last time that lot started they shot our 'Arold!! |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Gervase Date: 12 Mar 01 - 04:42 AM I like the idea of the Holmfirth Anthem - but what about Cadgewith? Surely more appropriate to the English over the centuries - "for to rob and to plunder, that is our intent.." |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Gervase Date: 12 Mar 01 - 04:47 AM ...to say nothing of "The Beauty of Kashmir". I'm sure I've had a rogan josh there, and it certainly sums up our national cuisine. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: JeZeBeL Date: 12 Mar 01 - 01:41 PM I agree with Bill. The only true national anthem has to be The Blaydon Races.....Not being a Geordie meself, except maybe after being accepted as an honorary one having done a yard of broon ale, I love the Blaydon Races.......... By the way Bill, do you know Byker Hill, as I cant remember the words, I always used to nick them off the wall in't'Cumberland Arms, eeeeee, them were the days.......... Emma xxx |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: roopoo Date: 13 Mar 01 - 01:58 AM Ooops! Eric, will you speak to me again? - my maiden name, although fairly common, is actually French (mediaeval or norman, pertaining to chaplains of chateaux - Larousse dictionary of French surnames). This is all tied in with the Irish side of me too! I hope there's enough of the Anglo-Saxon (Nottingham area, so it's possible) on my mother's side to redeem me! Anyway, if Harold hadn't had to shed some blood up at Stamford Bridge first and wear himself out, he probably wouldn't have been shot "on 'is 'orse, with 'is 'awk in 'is 'and!" I still think the Holmfirth Anthem is a good'un, although I must admit, the Cadgwith Anthem is a good sing too. Couldn't we somehow combine them: "To the streams in yonder mountains where the pratty flowers grow"? Andrea |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: roopoo Date: 13 Mar 01 - 03:28 AM Ok, so it's caves in the original, not streams, but you don't get many flowers growing in caves. Andrea |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: English Jon Date: 13 Mar 01 - 04:02 AM This B.N.P, S.N.P. joke thing... Isn't Scotland part of Britain? Cheers, English Jon (Only trouble with Cadgwith anthem is no bugger can find the right key for it. My family regularly massacre it at parties) |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Steve Parkes Date: 13 Mar 01 - 04:11 AM Mr Red -- sorry for the long delay, but that's what happens when you go home for the weekend. Right -- here's the CV: Born in Bloxwich (the old Maternity Hospital, in fact), brought up in Fullbrook, Walsall (about two years); Blakenall (near Blocco, not Blakenhall in 'Hampton), about six months; Beechdale (aka Gypsy Lane Estate), Leamore (by Walsall), about fifteen years; Sandymount, Highgate (back of the brewery), Walsall, about ten years (apart from a brief stay round the corner at Doveridge Place in Caldmore (pr. 'karma'!), sometime home of the poet Sir Henry Newbolt as a lad; then (after getting married, Aldridge, briefly; Walsall Wood, also briefly, then Stonnall for the last sixteen years. Not strictly Black Country (indeed, nearer Brownhills some of the time!). But I used to lie in bed as a small kid (and a big kid) watching the sky lit up like the fires of Hell from the cupola furnaces over Leamore Lane way, and listening to the trains shunting coal wagons at the Co-op coal depot to the north and the power station to the south. Somtimes I'd stay with my grandparents in Fullbrook and listen to the trains at Bescot marshalling yard, a mile down the road, spinning their wheels as they strained to pick up a string of trucks. It's a wonder I ever grew up into the fine athletic figure of a man I did, with all that pollution! Happy days ... maybe I should write a song about them? |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Mr Red Date: 13 Mar 01 - 12:27 PM Steve Parks I wrote a song 'bout Wedgebury. Did it years agoo at the Brewers Droop. Three handkerchief jobbie. Lived in Kings Hill, school there (amongst others). Lived in Rushall nr the Silly Isles and on the Yew Tree. Bescot marshalling yard kept me awake many a night. Moved to Malvern - such a nicer place to get divorced from, don't you think? Now its Stoud and proud. Wrote songs about Walsall, 'Hampton, Darlo with varying degrees of quality. Hey folks are we boring you? |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: GUEST,Bill Robinson Date: 13 Mar 01 - 04:02 PM My parents were Geordies from Durham.My dad was a railroader in the USA...I am looking for the lyrics to "The Little Red Caboose Behind the Train" I remember some of them from when I was little...Please email me at : sopwithcl:aol.com....thanks...Bill Robinson |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Steve Parkes Date: 14 Mar 01 - 06:49 AM Bill, you want to start a new thread: that way, you get everybody's attention. Bore away, Mr Red! My mom sya when she was little (in the thirties) she used to gaze from her bedroom window (in the Pleck) at the two churches on top o' the bonk at Darlaston and think how Romantic it looked, and always planned to go there when she was big enough. I've been to Darlo, and I don't know what it was all over the pavements, but it wor gold! I'd be interested in your songs; I'd love to impress the folks in Bedford with my Roots! Steve |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Wolfgang Date: 14 Mar 01 - 07:54 AM Mr. Red, everyone in this thread knows the tune of the Lichtenstein national anthem. Maybe they don't know that they know it, but they do. You can go here for a midi of it. Wolfgang |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Wolfgang Date: 14 Mar 01 - 07:55 AM BTW, the tune of the Lichtenstein national anthem is often used in the southwest of Germany for carneval songs. Wolfgang |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Wolfgang Date: 14 Mar 01 - 07:57 AM new try for the link Wolfgang |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: TamthebamfraeScotland Date: 14 Mar 01 - 09:33 AM English Jon, Scotland was forced to Join England in 1707 under the act of Union, the English government greased a lot of Scottish Lords in the Scottish government, that's the song Parcel of Rouges is all about, Scottish M.P's back taking back handers from the English counterparts. And that's why The S.N.P. want freedom for Scotland. When The duke of Hamilton went down to Westminster after the act of Union he wanted to Scotland's freedom back from the English. The S.N.P. members want Scotland to be a separate Country. Anyway we are a separate country from England, for example we have our own laws, our own eductional system, our own churches and our own money and now our own parliment as well, so how can you say that Scotland is a part of Britain. I hope that this makes it clear, as for the English national anthem should be The blaydon races. A good old Northern(English) song. Tom
|
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Dave Wynn Date: 14 Mar 01 - 06:46 PM English Jon...Sorry you asked now?.... ....and why would a person from Scotland (now apparently not part of the union) therefore believe thay have valid input into selecting a national anthem for England...It would be the equivalent of an English person (like me) suggesting Scotland should adopt "johnny where's your troosers" as their anthem...I wouldn't dream of it!;o) Spot. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Murray MacLeod Date: 14 Mar 01 - 06:51 PM "Johnny Where's Your Troosers" ? Don't know it, but I would have no objection to "Donald Where's Your Troosers" as the Scottish National Anthem. Murray |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Dave Wynn Date: 14 Mar 01 - 07:18 PM I must apologise for my last posting. I have just consulted my Penguin book of Folk Songs from Scotland and it is indeed "Donald" and not "Johnny" who has lost his trousers....see how easy it is to change a whole nations anthem with just a slip of the memory....Thanks for the correction Mr MacLeod. This could lead to all sorts of problems this memory lapse...we could end up with "Bristol Races" or "Moon spangled Banner"...frightenin'... Spot |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Bugsy Date: 14 Mar 01 - 07:42 PM Having lived longer now in Australia than I did in the land of my birth, I most probably shouldn't have any say here (though they do say that one never loses one's British birthright). However, I always thought that England's National Anthem should be "Jerusalem". For anyone who does not know it, the lyrics are as follows: And did those feet in ancient time Walk upon England's mountains green? And was the holy Lamb of God On England's pleasant pastures seen? And did the countenance divine Shine forth upon our clouded hills? And Jerusalem builded here Among those dark Satanic mills? Bring me my bow of burning gold Bring me my arrows of desire! Bring me my spear! Oh, clouds unfold! Bring me my chariot of fire. I will not cease from mental fight. Nor shall my sword sleep in my hand, Till we have built Jerusalem In England's green and pleasant land! When I was a lad, this song always stirred the loins! Still does, for that matter. Cheers Bugsy |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: GUEST,norton Date: 14 Mar 01 - 09:10 PM i |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: TamthebamfraeScotland Date: 15 Mar 01 - 02:47 PM For a person who is from Scotland, then why should Westminster or anywhere else in England tell us in Scotland HOW to run our country, that's what happens everytime your English M.p's do when they vote on Scottish policies, what about the Poll tax that we here in Scotland had a year before the English did, it was the ENGLISH M.P'S THAT VOTED FOR THAT AND ALSO TO HAVE NUCLEAR WEAPONS AT FASLANE.AND OTHER THINGS HERE IN SCOTLAND.
|
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: TamthebamfraeScotland Date: 15 Mar 01 - 02:53 PM You say that someone who doesn't feel a part of Britain I shuldn't be telling you what I think the English nationasl anthem should be. God you lot down there have being telling us here in Scotand what to do for years, it was the English M.P's that voted that Scotland should get the poll tax a YEAR before England, and another example that Faslane on the Clyde should get Nuclear weapons. Your English M.P's even stole the fishing rights from our Fishermen by moving your fishing grounds north to Scotland. I can go on with a list as long as my arm with all the things that Westminster has told us. When I talk about the fishing grounds i'M TALKING ABOUT WESTMINSTER. SCOTLAND HAS ALWAYS BEING A SEPARTE COUNTRY AND IS NOW A PART OF BRITIAN |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: Dave Wynn Date: 15 Mar 01 - 07:55 PM Stevieribs, ....Please stop shouting..Loud doesn't mean right....Have your Scotland..keep it...I don't want it...Dig a great channel across from Carlisle to the east coast and tow it away. But please don't shout. I didn't fight in the uprisings of 1745 and didn't clear one solitary highland. I didn't bribe any of your coutrymen nor hang one from a gallows tree...I didn't burn any crofts or rape and pillage. It must have been someone else who did it. So stop shouting at me coz I am innocent. Or if the charge is just being an Englishman...then I'm guilty as charged and proud of it! Spot. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: English National Anthem From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 15 Mar 01 - 08:37 PM "in the (unlikely) event of total independence for the Celtic countries"
Don't you believe it! (I just came in from a funeral trip to Ireland, and it's late at night, and I haven't even read the thread yet, and someone else may have said that already. But it jumped out at me.
Mind I disapprove of the term "Celtic countries" - Scotland and Ireland and even Wales are by no means exclusively "Celtic", even if you extend that from its proper sense of what language people speak to what language their ancestors spoke. Half the trouble in Ireland has stemmed from people thinking along those lines. But that's drifting the thread.
I'd vote for Yellow Submarine myself. Everyone knows it, it's easy to join in, and the words are highly appropriate and inclusive. |
| Share Thread: |
