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Veteran's Day (songs for)

11 Nov 97 - 07:35 PM
Gene 11 Nov 97 - 08:01 PM
Gene 11 Nov 97 - 10:46 PM
dwditty 11 Nov 97 - 10:54 PM
leprechaun 11 Nov 97 - 11:15 PM
Jon W. 12 Nov 97 - 10:38 AM
dick greenhaus 12 Nov 97 - 10:44 AM
Pauline Lerner 12 Nov 97 - 11:22 PM
S.P. Buck Mulligan 13 Nov 97 - 12:08 PM
13 Nov 97 - 06:32 PM
Wolfgang Hell 14 Nov 97 - 05:16 AM
S.P. Buck Mulligan 14 Nov 97 - 08:08 AM
Klinenboop 14 Nov 97 - 08:29 AM
Bert 14 Nov 97 - 10:49 AM
JMike 14 Nov 97 - 10:22 PM
leprechaun 15 Nov 97 - 09:29 PM
Barry 15 Nov 97 - 09:40 PM
Wolfgang 17 Nov 97 - 10:22 AM
Genie 20 Sep 01 - 07:01 AM
Genie 08 Nov 02 - 11:26 AM
Amos 08 Nov 02 - 11:30 AM
Troll 08 Nov 02 - 12:04 PM
mg 08 Nov 02 - 12:05 PM
Francy 08 Nov 02 - 12:08 PM
Midchuck 08 Nov 02 - 12:18 PM
Hrothgar 08 Nov 02 - 10:16 PM
bbc 09 Nov 02 - 08:28 AM
artbrooks 09 Nov 02 - 09:45 AM
chip a 09 Nov 02 - 12:09 PM
mg 09 Nov 02 - 08:59 PM
Banjer 09 Nov 02 - 11:01 PM
Big Mick 09 Nov 02 - 11:24 PM
Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull 09 Nov 02 - 11:45 PM
mg 09 Nov 02 - 11:58 PM
mg 10 Nov 02 - 12:16 AM
mg 10 Nov 02 - 12:25 AM
Big Mick 10 Nov 02 - 12:35 AM
Tinker 10 Nov 02 - 01:54 AM
The Pooka 10 Nov 02 - 10:06 AM
Banjer 10 Nov 02 - 10:33 AM
Greg F. 10 Nov 02 - 10:40 AM
Schantieman 10 Nov 02 - 10:43 AM
GUEST 10 Nov 02 - 10:55 AM
GUEST 10 Nov 02 - 11:04 AM
CET 10 Nov 02 - 12:29 PM
artbrooks 10 Nov 02 - 12:37 PM
mg 10 Nov 02 - 12:54 PM
GUEST 10 Nov 02 - 01:00 PM
GUEST 10 Nov 02 - 01:19 PM
GUEST 10 Nov 02 - 01:48 PM
mg 10 Nov 02 - 01:53 PM
artbrooks 10 Nov 02 - 01:57 PM
GUEST 10 Nov 02 - 02:12 PM
Big Mick 10 Nov 02 - 02:34 PM
Dave Swan 10 Nov 02 - 03:31 PM
Jeri 10 Nov 02 - 05:07 PM
GUEST,L 10 Nov 02 - 06:06 PM
Big Mick 10 Nov 02 - 06:17 PM
GUEST,L 10 Nov 02 - 07:10 PM
ballpienhammer 10 Nov 02 - 08:35 PM
ballpienhammer 10 Nov 02 - 08:48 PM
GUEST,L 10 Nov 02 - 09:06 PM
GUEST,L 10 Nov 02 - 09:08 PM
GUEST,L 10 Nov 02 - 09:31 PM
GUEST,L 10 Nov 02 - 09:35 PM
Mr Happy 10 Nov 02 - 09:44 PM
Amos 10 Nov 02 - 09:56 PM
mg 10 Nov 02 - 10:03 PM
Tinker 10 Nov 02 - 10:06 PM
GUEST,L 10 Nov 02 - 10:45 PM
mg 10 Nov 02 - 10:52 PM
GUEST,L 10 Nov 02 - 11:30 PM
GUEST,L 10 Nov 02 - 11:37 PM
GUEST,L 10 Nov 02 - 11:57 PM
GUEST,L 11 Nov 02 - 12:30 AM
GUEST,L 11 Nov 02 - 12:45 AM
mg 11 Nov 02 - 12:52 AM
GUEST,L 11 Nov 02 - 02:05 AM
GUEST,L 11 Nov 02 - 02:10 AM
Troll 11 Nov 02 - 06:08 AM
Big Mick 11 Nov 02 - 02:07 PM
mg 11 Nov 02 - 02:35 PM
GUEST,Q 11 Nov 02 - 03:32 PM
GUEST,Q 11 Nov 02 - 03:38 PM
Pinetop Slim 11 Nov 02 - 03:47 PM
GUEST,Lily Gardner 12 Aug 07 - 11:26 PM
GUEST,Mike B. 09 Nov 09 - 10:23 AM
GUEST,Elmore 09 Nov 09 - 11:46 AM
GUEST,Jacqued 09 Nov 09 - 03:24 PM
Amergin 09 Nov 09 - 03:51 PM
oldhippie 09 Nov 09 - 05:16 PM
open mike 09 Nov 09 - 10:26 PM
open mike 09 Nov 09 - 11:48 PM
eddie1 10 Nov 09 - 04:59 AM
GUEST,Ray 10 Nov 09 - 05:49 PM
mg 10 Nov 09 - 05:58 PM
open mike 10 Nov 09 - 09:28 PM
CET 10 Nov 09 - 10:29 PM
open mike 11 Nov 09 - 12:02 PM
Mrrzy 12 Nov 09 - 10:07 AM
GUEST,Azoic 31 Oct 12 - 05:24 AM
GUEST,mg 31 Oct 12 - 01:13 PM
GUEST,Azoic 03 Nov 12 - 02:58 PM
GUEST,Lighter 03 Nov 12 - 03:18 PM
GUEST,MikeK 04 Nov 12 - 01:34 AM
GUEST,Azoic 05 Nov 12 - 02:37 PM
GUEST,Azoic 11 Nov 12 - 12:30 PM
Jim Dixon 04 Jun 13 - 08:49 PM
GUEST,Lavengro 06 Jun 13 - 05:13 AM
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Subject: Veteran's Day
From:
Date: 11 Nov 97 - 07:35 PM

Hey, today is Veteran's Day in the US. Does anyone have a song in celebration of the dogface, leatherneck, flyboy or (what were sailors called)?


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Gene
Date: 11 Nov 97 - 08:01 PM

How 'bout: Comin' in on a wing and a prayer/There's a White Cross tonight on Okinawa/When the Yanks rasied the Stars and Stripes on Iwo Jima Isle/Soldier's Last Letter/ Let's Go Marine!/The Ballad of Ira Hayes/RTE. 1 Box 144/ There'll be bluebirds over the white cliffs of Dover/ When the lights come on again all over the world/Rosie, The Riveter/Buy Bonds/eWe did it before and we can do it again/etc....


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Gene
Date: 11 Nov 97 - 10:46 PM

AND: There's a Star-Spangled Banner waving somewhere/Seaman's Blues/The Ballad of Rodger Young/Rainbow at Midnight/ Silver Dew on the BLuegrass tonight/Remember Pearl Harbor/ The sinking of the Reuben James/and of course the standard Anchors Aweigh/When the cassions go rolling along/ You're in the army now/Waves in Blue/Roll, Tanks, roll/ Stars and Stripes forever/The Marines Hymn/The U. S. AirForce Song/Just to name a few.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: dwditty
Date: 11 Nov 97 - 10:54 PM

Don't forget all the marching songs...

GI beans and GI gravy
Gee, I wish I joined the navy

Not to mention the uncountable verses about "Jody" taking care of your business back on the block.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: leprechaun
Date: 11 Nov 97 - 11:15 PM

Don't sit under the apple tree with anyone else but me/Over There!/Boogie Woogie Bugle Boy/ My dad used to sing one that went..."Oh she really really loved me till the All Clear came."


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Jon W.
Date: 12 Nov 97 - 10:38 AM

Most songs mentioned so far have been the commercial, well known and popular songs, usually from WWII (a very popular war, everyone got in on it). I'll bet there are plenty of songs made up by the troops in Vietnam which haven't seen the light of day - usually all we hear from that era are "The Ballad of the Green Berets" on the one hand and "The Fish Cheer" on the other. How about it, you Vietnam Vets? Can you give us something? And let's not forget Korea, too.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 12 Nov 97 - 10:44 AM

To pummel a point, you can find some songs from the Vietnam war by searching Digitrad for @Vietnam. Similarly for @Korea, @WWI and @WWII.

As I recall, it used to be Armistice day, so appropriate songs would probably be from WWI. Lest we forget.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Pauline Lerner
Date: 12 Nov 97 - 11:22 PM

An appropriate veteran's song from WWI is the one about William MacBride (I can't remember the title), and another is Christmas in the Trenches, which is more commonly associated with Christmas than with Veteran's Day.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: S.P. Buck Mulligan
Date: 13 Nov 97 - 12:08 PM

I wasn't going to post these, for reasons I haven't quite figured out, but since someone mentioned Willie McBride, the song is "No Man's Land" by Eric Bogle. That and his "And the Band Played (Waltzing Matilda)" are the best Veteran's songs in the English language, as far as I'm concerned.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From:
Date: 13 Nov 97 - 06:32 PM

Up here we call it Remembrance Day, although fewer and fewer seem to be remembering it because some of the shops are refusing to let the old vets sell their poppies on the premises. But, what is to be expected in a city where less than 40% show up to vote in municipal elections?

BTW, I don't know about the US, but sailors were generally called Tars.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Wolfgang Hell
Date: 14 Nov 97 - 05:16 AM

speaking about Bogle's beautiful and sad WWI songs, he wrote another less known song along the same lines: "For king and for country". It doesn't seem to be in the DT-database. I think I have the lyrics at home. If so, you'll see them here on Monday.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: S.P. Buck Mulligan
Date: 14 Nov 97 - 08:08 AM

Does anyone remember the song that played over the ending of "Breaker Morant" (one of the best movies ever made, I think) - it was a chipper marching tune of the Empire days, the refrain went "We're soldiers of the Queen..." The juxtaposition of that tune & sentiment over the aftermath of the execution was brilliant.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Klinenboop
Date: 14 Nov 97 - 08:29 AM

& from US Cavalry days: Regular army Oh & Fiddlers Green


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Bert
Date: 14 Nov 97 - 10:49 AM

We're soldiers of the Queen my lads
we've been, my lads and seen, mylads
We'll fight for Englands glory lads
and we'll proudly show you what it means
and when they say our war is won
and when they ask you how it's done
we'll proudly point to every one
of England's soldiers of the Queen.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: JMike
Date: 14 Nov 97 - 10:22 PM

Don't have the reference with me, but on the "Bestiary" CD of Flanders and Swann (see the Hippopotamus Song thread) there is a song called "The War of 14-18" which compares WWI to other wars before (and since), always to the detriment of the others. The song is listd as a translation of a French song which I have not heard. (Nor can I remember off hand the name of the composer.)


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: leprechaun
Date: 15 Nov 97 - 09:29 PM

Snoopy and the Red Baron?


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Barry
Date: 15 Nov 97 - 09:40 PM

In the DT see a shorter version of Will You Go To Flanders. Barry


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Subject: Lyr Add: FOR KING AND COUNTRY (Eric Bogle)
From: Wolfgang
Date: 17 Nov 97 - 10:22 AM

FOR KING AND COUNTRY
(E. Bogle)

1. For King and for Country
we fought and we died
in the first flush of dawn,
by the fields of the Somme.

2. First to die was our captain
he was shot through the lung:
he lay in the mud
and he choked in his blood.

3. And ten minutes later
on these green fields of France
the grass had turned red
and thousands were dead.

4. And all through that morning
the slaughter went on:
we screamed and we cried
and cursed God as we died.

5. And when it was over
and the killing was done:
A generation had gone,
a generation had gone.

from Eric Bogle's LP "Down under" (a German release). Here are his notes to this song:
"The first song I ever wrote upon the subject that fascinates me most, the first World War. A simple little tune with a simple little message.

Wolfgang


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Subject: Lyr Add: HELLO, CENTRAL! GIVE ME NO MAN'S LAND
From: Genie
Date: 20 Sep 01 - 07:01 AM

I found this in a 1997 thread where someone was seeking the original words to "Hello, Central," and I thought people looking for Veterans' Day songs might miss it there.

HELLO, CENTRAL! GIVE ME NO MAN'S LAND
Words, Sam M. Lewis & Joe Young; music, Jean Schwartz.
New York: Waterson, Berlin & Snyder Co., ©1918.

1. When the gray shadows creep,
And the world is asleep,
In the still of the night,
Baby climbs down a flight.
First she looks all around,
Without making a sound,
Then baby toddles up to the telephone,
And whispers in a baby tone:

CHORUS: "Hello, Central! Give me No Man's Land.
My daddy's there, my mamma told me.
She tiptoed off to bed
After my prayer's were said.
Don't ring when you get my number,
Or you'll disturb mamma's slumber.
I'm afraid to stand here at the phone,
'Cause I'm alone,
So won't you hurry? I want to know why mamma starts to weep
When I say, 'Now I lay me down to sleep.'
Hello, Central! Give me No Man's Land."

2. Through the curtains of night
Comes a beautiful light,
And the sunshine that beams
Finds a baby in dreams.
Mamma looks in to see
Where her darling can be.
She finds her baby still in her slumber deep,
A-whisp'ring while she's fast asleep: CHORUS


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Genie
Date: 08 Nov 02 - 11:26 AM

Well, this coming Monday is Veterans' Day/Remembrance Day, so here's a link to one of the most popular WWII songs,
I'll Be Seeing You , which was actually published about 10 years earlier but became a favorite in the early 1940s.

Genie


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Amos
Date: 08 Nov 02 - 11:30 AM

I am in favor of this holiday. When I think of all we owe to veterinarians it is clear that they deserve a special day in their honor. Just think where your horses dogs and cats, parrots and cockatiels, goldfish and black mollies would be without American veterinarians!!

A


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Troll
Date: 08 Nov 02 - 12:04 PM

Amos, that's NOT funny.

troll


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: mg
Date: 08 Nov 02 - 12:05 PM

not funny.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Francy
Date: 08 Nov 02 - 12:08 PM

Look up Tom Russell's "Veteran's Day".......Frank of Toledo


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Midchuck
Date: 08 Nov 02 - 12:18 PM

What Troll said.

What mary garvey said.

Waht Francy said.

Peter.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Hrothgar
Date: 08 Nov 02 - 10:16 PM

Not sure whether it's funny or not, Amos, but it's certainly in the wrong place.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: bbc
Date: 09 Nov 02 - 08:28 AM

Love & respect to our veterans. Thank you for serving our country!

bbc


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: artbrooks
Date: 09 Nov 02 - 09:45 AM

My grandfather, my father, my daughter and I all thank you.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: chip a
Date: 09 Nov 02 - 12:09 PM

Thanks dad.

No thanks Amos.

Chip


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: mg
Date: 09 Nov 02 - 08:59 PM

I will say that it was not intended to be hurtful so that is good.

mg


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Banjer
Date: 09 Nov 02 - 11:01 PM

I think Amos made a powerful point in spite of hiumself. I don't know if his meaning was tongue-in-cheek or not, but there are way too many folks that do not take our national days of remebrance and thanks seriously. Monday morning will again find me on the grounds of our local veterans hospital, Bay Pines, with elements of the Junior ROTC Honor Guard firing a cannon salute at the opening of the annual Veteran's Day ceremonies. I will follow that with a visit to the other side of the hospital where the cemetery is and visit with some familiar names. God Bless our freedoms and those who fight to maintain them!


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Big Mick
Date: 09 Nov 02 - 11:24 PM

I don't believe that Amos had any intention whatever of insulting veterans. Whether his tongue in cheek comment was appropriate I will leave to the judgement of others.

What I would like to comment on, however, is the bad habit that folks have of confusing this day with Memorial Day. This is not the day to honor our war dead, except as the fact that they are Veterans. This is the day to walk up to a veteran and shake his/her hand and thank them for doing the worst job that humans are called on to do. Anyone who has gone to serve, especially during a time of armed conflict, and most especially in combat, has been profoundly affected. Only the odd ones find it exhilarating. The rest find that their lives will never be the same. They will never again see a sunrise, or tingle at the meeting of someone attractive, or smell the food in Mom's kitchen, or stare with wonder at the constellations on a clear winter night, ..............they will never do these things again through the naive, and optimistic eyes of youth, ever again.

I think of the nurses that had to assume the role of Mother, Lover, Wife for the dying in the field hospitals. These women had to hold crying boys afraid to die, and "help them on their way". Jed Marum wrote of one of these amazing women in his song "Banks of the Mobile" on his new CD. When I heard it, I thought of these women during my war, and the tears just flowed down my face. These veterans are heroes of the first order. Find one on Monday and give them all the thanks you can. They did the most difficult job one can imagine and under the worst conditions, some paid with their lives.

On this day I think of a young man, who only months before, had been playing in the big game, nervously rehearsing the words he would invite his girl to the prom with, watching corny sit coms or Laugh In on TV, and hearing his father talk about "the big war" and questioning what these sissy, long hairs were complaining about. After all, Vietnam wasn't like Europe. Next thing the young man knows is that boot camp seems like a dream and he is in country fighting for his life and not even sure what he is fighting for. 364 days later, if he is "lucky", he is standing on the tarmac waiting for a flight back to the world and a few days after that back on the front porch wondering what the hell that was all about. But he knows that he is different. The brightness is gone out of his eyes, and he know longer wonders what war would be like and whether he would be brave. He know longer wonders what it is like to kill, or what death looks and smells like. Or what it does to the people that live in the war zone. And worst of all................s/he dreams. Of lost dreams, and friends. S/he not only buried the bodies, but youth. Some deal with it differently, some are made of the stuff that allows them to put it behind them, some not. But all are affected mightily whether they admit it or not.

The price they paid was huge, the debt owed to them is profound.........and often unpaid.

Please.............find a vet.........walk up and at least shake their hand, and if they are willing, give them a hug. You owe them more than you will ever realize. And think about that.............Please.

Mick


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 09 Nov 02 - 11:45 PM

Mick-That's one of the best posts that I have ever read on Mudcat.john


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: mg
Date: 09 Nov 02 - 11:58 PM

good comments. If anyone wants to write anything to some nurses and other women who served, I run a list called Sanctuary and they would love to hear stuff. If anyone posts stuff I will assume it is OK to put elsewhere or you can email me at mgarvey@pacifier.edu.

Mick, I disagree with one thing and that is Veterans' Day is a day to honor the veterans and Memorial Day for the dead. That is true that that is the official designation..but on the blackest day of the year, on the day that one war thankfully ended, we remember the dead. I would rather switch them and remember the honor the living on Memorial day..when the sun is more likely to be shining and it is not cold and raining and more than anything else dark...I remember the first time I let myself cry after Vietnam..it was in Newfoundland and a freezing cold rain overlooking the harbor..and they sang Flanders Fields....it was so cold my tears froze to my face....

Your friends, my friends, are going to D.C. in great numbers this year. I wish I was with them....they will remember the dead don't you know. The dead, the living..it all sort of runs together. I think we are in the middle somewhere...

I think I'll put my words here for Never Enough..

Chorus:

Never enough, never enough
The times I would fake it the times I would bluff
I wasn't that brave and I wasn't that tough
Oh God it was never enough

I went there to sing and I must have sung some
But I drank to forget and I drank to stay numb
A drunken old woman is what I've become
Oh God it was never enough

The radio crackled by night and by day
I tried to make out all the words they did say
But some men got captured and some got away
Oh God it was never enough

Some went to fight and some went to heal
What was stolen from me was not their's to steal
Now anger and rage are all that I feel
Oh God it was never enough

???
So many wounded and so many dead
???
Oh God it was never enough


I worked on the airbase   and met all the planes
I'd stand and salute in the fog and the rains
What used to be men are now called remains
Oh God it was never enough


---

looks like I forgot some. That is the verse about me. Probably repressed it. Oh well, maybe I will remember it later.

mg


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: mg
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 12:16 AM

out of all that I sent why can't I go instead
with so many wounded and so many dead
they'll come back to haunt me and that's what I dread
Oh God it was never enough

and if I knew what was good for me I probably should unplug my computer for a couple of days. mg


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: mg
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 12:25 AM

I don't care if people love us, hate us, honor us etc...but I wish there were a couple of days per year and one is coming up that they would lay the f*** off.


mg


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Big Mick
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 12:35 AM

Mary.............thanks. Rest easy, my Sister. And never forget them. It is up to us to give them immortality. If we don't, who will?

Mick


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Tinker
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 01:54 AM

Sailing on Men River, I heard
A call; how deep how ordinary,
Seeking what I'd lost,
I found a host of saints.

--Soan ( trans Lucien Stryk)
Zen Poet


Blessings All

Kathy


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: The Pooka
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 10:06 AM

I'm certain that Amos was just being innocently punny & anarchic. He meant, and did, no harm.



Right on, Mick & everybody. Recently I had a chance meeting with a wounded Korea veteran, laboriously riding his bike (!) to & from the convenience store. He told me of his health troubles, and his (shoddy, it sounded like to me) treatments at the local Veterans' Hospital. Also of stacking US Marine corpses like cordwood upon the frozen ground near the Chinese border half-a-century ago.

The "forgotten war". When he was very young, this old man fought for freedom and his country, against 'the *other* poor sons-of-bitches' (see, "Patton") conscripted by arguably the most egregious regime of tyrants & mass murderers in the history of the human race thus far -- a hotly-contested title, to be sure. "Let a Hundred Flowers Bloom", indeed. / And, for what? So that we can now ask Beijing to ask Pyongyang to Please give up the Nukes?? Tears came to my eyes & I shook his hand and thanked him. Then he pedaled off into the night, with his groceries in a plastic bag in the bicycle basket. / May God bless all the veterans. "And for each and every underdog soldier in the night, we gazed upon the chimes of freedom flashing." - Dylan


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Banjer
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 10:33 AM

I found this on one of the newsgroups that I read occasionaly. It pretty much echos what Big Mick said in his post. Worth the read.


Veteran's Day Salute


He is the cop on the beat who spent six months in Saudi Arabia
sweating two gallons a day making sure the armored personnel
carriers didn't run out of fuel.

He is the barroom loudmouth, dumber than five wooden planks, whose
overgrown frat-boy behavior is outweighed a hundred times in the
cosmic scales by four hours of exquisite bravery near the 38th
parallel.

She (or he) is the nurse who fought against futility and went to
sleep sobbing every night for two solid years in Da Nang.

He is the POW who went away one person and came back another -- or
didn't come back AT ALL.

He is the Parris Island drill instructor who has never seen combat --
but has saved countless lives by turning slouchy, no-account rednecks
and gang members into Marines, and teaching them to watch each
other's backs.

He is the parade-riding Legionnaire who pins on his ribbons and
medals with a prosthetic hand.

He is the career quartermaster who watches the ribbons and medals
pass him by.

He is the three anonymous heroes in The Tomb Of The Unknowns, whose
presence at the Arlington National Cemetery must forever preserve the
memory of all anonymous heroes whose valor dies unrecognized with
them on the battlefield or in the ocean's sunless deep.

He is the old guy bagging groceries at the supermarket -- palsied now
and aggravatingly slow -- who helped liberate a Nazi death camp and
who wishes all day long that his wife were still alive to hold him
when the nightmares come.

He is an ordinary and yet an extraordinary human being -- a person
who offered some of his life's most vital years in the service of his
country, and who sacrificed his ambitions so others would not have
to sacrifice theirs.

He is a soldier and a savior and a sword against the darkness, and he
is nothing more than the finest, greatest testimony on behalf of the
finest, greatest nation ever known.

So remember, each time you see someone who has served our country,
just lean over and say Thank You. That's all most people need, and in
most cases it will mean more than any medals they could have been
awarded or were awarded.

Two little words that mean a lot, "THANK YOU."

It's the soldier, not the reporter, Who gave us our freedom of the
press.

It's the soldier, not the poet, Who gave us our freedom of speech.

It's the soldier, not the campus organizer, Who gave us our freedom
to demonstrate.

It's the soldier, Who salutes the flag, Who serves others with
respect for the flag, And whose coffin is draped by the flag, Who
allows the protester to burn the flag.


Of all the gifts you could give a U. S. serviceman, prayer is the
very best one.


Prayer for our Servicemen:
Lord, hold our troops in Your loving hands. Protect them as they
protect us. Bless them and their families for the selfless acts they
perform for us in our time of need. Amen




                                                                  Author Unknown


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Greg F.
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 10:40 AM

How about "Feel Like I'm Fixin'To Die Rag" by Country Joe & the Fish?

Best, Greg


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Schantieman
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 10:43 AM

I've just got in from a Remembrance Day parade and read this thread. The piece above is very moving. Thanks, Banjer.

Steve


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 10:55 AM

I disagree with your interpretation of what Veteran's Day means Mary. Here is an excerpt of a Veteran's Day essay/letter I had forwarded to me years ago by my Korean War Vet brother-in-law. It was titled "A Day to Begin Taking Back America's Future". I don't know if it can still be found online or not.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Veteran's Day should be a day for Vets to sound off to those who know the lingo and the lies. Vets understand each other. They've a special shared danger-bonding that helps many in the healing which never in one lifetime is 100 percent. Their warrior talk blows away the loneliness which comes from not being able to explain what happened to them to those who didn't make the journey.

This day should be one of serious reflection, to every American, not just about putting up our feet or talking about when we were young and brave. We need to think about the wars that were just -- WW1, WW11 and Korea -- and the bad ones, the futile swamps -- the Vietnams, the Lebanans, the Panamas and the Somalias -- where our cause was unjust or uncertain and where Americans died in vain. We should find out who was responsible for the miscalculations and look deeply into how we can prevent more of our youth from being so savagely wasted.

Many Vets today are asking : just what the hell they fought for? They say the "great sucking sound" is the values and ideals that made the USA the land of opportunity flushing down the toilet. They say: try walking down a dark street in most towns in America without feeling you're on patrol deep behind enemy lines; take a look at our rivers, our forests, our eco system and pretend your're not wandering through Death Valley; look at our youth who have little future beyond serving burgers and no hope to ever make it as their grandparents did; examine our sidewalks littered with needles from drugs that threaten our young from within more than any enemy from without; see our pork-driven, self-serving politicians buy still more wonder weapons to fight an enemy that's not there while feathering their nests with retirement programs fit for kings; listen to the political campaigns so gutter-disgusting they make mud wrestling look like an intellectual sport and Joe McCarthy look like a choir boy.


Did we fight and work so hard to watch our land and people become wasted and ruined? Bill Clinton said at Normandy last June "... America is the way it is today because of what people gave up 50 years ago." He got it wrong. America is the way it is today because too many of those of us who served switched off after we took off our uniforms, expecting the politicians to take over the watch and protect what we fought for.

So, have a good Veteran's Day -- but then after the celebration, take charge of our country again. There's 27 million of you out there, not to mention a few hundred million non-veterans -- you're the makings of some Revolutionary Army. Which if you think about it is what started America the Beautiful in the first place!


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 11:04 AM

I apologize--I missed the last two paragraphs of the essay in my cut and paste. Here they are:

* * * * * * * * * * * * *

Did we fight and work so hard to watch our land and people become wasted and ruined? Bill Clinton said at Normandy last June "... America is the way it is today because of what people gave up 50 years ago." He got it wrong. America is the way it is today because too many of those of us who served switched off after we took off our uniforms, expecting the politicians to take over the watch and protect what we fought for.

So, have a good Veteran's Day -- but then after the celebration, take charge of our country again. There's 27 million of you out there, not to mention a few hundred million non-veterans -- you're the makings of some Revolutionary Army. Which if you think about it is what started America the Beautiful in the first place!


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: CET
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 12:29 PM

Tomorrow morning I will put on my uniform and pin on the medals a grateful nation has given me for doing nothing that was even remotely brave or difficult. Then I will walk to the Cenotaph in downtown Ottawa and attend the Remembrance Day ceremony.

I do this every year because I consider it a sacred duty. I am almost embarassed to wear my medals I received for serving in Germany, Bosnia and Haiti when I compare them to the medals that other men earned at Vimy Ridge or Ortona or Juno Beach or during the liberation of Holland. However, I wear my medals anyway to show respect.

It is because remembrance is a sacred duty that I have real misgivings about mixing it with patriotism. Essays like the one quoted above contain a lot of truth, but they also leave an unpleasant taste in my mouth when the author wraps himself in the flag:

"He is a soldier and a savior and a sword against the darkness, and he is nothing more than the finest, greatest testimony on behalf of the finest, greatest nation ever known."

This kind of bombastic patriotism bothers me a great deal. It seems cheap and tacky when applied to the duty of honouring those who have served in war. It is also insulting to soldiers who suffered as much and worked as hard and died in the service of other countries. Did they give up their youth or their health or their lives on behalf of countries that were only reasonably great, the also rans of history?

To my mind, the example set by those who have fought for their country demands humility, the kind that Abraham Lincoln showed at Gettysburg, or that Laurence Binyon exemplified in the lines that are read at every Remembrance Day service in Canada:

"They shall grow not old as we that are left grow old
Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning,
We will remember them."

Edmund

(P.S. As a matter of interest, is there anybody else on Mudcat who is still serving?)


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: artbrooks
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 12:37 PM

I really don't know why ANON.GUEST thinks his/her.its contribution is at all different from friend Mary's. They both are examples of the right a person has to express a personal opinion, even anonymously, which is one of the rights veterans have fought to protect.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: mg
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 12:54 PM

I think a post that is disrepectful to veterans on veterans day of all days is deliberately provocative and abusive. They have the rest of the year to make their point. And I will tell you this...an angel, and I believe it was St. Michael the Archangel, told me that no one has ever died in vain. So that is what I believe. mg


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 01:00 PM

Probably true, artbrooks. But I have asked Mary here and in another thread, what group of people she feels should shut up and be silent on Veteran's Day. Seems odd to me.

As to the remark by Amos, the only thing I find inappropriate are the overwrought, reactionary responses by Mary, Midchuck, Chip, Troll, francy, et al. I found Amos' remark to be good natured punning, and a gentle attempt to break the tension being created by those who are trying to define Veteran's Day on their own narrow, personal, "patriotic" terms. The day is not just for them.

I'm certainly with Edmund. Only I'm not just bothered by such bombastic patriotic sentiments, I'm deeply offended by them.

Paul Wellstone was a patriot and a warrior who died for his country too, and he never served in the military. The fact that he did not serve in the military had nothing to do with bravery, cowardice, or patriotism.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 01:19 PM

Mary, I ask you again, respectfully and politely, to define what you consider to be disprespectful to veterans. You just posted again, saying: "I think a post that is disrepectful to veterans on veterans day of all days is deliberately provocative and abusive."

None of us knows how to keep from offending you, if you don't tell us what it is you consider to be disrespectful. I see no one here in Mudcat, in any way, showing disrespect for veterans. So it really would be helpful if you would tell us how you think some of us are being disrespectful, rather than making indirect accusations about disrectfulness.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 01:48 PM

artbrooks, veterans are not the only US citizens who have fought to protect our constitution, and our Bill of Rights. Many citizen activists have fought for them, but in non-violent, non-militarist ways.

The price for retaining our democratic freedoms enshrined in our constitution and Bill of Rights, artbrooks, is a constant, diligent watch over our political and miliatry leaders, and that requires daily citizenship. Not military service.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: mg
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 01:53 PM

Guest, I consider you to be abusive so there is no way in hell I would respond to you. You, if you are the same guest, and I must assume you are, are neither respectful nor polite. mg


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: artbrooks
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 01:57 PM

mg, I'd suggest we simply consider him/her/it a troll, and ignore his/her/its posts as they deserve.

Art


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 02:12 PM

OK mary and artbrooks, you can ignore me if you'd like. But I know I'm not being disrespectful, I'm not being impolite, nor am I trolling.

Mary, you can continue to refuse to define what you believe is disrespectful of veterans, of course. But if you do, I think some people will do what I'm leaning towards doing in regards to your accusations--ignore them as empty rhetoric.

Complaining that some posters in Mudcat are being disrespectful on any issue, without articulating who is doing it, and how, is a bit like crying wolf. Just an attention getting tactic, with no substance.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Big Mick
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 02:34 PM

GUEST, I know you by your postings. You hate war, which I have no problem with. But you also hate the warriors. You cover your contempt, but just barely, by trying to put up an intellectual front. No matter whether it is Ladies Against War, Peace Matriot, or the other multi gender personalities you assume, your writings betray you every time. You are obnoxious, and disgusting. You use the word "we" as if you have supporters and the facts are that you have none. You are a frustrated peace activist wannabe that takes every chance you can to trot out how your family has paid the price and then spout your useless rhetoric. I have told you before and I will tell you again. Why don't you take your crap out and do some real good in the streets. Instead of coming here and pretending to be fighting for peace, try taking it out of your academic setting and fight in the streets and precincts. There is no need to disrespect those that served and try to lump them all in one pile. (For those that don't know this person, you would have to read other posts to understand this)

Now will you please just go off and start a thread somewhere else and let those of us who need to simply say thank you do so.

And to the rest, please forgive me for that response. I cannot let this cyber bully get away with this. Would you please not engage in this debate, which Guest has as a goal to keep those of us who simply want to honor our vets? She seeks to destroy the conversation by side tracking it. I am a Peace Activist, who is also a vet and I resent this.

Mick


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Dave Swan
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 03:31 PM

Allow me to express my thanks to the folks who served, wherever they served, whatever the job.

I held a high lottery number near the end of the Viet Nam war and never had to test my imaginary reactions to a draft notice. Others did, and that's part of the reason I didn't have to. Thanks for that.

I'm in a line of work now which some folks consider dangerous and which people sometimes describe as heroic. To take nothing away from my brothers and sisters who have been broken and killed in fires, we are paid better for what we do than people of equal or better rank in armed service and...here's the point...we can choose to go home. Certainly there will be far reaching consequences, but we can turn our backs on the job and just drive home. Not a choice for folks under arms.

So, thanks to those, career, volunteer, or draftee, who went and did the job. Whatever the circumstances, or their intention, they did it, and paid for it one way or another.

Every veteran I know will understand that this is just thanks, not a debate.

Dave


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Jeri
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 05:07 PM

Beyond the faceless multitudes, beyond countries and armies, beyond the causes and slogans and flags, there are human beings. Mary, Mick and all the other folks who read this and have been through nightmares most of us can't imagine, thank you.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST,L
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 06:06 PM

Acting as cheerleaders for the next war by wrapping oneself in Veteran's Day sentiments, and evoking the dead doesn't honor vets. Quite the opposite, in fact.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Big Mick
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 06:17 PM

Now see, you seem to think that by changing screen names we can't figure you out. But that comment is exactly the same sentiment you expressed last time we tangled. You are so transparent that it is ridiculously easy to spot you, regardless of the name you use.

I will ask this plainly and sincerely. Will you please allow those of us who choose to thank those who have served, to simply have this thread to do so without you turning it into a fight? Just ignore it or start one of your own and have at it. To US, this is not a statement on Iraq, or war in general. It is simply saying thanks to those that served. Do you have enough decency to let us have that? I say again, I am simply asking you to leave us be with this.

Mick


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST,L
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 07:10 PM

No one is stopping anyone from saying thanks, or anything else.

Here is how this thread was anonymously launched back in 1997:

"Hey, today is Veteran's Day in the US. Does anyone have a song in celebration of the dogface, leatherneck, flyboy or (what were sailors called)?"

Here is how it was refreshed this year by Genie:

"Well, this coming Monday is Veterans' Day/Remembrance Day, so here's a link to one of the most popular WWII songs,
I'll Be Seeing You , which was actually published about 10 years earlier but became a favorite in the early 1940s."

Hardly the stuff of veteran worship, it started out about songs, Mick. NOT about sayting thanks to or honoring YOU personally.

When Amos innocently responded to Genie's post with a playful word pun, the grim militarist zealots came down on him like a load of bricks.

Get over yourselves.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: ballpienhammer
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 08:35 PM

When Johnny Comes Marching Home
Two Brothers
Yankee Doodle


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: ballpienhammer
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 08:48 PM

Dixie
Yellow Rose of Texas
Tramp Tramp Tramp
Navy Hymn


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Subject: Lyr Add: FUCK 'EM ALL
From: GUEST,L
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 09:06 PM

Dunno if this bawdy soldier song is in DT or not. WW2 British, it morphed across the water into a GI song. Later it was bowdlerized & popularized as "Bless Em All". Apologies to those of you with senstivities to this sort of thing, but it's historic and on topic.

FUCK EM ALL

Oh they say there's a troopship just leaving Bombay
Bound for old Blighty's shore,
Heavily laden with time-expired men
Bound for the land they adore;
There's many a twat just finishing his time,
There's many a cunt signing on;
You'll get no promotion this side of the ocean,
So cheer up my lads, fuck 'em all!
Chorus: Fuck 'em all!
Fuck 'em all!

The long and the short and the tall;
Fuck all the Sergeants and W.O.l.'s,
Fuck all the corporals and their bastard sons;
For we're saying goodbye to them all,
As up the C.O.'s arse they crawl;
You'll get no promotion this side of the ocean,
So cheer up my lads, fuck 'em all!

The Fleet Air Arm of the British Royal Navy had its own version, as did the U.S. Army Air Force both in World War 2 and in the Korean War. Numerous adaptations circulated in the Pacific theatre, including the following.

They called for the army to come to Tulagi,
But Douglas MacArthur said no;
They said there's a reason,
It isn't the season,
Besides there's no USO.
Chorus: Fuck 'em all! Fuck 'em all!

The long, the short, the tall;
Fuck all the Pelicans and Dogfaces too,
Fuck all the generals and above all fuck you!
So we're saying goodbye to them all,
As back to our foxholes we crawl;
There'll be no promotion on MacArthur's blue ocean,
So cheer up Gyrenes, fuck 'em all.

Two additional verses circulating in the Marine Corps were:

They sent for the Navy to come to Tulagi,
The gallant Navy agreed;
With one thousand sections
In different directions,
My God! What a fucked-up stampede!
Chorus: Fuck 'em all, etc.

They sent for the nurses to come overseas,
The reason was perfectly clear,
To make a good marriage and push a carriage
While fucking all hands, my dear!

Chorus: Fuck 'em all, etc.

Finally a version collected from a G.I. returning from Germany.

Just think of the boys at the front,
No beer, no whisky, no cunt;
They sit in their trenches
And think of their wenches,
So cheer up, my boys, fuck 'em all! etc.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST,L
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 09:08 PM

Sorry, meant to give the source I'm quoting this from, a great article titled "Soldiers' Songs: Folklore of the Powerless".

You can read it online here:

http://faculty.buffalostate.edu/fishlm/folksongs/les01.htm


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST,L
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 09:31 PM

Here is a great website with WW1 songs from the trenches (warning: also non-bowdlerised):

http://info.ox.ac.uk/jtap/tutorials/intro/trench/songs.html

The source for most of these songs is given as 'What a lovely war!': British Soldiers' Songs.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST,L
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 09:35 PM

ballpienhammer, do all the songs you list above predate Armistice Day?


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Mr Happy
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 09:44 PM

'poor murdered men never laid down their lives,they were sent to be killed in the war' jon heslop


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Amos
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 09:56 PM

In case anyone wonders what I had in mind, I meant no offense, but I do regret I was not being sufficiently sensitive to the feelings of those who have been where I have not been, and faced forces that for all my adventures I could not begin to know. I believe they deserve complete respect and recognition for what they've beent hrough, done and survived. "S all I got to say on the matter.

A


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: mg
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 10:03 PM

Folks, this is it in a nutshell. Why so many veterans, especially of the Vietnam war, have committed suicide. They were goaded to death. Younger people, perhaps if you haven't seen this in person, you don't know. Print this thread out and keep it. This type of stuff happened constantly and has only in the last few years died down. This is what we went through after the war when we should have been healing. I guess we will go through it until we die one way or the other. It is not someone just being insensitive, as others have been, but I can tell the difference and write it off usually. This is someone who knows what buttons to push and will do it regardless of the consequences. This country will get what it as a whole deserves sooner or later, which is a terrible threat and not the human resources to defend against it. Don't bother asking yourselves why.

mg


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Tinker
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 10:06 PM

Mary, I sat and cried last night through your post. And smiled this morning when you hit our hormonal guest with angels. Through the night and the morning this arose... it's rough and I will not battle with idiots for the thread. But it arose from you... it may recycle and be born again at some other date, as do all the things that force us beyond ourselves. But for now...

When there is no choice but to give
Until humanity has been stripped
And the soul stands on the void
Echoing in the winds of the demonic and the devine

And again need calls and the winds blow
An again I answer the unknown
Pelting the rain, echoing pain
The still of the night may recall the devine
Or the winds only echo the void

Blessings on those who rode the wings
Blessings on those who fell
Blessings on all who stand the edge
Blessings ride the winds whisper,hear,tell


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST,L
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 10:45 PM

You know folks, if you don't want to discuss these songs, and want to have a thread for the purpose of thanking veterans, why don't you just start one? This thread was started, and has been about songs dating back to Armistice Day, from it's inception. For the record people, the history of Armistice Day:

November 11 1919: President Wilson proclaims the first Armistice Day with the following words: "To us in America, the reflections of armistice Day will be filled with solemn pride in the heroism of those who died in the country's service and with gratitude for the victory, both because of the thing from which it has freed us and because of the opportunity it has given America to show her sympathy with peace and justice in the councils of the nations…" The original concept for the celebration was for the suspension of business for a two minute period beginning at 11 A.M., with the day also marked by parades and public mettings.

On the second anniversary of the armistice, France and the United Kingdom hold ceremonies honoring their unknown dead from the war. In America, at the suggestion of church groups, President Wilson names the Sunday nearest Armistice Day Sunday, on which should be held services in the interest of international peace.

Get it people? The history of this holiday has been linked just as much to anti-war efforts as it has to honoring veterans from the gitgo. Whether it is called Peace Sunday, Discernment Sunday, or Armistice Day Sunday, ever since the first anniversary of Armistice Day, the two have gone hand in hand.

One has to wonder what exactly the agenda is of people accusing other posters in music threads of goading Vietnam Vets into committing suicide? Do we really need to go there?


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: mg
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 10:52 PM

I think we should go back to calling it Armistice day. mg


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Subject: Lyr Add: DON'T TAKE MY DARLING BOY AWAY
From: GUEST,L
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 11:30 PM

An early anti-war song, from 1916:

DON'T TAKE MY DARLING BOY AWAY

A mother was kneeling to pray
For loved ones at war far away
And there by her side, her one joy and pride,
knelt down with her that day

Then came a knock on the door
Your boy is commanded to war
"No Captain please, here on my knees,
I plead for one I adore"

Don't take my darling boy away from me,
Don't send him off to war
You took his father and brothers three,
Now you've come back for more

Who are the heroes that fight your war
Mothers who have no say
But my duty's done so for god's sake leave one!
And don't take my darling boy away.

Tenting tonight, Tenting tonight
Tenting on the old campground

You took his father and brothers three,
Now you've come back for more

Tenting tonight, Tenting tonight
Tenting on the old campground

But my duty's done so for god's sake leave one!
And don't take my darling boy away.

A hero is now laid to rest, A hero and one of the best
He fought with each son, The battles he'd won,
And the battles that proved a test

Though she never went to the war,
She was a hero by far, they gave a gun
But who gave a son,
M. O. T. H. E. R.

Don't take my darling boy away from me,
Don't send him off to war
You took his father and brothers three,
Now you've come back for more

Who are the heroes that fight your war
Mothers who have no say
But my duty's done so for god's sake leave one!
And don't take my darling boy away.

Tenting tonight, Tenting tonight
Tenting on the old campground

You took his father and brothers three,
Now you've come back for more

Tenting tonight, Tenting tonight
Tenting on the old campground

But my duty's done so for god's sake leave one!
And don't take my darling boy away.


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Subject: Lyr Add: LLOYD GEORGE'S BEER (Weston & Lee)
From: GUEST,L
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 11:37 PM

A humorous WW1 song from Britain, called "Lloyd George's Beer" by R P Weston and Bert Lee, 1915. In response to government attempts to limit alcohol consumption during the war.

LLOYD GEORGE'S BEER

We shall win the war, we shall win the war,
As I said before, we shall win the war.
The Kaiser's in a dreadful fury,
Now he knows we're making it at every brewery.
Have you read of it, seen what's said of it,
In the Mirror and the Mail.
It's a substitute, and a pubstitute,
And it's known as Government Ale (or otherwise).

Lloyd George's Beer, Lloyd George's Beer.
At the brewery, there's nothing doing,
All the water works are brewing,
Lloyd George's Beer, it isn't dear.
Oh they say it's a terrible war, oh law,
And there never was a war like this before,
But the worst thing that ever happened in this war
Is Lloyd George's Beer.

Buy a lot of it, all they've got of it.
Dip your bread in it, Shove your head in it
From January to October,
And I'll bet a penny that you"ll still be sober.
Get your cloth in it, make some broth in it,
With a pair of mutton chops.
Drown your dogs in it, pop your clogs in it,
And you'll see some wonderful sights (in that lovely stufo).

Lloyd George's Beer, Lloyd George's Beer.
At the brewery, there's nothing doing,
All the water works are brewing,
Lloyd George's Beer, it isn't dear.
With Haig and Joffre when affairs look black,
And you can't get at Jerry with his gas attack.
Just get your squirters out and we'll squirt the buggers back,
With Lloyd George's Beer.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST,L
Date: 10 Nov 02 - 11:57 PM

Many great WW1 songs (including the two I give lyrics to above) can be found at my favorite WW1 website, FirstWorldWar.com. Their list includes song MP3s of the actual vintage recordings of these and many other songs, speeches, etc. and was just updated.

John McCormack was one of the most famous singers of this era, and recorded many of the popular songs of the era, and there are many sources of information, recordings, etc about him online.

Also, there are WAV files at Trenches on the Web here:

http://www.worldwar1.com/media.htm#clips

You can also hear samples of WW1 songs recorded from original hand cranked Victrolas can be heard here, and the tapes & sheet music ordered too!

http://www.besmark.com/ww1b.html


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST,L
Date: 11 Nov 02 - 12:30 AM

One final thing, as I finish perusing my bookmarks on war and anti-war music of the 20th century. Anyone with a serious interest in the real thing--the folk music and folklore of American involvement in the Vietnam war, should not be without this exhaustive site of Dr. Lydia Fish:

http://www.vwip.org/articles/f/FishLydia_FolkloreBibliography.htm


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST,L
Date: 11 Nov 02 - 12:45 AM

Actually, considering the fact that Vietnam has such a well documented wealth of folk songs sung by enlisted folk, how about those of you who served and are posting to this thread, share the songs *you* sang while in Vietnam?


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: mg
Date: 11 Nov 02 - 12:52 AM

Sorry I was an officer and was stateside. And a lot of those songs Dr. Fish collected were by officers. Pilots in particular. And since I don't know if you are abusive guest or non-abusive guest I will pass on sharing anything at this particular moment. We sang things like Blowing in the Wind. mg


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST,L
Date: 11 Nov 02 - 02:05 AM

Mary, I don't who you are from adam, or pretend to know what this debate is over abusive/non-abusive guests, but I've got to say, in this thread you are coming off like a poster child for victimhood.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST,L
Date: 11 Nov 02 - 02:10 AM

And BTW Mary, I'm Guest L to distinguish myself from Guest Q, who also is posting information on WW1 right now in another thread. We aren't the same people. If that is what you are referring to with this whole abusive/non-abusive guest thing.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Troll
Date: 11 Nov 02 - 06:08 AM

GUEST,L with all the explainations, you STILL don't have a clue do you? You don't know what we're about and you never will know, because you're too damn busy presenting your rebutals to what you think we said.
Why not listen and try to understand for a change.

troll


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Big Mick
Date: 11 Nov 02 - 02:07 PM

Nope, Troll, nor will she ever. The posts by this person using a multitude of personalities demonstrate the real agenda. They also demonstrate an inability to see anyone's point of view than her own. There is an agenda at work here to demonstrate superiority (but only in Guest L, Peace Matriot, Ladies against War, and on and on own mind) by hijacking this and getting folks not to discuss the need to thank Vets regardless of one's belief about war. She has suggested that I am attacking her for personal reasons, once more ducking that I have her figured out. Well, I am. I am happy to discuss the music of Vets, and the politics of war. Dropping a line in a thread entitled "Veterans Day" just to remind folks about the price paid by those still living is entirely appropriate. This person's reaction and suggestions demonstrate, if read carefully, exactly what her agenda is.

Now, ....... please don't feed this poster anymore.

For some reason, Norman Greenbaum's "Spirit in the Sky" always comes to mind.

Mick


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: mg
Date: 11 Nov 02 - 02:35 PM

thank you everyone who expressed positive or neutral sentiments or sat this one out.    And to those who just went shopping...that is perfectly fine too. But I think one, and I am willing to drop it to one, this one, day a year to at least not abuse veterans is a very good idea. Drive on. If you want a good song, find the one Kipling wrote about when you go to London town grieving, grieving, take your flowers and lay them down at the wall of grieving. (not celebrating by the way)....you can sing this to one of the Banorie tunes..mg


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 11 Nov 02 - 03:32 PM

No one seems to have quoted the John McCutcheon rewrite of "Christmas in the Trenches." Just parts of the first and last verses:

My name is Francis Tolliver, I come from Liverpool.
Two years ago the war was waiting for me after school.
To Belgium and to Flanders, to Germany to here
I fought for king and country I love dear.

My name is Francis Tolliver, in Liverpool I dwell.
Each Christmas come since World War I, I've learned its lessons well.
That the ones that call the shots won't be among the dead and lame,
And on each end of the rifle we're the same.

Francis Tolliver
(mentioned by Susanne in another thread)


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 11 Nov 02 - 03:38 PM

The same website has "An Internet History of the Great War." Find it directly at World War 1
Worth reading on this day.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: Pinetop Slim
Date: 11 Nov 02 - 03:47 PM

Vets Day puts me in mind of this verse from Ralph McTell's "Streets of London."

Have you seen the old man outside the seaman's mission

Memory fading like the ribbons that he wears

In our winter city, the rain cries a little pity

For one more forgotten hero in a world that doesn't care


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day
From: GUEST,Lily Gardner
Date: 12 Aug 07 - 11:26 PM

This is why I love WWI songs so much better than WWII. Ernie Mayne made a whole career out of songs like Lloyd George's Beer, My Meatless Day, Sugar...there were songs about war profiteering, conscientious objectors, and wartime lust. Some of the songs about the enemy were playful, like "Old Iron Cross" or the one suggesting that the way to trap the "Huns" was to entice them with sauerkraut and pinochle. Compared to the relentless team spirit of the whole Andrews Sisters/Johnny Mercer brigade, it is really refreshing to hear songs that honestly address the way people felt about the effect of the war on the soldiers and those at home.

Of course, now we don't sing about them at all...


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Subject: Lyr Add: NOTHING BUT A PLAIN OLD SOLDIER (Foster)
From: GUEST,Mike B.
Date: 09 Nov 09 - 10:23 AM

Predates Veterans Day by a lot of years, yet still seems fitting.

NOTHING BUT A PLAIN OLD SOLDIER (Stephen Foster)

I'm nothing but a plain old soldier,
An old revolutionary soldier,
But I've handled a gun where noble deeds were done,
For the name of my commander was George Washington.
My home and my country to me were dear,
And I fought for both when the foe came near,
But now I will meet with a slight or sneer,
For I'm nothing but a plain old soldier.

Nothing but a plain old soldier
An old revolutionary soldier,
But I've handled a gun where noble deeds were done,
For the name of my commander was George Washington.
The friends I loved the best have departed,
The days of my early joys have gone,
And the voices once dear and familiar to my ear,
Have faded from the scenes of the earth one by one.
The tomb and the battle have laid them low,
And they roam no more where the bright streams flow,
I'm longing to join them and soon must go,
For I'm nothing but a plain old soldier.

Again the battle song is resounding
And who'll bring the trouble to an end?
The union will pout and secession ever shout
But none can tell us now which will yield or bend
You've had many generals from over the land,
You've tried one by one and you're still at a stand,
But when I took the field we had one in command,
Yet I'm nothing but a plain old soldier.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: GUEST,Elmore
Date: 09 Nov 09 - 11:46 AM

"Touch a Name on the Wall" by Joel Mabus


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: GUEST,Jacqued
Date: 09 Nov 09 - 03:24 PM

May I suggest a visit to http://www.terry-kelly.com/pittance/pittance_en_lyrics.htm

Says it all for me.   God bless them all


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: Amergin
Date: 09 Nov 09 - 03:51 PM

Eric Bogle's Gift of Years


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: oldhippie
Date: 09 Nov 09 - 05:16 PM

Lots of different viewpoints - all appropriate

Veterans Day - Tom Russell
Sam Stone - John Prine
Agent Orange (My Country Tis Of Thee)- Larry Long
Agent Orange - Kate Wolf
Forgotten Soldier - Linda & Greg Lewis
The Wall (I Touched His Name) - Marie Zerby
Thank You - Daniel Smith
two by Bobby Ross - No Home For The Brave, The Home of Billy D
And The Band Played Waltzing Matilda
Old Viet Vet - Dane Brown


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Subject: Lyr Add: THERE'S A WALL IN WASHINGTON (I DeMent)
From: open mike
Date: 09 Nov 09 - 10:26 PM

I am looking for songs for a radio show..
and am trying to balance the ideas of
being thankful and appreciative to veterans
and being horrified that such an insane thing
as war even exists...

Kris Kristopherson...has some
Judy Small...Mothers, Daughters, Wivews...recorded by several including Margaret Crystal (Christal?), the Mac

Iris DeMent....THERE'S A WALL IN WASHINGTON,

here's a wall in Washington
and it's made of cold black granite
They say 60,000 names are etched there in it
in that wall in Washington

A father, he traveled from far away
to walk the path 'til he finds that name
He reaches his hand up and traces each letter
The tears they fall as his memories gather
for the boy who filled his heart with pride
is now but a name that's been etched
in the side of this wall in Washington

A mother she traveled from far away
to walk the path 'til she finds that name
She reaches her hand up and traces each letter
The tears they fall as her memories gather
She feels the baby at her breast
but her heart it breaks because all that is left
is this wall in Washington

A boy, he traveled from far away
to walk the path 'til he finds that name
He reaches his hand up and traces each letter
He stares at the name of his unknown father
His heart is young and it's filled with pain
in anger he cries out

"Who is to blame for this wall in Washington
that's made of cold black granite?
Why is my father's name etched here in it
in this wall in Washington?

also Iris DeMent...Wasteland of the Free,

John McCutcheon..(mentioned before) Christmas in the Trenches,

Don't get me Started -- by Rodney Crowell see it here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xqwoOsblEnY


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: open mike
Date: 09 Nov 09 - 11:48 PM

oh yes, also Judy Small..
Mother's Daughters Wives..

i lost the URL of the
recording i found..
i think it was 3 fellows..
Maccollums or something??


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Subject: Lyr Add: AS IF HE KNOWS (Eric Bogle)
From: eddie1
Date: 10 Nov 09 - 04:59 AM

Open Mike
It was the McCalmans. On "Far, Far From Ypres" (Greentrax CDTrax1418).

Amos
Like most here, I found your first post inappropriate at first but then I did some thinking.
In Edinburgh Castle, right in the middle, at its highest point, is The Scottish National War Memorial. There are plaques on the walls for most of the Scottish regiments and books, covered in red leather and bound in brass, with the names of the fallen.
One such plaque is devoted to the Royal Army Veterinary Corps and depicts the various animals that were used in war, from horses to canaries. Taken there as a small child by my parents, I always found this particularly sad.
All these feelings were brought back when I first heard this song, also written by Eric Bogle and also on the above CD.
In WWI the Australian Light Horse took 53,000 horses overseas to various theatres of war and of the 53,000, one horse was allowed to return home (a general's horse of course!) The reason for the rest not being allowed to return home was the fear that they would spread anthrax to the Australian beef industry. In the French, Belgian and German theatres horses were sold or given to local farmers and peasants but in the Middle East it was believed that the locals were cruel to their animals so a decision was reached that the horses should be shot, Each man agreed to shoot his best friend's horse.

"Recalling his days in Palestine, an old Light Horseman called Elijah Kohn who was in the Seventh Light Horse told of his horse, Banjo and of his best mate having to shoot Banjo. Even after 70 years, Elijah's eyes filled with tears. He'd forgotten the names of some of his mates, but he remembered the name of his horse, Banjo because, as he said, he reckoned it saved his life three or four times.
It's bad enough what we do to human being during war but what we do to poor dumb animals is just as reprehensible." (from sleeve notes)



AS IF HE KNOWS

It's as if he knows
He's standing close to me
His breath warm on my sleeve
His head hung low
It's as if he knows
What the dawn will bring
The end of everything
For my old Banjo
And all along the picket lines beneath the desert sky
The Light Horsemen move amongst their mates to say one last goodbye
And the horses stand so quietly
Row on silent row
It's as if they know

Time after time
We rode through shot and shell
We rode in and out of Hell
On their strong backs
Time after time
They brought us safely through
By their swift sure hooves
And their brave hearts
Tomorrow we will form up ranks and march down to the quay
And sail back to our loved ones in that dear land across the sea
While our loyal and true companions
Who asked so little and gave so much
Will lie dead in the dust.

For the orders came
No horses to return
We were to abandon them
To be slaves
After all we'd shared
And all that we'd been through
A Nation's gratitude
Was a dusty grave
For we can't leave them to the people here, we'd rather see them dead
So each man will take his best mate's horse with a bullet through the head
For the people here are like their land
Wild and cruel and hard
So Banjo, here's your reward.

It's as if he knows, he standing close to me,
His breath warm on my sleeve, his head hung low.
As he if he knew.

Copyright Eric Bogle July 2001

I can't listen to this song without a lump in my throat.

Eddie


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: GUEST,Ray
Date: 10 Nov 09 - 05:49 PM

I have a Karaoke Business and I need a Veteran's Day song to sing tonight......HELP.. Im drawing a blank other than that Lee greenwood song...


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: mg
Date: 10 Nov 09 - 05:58 PM

I personally would not strive for balance on November 11, but instead have it totally a memorial. There are many other days of the year for balance. There is one day a year we should not have to brace ourselves. mg


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: open mike
Date: 10 Nov 09 - 09:28 PM

Here is the result of my striving for balance..
(which i believe there is always a reason to do..)
I found this c.d. which also has been made
into a video...http://www.ardensgarden.org/tmh.html
a benefit c.d. for the cause of Veterans for Peace,
http://www.veteransforpeace.org/
Take me Home....which is a collection of songs
by a variety of artists. It is available here:
http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/takemehome


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: CET
Date: 10 Nov 09 - 10:29 PM

I have to say that I have always despised Judy Small's "Mothers, Daughters, Wives". I find it contemptuous and condescending to the many good men I know who have worn a uniform. I dislike this song just about as much as I do "Margaret and Me".


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: open mike
Date: 11 Nov 09 - 12:02 PM

What is margaret and me? is the same as the Dutchman?

Here is a song about trees planted in the shape of a heart
as a memorial to a deceased pilot

http://www.kristinaolsen.net/pdfs/duet/hill.pdf


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: Mrrzy
Date: 12 Nov 09 - 10:07 AM

I sing:

-Anything by Phil Ochs against war in general
-And The Band Played Waltzing Matilda, and
-The Green Fields of France / No Man's Land (it has various titles, but it's by Eric Bogle, I think)

I have a hard time getting through the last 2 without tearing up... (that is, tee-ring, not tay-ring!)


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: GUEST,Azoic
Date: 31 Oct 12 - 05:24 AM

We are coming up on Vet's Day 2012. Here are a few song suggestions:The Band Played Waltzing Matilda,Flowers Of The Field-No Man's Land,Happed In Mist,The Nurse Dorothy Nicol-The Long Trail-The Reaper's Blade,Soldiers Three,Standing In Line,The Writing Of Tipperary,Rumours Of War,I'll Be Seeing You,Send Us A Quiet Night,Will Ye Go To Flanders?,A Smiling Shore,Aqaba,Shipbuilding,The Grey Funnel Line,The King's Shilling,The Fiddle And The Drum.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 31 Oct 12 - 01:13 PM

I would highly recommend leaving out any that insult veterans on this day of all days. If you can't sing something at least neutral, please don't sing anything. mg


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: GUEST,Azoic
Date: 03 Nov 12 - 02:58 PM

Indeed.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: GUEST,Lighter
Date: 03 Nov 12 - 03:18 PM

The real question is why you're singing "songs for veterans day" in the first place.

I can think of two or three reasons, but the only one that's any good is "to honor our veterans."

But the only songs that are especially appropriate to Veterans' Day are either "patriotic" or "antiwar." (There are silly marching songs like "I Don't Want No More Army Life," but I doubt that's what most people on this thread have in mind.)

Either kind is likely to offend or annoy somebody, including veterans.


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Subject: Lyr Add: 11:11 (Garnet Rogers)
From: GUEST,MikeK
Date: 04 Nov 12 - 01:34 AM

Here's a relatively new song (1999) about "Remembrance Day", the Canadian name for November 11, from Garnet Rogers. It's called simply "11/11"

11:11

by © Garnet Rogers

Ah the glorious few are all the few here
in the cold November air
the crowd draws silent
their collars raised
to the edges of the square
The children's choir sings "In Flander's Fields"
the band plays "Over There"
the old heroes still try to dress the line
As the chaplain leads the prayer

For the glorious few no longer stand so straight
As they did long years before
when they faced a hard and cruel fate
on a far and distant shore
their tunics faded green and blue
poor shelter from this cold
the memories made yet raw and new
at the calling of the roll

The heads are bowed in silence now
at the tolling of the hour
The first few falling flakes of snow
drift gently on the flowers
all piled and stacked against the stones
petals fluttering in the air
The eyes that stare down through the years
at the ones no longer there

The taste of lost and wasted years
so bitter on the tongue
white breath in clouds in the autumn cold
Fail chest with medals hung
in battle ribbons red and gold
in the pale November sun
the hands and faces grown so old
while the heart stays ever young

For the glorious few are the fewer here
the old soldiers from the square
the wind blows hard and shakes the leaves
and stirs the white thin hair
of these fading brave and fragile souls
as the bugler plays "Last Post"
the snow falls thick and faster still
and turns them white as ghosts


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: GUEST,Azoic
Date: 05 Nov 12 - 02:37 PM

Noble,elegant,and heartbreaking.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: GUEST,Azoic
Date: 11 Nov 12 - 12:30 PM

Today is Veteran's day here in the US.Because it is Sunday it will be observed tomorrow.


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Subject: Lyr Add: DON'T TAKE MY DARLING BOY AWAY!
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 04 Jun 13 - 08:49 PM

The sheet music can be seen at Duke University's web site. The "tenting tonight" lines that GUEST,L posted above are interpolated from another song. Maybe somebody recorded it that way, but those words don't appear in the sheet music:


DON'T TAKE MY DARLING BOY AWAY!
Words, Will Dillon; music, Albert Von Tilzer.
New York: Broadway Music Corporation, ©1915.

1. A mother was kneeling to pray
For loved ones at war far away,
And there by her side,
Her one joy and pride
Knelt down with her that day.
Then came a knock on the door:
"Your boy is commanded to war."
"No, captain, please!
Here on my knees,
I plead for one I adore.

CHORUS: "Don't take my darling boy away from me.
Don't send him off to war.
You took his father and brothers three.
Now you come back for more.
Who are the heroes that fight your war?
Mothers who have no say!
But my duty's done,
So for God's sake leave one,
And don't take my darling boy away."

2. A hero is now laid to rest,
A hero and one of the best.
She fought with each son,
The battles he'd won,
And the battles that proved a test.
Though she never went to the war,
She was the hero by far.
They gave the guns,
But who gave the sons?
M. O. T. H. E. R.


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Subject: RE: Veteran's Day (songs for)
From: GUEST,Lavengro
Date: 06 Jun 13 - 05:13 AM

I really like this by Mark Stuart and Stacey Earle. Written from the POV of someone who stayed at home.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6hOT8d8pKw


The Old Watch

My friend he stepped on the train
To go far away and fight war
Something I saw in his eyes told me
I would see my friend no more

I'll be back, he said to me
And he gave me an old pocket watch
Count the seconds, till the second I'm home
We'll rejoice for the war will have stopped

Chorus
There's an old watch that lay on my shelf
It's old but it still ticks away
The owner will one day reclaim it
But meanwhile the old watch will stay….
On my shelf, a ticking, a ticking, ticking away

Well my life it went through some changes
I safely lived in my home town
My friend he lived in a different world
He walked on dangerous ground

Once, he sent me a letter
I could tell he felt homesick and pain
But he mostly wrote me of visions
Of when we would meet once again

Chorus
Well the war, it finally ended
3 or 4 years had gone by
Thousands of young men returned home
But other thousands had died

My friend he is missing in action
His body may never be found
He may not even know where he is
Be injured in some foreign town

Chorus


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