BS: American bashing

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: GUEST,jayohjo in Russia
Date: 19 May 01 - 06:34 AM

My my my my......
Well first of all, thanks for the compliments on my English *BG*. Guess I should have made my very-Britishness a bit clearer!
Secondly, I know I was sort of asking for it with the thread title, but this REALLY was not intended as an anti-American thread. I've met LOVELY Americans, and I was feeling a bit homesick and isolated, and just wanted to get some reassurance from the lovely Americans here that you're not all bonkers. I've been feeling isolated because the teacher I work with worships all aspects of American culture, refuses to see anything bad about it, and refuses to hear anything good about Britain - she'll concede Shakespeare, just, and that's about it. And American missionaries turned up, who she worshipped too, and who seemed to find my English accent hilarious. Which was a bit tedious to be honest.
Finally, going back to someone's post about Russians knowing many more folk songs, that's because in former times (and still now) there were youth groups set up by the government for all sorts of things, including traditional music and crafts. So Russian teenagers know more about their countries traditions one the one hand, but on the other it's been taught in quite a contrived way. Still good though, it means that so far a lot has not been lost - though with the onset of Westernization and the closing of youth groups, who knows.....? Anyway lots of love to the Americans who inbetween all the craziness posted here, and served the purpose of the thread (proved they were lovely!) and to everyone else too (yes everyone) and now I'll go and bargain on the market some more Jayohjo XXX

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: InOBU
Date: 18 May 01 - 07:59 AM

Dear Gypsy... I was writing to you Romaness - our language, we who are Roma commonly called Gypsies, in short, Con suh? Roma?, Romanichale? Boyasha? Gitanos, Kaale, A bhfuil tu an Pavee? ... who are your people? Larry

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: Boab
Date: 18 May 01 - 04:11 AM

This thread is getting saner. A science teacher in Scotland swears to the truth of the following "Attention class---what is "inertia'"? Wee boy--"Irvine , Troon and Prestwick, Sur!" Och---the Scots 'll a' get it oneywey!! Boab

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: Gypsy
Date: 17 May 01 - 09:39 PM

inOBU, canna translate without gesticulations. Whattizzat yer sayin'?

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: kendall
Date: 17 May 01 - 09:12 AM

Didn't the McLeods originate in Norway? If so, how did they get a tartan? My 13th century Scottish history is a bit fuzzy.

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: GUEST,Joe
Date: 17 May 01 - 03:59 AM

Hello Murray good to hear from you the Kilt you described is of the MacLeods of Lewis the MacLeods of Harris is blue and green with red and yellow stripes. Highlander the movie actually shows the correct tartan for the Macleods of Harris

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 16 May 01 - 08:12 PM

Great posting, robomatic. You appear to be new here, but your posts are excellent. Keep contributing.

Guest Joe, I will have to check with my kiltmaker as to what the tartan is. It is NOT shortbread-tin yellow and black , that I CAN tell you !

Murray

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: kendall
Date: 16 May 01 - 07:39 PM

In the movie THE THIRD MAN, Joseph Cotton told Wilfred Hyde Whyte that he had arrived in Vienna to work for a friend, only to find upon arrival that his friend was dead. My Whyte said, "Oh my, that is awkward." Great line!

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: robomatic
Date: 16 May 01 - 04:53 PM

Been an American all my life, willingly. Also been overseas a few times and find that I like both the English AND the French. Now, how many Americans can say that? Every culture (and sub-culture) has its own ways. The French can be both the most polite people you'd ever want to meet, and among the most casually rude. In my experience they reserve the most rudeness for other French people and people such as those I call "Americans in plaid" not that i'm a fashion hound just a term for people who would go to a country thousands of miles away and then eat at McDonalds. The English have the most marvelous quiet spoken machismo, as the fellow narrating the Korean war story noted. If an Englishperson is really pissed off, they are 'not amused' If they went to a party and didn't enjoy anything about it it was 'a bore'. This attitude takes some getting used to from an American who typically has to learn to speak up if he or she wants to get a point across from the family table on into school and work. We are a rather loud, unsubtle bunch, but mostly good hearted. Quite often in an English room the most influential person is the most quietly spoken. I love it.

As for who saved whom in the late spot of bother in the previous century, check out Kevin Kline's little set-to with the actress playing John Cleese's wife in the movie "A Fish Called Wanda"

As for missionaries, at their best, they can bring order, literacy, and a sense of self-worth to people who feel they have nothing. At their worst, they are mental rapists who due to their own warped insecurities feel they must transmit a false salvation to people with no basic spiritual problems. The United States is a source of both kinds.

I visited The Soviet Union in the 70's and felt very positive toward the friendliness of the individuals I met there. Lately there has been a great deal of Russian - American interaction in Alaska. Again, most of the Russians who come over here are intelligent, interested folk who really appreciate being here. They are typically better educated for their tasks than the typical American, and I'll never forget the time a whole chorus came over and in an informal setting with Russian and America folkies, the Russians knew so many more folk songs than the Yanks it was incredible. And GOOD ones. I had to attibute it to way less good TV on their side of their Bering Strait.

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: kendall
Date: 16 May 01 - 09:33 AM

I know that story is BS, that wasn't the point.

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: InOBU
Date: 16 May 01 - 07:43 AM

Jeeze Murray, Do ya think Cathal's brother could write a great old song about the aircraft carrier and the lighthouse?! Only kidding about natural selection, of course, we were all head hunters once... even the Smithsonian, Real American, though, the Smithonian was involved in head hunting much more recently than the rest of us!
Cheers, pals, Larry

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: Boab
Date: 16 May 01 - 05:06 AM

I think this thread is petering out.It has been an education, in as much as it has shown , as surely as any gallup poll , that the great majority of Americans are good folks. It is obvious that ordinary decent Americans are like me [in one respect at least]---they cannot abide arrogance being displayed by one of their own. For the record, arrogant Americans/Germans/French/Canadians don't much move me one way or the other; being a product of Caledonia,arrogant Scots break my heart---and they exist, too. [I am NOT being facetious about Murray's romanticising!!]

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: GUEST,Joe
Date: 16 May 01 - 04:13 AM

hello Thank you for answering Murray and now I am assuming you wear the Macleod of Harris Tartan please correct me if I am wrong.

Real American you Have still not Shown me any facts like what place we dropped the bomb on Japan. Who created this bomb of mass destruction and how was the bomb delivered to Japan?

Gervase Thank you of reminding me of the Gurkhas I am not to clear on the story but there was A german unit stuck between having to face a larger Us force one way and a force of Gurkhas about the same size the other the Germans chose to face the US force Because they knew we would let them surrender.

Kendall the whole lighthouse USS Lincoln is Bullshit Good story though if your into Morals.

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: kendall
Date: 15 May 01 - 11:37 PM

This is an old story, and may have been posted here befTue, 15 May 2001 08:07:29 EDT Subject: Naval Story To: This is the transcript of the ACTUAL radio conversation of a US Naval ship and the Canadians, off the coast of Newfoundland, Oct 95. Radio conversation released by the Chief of Naval Operations 10-10-95.

CANADIANS: Please divert your course 15 degrees to the South, to avoid a collision.>

AMERICANS: Recommend you divert your course 15 degrees to the North, to avoid a collision.

CANADIANS: Negative. You will have to divert your course 15 degrees to the South to avoid a collision.

AMERICANS: This is the Captain of a US Navy ship. I say again, divert YOUR course.

CANADIANS: Negative. I say again, You will have to divert your course.

AMERICANS: THIS IS THE AIRCRAFT CARRIER USS LINCOLN. THE SECOND LARGEST SHIP IN THE UNITED STATES ATLANTIC FLEET. WE ARE ACCOMPANIED BY THREE DESTROYERS, THREE CRUISERS, AND NUMEROUS SUPPORT VESSELS. I DEMAND THAT YOU CHANGE YOUR COURSE 15 DEGREES NORTH, I SAY AGAIN, THAT'S 15 DEGREES NORTH, OR COUNTERMEASURES WILL BE UNDERTAKEN TO ENSURE THE SAFETY OF THIS SHIP.

CANADIANS: We are a lighthouse. Your call.

ore, but, it needs repeating. I love stories about pricking the pompous...

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 15 May 01 - 11:05 PM

Larry, I have often wondered why nature favoured the Highland Scots and the Irish with that natural graciousness which so entrances the rest of the world. Natural selection? I don't know.

Growing up amidst the beauty of the West Highlands of Scotland, one can hardly can hardly fail to assimilate some of that beauty and grace. Likewise for the West Coast of Ireland, I imagine. I think of our mutual friend Cathal, and wonder if there has ever been a more gracious man than he? (Next time you speak to him tell him we want him down here in Florida, OK)

Apologies for this thread creep. I just can't work up any American - bashing emotions at his point in time.

Murray

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: CarolC
Date: 15 May 01 - 10:17 PM

Actually, Spaw, if 'GUEST, Real American' is who I think he is, his father is a good man and not a klansman.

If GUEST, Real American is who I think he is, he dishonors his father, his family name, and his country with his behavior in this forum.

Carol

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: InOBU
Date: 15 May 01 - 10:09 PM

Gypsy? Sar San! Rom? Con vitsa? Con nasti? Murra daka janeh avin ando Berlod Romania, Lovari. My dee kos amay, Larry (Lolya)

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: catspaw49
Date: 15 May 01 - 10:07 PM

Yeah, I know what you mean Cami........Like Mav, he lives in a world where everything fits his mindset and his bigotry. Too often though, he IS the face we show to the rest of the world. I'd prefer yours.

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: CamiSu
Date: 15 May 01 - 09:56 PM

No, Pat, he will also find what he is looking for. As Gypsy's story so rightly points out, you get what you're looking for, or perhaps more to the point, you get what you express. I never got anything but smiles when I walked down the streets of NYC, most likely because I smiled at them first... (And I once had the most fascinating few hours of talk with the old black men who were living in Grand Central Station 30 years ago...wonderful people!)

And you will note that I used quotes around what's-his-face's name, since I, to do not think his option of the name makes him any more real than any of the rest of us who live here.

CamiSu

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: catspaw49
Date: 15 May 01 - 09:27 PM

Unless of course you're the results of a Klansman copulating with a buffalo........................................ .........................................like "Real American"...

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: Gypsy
Date: 15 May 01 - 08:45 PM

Sigh....i add to this thread a very old story. About the wise man by the river? A couple was preparing to cross, and asked him what the city was like on the other side. He asked what is was like where they had just departed. They said it was awful, filled with strife and hate. He said that is what the city across the river held. Yet another couple came up, and asked the same question. So did he. Their reply was that they hated to move, their former home was so wonderful, with loving, fabulous people. He said that they would find the same in the city across the river. You tend to get what you are looking for, in anyone. Just try it sometime.

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: GUEST,Albamist
Date: 15 May 01 - 08:44 PM

Murray, you failed to add the qualifier, "except when they are sniping on the internet" then they display their inherent doureness. Having travelled quite a bit over the years, I can only say that no nation holds a monopoly on manners, good or bad. As for Real American, it is just a reality that being the most dominant and powerful nation is going to earn your country criticism, not I might add, the individual citizenry of your fine land but more often the assinine foreign policy of your elected and non-elected officials. Add to this the fact that your nation continues to elect the most obtuse individuals as leaders much like the English were led by a bunch of bufoons back in the olde Great Britain days, despite the reality of both nations having an obvious wealth of talent (just not on the political front) Regards Albamist

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: artbrooks
Date: 15 May 01 - 08:34 PM

What's his name (I decline to use his nickname, because as far as I'm concerned he isn't) says: "My critics are the one's who have failed to name a single major battle in the Pacific won by non-Americans." How about the British 14th Army, and specifically the 5th Indian Division's defeat of the Japanese 15th Army in Assam (March-June 1944) and General Wingate's campaign in Burma?

The large amount of US aid was certainly a major factor in Russia's victory in the east, but much of it was transportation assets. It is really unlikely that much Soviet artillery ammunition came from US plants, both because the supply lines were too long and dangerous for cargo space to be wasted on expendables such as munitions and because the standard Soviet field artillery pieces were different calibres (76.5mm, 122mm and 152mm) than American (75mm, 105mm, 155mm and 8").

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: InOBU
Date: 15 May 01 - 06:18 PM

Dear Murray,
As I contemplate the well of seven heads, I have to wonder if Highland courtesy may be a matter of natural selection? Any thoughts brother Celt?
Slan agus beannacht
Larry (Lorcan)

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 15 May 01 - 05:57 PM

Guest Joe, I am indeed from Scotland, I grew up in a small village on the West Coast of Sutherland, which makes me a Highlander. btw, when I said that Americans have better manners than the British, I did not mean to imply that they have better manners than the Highland Scots, who are unfailingly the most courteous, considerate people you eould ever hope to meet.

Murray

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: CarolC
Date: 15 May 01 - 04:35 PM

Cheap shots are easy, GUEST, Real American, but they lack substance.

Good thing you remembered to hide behind an anonymous pseudonym. That way, when you go overseas, no one over there will know that you're the one who offended them on this thread.

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: CamiSu
Date: 15 May 01 - 04:05 PM

I'm afraid "Real American" is probably real. There are several like him around here, those who think that the last shoulder added to a job is the one who did all the work and deserves everyone else's undying, complete, and vocal gratitude. While it is true that the allies were having a very hard time (can you tell I have British ancestry?) the fact is had the Europeans, Russians, and Anzac not been doing their best there would not have been a place for the U.S. to put their collective shoulder, and we couldn't have won it by ourselves. It was a group effort, and none of us should forget it.

I have an AFS student from Austria, and once, upon seeing a bank employee take down the flag at the end of the day, he said, "Now I love America. No one in Austria is proud of our country!" I must admit that I hope this is not true. But perhaps, we should concentrate more on LOVING our countries, appreciating what is good about the whole world, and doing our best to correct what is wrong.

That said, I am grateful to be an American. I appreciate that I live in this lovely area, surrounded by (mostly) wonderful people. I have also been abroad, and have seen other lovely places, populated by wonderful people. I am also aware that there are some very large warts on us, and that, as far as I know, my ancestors did not arrive here before about 1635. There are real Americans whose ancestors have been here MUCH longer. And while we have a wonderfully liberal citizenship policy, we do not treat many of our own very well. Perhaps, when we get the beam out of our own eyes, we can see to cast the mote out of out brothers'.

Kind of an aside, as a citizen of the U.S. where all children born here can be citizens, I was unaware that there are many countries where you can be a second or third generation resident, and still be considered a citizen of the country of your grandparents, even though, culturally, you identify with the country of your birth.

Peace,

CamiSu

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 15 May 01 - 02:52 PM

Rick said

D-Day would've turned out a lot differently (and may not have happened at all) had the Russians not taken on the brunt of the German army, giving as well as receiving staggering losses, and defeating them at Stalingrad.

That the Russians took the brunt of the Nazi war machine and won can't be argued. The fact that Stalin sent thousands of these Red Army soldiers to die in concentration camps after being "infected" by contact with their Western Allies is one of the most disgusting occurrences of the War, and worthy of that other Great Dictator of the era, Herr Hitler.

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: mousethief
Date: 15 May 01 - 02:07 PM

I've said this before: I love living in the USA and think it's the greatest country in the world (in spite of its many warts, and don't think I don't konw they're there), and furthermore I expect every person to love his/her own country, and think it is (at least potentially, if things are bad there now) the greatest in the world. If I was sitting down with a person from Ghana, or Thailand, or wherever, drinking a beer or whatever, I'd expect him/her to say how beautiful the mountains/deserts/cities/jungles/etc. of home are, and how those of any other country can't hold a candle to them. And I'd say the same thing about my country, and we'd understand where one another were coming from.

At the same time I don't think that need be a cause for war or imperialism. If we understand that every person thinks his land is the best, there's no need to impose our way of looking at the world on anybody. The world is more than large enough for hundreds of countries, each of which is happy to be itself, and all of which can get along with one another.

Now if we could just do that -- get along with one another. For some reason that seems to be the hard part.

Alex

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: Owlkat
Date: 15 May 01 - 02:00 PM

Hi,
YeeeeeeHa! Heat up the skillet, Everitt! We got us a live one!
But seriously, folks, speaking Canadianly, and for myself, I do confess to some south of the border envy. Americans do identify more clearly in terms of a sense of recognizable nationalism, and a cultural homogeneousness, which we still haven't quite caught onto, yet. (Hey, look at me, Ma, I'm making up new words) That is, you are less confused about who you are, where you live, and why you think it's a better place to live than other places in the world.
This is not, however, unique. Citizens of many other nations share these same notions. Unfortunately, the resulting arrogance, imperialism, and xenophobia can lead to world-views that cause tension, persecution, and bloodshed.
Yes, it's a wonderful flag, full of all kinds of history and symbols that mean all kinds of important things to you. That's why you should wave it in your own yard. Don't beat the crap out of your neighbour if he doesn't want to hang it in his yard.This notion applies to many countries in the world and not just the U.S.
Here's another idea. There's a difference between The people and A people. As a collective, Americans are not seen the same way as individuals. As an example, most of the Germans I've met, so far, have been fairly likeable people. The sound of German, however, raises the hair on my neck, and conjures images of far too many, and too recent, very evil things. I've met nice Americans and nasty ones. Some of both are my relatives. But, I believe that the existence of stereotype is based on both reality and rumour. Nice Canadians? Tell that to the Jewish refugees turned back from Canada in Halifax harbour at bayonet-point in 1939. Or, to the west coast Nisei stripped of property, rights, citizenship, and imprisoned in Canadian concentration camps, because of ignorant and racist backlashes against their Japanese cultural heritage.
Don't like Yankee-bashing? Well, the assumptions of superiority and higher morality that go with strong nationalism are lightning rods for criticism. That's just the way it is. Every nation-state in existence has had to take it. (Who do those damned Phoenicians think they are, anyway?) The stronger the national sentiments have been, so has the flak been thicker and smellier. So, if you're tired of the cheap shots, than maybe less time should be spent on foreign policy that tries to wallpaper the globe with stars and stripes. Tend your own apple trees, and maybe you'll learn to notice and appreciate your neighbours rose bushes.
Your serve,
Owl

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: InOBU
Date: 15 May 01 - 01:59 PM

Order me up a diet Coke, Alex, I'll be in in a minute, pipes under arm... You'll recognise me, I am the one in the black Uncle Ho Che Mien pajamas... (he said ducking the chairs...)
:-)
Larry

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: mousethief
Date: 15 May 01 - 12:58 PM

I think we would have been better off going out for a beer.

Alex

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: John J
Date: 15 May 01 - 12:50 PM

Nice one Gervase!

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: catspaw49
Date: 15 May 01 - 11:26 AM

Nicely put Gervase!!!

And "Real American Asshole".........

There were several non-American victories if the Pacific theatre.........Bataan and Corrigador, Coral Sea was at best a draw............seems to me the fleet took a hell of a pasting at Pearl Harbor too.

May I apologize to my British, Australian, New Zealand, and Canadian brethren? We produce a few like Real American Asshole.........I think we have a supply source somewhere like maybe they're by-products of medical experiments. It's got to be that......or just another in the continuing lineage from that Klansman that fucked a buffalo. What a tool.........

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: Ebbie
Date: 15 May 01 - 11:20 AM

Oh, Popeye! I'd know you anywhere. Not to worry, folks. Let him be...

Ebbie

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: InOBU
Date: 15 May 01 - 11:19 AM

and the last thing you want to do is piss off a Ghurka, living or dead!!! (Larry)

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: Gervase
Date: 15 May 01 - 10:56 AM

Listen, lunkhead, the facts are posted above. If you choose not to read them, or don't understand them, then that's your problem.
And may the ghosts of ten thousand Ghurkas, Chindits and Indians dance around your pea-like brain.

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: GUEST,Real American
Date: 15 May 01 - 10:49 AM

I have provided facts. The U.S. dropped the bomb on Japan, then demanded and received an unconditional surrender. I assumed that it was common knowledge but most of you seem oblivious to the significance of this this event. My critics are the one's who have failed to name a single major battle in the Pacific won by non-Americans. I also doubt that most of you were aware of the material/logistical aid provided to the Russians by the U.S. until I educated you about it. Did you even know that Russian pilots were based in the U.S.? I doubt it because you are long on verbosity and short on historical knowledge. Don't try to fool yourselves, I am taking on this entire thread and winning. Maybe you should go pick an argument with Karen or Carol, they are easy...

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: InOBU
Date: 15 May 01 - 08:05 AM

No Joe, it wasn't the Maine, it was the Palmer raids. Just as we are blockading Cuba, to the world's disgust, we will always tolerate a Nazi over a leftest. Things just don't change here. - Larry

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: GUEST,Joe
Date: 15 May 01 - 05:11 AM

Hello Real American since you can tell I'm an Idiot since I keep hitting the wrong button please tell me who helped create the BOMB and what country they are from.

Larry I guess we still held A grudge for them sinking the Maine back in 1898 thats why we didn't help Spain.

Like I said before if Hitler had read his history books the war would of came out differently,especially the Chapter about Napoleon and the harsh Russian winter.

Real American you asked Karen to show you facts so far you haven't shown us any such as what battles the US won and when you just keep spouting off general info most everyone knows.

Also Murray MacLeod Are you originally from Scotland and if So are you from the Isles or are you a highlander,I ask this question honestly I am not trying to be a smart ass with the whole highlander bit as from the earlier part of this post you can see that would be impossible

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: Gervase
Date: 15 May 01 - 05:07 AM

For crap's sake, the problem isn't nations but ideologies.
The bomb was built in America, but it was built by Americans, Brits, Germans, Australians, Austrians and Italians among others; all united in their resolve to overthrow totalitarianism.
The kind of blinkered, hectoring nationalism expressed by some of the "guests" here would turn fact on its head and rewrite history.
And, "Real American", look up Kohima and Imphal; if, that is, they appear in your history books.

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: GUEST,Joe
Date: 15 May 01 - 04:44 AM

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: Matt_R
Date: 14 May 01 - 07:44 PM

The Statue of Liberty Lost her virginity To me And that's just fine!!

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: Joe_F
Date: 14 May 01 - 07:30 PM

ObSongs (not to mention Who Won the War): The most sustained piece of American bashing I know is "The Second Front Song". I heard it at a concert of the Ballads & Blues Society in London in 1958, and later on the radio from a Ewan MacColl recording. Is it known who wrote it?

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: gnu
Date: 14 May 01 - 06:35 PM

McGrath... I suppose one must never underestimate. Therefore, my hat's off to Real Flamerican. He really had me going. I actually thought he was just another ***hole and, instead, he's a clever ***hole. Gee, I feel like a dumb animal.

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: CarolC
Date: 14 May 01 - 06:32 PM

Maybe the problem is that although our GUEST, Real American has a lot of firepower, he keeps using it to bomb his own runway.

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: mousethief
Date: 14 May 01 - 06:11 PM

Thank you, McGrath, for throwing petrol on the fire. I would never have thought of doing so.

Alex

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 14 May 01 - 06:10 PM

I reckon "GUEST Real American" is probably someone who loathes America and Americans, and has thought up this sneaky way of trying to get other people to see them the same way.

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: InOBU
Date: 14 May 01 - 06:06 PM

I'm with Alex, on the suggestion that it is time for a beer break... unfortunatly my liver isn't anymore, Have one or two for me, ol' mousethief! Cheers, NO PASARAN! Larry
PS WHere was the US when Spain needed help, oh forget it, Salud!

Subject: RE: BS: American bashing
From: mousethief
Date: 14 May 01 - 06:04 PM

You know, one can be right and rude, or right and polite, or wrong and rude, or wrong and polite.

Whether one is right or wrong, being polite will win you more points than being rude. Indeed, you can be 100% correct, but so rude that you turn people away from your cause -- even people who were already on your side (the famous "Please stop being on my side" phenomenon which we've all experienced!).

And of course at the time you're wrong you don't realize it.

Thus general humility and enlightened self-interest would dictate that being polite is almost always the better option than being rude.

Not advice I always follow, alas, but it's true nevertheless.

Alex