Lyr Req: Whispering Hope

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: WHISPERING HOPE
From: Ferrara
Date: 07 Jun 01 - 12:26 AM

The net is a bit funky tonight. I searched on "voice of an angel" and got two good sites. One gave the first three verses that we have here, and also confirmed that it was written by Septimus Winner. (I was afraid I might have been having a Senior Moment when I wrote that....) This same site said that one can go to the Cyberhymnal for info on song authors and history. I can't get Cyberhymnal to finish loading anything and I ran out of patience. Maybe tomorrow....

I'm very pleased, actually. The CyberHymnal has moved since I first found them and bookmarked their site. When I tried to use my bookmark in the past few months and it didn't work, I thought maybe they had gone under for some reason. So it was great to learn they just have a new address. They're at www.cyberhymnal.org now.

Rita

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: WHISPERING HOPE
From: Helen
Date: 06 Jun 01 - 07:45 PM

Curiouser & curiouser, Charlie.

You could be right about the size limitation. Seems logical.

I did a search yesterday for info on the net but there are more sites mentioning WH than you can poke a stick at, so I gave up. But I'll give it another go, maybe over the weekend when I have more time.

Helen

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: WHISPERING HOPE
From: Chicken Charlie
Date: 06 Jun 01 - 02:12 PM

Just when you thought it was safe to ignore this thread ....

I looked in my Edison machine this A.M. and found weird information. The actual cylinder of Whis. H. says it is by Helen Clark and J. Young. On the label, however, it says Helen Clark and Harry Anthony. Just to immunize myself from the nit-whackers, the brand name of those cylinders is Blue Amberol. I said "Blue Seal" but that's a local laundry!!!!! As for a date, neither cylinder nor label has one, so the best I can do is say it was after 1919, as it refers to a patent taken out that year--but a patent on hardware, not a copyright.

I think the limit of three verses might have been imposed by the length of the cylinder; with one song per, they didn't have the option of doing super-long Lily, Rosemary type tracks. Either that or the fourth verse wasn't written yet.

CC

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: WHISPERING HOPE
From: Helen
Date: 06 Jun 01 - 07:53 AM

Rita,

That makes sense to me, i.e. adding more verses as needed or wanted. I didn't realise that the song is so old, either. I thought it was written in the mid-20th century.

Live and learn at Mudcat - as always. (grin)

Helen

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: WHISPERING HOPE
From: Ferrara
Date: 06 Jun 01 - 01:20 AM

Helen, thanks for that fourth verse! I have two different sheet music versions. One has two verses, the other has three.

I dearly love this song. My mom asked to have it sung for my sister's memorial service.

[Irrelevant aside: The next morning as I was waking up, I had a strong intuition that I needed to turn on the radio RIGHT NOW. I didn't really want to move, but the little inner voice said in so many words that if I waited,I would miss hearing something that would comfort me about my sister's death. So I turned on the radio and they were just starting to play "Whispering Hope." I've always felt that little inner prompting came from my sister somehow.... Or maybe it was just a bizarre series of coincidences? No way to find out, but it WAS comforting at the time.]

Another aside, but relevant: The song was published under the name of Alice Hawthorne. This was a pseudonym of a fellow named Septimus Winner, who churned out songs just about as fast as they could be published. Some were darned good, too! He also wrote the lyrics of "Listen to the Mockingbird." I have an old book containing a slave song called "Heaven is a Great Ways Off," as adapted by Septimus Winner. He really got around!

Anyway, I believe he sometimes added more verses when a song went into multiple printings. The Levy site has two or three sheet music versions of "Listen to the Mockingbird" which have a third verse printed ABOVE the music staves. I suspect they were added to make it even more salable.

It was pretty common at that time (about 1880) for authors to revise their songs when they were reprinted. There are multiple authentic versions of "Tenting Tonight" by Walter Kittredge, for example, with small changes here and there. (Not to be confuse with pirated versions of "Tenting Tonight," where his tune was used but the words were entirely rewritten.)

Well, how's that for useless information?

Rita

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: WHISPERING HOPE
From: Nancy King
Date: 06 Jun 01 - 01:17 AM

Some years ago, when I used to sing with Nan Goland and Gail McHenry as Sweet Accord, we sang the version in the Broadman Hymnal, using the soprano, alto, and tenor parts pretty much as written in Broadman, but with the tenor part an octave higher, above the other parts. It's a great harmony piece.

The Broadman version ("arr. from Alice Hawthorne") has the verses as follows:

#1 - "Soft as the voice of an angel..." (per Gene),

#2 - "If in the dusk of the twilight..." (per Charlie),

#3 - "Hope as an anchor so steadfast..." (per Gene).

Helen said the "Hope as an anchor" verse seemed "different" to her. For me, the "Life is a journey before us..." verse she posted seems different -- because I've never heard it before! Anyhow, I like it. And one more verse gives us another chance to sing the refrain.

The Broadman uses the refrain posted by Helen ("...making my heart in its sorrow rejoice") and there are counterpoint parts for the tenor and bass on the chorus. There is no way I can explain it in words, but the timing and harmony in the counterpoint are great!

The schmaltzy phrasing on Charlie's cylinder sounds right to me. We always gave it just a bit of a pause after "wait --". It's possible to get TOO schmaltzy, of course, but adding a little drama never hurts.

Thanks for reminding me about "Whispering Hope"!

Cheers, Nancy

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: WHISPERING HOPE
From: Helen
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 09:19 PM

Charlie,

It was this verse which seems a bit "darker" to me, but on re-reading it is maybe not so dark and gloomy.

Hope, as an anchor so steadfast
Rends the dark veil for the soul
Whither the Master has entered
Robbing the grave of its goal
Come then, O come, glad fruition
Come to my sad, weary heart
Come, O Thou blest hope of glory
Never, O never depart.

The style of this verse seems different to me, but I am just going on gut-reaction so I'm open to discussion on it.

I am aware that the sheet music may not be the same as the original version. It's quite possible that the sheet music version was "prettied up" for general consumption. It's also possible that, being printed in Australia, it was re-worked for what the publishers may have thought the Oz public would want. In my mind, anything is possible while I don't have the full facts.

I don't have time to do any searching right now because I have "wasted" more time than I should this morning on the 'Net and I have work to do, but I'll check back here later and then see what I can find out.

Helen

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: WHISPERING HOPE
From: Sorcha
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 09:10 PM

Yes, Charlie. You right.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: WHISPERING HOPE
From: Chicken Charlie
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 08:45 PM

Whoa, buck!

I will check tonight on date/performers of my version; since it is on the "Blue Seal" label, it's a durn sight prior to 1950.

I'm trying to follow your logic on verse 2 and can't. To to that verse and the "Hope with an anchor" verse are painfully consistent. What are you saying was re-done?

BTW, is "Alice Hawthorne" not a pseudoname for Septimus Winter (Winner?), a Black who also wrote "Listen to the Mockingbird"? Somebody who knows this please save me the grief of looking it up again.

CC

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: WHISPERING HOPE
From: wysiwyg
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 08:06 PM

That addy is workin' fine fer me.

Somebuddy'll have to make a compilation of ALL the verses to make it easier to harvest.

Yes Scorchy I knew whatcha meant, I'se just twistin' mah bes/bud's tail!

Personally I think the more verses the better. I write them myself when there aren't "enough"!

~S~

Subject: Lyr Add: WHISPERING HOPE (Added verse)^^
From: Helen
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 07:58 PM

I have the sheet music here. One of my treasured pieces - learnt it in school way back when, on a plastic whistle.

The verses I have are:

No. 1: The first verse posted by Gene.

No. 2: The verse posted by Chicken Charlie

No. 3:

Life is a journey before us,
Thru [sic] the great forest unknown,
Yet ther eis courage in learning,
Never are we all alone;
There all around hope is waiting,
Waiting to shine thru our fears,
Waiting 'til dawn brings the sunshine,
Giving farewell to our tears.

Refrain:

Whispering hope
Oh, how welcome thy voice.
Making my heart
In its sorrow rejoice.

This sheet music was published by southern Music Pub Co, Sydney (Oz), 1950. Words & music by Alice Hawthorne.

The second verse and refrain posted by Gene sound like they have been reworked, because the message is slightly different from the sheet music version.

Helen

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: WHISPERING HOPE
From: Sorcha
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 07:04 PM

Soozer-Doozer, ya knows what I meaned!! Silly Billy! Go ye forth and find When We Gather (couldn't be the Thanksgiving one, We gather together to ask the Lord's blessing, now could it?)

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: WHISPERING HOPE
From: Chicken Charlie
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 06:54 PM

Tried that address twice & got error message.

Meanwhile, here is another verse. On the Edison cylinder version of this I have (can't remember group; I'll look) it is the second verse.

If in the dusk of the twilight,
Dim be the region afar,
Will not the deepening darkness
Brighten the glimmering star?
Then, when the night is upon us,
Why should the heart sink away?
When the dark midnight is over,
Watch for the breaking of day.

There is also an interesting effect on this version which I copy, though some may find it schmaltzlich. On the first verse, they "wait" on the two "waits"--i.e., the word "wait" is not prolonged, but is followed by a one-beat rest. Second verse in the same place I guess it's like dotted quarter followed by eighths on "Br-i-i-ghten the ...." in the syncopated way I'm used to hearing the whole song sung. On the last verse, though, "Come then oh come" is done in four equal notes like the glad fruition is marching right up on stage. For those who like that sort of stuff ....

CC

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: WHISPERING HOPE
From: wysiwyg
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 03:04 PM

(LOL!)

OK, "PLEASE search Mudcat first, THANKS!"

*G*G*G*

ROFLMAO!

~S~

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: WHISPERING HOPE
From: Sorcha
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 01:25 PM

How about a "please", too?..........and maybe a "thanks" when(if) you come back?

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: WHISPERING HOPE
From: wysiwyg
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 01:17 PM

.... let's... search... Mudcat... FIRST, folks?

~S~

Subject: Lyr Add: WHISPERING HOPE^^
From: GUEST,Gene
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 01:15 PM

Found on-line--

WHISPERING HOPE

Soft as the voice of an angel
Breathing a lesson unheard
Hope with a gentle persuasion
Whispers her comforting word
Wait till the darkness is over
Wait till the tempest is done
Hope for the sunshine tomorrow
After the shower is gone.

Hope, as an anchor so steadfast
Rends the dark veil for the soul
Whither the Master has entered
Robbing the grave of its goal
Come then, O come, glad fruition
Come to my sad, weary heart
Come, O Thou blest hope of glory
Never, O never depart.

Whispering hope
O how welcome thy voice
Calling me home
Where the ransomed rejoice.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: WHISPERING HOPE
From: wysiwyg
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 01:12 PM

It's here:

Click here

~S~

URL converted to link. --JoeClone, 16-Apr-02.

Subject: WHISPERING HOPE
From: GUEST,DERMOT HARTIGAN
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 01:00 PM