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Help: Menopause. Effect on the voice?

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Deni 26 Jun 01 - 02:13 AM
DougR 26 Jun 01 - 02:48 AM
Llanfair 26 Jun 01 - 04:00 AM
Jim Hancock 26 Jun 01 - 04:45 AM
SINSULL 26 Jun 01 - 08:39 AM
nutty 26 Jun 01 - 09:43 AM
kendall 26 Jun 01 - 11:19 AM
Steve Parkes 26 Jun 01 - 12:12 PM
GUEST,guest 26 Jun 01 - 01:11 PM
MMario 26 Jun 01 - 01:33 PM
Fiolar 26 Jun 01 - 01:49 PM
Llanfair 26 Jun 01 - 05:23 PM
DougR 26 Jun 01 - 06:45 PM
vectis 26 Jun 01 - 08:27 PM
Art Thieme 26 Jun 01 - 10:27 PM
Deni 27 Jun 01 - 12:36 AM
balladeer 27 Jun 01 - 12:42 AM
Liz the Squeak 27 Jun 01 - 01:53 AM
Mudlark 27 Jun 01 - 02:16 AM
katlaughing 27 Jun 01 - 02:43 AM
Steve Parkes 27 Jun 01 - 04:40 AM
Peg 27 Jun 01 - 09:14 AM
MMario 27 Jun 01 - 09:21 AM
Llanfair 27 Jun 01 - 09:50 AM
Bert 27 Jun 01 - 12:37 PM
GUEST,mgarvey@pacifier.com 27 Jun 01 - 07:21 PM
MAG (inactive) 27 Jun 01 - 08:38 PM
GUEST,b;t 27 Jun 01 - 09:21 PM
GUEST,moonwoman18@home.com 27 Jun 01 - 10:31 PM
Deni 28 Jun 01 - 01:12 AM
harriet 28 Jun 01 - 10:09 AM
Mr Red 28 Jun 01 - 06:22 PM
Fortunato 29 Jun 01 - 01:09 PM
Shall 29 Jun 01 - 03:00 PM
Llanfair 29 Jun 01 - 03:43 PM
Mr Red 30 Jun 01 - 09:25 AM
Shall 30 Jun 01 - 11:20 AM
Robin2 30 Jun 01 - 10:37 PM
Ferrara 01 Jul 01 - 09:56 AM
Alice 01 Jul 01 - 10:10 AM
balladeer 01 Jul 01 - 04:55 PM
GUEST,Ickle dorritt 01 Jul 01 - 05:19 PM
GUEST,Ickle Dorritt 01 Jul 01 - 05:22 PM
GUEST,Celtic Soul 01 Jul 01 - 08:01 PM
Judy Predmore 01 Jul 01 - 10:18 PM
Mr Red 02 Jul 01 - 02:16 PM
Bluegrass Girl 02 Jul 01 - 03:59 PM
Deni 04 Jul 01 - 05:43 AM
Kaleea 05 Jul 01 - 12:44 AM
Liz the Squeak 05 Jul 01 - 01:27 AM
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Subject: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Deni
Date: 26 Jun 01 - 02:13 AM

I was reading that the menapause can affect the voice. Anyone noticed any problems? How do you overcome them? D


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: DougR
Date: 26 Jun 01 - 02:48 AM

It didn't affect me that much, Deni. :>)

DougR


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Llanfair
Date: 26 Jun 01 - 04:00 AM

It's essential to keep the throat well lubricated.....alcohol works very well!!!!
Seriously, I noticed more changes when I stopped smoking 2 years ago, I can sing a tone or two higher now. I think there is a little drying out, but that is easily dealt with,
Cheers, Bron.


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Jim Hancock
Date: 26 Jun 01 - 04:45 AM

Whatever the solution to dry vocal chords is it's not alcohol, it tightens up the vocal chords, consider what it does to other bits of the anatomy for a comparison. I find acidic fruit juices etc. to be less than beneficial also. Try tomato juice or drinks of similar consitancy. all the best jim


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: SINSULL
Date: 26 Jun 01 - 08:39 AM

The screaming tantrums tend to leave me a little raspy but other than that...


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: nutty
Date: 26 Jun 01 - 09:43 AM

I suppose the voice should really get deeper as there is a depleted amount of female hormones in the body ????


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: kendall
Date: 26 Jun 01 - 11:19 AM

hhmmm, come to think of it, I dont remember when I had a period. When I quit smoking, I noticed that my voice had relaxed and I could sing a bit lower than before. Now, since te operation, I never know if I can sing at all.


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Steve Parkes
Date: 26 Jun 01 - 12:12 PM

I don't think the hormone changes will affect the larynx as it's fully grown: it won't start to shrink. (On the other hand, you may get hairier legs!) There's always HRT, if that's suitable for you. Ask you doctor, s/he probably won't have a clue though.

Come on. there must be some post-menopausal singers on the 'Cat--we chaps promis not to look at your names when we read your posts!

Steve


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: GUEST,guest
Date: 26 Jun 01 - 01:11 PM

1. Almost all post-menopausal women should take replacement hormones. Check with your doctor and read reliable literature, and you'll see. Hormones keep many parts of your body young, and probably the voice, too.

2. Keep singing. Sing around the house and in the shower.

3. Drink water and/or fruit juice. Alcohol, chocolate and caffeine dry your throat up.

4. Heredity has something to do with it. My mother had a sweet, girlish voice till age 75. A friend of mine, on the other hand, had an old woman's voice at 60.


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: MMario
Date: 26 Jun 01 - 01:33 PM

Now going through my third generation of menapausal woman in my family- haven't heard any of them complain about effects on their voices - and several sing - at least for pleasure.

On the other hand the men in the family definately feel that menapause adds a certain "edge" to the ladies voices. One we have all learned to avoid in one way or another.


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Fiolar
Date: 26 Jun 01 - 01:49 PM

I don't know about the "menapause" but the "menopause" does have some bodily effects. :-)


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Llanfair
Date: 26 Jun 01 - 05:23 PM

I am amazed by the number of men who have responded to this thread, and not always with any semblance of understanding or empathy.
Guest, HRT is not the cure-all that women are led to believe. Not enough work is done to ensure the right dosage for each person, and it does not allow the natural hormone substitutes to kick in.
And what happens when you stop taking it?
It makes me cross when people make fun of a very natural phase in a woman's life, without knowing how it feels.
I am 53.
Bron.


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: DougR
Date: 26 Jun 01 - 06:45 PM

Sorry I made light of a difficult situation for women, Bron. Just being a smart-ass.

DougR


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: vectis
Date: 26 Jun 01 - 08:27 PM

My voice has deepened and improved since the menopause. My husband claims it is the cigarettes, whiskey and beer but I reckon it's age. I don't take HRT but may go on it sometime to protect my bones.
I think that if you're noticing changes you don't like get medical help/advice. If, like me, you relish the freedom and are enjoying the changes, then why muck up a good thing?


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Art Thieme
Date: 26 Jun 01 - 10:27 PM

I think I hear the difference in Joan Baez's voice. That amazing 20 year old's voice just isn't there now. She does a nice job these days, but that voice when I saw her open a show for Bob Gibson at the Gate Of Horn folk nightclub in Chicago--1959---------she was truly spectacular. And Lauren Bacall's voice is more husky now. It's a natural progression for many/some I suspect. But those of us who recorded when we were young can sure HEAR the difference. Jean Redpath's voice seems to be more expressive now than when she showed up unannounced at the first University Of Chicago Folk Festival in 1961. Then again, Jean Ritchie has the same lovely voice she had when she made her ten-inch LP for Elektra called "Jean Ritchie sings the traditional songs of her Kentucky mountain family". I guess the difference can be found in our genes. (Or should I say our JEANS.) pun intended !!!

Art Thieme


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Deni
Date: 27 Jun 01 - 12:36 AM

Where have all the women gone? when I worked on a radio prog about the menopause - sorry about the spelling before - the phone lines were screaming with desperate calls frm women. but here it really seems that the men are the new women, as it said in an earlier thread. Seriously though, I've had a low voice since I was eight or nine and now I'm, 39 forever, I just wondered if I'd eventualy end up a bass-baritone!!!! D


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: balladeer
Date: 27 Jun 01 - 12:42 AM

I have found a product called Hydrasense very helpful. Sold over the counter at drugstores, it's desalinated sea water under pressure. You squirt it up your nose and it helps rehydrate and replace the fluids your sinuses stop producing so much of post-fifty. I had lost my voice altogether, then recovered it partially but unpredictably. Now it's the best voice I've ever had, though significantly plummier than when I was a girl. I just used it to record my debut CD (which, BTW, will be released at the Free Times Cafe in Toronto on October 27th). Good luck and good health!


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 27 Jun 01 - 01:53 AM

As long as you keep it lubricated and excercised, it shouldn't be a problem. If you are worried about HRT for Osteo reasons, drink milk. Nice and thick, it coats the throat, and full of calcium, it will keep your bones doing OK.

Little old ladies are usually afraid to open their mouths and sing properly, because their teeth fall out. Those who sing with a quavery voice, probably don't sing much at all... Listen to Gracie Fields or Vera Lynn (pause to spit over left shoulder) - their voices are/were just as powerful in 1970's as they were in the 1940's. Vera is just as strong now, 20 years after that!

Don't take up smoking, or try and give up if you do already. Avoid singing in smoky bars/houses (the Roy Castle/lung cancer thing - taking deep breaths of other smoke is as bad as doing it yourself). Take it easy on the alcohol, particularly the rough stuff like scotch or gin - that's why Lauren Bacall sounds the way she does - I found a half and half mix of good port and brandy is a nice lubricant, and such a pretty colour.

Your voice might deepen a little, but that's just normal, because as with everything, things take a little longer to bounce back, elasticity goes in all things..... Mine went a bit plummy when I hit puberty.... with practice I can still hit the top B's and C's (that's 2 octaves above middle C) I was getting easily 10 - 15 years ago, but it gets harder the less I do it.

Regular excercise for your larynx is good too, sing regularly, join a choir or a band, or a club where you can sing along. Or just set aside an afternoon each week where you do nothing but sing for 3 hours.

Hope this has been helpful - I'm waiting for mine, reckon I've got another 5 - 8 years to go.....

LTS


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Mudlark
Date: 27 Jun 01 - 02:16 AM

I lost my singing voice when menopause hit....no wonder I was so bitchy for a while. I quit performing, quit even playing my guitar for a long time, but I never quit singing...while doing dishes, in the shower, whenever. And lo and behold, in a year or so it came back. It's deeper now, and range is a tad more limited. But it has gained tremendously in power and strength....when I was younger I had no volume at all...now I can really belt a song out, if needed.

I researched HRT exhaustively and (so far, at least) have decided to go with the finding that taking calcium/magnesium (2:1 ratio, 1000 mg cal./500 mg mag) plus regular load bearing exercise like walking briskly is better protection for bones than anything else, including HRT. And with no bad side effects and lots of good ones.

In a culture that fears age, menopause is a bugbear.....wrong, all wrong. Transition may be difficult, more for some than others, but ultimately it is all about growth and freedom and maturity in the best sense of the word. You go girl!.......just keep singing!

Nancy


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: katlaughing
Date: 27 Jun 01 - 02:43 AM

I haven't noticed the pausing of men to have any effect on my voice:-) and I went through it fairly early late 30's/early 40's) partly from being spayed when even younger (26). The meds I take for my heart do dry me out a bit, but I also use a saline spray up my nose which helps; over here it's called "Ocean Spray" but the generic is the same stuff and just as good. I agree with the advice to use your voice in singing etc. as much as possible without straining it. Since I've begun to sing regularly for the first time in years, I've noticed my vioce growing stronger and improving, kind of like tuning up an old car that sat in a weed patch. Get the carbs cleaned out, gap the points proper, chang the plugs and listen to that baby hum.**BG**

The best thing you can do for your bones, besides the exeeercises noted above, is not drink any carbonated drinks, i.e. sodas. The carbonation leaches calcium from your bones.

I didn't have much difficulty, just a few months of night sweats and sleeplessness. I did tincture of dandelion root and motherwort in a small bit of spring water, 4-5 times per day and it really got me through the rough patches. I used those herbs off and on for about 2 years.

After researching and writing a piece on where the brand drug "Premarin" came from, pregnant mares' urine, I urged every woman I knew to refuse to use it because of the cruelty and, demand synthetics or other natural alternatives. Fortunately, it seems this has become more mainstream.

I highly recommned Susan Weed's book, Menopausal Years, The Wise Womens' Way.

Men go through menopause(1) / menopause (2) too, it's just not as recognised or talked about.

Good luck,

kat


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Steve Parkes
Date: 27 Jun 01 - 04:40 AM

Yes, I noticed the high proportion of men on this thread: I suppose it's because we feel duty-bound to discuss a subject that was not open for discussion by our fathers andf grandfathers--and indeed by our mothers and grandmothers. And because of the high proportion of smart-arses as well ...

If you're concerned about osteoporosis (and you should be, in this man's opinion), you need to start young--get your young teenager daughters into the healthy excercise habit, make them walk to the shops ... OK, I'll get off my male soap-box!

I will pass on this observation, though: since Sue had her hysterectomy and went on to two HRT patches a week, instead of a few fraught days once a month, we now get two fraught evenings every week!

Steve

P.S. And she still can't sing for toffee!


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Peg
Date: 27 Jun 01 - 09:14 AM

thanks to those who disagree that hormone replacement therapy is always trhe solution to problems of menopause. It carries its own risks and problems and is known for some bad side effects in some women.

There are a great many holistic solutions to deal with menopause and I would think some of these would help any vocal problems too.

Susan Weed's book "A Wise Woman's Herbal fo the Menopausal Years" offers many herbal remedies for the same problems meant to be helped by HRT; but with NO risks or side effects.

There is also a great book called "Creative Menopause" with lots of meditations, exercises and tips for healthier living.

The impetus behind pushing HRT on every menopausal woman is not all that different from the assumption that a hysterectomy is the most effective way to solve "female problems." IMHO.

Peg


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: MMario
Date: 27 Jun 01 - 09:21 AM

I am certainly sorry if my comments were in any way taken to trivialize the effects of menopause on women. However I would like to point out that a women going through menopause usually effects a number of other people then herself. It is a difficult thing for men to understand -(heck - we don't do to good a job understanding much about women!) and as I said I am now watching my third generation of women in my family pass through menopause - in a family that undergoes both early onset and protracted duration. (twenty some odd years for both my grandmother and mother)


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Llanfair
Date: 27 Jun 01 - 09:50 AM

That's much better!!! My symptoms are easing now, after almost two years. Just remember that it does pass, and it is important to look after yourself, and deal with each discomfort as it arises, using any form of therapy that suits YOU.
Doctors and other therapists cannot know how you feel, so you have to tell them, and don't be fobbed off with universal panacaea to give them a quiet life.
Cheers, Bron.


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Bert
Date: 27 Jun 01 - 12:37 PM

And be careful with the calcium supplements too, they can cause kidney stones.


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: GUEST,mgarvey@pacifier.com
Date: 27 Jun 01 - 07:21 PM

I would definitely see a naturopath if unpleasant symptoms are experienced. I think the default is supposed to be fairly easy...and wonder how many problems are really dietary...particularly now our phobia about fats...better to develop a phobia about white flour and sugar (which I keep trying to do), eat no artificially produced fats, and eat a certain amount of olive oil, flaxseed oil, walnut oil, BUTTER, CREAM and CHOCOLATE and COCONUT. Better yet all at once. A whole lot of ailments, particularly surrounding the hormonal system, are affected by fatty acids, and an excess of insulin/sugar in the blood. And get some sunshine and fresh air. Lack of sunshine and vitamin D is linked to osteoporosis. mg


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: MAG (inactive)
Date: 27 Jun 01 - 08:38 PM

53 sounds good, Bron; I'll be there this year.

HRT -- I use because heart problems run in my family. It is NOT recommended if you have cancer in yours.

and research, research, research before you take it -- if you have a doctor trying to ram it down your throat, change doctors.

the heavy allergens where I live now are a much worse problem for my voice.


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: GUEST,b;t
Date: 27 Jun 01 - 09:21 PM

It's really wonderful to read postings from women about this subject--the Mudcat sometimes seems to be dominated by a male perspective and/or opinions--I'm turning 50 this year and began to have premenopausal symptoms when I was in my mid-40s, mostly due to stress. I haven't noticed any vocal problems or changes, except feeling more insecure about singing in public, which seems more related to having less time than premenopause. I think that my voice changes with how much loving care I invest in it, like everything else. When I don't sing very much, my voice sounds rusty; when I sing daily, warm-up with scales (I think there was a great thread on how to warmup vocally not too long ago), and stop being so damn self-critical, my voice sounds more relaxed. It wouldn't surprise me if menopause had an impact, although I think it would be based on both hormonal and emotional changes. A voice is the sound of the soul, and during menopause, one's soul goes through quite a transformation.

blt


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: GUEST,moonwoman18@home.com
Date: 27 Jun 01 - 10:31 PM

I am a 58 year old woman who has been singing most of her life. The only thing different about my voice now is that I use it to say just about anything to anybody! Age is a wonderful gift, especially to inhibitions. I still sing regularly with two other women. We sing and play in a bar in Newport, RI, and have a great time. My voice is lower, but then, it always was low. We do bluegrass and old-timey music, with fiddle, guitar, and banjo. And yes, I do HRT and lots of tofu. Diana


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Deni
Date: 28 Jun 01 - 01:12 AM

Lots of women there! Kidney stones,dry nasal passages. Lots to look forward too. But some of the men are sounding positively supportive. Good on you chaps, we'll support you if you get prostate troubles. Cheers all. some really good points.

Deni


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: harriet
Date: 28 Jun 01 - 10:09 AM

I never had a problem, but then again, some people say I never had a voice to begin with.


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Mr Red
Date: 28 Jun 01 - 06:22 PM

Yep, heard of
along with other drynesses
50% of women have some menopausal symptoms, 30% prety bad
I have lived through 2 of the latter,
irrationality (more than the norm) is another symptom, and how do you reason with irrationality .... viz "OH you can't blame it on that!" kind of killer argument.
I usually counsel younger people to mug-up on the subject before it happens - especially men - they won't know what hit them otherwise. Or when.
I didn't.


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Fortunato
Date: 29 Jun 01 - 01:09 PM

Here's something interesting on this topic:
Soy product intake and hot flashes in Japanese women: results from a community-based prospective study.
Nagata C, Takatsuka N, Kawakami N, Shimizu H.
Department of Public Health, Gifu University School of Medicine, Gifu, Japan.
The association between soy product intake and the occurrence of hot flashes was examined in a cohort of 1,106 female residents of Takayama, Gifu, JAPAN: The women were aged 35-54 years and premenopausal at their entry into the study in 1992. Diet, including intake of soy products and isoflavones, was assessed by means of a validated semiquantitative food frequency questionnaire atstudy entry. A follow-up mail questionnaire asking about experiences of hot flashes was sent in 1998. During the 6 years of the study period, 101 women had new moderate or severe hot flashes according to the Kupperman test of menopausal distress. After data were controlled for age, total energy intake, and menopausal status, hot flashes were significantly inversely associated with consumption of soy products in terms of both total amount (highest tertile of soy product intake(g/day) vs. lowest: hazard ratio = 0.47; 95% confidence interval: 0.28, 0.79; p for trend = 0.005) and isoflavone intake (highest tertile of isoflavone intake (mg/day) vs. lowest: hazard ratio = 0.42; 95% confidence interval: 0.25, 0.72; p for trend = 0.002). These data suggest that consumption of soy products has a protective effect against hot flashes. PMID: 11296152 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
This from National Institutes of Health
PubMED:http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/PubMed/


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Shall
Date: 29 Jun 01 - 03:00 PM

It is so good to read feed back about the NORMAL funtion in an older womans life. Menopause is not a disease. I have to be honest at 51 years old.....it is a hot time in the city, my body is hot and sweaty. The heat slowly creeps up on me and then hits me with a firebolt, lasting until my hair is soaking wet. Yuck. My band partners (all men) and friends have noticed the big drips of sweat dropping off my nose on to the fiddle. The question of the day seems to be not what tune we are going to do but "Hey Shar, are you okay? Your face is really red.You look damn hot!" I am holding on for dear life. Don't dare drink beer and wine, adding fuel to the fire. My poor hubby of 32 years is roaming around the house late at night looking for me, I am trying to find a cool dry place to bed down, NAKED. I have waited all these years to expereince the true "HOT FLASH". I Just finished reading a very interesting book by John R. Lee, M.D. and Virginia Hopkins. "What Your Doctor May Not Tell You about Menopause.The breakthrough book on NATURAL PROGESTERONE." VErrrrrry intersting. I checked out the health food store and found Pro-Gest body creme, on special, a Twin pack of 2oz tubes for $39.00. The company's name is "Emerita", the name is derived from the Latin, meaning "A woman who has achieved a place of honor". I am going to check out their web site: www.transitionsforhealth.com. Shar


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Llanfair
Date: 29 Jun 01 - 03:43 PM

Shall, this, too, will pass! I moved the bed to the window, and invested in a fan, a big one. The dripping face is a phenomenon no-one talks about, and the sweat comes from UNDER the eyes, so sweatbands are useless!!
When the flushes (that's what we call them in the UK, though yours is much more expressive) begin, they seem to start just above my elbows, and radiate from there. They aren't so bad now.
I never wear polyester, or any non-natural fibres, and nylon raincoats are a no-no....I discovered the true meaning of Boil-in-the-Bag wearing one of those!!!!!!
Oh, one last thing, the flushes occur more when the bladder is full. I have no idea why.
Cheers, Bron.


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Mr Red
Date: 30 Jun 01 - 09:25 AM

Soy Sauce contains phyto oestrogens (spelling?) so do tomatoes.
I never saw a serious study that demonstrated that the phyto variety had similar effects.
The woman I tried to help was so negative - especially during episodes (and phases thereof) of HRT I never got to see if soy and soya were any use.
HRT is another minefield, on some people it works wonders, on some you have to try three formulations, some people give-up on it - especially negative people.
I have seen the same conflicting reports on the male version of HRT
good luck


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Shall
Date: 30 Jun 01 - 11:20 AM

Thank you for the impute fellow Mudcatters. I will take more notice of when my wonderful occurance drop in. I have noticed that smoking a fag/Cig. encourages the heat up. Soooooo.... I am cutting back, with a goal to quit smoking. It is tough when the entire band lights up. But I know in the long run I'll be far better off. I tried the soy suppliment...no noticable relief. I also have to watch the estrogen intake due to breast cancer issues.I am trying to drink more water, flushing out the impurities, or maybe becoming a "hot spring", rent myself out as a spa! I like tomatoes but have found that I have to be careful, seems eggplant, potatoes and tomatoes make my joints ache...nightshades I do beleive. The boiling bag line was perfect! Be there, done that. Cotton is the fabric of choice, well next to no clothing at all. I told my husband I am in training to be a nudie. Cool and calm (hah) in West Virginia....Shar


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Robin2
Date: 30 Jun 01 - 10:37 PM

gee, ladies, this subject is great to read!
I woke up one morning(really) and discovered I was a baritone! But I like my voice better, before it seemed thin, now I seem to be able to sing with more power (but with a more limited range).
I finally looked up "menopause symptoms" on the 'net, (i'm 47), and realized a lot of what's going on with me is pre-menopausal stuff. I feel relieved to be reaching this stage of my life, and I appreciate hearing from other catters that are going through it!
Robin


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Ferrara
Date: 01 Jul 01 - 09:56 AM

Well, I'm 59 now, had a late menopause, but it's hard to separate the effects of menopause from the effects of the transplant drugs, which include prednisone.

My voice has been better since the transplant, and it's getting stronger, clearer and warmer every year. My range is not any lower, in fact I'm reaching high and low notes more easily. But one of my meds does in fact thicken the vocal chords.

It's hard to pinpoint when menopause began for me. The labs were contradictory. But I've been definitely menopausal for at least the last two years; my voice just keeps getting better.

LLanfair, thanks for mentioning the fact that a full bladder makes it worse. I agree. I talked this over with my doctor. Being a man, he didn't mention menopause at all, but he told me I was experiencing "cholinergic" symptoms. They include a sharp feeling of heat throughout the body, as well as a crazy "antsy-ness". Stress of any kind can cause cholinergic symptoms, he said. They're sometimes related to hives. So, like most everybody else here, I'd say to keep yourself hydrated; in addition, as soon as you start feeling you have to go to the bathroom, do so if it's practical. Don't wait, it makes everything worse. Very strange but true.

Has anyone heard anything about WHY menopause would affect a woman's voice? What is the mechanism?


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Alice
Date: 01 Jul 01 - 10:10 AM

Before we reach menopause, we women are all premenopausal. The stage is called "perimenopause" when we begin to lose the estrogen production connected to ovulation. I haven't noticed any changes to the range of my voice. I really believe range is more affected by how you use and take care of your voice, but each person's experience is unique. I, too, notice that I've grown more of a backbone, figuratively, and have more courage to stand up for myself and my opinions.

Mr. Red, your comment of "irrationality (more than the norm) is another symptom," shows just how much women are still labeled with prejudicial and false stereotypes. Being irrational has nothing to do with gender, but it is a stereotype of women that has been perpetuated for a very long time, continues to be stated, joked about, or believed without question, regardless of the facts. I have known just as many men to be irrational as I've known women to be.


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: balladeer
Date: 01 Jul 01 - 04:55 PM

Ferrara, decrease in "female" hormones, increase in "male."


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: GUEST,Ickle dorritt
Date: 01 Jul 01 - 05:19 PM


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: GUEST,Ickle Dorritt
Date: 01 Jul 01 - 05:22 PM

I tell you what -you lot keep worrying about your voices -I'll worry about my sex life. Ickle (still hanging in at 45)


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: GUEST,Celtic Soul
Date: 01 Jul 01 - 08:01 PM

Deni.

As a perimenopausal singer, and from what I have been told by friends who sing and who have gone through the whole shebang, it can have differing effects on differing women.

For a friend of mine who sings Irish music locally here in the DC area, but who was operatically trained, she says that she has noticed her midrange failing on her sooner than in earlier years.

For me, I have noticed a lowering of my range, though not a lessening (I have a lower lowest note, and a lower highest note, but still have my same approximate slightly less than 3 octaves).

I have noticed that some female singers over a certain age tend not to be able to project as they once did in youth, though I do not know if it is menopausal in origin. As an example, Dinah Shore lost a great deal of her oomph during her talk show years, but had quite a lot more control and power when she was younger (and boy-howdy, am I showing my age on that one!)

I think that there is no hard and fast answer here. What may happen to one woman may never occur for another. It would probably be best for each of us to wait and see what our personal experience is, and then figure it out from there. :D


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Judy Predmore
Date: 01 Jul 01 - 10:18 PM

Lots of great info. Don't thread creep just because I'm going to vent one of my pet peeves: I have two words to say about how male hormones can make men irrational & unsuited for positions of responsibility: Bill, Clinton. (And I'm a flaming liberal...)

Now back to all that useful info & feedback from all ages & genders...


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Mr Red
Date: 02 Jul 01 - 02:16 PM

Alice

Sorry to confuse
I was referring to one person and the relative "irrationalities" before and after, particularly with HRT.

It is a common observation that a lot of divorces in long term marriages get blamed on the outward symptoms of menopause.
In my limited experience it menopause tends to accentuate resident characteristics.
I knew one lass who had no problems, she was placid and a really nice person. I make the connection.
I've known irrational men, but most of the gender sniping is about differences that clearly exist. Women call it intuition men have a different take on it - by and large.
Vivre la difference (notice the gender there?)


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Bluegrass Girl
Date: 02 Jul 01 - 03:59 PM

Really enjoyed this thread! My opinion (and have been through the dreaded MP) -- it's all a matter of attitude!

Hot Flashes were a lot like orgasms -- but they were from the waist up this time. Embrace life in all its forms and at all ages.

Pleased to report (at 61) that this is the "best age to be" -- a thought I've had through all the ages.

Do consider the positive points when looking into HRT. I take hormones -- although they did stop those lovely flashes!


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Deni
Date: 04 Jul 01 - 05:43 AM

This news from Bluegrass Girl has to be worth a refresh.

'Hot Flashes were a lot like orgasms -- but they were from the waist up this time. Embrace life in all its forms and at all ages.'

Still dreading the menopause after hearing that? I don't think so!

D


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Kaleea
Date: 05 Jul 01 - 12:44 AM

How about an opinion from a voice instructor? Just as menopause differs from woman to woman, the effects on the voice differ. What I have ascertained is that when one is a properly trained vocalist--trained in the "Belle Conto" method which is the preferred method in most of the world, one has an instrument which is open and full, and muscles which are strong and resilient. If the vocal folds (they are actually folds of tissue, not "chords" or "cords") of a trained vocalist are well excercised on a regular basis throughout one's singing life, one will not experience tremendously noticeable effects of menopause, providing, of course, that one takes care to ensure proper nutrition, etc. and a healthy lifestyle. Alcohol and smoking (to include second hand smoke!) are quite damaging to the vocal folds whether one is 20 or 60, as are pollution and many everyday chemicals and cleaning solutions. I have had female voice students who have come to me after they retired to seek the vocal training they always wanted but never had the opportunity for. These women have enjoyed beautiful singing voices-provided that the talent was inherently there. Our larynx moves over the years and that is why we hear the noticeable difference from earlier to later decades, in addition to other health situations, of course. In summation, menopause need have no noticeable effect upon your voice if you are healthy and vocalize regularly. The most important thing you can do is to seek proper vocal instruction no matter what your age.


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Subject: RE: Help: Menapause. Effect on the voice?
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 05 Jul 01 - 01:27 AM

Sorry, couple of phrases there I didn't recognise - sex life and orgasms..... can anyone remind me what these are please??!!!

*BG*

LTS


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