Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Waddon Pete
Date: 02 Mar 11 - 04:57 AM

Thinking about Catford Dick, it was Dave Cooper along with Jacquie and Ed(The Chapmen?)who started the club (Phoebus Awakes)way back in the day. It was the first Folk Club as such that I had visited and it was a fine introduction to the music.

Best wishes,

Peter

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Splott Man
Date: 02 Mar 11 - 04:01 AM

I was (and still am) too young to remember Theo Johnson, but I remember one of his songs: The Dirge of a Disgruntled Cow After Artificial Insemination.

Splott Man

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 01 Mar 11 - 01:55 PM

I met Dave Cooper at the EFDSS London folk festival (in 1969, I think), as a result of which I visited both the Rising Sun and Dennis Manners' Towersey Folk Club (Dave gave me a lift to both, and to me and John Kirkpatrick to Towersey).

Kitty

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: GUEST,PW
Date: 01 Mar 11 - 01:49 PM

Does anyone here have memories of Theo Johnson? He ran the Barge in Kingston in the 60s and (is this right?) Bunjies as well. I've collected what I know here:
http://sandydenny.blogspot.com/2010/10/theo-sailor.html
The last sighting of him was in the Half Moon, Putney, late 70s or early 80s, where he took an interest in the young Eddi Reader.

@John MacKenzie: the Dave Cousins song you mention sounds lke 'Pieces of 79 and 15'. It's on the Strawbs' eponymous 1969 album.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: JohnH
Date: 01 Mar 11 - 09:09 AM

I've just been pointed to this thread and my afternoon is now ruined! Hi! Jane and Bonnie!
If there's anyone who used to go to Phoebus Awakes and lives near Bury St. Edmunds, there are a couple of monthly pub sessions locally that Dave Cooper, Pete Twitchett and I go to and we'd love to meet you again.
Send me a PM if you want details.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: GUEST,Guest cookiless Kevin Sheils on different m
Date: 01 Mar 11 - 05:36 AM

Jack and Margaret - I doubt if the faces that go with the names look too much like the faces you would have remembered anyway!

Joan - I never went to the Scots House (Hoose?) in it;s Ballads and Blues days but there was still a club running later than that which I wnt to onec or twice.

Can only recall seeing Bert Jansch and possibly Alex Campbell there though. And if my memory is OK the Spice of Life is the same place

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 28 Feb 11 - 02:56 PM

Refresh

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: GUEST,John MacKenzie
Date: 27 Feb 11 - 06:15 PM

Look under Bruce Dunnet

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: The Sandman
Date: 27 Feb 11 - 05:52 PM

Phoebus Awakes, now who ran it before Dave Cooper?, was it the guy who went on to organise the club at Cowden pound, was it Tony Deane?

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Waddon Pete
Date: 27 Feb 11 - 03:06 PM

Yes...the Rising Sun in Catford was the starting place and watering hole for a goodly number of singers, performers and audience! Some-one ought to write a book! There was the visit of members of the Vienna Boys Choir and also the morris team trying to dance under that strange monstrosity they added to the back room! Then there was the Royal Toby!

Good times and chorus singing that could raise the roof in perfect harmony!

Best wishes,

Peter

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: GUEST,Joan Crump
Date: 27 Feb 11 - 10:32 AM

Guest above is me.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Feb 11 - 10:30 AM

Can anyone tell me any more about the Scots Hoose in Cambridge Circus? I saw a mention of it by Peter Bellamy in an old video last night, and was taken aback as I worked in the pub which I believe replaced it, The Spice of Life, in the early 90s. Wikipedia tells me the Ballads and Blues Club was based there for a while, but I'm not sure this is true. Is it?

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: janemick
Date: 27 Feb 11 - 07:26 AM

Coo, The Rising Sun at Catford was the scene of my debut, around 1972.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: GUEST,John MacKenzie
Date: 27 Feb 11 - 06:59 AM

Dave Cousins also did an interminable, and for my taste, somewhat boring song, called something like 'Pieces of 79 & 16'. Apparently these were the house numbers of previous addresses. It was very 60's and somewhat pretentious, as a song, I thought.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: GUEST,Jack& Margaret King
Date: 27 Feb 11 - 04:44 AM

Many thanks for the kind words seligmansson and our best wishes are sent in return. It's always nice to be appreciated but in our turn we would pay tribute to our loyal & faithful ( and sometimes pee- taking ) audience. Sorry after all these years we cant put a face to a name put it down to galloping senility
                      Thanks again J&M

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Rusty Dobro
Date: 26 Feb 11 - 03:54 PM

Good to see mention of the White Bear, Hounslow. Fond memories of Dave Cousins singing 'Vision of the Lady of the Lake' - the only thing that took longer was the wait for Mungo Jerry to arrive - always on their way but never quite arrived.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Max Johnson
Date: 26 Feb 11 - 11:01 AM

Whoever asked about the Fulham Club on Lilley Road, I think it was the Golden Lion.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: GUEST,seligmanson
Date: 25 Feb 11 - 09:39 PM

I know this posting is a bit late, but nevertheless: It's good to know that Jack and Maragert King are well. I recall a great deal of what most of you have been describing, having been to most of these places and sung in many of them - anybody remember Karl Dallas's London Folk Centre? - and, as a member of McColl's Critics Group, having been a one-time regular at the Singer's Club; and I have no doubts in my own mind that the best club was the Cellar Club when J&K were running it. I'd like to thank then now for the great memories I have of that place, even after all these years.Thanks guys.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: The Sandman
Date: 15 Feb 11 - 12:58 PM

HERE HE IS AGAIN.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMF4rpk_f-o what a great bloke

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: The Sandman
Date: 15 Feb 11 - 12:49 PM

here is Dave Roberts in his prime, Dave was a great bloke, and really easy to work with.hope you enjoy this. he used to do this dance at stratford folk club on occasions, R I P Dave.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-rzRdgsquak

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Max Johnson
Date: 15 Feb 11 - 12:04 PM

Yep - I remember the ladies' panto with Sandra dressed as a fairy! I'm really wallowing in nostalgia now. Haven't wallowed like this for ages, in fact.
I missed Charlies Angels though :-(

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Kevin Sheils
Date: 15 Feb 11 - 04:47 AM

Just mentioned it to Sandra, Kitty, and she remembers Dave in the Nappy but that year she claims she and her flatmates went as Charlie's Angels not as a fairy, although I remember her as a fairy in one of the Blackbird's Ladies Christmas pantomimes around that time.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Kevin Sheils
Date: 15 Feb 11 - 04:43 AM

Not me Kitty!

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 14 Feb 11 - 07:33 PM

I remember when Puddleduck played for an Earls' Christmas party, dancing the Dorset 4 hand reel. Of the other 3 hands, one was Dave Roberts dressed as a baby in a (largish) nappy, and one was Sandra dressed as a fairy. Wish I could remember (after about 35 years) who was the 4th...

Kitty

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: The Sandman
Date: 14 Feb 11 - 02:21 PM

I moved to Suffolk in 78, so I not sure what happened at the Blackbirds once I was away.
I do remember Derek Brimstone having a great night at the Blackbirds, he did a couple [at least] of encores and he said to me and Derek Simpson "what a great club it was".

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Kevin Sheils
Date: 14 Feb 11 - 01:09 PM

Max, ah the dejeuners, what good fun they were. I still see the main organisers from time to time.

Yes the Blackbirds predated the Chestnuts, Dick, I though I'd made that clear when I posted that the Blackbirds and Navy Boot (Alan Bearman's Sunday club) joined together to form the Chestnuts.

Although not a direct descendent of the Chestnuts, as they ran parallel and mutually co-operative for a while, Walthamstow Folk is still going strong on Sunday nights and now we're back at the Rose and Crown getting full houses. And we still have links back to the old Tower club as Dympna (Messenger that was) drops in from time to time and very occasionally her sister Sheila.

Mind you I still have links at Waltamstow to the old Enterprise at Chalk farm as at least one of our regulars was also a regular there in the late 60's and early 70s

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Max Johnson
Date: 14 Feb 11 - 11:35 AM

I posted here,I thought, to ask if anyone remembered the string quartet who used to play Haydn at the dejeuners in Highams Park. They were really good!

But the post isn't here, so I must have posted it somewhere else.
Wonder where?

Schweik - the Walthamstow club was the Chestnut Tree.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: The Sandman
Date: 14 Feb 11 - 10:56 AM

Chris Timson[concertina chap]AnnGregson and Dave Rennolds[ he who accidentally introduced June Tabor as Jane Tuba.Dave Rennolds
AKA Somerset Dave, although he was from gloucestershire
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eek7M_nn3Q

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: The Sandman
Date: 14 Feb 11 - 10:25 AM

the folk club that Dave Roberts/DaveSurman was involved in was Stratford folk club held at Stage One, Deanery Road, wednesday night, we booked Bonnie Shaljean when she was with Catchpenny.
I was also involved with the Three Blackbirds on a Friday night, this had previously been the Tower folk club, Rip Rippingale and EdCaines Rob Neal,Derek Simpson, had been involved with it, it moved downstairs and became the Three Blackbirds.
Alan Bearman started a folk club in walthamstow[I think] on a sunday, sometime after the other two clubs had been running.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 14 Feb 11 - 10:21 AM

I remember it too... wow, that was a long time ago! Lotta water under the bridge since them days -

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: The Sandman
Date: 14 Feb 11 - 10:17 AM

the folk club that Dave Roberts was involved in was Stratford folk club held at Stage One, Deanery Road, wednesday night, we booked Bonnie Shaljean when she was with Catchpenny.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Manitas_at_home
Date: 14 Feb 11 - 07:55 AM

I remember the dejeuners in Highams Park. I don't think they were Dave's or the Earls but were held by associated folks and regularly attended by the Earls. There were also the Olympics by the ponds on Wanstead Flats.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Max Johnson
Date: 13 Feb 11 - 01:20 PM

Wotcher, Kevin!

Yes, you're right. I remember the Chestnuts opening - what a great club - hope it's still running. I'm sure I recall that The Blackbirds and the Chestnuts ran contemporaneously (:-O) for a while.

What I can't remember is, did they both do a Ladies' Christmas Panto in the same year? Those Ladies' Pantos were simply awesome! And very, very funny.

Do you remember Dave Roberts' (and other Earls of Essex's) summer Dejeurners?

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Kevin Sheils
Date: 13 Feb 11 - 12:14 PM

The Three Blackbirds in Leyton IIRC merged with the Navy Boot Club in Walthamstow at the The Lord Brooke to form The Chestnuts Club at the Chestnut Tree Lea Bridge Road. The merger was 1978 I recall, Max.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 13 Feb 11 - 09:02 AM

Yep, that rings a bell with me, Max - they had a bomb scare while we were doing a gig there, so everybody had to troop outside and stand around. It was during the time I had that tiny old antique harmonium and I think we carried that out too, probably to while the time away playing. Great club -

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Max Johnson
Date: 13 Feb 11 - 08:41 AM

Thanks Jock (Pogue Mahone), but I meant the other one, on the corner of Earls Court Road and Old Brompton Road. I think it's changed its name to O' Neills now. Less threatening than the Coleherne, but with a similar clientele. I lived next door, on Old Brompton Road.

To those trying to remember the name of the East End club, Was it the Three Blackbirds in Leyton/Walthamstow?

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 13 Feb 11 - 04:47 AM

It was the Coleherne, Max J

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: GUEST,Max Johnson
Date: 06 Feb 11 - 08:43 AM

Mick Penning.

Cheer up mate - if you got paid, it was a successful gig.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: GUEST,Max Johnson
Date: 06 Feb 11 - 08:04 AM

I'm a bit late to this party, but nm.

I used to have a flat in the mansion block directly opposite the Troubadour. Eric Leggoe and I used to sing there (First time we went, we spent the evening and got drunk on bootleg likker with Red Sullivan - the Troub was dry). When Threadbare Consort formed we used to go over after rehearsals. What a wonderful little club!
I'm trying to remember what the other leather bar was called. It was my local. (Yes it was!)

The 'Long Lankin with strobes' sounds very Magic Lantern - could it have been them? (Although they'd probably have used a torch with a windmill on the end and achieved the same effect).

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: GUEST,Mick Penning -Stoke
Date: 05 Feb 11 - 06:25 PM

Stumbled onto this site from (I think), checking out Nat Gonella. Don't no why I should get 'Folk' in my head whilst on Jazz, but anyway, I then saw, 'Does anyone remember the Nags Head, York Rd Battersea? I'll say I remember it. It featured in 'kicking off my 'career' as a 'named' Artiste on the Circuit (billed in the Melody Maker)-and ended it the same night!!!!!! A complete drunken disaster. Anyone unfortunate to have been there on that fateful night cannot but forget it.
It's a long story and the devil is in the detail, but to 'cut a strong hoary wart' -the first set (of two, with interval) -lived up to all the promise of my 'floor-spot' a month earlier, which had itself gone to secure the booking, 'top of the bill'..... the big time.
I was, at the time 'to-ing and fro-ing' between London and Paris -Busking in both cities... but with the intention of settling in Paris (which I did for a couple of years). Anyway, 'lodging in Fulham' at the time, I paid a 'chance' visit to the Nags Head, with guitar -hoping to get a 'floor spot' -not only did I get one -but I went down a bomb. So much did they all like my performance -a mixed bag of stuff, some originals from a fellow Stokie, that I was booked for late January -1973.
On the night, a mixture of elation and nerves -and a growing feeling that I had 'bitten off more than I could chew' (my fellow Stokie, on hearing of my success at getting the gig, shocked me by refusing to use any more of his stuff -his original material). I needed it to have enough for two sets -without struggling. I'd been too hasty -clutching at a chance in a million, taking the booking before consulting the gods.
Consequently, after the first set, as I said, going down really well, I had already had four pints of strong ale, nerves and a sense of impending disaster led me to 'neck' as much more as I could before going back upstairs to 'face the mob'.
I was kicked out after just two incoherent ramblings -'Here have the money and don't come back' -I can't remember much after that. Just went back to Paris -Charing X to Gare du Nord -and busked.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: GUEST,hippiemalcolm
Date: 23 Jan 11 - 03:46 PM

The "Hole in the Ground' was in the basement of "the witches culdron" a restaurant/cafe in Belsize Village.
The Tinkers played every Friday night in the room above the Three Horseshoes Public House in Hampstead Village.
I still have my membership card to The Country Club behind Belsize Park, but that was too expensive to go to!!

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: GUEST,Marco P. McNeill
Date: 22 Jan 11 - 01:02 PM

http://www.paulmcneill.ch
http://paulmcneill.zimbalam.fr

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: ollaimh
Date: 09 Jan 11 - 05:35 PM

as a postscript to my earlier story. when i was in londan last year i visited the cecil sharpe house singing night. they has post cards for sale. one had ewen mccoll on the telephone and a caption"hello folk police".

it seems lots of folks realize what a pack of bullshit meisters used to pousture about pretending to be traditional folk.

i had to buy a couple

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 08:28 PM

""Is there anyone out there who frequented the pub on Friday nights around 1972/73? Folk Night (upstairs)..... The Nag's Head, York Rd Battersea.""

I was a regular much earlier than that, from about mid 65 till I left London in April 69.

A great club where the organisers took considerable pains to ease the nerves of newcomers.

There was also a Sunday night club out at Wych Cross near Hackney where I did several floor spots in the same period. I've been racking my brains without success and can't remember the name, but it was there that I first saw the very soft voiced John Foreman, the eccentric but utterly likeable Adrian May, and Johnny Silvo, who cleared my sinuses ultrasonically as I sat in the front row in the path of that incredibly powerful voice.

Can anybody refresh my memory as the the name of the club?

Don T.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 05:39 PM

I sure do - Rosemary Webb. She was lovely & warmhearted underneath that starchy exterior, and we shared a love of reading - Jane Austen in particular. Rosemary was the one who turned me onto Mary Webb's Precious Bane and we used to swap/loan books. I believe you're right that she's no longer with us. What a great place that was to work in. What a brill thread this is... gettin' all sentimentyfied just remembering everything...

Bonnie xxx

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: GUEST,Roger Fleming
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 05:05 PM

Hi Bonnie & Barbara,
Do you remember Rosemary (forget her second name) who worked in the upstairs office at CSH. I would think she's no longer with us now.
When I organised the instrumental workshops on Tuesdays and ran the Folk Cellar on Saturday's for a while, payments for myself, the guitar and banjo teachers and the Folk Cellar guests were given through Rosemary who I was in regular contact with for many years.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: The Sandman
Date: 20 Dec 10 - 05:50 PM

ollaimh,great post.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: ollaimh
Date: 19 Dec 10 - 10:35 PM

i once wondered up to the troubadour back in 73 i think. i didn't knw any of the history at the time and played a couple of scottish songs. some git was in my face telling me i shouldn't be playing scottish songs--i had no idea then what he was on about but i supose now he thought i was american. for those who don't know i am a nova scotian franco gael. well i was sitting in the audience duely chasened(from my child hood in the educational system i had learned we were to be duely chasened when anglos told us what to do) and he began to sing the mist covewred mountains of home--well i knew the chorus to that one and started to belt out the classic gaelic chourus!!! i didn't notice they were singing in english, but back home we always sang that chorus in gaelic. well he shut up and i looked around at people gawking at the odd ball(that would be me). years later i realized he was a lowlander pretending to be a gael. i didn't understand that back then but people want to get "folkie cred" by pretending to be gaels.was he hot with me afterwards, he claimed i was trying to publicly embarrase him--i was just singing it the way we did back home. i really wish they would wait to do play gael untill after they have been refused a few jobs or a place in a university course(as i was ) before they play the holy gael.

am i a cynic?YES

there used to be so many poncy gits pretending to be gaels back then who may have once know some one who actualy met and talked to an actual gael once when they were on holiday on skye or ireland. what can i say? that's why for years i stopped calling what i do folk and called it traditional music. now they have co opted the term traditional music so i just say celtic music from nova scotia and new foundland with a few ole vieux acadie chants!!

so other than the occasional lecture i was way too unsophisticated to understand back then( i really was fresh off the turnip truck)i had a great time. and outside i saw the tallest and oddest woman i ahd ever seen. she saw me staring and began to upbraid me. again later i realized she was a he and i was a rube from a place so rural we not only rarely had in door plumbing but had few in door ideas as well. i had at the time worked on a fish boat and in a carpet factory and that was pretty much it, and had dropped out of school so i didn't even have grade twelve.we rural nova scotians used to go to the city and smile and act friendly and expect people would be nice to us--good fucking luck with that!!!!(see bruce cockburns song going down the road for a great story of those days)

now on the bright side i found a home first in a squat huse populated with a couple of finnish dope dealers, a cuban political activist and a couple of buskers-- who were the ones who took me along and showed me the ropes for busking. then the house burnt to the ground and i found a spot on a huge river boat that was divided up into tiny rooms near battersea bridge. last year i went back there and a couple of the old boats were still there but much renovated and much spiffier and up market. we paid fourteen pounds a month for ourpart of the boat. divided three ways--buskers rent for sure. we had parties all the time. i often had to go visit friends to find a place to sleep as my room would have several people passed out thewre when i got home. i still am amazed the police didn't once pay us a visit. we couldn't aford heat, but during the coal strike--the edward heath coal strike--when every one lacked heat we charged a bottle of parafin fuel every so often for entrance to the parties.so we were the only warm place in london that winter.

i didn't go back to the troubador but i'm glad to say i went once. i got into busking and then went over to france and didn't revisit the uk for twenty years, but over all i had a ball there.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Kevin Sheils
Date: 19 Dec 10 - 04:08 AM

Hi Barbara. I remember you.

I still see Dave Armitage at various festivals and have an email for him somewhere. If I can dig it out I'll pass yours on to him.

Subject: RE: Folk Clubs London 1960s & 70s
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 19 Dec 10 - 03:32 AM

BARBARA... WOW!!! I worked upstairs for Miss Gold when you were at CSH, and never would have gotten my job there if it hadn't been for you. I'd done some volunteer typing in the library (remember all those little index cards?) and when they needed to hire someone in the Folk Shop mail order department you rang to tell me about it, and I came in and applied and got the job.

My email is my full name as it appears above, no dots or spaces, at Gmail dot com. I live in an old farmhouse on the south coast of Ireland now. How great to see your post here! Brilliant site, is Mudcat.

Bonnie xxx