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Origins: Wheels of the World
Related threads:
Tune Req: Wheels of the World (6)
Lyr Req: Wheels of the World (3)
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Subject: Wheels of the WOrld From: Scabby Douglas Date: 25 Jul 01 - 08:28 AM Anyone have any words or a source for this song? It's of Irish origin ( I think), and the theme is saying great historical personages were "great spinners". Castlereagh and Napoleon are both mentioned.
The last verse goes something like: "So if you're compelled to go spinning, Cheers SD |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the WOrld From: GUEST,Dita (at work) Date: 25 Jul 01 - 09:22 AM I think Len Graham recorded it on an album called "Do Me Justice". I'll post more details when I get my hands on it, unless somebody beats me to it. love, john |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the WOrld From: GUEST,Martin Ryan Date: 25 Jul 01 - 10:18 AM HERE it is. Regards |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the WOrld From: Scabby Douglas Date: 25 Jul 01 - 11:21 AM Thanks, Martin but that thread has a link to the song "Do Me Justice", not to the one I'm looking for. That fits, though, because the guy I know who sings it also sings THAT one.. Hi John, nice to meet you at last at Bute. How'd the rest of the weekend go? We went for a fish tea at the West End Chippy, and I had a kip on the boat back so that I was fit to drive. Oh, by the way, John, I keep meaning to give you my work mail address... sclark@indigolighthouse.com Cheers Steven |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the WOrld From: Scabby Douglas Date: 25 Jul 01 - 11:50 AM And, the reason I can't get these lyrics from the guy who sings the song is that he's aff to Switzerland for 3 weeks... Cheers SD |
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Subject: Lyr Add: WHEELS OF THE WORLD (traditional Irish) From: Brían Date: 25 Jul 01 - 12:30 PM Here is is: THE WHEELS OF THE WORLD Come all ye true sons of Erin, attend to these few nimble lines I'll sing you a song about spinning, it was a good trade in its time. Some they spun worsted and yarn, others they spun flax and tow By experience, my friends, you can learn how the wheels of the world how they go. William Pitt he was a great spinner, and so was Lord Castlereagh. They spun the Union for Ireland to England they shipped it away. Poor Pitt spun out his existence, then took a long trip on a boat. Then Lord Castlereagh saved the distance,by cutting the rim of his throat. Napolean he was a great spinner, he freedom did always advance. Over deserts and high lofty mountains, he marched the brave sons of France. Old Wellington he went a-spinning, his wheels they were at Waterloo; But if Grouchy had never been bribed, thr French would have split him in two. John Mitchell the true son of Erin, declared that a spinner he'd be. He set all the wheels in motion, his dear native land to set free. But John Bull that crafty old tyrant, at spinning he was fully bent. And to Van Dieman's Land the sons of old Ireland were sent. The factory owners are spinning, ther wheels are turning away. And now they are wanting their hands to work thirteen hours a day. They don't give a fig for the poor, they heed not the sighs or the moans, Don't give a pin if you work 'til you spin all the flesh off your bones. The rich they are all famous spinners, of that we are all very sure. They are always contriving a sceme to crush down the rights of the poor. So if you're compelled to go spinning, let each of your spindles be steel. Let liberty then be your motto, and glory will turn your big wheel. Who makes the rich? The answer is sure. It must be the industrious poor. -James Campbel(1758-18180 Boy, Castlereagh, Napolean and others.one could devote a history class titled The Wheels of the World devoted to this song alone. There is more on the liner notes, but I may dig up some more to post later if anyone is interested. Beidh mé ag caint libh arís, Brían. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the WOrld From: Scabby Douglas Date: 26 Jul 01 - 04:07 AM Many thanks, Brían .. This is exactly what I was looking for - it's a cracker of a song. Cheers SD |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the WOrld From: Brían Date: 26 Jul 01 - 05:01 AM Your welcome, Doug. Brían. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the WOrld From: GUEST,Martin Ryan Date: 29 Jul 01 - 07:28 PM Sorry about that, Doug! Regards |
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Subject: Lyr Add: THE WHEELS OF THE WORLD (from Bodleian) From: Jim Dixon Date: 23 Jun 04 - 09:17 AM From Bodleian Library Broadside Ballads. I have consolidated 3 broadsides: Harding B 20(190), Firth c.14(127), and Harding B 11(4120), which differ only in minor issues of phrasing. My editing consists mainly of selecting the phrases that fit the rhythm best; e.g. "old times" rather than "olden times." Note that there is a chorus and two more verses than the version given above. THE WHEELS OF THE WORLD Come all you true sons of Erin; attend to these few simple lines: I'll sing you a song about spinning. It was a good trade in old times. Some they spun worsted and yarn, and others they spun flax and tow. By experience, my friends, you may learn how the wheels of the world they do go. CHORUS: So these are the wheels of the world, my friends, you must all understand. For three hundred years, they've been spinning destruction all over the land. Luther spun out his existence, and so did King Henry the Eighth. John Calvin by Satan's temptation, their maxims he did imitate. Tom Cranmer he joined the new system, and swore he'd make spindles of steel. Pluto himself did assist them, perdition that turned their wheel. John Mitchell the brave son of Erin, declared that a spinner he'd be. He got all his wheels in full motion, his dear native land to set free. But Lord C—n—n the lieutenant, at spinning he was fully bent, And unto the Isle of Bermuda the sons of Hibernia were sent. Lord Nelson he was a good spinner on board of the ship Victory. He was counted the greatest of spinners that ever set sail on the sea. His shipmen were all famous spinners. For Nelson they spun very well, But the French spun a ball in Trafalgar, and on the ship deck Nelson fell. Billy Pitt too was a good spinner, and so was Lord Castlereagh. Sure they spun out the Union from Ireland. To England they shipped it away. Poor Billy spun out his existence, and banished in Charon's old boat. Then Lord C—— saved his distance, by cutting the rim of his throat. Napoleon he was a good spinner, for freedom did always advance. Over deserts and great lofty mountains, he led on the brave sons of France. Old Wellington he went a-spinning. His wheels they were at Waterloo; But if Grouchy had never been bribed, the French would have split him in two. Prince Albert came spinning to England. His wheel by a compass did steer. He spun out a queen for his consort, and some little thousands a year. John Bull must now go a-spinning. A few thousands more he must fork, For the Queen has another young son that was spun in the city of Cork. The factory masters are spinning. Their wheels they are turning away, And now they are wanting their hands for to work thirteen hours a day. They don't care a fig for the poor. They heed not their sighs nor their moans. They don't care a pin if you work till you spin all the flesh off your bones. The rich they are all famous spinners, and you are very well sure They are always contriving a scheme to crush down the rights of the poor. So if you're compelled to go spinning, let each of your spindles be steel. Let "Liberty" then be your motto, and glory will turn your wheel. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the World From: mikesamwild Date: 30 Apr 10 - 09:06 AM I've been looking for the words. John Doyle and Len Graham sing it. the tune I have is a Slip Jig 9/8 in G major. Also called Red Haired Molly and lots more names( see The Sesiion site) there's also a Reel of the same name, not the same tune! |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the World From: mikesamwild Date: 30 Apr 10 - 09:08 AM One name is TheNight Before larry was Stretched , sounds like another song title? |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the World From: Liberty Boy Date: 01 May 10 - 02:10 AM The tune is a slip jig called Moll Roe or if you like Máire Rua. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the World From: mikesamwild Date: 01 May 10 - 07:55 AM was 'spinning' used commonly to describe wheeling and dealing? Today it's media spin like whipping a top a partuclar way or spin doctoring? |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the World From: GUEST Date: 27 Dec 12 - 05:32 AM He means spinning, as in spinning thread. There are plenty of references "Some they spun worsted and yarn, and others they spun flax and tow." Worsted, yarn, flax and tow are all types of fabric. "So if you're compelled to go spinning, let each of your spindles be steel." Spindles. Those things you use to turn raw wool into thread. "Let "Liberty" then be your motto, and glory will turn your wheel." Turning wheel - to a spinning wheel...those giant wheels you use to, again, turn raw wool into thread. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the World From: GUEST Date: 12 Aug 14 - 01:10 PM THE WHEELS OF THE WORLD Come all ye true sons of Erin, attend to these few nimble lines I'll sing you a song about spinning, it was a good trade in its time. Some they spun worsted and yarn, others they spun flax and tow By experience, my friends, you can learn how the wheels of the world how they go. William Pitt he was a great spinner, and so was Lord Castlereagh. They spun the Union for Ireland to England they shipped it away. Poor Pitt spun out his existence, then took a long trip on a boat. Then Lord Castlereagh saved the distance,by cutting the rim of his throat. Napolean he was a great spinner, he freedom did always advance. Over deserts and high lofty mountains, he marched the brave sons of France. Old Wellington he went a-spinning, his wheels they were at Waterloo; But if Grouchy had never been bribed, thr French would have split him in two. John Mitchell the true son of Erin, declared that a spinner he'd be. He set all the wheels in motion, his dear native land to set free. But John Bull that crafty old tyrant, at spinning he was fully bent. And to Van Dieman's Land the sons of old Ireland were sent. The factory owners are spinning, ther wheels are turning away. And now they are wanting their hands to work thirteen hours a day. They don't give a fig for the poor, they heed not the sighs or the moans, Don't give a pin if you work 'til you spin all the flesh off your bones. The rich they are all famous spinners, of that we are all very sure. They are always contriving a sceme to crush down the rights of the poor. So if you're compelled to go spinning, let each of your spindles be steel. Let liberty then be your motto, and glory will turn your big wheel. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the World From: GUEST,Anne Neilson Date: 12 Aug 14 - 01:45 PM Kevin Mitchell -- originally from Derry but a Glaswegian for the past 40 years or so -- sings a fine version of this, full of passion! |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the World From: dick greenhaus Date: 13 Aug 14 - 01:36 PM Nitchell adds a chorus: "These are the wheels of the world, My friend, you must undestand, For three hundred years they've been spinning DEstruction all over the land." |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the World From: GUEST,Amelia Date: 03 Apr 17 - 01:58 AM If anyone is wondering the female voice in John Doyle's version is Karan Casey. Also I just realized that Erin is synonymous whith Ireland. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the World From: Mo the caller Date: 03 Apr 17 - 11:07 AM The verse seemed when I read it to want to be sung to the Rapper Sword Calling on song "Good people, give ear to my story, we've called for to see you by chance; Five heroes I've brought blithe and bonny, intending to give you a dance". So when I Googled the tune mentioned above and found this the similarities didn't surprise me. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the World From: GUEST,Brian Casley Date: 17 Apr 18 - 10:25 AM John Doyle and Karen Casey do a great version on his album 'Evening Comes Early' |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Wheels of the World From: GUEST,kenny Date: 17 Apr 18 - 12:02 PM I would recommend the version by Donal Maguire. |
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Subject: Origins: Wheels of the World From: Joe Offer Date: 01 May 20 - 04:37 PM Here's the Traditional Ballad Index entry for this song: Wheels of the World, TheDESCRIPTION: Spinners turn the wheels of the world. Some spinners are named with their product: Pitt, Castlereagh, Napoleon, Wellington, John Mitchell, John Bull, factory owners and the rich. "Let liberty be your bright motto and glory will turn your big wheel"AUTHOR: unknown EARLIEST DATE: before 1867 (broadside, Bodleian Harding B 20(190)) KEYWORDS: death suicide exile nonballad political worker Napoleon Ireland FOUND IN: Ireland REFERENCES (1 citation): Moylan 200, "The Wheels of the World" (1 text, 1 tune) Roud #16901 BROADSIDES: Bodleian, Harding B 11(4120), "Wheels of the World" ("Come all you true sons of old Erin"), J. Pitts (London), 1819-1844[?]; also Harding B 20(190) [J. Harkness(Preston), 1840-1866], Firth c.14(127), "Wheels of the World," Firth b.27(49) [mostly illegible and probably trimmed] CROSS-REFERENCES: cf. "The Game of Cards (II)" (subject: the elimination of Grattan's parliament) NOTES [1463 words]: According to "Wheels of the World," Pitt [ "banish'd in Charon's old boat": d.1806] and Castlereagh spun the union of Ireland to England [1800] but were unhappy at the end, and Castlereagh committed suicide [1822]; Napoleon spun freedom and Wellington spun Waterloo [1815] "but if Grouchy had never been bribed sure the French would have split him in two"; John Mitchell spun to free Ireland but John Bull spun him to exile [1848]; factory owners and the rich spin to grind the poor. Broadside Bodleian Harding B 11(4120) mentions other spinners: Luther, Henry VIII, John Calvin, Nelson and the French that killed him at Trafalgar [1805], Prince Albert [1840] and Victoria: "For 300 years they've been spinning, Destruction all over the land." There is a dating problem for broadside Bodleian Harding B 11(4120): it mentions John Mitchel's exile to Bermuda [subsequently Cape Colony and finally to Van Dieman's Land] which occurred after 1844. [I think the problem is an error in the attribution to the printer Pitts; the defaced imprint does not contain his name as it stands, merely the words "toy warehouse." Pitts also owned a toy warehouse, but the appearance of the broadside is unlike any of the other Pitts broadsides I checked. Given that this piece, if circulated in Ireland, would be considered perilously close to treason, I wonder if a printer might not try to fake the attribution. There is probably a good thesis in there somewhere, on broadside printers and their fonts and clip art collections. - RBW] The ballad is recorded on one of the CD's issued around the time of the bicentennial of the 1798 Irish Rebellion. See: Franke Harte and Donal Lunny, "Wheels of the World" (on Franke Harte and Donal Lunny, "1798 the First Year of Liberty," Hummingbird Records HBCD0014 (1998)) - BS It is interesting to note that, of the three legible Bodelian broadsides of this song, only one carries an actual printer's imprint, and that defaced. The Bodleian editors did manage to determine two of the printers, but one of those attributions is questionable -- and it's also interesting that this song of interest primarily to the Irish was printed on British soil. There is much interesting history in this song, which can be dated fairly precisely by the events it mentions. The three legible Bodleian broadsides (Harding B 11(4120), Harding B 20(190), Firth c.14(127)) all have nearly the same text, and must have been printed at about the same time. The references which give us our dates are as follows: "I'll sing you a song about spinning, it was a good trade in its time" -- This might (or might not) refer to the direct control Britain exerted over Irish textile manufacturing; for more on this, see e.g. "The Volunteers' March." "Luther... King Henry the eighth... John Calvin" -- the founders of the three basic branches of non-Catholic Christianity: Protestant (a name falsely applied to all three types), Anglican, and Reformed/Presbyterian. In Protestant England the three were mostly approved of; not so in Catholic Ireland! Thomas ("Tom") Cranmer (1489-1556) was Henry VIII's Archbishop of Canterbury; though hardly a noteworthy theologian, he was largely responsible for implementing Henry's new church. It is odd to note that the song does not mention his hard end (Mary Tudor had him burned at the stake) "John Mitchell the brave son of Erin" -- John Mitchel (1815-1875), for whom see the song of the same name, started as a writer, and founded the publication The United Irishman. He ended up calling stridently for change in Ireland, and in 1848 was sentenced to transportation. Sent briefly to Bermuda, he then was moved to Australia, and escaped to the United States, there to advocate slavery and flogging of prisoners. Since his exile to Bermuda is mentioned, the song must date after 1848. (One suspects this verse, the third in all the broadside texts, has been displaced; were it moved after the seventh verse, the song would be in chronological order. On the other hand, Mitchel is the only Irishman referred to; maybe he was shoved forward as a result.) The Lord C--n--n of all the broadsides is Lord Clarendon, i.e. George Villiers, fourth earl of Clarendon (1800-1870), the Lord Lieutenant from 1847-1852 before becoming foreign secretary. Although nominally responsible for the case against Mitchel, and the suppression of the sort-of-revolt of 1848, he had so little influence on the course of Irish history that I found only one mention of him in the histories I checked. In the broader world, his work seems to have been successful and relatively enlightened. "Lord Nelson he was a good spinner" -- For Horatio Nelson, see e.g. "Nelson's Victory at Trafalgar (Brave Nelson)" [Laws J17] "Billy Pitt, too, was a good spinner, and so was Lord Castlereigh... they spun the Union from Ireland" -- William Pitt the Younger (1759-1806) was an MP as early as 1781 (from a "rotten" borough) and Prime Minister while still in his early twenties (1783). He would be Prime Minister for most of the rest of his life. He tried to pass several measures to help Ireland (free trade, Catholic emancipation -- Brumwell/Speck, pp. 296-297), but all were stymied. Therefore he is remembered mostly for the much-hated Act of Union, which eliminated the Irish parliament while introducing Irish members into the British Lords and Commons. The reference here reminds me very strongly of similar references in "The Game of Cards (II)" and "The Shan Van Voght (1848)," though the direction of the dependence is not clear to me. Robert Stewart Viscount Castlereagh (1769-1822) was actually Irish (from Ulster), and early in his career in fact supported Catholic emancipation (Brumwell/Speck, p. 77). He entered the English parliament in 1794, and became a member of Pitt's government. His was a brilliant career; he served at various times as both war and foreign secretaries, was largely responsible for the Peninsular campaign, and helped direct the last battles against Napoleon. He was by rational standards an outstanding success -- but in Ireland he was remembered as being the actual director of the campaign for Union. In his later years, when it was clear that the Congress system for governing Europe was failing, he became despondent. The responsibilities of his offices overwhelmed him, and he had a nervous breakdown and committed suicide. "Napoleon he was a great spinner" -- The Irish held out great hopes for Napoleon, though he never did much for them; for what encouragement and help he did give, see the notes to "The Shan Van Voght." "Old Wellington" -- obviously the Duke of Wellington (1769-1852), winner of the Peninsular campaign and victor at Waterloo (1815), much disliked by the masses because he finally defeated Napoleon. If Mitchell's 1848 exile offers the earliest date for this song, the "Iron Duke's" death may supply the latest; two of the three broadsides have the line "Old Wellington he went a-spinning," but Firth c.14(127) patches this to "Old Wellington he now is dead"; this presumably was a topical change made 1852 or 1853, with the other versions coming from (though perhaps not printed) before 1852. "If Grouchy had never been bribed" -- Emmanuel Grouchy (1766-1847) commanded one of the wings of Napoleon's army in the Waterloo campaign, and his failure to arrive at Waterloo may have cost Napoleon the battle (Pope, p. 247). The charge that he betrayed Napoleon occurs also in "Napoleon Bonaparte (III)" (see that song for a discussion) and in "The Removal of Napoleon's Ashes," but there is no reason whatsoever to believe that it is true. "Prince Albert" -- Albert of Saxe-Coburg (1819-1861), the husband of Queen Victoria, upon whom she doted almost irrationally. He was not particularly well-liked in England, being suspected (as in this song) of being "on the make," since he was of far less hereditary importance than Victoria (see Cowan, pp. 161-162, for a couple of joke songs about Albert). But though she seems to have fallen in love first, there is no evidence that he tried to tempt her into anything. Indeed, as long as he lived, he proved a capable consort and diplomat, even if the people did not take to him. "For the Queen has another young son That was spun in the City of Cork" -- Victoria had four sons: Edward (the future Edward VII, 1841-1910), Alfred (1844-1900), Arthur (1850-1942), and Leopold (1853-1884). Arthur, who was Victoria's favorite son (Longford, p. 367) later became Duke of Connaught, and is surely the child intended. The more so since Victoria visited Cork (which was renamed Queenstown at that time) in 1849, so it is possible (though hardly proved) that he was conceived in Cork. Thus the strong internal evidence is that this piece was written between 1850 and 1852. - RBW Bibliography
File: Moyl200 Go to the Ballad Search form Go to the Ballad Index Instructions The Ballad Index Copyright 2020 by Robert B. Waltz and David G. Engle. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Wheels of the World From: GUEST,Starship Date: 01 May 20 - 06:40 PM https://digital.nls.uk/english-ballads/archive/74892334?mode=transcription That may be of use, Joe. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Wheels of the World From: rich-joy Date: 02 May 20 - 12:01 AM What a great song! I'd never heard of it before...... R-J |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Wheels of the World From: Black belt caterpillar wrestler Date: 02 May 20 - 03:44 AM There's also the Granny's Attic rendition, which is excellent. Robin |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Wheels of the World From: GUEST Date: 02 May 20 - 06:21 AM There are at least three reels with this title. Probably the best known is this one , played here by the greatly missed Tommy Peoples, superbly accompanied by Paul Brady. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Wheels of the World From: Gordon Jackson Date: 02 May 20 - 06:23 AM That last guest was me - sorry to be rude! |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Wheels of the World From: Joe Offer Date: 16 May 20 - 04:03 PM thread needs some cleanup. Interesting version here: https://www.mustrad.org.uk/articles/mitchell.htm |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Wheels of the World From: Joe Offer Date: 29 Mar 21 - 03:51 PM Interesting page on this song: https://digital.nls.uk/english-ballads/archive/74892334?mode=transcription |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Wheels of the World From: Felipa Date: 19 Jun 21 - 02:50 PM Here is Frank Harte singing https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrzQFKf1FJc The Wheels of the World There is a different dance tune called "The Wheels of the World". And there is a tune I've often heard at Irish music sessions whichs the tune "Wheels of the World is sung to; I don't have a name for that tune. It always make me think of another song I've heard but only remember a few words of, a song re hiring with a farmer. And now I've heard Alistair MacDonald singing "The Wallace" to the same tune https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iR5her2eCS8 According to this site, the lyrics of that song were penned by Jim MccLean https://www.irish-folk-songs.com/the-wallace-lyrics-and-guitar-chords.html |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Wheels of the World From: Felipa Date: 19 Jun 21 - 02:58 PM The Wallace is already on Mudcat https://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=84114, and someone had commented in that discussion that it goes to the same air as the lyrics of "The Wheels of the World". |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Wheels of the World From: Felipa Date: 19 Jun 21 - 03:05 PM and the Mudcat also has the hiring song I was looking for, same tune The Salt |
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